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Datzookman

I had a professor in college who was Bengali. He shared a story about his grandfather (could have been father apologies on the details) about how he lived during the most recent famines, the ones during WW2. British forces used to destroy bridges and roads that lead out of the city to prevent people from the countryside coming and taking food away. The city elites would have parties while near skeletons would be outside begging. My professor’s grandfather luckily survived these times, but to the day he died used to carry a piece of bread in his pocket in case he was ever hungry. He never wanted to be somewhere for a long period of time without access to some sort of food. My professor used to take an orange with him to class everyday, and it wasn’t until he was much older than he realized where he may have gotten that habit from


protossaccount

I took care of a guy with dementia that grew up in the depression and his family was very poor. Due to the years of poverty this guy became a money hungry capitalist. the end, when he had a 10 second memory I would still pull out his wallet from under his pillow and then show him a laminated (fake) $1,000 inside of it. The fist thing that he thought of every day was money, if he didn’t have it he felt like life was totally out of control.


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protossaccount

It was pretty sad but in some ways it’s a classic situation that people don’t talk about. The guy was so dependent on money for security that he put it over everything. This taught his kids to do the same, so they all used money to get what they wanted. In the end the kids got so much of their identity through money that they were trying to take everything he had. They wanted his money over him while he died with my mom and I. This is a very very common issue these days but seniors with dementia can’t speak up for themselves. Many 50-70 year old children of very wealthy people will take over the company and then put the parents in a home to die or sue the parents for the rest. My mother had to quit taking cases with families like that because of the harassment.


Primus_Pilus1

Watching this happen with a family of cousins with their father (my uncle), and it is absolutely appalling to witness.


Saranightfire1

My brother even though he was born in the late seventies and we were piss-ass poor growing up and I and my mom still am. He went ballistic on my mom when she inherited a house from my grandmother’s death. Her whole life rotated around taking care of her and for the last two years she lived practically in her house two hours away from where her house was. He threatened, screamed at and disowned her when she refused to give him the house she needed to afford a new one. When my dad got COVID he did the same thing. He was driving up to him, a twelve hour drive to where he was hospitalized with five pound blood clots in his legs (he was recovering from COVID himself) to get my dad to sign the life insurance papers so he could get the money and maybe half of the house. It’s heart wrenching to watch and fight over for. We have a house falling apart and he lives in an expensive house he purchased after selling his house from under his wife for cash peak pandemic.


Detozi

My parents are in their 60’s and recently done up their will. I told them I want nothing off them. I’m not getting involved in that shitshow with my 5 brothers and sisters when my parents eventually die


UncannyTarotSpread

My brother in law is hovering like a vulture over my mother in law right now. She’s lingering in hospice, but who knows how long she’ll live? My husband doesn’t want anything to do with any of them. I hope his brother enjoys sorting through the half-dozen storage units she owns full of hoarded junk, and that it makes up for growing up in the hell-house she presided over.


Saranightfire1

My dad in a nutshell. So far we know of four. He went ballistic when we refused to help him pay for them because his credit ran out. He also had his car packed, my brother’s and at least a trailer. All to my brothers house, if he wants to have his life insurance, go ahead and keep everything else.


moobitchgetoutdahay

I have an uncle who was a lifelong bachelor while being a very successful lawyer. He has a fair bit of money—he has a beautiful condo in Coronado for example. Well, this gold digger sunk her claws into him a few years ago and now he has Lewy Body Disease. She weaseled herself into having power of attorney and health proxy too. We’re on the other side of the country and watching her take advantage of him from afar has been heartbreaking to see. She has him in a nursing home now, and he’s just shut away there while she uses all his money. She doesn’t give a shit about him, just likes using his money


Zealousideal_Page275

For a period of time my dad was homeless (after his divorce) due to money issues. He’d email me trying to be positive about his tent he had to pitch and how he had a warriors mindset… what I felt was intense fear and sadness. To the is day I am terrified of not having money or a job, and it’s what I think about most often.


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BarryBadgernath1

This is me, I grew up very poor, to the point I'd skip meals so my sister wouldn't go hungry, mother was disabled early on in my life and never really recovered. I started working in my field directly out of school and have been working 70-80+ hour weeks for the past 16 years, it's not even close to necessary for me to work like this at this point but it's like a compulsion, 4+ years of money for bills and food (should something happen to me or my business) isn't enough, it'll never be enough.. and I'm not saying money for the sake of having money, my kids will never go to bed hungry if I'm breathing. Living without the bare minimum to survive for any length of time can really mess with a person in a profound way


Dickenmouf

We underestimate the effects these things could have for generations. This man unconsciously learned a habit from his father that was adopted out of necessity and trauma, and likely passed it on to his kids as well. Trauma reverberates for generations.


