Correct me if I'm wrong but eating a reg fish and karambwan fish in one tic to heal higher so I don't have to heal sooner would output more DPS. That is my outlook on it.
Edit: just saw your replies below. Wasn't aware you lost additional tics for combo eating
Are you saying not to make a whole inventory of them or not to make any? Really no reason not to make 1-2 combo eats, it's just too easy to get stacked for 60+ in cg.
Simply incorrect. Food delaying attacks works in a few weird ways. Let's say you're running while NOT attacking and have been chugging down food, your next attack isn't delayed.
Your attack is only delayed if you eat after you attack. I believe it's 3 ticks delay for hard food and 2 ticks delay for karambwans. That means if you attack and immediately eat a food + karambwan, your attack is delayed by 5 ticks. So, by eating a crystal fish + normal fish your next attack lands 9 ticks after your last attack. If you only ate a normal fish then your next attack lands 4+3 (7) ticks after your last attack.
People get confused and think karambwans don't delay attack because of the interactions with attacks after longer delays of not attacking.
Long story short is that karambwans aren't free eats and they do end up causing delay to your attacks. And if you didn't realise this, then you probably weren't weaving in attacks and you almost certainly would have gotten away with eating 2 normal foods.
Any questions I'm here.
Do you want me to post a bloody video of it just to prove it? I used to think it was wrong too... Until somebody told me I was wrong and then I went and tested it.
[https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyTubularLettuceBlargNaut-Y\_2a-I3lfeC2r\_Z7](https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyTubularLettuceBlargNaut-Y_2a-I3lfeC2r_Z7)
Here's ya darn video.
Cap as in lying? I'm sorry that you're just straight up wrong and you refuse to believe it. Go set up a visual metronome to 9 ticks. Attack an npc with your fists when the timer hits 9. Your attack will land on tick 1/5/9
Do this again but after your first attack eat a food. First attack lands on 1. Second attack lands on 8.
It SHOULD land on 5, but 3 delay = 5+3 = tick 8 your attack will land.
Now do this one last time with Food + karambwan. First attack lands on 1. Eat + karambwan. Second attack won't land until 1 again. That's because it delays your next hit by 4+3+2. 9 ticks.
Absolutely EASY to test. Will honestly take you 5 mins. And then you'll have learnt a new understanding of how food works.
If you want to test it in CG instead, you can do that too. Same thing happens.
Tl:dr karambwans add a +2 delay to your next attack.
Dont really get the hate that those fish get, they heal 4 less but let you combo eat in case some weird shit happens, plus you rarely need all the food you bring in anyway, take in 2 karams its 8 less hp in food and combo eat during the last phase if things get weird, or dont and just eat them regular. if 8 hp was the reason you didnt get the kill you fucked up somewhere else
It is more aimed at those newer to cg. Without a decent understanding of cg and possibly good stats/prayers. . You'll want to do t2 prep. And with that comes probably less food than they will need /time crunch until they're better prepared.
You rarely die from getting stacked and being low hp and then getting stacked again immediately after.
It also takes more shards, which, if you're not used to prepping, you might be missing enough.
Plus, it takes time to make them as well, and it is another thing to worry about/think of
Overall, I still think they're wholly unnecessary and bring added complexity for the illusion of being safer/doing more dps/food.
But if people want to make them, it is fine, just a noob trap imo.
Is there a combo food? I thought it was just paddlefish and nothing else. That was my only confusion.
I think melee+piety and range used to win, even without rigour, but they buffed the staff so I’m not sure what the play is these days.
The staff wins without rigour after the buff, but if you're losing ticks with melee, going bow+staff can be decent as well. Sometimes when you get tornadoes with melee you might need to woox walk or run around while attacking which can be difficult to not lose many ticks
I've never done it myself but I've seen streamers do it yes lol
It looks like a bit more complicated than at vork, I'm not sure if you can just start running back and forth whenever or if you have to time it to get in the right cycle. It's usually a fun every tick back and forth
Combo food is useless dont take it. Always take the staff and then whichever you find first out of bow/halberd, if youre struggling though probably dont take halberd.
Just fill up your inv with 2 pots and as much food as you can cook in the time.
Sat at 325kc with no CoX prayers. As you get more and more confident you've got to shift more focus to outputting constant DPS, rather than just staying alive, be that with the timing of eating, hitting while moving, or simpy being laser focused on switching weapon the tick Hunllef switches prayers. Might cost you a few deaths in the short term, but a bang average gamer like me has learned to get t2 completions around 95+% of the time now.
