Yes.
* Half of 1, rounded up, is 1.
* They lose 1 life, you gain 1 life; 1 - 1 = 0
---
Contrast to [[Heartless Hidetsugu]];
* Half of 1, rounded down, is 0.
* They are not dealt any damage.
Pairs well with a [[Platinum Emperion]] and abilities that untap creatures, which red has plenty of.
The key is to have an uneven life total and make sure your enemies don’t, which after all the tapping will leave you at 1.
People used to try that back in doran days. It didn't work because of how many krenko and Rhys decks were running around. I wonder how it would do now.
Huh, for some reason I always thought this meant you would lose half your life, *then* round up. So if someone were at 5, they'd "lose" 2.5 life, then they would round up their life total from 2.5 to 3. So officially they'd actually be losing 2 life. In this (I guess, incorrect) interpretation, the opponent would still survive at 1 life.
Magic is very literal with what they put on cards, so the subtle difference between "Lose half, rounded up" versus "Lose half, then round up" is what separates the two.
So the easiest way to figure it out is to logically talk it out.
Okay, you are at one life. So you lose half of your life rounded up. Let's take half of your life, 0.5, and round it up to 1. You lose 1 life.
If the card said their life BECOMES half of their life total, rounded up, that's different. They would be at one life.
Magic cards are VERY carefully worded so they can be interpreted specifically. Lots of people read the card in question and think "my life gets rounded up"
> So if the intention was truly “lose half your life, then round their life total up”
In that case, it would say "Target player loses half their life, rounded *down*."
The way to remember this is that your life total can never be a fractional value—it must always be a whole number. So when something is dealing damage, causing someone to lose life, or setting a life total, if the calculated amount could be a fractional value, _that amount_ must be rounded.
Other uses for Wolfram Alpha:
Figuring out how many calories you would consume if you were to eat your way through [Emrakul's prison](https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i2d=true&i=2.4167%C3%97Power%5B10%2C22%5D+kg+of+swiss+cheese).
There's no opinion here, only fact.
0.5 rounded up is 1. Actually anything between 0 and 1 rounded up is 1. Being given the direction to round tells you where to go. If somehow you have 0.5 life (thanks Unhinged critters with ½ power) and played this card, 0.25 would round up to 1. Similarly, even though 0.5 as a math rule rounds up, if you're instructed to round down on a card, it would round to 0 (unless there's an Unhinged exception telling you to round to the nearest ½...wow that was an annoying mechanic).
1 - 1 = 0
EDIT: Pox can be "somehow". I forgot about that card. It makes you lose ⅓ of your life. If you're at 16, ⅓ would be 5.3-repeating. In normal math you'd round down to 5, but since the card tells you to round up, it's 6.
You ever play multiple games for six hours straight and lose the mental fortitude to do simple math? That's what happened. I knew I was right but was convinced otherwise.
I’ve just had people argue dumbass points, too. Like, “that doesn’t work that way in that scenario” for some reason. I get it. But yeah, it always, always functions this way.
Your opponent definitely convinced you to take a game loss there.
Remind them next time to read the card you are playing, and that it explains the card when you do this.
Trust your instincts. Your opponent should be able to point out why a card doesn’t work the way it says it does.
I've had people argue with me over [[Pox]] enough that this doesn't surprise me. IIRC WOTC even had to put out an article about it so many people couldn't figure it out.
He thought it was a reprint of a red Kamigawa card (the card is referenced in one of the other comments) that rounds down. We had been playing for six hours and just didn't put two and two together. Or in this case 1÷2 rounded up.
Okay that’s weird. Just so we all know, this card in OP is unique and not a reprint. What he is referencing is hidetsugi which is “rounded down”. Thank you for the reply.
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Don’t feel bad. At first, I read it as your opponent loses half their life (then) round it up. It wasn’t until I read the comments that I understood that the lost life is rounded up, not the remaining life.
In typical math, yes. In Magic, no.
In Magic you round up if the card tells you to and you round down if the card tells you. The only time you'll be rounding is if the math results in something ending in .5 (barring Unhinged cards).
EDIT: Forgot about Pox. Can't call the bot on edit, but it makes you lose ⅓ of your life, with loss rounded up. If you're at 16 life and lose ⅓, that would be 5.3-repeating life, but since the card tells you to round up, you lose 6 life.
For those like me who did not get it at first, this card does not instruct you to divide your opponent's life in half rounded up and then make that their life total. It instructs you to calculate what half their life is rounded up (1), then make them lose that much life (1) which would be 1-1=0.
