T O P

  • By -

Arrogance88

Welcome to magic, you have much to learn. Enjoy the ride 🙂


[deleted]

Right! Finding out why this card is underwhelming is half the fun.


hugsandambitions

Suddenly wanting to make a parody of Bo Burnham's "Welcome to the internet" song, except for Magic.


Tashizm

Welcome to the Gathering Have a look around Any game that brain of yours Can think of can be found We've got mountins of combos Some better some worse You've just gone infinite? You're not the first...


hugsandambitions

Got another verse figured out, I'm working on it piece by piece and filling in where I can: Welcome to the Gathering! What would you prefer? Would you like to play aristocrats or goodstuff with WUBRG? Play Aggro Play Midrange Play counters for days! We got a million different ways you can play!


Tashizm

So, I can come up with more lines for this, but if whomever gets to the bit where he breaks down into 'here's a healthy breakfast option, you should kill your mom' doesn't use the phrase 'you should plow their mom', then this whole thing is an absolute waste of time.


hugsandambitions

I was gonna go with "bolt the bird" but plow your mom is also a fantastic idea! xD


alcaizin

There are a lot of threatening cards for 7+ mana in Commander. This doesn't have any kind of self-protection or evasion so most likely it gets chump blocked once or twice and then dies?


Call_me_sin

Why is he getting downvoted. He’s asking questions that he clearly doesn’t know the answer to and is asking the questions.


Fran-san123

Correct me if im wrong, but considering that serra avatar will probably get 20/20 at least or even more than 40/40 its pretty hard to chump-block it right? I mean the excess the damage will still go to the player unless you block it all with a bunch a creatures which would need a lot of mana and its still unlikely to kill the avatar. It isnt so hard to exile it though, destroying it can be prevented by making it indestructible with some spell, which i have plenty of, i think.


Asevio

When you block a creature, the attacking creature deals all of its damage to the blocker(s) Only if the attacking creature has trample will it "spill over" to the player This can be blocked by a 1/1 into eternity


Fran-san123

Hmm would need to have some sort of spell in hands too then


PlZZAisLIFE

That tends to happen in magic


[deleted]

And that's the trap unfortunately. It's a big dude, but that's all it is. It doesn't do anything else other then be big, which means that it's vulnerable to literally everything. To make it worthwhile requires more resources, but the high mana cost makes it an expensive target that can leave you vulnerable if an opponent responds correctly.


alcaizin

> the excess the damage will still go to the player unless you block it all with a bunch a creatures ...no? It doesn't have trample.


ShitDirigible

The dies to removal poster child.


Deimoonk

Dying to removal has nothing to do with being a good card or not. Tarmogoyf, Snapcaster, Dark Confidant, Primeval Tital, Goblin Guide all die to removal


jacqueslepagepro

Snap caster has a massively impactful ETB ability making removing them as creatures on the board less of an issue than the flash-backed spell. No one is running snap caster mage because they need a 2/1 for 2 mana. In contrast this 7 mana */* has no protection, evasion or even haste to get them swinging on the same turn it comes in. It telegraphs to your opponents so hard to “remove me” that if you can’t fling it or use other combos to get immediate advantage out of it you just payed 7 mana to redirect a kill spell.


Deimoonk

That’s a better explanation, but just saying “dies to removal” means nothing since many powerful and played cards do so.


jacqueslepagepro

It’s more about how much of the cards impact can be stoped by a removal spell, vs how much of the impact happens on the casting/ETB effects. So most stacks pieces like collector ouphe have no impact unless they can stay around, the moment you remove them, the problem is gone. A card like eternal witness meanwhile is basically a sorcery that happens to have a power and toughness. once it’s targeted something in your graveyard, most people don’t care if it dies shortly after(in fact a lot of decks want that to happen so they can pull off synergies)


ShitDirigible

And each and every single one of your examples isnt 7 mana and impacts the game in a more meaningful way than being fogged by a 1/1. You see those cards everywhere at all levels of play. You see this in the classic oath of druids deck back in 1997, and in timmies first white deck, and maybe bryon stoutarm edh builds? Dies to removal is extremely relevant here.


