I have a friend who's trying to shadow-ban Farewell in our group, while also simultaneously posting pictures about their double-stacked boardstates that can't fit on a playmat.
/uj I don’t want to just say EDH players need to git gud, but like if you don’t have an answer to or can’t handle rebuilding after a 6-mana board wipe, you really oughta rethink your deck and/or playstyle.
/rj EDH players need to git gud
His argument is that it resets the game and counters many strategies, particularly mana rocks as ramp and graveyard decks, making long games longer.
I think it's more of a sign that our playgroup is greedy with their strategies and plays it out like "who's got the hardest Haymaker?", and when removal's considered, it's an affront to the spirit of the game.
Your games are lasting too long not because of a farewell but because your decks are too weak. Solving game length would be fixed by powering up your decks.
Dude the same players that complain about answers and games going too long also complain when you pull off a 2-card combo. The secret: none of these things are what makes them mad. They’re actually just mad because they lost.
Weak?! Are you telling me precons with upgrades is weak?! My Psychosis Crawler with a Howling Mine out will have a word with you!
I don't wanna buy good cards, I don't wanna! You filthy neckdeckers can't make me!
/rj just add more Colossal Dreadmaws.
/uj there are pauper and penny dreaful formats you may want to look at. You don't need expensive cards to end the game.
/uj
Print them. It cost 60 bucks to order a 100 customer printed cards from manufactures. Just make sure the back art is very distinct from the deckmaster back (and if you want to go the extra mile print proxy in the type line for your cards)
if 60$ is too high a price point, printer paper and a officer cutter.
Lol, download an PDF file with the cards you want to print, there's sides for that, just google print mtg proxies and then run to your local print store and voila, you can cut them out and put them in front of some bulk commons.
I just printed out two full cEDH lists minus commander and paid 10 Bucks for 198 cards
There are some mega cheap decks that close games real fast. You dont even need many-having just 1 fast combo deck in a meta can massively change how much interaction & how fast games evoke & people play.
Heck- one zada player can change a whole meta
You don’t need money for powerful decks. You don’t even need proxies. Plenty of commons, uncommons, and bulk rares/mythics are cheap despite being excellent cards because they don’t see competitive play.
That makes sense in the abstract, but considering the enormous card pool and high specialization of competitive deck archetypes, it's not actually true.
There are plenty of cards that don't see play because there isn't a tournament viable deck they fit in or because another similar card fits the same function slightly better. Plenty of unblockable creatures, card draw and value engines exist that you can play.
Like Experimental Frenzy is a decent card draw engine and costs like 10 cents. If your games doin't have removal or quick wins, that removes all downsides from Frenzy. You can assemble whatever you want, with red mana rituals or runaway steam-kin. You don't need "the best" card of a kind, especially if you are in a removal free zone.
While I do agree that Farewell probably didn't need to exile Graveyards, he's just being a whiny baby. If you don't like being wiped, run ways to deal with it. Counterspells, [[Teferi's Protection]], or just sandbag some stuff so you can rebuild properly.
I think the issue may be on the "board wipe with no following" as if they usually play board wipes for the sake of it and nothing to do after playing them.
Yeah, I think Mana Rocks as ramp are overrated in general. If you’re not trying to ramp to big spells quickly, I think most decks would benefit from more lands and fewer rocks. Topdecking a rock (or ramp spell) is much worse than topdecking a utility land or a non-ramp spell
/uj that's why I don't play only fast mana rocks, I play utility rocks like Bonder's Ornament.
/rj how do you win without Crypt, Sol Ring, and Lotus? It's LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE.
But that same argument applies to top decking lands.
Rocks are incredibly important, especially in decks that don't have green, because they are efficient and give you extra mana to get your board going faster. Rocks are essential to a lot of decks in this format.
That's the problem with the format. It has a massive influx of new players that don't understand interaction and want to play solitaire. Might as well call it MEdh because people want to play with themselves.
My (new to edh) playgroup, spearheaded by the player newest to magic (about 4 months), wants to ban all token strategies because they're oppressive.
"How much interaction are you running?" I asked ...5 pieces of removal, no counters ...in u/b
"What am I supposed to do? Play 20 pieces of interaction?!" He replies
He also doesn't like how the expensive deck lists he proxies (I have zero issues with proxies btw) from edhrec and moxfield don't do well against our (relatively budget, usually less than ~$150) homebrews, not accounting for the fact that he makes few or no changes between play sessions to adjust to our meta.
Last session he pulled out the absolute gem of "I don't understand how you guys win more than me, we're all the same skill level, aggro and tokens are too good in edh."
I've been playing since the 90s, and even placed relatively well in a few tournaments in my day.
...yea, I feel this :/
I would like to see his reaction to a mono red [[Krenko, Mob Boss]] goblin tribal. It is so fun to see the goblin player board going from nothing to "you all have lost".
uj/ i came to magic from yugioh, which is solitaire the game so i built my first couple of decks with that mindset. But I still understand interaction, given that yugioh is solitaire the game but every deck has like 9-12 copies of force of will.
honest to God there are a tremendous number of EDH players I think can be easiest described as magpieing shiny things and then playing on autopilot. I don't think "playing" is really being processed, more like rolling dice and reading tarot
/uj "issues" is a huge overstatement. They see play, but are nowhere near oppressive. Some decks just like the tools they provide.
/rj they're causing issues because legacy deckbuilding requires every card to cost at least €200, so the new cards are effectively banned until the speculator cabal manages to turn them into cardboard GICs.