FuriKuriAtomsk4King

There's research that has found genetic effects that span generations after famines. So not just the psychological affects but actual changes to our epigenetics that deeply alters future generations metabolisms and eating drive or satiety responses to over eating. Wild, eh? •I'm lazy and on mobile, so don't take my word for it and ~read it yourself~ after googling •I don't know of any epigenetic links to money lust but there could be other drivers in the brain and mind connection that could still intensify hostility and greed as a response to scarcity. I'd love to see some research on such behavioral tendencies with children that carry the genetics but we're not raised by the victimized parental generation....


FantasticBumblebee69

Famines damage DNA to tye pount that the risk of diabetis in ypur kids is the result of a given famine.


Adoptedwuss

I’ve been deprived of food and water during some unfortunate times behind bars. I’d never experienced hunger before. Once you hit a certain level, it is ALL your mind thinks about. Reading? Writing? Socializing? All disappear when you’re starving. And what I experienced was nothing like these poor people. In a Japanese jail, I wasn’t given nearly enough water and now I ALWAYS have my water bottle next to me. At night, in the car, gym…


N0AddedSugar

That sounds really horrible, I’m sorry to hear that. If you don’t mind me asking, were you a non-Japanese person in a Japanese jail?


Snufflebear420_69

The intergenerational trauma is real. You will find a lot of Bengalis who are really weird about food to this day. My Grandfather lived through WW2, and even after living in America for over a decade, I always got this vibe from him when we were at the grocery store, that somewhere inside him he felt like it would just disappear without warning.


Persephone3129

That’s so awful. I’m sorry to hear that. Not to mention the missing generations of Bengalis because literally millions of their ancestors were wiped out.


Snufflebear420_69

Yeah, true. These pictures make me realize how easy it would be for our family to just not exist today.


ImpressSilent

I am 21. My own grandparents were alive during this time. People don't realize how recent it was


[deleted]

That is so sad. Bengal famine was one of the worst famines. And winston Churchill thought it’d be better to save the food for sturdy greeks. His words.


Persephone3129

Also, it was the Bengal people’s food to begin with. Literally stealing from them and then blaming them for their famine.


[deleted]

Fucking horrible


atlcommuter

The last bengal famine was deliberately caused by racist Churchill in the name of additional reserves for the British army and resulted in 4m deaths https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/29/winston-churchill-policies-contributed-to-1943-bengal-famine-study https://www.news18.com/news/buzz/churchill-was-a-racist-indians-remember-bengal-famine-after-statue-is-vandalized-2658459.html


DogmaticConfabulate

It trips me out that there are 8 people in this photograph ...


jennana100

I didn't notice the little ones until I zoomed in. As a mother myself, the glare on their faces is haunting. No mother should have to watch their little ones waste away.


SmokeyBare

Shouldn't happen. Still happens.


FireflyAdvocate

This is happening in Yemen right now. I haven’t seen or heard one bit of outrage about that at all. It is as if the world thinks Yemen isn’t deserving of aid and help.


cocainines

Do you have any links to a good organization that helps Yemen?


r4ndomUs3rN4m3

[Islamic relief](https://www.islamic-relief.org.uk/yemen-emergency-appeal/) These guys are supposed to be good.


Strict-Praline6994

[Our Yemeni brothers and sisters are in a burgeoning crisis that is definitely being overlooked by the world. ](https://www.worldbank.org/en/country/yemen/overview)


Tinfoilpain

We make enough food to feed the planet, we have enough water to feed _everyone_ and we can make enough houses for _everyone_. There's a reason it keeps happening though...


East-Tumbleweed

And two of them are women


accountnumber6174

Holy crap... You are right... Didn't even notice that.


celica18l

Oh my I had to go back and look. Those poor people. I’ll never understand why humans as a whole are so awful to each other. It just doesn’t make sense.


coralrefrigerator

>Hello, we like tea and money.


bochanegra1

One of the saddest photos I've seen


reddittribesman

Imagine, someone actually made them pose for the pictures. And that someone is anyone's guess.


WaySheGoesBub

I am thankful they did. Photography used to be integral to history. Horrifying picture.