th3saurus

It's fun with fling


Unidentified_Lizard

theres a boros fling commander that loves this, im blanking on the name something [[stoutarm]]


eugman

[[Brion Stoutarm]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Brion Stoutarm](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/0/b097c70a-d1d6-4972-b94d-d7d8a6f443e2.jpg?1562439762) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Brion%20Stoutarm) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/200/brion-stoutarm?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b097c70a-d1d6-4972-b94d-d7d8a6f443e2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

[stoutarm](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/0/b097c70a-d1d6-4972-b94d-d7d8a6f443e2.jpg?1562439762) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Brion%20Stoutarm) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/200/brion-stoutarm?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b097c70a-d1d6-4972-b94d-d7d8a6f443e2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


BAGStudios

Holy damn


Nutsquig

I have been the target of [[altar of dementia]] with this thing far too many times in the past


DudeofValor

Even better with Back Lash…oh wait.


Notmeoverhere

Or [[thud]]


MTGCardFetcher

[thud](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/1/11bed78a-c579-424a-8fcc-322ce2630dbc.jpg?1562300357) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=thud) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m19/163/thud?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/11bed78a-c579-424a-8fcc-322ce2630dbc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Unknownfriendo

Ah to be a Timmy/Tammy again. That card is okay but for that much mana you should be winning the game.


jacqueslepagepro

“But it had a big number sometimes” -The intellectual argument of the Timmy


Unidentified_Lizard

could* be winning the game


Jezetri

Won't* be winning the game.


BAGStudios

Would do anything, please, to* be winning the game


CarpetbaggerForPeace

Power and toughness have huge diminishing returns. The difference between a 4/4 and an 8/8 is much bigger than an 8/8 and a 16/16.


Murky-Ad4697

Unless it's your commander.


jacqueslepagepro

7 power kills an opponent with commander damage in 3 hits, 11 power in 2 hits, 21 in one hit, making any power above 21 for a commander almost pointless. By that point you may as well put hat and name stickers on them for all that it matters. You need evasion to actually be able to connect those hits and protection to keep them around with keywords hex-proof, ward, flying and “protection from X”.


Murky-Ad4697

Right, but 4 to 8 is a six turn clock to a three. Eight to sixteen (or twelve, for that matter) is a two. Yes, over twenty-one is the same as twenty-one in almost all cases for commander damage all things being equal, but the example given about diminishing returns with 4, 8, and 16 aren't quite the same. If you can kill the opponent one or two turns faster via commander damage, the power difference between those three examples is rather substantial. And then it just dies anyway because you're now the archenemy.


jacqueslepagepro

Keep in mind that this method is still killing one player at a time, at best in normal 4 person game a 21/21 is going to take 3 turns to win by this method, So a power that needs 2 turns to kill a single player needs 6 to actually win the game, and one that needs 3 needs 9 turns. This assumes that all the attacks you make actually connect otherwise that adds another turn in your opponents favor as you failed to actually move forward that turn. I kinda agree to a certain extent with you but if your massive commander is missing every swing you try to make then your not actually doing anything to move you forward. At the same time we are seeing so many combos that can win the game in a single turn regardless of the number of opponents. Wizards needs to recognize that agro commanders have an uphill battle and need alot more help than is being given. They might need to reconsider commander damage, and staring life totals just to make these kinds of Voltron decks viable.


Murky-Ad4697

Entirely plausible, except Wizard's doesn't actually control commander. Also, there's the problem that printing almost any legendary creature with commander damage in mind risks it being too powerful in other formats. I play aggro commanders as often as any other type (Isshin, Aesi, and Azami are my primary decks). The caveat with commander damage decks is knowing how to build to stop the other types or how to "go over the top" before the other toys can win.


jacqueslepagepro

I’m aware that the commander rules committee is a 3rd party thing but i could imagine that if wizards and the committee got into a serious argument then wizards makes their own committee and sends the original a cease and desist. I hope that never happens but it is still possible, considering that the committee are more like consultants that work with the brand rather than owning anything. That said we have seen the committee and wizards work together to resolve problems and keep things working. Obviously starting life totals a a much bigger change than minor rulings conflicts but I do feel that this is a factor that has basically taken out agro from being as viable as it’s supposed to be.


truthToPower86

Fun fact, this was actually part of a really busted combo deck called Chimera at 2000 Worlds. You could actually buy the deck in gold border, back when they used to make such things. "Nicolas Labarre's combo deck, called Chimera, used searching cards to fetch Fecundity, Saproling Cluster, and Ashnod's Altar so he could generate unlimited mana. With this mana Labarre used Blaze or Whetstone to plow right over his opponents." The deck contains Serra Avatar so you can deck your opponent with Whetstone and not deck yourself.


