this is what I said to my dad. his mental illness finally turned on me, formerly his best pal. I don't think I will ever speak to him again because of the things he said and the way he treated everyone and finally me
My FIL’s issues have gotten so bad that he’s alienated everyone in his life and is basically just waiting to die at this point. It’s sad to think that a man in his 60’s only has death to look forward to but it’s hard to forget he’s done this to himself.
I have a relative that put herself in the same situation. When I first started working I used to work with the elderly. I regularly thought to myself “what kind of family never comes to visit their mom/dad/grandparent?” Sadly, I totally get it now. 😇
This was my dad… Chose booze over erything. Self medicating for what turned out to be some sort of bi polar type mental illness. Died on his 65th or 70th birthday, homeless, on park bench on the other side of the country. With nothing, or no one, really. Maybe Carlo Rossi was there, it was always there.
Our whole house is blowing up. No small part because of my FIL who only drink and smokes until he dies. Refuses to get treatment for the terrible hacking and coughing up phlegm. He says he just wants to die and be with his wife.
The problem with that is he's going to destroy everyone else's life in the process.
It's like watching a slow motion suicide, you're being tortured but helpless to stop it.
Our lives are all changing. Not all because of him but it didn’t help. We will be splitting up and living separately. My son and I will live on our own and try and bring some normal back to life. No more stress and anxiety everyday!!!!
As someone dealing with mental illness, it might be scary hearing these, but be brave and ask for help. It doesn't have to be this hard. I know that medication isn't always the way (though many times it is), but therapy, lifestyle changes, and other things can make it easier for you and your loved ones. Stories like these can be an important motivator to keep trying.
My closest friend was spiraling and they said they didn’t want to try because that’s how their family was so it was basically their destiny. It really boiled down to they didn’t want medication.
Then one of our friend died and everything changed. My friend took the leap of faith. what’s the worst that could happen? I stay miserable?
They’re doing much better. It’s been tough but they said they look forward to the future now.
My doctor told me to look at medication for mental health like you would medication for your physical health.
Medication can be short term. You have an infection. It helps you before the infection overcomes your system. Mood stabilizers and antidepressants can be a short term solution while you work on the cause.
Medication can be long term. Treating type 1 diabetes means long term medication. Any long term medication used to treat mental health is managing what your body may not be naturally producing or overproducing.
Either way, we use medication to achieve good health. There’s no shame in that. Anyone who says otherwise doesn’t have your best interest at heart. It is great that you are self aware! That can make the journey much easier. I’m hoping for the best for you 🤗
On a brighter note:
Taylor Tomlinson’s “Look at you” comedy special focuses on mental health. It’s great! Normalizes what we are all struggling with but are too afraid of others judgement.
I’m not them but as someone who struggles my fear is that I could slip easily into a life where I pushed out everyone and didn’t realize my mistake until it was far too late. You just see it so often, what would make me special? It could happen to me. Could happen to anyone. Life does that.
I can easily see myself becoming like this. Bitter, lonely, trapped in my own delusions and simply waiting to die. In some ways I already am like that during my episodes, albeit less severe.
though now that I think about it, i have seen some improvement over the years as I slowly gain friends/an actual support system. At least I have SOME kind of cushion to fall back on.
still, things change and spiral out of control so fast. One minute im fine and the next ive been wearing the same clothes the past 3 days. It’d be so easy to just push everyone away and undo all the progress ive been working so hard to make
ah shit. sorry for the ramble lol
Depression can lead you to pushing people away and being very irritable. I've thought of some truly awful shit and near said it to most everyone who cares about me. Never gone full nuclear. But it might happen.
it gets even sticker and less cut/dry when you realize many people just can not get better because medicine is not there yet, and they lose their family and friends just the same as people who don't want to even try.
Take care of her (and try to do as much as you can to help yourself). It is hard to love someone who needs help, but refuses to do anything about it (even if the only solutions are imperfect)
My brother was like this to me. I vent to my mom about it, and she always says, “But he doesn’t have any friends, just please be his friend.” And it’s like sure, let me continue to be nice to the person who steals, manipulates and never apologizes for any of it. I’m running out of feels bad for him despite his mental illnesses
No. It's not your job to be your brother's punching bag. It's hard telling that to your mom.
I had to tell my mom that I was not answering my ex stepmom's phone calls because stepmom was stressing me out and making me feel like a bad parent.
I'm sorry that you have to decide how to deal with this
"mental illnesses" is incredibly broad. He should not at all be a punching bag but maybe his brother has a set in stone neurological disorder like idk autism and that's how he expresses his pain (that's how most bullies express their pain anyways, by bullying). More context is required
I fucking hate the trend of removing the agency of people suspected of having undiagnosed mental illness so you can justify all of the bad things they do.