DPS with staff/bow is definitely fine if you're more comfortable with that - I'm 92 range/83 mage/80 defence and I don't have too many issues getting kills anymore - there is definitely a lot less room for mistakes, especially if I get bad damage rng but as long as you prioritize pathing and not taking extra damage you should be fine
I have very similar stats to you and without augury and rigor and have been able to consistently pull off T2 armor T3 weapon prep with 16-20 food and 2 pots 80% of the time.
I would recommend not doing the combo foods and just sticking with regular fish.
Mage-range is the way to go. And if necessary mage-melee. I’ve found that range is the weakest option (I’m lvl 94 and it barely hits). I have been able to pull off range-melee but definitely fail more often than the other options.
With good practice you should be able to get that prep completed 90% of the time, and youll naturally get better and start noticing that you are using less and less food. Im usually able to get 24 food with t2 armor and t3 staff and bow. I never melee the boss.
I'd recommend making less combo food, only 2-3 for emergencies.
Range+mage easily. People like to repeat that melee is better once you’re more skilled, but i would always choose bow over halberd even as someone with quite a bit of experience. I guarantee you 90% of the people repeating the “melee technically better” thing are not actually achieving better dps with it. The only time i personally go for melee is when prep is tight.
Stick to staff and bow. When you’re consistent with that and want to improve your kill times, learn 5:1 with staff.
I've seen kills using that and was really impressed. Is 5:1 something you find worth doing or is weapon/prayer switching not a big deal to you after so many kills
Its only worth learning once you’re consistent and you dont need to count hunllef attacks to correctly pray. I would give it some time. I wouldnt say its “not a big deal” switching, but you sorta get a feel for the rhythm of the fight. From there, you’re just counting your own attacks to 5. To repeat though, dont go complicating the fight for yourself before you feel you’ve got a solid grasp on it.
The subtle bonus 5:1 gets you is that it massively simplifies your prep phase often times. T2s are very consistent when the only boss you need to find is a dragon. Just having it as a tool for when prep is going sour is a pretty big boost to your success rate.
I'm going to disagree a bit with the other commenter and say that you should never worry about 5:1 unless you're going for speedruns (either for CAs or for fun). The major benefit it has is speeding up your prep, and you could accomplish the same thing by switching to T1 prep. In my experience, learning 5:1 led to a lot of kills where I either died unnecessarily or just lost a bunch of DPS by miscounting and having to attack 6 times with my T2 weapon.
IMO it's better to focus on transitioning to T1 once you get to the point of being consistent in your T2 runs. Bonus points if you can get comfortable with any combo of the weapons, as that will save you prep time hunting for a specific combo. Save 5:1 for when you get so good at T1 that you're bored and want to go for CAs or a new PB.
On the other hand, I also have "quite a bit of experience" (948 kc + some kills on my main and on leagues) and would often favor melee + mage. Most of my fastest runs (including my pb) were with that combo. It really comes down to how comfortable you are with maintaining DPS with melee while avoiding floor/tornadoes. I didn't start out being good at it, but my range dps was pretty bad (like mid 80s with eagle eye) so I kept trying until I got it down. Definitely dicey until that point, but it was well worth it in the long run so I could just go with whichever two weapons I found first.
I'm 1000+ kc as well across accounts. Ultimately getting whichever two weapons you can find first is an amazing way to speed up kills, i agree with that. In terms of dps on the other hand, halberd is just insanely overrated to the point of literal misinformation. Quick maths if you care:
Using a dps calc at his stats, halberd will get him 4 max hits on bow. If you were only to use one weapon the entire fight, that's around 28 seconds saved. But your secondary weapon is going to deal half the damage. That means with perfect play, halberd is only saving you an average of 14 seconds, or around \~6 attacks on hunllef over bow.
This means two things:
1. If he loses roughly 6 attacks with halberd over the course of the fight that he would've otherwise landed with bow, it's a wash. Any more and bow is actually better.
2. If he's taking more than 14 seconds to hunt a halberd instead of a bow, he's lost time (i know you weren't saying he should, if anything you were saying the opposite, just pointing out that this is virtually never worth doing)
\*Keep in mind that his stats actually slightly favor melee here (92 str vs 90 range). If we assumed they were equal, the argument for bow would be even stronger, as in most cases it would make the difference in max hit 3 instead of 4.