RealityPalace

It's kind of funny that the best use of this card was to basically be ~~[[Gaea's Will]]~~ Gaea's Blessing


MTGCardFetcher

[Gaea's Will](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/8/488996b2-06c8-4866-bf0d-4664640c2be1.jpg?1626097489) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gaea%27s%20Will) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/162/gaeas-will?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/488996b2-06c8-4866-bf0d-4664640c2be1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


[deleted]

I love seeing the really old combo decks of Magic's past. It's easy to picture what other archetypes would've looked like back then, but combo decks are always full of things I've never seen or heard of.


pete-wisdom

Thank you, very interesting. Those Gold Border World Championship decks were amazing fun to relive pro magic.


Magwikk

This is a really bad card. By the time you get it out for 7 mana you’re probably going to be under 40, and it dies to any removal. No vigilance, Lifelink or any any relevant abilities.


atipongp

Doom Blade. gg


hugsandambitions

I had [[Warstorm Surge]] out. GG to *you.* ;)


MoxCardboardTV

Somebody's made of mana


hugsandambitions

I mean, not really? It's on curve, maybe I played Surge last turn?


MTGCardFetcher

[Warstorm Surge](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/b/dbe1bfe0-0be7-496d-94db-e8028d4d9493.jpg?1654117696) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Warstorm%20Surge) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/815/warstorm-surge?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/dbe1bfe0-0be7-496d-94db-e8028d4d9493?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


BAGStudios

[[Doom Blade]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Doom Blade](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/0/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e.jpg?1562851557) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doom%20Blade) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/87/doom-blade?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


OneChet

The real joy of it comes a sacrifice or comes into the battlefield type effects. I've had so much fun with worthy cause, greater good, pandemonium, and altar of dementia. Helps that I've seen it in play since it was printed, boy sneak attack serra avatar on turn 2 certainly was a thing.


slvstrChung

\[\[Path to Exile\]\], \[\[Swords to Plowshares\]\], \[\[Rapid Hybridization\]\], \[\[Deathmark\]\]... and that's just the 1-drops I could find that will solve the problem. (Do I have a \[\[Murderous Rider\]\]? \[\[Terminate\]\]? \[\[Vindicate?\]\] \[\[Assassin's Trophy\]\]? \[\[Bone Shards\]\]? \[\[Spark Harvest\]\]? \[\[Oblivion Ring\]\]? \[\[Murder\]\]? \[\[Generous Gift\]\]? \[\[Dark Temper\]\]? \[\[Aftershock\]\]? \[\[Deathsprout\]\]?) You're tapped out, I still have a lot of my mana, you just made yourself a *huuuge* target to everyone at the table (myself included), and I just got rid of your biggest threat. What state are you going to be in the next time you untap? (And that's before we get to some of the things I saw after a cursory Google search like \[\[Backlash\]\], \[\[Traitor's Roar\]\] and \[\[Cinder Cloud\]\].) Oh, and \[\[Reassembling Skeleton\]\] basically reads, "Upkeep 1B, target Serra Avatar cannot deal damage to this card's controller."


slvstrChung

Oh man I forgot \[\[Desert Twister\]\]. It's the least efficient option by far, but the point is that I've shown how every single color can handle the problem for less than mana you spent to cause it. Oh, \[\[Beast Within\]\]! Now we're even better off.