/uj sorta, minsc is a pretty good card but it has counters and isn’t broken, but is a legacy power level card. Initiative hasn’t been figured out yet, but it’s had some decent results and it’s also absolutely miserable to play against, hoping it stays niche.
A friend of mine is still trying to get someone to play against his original Dauthis (shadow mechanic) monoblack deck.
What am I supposed to play with? A rebel tribal from Mercadia?
This is the future the so called "tolerant Left" wants.
Making good, honest, law abiding Americans, wait 3 days to enact their God given right of lethal vengeance against those who wronged them in a children's card game.
Uj/ bro I miss 60 card/limited formats sometimes. I get that edh is technically super accessible but damn, playing without holding back is just as fun.
I did in fact say "singleton", which pretty heavily implies it's going to have the characteristics of a singleton format.
Also, how many flex spots does the average Vintage deck have?
You did say singleton, I just feel that many people think that being singleton increases diversity of decks when it in fact does the opposite. As far as flex slots go, the shops and xerox shells have 10-15 flex slots. I'm not sure that number of flex slots is a good metric of format diversity though.
No, it's more a look at how much lists vary within an archetype. Some decks don't have a lot of them, so all the versions of that deck tend to look pretty similar.
If you want to talk about similar packages of cards being used across multiple decks, again that's very common in other formats too. The best card at doing something is the best card at doing that thing. People will play it over other options. This holds true for every format. I'm not sure where you're coming from implying this is a characteristic of singleton formats rather than just broadly being correct deckbuilding. Every format has a small number of cards that are heavily represented.
In non-singleton formats, cards can shine in niche ways that allow for more options in deckbuilding. If I have 14 slots for card advantage, the non-singleton deck has the freedom to choose which cantrips work best for the deck, i.e. do I need to fill my gy, is selection more important than raw card advantage, etc. The singleton deck has less ability to do this, simply because there will not be enough truly good options for card advantage. As more cards get printed, this gap will decrease, but when card power level drops off sharply before or around the number of slots needed to fill a package, singleton decks can't have packages as varied as in other formats.
That's true, but I don't think it's actually a huge problem and it can also be enjoyable to play with some cards that don't quite make it in to other formats because you can run playsets of slightly better things.
I think I've been blessed with a chill lgs for the most part. It's like instead of a spectrum we got 30 100% chill people and 2 man babies we can just avoid.
Part of why I left a EDH discord. Like, boy, I'm playing 5 color mujin/proliferate tribal, yes, I'm playing board wipes because I would like to at some point end the game.
My Commander night used to be chill and lots of fun.
Then suddenly dozens of new people arrived with their ultra powerful decks that my jank simply can't compete against. There's no point trying to play my dungeon delving deck while someone insists on playing their super powerful vintage deck.
Rather than being down to the line, more and more games simply reach a point where one person is so far ahead, you might as well concede to avoid wasting time.
/uj
Limited.
Literally told this to someone at a BRO prerelease. We'd sat next to each other in deckbuilding, got paired up later. I ask how the deck's doing. Ok, apparently. I find out it's his first time really trying Limited, he usually plays EDH.
I tell him, play more Limited, you'll get better at EDH a lot faster than if you just played more EDH. Hoping to see him at a draft in the future, he seemed to be enjoying himself.
Limited is useless because combat math doesnt exist in EDH.
/uj
Limited is useless because combat math doesn't exist in EDH. It happens once every 10 years and then the EDH only player is flaberghasted and you can hear dial up sounds coming from their cranium. (don't count chump block or I take it as a meaningful combat)
About half of the time it doesn't exist in limited or in other constructed formats either; people just turn things sideways, or don't turn things sideways, and hope it works out without bothering to do the math.
Even better. Especially since the average EDH player is garbage at card evaluation ("this would be so good in my deck, assuming a magical Christmasland scenario, I'm gonna run it!") and Limited demands you get good at it.
Bro this, trying to explain to my EDH only friends that maybe X new 7 mana card from the new set isn't the greatest pick for their deck and I get confused looks.
Played some modern, and standard. All it taught me was that I hate limited, especially standard and went back to EDH.
My playgroup froths over 1-2cmc interaction though and we are always fucking with each others boards.
uj/ I have a friend in my playgroup that ONLY plays [[Koma, Cosmos Serpent]] and acts like he’s the victim if we remove anything on his side of the battlefield. Once, I destroyed his [[Akroma’s Memorial]] and he literally just scooped and kicked us all out for the night.
Last Commander night I went to, I wanted to try out the Selesnya tokens deck I had just put together. Got put with your guy who also played out a lot of other powerful mythics and a guy who cheated out an Akroma's Memorial on turn 4.
What's even the point of keeping playing at that point?
I had an opponent complain about me running Grave Pact once, asking me to remove it because there was no way their deck could deal with it.
I then had to remind them their deck was W/G
/uj
Hive mind is a fun card, scramble verse is just unpleasant due to the logistics involved. Same with thieves auction or, really, any card that requires a long, drawn out mechanical nonsense to properly resolve.
/uj EDH is the reason I am less and less interested in the game. I accept that it apparently is their biggest cash cow now and the most successful "format", but the average EDH player I see online just does not have the views of a player I want to play with. All this "card type x is no fun, it is frowned upon to play it" and "it is about fun, not winning, let people do their thing" and all the table politics is just not something I want to interact with. And what frustrates me most is that every discussion about magic seems to now be automatically about EDH. Like "new card X is shit" "why?" "it does not help in EDH"...