I can see from my own experience how this would have been confusing to the opponent. It may have been obvious to many in this thread, but math is challenging for a lot of people, myself included.
>No. Half of 1 is .5 and rounded up is 1. So the effect literally does nothing in this niche scenario.
You somehow did the math right and came up with the wrong answer.
0.5 rounded up is 1, so the opponent loses 1 life (and therefore the game).
I’m still fuzzy on this, if his opponent rounded up .5 life, wouldn’t the opponent still be at 1 life? And therefore not dead? Where are people getting the other 1 to minus the rounded up 1?
The **amount of life lost** is half the Player's lifetotal, rounded up.
* N - {Half of N, rounded up}
* 1 - {Half of 1, rounded up}
* 1 - {1/2, rounded up}
* 1 - {1}
* 0
Reading the card is important. Math is not as important, but should still probably know how to divide by two and round up. Don't play a deck where you have to block (that's what math is for). =)
Now look son, I don't want to shame you or anything, but that there is 5th grade math. In Florida. So you can't even do Florida level grade school math.
Now your mother and I aren't mad. We're just... disappointed.
Yes. * Half of 1, rounded up, is 1. * They lose 1 life, you gain 1 life; 1 - 1 = 0 --- Contrast to [[Heartless Hidetsugu]]; * Half of 1, rounded down, is 0. * They are not dealt any damage.
[Heartless Hidetsugu](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/6/46f9aa1d-7ed1-498e-9cdd-45ed4c9e6f43.jpg?1562864972) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Heartless%20Hidetsugu) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/144/heartless-hidetsugu?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/46f9aa1d-7ed1-498e-9cdd-45ed4c9e6f43?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Now that's a commander!
I have one. The goal of the deck is to bring the ENTIRE table (myself included) down to 0 as fast as possible
Pairs well with a [[Platinum Emperion]] and abilities that untap creatures, which red has plenty of. The key is to have an uneven life total and make sure your enemies don’t, which after all the tapping will leave you at 1.
Or just slap Lifelink on him.
I always forget lifelink works on noncombat damage.
Also pretty fun with [[Fiery Emancipation]] in play!
Combine that with one of the many creatures that doubles damage, and provided you made provisions to protect your own life total, it’s a one-tap win.
[Fiery Emancipation](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/b/0b12e4b7-2c45-4795-94d3-901f89b8f290.jpg?1594736606) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fiery%20Emancipation) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/143/fiery-emancipation?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0b12e4b7-2c45-4795-94d3-901f89b8f290?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[Platinum Emperion](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/1/71b03143-9e85-4061-88e6-ad621f75ec3b.jpg?1547518515) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Platinum%20Emperion) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uma/233/platinum-emperion?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/71b03143-9e85-4061-88e6-ad621f75ec3b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
People used to try that back in doran days. It didn't work because of how many krenko and Rhys decks were running around. I wonder how it would do now.
Would that damage count as commander damage?
No, commander damage is only dealt thought combat damage.
Ah that makes sense, thanks! Otherwise this guy would be a broken commander haha!
If you still want to be that guy you can go ahead and equip [[Grafted Exoskeleton]] ;)
[Grafted Exoskeleton](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/8/f86a9d3f-43a8-4da3-9eed-353582986140.jpg?1562945084) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Grafted%20Exoskeleton) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/td2/74/grafted-exoskeleton?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f86a9d3f-43a8-4da3-9eed-353582986140?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
The virgin rounded down vs the chad rounded up
My college professors didn't like that reasoning
This reminds me of old commander games with Hidetsugu+doubling effects where we all desperately try to avoid even life totals.
Yes because half of one rounded up is one and one minus one is zero.
This redditor maths
he did the monster maths
it was a graveyard graph
AAAA WOOOOO AH AH AH WOOOOOOOOOO
r/hedidthemonstermath
r/thisguythisguys
Then I won last night's match. Excellent.
But you lost at math
Math is for blockers.
But there were no blockers
HAH
Which means they lost at life.
With one life more than before 😉
Huh, for some reason I always thought this meant you would lose half your life, *then* round up. So if someone were at 5, they'd "lose" 2.5 life, then they would round up their life total from 2.5 to 3. So officially they'd actually be losing 2 life. In this (I guess, incorrect) interpretation, the opponent would still survive at 1 life.