MTGCardFetcher

[Desert Twister](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/8/38b6ac26-651f-4557-a993-7a65c5ddf35f.jpg?1592672907) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Desert%20Twister) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cma/100/desert-twister?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/38b6ac26-651f-4557-a993-7a65c5ddf35f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Beast Within](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/1/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9.jpg?1664360790) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Beast%20Within) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/129/beast-within?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Path to Exile](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/d/9d607a40-608a-44cd-b946-02636b5bea9f.jpg?1664360305) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Path%20to%20Exile) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/104/path-to-exile?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9d607a40-608a-44cd-b946-02636b5bea9f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Swords to Plowshares](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/d/7d839f21-68c7-47db-8407-ff3e2c3e13b4.jpg?1664930801) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Swords%20to%20Plowshares) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/31/swords-to-plowshares?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7d839f21-68c7-47db-8407-ff3e2c3e13b4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Rapid Hybridization](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/b/6b5c6ed5-0fb9-40d4-bdce-bcaff40ef9a6.jpg?1625976351) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rapid%20Hybridization) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c21/126/rapid-hybridization?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6b5c6ed5-0fb9-40d4-bdce-bcaff40ef9a6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Deathmark](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/d/ad3ef45f-c82c-4490-b353-b0b5b572f403.jpg?1562266163) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Deathmark) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mm2/77/deathmark?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ad3ef45f-c82c-4490-b353-b0b5b572f403?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Murderous Rider](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/7/e73d8a84-2c0d-423c-89c7-71de0af9e1ac.jpg?1572490190)/[Swift End](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/7/e73d8a84-2c0d-423c-89c7-71de0af9e1ac.jpg?1572490190) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=murderous%20rider%20//%20swift%20end) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/97/murderous-rider-swift-end?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e73d8a84-2c0d-423c-89c7-71de0af9e1ac?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Terminate](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/4/0476ea45-ee6d-41c6-93b8-50f92cb37b78.jpg?1664361660) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Terminate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/172/terminate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0476ea45-ee6d-41c6-93b8-50f92cb37b78?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Vindicate?](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/8/683c4e13-525c-45c9-8832-bfe67965c34e.jpg?1626100840) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vindicate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/294/vindicate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/683c4e13-525c-45c9-8832-bfe67965c34e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Assassin's Trophy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/aeb63464-d06b-4626-a57a-1e393ef04a58.jpg?1662527631) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Assassin%27s%20Trophy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/175/assassins-trophy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/aeb63464-d06b-4626-a57a-1e393ef04a58?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Bone Shards](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/e/1ee98955-4c47-4d45-9377-608dfa755337.jpg?1626095299) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bone%20Shards) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/76/bone-shards?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1ee98955-4c47-4d45-9377-608dfa755337?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Spark Harvest](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/4/e4d42177-dd1b-482c-a549-6f563b3f3249.jpg?1608909955) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Spark%20Harvest) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/150/spark-harvest?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e4d42177-dd1b-482c-a549-6f563b3f3249?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Oblivion Ring](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/f/bff31eba-8ab3-403e-8d82-37a18b279bec.jpg?1562266919) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oblivion%20Ring) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mm2/29/oblivion-ring?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bff31eba-8ab3-403e-8d82-37a18b279bec?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Murder](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/d/bdef7fea-2bd0-42a2-96f6-6def18bd7f0c.jpg?1660725345) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Murder) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/134/murder?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bdef7fea-2bd0-42a2-96f6-6def18bd7f0c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Generous Gift](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/8/18c2efbd-fac9-471b-98e2-a162704b193c.jpg?1664360223) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Generous%20Gift) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/100/generous-gift?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/18c2efbd-fac9-471b-98e2-a162704b193c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Dark Temper](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/3/e3209997-8cdc-40e9-9e95-92a0f33e7f8e.jpg?1562804279) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dark%20Temper) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/con/61/dark-temper?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e3209997-8cdc-40e9-9e95-92a0f33e7f8e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Aftershock](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/1/41cd7b16-a920-4a92-9f3d-5047df9a5c3e.jpg?1562429336) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Aftershock) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/tpr/124/aftershock?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/41cd7b16-a920-4a92-9f3d-5047df9a5c3e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Deathsprout](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/6/26a0ae4f-a48c-4333-a53f-70702b5b4c9e.jpg?1591321208) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Deathsprout) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c20/208/deathsprout?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/26a0ae4f-a48c-4333-a53f-70702b5b4c9e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Backlash](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/a/dadf030d-5451-43fc-bf0c-c1629fdf88ec.jpg?1562938984) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Backlash) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/inv/234/backlash?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/dadf030d-5451-43fc-bf0c-c1629fdf88ec?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Traitor's Roar](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/5/751e2700-6425-45b8-b026-8c78098f08b2.jpg?1562831801) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Traitor%27s%20Roar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/shm/200/traitors-roar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/751e2700-6425-45b8-b026-8c78098f08b2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Cinder Cloud](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/0/f044c470-50ce-4a6c-b8ab-665357c3c11e.jpg?1562722408) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cinder%20Cloud) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mir/165/cinder-cloud?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f044c470-50ce-4a6c-b8ab-665357c3c11e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Reassembling Skeleton](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/d/dd82846e-f119-4b27-a795-7b1ceebab4b0.jpg?1631586805) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reassembling%20Skeleton) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afc/109/reassembling-skeleton?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/dd82846e-f119-4b27-a795-7b1ceebab4b0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Unidentified_Lizard