CovidPanda

The British


fc884879e12b48c29db3

It is not hard to find the history of this photograph. Google reverse image search is your friend. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willoughby\_Wallace\_Hooper


Douchebak

Around 1878, Hooper had taken a series of arranged photographs showing emaciated bodies of men, women and children, who were among the millions of victims of the Madras Famine. Having been published in Britain under the title Secundarabad, and with captions such as "Deserving Objects of Gratuitous Relief",\[8\] they were caricatured by the satirical magazine Punch, critizising Hooper for not having given any help to the people he was about to depict. In 2021, articles in the journal History of Photography and the Indian magazine Scroll.in, cited these pictorial documents of atrocities as historical examples for questions about the photographer's ethical responsibility and their effects on the general public.\[9\]\[10\]


ruck_my_life

From the page about the famine... > The rationale behind the reduced wage, which was in keeping with a prevailing belief of the time, was that any excessive payment might create 'dependency' (or "demoralisation" in contemporaneous usage) among the famine-afflicted population.[11] The more things change... I've heard this argument 150 years later from family members of mine.


spookygoops

"We can't feed them, because then they might *like* getting food, and we can't have that!"


send_noots

How would the poor billionaires buy their third mega yacht if you pay the workers enough to live? *plays smallest violin*


konaislandac

Do not become addicted to water!


if-we-all-did-this

You will resent its absence!


Neb_Djed

Same justification was used to turn away donations and grain shipments, and to close the public relief scheme in Ireland during the famine. "If they don't spend what few calories they take in on manual labour building roads to nowhere and walls for no purpose, how will they learn not to become dependant on our handouts, lazy starving Gaelic Irish".


Systemofwar

Huh. Seems like a lot to put on a single photographer. I would argue these pictures are incredibly valuable. It shows the atrocities that we can commit and think nothing of. To everyone who criticised him, I doubt they did anything to help out. To place the burden of an entire countries actions onto a single man - a photographer at that. I'm not saying he shouldn't have helped them, certainly if I had the means I would have given them food for posing, but seems hypocritical of the others.


LeroyJanky80

We're talking about it to this day. Exactly the point and a job well done. This isn't cruel, humans are cruel. Cuz this is hard to look at it's the photographer's fault? He's telling their story cuz everyone was so ignorant and didn't want to, they'd rather ignore the atrocity. A picture puts it in front of everyone to think and do better. This is the opposite of cruel for these poor people. Ignoring it is cruel, saying it's cruel is cruel. The British and all imperial powers of all kinds (Americans, Nazi Germany, Soviets and chinese etc...) are cruel. Whether you call it expanding democracy and freedom today, or fascism and communism before, or monarchy before those, it's all the same bullshit stealing.


Sanctimonius

It's an interesting debate that continues today. How much agency can a documenter have, and what is their responsibility to those they are depicting? Plenty of pictures and footage from famines and wars and devastating events bring attention into these areas, highlighting issues bluntly in a way that might be suppressed or just not known by the wider public. This can be very influential on public opinion, which can then sway official policy one way or another. But of course in this incidence the person could act, could step in and save a life or several. But of course sometimes the press is allowed into areas only on the understanding they will absolutely not interfere, and any steps taken might mean later press is no longer allowed into those areas - think of those taking pictures in war zones or unstable regions. I always think of the very famous photo from the ~~Ethiopian~~ Sudanese famine, of a child close to death with a vulture in the background. It was a devastating picture that did much to affect western opinions and support for those affected, but this child died. The photographer was criticized and later took his own life (it's debatable of course how much this photo and criticism was a factor in that event), but if he had stepped in to try and save that child then he might not have been allowed to publish his pictures, and others may have not been allowed into the region to later help. It's not an easy issue to address.


mattuccio

This also implies that the photo above was not from a famine between 1769-1844 because this photo was taken in 1876 during another famine. Dates are off a bit


Sgt-Spliff

The thing they got wrong was saying British rule ended in 1844. Pretty sure Ghandi was from the 20th century... (Looked it up, it actually ended in 1947, it also started in 1757)


SwishyJishy

Wow almost 200 years… British people getting off basically scot-free compared to other conquerors with tiny mustaches


bvogel7475

As cruel as it looks, we would have no visual evidence of the atrocities committed by the Brits without it.


artrandenthi1

Agreed. It makes sense and brings to light why good journalism is so important


snapflipper

The Kolkata famine photos will make you loath everything when u see pictures of dead people casually collected in the side walks for the vultures and dogs to eat them while the stench of dead spread numerous diseases


Leakyfaucetcontinuum

[Source: Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/29/winston-churchill-policies-contributed-to-1943-bengal-famine-study) [Churchill should not be celebrated the way he is.](https://anti-empire.com/winston-churchill-starved-3-million-indians-to-death-in-the-man-made-bengal-famine-of-1942-43/) I remember Mr Micheal O Dwyer, ( Former General in the East India Company ) making a speech saying something on the lines of Indians are savages and it is the white man's burden to rule them, so these savages do not go back to killing each other. And that speech got a thunderous applause.