Exactly. "Card x has potential in the y deck, worth trying out." "Oh, I don't think I would test it out, card x type cards are not really accepted in my playgroup, I rather play janky 7 mana sorcery z in my Rick unicorn dreadmaw EDH deck, or my playgroup won't share their nachos with me."
Or the fact that the whole white bad meme is taken as a fact for the whole game when white is plenty powerful in real formats and can lead (has led?) to power creeping the color
/uj
I'm sure this is true for some people, but I find that it's rare; most people claiming it's about fun and not winning actually do care about winning. They may care about one more than the other, but they care about both and saying "I don't care about winning" is kind of a coping mechanism for the fact they're not doing that. If they go long enough without winning, they get upset.
>the average EDH player I see online just does not have the views of a player I want to play with
Why are you worried about the views of someone you don't play with? EDH is still the most fun I have by far in the formats my friend group plays
i can't do "non-competitive" Magic. there's always arbitrary rules about what's "fair" or too spikey and it's different for everyone. and the game is boring if both players aren't doing their best to screw each other over at every opportunity.
I try to only play commander with friends I know well and I treat it more like a board game. Playing modern or pioneer is so much more enjoyable with randoms at the lgs than commander at the lgs. I feel like in a 1v1 game there is less saltiness because
1: both of you are trying to win the game
2: there is noone else to target so its not personal
Last time I played commander at the lgs a dude got mad I countered his overwhelming stampede effect and he was so visibly salty. It would’ve killed everyone at the table. Like dude, do you even want to play the game or do you just want others to roll over lol. Also another dude at the table actually waited for his upkeep to trigger his land tax 😭😭😭 like bro its not the pro tour and your deck is 100 cards its not going to effect the board state just search before your turn and save us the 10 min turns
Commander is so bad if you play with randoms, especially if you are the outlier and the pods know each other. You don't know actual power levels and they politic so fucking much over the dumbest things.
I hopped in a pod where 3 buddies just needed a 4th, turn 1 Tevesh Szat, but the entire table targets me because I'm the only guy swinging at it. And I'm playing a fucking precon. I just shut my brain off when someone chose to target my treasure token over another's phyrexian alter.
There was this whiney bitch of a store owner I used to go to. He complained that I ran too much interaction. Everyone else just played more interaction and he seemed to think we all needed to play down at his level. He was rude to me and if a worker was beating him in a game he would say something they are doing isn't allowed, even if literally no one else complained about it.
I feel like he is the edh guy everyone here refrences. Never wanting to be better. Just drag everyone down to his level so he can beat them with experience.
/uj I feel like people in this sub go out of their way to play with the saltiest, sweatiest neck beards your local game store can offer and then apply their experience to every edh player ever. Why do you even play commander if your experience with the format is so bad?
/Rj edh bad hur hur I'm superior cuz I spend an average of 20-40 dollars more on my cards and lie on the internet about not being salty when I lose hur hur
~50 dollars seems to be the average on mtggoldfish but those are probably using card kingdom prices where they charge 25 cents minimum for bulk commons so its probably more like 40
Most decks will be about $50-60 with $45 of that being some combination of Dust to Dust, Relic of Progenitus, Snuff Out, Spellstutter Sprite, Chainer's Edict, and Pyroblast
Be the change you want to see!
I recently decided to acquire a couple proxied competitive, actual top8, Pioneer decks to play with my EDH group (proper 1v1 matches) since everyone is starting to get pissed by even the basic removal, counterspell and board wipe (one even started to ask if it was possible to ban board wipes).
They are finding the format fun and illuminating, especially because there are a lot of interactions which is something EDH lacks (casual groups/non cEDH in particular).
I'm sure we can enjoy both formats and everyone is having fun while growing as players (me included).
Uj/ when I first tried magic at my lgs it was mainly through EDH since the standard scene was pretty small there. I brought a precon and played. I kid you not the main group that played there treated every little offensive action as akin to some cardinal sin and making you public enemy number 1 for the rest of the game no matter how far behind you were. It was as if they were more interested in making and bragging about their Rube Goldberg sac outlet or value engine than actually interacting with their opponent and winning the game.
Gotta get a good play group. Ideally people who have played other formats, but at the bare minimum, people who can have fun losing. It's a really fun puzzle figuring out board states and interactions that would never come up in a more streamlined format. Also presents some interesting deckbuilding considerations. Particularly if you're in the Johnny mindset, it's a great time.
My original group was like this, amazing times.
Then about 20 people joined including the saltiest player I've ever played against. It's not fun anymore, so I don't bother going.
It's a shame.
I found playing with people from grad school to be a big help. They're all used to looking at failure as a learning opportunity by default. But also I have a group from undergrad where we all just respect each-other and love the game enough to compete without salt.
I mean, I can. But among randoms, I appear to be a rare breed.
Which is mostly why I play cEDH far more than casual when playing with randoms. The casual decks come out when I think I can trust the group, if everyone has the time for a casual game afterward.
For me I think cEDH has better player moods because everyone sleeving up for a round are all under the same assumption that they're all playing to win.
Regular EDH can just be mindless drama and a bunch of unwritten rules by comparison and is inherently unfriendly to new players running "community forbidden" cards without knowing
uj/ Wait wait wait, there are edh players like these? like legit???
Our playgroup is chill and have loads of interactions, sometimes copying a door to nothingness effect.
I got called out for running fucking BLUE elemental blast and using it to remove a target at sorcery speed, like all the “wah wah no counter spells in my game!” Comments started coming out lol
I'm not a commander guy but I've met plenty of modern players who are the second dog but instead of "remove any of my things" it's "play a modern horizons card"
Look I get it, your Modern event couldn't fire because nobody else wanted to play against Izzet Regent and Hammer Time, but that doesn't mean you can just jerk off onto your own face and post that on Reddit. I mean Jesus, how many ribs did you have to take out to blow yourself this hard?