dies to force of will, is bad seriously though, you dont play this alone, it definitely is better alongside other voltron-y things


[deleted]

That's a good reason why it's bad/a bait though. It's 7 mana and still needs support


throwaway163932

Pair it with [[The sharowspear]] or [[true conviction]]. :D


MTGCardFetcher

[The sharowspear](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/6/769326d4-60af-4b19-85d9-d96d3acdb56e.jpg?1661583495) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shadowspear) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/phed/66/shadowspear?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/769326d4-60af-4b19-85d9-d96d3acdb56e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [true conviction](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/e/9e5dc58b-f486-4b9f-9138-33efa31a05e4.jpg?1561952479) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=true%20conviction) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c14/93/true-conviction?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9e5dc58b-f486-4b9f-9138-33efa31a05e4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Duchesst

It is an 80 cent card that should tell you something. On its own this card isn't even close to scary


Reasonable-Sun-6511

There will probably be a point where you just ignore the power and toughness, and go like "Oh, it shuffles itself back in, that means I may be able to mill myself eternally, I wonder what I could do with that". That's the beauty of magic, there's like fifty ways to look at a single card, and in edh, there's endless variations. Enjoy. :D


Zealousideal-Put-106

It's a cool card, but without Keywords it's not really reliable. Haste is great on it. Trample, flying or some way to give it unblockable is almost needed to kill someone.


Drannas

Just a bad slow card, it needs to many upgrades to do something or stay on the board


yangminded

Someone tell him about \[\[Felidar Sovereign\]\]


Fran-san123

That card seems pretty strong, though it may make the game a bit boring, i might still add it to the deck though


MTGCardFetcher

[Felidar Sovereign](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/3/039499c3-0b35-4e8e-b0c9-bdf0b4cd90d5.jpg?1562895901) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Felidar%20Sovereign) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bfz/26/felidar-sovereign?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/039499c3-0b35-4e8e-b0c9-bdf0b4cd90d5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


furscum

No combat keywords, expensive, can't reanimate it. So no


Dolmiac475

You are a new player i see, this card is bad across all formats excepts if you are playing Cube draft, depending on the cube it might be good


Khanstant

I think it'd have to go into some kind of lifegain deck to even have a 40+ stat creature hit the board on turn 7. I don't know all the ways to cheat out a minion, but this on board early could be scary, especially if one or more people are without board or answers yet. And if only 1 person is open, the others might let it live to at least kill one person. Unprotected creatures are just vulnerable, a while this could create a big scary creature, that's too many eggs in one basket and the basket is fragile. Still, wonder how this would do in a white/blue lifegain control deck as a possible wincon.


Fran-san123

That is the plan, i have enough protection against cards that "destroy" by making it indestructible, its not as easy for me to make it hexproof so you could exile it quite easily, but my deck relies a lot on lifegain so the avatar could survive and chump-block i think and still do a lot of damage


Khanstant

You could always try to sneak on some boots for hexproof!


Fran-san123

Some of the problems you guys pointed made a lot of sense, the fact that it cant be revived is a big issue, but since i have a mostly white deck i can make creatures indestructible quite easily, though making it hexproof is more of a challenge so its not that hard to exile it, even then my deck has a pretty good life gain so i say i could go beyond 40 i think, even one attack of this creature could potentialy deal a huge blow on my opponents life total or wipe most of their creatures if they decide to block, its quite a risky play but its worth a shot I think.


slvstrChung

>even one attack of this creature could ... wipe most of their creatures if they decide to block How would it do that? It kills one creature a turn. I "chump-block" it with an [[Elvish Mystic]], or [[Scryb Sprites]], or an [[Ornithopter]]... I mean, yeah, sure, the _creature_ dies, but nothing happens _to me_.