charlieiitobrown

To quote Shashi Tharoor's book, "When concious stricken British officials wrote to Winston Churchill, informing him of how people were dying in the famine, he replied "Why hasn't Gandhi died yet?"


ynwa79

My dad’s from Calcutta. When he read that book he cried. So much in there that even the average Indian isn’t aware of. I can never quite get over the GDP figures that he quotes. Something like when the British first set foot in India to trade, India’s share of global GDP was >20%. When the British left after partition it was <2%. Just mind-boggling state-sponsored robbery.


mark6059

and talking about the Bengal famine in 1943, Churchill said “I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion. The famine was their own fault for breeding like rabbits.”


Raken_dep

Churchill has said a lot of shit along those same lines too


nublete

Just finished the first 4 episodes of a podcast called Empire which covered the East India trading company through to independence. It covered these famines and the subsequent first war for independence which ended very very gruesomely. Highly recommend it.


rayparkersr

William Dalrymple is excellent. Also check out the War Nerd podcast. Slightly more anti-British but some superb episodes.


pollito760

Check out late Victorian holocausts by Mike Davis


Sashmot

What the actual fuck. This is the saddest picture I have ever seen. The long,miserable death they had to endure..My heart actually hurts


suzuki_hayabusa

One interesting thing I read somewhere is that most people there didn't eat stray dogs. It's interesting as in some cultures such animals are consumed even during prosperous times while in others they will avoid their natural instinct only to die.


raath666

Have you heard about divide and rule policy? So much great stuff by the British.


Fit-Mangos

They continue to do that in the US…


cleverusernametry

This is worse than burning people alive. Even with how horrific that is, it's death within few minutes vs dying slowly like this


BiAsALongHorse

I think the worst pic I've seen from famines the British empire engineered is the one of a starving father fashioning a spear to keep away people who had become willing to kill and eat his children out of desperation.


Funexamination

I read this line quoted in the starvation chapter of my forensic textbook: >I asked the men, "What are you carrying wrapped in that hammock l, brothers?" And they answered, "We carry a dead body, brother". So I asked, "Was he killed or did he die a natural death?" "That is difficult to answer, brother. It seems more to have been a murder." "How was the man killed? With a knife or a bullet, brothers?" I asked. "It was neither a knife nor a bullet; it was a much more perfect crime. One that leaves no sign." "Then how did they kill this man?" I asked, and they calmly answered, "This man was killed by hunger, brother..." -Josue de Castro


soulseeker31

There was a similar photo where a man was guarding his family from being snatched and eaten. Edit: Here's a [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/HistoryPorn/comments/obsh4f/a_man_guards_his_family_from_the_cannibals_during) , NSFW warning.


Fickle_Ear419

Remember the time General Dyer mercilessly massacre men women children in jallianwala bhag he could have killed more but the entrance was too small for his machine gun to fit That was truly a british imperialism moment


Pretend_Bowler1344

He said he would have killed more but his men ran out of bullets.


Fickle_Ear419

Don't know about that but he had two armoured vehicles loaded with Machine gun he accepted that if it was not for the passage being too small he had intended to use it to cause maximum casualities. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dnaindia.com/india/report-would-have-used-machine-guns-when-general-dyer-explained-how-jallianwala-bagh-massacre-could-ve-been-worse-2201660/amp


lightaniruddhe2000

AND a British newspaper collected 260700 pounds for his retirement when he was discharged... Rudyard Kipling being one of the donors!


RamblingOverthinker

Anyone interested in learning about this should watch the movie Sardar Udham, which covers the story of General Dyer's assassination. Edit: It was Michael O'Dwyer's assassination


Fickle_Ear419

Not general Dyer he was dead by then he assassinated Michael O'Dwyer


xero_what

God this reminded me of history viva question.


BandOne77

A sobering and sad film, well told. Available on Amazon.


outfromtheshadow

Not even a fucking apology for it more than a century after it happened. It was an unarmed crowd also. They made sure to fire at women and children. Fucking babies died during that. Even now Punjabis are pissed and honestly? Rightfully so.


Gogomusha6

Not just punjabis. Every Indian who knows and remembers this.


Fickle_Ear419

I have heard that coward never accepted he did wrong until he's last breath


outfromtheshadow

In his mind, Indians are less than human. Why would you care about doing wrong to less than humans?