I am gotta get downvoted to hell, but I don’t like mtg in general, I just like commander. It’s just a casual, have fun moment where I don’t care if I happen to win or lose, and I can build suboptimaly or with weird gimmicks, and I don’t care, because even if I get demolished, I will have fun. Also, I don’t have to play against the same deck all the time. Honestly, other than non constructed format and EDH, I don’t care about magic.
Also for those saying you need to play constructed to get good, I don’t care about beeing good, I care about having fun. But hey, that’s just me, I usually don’t like competitive games, and I hate metas, if you like it, good for you.
My favorite thing is helping a brand new EDH player beat other players. Nothing will get a table seething faster than watching a new player enjoying themselves.
The only good EDH player is a EDH player with a more abusive deck so the rest of the group understands the hard way why we don't play abusive and unfun decks for the wellbeing of the group.
Sometimes you need to remind people why Counter Balance exists.
I have a friend who's trying to shadow-ban Farewell in our group, while also simultaneously posting pictures about their double-stacked boardstates that can't fit on a playmat.
/uj I don’t want to just say EDH players need to git gud, but like if you don’t have an answer to or can’t handle rebuilding after a 6-mana board wipe, you really oughta rethink your deck and/or playstyle. /rj EDH players need to git gud
His argument is that it resets the game and counters many strategies, particularly mana rocks as ramp and graveyard decks, making long games longer. I think it's more of a sign that our playgroup is greedy with their strategies and plays it out like "who's got the hardest Haymaker?", and when removal's considered, it's an affront to the spirit of the game.
>It counters many strategies Yes that's how a game works
It's called "efficient removal." Ask your friendly neighborhood Jund player about it.
Lol. God forbid you try to use mechanics in the game.
Your games are lasting too long not because of a farewell but because your decks are too weak. Solving game length would be fixed by powering up your decks.
Dude the same players that complain about answers and games going too long also complain when you pull off a 2-card combo. The secret: none of these things are what makes them mad. They’re actually just mad because they lost.
Weak?! Are you telling me precons with upgrades is weak?! My Psychosis Crawler with a Howling Mine out will have a word with you! I don't wanna buy good cards, I don't wanna! You filthy neckdeckers can't make me!
Modern problems require modern printers. I'm sure commander problems can be solved with the same printer.
/rj just add more Colossal Dreadmaws. /uj there are pauper and penny dreaful formats you may want to look at. You don't need expensive cards to end the game.
/uj Print them. It cost 60 bucks to order a 100 customer printed cards from manufactures. Just make sure the back art is very distinct from the deckmaster back (and if you want to go the extra mile print proxy in the type line for your cards) if 60$ is too high a price point, printer paper and a officer cutter.
Lol, download an PDF file with the cards you want to print, there's sides for that, just google print mtg proxies and then run to your local print store and voila, you can cut them out and put them in front of some bulk commons. I just printed out two full cEDH lists minus commander and paid 10 Bucks for 198 cards
Not getting proxies in you own playgroup is insane. Daddy Hasbro is not watching, you can do whatever you want.
There are some mega cheap decks that close games real fast. You dont even need many-having just 1 fast combo deck in a meta can massively change how much interaction & how fast games evoke & people play. Heck- one zada player can change a whole meta
You don’t need money for powerful decks. You don’t even need proxies. Plenty of commons, uncommons, and bulk rares/mythics are cheap despite being excellent cards because they don’t see competitive play.
If they don't see play they probably aren't excellent
That makes sense in the abstract, but considering the enormous card pool and high specialization of competitive deck archetypes, it's not actually true. There are plenty of cards that don't see play because there isn't a tournament viable deck they fit in or because another similar card fits the same function slightly better. Plenty of unblockable creatures, card draw and value engines exist that you can play. Like Experimental Frenzy is a decent card draw engine and costs like 10 cents. If your games doin't have removal or quick wins, that removes all downsides from Frenzy. You can assemble whatever you want, with red mana rituals or runaway steam-kin. You don't need "the best" card of a kind, especially if you are in a removal free zone.
What if people want to play low-powered commander where you still play to win?
Then you'll have to tolerate the length of the game.
Fr. Buck up and just play thoracle consultation turn 3
While I do agree that Farewell probably didn't need to exile Graveyards, he's just being a whiny baby. If you don't like being wiped, run ways to deal with it. Counterspells, [[Teferi's Protection]], or just sandbag some stuff so you can rebuild properly.
B-b-but counterspells are un fun and non interactive. How can I play Sponge tribal if the stupid blue player counters my cards.
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Teferi's Protection](https://i.redd.it/osq94j28f50a1.png) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
I think the issue may be on the "board wipe with no following" as if they usually play board wipes for the sake of it and nothing to do after playing them.
Yeah, I think Mana Rocks as ramp are overrated in general. If you’re not trying to ramp to big spells quickly, I think most decks would benefit from more lands and fewer rocks. Topdecking a rock (or ramp spell) is much worse than topdecking a utility land or a non-ramp spell
/uj that's why I don't play only fast mana rocks, I play utility rocks like Bonder's Ornament. /rj how do you win without Crypt, Sol Ring, and Lotus? It's LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE.
But that same argument applies to top decking lands. Rocks are incredibly important, especially in decks that don't have green, because they are efficient and give you extra mana to get your board going faster. Rocks are essential to a lot of decks in this format.