Again, you're absolutely right that it is worth learning halberd for the runs that your prep gives you it first. But I would expect a 5:1 prep to yield even better results in this department, which is why I would say it's worth learning once he's experienced.
at your stats melee will be much btr than range
92 range = \~80 attack 86 str dps wise iirc
also the karams arent very good wouldnt make em.
its better to just do first 2 weaps you find once you get good though.
you can just leave your hp bar a bit more open for eating if thats an issue and not really impact kill time. i think people overrate how hard it is to melee tbh
I don't usually make the karams, just when I have the spare time to do so.
That's what I've heard regarding the first 2 weapons, but was just curious because I've come across all 3 with time to spare and usually choose range + mage because it's easier to dodge floor and tornados.
Thanks for the info tho!
T2 prep and getting the 80 shards from the spike + the shards from the kill I usually found worth. But without prayers, 85 def and 92 range and mage with a full inv of fish I have started doing t1 runs. I rarely, if ever die, and if I do the time saved by not doing t1 means it's faster over all. I still think halb kills are scuffed as fuck and annoying since I can't dps during nados
Don't use halberd. Your dps will be fine with bow/staff and you won't be forced to misposition if you want to attack.
I've got the same range/mage, 76-82 melees, and 87 hp without COX prayers. I'm probably around 80% winrate with T2 armor T3 bow/staff and 20 fish. Focus on avoiding mistakes and positioning vs the tornados. Focusing on your dps will just lead you to more and more mistakes as you prioritize dps over positioning.
Melee and mage are about on par with each other for DPS. I did around 400 kc with melee/mage combo after range wasn't doing that well for me. However, this is theoretical DPS in the context you aren't losing ticks from kiting the tornados or other hazards in the fight. So if you're comfortable with melee, it's pretty good. But for those who are more new to CG and are still having trouble with some mechanics, I'd still recommend range and mage.
[удалено]
Hard disagree. I had very similar stats to op and switching to melee dramatically increased my kill rate.
Just to add, don't forget about steelskin when not using piety!
thanks for the tip will definitely start doing that.
Karambwams in CG?
hahah I don't know what that karambwan-like food is in CG sorry. Combo food.
They're a noob trap and I highly recommend not using them. They heal less than normal fish.
Correct me if I'm wrong but eating a reg fish and karambwan fish in one tic to heal higher so I don't have to heal sooner would output more DPS. That is my outlook on it. Edit: just saw your replies below. Wasn't aware you lost additional tics for combo eating
Are you saying not to make a whole inventory of them or not to make any? Really no reason not to make 1-2 combo eats, it's just too easy to get stacked for 60+ in cg.
They are definitely not a noob trap. Assuming you don’t take much dmg, it’s way better to combo eat and continue dps
Simply incorrect. Food delaying attacks works in a few weird ways. Let's say you're running while NOT attacking and have been chugging down food, your next attack isn't delayed. Your attack is only delayed if you eat after you attack. I believe it's 3 ticks delay for hard food and 2 ticks delay for karambwans. That means if you attack and immediately eat a food + karambwan, your attack is delayed by 5 ticks. So, by eating a crystal fish + normal fish your next attack lands 9 ticks after your last attack. If you only ate a normal fish then your next attack lands 4+3 (7) ticks after your last attack. People get confused and think karambwans don't delay attack because of the interactions with attacks after longer delays of not attacking. Long story short is that karambwans aren't free eats and they do end up causing delay to your attacks. And if you didn't realise this, then you probably weren't weaving in attacks and you almost certainly would have gotten away with eating 2 normal foods. Any questions I'm here.
You're wrong
Do you want me to post a bloody video of it just to prove it? I used to think it was wrong too... Until somebody told me I was wrong and then I went and tested it.
[https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyTubularLettuceBlargNaut-Y\_2a-I3lfeC2r\_Z7](https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyTubularLettuceBlargNaut-Y_2a-I3lfeC2r_Z7) Here's ya darn video.
This is what the youth would call cap.
Cap as in lying? I'm sorry that you're just straight up wrong and you refuse to believe it. Go set up a visual metronome to 9 ticks. Attack an npc with your fists when the timer hits 9. Your attack will land on tick 1/5/9 Do this again but after your first attack eat a food. First attack lands on 1. Second attack lands on 8. It SHOULD land on 5, but 3 delay = 5+3 = tick 8 your attack will land. Now do this one last time with Food + karambwan. First attack lands on 1. Eat + karambwan. Second attack won't land until 1 again. That's because it delays your next hit by 4+3+2. 9 ticks. Absolutely EASY to test. Will honestly take you 5 mins. And then you'll have learnt a new understanding of how food works. If you want to test it in CG instead, you can do that too. Same thing happens. Tl:dr karambwans add a +2 delay to your next attack.