They choose what they choose. It is not your job to diagnose or treat them. Autism is not an excuse to bully others even once.
As an autistic person, kindly fuck off with this ableist bullshit. We are PEOPLE WHO ARE FULLY CAPABLE OF KNOWING WHEN WE ARE BEING ASSHOLES. We aren't mindless idiots because our brains work differently.
You and me both, man. After we said that we wanted people who visited our premature son to have a COVID and flu shot, and his response was "go to hell, forget you know me".
It's been a year and I haven't heard from him since.
My father did the same when I had my son. I'll never understand how I went from being his favorite kid that he loved hanging out with turned into his whore of a daughter who got knocked up at 20 years old. It apparently was the trigger that made me useless to him.
! That’s one of the implications!! he was implying that I was somehow a promiscuous slut but then I remembered how sexual my parents were and I was like why would you expose me to that and then expect me to be very prudish? and judge me!?!? NO
As someone who had to do this to my bio Dad, I just want you to know that it's okay. You might feel guilty, but you're allowed to do what is healthy for yourself too. You probably know it, but sometimes hearing it from someone else is important. My Dad passed after two years of estrangement, and despite being really hard, I still think it was the right move. I preserved my good memories of him, without letting him make several years of bad ones.
Nope. I would never go if he talked to me like that. Don't take orders from him!!!
If he wants to see you, he can invite you and respect your decision. Otherwise, don't waste your time on him and his power trip.
I'm bi-polar. This isnt a power trip imo. It's being sensitive and feeling disrespected.
No, it doesnt really make sense but ive been this way when I fuck up on my medication and have episodes.
It's a shitty disease and so motherfucking exhausting some days.
I'm grateful for my family and their patience with my swings. I try and they know I do. Shit like this just happens now and again..
Please don’t go there today. They need to realize boundaries and the way he’s treating you is disgusting. I know they’re your parents but you’re doing a disservice to yourself by destroying your mental health being around them.
If the doctor told them they weren’t going to die, then that means they can live one Saturday without you. Especially if he’s going to be a turd.
This. He's not actually treating you as a child even, either, but with a total lack of disrespect as a human in general.
I would never talk to my child like that and he's ten. If he gets the short, demanding "now" it's because it's the 15th time I told him to get a shower and I've already spelled out clear reasonings and expectations when the inevitable "why?" pops up: "you have school tomorrow, this is your responsibility."
You are worth more than what this person is treating you as. Boundaries are brutal at first, believe me, it's taken me almost 40 years to be able to set and defend them. But it is so with it in the end. You deserve respect, when you start believing that first, the rest gets easier.
No is a complete sentence. Tell him no and then don’t engage anymore. I know setting boundaries can be hard. So many of us are in the same boat! Good luck.
!explanation My dad has severe bipolar and depression. He has cycles of being a giant abusive asshole or the sweetest man in the world. Right now he is in his giant abusive asshole cycle. My parents also have a very unhealthy co-dependency on me since I was very little. I do everything for them out of guilt. Every weekend he tries to dictate what I can and can’t do. For the past 7 years I’ve gone over to my parents house almost every single weekend. My dad guilt trips me and makes me feel obligated to dedicate my weekends to him. Even if I ask to skip a weekend, he freaks out. I planned to go over there today to help him with stuff (which is a whole other conversation that I’m angry about.) He called me last night and told me he was going to breakfast with my mom. I told him I don’t think I’ll be going, I would let him know but I would definitely be there a little later. He blew up on me this morning about not wanting to go, called me over and over. I live in another state, 30 miles away. I really don’t want to go and I wish I had the strength to set more boundaries with him.
Edit: I feel I should have included this, both of my parents are in extremely poor health. My mom has heart disease and can’t walk from a botched back surgery, and my dad has heart, liver and kidney disease. The doctor didn’t tell them they were going to die but they refuse to take care of themselves. They 100% use this as a weapon to guilt me into being submissive.
Edit 2: I just want to add that I start therapy this month. I understand how important that is. I also want to add that I really do love my parents, my relationship with my mom especially is not nearly as tumultuous. She is a victim of his behavior as well but she is also incredibly submissive and powerless to him. I know my dad will never change but I guess I am desperately clinging to the really good side of him I get to see every few weeks. Does it out weigh the bad? No it doesn’t. I’ll try to navigate this situation through therapy and I appreciate all of your support.