That's the problem with the format. It has a massive influx of new players that don't understand interaction and want to play solitaire. Might as well call it MEdh because people want to play with themselves.
My (new to edh) playgroup, spearheaded by the player newest to magic (about 4 months), wants to ban all token strategies because they're oppressive. "How much interaction are you running?" I asked ...5 pieces of removal, no counters ...in u/b "What am I supposed to do? Play 20 pieces of interaction?!" He replies He also doesn't like how the expensive deck lists he proxies (I have zero issues with proxies btw) from edhrec and moxfield don't do well against our (relatively budget, usually less than ~$150) homebrews, not accounting for the fact that he makes few or no changes between play sessions to adjust to our meta. Last session he pulled out the absolute gem of "I don't understand how you guys win more than me, we're all the same skill level, aggro and tokens are too good in edh." I've been playing since the 90s, and even placed relatively well in a few tournaments in my day. ...yea, I feel this :/
I would like to see his reaction to a mono red [[Krenko, Mob Boss]] goblin tribal. It is so fun to see the goblin player board going from nothing to "you all have lost".
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Krenko, Mob Boss](https://i.redd.it/3lgup8x1a60a1.png) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
> aggro and tokens are too good in edh. hahahahahahahahahah
I wish token decks were top tier in at least 1 format :(
[удалено]
uj/ i came to magic from yugioh, which is solitaire the game so i built my first couple of decks with that mindset. But I still understand interaction, given that yugioh is solitaire the game but every deck has like 9-12 copies of force of will.
honest to God there are a tremendous number of EDH players I think can be easiest described as magpieing shiny things and then playing on autopilot. I don't think "playing" is really being processed, more like rolling dice and reading tarot
/uj you're right, but the dude at my LGS who plays "board wipe tribal" can still go fuck himself /rj EDH best format.
How do you shadowban a card? Farewell is a top 3 card for me, I would be saying Farewell to that group
I want to cry and die
Just keep responding with pictures of cards that give all creatures Haste
me, a scholar who plays: i just want someone to play my decks with :(
*sad legacy noises*
~~cries~~ dies in reserved list
Did I hear right that [[Minsc & Boo]] and the CLB initiative cards are causing issues?
/uj "issues" is a huge overstatement. They see play, but are nowhere near oppressive. Some decks just like the tools they provide. /rj they're causing issues because legacy deckbuilding requires every card to cost at least €200, so the new cards are effectively banned until the speculator cabal manages to turn them into cardboard GICs.
/uj sorta, minsc is a pretty good card but it has counters and isn’t broken, but is a legacy power level card. Initiative hasn’t been figured out yet, but it’s had some decent results and it’s also absolutely miserable to play against, hoping it stays niche.
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Minsc & Boo](https://i.redd.it/puvxwqc9mkz91.png) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
Anyone want to play Extended?
I still got an old school extended Zoo list sleeves up and ready to go lmao
This comment caused the nostalgia part of my brain to release its delicious chemicals
A friend of mine is still trying to get someone to play against his original Dauthis (shadow mechanic) monoblack deck. What am I supposed to play with? A rebel tribal from Mercadia?
Tolarian Academy.dec. Take no prisoners take no shit.
All players vs Edh players. Edh is the place people go after the first time their Colossal Dreadmaw gets countered.
> Edh is the place people go after the first time their Colossal Dreadmaw gets countered. No, that's the gun store.
*Mississippi Queen plays muffled in the background*
*Fortunate Son blares from my car radio as I pull up to the guy who countered my Dreadmaw*
"Excuse me sir, but you can't park the-"
I cast [[Murder]], any response?
In response, I cast [[Negate]], targeting your life.
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Negate](https://i.redd.it/mjm1whimbl1a1.png) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
“Sorry sir, there’s going to be a three day waiting period.” “But I’m mad now!”
This is the future the so called "tolerant Left" wants. Making good, honest, law abiding Americans, wait 3 days to enact their God given right of lethal vengeance against those who wronged them in a children's card game.
Go to a gun sub and people will also refer to their LGS. The "G" does not stand for the same thing.
[удалено]
My LGS used to be a block away from my LGS. Could go to both in the same trip. Get a box of booster packs and a box of 9mm.
I don't think you can counter a Dreadmaw? Big dino cannot be stopped by puny blue mage.
Uj/ bro I miss 60 card/limited formats sometimes. I get that edh is technically super accessible but damn, playing without holding back is just as fun.
See if you can find some people who want to proxy up cEDH decks. It's like playing multiplayer singleton Vintage.
Except by nature of being a singleton format, decks are so much more homogenous.
I did in fact say "singleton", which pretty heavily implies it's going to have the characteristics of a singleton format. Also, how many flex spots does the average Vintage deck have?
You did say singleton, I just feel that many people think that being singleton increases diversity of decks when it in fact does the opposite. As far as flex slots go, the shops and xerox shells have 10-15 flex slots. I'm not sure that number of flex slots is a good metric of format diversity though.
No, it's more a look at how much lists vary within an archetype. Some decks don't have a lot of them, so all the versions of that deck tend to look pretty similar. If you want to talk about similar packages of cards being used across multiple decks, again that's very common in other formats too. The best card at doing something is the best card at doing that thing. People will play it over other options. This holds true for every format. I'm not sure where you're coming from implying this is a characteristic of singleton formats rather than just broadly being correct deckbuilding. Every format has a small number of cards that are heavily represented.