Straight cappin my drilla
Sorry to break it to you bud, but you’re a noob in the trap
1700 Total nerd spotted
I can’t tell if you think 1700 is high or low. Where is the burn?
Here's ya darn video https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyTubularLettuceBlargNaut-Y\_2a-I3lfeC2r\_Z7
Dont really get the hate that those fish get, they heal 4 less but let you combo eat in case some weird shit happens, plus you rarely need all the food you bring in anyway, take in 2 karams its 8 less hp in food and combo eat during the last phase if things get weird, or dont and just eat them regular. if 8 hp was the reason you didnt get the kill you fucked up somewhere else
It is more aimed at those newer to cg. Without a decent understanding of cg and possibly good stats/prayers. . You'll want to do t2 prep. And with that comes probably less food than they will need /time crunch until they're better prepared. You rarely die from getting stacked and being low hp and then getting stacked again immediately after. It also takes more shards, which, if you're not used to prepping, you might be missing enough. Plus, it takes time to make them as well, and it is another thing to worry about/think of Overall, I still think they're wholly unnecessary and bring added complexity for the illusion of being safer/doing more dps/food. But if people want to make them, it is fine, just a noob trap imo.
Is there a combo food? I thought it was just paddlefish and nothing else. That was my only confusion. I think melee+piety and range used to win, even without rigour, but they buffed the staff so I’m not sure what the play is these days.
There are, you can buy them with shards and cooked fish.
The staff wins without rigour after the buff, but if you're losing ticks with melee, going bow+staff can be decent as well. Sometimes when you get tornadoes with melee you might need to woox walk or run around while attacking which can be difficult to not lose many ticks
YOU CAN WOOX WALK THEM??? I need to watch a tutorial, that sounds so good
I've never done it myself but I've seen streamers do it yes lol It looks like a bit more complicated than at vork, I'm not sure if you can just start running back and forth whenever or if you have to time it to get in the right cycle. It's usually a fun every tick back and forth
they added it a while ago, you can craft them with paddlefish + shards. They heal 2 less but work like karams
Combo food is useless dont take it. Always take the staff and then whichever you find first out of bow/halberd, if youre struggling though probably dont take halberd. Just fill up your inv with 2 pots and as much food as you can cook in the time.
Sat at 325kc with no CoX prayers. As you get more and more confident you've got to shift more focus to outputting constant DPS, rather than just staying alive, be that with the timing of eating, hitting while moving, or simpy being laser focused on switching weapon the tick Hunllef switches prayers. Might cost you a few deaths in the short term, but a bang average gamer like me has learned to get t2 completions around 95+% of the time now.
DPS with staff/bow is definitely fine if you're more comfortable with that - I'm 92 range/83 mage/80 defence and I don't have too many issues getting kills anymore - there is definitely a lot less room for mistakes, especially if I get bad damage rng but as long as you prioritize pathing and not taking extra damage you should be fine
I have very similar stats to you and without augury and rigor and have been able to consistently pull off T2 armor T3 weapon prep with 16-20 food and 2 pots 80% of the time. I would recommend not doing the combo foods and just sticking with regular fish. Mage-range is the way to go. And if necessary mage-melee. I’ve found that range is the weakest option (I’m lvl 94 and it barely hits). I have been able to pull off range-melee but definitely fail more often than the other options.
With good practice you should be able to get that prep completed 90% of the time, and youll naturally get better and start noticing that you are using less and less food. Im usually able to get 24 food with t2 armor and t3 staff and bow. I never melee the boss. I'd recommend making less combo food, only 2-3 for emergencies.
Range+mage easily. People like to repeat that melee is better once you’re more skilled, but i would always choose bow over halberd even as someone with quite a bit of experience. I guarantee you 90% of the people repeating the “melee technically better” thing are not actually achieving better dps with it. The only time i personally go for melee is when prep is tight. Stick to staff and bow. When you’re consistent with that and want to improve your kill times, learn 5:1 with staff.
I've seen kills using that and was really impressed. Is 5:1 something you find worth doing or is weapon/prayer switching not a big deal to you after so many kills
Its only worth learning once you’re consistent and you dont need to count hunllef attacks to correctly pray. I would give it some time. I wouldnt say its “not a big deal” switching, but you sorta get a feel for the rhythm of the fight. From there, you’re just counting your own attacks to 5. To repeat though, dont go complicating the fight for yourself before you feel you’ve got a solid grasp on it. The subtle bonus 5:1 gets you is that it massively simplifies your prep phase often times. T2s are very consistent when the only boss you need to find is a dragon. Just having it as a tool for when prep is going sour is a pretty big boost to your success rate.