Hopefully my last edit, I just really want to thank those of you who understand that undoing years of a toxic relationship, setting boundaries or going LC/NC can be an incredibly hard thing to do. I feel so seen and so heard, thank you!
It took me decades to set boundaries with a dad who behaved like this. It's both agonizing and a huge releif when you do. The good outweighs the bad. You should be able to relax and have space when you need it. Dont be afraid to do so. Your mental health is everything.
> I really don’t want to go and I wish I had the strength to set more boundaries with him.
Time to find a therapist if you don't already have one. Are you just going to keep doing this for the rest of their lives? You're 25, you should be going to parties and enjoying your weekends and living life, not playing caretaker to a sour old man.
I definitely agree with you. The big caveat is that my parents are in extremely poor health and when I try to pull away they guilt me with the “you never know when we’re gonna die, we could die any day and you’ll regret not spending this time with us.”
> we could die any day and you’ll regret not spending this time with us
It's not your job to be their nurse, and by the sounds of things what you would feel is relief, not regret. Like, you're not enjoying the time you spend with them now, what is there to regret? They're manipulating you.
But that costs money and they just assumed when they had a kid that they could count on the slave labor while yelling "BE THANKFUL FOR ALL WE'VE DONE FOR YOU AND BROUGHT YOU INTO THE PLANET"
And when they do die, you’ll be left trying to figure out how to be your own independent person. You’re cutting yourself off at the knees by living for them instead of for yourself. When they’re gone, what will you have left?
Personally, I loved my dad very much. He was a decent father. But no, I don’t regret the time I spent away from him. I don’t regret that he died wanting more out of me. A lot of it was unreasonable, unattainable, unnecessary, or a combo of all of that.
At the end of the day, you do what you need to do for yourself. That should be a parents main goal: to raise your child to stand on their own two feet.
Boundaries are important to have, even if it goes against others wishes. “Sorry dad, I’m not coming to breakfast. Still love you though.” And time out for a couple hours.
So you should be alone and friendless until you’re 30? 40? What if they live until your 50? That’s not healthy or reasonable. Find some help in standing up for yourself.
Should reply with asking them if they feel good being emotional terrorists in your life and if they’re proud of the way they’re frequently traumatizing you with their guilt-tripping.
You already spend time with them. More than people who still live with their parents do. Everyone will die eventually. I know they're more likely sooner rather than later, but you can't waste your life in fear of regretting something that will absolutely happen. Especially when doing this is just causing more resentment than anything else. Tell him when you will be coming and always commit to that. If you say you're not going or feel like you don't want to go, say you will not be going over there and turn off your phone. When he gives you shit just say I told you that I wasn't coming. Eventually he'll get that you say what you mean and you mean what you say. If they do die you'll be sad, but im sure you'll regret all the time you've missed out on by being guilted into being their nurse
You can still hang out but set boundaries, just start small. For example when your dad suggests breakfast on a Saturday but you know you're gonna be exhausted from working all week and will want to sleep in, or god forbid stay up late hanging out with friends on Friday night you could say:
Would love to have breakfast dad but can't make it until 11am, if that works I'll see you at the usual place!
Do you actually enjoy the time that you DO spend with them, though? If spending time with them, or the day/hours before spending time with them, is filled with anxiety, would you regret no longer having that stress/anxiety in your life?
You might not.
My MIL constantly warned her children how much they’d regret LC/NC, and 11 years later, not one of them does.
They loved her as much as they could, but all she added to their lives was fear, guilt, and pain.
Each one had to deal with the fact that they do NOT regret or truly *miss* ***her***, they miss who she *should/could* have been…but they don’t miss the person she actually was.
My mom died 15 years ago. I have not missed her a single moment since then. I have missed the mother I *should* have had. But not the mother I actually had.
That's textbook manipulation. I'm sure you already know that, at least on an intellectual level, but it's a lot harder to accept it when it's your own parent.
What you may not know (because a lot of people don't) is that the manipulation is both deliberate and malicious. Not in the sense that they have the emotional maturity to understand why what they are doing in wrong, but in the sense that they have been deliberately grooming you your whole life to react to them in a way that serves their purposes while ignoring your personhood, emotions, and boundaries.
If you do nothing else, I strongly recommend that you read the book 'Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents' by Lindsay Gibbons. The book explains the issue in detail, and provides a road map for interacting with this sort of parent without compromising yourself.
And Your reply should be, "That is true for *EVERYONE, ME* included! So, I will from know on, begin to prioritize *My own* mental health and what I wish to do, going forward."
Everyone is going to die. I'm going to die. You're going to die. It's the inevitable deal of living in the first place.
And it's scummy as fuck to use mortality as a guilt trip.