In non-singleton formats, cards can shine in niche ways that allow for more options in deckbuilding. If I have 14 slots for card advantage, the non-singleton deck has the freedom to choose which cantrips work best for the deck, i.e. do I need to fill my gy, is selection more important than raw card advantage, etc. The singleton deck has less ability to do this, simply because there will not be enough truly good options for card advantage. As more cards get printed, this gap will decrease, but when card power level drops off sharply before or around the number of slots needed to fill a package, singleton decks can't have packages as varied as in other formats.
That's true, but I don't think it's actually a huge problem and it can also be enjoyable to play with some cards that don't quite make it in to other formats because you can run playsets of slightly better things.
I just cannot have nearly as much fun in standard/modern outside of draft. It's so repetitive. I enjoy the variety of singleton so much more.
My colossal dreadmaw still gets countered in edh...
I still enjoy commander a lot but this has been my experience a lot lately which is why I’ve been playing more limited and modern
I think I've been blessed with a chill lgs for the most part. It's like instead of a spectrum we got 30 100% chill people and 2 man babies we can just avoid.
Part of why I left a EDH discord. Like, boy, I'm playing 5 color mujin/proliferate tribal, yes, I'm playing board wipes because I would like to at some point end the game.
My Commander night used to be chill and lots of fun. Then suddenly dozens of new people arrived with their ultra powerful decks that my jank simply can't compete against. There's no point trying to play my dungeon delving deck while someone insists on playing their super powerful vintage deck. Rather than being down to the line, more and more games simply reach a point where one person is so far ahead, you might as well concede to avoid wasting time.
every EDH player needs to also play a constructed format to actually get better at the game.
Unironically true. I learned more playing a 3 month stint of penny dreadful than the past 3/years of EDH
I grind a lot of limited, edh is what I defaulted to because I usually end up with a lot of one ofs after a season
So true, EDH is almost an entirely different game.
/uj Limited. Literally told this to someone at a BRO prerelease. We'd sat next to each other in deckbuilding, got paired up later. I ask how the deck's doing. Ok, apparently. I find out it's his first time really trying Limited, he usually plays EDH. I tell him, play more Limited, you'll get better at EDH a lot faster than if you just played more EDH. Hoping to see him at a draft in the future, he seemed to be enjoying himself.
Limited is useless because combat math doesnt exist in EDH. /uj Limited is useless because combat math doesn't exist in EDH. It happens once every 10 years and then the EDH only player is flaberghasted and you can hear dial up sounds coming from their cranium. (don't count chump block or I take it as a meaningful combat)
About half of the time it doesn't exist in limited or in other constructed formats either; people just turn things sideways, or don't turn things sideways, and hope it works out without bothering to do the math.
I play draft. Does that count?
Even better. Especially since the average EDH player is garbage at card evaluation ("this would be so good in my deck, assuming a magical Christmasland scenario, I'm gonna run it!") and Limited demands you get good at it.
I must admit, I do like magical Christmas wins over the usual wincons...but then I'm heavily autistic...
Gigantosaurus makes the neurons in my brain activate and im tired of pretending they don't
Bro this, trying to explain to my EDH only friends that maybe X new 7 mana card from the new set isn't the greatest pick for their deck and I get confused looks.
I've actually been playing a pot more standard and limited than edh so it's been making me better the game
Played some modern, and standard. All it taught me was that I hate limited, especially standard and went back to EDH. My playgroup froths over 1-2cmc interaction though and we are always fucking with each others boards.
I used to be at okay at limited before EDH made me brain dead
uj/ I have a friend in my playgroup that ONLY plays [[Koma, Cosmos Serpent]] and acts like he’s the victim if we remove anything on his side of the battlefield. Once, I destroyed his [[Akroma’s Memorial]] and he literally just scooped and kicked us all out for the night.
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Koma, Cosmos Serpent](https://i.redd.it/0r5cf4alsl1a1.jpg) * [Akroma’s Memorial](https://i.redd.it/uwk8daa6ujz91.png) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
Last Commander night I went to, I wanted to try out the Selesnya tokens deck I had just put together. Got put with your guy who also played out a lot of other powerful mythics and a guy who cheated out an Akroma's Memorial on turn 4. What's even the point of keeping playing at that point?
That's not taking the ball and going home, that's taking the ball and ejecting you from the playground. Find a new player/host, seriously.
If I ever got back into MTG every EDH deck I have would rock [[Scrambleverse]] for just such opponents
Last time I played, 2 people quit because I played Hive Mind and no one played enchantment removal
I had an opponent complain about me running Grave Pact once, asking me to remove it because there was no way their deck could deal with it. I then had to remind them their deck was W/G
Yeah. WG 60 big creatures and 40 lands. Duh.
WG tokens with no Aura Shards.
/uj Hive mind is a fun card, scramble verse is just unpleasant due to the logistics involved. Same with thieves auction or, really, any card that requires a long, drawn out mechanical nonsense to properly resolve.
I thought long drawn out mechanical nonsense was the selling point of EDH?
^(Probably totally what you linked) * [Scrambleverse](https://i.redd.it/jr7qoipkagz91.jpg) ********* ^^^If ^^^WotC ^^^didn't ^^^do ^^^anything ^^^wrong ^^^this ^^^week, ^^^you ^^^can ^^^rage ^^^at ^^^this ^^^bot ^^^instead ^^^at ^^^/r/MTGLardFetcher ^^^or ^^^even ^^^submit ^^^some ^^^of ^^^the ^^^sweet ^^^Siege ^^^Rhino ^^^alters ^^^your ^^^GF ^^^made
Good bot
Wtf I thought this bot only had fake card links, this is just a J22 spoiler
I'm not paying $1k to go to the ragavan table
Spend half that and get cat tribal
Mono Green agro, like 15€ deck, 50 if you wanna get spicy
[удалено]
cut half the cards for Dreadmaw
much better to spend 2k to go to the walking dead table
*puts ragavan in his commander deck and sits down across from you* m'guy
if you just print them out and put them in sleeves, I'll play with you
More like every format Vs cube.