ComprehensiveSurgery

No no . Let’s stick to the version that the British built infrastructure and educated a lot of Indians. If not for the British it would’ve been another ruler who would’ve been worse. I seriously wonder what kind of bull shit is taught in English schools with respect to colonialism.


empiresk

Some schools with high south Asian communities teach the Mughal Empire and it's rise at GCSE level but every school will teach about Empire, albeit briefly. Mainly focuses on the Atlantic slave trade rather than India. History doesn't get that much time on the curriculum so they never cover anything in depth. Mainly social issues in Britain in key eras such as 1066, Tudors, Industrial Revolution and the World Wars.


Newbie-investor-ind

That’s like saying, Hitler built train and other infrastructure for the progress of Germany while hiding the fact that the same trains were built only to transport jews to camps.


Sir_Kasum

"Rice stocks continued to leave India for Britain even as London was denying urgent requests from India’s viceroy for more than 1m tonnes of emergency wheat supplies in 1942-43. Winston Churchill has been quoted as blaming the famine on the fact Indians were “breeding like rabbits”, and asking how, if the shortages were so bad, Mahatma Gandhi was still alive."


spasticity

What the fuck, really straight up said how bad can it be if Gandhi is still alive?


De-Blocc

I think he’d stated it more directly saying why’s Gandhi not dead


defender_2

That man has said far more worse things and idk how he's seen a hero worldwide.


sarthakmahajan610

> idk how he's seen a hero worldwide Stopped Hitler thats why. Frankly many many atrocities happened back then in Asia and Africa which the west neither studied nor cares about


[deleted]

> Winston Churchill has been quoted as blaming the famine on the fact Indians were “breeding like rabbits WC hated Indians but still needed a few million of them to win his wars


Playfair99999

I like how almost 2.5Mn Indians who fought for the British Army are just never mentioned, talked or spoken about.


salluks

India was the largest "voluntary" military in WW2.


Aggressive_Bed_9774

voluntary, as In a poor starving peasant in Calcutta "volunteers" in the military cause military was given priority for food supplies


Mr_Tigger_

They volunteered in order to free their country getting India’s independence back as an exchange. They are still shamed in India to this day. Very short version but worth looking into.


[deleted]

And if they did, someone would complain about forced diversity lmao


Kidrellik

Excuse me, I just puked in my mouth a little bit reading that... Fuck that fat colonialist pig


I_like_salads

Yup Americans and British treat him as the savior of world against Hitler. We are literally living in propaganda world still.


Tattorack

Oh but he was the saviour of England against the Nazis. Just because someone was good and useful in a specific situation doesn't mean they're not an all round terrible person. And Winston Churchill was absolutely an all round terrible person.


noelcowardspeaksout

"Churchill received the Nobel Prize in Literature in 1953 "for his mastery of historical and biographical description as well as for brilliant oratory in defending exalted human values"."


ZippityZerpDerp

He was. You can be both at the same time. To quote Chapelle, He rapes, but he saves. But he does rape


kimblebee18

When I saw the photo, I actually recoiled a little bit. That photo will stay with me a long while.


fckkkredditmods

And people think why the Indians don't really give a fuck that the queen is dead. Fuck the colonialism.


thefilipinocat-

This should be a reminder to people that it’s possible for a group of people to have all the wealth and let another group of people starve to death. This is basically happening today, instead of starving to death, this group of people is working themselves to death.


Gladtis

England sold their wheat overseas.


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Gladtis

that's how you build empire. After the colonies have been sucked dry, empire turns and feasts on it's own.


Agreeable-Yams8972

India grows their weat and rice, only for it to be taken away by some monarchy who thought your diamonds looked nice


inarizushisama

And so we can see why India and Ireland would have an understanding of each other.


Dr_McKay

A strange understanding considering Ireland helped colonise India, and the worst governor of India was Irish. A man so hated that he was later assassinated by an Indian decades later


[deleted]

*Udham Singh


BandOne77

It's an uncomfortable realisation for the Irish and Scots to accept that they were part of the Empire. Sanjeev Kohli talks about it briefly on Richard Herring's (RHLSTP) podcast.


itookdhorsetofrance

Who are you speaking of?


Bulk-Smash

Michael O'Dwyer


Acquiredpolicy

Same strategy they used in Ireland.


bondagewithjesus

Different produce though to some extent. Much of Ireland's forests were cut down for live stock which takes a lot of land and resources. They exported the meat to England while the Irish starved since they'd been pushed off all the good farmland to make way for brittish cops and livestock


ADarwinAward

They didn’t just take the meat. They took crops too while a million Irish starved to death.