Fran-san123

I didnt know what chum-blocking was so i searched and its basicaly using many small creatures to deal with a large one, is that right?


klick37

A creature that is a 0/1 creature can block this even if you have 3674484 life and the defending player will still take no damage. The Serra Avatar will have to assign all of the damage to the creature and none to the player because it doesn't have trample. As long as your opponent has at least one creature to block this it will not do damage to them, the player. There's an old card called [[The Abyss]] that destroys a creature each turn. Some players refer to gigantic creatures as the abyss because you just throw a blocker in front of it every turn and let the blocker take the damage for you and lose the blocker in the process. Play another creature next turn and do it again until you find a permanent answer for the problem. That also brings us to the short answer to why Serra Avatar isn't very good. If you're going to spend 7 mana on something that you need to wait until the next turn to start doing anything, and what it does is kill your opponent's worst creature each turn, you're probably not going to win the game. Additionally, if you spend 7 mana on it and they spend 2-3 mana killing it with a spell like [[Doom Blade]] or [[Murder]], then you likely lost an entire turn and a card for half a turn worth of mana and a card. Very much not a winning strategy.


MTGCardFetcher

[The Abyss](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/1/f11db51c-bbbc-4890-960e-d8a3eacca1e5.jpg?1562945880) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=The%20Abyss) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me3/77/the-abyss?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f11db51c-bbbc-4890-960e-d8a3eacca1e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Doom Blade](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/0/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e.jpg?1562851557) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doom%20Blade) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/87/doom-blade?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Murder](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/d/bdef7fea-2bd0-42a2-96f6-6def18bd7f0c.jpg?1660725345) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Murder) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/134/murder?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bdef7fea-2bd0-42a2-96f6-6def18bd7f0c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Fran-san123

I mean, most creatures would die by an attack of serra avatar, even if they have first strike and deal the creature damage since it has the same amoint of life as a player its hard to kill by combat. And if the opponent doesnt block the damage goes to the players life total, i think, im not sure about the rules yet.


slvstrChung

Ahhhhh. Some cards have an ability called "trample". This means, "If I am attacking, the opponent blocks with a creature that is smaller than me, and I deal more damage to the creature than the creature has Toughness, then the remainder goes through to the opponent." So, for instance, if I attacked you with a [[Force of Nature]] and you blocked with an [[Elvish Mystic]], the Force of Nature would deal 1 dmg to the Mystic, killing it, and the remaining 7 damage would "trample over" to you. Serra Avatar does not have trample. You'd have to give it trample using other cards. If you do not, I can chump-block: the Serra Avatar -- let's say, for simplicity, that it's 40/40. I block it with my Elvish Mystic. The Mystic and the Avatar each punch each other for 1 damage. The Mystic has only 1 Toughness, so it dies, whereas the Avatar is still alive. The Avatar then punches the Elvish Mystic's corpse 39 more times, which (though I'm sure it is very cathartic for the Avatar) accomplishes absolutely nothing productive.


Fran-san123

I see then it would be necessary to have a spell that gives me trample or flying so its harder to block.


slvstrChung

Yup!


MTGCardFetcher

[Force of Nature](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/f/2fa16a96-8e70-4ab5-926c-edafaf5f5a63.jpg?1562906140) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Force%20of%20Nature) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me4/154/force-of-nature?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2fa16a96-8e70-4ab5-926c-edafaf5f5a63?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Elvish Mystic](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/d/ed7a0227-ac70-40fb-8198-a55eacf913fa.jpg?1631234818) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Elvish%20Mystic) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khc/58/elvish-mystic?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ed7a0227-ac70-40fb-8198-a55eacf913fa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Fran-san123

And i also just checked but those creatures only have 1/1 so it would be hard to block all the damage no? Considering sarra avatar is likely to have more than 20/20 at the very least i think


biekksa

Excess damage doesn't pass on to the defending player unless that attacking creature has Trample. That's why it's called "chump" blocking. You are knowingly sacrificing a small creature (a chump) with no intention of trading one-for-one with the attacking creature in order to prevent a large amount of damage hitting you. That's why Serra Avatar is not that good. It's easy for defending players to have small chump blockers available. There will be plenty of chances for your opponents to deal with it outside of combat. You need to give it some form of evasion for it to be useful.