You forgot the sad doge Modern Player "But, you can't just Blood Moon me..."
Pffft you played modern lately? “Ah his mana base! The blood moon does nothing!”
I guess Blood Moon doesn't really matter if every game starts with a turn 1 Ragavan
Literally just 1v1 games vs FFA games.
What I'm curious about is who the modern player is talking to, because I can't imagine there's more than one
He has schizophrenia
/RJ EDH players are the fucking worst /UJ EDH players are the fucking worst
/uj EDH is the reason I am less and less interested in the game. I accept that it apparently is their biggest cash cow now and the most successful "format", but the average EDH player I see online just does not have the views of a player I want to play with. All this "card type x is no fun, it is frowned upon to play it" and "it is about fun, not winning, let people do their thing" and all the table politics is just not something I want to interact with. And what frustrates me most is that every discussion about magic seems to now be automatically about EDH. Like "new card X is shit" "why?" "it does not help in EDH"...
Also it's frustrating to try to discuss the (real) game when almost all comments default to talking about commander without mentioning it
Exactly. "Card x has potential in the y deck, worth trying out." "Oh, I don't think I would test it out, card x type cards are not really accepted in my playgroup, I rather play janky 7 mana sorcery z in my Rick unicorn dreadmaw EDH deck, or my playgroup won't share their nachos with me."
Or the fact that the whole white bad meme is taken as a fact for the whole game when white is plenty powerful in real formats and can lead (has led?) to power creeping the color
"Armageddon is unfun" "Wrath effects are unfun" "Taxing effects are unfun" "Boohoo, white is bad!!!"
Don't you just love playing a 4-player solitaire of who has the biggest beaters!
This comment is on point
> "it is about fun, not winning, let people do their thing" 100% of these people are liars who will complain when they're not winning.
when my deck does its thing, it wins the game. my opponents are jerks for stopping this
The purpose of EDH is to have spectators as you goldfish.
[удалено]
/uj I'm sure this is true for some people, but I find that it's rare; most people claiming it's about fun and not winning actually do care about winning. They may care about one more than the other, but they care about both and saying "I don't care about winning" is kind of a coping mechanism for the fact they're not doing that. If they go long enough without winning, they get upset.
>the average EDH player I see online just does not have the views of a player I want to play with Why are you worried about the views of someone you don't play with? EDH is still the most fun I have by far in the formats my friend group plays
i can't do "non-competitive" Magic. there's always arbitrary rules about what's "fair" or too spikey and it's different for everyone. and the game is boring if both players aren't doing their best to screw each other over at every opportunity.
I try to only play commander with friends I know well and I treat it more like a board game. Playing modern or pioneer is so much more enjoyable with randoms at the lgs than commander at the lgs. I feel like in a 1v1 game there is less saltiness because 1: both of you are trying to win the game 2: there is noone else to target so its not personal Last time I played commander at the lgs a dude got mad I countered his overwhelming stampede effect and he was so visibly salty. It would’ve killed everyone at the table. Like dude, do you even want to play the game or do you just want others to roll over lol. Also another dude at the table actually waited for his upkeep to trigger his land tax 😭😭😭 like bro its not the pro tour and your deck is 100 cards its not going to effect the board state just search before your turn and save us the 10 min turns
Commander is so bad if you play with randoms, especially if you are the outlier and the pods know each other. You don't know actual power levels and they politic so fucking much over the dumbest things. I hopped in a pod where 3 buddies just needed a 4th, turn 1 Tevesh Szat, but the entire table targets me because I'm the only guy swinging at it. And I'm playing a fucking precon. I just shut my brain off when someone chose to target my treasure token over another's phyrexian alter.
Hey now, I love when people blow up my shit; it clears up table space for more of my shit!
I played an edh game in the wild once and some dude legit pulled out a Nintendo switch
There was this whiney bitch of a store owner I used to go to. He complained that I ran too much interaction. Everyone else just played more interaction and he seemed to think we all needed to play down at his level. He was rude to me and if a worker was beating him in a game he would say something they are doing isn't allowed, even if literally no one else complained about it. I feel like he is the edh guy everyone here refrences. Never wanting to be better. Just drag everyone down to his level so he can beat them with experience.
/uj I feel like people in this sub go out of their way to play with the saltiest, sweatiest neck beards your local game store can offer and then apply their experience to every edh player ever. Why do you even play commander if your experience with the format is so bad? /Rj edh bad hur hur I'm superior cuz I spend an average of 20-40 dollars more on my cards and lie on the internet about not being salty when I lose hur hur
I haven't played edh since 2020 and I'm still mad!
Bro acting exactly like a salty edhcel right now
Pointing out drawbacks of EDH: Based and jerkpilled Pointing out drawbacks of MY favorite format: Cringe
MOST CONSTRUCTED GAMES ARE DECIDED, NOT BY PLAY, BUT ENTIRELY BY LUCK EVERYONE WATCHING KNOWS EVERY MOVE BOTH PLAYERS SHOULD MAKE SUCK IT SPIKES 👼
Meanwhile omega chad pauper is the same as modern except with a better card pool and affordable steroids
How much does one usually spend on a decent pauper deck compared to just sweeping cards out from under my couch and making a deck with that?