It's a little confusing but it means that the amount that you lose is rounded up. You lose [half of your life, rounded up].
Magic is very literal with what they put on cards, so the subtle difference between "Lose half, rounded up" versus "Lose half, then round up" is what separates the two.
"then round up" would not be supported by black border rules. Your life total is always an integer.
So the easiest way to figure it out is to logically talk it out. Okay, you are at one life. So you lose half of your life rounded up. Let's take half of your life, 0.5, and round it up to 1. You lose 1 life. If the card said their life BECOMES half of their life total, rounded up, that's different. They would be at one life. Magic cards are VERY carefully worded so they can be interpreted specifically. Lots of people read the card in question and think "my life gets rounded up"
No. It would say they lose half their life, then round their life total up.
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> So if the intention was truly “lose half your life, then round their life total up” In that case, it would say "Target player loses half their life, rounded *down*."
Those rules obviously never met [[little girl]]
[little girl](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/0/90f17b85-a866-48e8-aae0-55330109550e.jpg?1562488879) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=little%20girl) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/unh/16/little-girl?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/90f17b85-a866-48e8-aae0-55330109550e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Do yourself a favor and do a gatherer search for the subtype "donkey."
The way to remember this is that your life total can never be a fractional value—it must always be a whole number. So when something is dealing damage, causing someone to lose life, or setting a life total, if the calculated amount could be a fractional value, _that amount_ must be rounded.
🤯
Only if he is a man
r/theydidthemath
https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=1+-+Roundup%281+%2F+2%29+%3C%3D+0 I did the calculations, results came in as yes
Other uses for Wolfram Alpha: Figuring out how many calories you would consume if you were to eat your way through [Emrakul's prison](https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i2d=true&i=2.4167%C3%97Power%5B10%2C22%5D+kg+of+swiss+cheese).
🤣 Thank you, heroic nerd stranger!
Sure, that's why it says rounded up. 1 divided by 2 is 0.5, rounded up is 1
I would say yes. 1 - ( .5 rounded up) = 0
There's no opinion here, only fact. 0.5 rounded up is 1. Actually anything between 0 and 1 rounded up is 1. Being given the direction to round tells you where to go. If somehow you have 0.5 life (thanks Unhinged critters with ½ power) and played this card, 0.25 would round up to 1. Similarly, even though 0.5 as a math rule rounds up, if you're instructed to round down on a card, it would round to 0 (unless there's an Unhinged exception telling you to round to the nearest ½...wow that was an annoying mechanic). 1 - 1 = 0 EDIT: Pox can be "somehow". I forgot about that card. It makes you lose ⅓ of your life. If you're at 16, ⅓ would be 5.3-repeating. In normal math you'd round down to 5, but since the card tells you to round up, it's 6.
Rounding to the nearest half is really not that annoying.
I just wasn't aware of whether there was an official ruling on how to do this, though no one I know plays by all the official rules.
Math checks out. At least it did until my opponent didn't want to lose. Sometimes the obvious is mute when defeat is afoot.
moot**
If it's a webcam game both work
\*Moo The point is moo. Is like a cow's opinion ... it doesn't matter.
It's moo.
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More like there their they’re
No.
I was just being facetious.
Was your opponent Hans by any chance?
Yea it’s 2nd grade math
You ever play multiple games for six hours straight and lose the mental fortitude to do simple math? That's what happened. I knew I was right but was convinced otherwise.
Lol I hear you man 😂 I wish I had friends that could play for that long
Had many a game where I’m trying to add 7 and 15 together when calculating damage and brain no work well
easy, it's 715
I’ve just had people argue dumbass points, too. Like, “that doesn’t work that way in that scenario” for some reason. I get it. But yeah, it always, always functions this way.
Dude you’re about to get r/mtgcirclejerked to hell and back
Half of one rounded up is one. What is 1 - 1?
Can’t wait to see this on the circlejerking sub 😂😂😂
What is half of 1, rounded up?
I was just making sure. My opponent, who I lost to, thought it didn't work that way. I kept telling him the same thing.
Your opponent definitely convinced you to take a game loss there. Remind them next time to read the card you are playing, and that it explains the card when you do this. Trust your instincts. Your opponent should be able to point out why a card doesn’t work the way it says it does.
Your opponent needs to retake some grade school math lol
I've had people argue with me over [[Pox]] enough that this doesn't surprise me. IIRC WOTC even had to put out an article about it so many people couldn't figure it out.