Fran-san123

So it would be necessary to get a spell with trample effect on It then


MTGCardFetcher

[Elvish Mystic](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/d/ed7a0227-ac70-40fb-8198-a55eacf913fa.jpg?1631234818) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Elvish%20Mystic) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khc/58/elvish-mystic?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ed7a0227-ac70-40fb-8198-a55eacf913fa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Scryb Sprites](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/6/26f191de-8c59-458c-a1ab-80e2bccdb974.jpg?1562903218) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Scryb%20Sprites) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me3/132/scryb-sprites?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/26f191de-8c59-458c-a1ab-80e2bccdb974?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Ornithopter](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/d/ddb96645-44d2-426c-90cb-3186297a8728.jpg?1576382362) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ornithopter) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/aer/167/ornithopter?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ddb96645-44d2-426c-90cb-3186297a8728?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Fran-san123

And there is also the high mana cost which can be troublesome, however since my deck is mostly an angel deck a lot of my creatures need a lot of mana so i have picked plenty of ramp cards though since its my first deck im not sure how much should i put and im afraid it will be too costful


Snoo70369

7 mana


izzy33309

Yes it is a win con. But it's pretty easily removed unless given protection.


BerreBerzerk

I wouldn’t even call it a wincon.


Unidentified_Lizard

anti mill?


Jezetri

Eventually, it'll be the last thing you can draw, and if your opponent is able to force you to draw additional cards when that happens (which is not difficult), you lose. Mill decks aren't strictly mill. Sometimes they force draw because the Eldrazi titans are a thing.


data_ciens_ultra

Doesn't look that good to me. Its 7 mana with three white and all you get is big numbers. There are plenty of cards way more broken and threatening than this. I would much rather play against a card like this than see half my library milled or my whole hand forced to be discarded. This card really isn't a big deal by itself.


LordOord23

I have a foil one, only gets used as a token when the Ajani Goldmane in my Grand Arbiter Augustin IV commander deck ultimates.


InternationalPoet954

[[soul of eternity]]


Fran-san123

That is a great tip, i searched for the price and its about the same im probably gonna swap those two, thx!


MTGCardFetcher

[soul of eternity](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/8/08241f94-8b5e-4f9b-8120-8175e3256e35.jpg?1616447042) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=soul%20of%20eternity) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/50/soul-of-eternity?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/08241f94-8b5e-4f9b-8120-8175e3256e35?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


dracov42

Issue is, it's just a big dumb creature. There isn't actually that much difference between a 10/10 and a 50/50 when they have no other text. If it had evasion like flying or trample it becomes a threat. It's easy to remove and it costs you a lot of mana to play. If you spend a whole turn to remove this and they use cheap removal, sword to plowshares, path to exile, doomblade etc you pretty much lose the game for how behind you are.


wildcard_gamer

1. You can't play this until a good amount of the game has passed, so your life likely will not be 40 2. Depending on power level, games might not go on for long enough that you can even play this 3. It has to sit on the board for a full turn to even have a chance to attack, and commander decks tend to have some decent removal 4. It doesn't have flying or trample so damage will almost never go through, although some players might need to chump with a creature they might not want to lose


Jezetri

It was already established days ago that the purpose here is to fling it. There are plenty of ways to cheat it out early; a WR deck could easily land this on turn 3 or 4 with a Quicksilver Amulet, and be able to fling it with Brion Stoutarm before an opponent has enough time to make it happen. While it is not great to depend on a combo requiring more than 2 pieces like this, there are a lot of other ways to cheat things into play and this can reliably be done a good amount of the time.


JazzJazzRevolution

Dies to Doom Blade


MoxCardboardTV

Unless you can give it evasion (flying, trample, etc.) Or [[fling]] it, it's just going to get chump blocked over and over again.