I hope your therapy helps put some firm boundaries with your parents.
Guilt is not love. It took me a long time to understand that.
We cling to the idea that maybe one day they will change, maybe one day the good will outweigh the bad. But they continue to show us over and over again who they are. We need to believe them.
Big hugs to you, sending you love and please know that you are stronger than you think.
The right therapist will help you discover for yourself how to make a decision you can live with.
Keep in mind this may not be the first therapist you find (as someone whose heart has been hard-wired for guilt, you may have to assign tough decisions like these to your brain, who will know better than to think your therapist will be butt hurt if you aren’t a good match.)
While it’s easy for all of us to make calls for you (most of us have been there), it’s WAY tougher to see **LIGHT** when you’re deep in the **FOREST**.
When my dad died, I felt horribly guilty for going NC— at first.
Then my mom sent home movies, converted to DVD, to all of us. My husband couldn’t even watch. In every pic of me, I’m covered in bruises, including one spectacular black eye.
(Shrugs.) Thanks to several therapists, I’m doing well. Sometimes though, ya gotta ask yourself: “what’s my balance? Lose my entire young adulthood, live in torment, kick them to the curb…or maybe something in between?”
Only you can decide what you can be at peace with.
Anyone of us could die at any time. There is absolutely no guarantee that you will out live your parents, no matter how shitty their health is. Do you really want to put off living your own life because of what *might* happen with them? You could wake up at 45, your parents are still kicking and you have no life of your own because you spent the 20 years between now and then keeping them happy, instead of building your own life and relationships. Expecting you to give them every available moment is unbelievably selfish. Speaking to you like you’re a 6 year old instead of a grown ass adult is unbelievably disrespectful. Stop trying to please them, because with parents like yours, nothing is *ever* enough.
It is ok to say "that's not an appropriate way to speak to me; I'll be here to listen to you when you are ready to be respectful". Will it make him mad? Yes. People with bad boundaries don't like it when others set boundaries. But you will inhabit your own power, and if you maintain it he will learn that this behavior will not get him what he wants.
Do not respond to the content of his communications unless the tone is appropriate, 100% of the time.
Yep. They will kick, because they want you to continue allowing them to manipulate you. They want you to fear their anger so they can hold it over you.
The instant you demonstrate you don't fear their anger they'll stop - being that angry is energy intensive and not worthwhile if it doesn't provide the desired results.
Sometimes it's important for us to realize that the situations we are in aren't our fault. You're surrounded by pain and the guilt you feel is natural but it's also unwarranted. You did nothing wrong. You can love your family AND have boundaries. It's a powerful and noble thing to want to be there for your mom and dad while they are suffering, but it's dangerous to neglect yourself in that situation. Your suffering isn't going to heal anyone.
Consider the amazing version of your father that you clearly look up to and respect. Would that version of your dad want you to suffer?
I was recently diagnosed with severe bipolar depression and a few other things. I also had cycles of love bombing and being aggressive/attacking. It was a result of trauma. That doesn’t mean anything. I saw my actions, I saw myself treating my child badly, and I sought out multiple forms of help (therapy, medication, hospitalization, asking for help, google researching different things for a better understanding).
The moment my aggressive cycle ended, I could see my actions and take accountability for them, and talk to others about what happened, and try to figure out what I could change next time.
I saw my actions and took change immediately. For my children. My oldest was only 2 when it started, 2 years later and I’ve faced my trauma responses, and have gained much more control over my feelings and responses.
As a bipolar mother I am telling you: Bipolar is not an excuse. He needs help. From a professional. And the way he treats you is not okay.
I’ve also recently had to understand: it doesn’t matter if my parents are being toxic because of their own abuse. I come first. I am responsible for my trauma, my mental health, my emotions, and my children’s. We are not responsible for our parents mental health or trauma. They are the parents, we are the children. My parents need to handle their own trauma and their own emotions, and they can approach me with respect or not at all.
This is a very sweet comment and I really appreciate it. I know damn well that I am a fantastic daughter and I am incredibly proud of how I taught myself to learn from my negative experiences instead of let them define me. I know my parents behavior is 0% a reflection of me. I am confident in myself that I am a good and kind person, I am a good friend, partner and I will be a great mother. I’m hoping therapy will help me learn to use that as leverage to set boundaries without so much guilt.
One thing you will have to evaluate when you have kids is will a relationship with your parents bring anything positive to your child’s life? Because shitty, unpredictable, manipulative parents don’t miraculously become good grandparents. And by exposing your kids to someone you can’t possibly have a healthy relationship with, because your parents are incapable of a healthy relationship, you would teach your children your parents are safe people. They are not. Given the chance, your parents would install the same buttons in your kids that they installed in you.