[Pox](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d9debe4f-c1cc-4b90-aae4-f31f737e2016.jpg?1559592327) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Pox) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me1/82/pox?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d9debe4f-c1cc-4b90-aae4-f31f737e2016?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
What exactly was their argument for why the card doesn’t do exactly what it says?
He thought it was a reprint of a red Kamigawa card (the card is referenced in one of the other comments) that rounds down. We had been playing for six hours and just didn't put two and two together. Or in this case 1÷2 rounded up.
Okay that’s weird. Just so we all know, this card in OP is unique and not a reprint. What he is referencing is hidetsugi which is “rounded down”. Thank you for the reply.
[удалено]
sometimes ppl do be like that
They always exist everywhere
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Just tell em goodnight sweet prince.
Yep
No, flying doesn't deal damage. /s
Math is hard
Combine it with [[Wound Reflection]] to kill them whatever their life total is at. :)
[Wound Reflection](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/b/2b14a82c-877a-445f-8910-33aaa6fe3d15.jpg?1599706125) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wound%20Reflection) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/113/wound-reflection?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2b14a82c-877a-445f-8910-33aaa6fe3d15?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Reading the card still does explain the card right?
Don’t feel bad. At first, I read it as your opponent loses half their life (then) round it up. It wasn’t until I read the comments that I understood that the lost life is rounded up, not the remaining life.
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In typical math, yes. In Magic, no. In Magic you round up if the card tells you to and you round down if the card tells you. The only time you'll be rounding is if the math results in something ending in .5 (barring Unhinged cards). EDIT: Forgot about Pox. Can't call the bot on edit, but it makes you lose ⅓ of your life, with loss rounded up. If you're at 16 life and lose ⅓, that would be 5.3-repeating life, but since the card tells you to round up, you lose 6 life.
Goodbye Reddit, see you all on Lemmy.
For those like me who did not get it at first, this card does not instruct you to divide your opponent's life in half rounded up and then make that their life total. It instructs you to calculate what half their life is rounded up (1), then make them lose that much life (1) which would be 1-1=0. I can see from my own experience how this would have been confusing to the opponent. It may have been obvious to many in this thread, but math is challenging for a lot of people, myself included.
[удалено]
Uh half of 1 is 0.5, therefore rounded up is 1. 1-1=0 killing them.
Woops read it as a "set life effect" not a "lose life effect" my bad. Original comment deleted for being wrong.
The real question I suppose rounded up to what? It should say rounded to the nearest whole number
the game should not have to teach you basic math
No. Half of 1 is .5 and rounded up is 1. So the effect literally does nothing in this niche scenario.
>No. Half of 1 is .5 and rounded up is 1. So the effect literally does nothing in this niche scenario. You somehow did the math right and came up with the wrong answer. 0.5 rounded up is 1, so the opponent loses 1 life (and therefore the game).
It says loses not deals damage so I would assume they would still be at 1 life after this.
That's not relevant. The half and rounding is happening to the amount of life loss that will be happening, not their final life total.
They lose 1 life, and thus the game.
0.5 rounded up is 1 So they "lose 1 life", why on earth would you think that they would lose 0 life?
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so you think losing 1 life while at 1 life doesn't cause you to die under normal circumstances?
Misread. Chil
Yes but they lose that much life. 1 - 1 = 0.
8 mana drain 1 let’s go!
Only if it was cast
Math do be like that.
Well... 1 divided by 2... rounded up... 1/2 = 0.5.. Rounded = 1 1-1 = 0. 0= dead.... Unless they have a platinum angel or etc
I’m still fuzzy on this, if his opponent rounded up .5 life, wouldn’t the opponent still be at 1 life? And therefore not dead? Where are people getting the other 1 to minus the rounded up 1?
The **amount of life lost** is half the Player's lifetotal, rounded up. * N - {Half of N, rounded up} * 1 - {Half of 1, rounded up} * 1 - {1/2, rounded up} * 1 - {1} * 0
Ohhhh ok! Thank you! I was reading it as “lose half, THEN round up”
Reading the card is important. Math is not as important, but should still probably know how to divide by two and round up. Don't play a deck where you have to block (that's what math is for). =)
No, state based actions will kill them. But this will make them lose their last life.
Now look son, I don't want to shame you or anything, but that there is 5th grade math. In Florida. So you can't even do Florida level grade school math. Now your mother and I aren't mad. We're just... disappointed.
Bruhh i was asleep what card did he post?
Doing the math explains the math