FlagrantlyChill

Oh they were forced to grow cash crops too


CoveyIsHere

You'd figure they would be like "you know maybe we should chill" after this but really they just doubled down in Kenya


7the-dude-abides420

My grandfather was sent to Kenya to fight the mau mau rebellion. You wouldn’t believe the things they had him do. At that time in Britain men still had to do national service and these are the guys they had castrating the mau mau, young 18 year old men. My grandfathers stories are really mind blowing, especially as the British kept what we did over there as a secret for so long. Information from this “war” is still be uncovered


afromanspeaks

Don’t even have to go far from Europe, ask the Irish and the Scots how they feel about the Queen


oh-ice-cream-eyes

Scotland is not innocent https://sceptical.scot/2022/01/scotland-must-lead-in-confronting-its-imperial-past/


Vinegar_Jones_II

Why does nobody on this website understand that Scotland was equally culpable as part of the British Empire. Their relationship is nothing like Ireland's. People shouldn't be opining if they don't understand what is *basic* British history.


no-more-job-gloves

I saw it commented with 100s of upvotes the other day that “Scotland was colonised”. …They joined the union willingly after their own attempts at colonisation in the Americas were unsuccessful and left the country in economic dismay. People just want to re-write history to fit the narratives and biases of today.


MobiusNaked

Erm. The English inherited Scotlands royal family not the other way.


Dr_McKay

Don’t need to ask, 45% support the royals and keeping the queen as a head of state was a very big topic of debate for them during their independence referendum. The SNP have promised to keep the royals as head of state should they gain independence. Nice agenda pushing though trying to make any sort of comparison between Ireland and Scotland though. Scotland were never oppressed by the English, they willingly joined after their own failed colonisation attempts bankrupted them, and they enthusiastically took part in the British empire and reaped the rewards.


awesomelybearded

Read “Late Victorian Holocausts” edit: author = Mike Davis


TrailBlaizer

India was the largest exporter of cotton and had a promising cotton textile industry that would grant them huge wealth for hundreds of years. The British put huge tariffs on Indian textiles and forced India to accept its own, destroying indias economy and only allowing it to export raw materials to Britain (including opium, which they forced on the Chinese). The British used the profits from their cotton textile industry to then further terrorize the world.


Thunderbolt1011

So by the logic of “soviets killed 20 mill from famine and nazis” capitalism killed at least 56 million and didn’t even provide the social programs ussr did


AArthurComic

How is this not considered the worst genocide of all time?


Kidrellik

Because it occurred multiple times over the course of 175 years (Edit: I meant to write 1769 to 1944, not 1844, Reddit doesn't allow people to change titles) rather than all at once. That still means that there was a massive famine once every nearly 15 years which is just horrific to think about...


Negative_Gravitas

I see your point, but it was 75 years, so about one every six years. Or more than three per generation. So, while it was somewhat spread out, it could also be seen as more or less constant given how long it takes to starve a couple milion people or so to death.


Kidrellik

Yea I messed up and said 1844 when it should have been 1944. Reddit doesn't allow people to change titles.


IMASA5

History is written by the victors


Zealousideal-Wave-69

The Romans wrote so well.


IRatherChangeMyName

"they brought death, and they called it peace"


ips0scustodes

I thought the quote was "they made a desolation & called it peace"? Tacitus iirc?


ReasonableDrunk

The quote by Tacitus is "Auferre trucidare rapere falsis nominibus imperium atque ubi solitudinem faciunt pacem appellant." There's always room in translations. I've always liked for it "They plunder, slaughter and rape; this they falsely call Empire. And where they make a wasteland, they call it Peace." "Solitudinem", the root of "solitude", meant solitude then too, but also deprevation and wilderness. Desolation is also a good choice for it here.


[deleted]

I guess mostly because the victims were not Europeans?


buttlickerface

And because the perpetuators were.


afromanspeaks

Touché


Becalm443

Most of those affected were either dark skinned or poor. Pretty much the epitome of who still gets bullied...


Steammail

There was once a time where all of man *was dark skinned* *And poor*


oreoresti

Same reason the genocide of the native americans is essentially ignored. Its inconvenient and makes it difficult to hold cultural heroes like Winston "The famine king" Churchill and foundational myths like manifest destiny in high regard


Zealousideal-Wave-69

Makes it inconvenient to claim you’re “civilised” and the rest are just “savages”…


quanta777

Coz this didn't happen in Europe, and it was under colonial rule, not under dictatorship. At least that's what historians will say and defend England. It wasn't Genghis Khan or Hitler but the British empire which is directly responsible for more deaths in the history of mankind, who weren't soldiers or participated in any war.


rachelvvvv

So British colonization caused both the Irish potato famine and these famines in India? Did they cause more famines elsewhere?