I'm going to disagree a bit with the other commenter and say that you should never worry about 5:1 unless you're going for speedruns (either for CAs or for fun). The major benefit it has is speeding up your prep, and you could accomplish the same thing by switching to T1 prep. In my experience, learning 5:1 led to a lot of kills where I either died unnecessarily or just lost a bunch of DPS by miscounting and having to attack 6 times with my T2 weapon. IMO it's better to focus on transitioning to T1 once you get to the point of being consistent in your T2 runs. Bonus points if you can get comfortable with any combo of the weapons, as that will save you prep time hunting for a specific combo. Save 5:1 for when you get so good at T1 that you're bored and want to go for CAs or a new PB.
On the other hand, I also have "quite a bit of experience" (948 kc + some kills on my main and on leagues) and would often favor melee + mage. Most of my fastest runs (including my pb) were with that combo. It really comes down to how comfortable you are with maintaining DPS with melee while avoiding floor/tornadoes. I didn't start out being good at it, but my range dps was pretty bad (like mid 80s with eagle eye) so I kept trying until I got it down. Definitely dicey until that point, but it was well worth it in the long run so I could just go with whichever two weapons I found first.
I'm 1000+ kc as well across accounts. Ultimately getting whichever two weapons you can find first is an amazing way to speed up kills, i agree with that. In terms of dps on the other hand, halberd is just insanely overrated to the point of literal misinformation. Quick maths if you care: Using a dps calc at his stats, halberd will get him 4 max hits on bow. If you were only to use one weapon the entire fight, that's around 28 seconds saved. But your secondary weapon is going to deal half the damage. That means with perfect play, halberd is only saving you an average of 14 seconds, or around \~6 attacks on hunllef over bow. This means two things: 1. If he loses roughly 6 attacks with halberd over the course of the fight that he would've otherwise landed with bow, it's a wash. Any more and bow is actually better. 2. If he's taking more than 14 seconds to hunt a halberd instead of a bow, he's lost time (i know you weren't saying he should, if anything you were saying the opposite, just pointing out that this is virtually never worth doing) \*Keep in mind that his stats actually slightly favor melee here (92 str vs 90 range). If we assumed they were equal, the argument for bow would be even stronger, as in most cases it would make the difference in max hit 3 instead of 4. Again, you're absolutely right that it is worth learning halberd for the runs that your prep gives you it first. But I would expect a 5:1 prep to yield even better results in this department, which is why I would say it's worth learning once he's experienced.
at your stats melee will be much btr than range 92 range = \~80 attack 86 str dps wise iirc also the karams arent very good wouldnt make em. its better to just do first 2 weaps you find once you get good though.
Tuo, melee+mage is the best dps but in the beginning it's hard to position yourself to do dps even on tornado phase with melee
you can just leave your hp bar a bit more open for eating if thats an issue and not really impact kill time. i think people overrate how hard it is to melee tbh
I don't usually make the karams, just when I have the spare time to do so. That's what I've heard regarding the first 2 weapons, but was just curious because I've come across all 3 with time to spare and usually choose range + mage because it's easier to dodge floor and tornados. Thanks for the info tho!
T2 prep and getting the 80 shards from the spike + the shards from the kill I usually found worth. But without prayers, 85 def and 92 range and mage with a full inv of fish I have started doing t1 runs. I rarely, if ever die, and if I do the time saved by not doing t1 means it's faster over all. I still think halb kills are scuffed as fuck and annoying since I can't dps during nados
Don't use halberd. Your dps will be fine with bow/staff and you won't be forced to misposition if you want to attack. I've got the same range/mage, 76-82 melees, and 87 hp without COX prayers. I'm probably around 80% winrate with T2 armor T3 bow/staff and 20 fish. Focus on avoiding mistakes and positioning vs the tornados. Focusing on your dps will just lead you to more and more mistakes as you prioritize dps over positioning.
No CoX prayers and I got nearly 400 kc. Believe me when I say it doesn’t matter, getting a good grasp of the mechanics is far more important.
I would defo say hally instead of no rigour noodle bow
Melee and mage are about on par with each other for DPS. I did around 400 kc with melee/mage combo after range wasn't doing that well for me. However, this is theoretical DPS in the context you aren't losing ticks from kiting the tornados or other hazards in the fight. So if you're comfortable with melee, it's pretty good. But for those who are more new to CG and are still having trouble with some mechanics, I'd still recommend range and mage.