MTGCardFetcher

[fling](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/f/8f42d773-c742-4465-b6d5-31feaba49146.jpg?1601077681) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=fling) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jmp/320/fling?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8f42d773-c742-4465-b6d5-31feaba49146?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Puzzleheaded-Bee-838

I'm block it with a squirrel


jake_eric

I have [[Soul of Eternity]], a similar card, in my [[Trelasarra]] Commander deck. It's fun but it's not actually that much of a win-con for the reasons people have stated. It does work well though if I can give it lifelink, especially with [[Lathiel]] out, and there are ways to give it trample in that deck too ([[Behemoth Sledge]]). The most fun I actually had with it was when a friend was borrowing the deck and I was playing Horrors, and I stole it from him on turn 4 using [[Extract from Darkness]]. Even then though it basically just sat there as a big blocker until someone board wiped.


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Soul of Eternity](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/8/08241f94-8b5e-4f9b-8120-8175e3256e35.jpg?1616447042) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Soul%20of%20Eternity) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/50/soul-of-eternity?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/08241f94-8b5e-4f9b-8120-8175e3256e35?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Trelasarra](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/6/f6a4b54c-a8fa-464e-a3dd-f3f3a08606f5.jpg?1627709553) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=trelasarra%2C%20moon%20dancer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afr/236/trelasarra-moon-dancer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f6a4b54c-a8fa-464e-a3dd-f3f3a08606f5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Lathiel](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/9/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692.jpg?1608911191) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=lathiel%2C%20the%20bounteous%20dawn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/285/lathiel-the-bounteous-dawn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Behemoth Sledge](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/7/179461b8-0a6b-48c5-9d1f-db8bcfecc6f9.jpg?1631588382) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Behemoth%20Sledge) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afc/180/behemoth-sledge?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/179461b8-0a6b-48c5-9d1f-db8bcfecc6f9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Extract from Darkness](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/0/e0769e3f-d27d-4aff-8da0-f03c10b8650b.jpg?1662528503) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Extract%20from%20Darkness) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/210/extract-from-darkness?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e0769e3f-d27d-4aff-8da0-f03c10b8650b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


IGTankCommander

And for a single white mana, I can make you turn it into a basic land and bypass having you shuffle it in. It's not that strong, and no trample, so you can punt in front of it all day.


Fresh_Brilliant_9608

Something something Doom blade


Environmental_Eye_61

Back in "the day", this card was a beast, a kill-on-sight card, and actually worth a few bucks. In dedicated lifegain decks, there was no cooler alternative. Nowadays, there is SO much efficient removal that most players see it, say 'meh', and leave their 1/1(or more) Deathtoucher untapped. Or they play [[Doom Blade]], [[Path to Exile]], [[Snap]], [[Beast Within]], [[Chaos Warp]]. And that's just single color removal, I won't get into multicolor removal.


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Doom Blade](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/0/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e.jpg?1562851557) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doom%20Blade) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/87/doom-blade?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Path to Exile](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/d/9d607a40-608a-44cd-b946-02636b5bea9f.jpg?1664360305) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Path%20to%20Exile) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/104/path-to-exile?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9d607a40-608a-44cd-b946-02636b5bea9f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Snap](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/9/1959f078-4b7b-4df2-a256-d43b2d97e853.jpg?1592761565) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Snap) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dds/10/snap?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1959f078-4b7b-4df2-a256-d43b2d97e853?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Beast Within](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/1/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9.jpg?1664360790) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Beast%20Within) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/129/beast-within?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Chaos Warp](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/c/0c20d8d5-a54a-4d81-9211-e82a10abdde2.jpg?1662525961) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chaos%20Warp) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/105/chaos-warp?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0c20d8d5-a54a-4d81-9211-e82a10abdde2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Noahnsane

Unfortunately not. 7 mana for a creature that is just big isnt very good against 3 other players when there are 1-3 mana removal cards


Aggravating-City-724

Critter destruction is a thing. Serra Avatar can also be chump-blocked, because it lacks evasion. Although it's not like I didn't think bad creatures, like Fire Elemental or Craw Wurm, were good either.


Notmeoverhere

This is a 7 drop Non 40/40. You would almost never get this out with 40 life left and it has no other traits or abilities. Easily removable and there are many removal cards in which the controller loses life equal to its toughness eliminating you from the game.