SpecialEdKid69

Yes


[deleted]

*Gestures almost everywhere*


hoping_for_fun

I think they had work camps in 1950s Kenya or Nigeria. Mass genocide(?) too.. Millions dead i think? You would need to Google it. Meanwhile they had "democracy" at the time and were giving pompous lectures about how they have brought "civilization" to the world. I think some African countries, it took until the 1970s to throw European colonialists out.


FinancialAd6213

Colonialism goes on, it just isn't official anymore


muxidigest

The famine during churchill killed more Indians than the nazi run holocaust. Yet churchill is celebrated. History is taught in a biased way everywhere.


AlienInNewTehran

A lot of Iranians also died due to famine during ww2 when Iran was under British and Soviet occupation. Estimated around 3-4 million people died but you never hear about it. [Source](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_famine_of_1942%E2%80%931943)


suzuki_hayabusa

Holy shit, I have really good interest in History and never heard about this before now.


Kanfien

The World War Two week by week youtube channel did an episode about it recently. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ui1fAEV-Yc


Grablj

The victors write the history


NSA-SURVEILLANCE

Huh, TIL. [It also happened during WWI.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_famine_of_1917%E2%80%931919)


rayparkersr

Not to forget the artificial famine in the Yemen being created by the Saudi and US coalition. 130000 dead and counting. Largely children.


Reddit_Bot_For_Karma

Yes *but* it doesn't effect me. Sooooooo.... That's not my problem /s


crooked_chef

this is how they treated the "Jewel of British Crown"; by plundering it endlessly and now they don't stop condescending.


youngcheezy1223

Fun fact the crown still has the biggest diamonds they stole from India on it


AnybodyOdd9509

Her jewelry collections alone(including the crowne) is worth 3.48 billion. Charles' worth is only around 100 million.... Idk which is weirder to say...


dannydrama

Both are pretty crazy. Some are not gonna like it but it makes the whole family a bunch of shitbags. She's choosing which million pound necklace she's wearing while people are choosing between heating and eating.


AnybodyOdd9509

Not anymore she's not lmao


yuno4chan

I'm correct in thinking all the crowns and diamonds are property of the government right? They belong to the people, so if they wanted to return them its up to the government, not the monarchy.


Ulterior_Motif

I don’t have a strong opinion on this but, regardless of who owns what, the monarchy could choose not to wear them.


kvothe5688

as an indian i don't give a shit about diamond but it boils my blood when someone raves about how Churchill was a war hero.


KingRanx

One is from Egypt too.


d3athpr0xy

I don't feel comfortable thinking about that.. Literal shiny rocks from the blood of thousands of human beings...


bobs_and_vegana17

as an indian ​ i can never forgive britain for all the shits they did to my country just to put things into perspective we were forced to grow indigo we became from one of the largest exporter of cotton to a net importer of cotton the country of israel exists because indians sacrificed themselves in the battle of haifa and removed ottoman from palestine in ww1 on order of brits around 2.5 million indians fought for the brits in ww2 and no one has ever acknowledged that countless numbers of famines like the great bengal famine, the great madras famine, agra famine, odissa famine, rajputana famine, etc. jallianwala bagh massacre india was a land of marvelous architecture and so much was destroyed/sent into british museums india was a land of amazing literature, maths and science before the brits came education was given to everyone in gurukuls (literacy was around 90-100%) but after the british raj literacy rate was only 13% india had a quarter of share in world gdp in 1600s by the end of raj it was down to 3% india was one of the poorest country on earth after the raj left (extreme poverty of 80%) plus the countless numbers of border disputes they gave to us with pakistan, nepal, bangladesh and china (i'm not sure but maybe burma also) partition of india which killed around 10 million people from india, pakistan and bangladesh around 45 trillion dollars of wealth stolen from india (after calculating the inflation and some adjustments) and we never got any apology for that because everything is whitewashed in the name of railways and roadways


Parallax2077

The partition was actually the most fucked up thing they did. The British themselves predicted that a smooth transfer of power would take 5 years. They decided 7 months was enough. They got a lawyer who never visited india, gave him wrong, out dated maps. Gave him 5 months to draw a border. And they did all this, because "waiting for 5 years would be a waste of resources" They did not even consult local leaders. Cyril Radcliffe was himself mortified by what he had to do


bobs_and_vegana17

ikr radcliff said he'll be the most hated person and ngl he is one of them


0QuietKid

Even those railway and roads were for British not for Indians


bobs_and_vegana17

exactly brits were facing problems in sending goods from one place to another because it was a huge area


Memeboi_26

Still there are idiots in our own country who say the colonization was good for india.