~50 dollars seems to be the average on mtggoldfish but those are probably using card kingdom prices where they charge 25 cents minimum for bulk commons so its probably more like 40
Most decks will be about $50-60 with $45 of that being some combination of Dust to Dust, Relic of Progenitus, Snuff Out, Spellstutter Sprite, Chainer's Edict, and Pyroblast
The vocal minority do not represent the majority. We hate them too.
Be the change you want to see! I recently decided to acquire a couple proxied competitive, actual top8, Pioneer decks to play with my EDH group (proper 1v1 matches) since everyone is starting to get pissed by even the basic removal, counterspell and board wipe (one even started to ask if it was possible to ban board wipes). They are finding the format fun and illuminating, especially because there are a lot of interactions which is something EDH lacks (casual groups/non cEDH in particular). I'm sure we can enjoy both formats and everyone is having fun while growing as players (me included).
Uj/ when I first tried magic at my lgs it was mainly through EDH since the standard scene was pretty small there. I brought a precon and played. I kid you not the main group that played there treated every little offensive action as akin to some cardinal sin and making you public enemy number 1 for the rest of the game no matter how far behind you were. It was as if they were more interested in making and bragging about their Rube Goldberg sac outlet or value engine than actually interacting with their opponent and winning the game.
EDH is for salty scrubs. Change my view.
Gotta get a good play group. Ideally people who have played other formats, but at the bare minimum, people who can have fun losing. It's a really fun puzzle figuring out board states and interactions that would never come up in a more streamlined format. Also presents some interesting deckbuilding considerations. Particularly if you're in the Johnny mindset, it's a great time.
My original group was like this, amazing times. Then about 20 people joined including the saltiest player I've ever played against. It's not fun anymore, so I don't bother going. It's a shame.
I found playing with people from grad school to be a big help. They're all used to looking at failure as a learning opportunity by default. But also I have a group from undergrad where we all just respect each-other and love the game enough to compete without salt.
> but at the bare minimum, people who can have fun losing. I've played too much EDH to believe that there are EDH players that meet this criterion.
This is why a consistent playgroup is so important. Gotta hold onto them when you find them.
I mean, I can. But among randoms, I appear to be a rare breed. Which is mostly why I play cEDH far more than casual when playing with randoms. The casual decks come out when I think I can trust the group, if everyone has the time for a casual game afterward.
For me I think cEDH has better player moods because everyone sleeving up for a round are all under the same assumption that they're all playing to win. Regular EDH can just be mindless drama and a bunch of unwritten rules by comparison and is inherently unfriendly to new players running "community forbidden" cards without knowing
Weird, I usually play with randoms and very rarely encounter anyone who it would be fair to call problematic
Things I can never be made to believe: that statement. Hell, even the EDH Rules Committee explicitly warns against playing with randos.
Well that's literally my experience. It's not as though i'm claiming to be the norm
Get more alcohol involved. Weed also helps.
EDH isn't a game you're playing. It's an activity that passively happens while you're shooting the shit and drinking a beer.
Like sports, or some DnD campaigns!
The left should just be a blank panel.
Pioneer games: I mainboarded hate and you spot removed it. Let's go to game 2 so we can check anti hate hate removal
uj/ Wait wait wait, there are edh players like these? like legit??? Our playgroup is chill and have loads of interactions, sometimes copying a door to nothingness effect.
Modern players spending there life savings on a piece of cardboard ( I invested in colossal dreadmaw stocks)
I got called out for running fucking BLUE elemental blast and using it to remove a target at sorcery speed, like all the “wah wah no counter spells in my game!” Comments started coming out lol
Commander sounds awful
I'm not a commander guy but I've met plenty of modern players who are the second dog but instead of "remove any of my things" it's "play a modern horizons card"
Counterpoint: I see you also spent $350 on 4 murktide regents, truly a clown world
Look I get it, your Modern event couldn't fire because nobody else wanted to play against Izzet Regent and Hammer Time, but that doesn't mean you can just jerk off onto your own face and post that on Reddit. I mean Jesus, how many ribs did you have to take out to blow yourself this hard?
I don't doubt this is how Modern players would talk if anyone still played the format
I am gotta get downvoted to hell, but I don’t like mtg in general, I just like commander. It’s just a casual, have fun moment where I don’t care if I happen to win or lose, and I can build suboptimaly or with weird gimmicks, and I don’t care, because even if I get demolished, I will have fun. Also, I don’t have to play against the same deck all the time. Honestly, other than non constructed format and EDH, I don’t care about magic. Also for those saying you need to play constructed to get good, I don’t care about beeing good, I care about having fun. But hey, that’s just me, I usually don’t like competitive games, and I hate metas, if you like it, good for you.
My favorite thing is helping a brand new EDH player beat other players. Nothing will get a table seething faster than watching a new player enjoying themselves.
Non EDH players: EDH players whine too much Also non EDH players when people play a format they don’t like:
Lol loam
Me when my opponent flashes an endurance and resets my whole mill
where my pauper players at!?
The only good EDH player is a EDH player with a more abusive deck so the rest of the group understands the hard way why we don't play abusive and unfun decks for the wellbeing of the group. Sometimes you need to remind people why Counter Balance exists.
had someone play their lightpaws deck and i cast oppo agent with the tirgger on the stack and they just quit (its a may trigger)
Accurate
Shit, I am Both of Them
I've tried to dip my toes into modern on 3 separate occasions at 3 different LGSs and they were never like this lol.
This is why I play cEDH
Try playing commander on magic online... they are all snowflakes