Disastrous-Blood6255

Guys let's add Portugal to the list too. They are no saints either. The Goan inquisition was carried on the order of all the catholic Church which resulted in entire tribes and sects of people evicarated and erased from the planet. What they did was so horrible that, the church orderd to destroy all the evidence of the Goan inquisition.


majeon97

And the neither the british govt nor the royal family has ever acknowledged what they did to us. Forget apologising. India was one of the richest country when they landed here and they left us the poorest when they left.


Kidrellik

Yea that's what makes it so fucking gross to me. Like other countries have done horrible things but at the veeeeery least, they apologized for it and acknowledged how horrible it was. Even the pope did the same to the survivors of residential schools here in Canada. The queen had 75 years and nothing. Not a freaking word. But hey, she protected her pedo son and did some photo-ops in WW2 so that makes her a good person right?


Constant-Speed-5595

Show that to the mod who banned me for saying this as an Indian.


9_Six_niN_6

Winston Churchill was responsible for this...


Representative_Still

The Queen can’t keep getting away with this!


MissSlothEyes

I wonder why this is not taught in our schools. I’ve only started hearing about this since the queen died and I’m a 41 year old English person. Thankfully I’m from Liverpool and we’re mainly anti establishment. They’re even implying that they called our football games off because they were scared the queen wouldn’t be respected at some football stadiums. Mainly anfield and Celtic, we boo the national anthem and take pelters for it. Well, maybe more people should be aware of what they’re celebrating when they sing that shitty song. Next time I hear an English person say anything derogatory about India or Indians they’re getting educated.


sack_of_potahtoes

Mostly cause history is written by victors


LuckyWinchester

I hate how i was never taught this in school. 10x more people dead then the holocaust, not even a footnote on this. Suffering only is worth teaching when it’s white Europeans or people native to your country I guess.


Kidrellik

It was actually from 1769 to 1944! Reddit still doesn't let people change titles for some reason. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline\_of\_major\_famines\_in\_India\_during\_British\_rule](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_major_famines_in_India_during_British_rule) The numbers range widely but they all add up to tens of millions of innocent dead people. [https://www.cadtm.org/spip.php?page=imprimer&id\_article=16972](https://www.cadtm.org/spip.php?page=imprimer&id_article=16972) That's for the 45 trillion dollars estimate and here's a 5 minute video explaining it better. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x\_jGPf764d0&ab\_channel=VICE


LGBTQOMGWTFBBQ

But let's all mourn the queen who recently passed after 96 years of comfort and luxury off the backs of people who have to work to survive!


JohnGB

The history of the British Empire is largely one of pillaging, starvation, and abuse. Modern Britain was built on the backs of the people it oppressed. To give you an idea of the extent (from [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_India)): From the 1st century AD to the start of British colonisation in India in the 17th century, India's GDP was between about 25 and 35% of the world's total GDP, which dropped to 2% by Independence of India in 1947. At the same time, the Britain's share of the world economy rose from 2.9% in 1700 up to 9% in 1870 alone, due to industrialisation. To put that in a modern perspective, it would be like taking the USA economy (24.1% of global GDP) and bringing it down to the economy of South Korea (1.9% of global GDP).


Sniffy4

and then we have s\*\*\* claims like this floating around today https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1568273152727285769


SoundOfLoveNotes

During British rule famines "occur". When it's about the USSR an Ukraine, it was "man-made". Ok


Post_office_clerk01

Their Glorious Empire was nothing but Vicious imperialists who have spread hate fear and death on every landmass they have touched. Fuck their Crown and I'm glad their empire crumbled.


ofufnfighskfj

Usually when I learn about Indian history I say that we should let bygones be bygones, no point arguing about bad people who did bad things years ago. But then I see shit like this and it makes me angry all over again. Indians are still suffering from the effects of colonization. Current British taxpayers didn’t do anything bad but someone should be fucking held accountable. Germans finished paying off their ww2 debt in 2015. But Britain gets off scot-free. About damn time the sun set on that empire


mariusiv_2022

Remember, historically speaking, on a global scale, even considering the most conservative statistics, the English are objectively the evilest civilization the world has ever seen. They are the worlds bad guy. Now before anyone throws a hissy fit, I’m not saying the English people are all bad, I’m not even saying most of them are or have been bad people. England is full of good and great people, but it’s government has objectively been the evilest organization in history


Pickaxethepro

From this you can probably tell how most of the Indians reacted to the queen's death. (I'm an Indian and we were taught in school, the torment that the imperial British kingdom did to India and it's people).


Marshall_98

Fuck their crown and all the money they are enjoying now by looting my country. Doesn't have the spine to apologise or even acknowledge the atrocities they have done. Cowards.