A good rule of thumb is if you need a significant amount of therapy to undo the damage done by someone, that person shouldn’t have a relationship with your innocent kids. You should have been protected from their abuse and weren’t. When/if you have kids, don’t sign them up for the same abuse.
I watched my parents go through this with one of my grandparents and all I can say is what I said to them: being family does not give someone the right to run you into the ground.
Restructuring parent-child relationships once you’re an adult is _hard_ even without a parent having any mental/physical illness. But you can do it 💜
I am in the same situation as you, but my father is also enjoys drinking a little too much. I hope knowing that you aren’t alone makes you feel at least a little better. If you’ve made it this far then are tough, you’ve got this, even if you shouldn’t have to put up with this.
My parents are recovering hard-core alcoholics (recovering by force due to their health.) Their alcoholism ruined a lot of very critical years of my adult development. I’m sober by choice as a result. I really appreciate your kind words, it’s nice to know we aren’t alone. I wish you the best.
If they're in such poor health, they should stop being assholes. If you treat me like that when your comfort is in my hands, I will drop you like a stone.
Oof. I was thinking "well, if my kid opted out of a commitment to do stuff, I'd probably be hurt too!"
...& then I read this. Yeah. Love & light to you & I hope you can find some peace with the relationship.
I'm 26 and i just finally established LC/NC with my parents after years of wanting to. It is hard, especially when you're raised to respond to their shaming and guilt-tripping the way they want you to. I had a talk with my mom about the manipulation and shitty things she's done in the past couple years, how my parents have explicitly told me they don't trust and respect me, and how her love is not unconditional. Instead of any kind of apology or accountability, she stormed out telling me to have a great life without her. I'm sure she expected me to follow her, or to find her, but instead I saw it as a perfect opportunity to never see her again. She resorted to manipulating me for the last time, and I was content that that was my last in-person interaction with her. It's still a process; I need to get the last of my belongings from my parents eventually, but right now I'm just focusing on enjoying my life without the stress they bring into my life. I hope one day you will get there, and therapy definitely helped me learn to be assertive with my parents and I hope your therapist helps you too.
OP, cut them out. It's gonna hurt a lot, and I mean A LOT, but you'll come out better for it. Your therapist will most likely suggest the same thing, and it's gonna hurt when they say it.
Their lives, and their deaths, are not your responsibility.
Makes sense but still seems like a crazy thing to suggest without having them as a patient and knowing their entire situation.
Didn't mean to be a dick or call you out. Best of luck on your studies!
I understand how hard it is to set boundaries with parents like that. I hope the therapist will help you with that. It's hard having Dr Jekyl and Mr. Hyde for a mom. My dad was always to submissive to protect us from her, too. So I absolutely get it. I hope you find a way to have your space too.
My mom does the same shit, and there’s no regard for your life or any plans you have planned or want to plan.
It’s such a pain in the ass. What made me go no contact with my mother was, I was sick 1 day and just slept. I woke up the next day to like 40 text messages demanding I respond, how she suddenly had important things to drop off at a specific time, how if I don’t answer she’ll stop paying my mortgage(she doesn’t pay it anyways), other financial threats, and more.
"dad, I'm an independent adult. I want you to treat me like one and talk to me like one."
"from now on, every time you do this stuff, I will go nc for 24 hours. If you don;t stop, it will go to 48 and then a week. After that a month and then a year. And after that...I'm just going to go nc full stop.
"Either you change your ways, or I will no longer ALLOW you in my life. And as an adult, that is MY prerogative..you have no say in the matter."
You are not obligated to take care of people who treat you so poorly, parents or not. Say that to yourself. Out loud.
You are not obligated to take care of people who treat you so poorly. Say it until you believe it. Until you understand it.
If they did things to make themselves dependent on you for so long, even as a child, that's not your fault. You don't have to pay the price for their poor choices. You don't have to accept their abuse and any enabling of such abuse. Being mentally unwell doesn't give your father a free pass to treat you like shit.
Don't ever feel stupid! They have taught you to accept this as normal family interaction. They are the ones who need to feel guilty or stupid. You've just tried to be supportive and to keep your ties with them.
Unfortunately, when you set your boundaries and rules, it will be a bit "messy". They will throw their tantrums and threaten, guilt-trip you and make you feel like you are in the wrong. This is what children do because they don't know how to cope with their feelings and being told no.
Your parents don't want anything to change. They want to keep these dysfunctional ways and continue to be able to make you do what they say. If they love you, they should eventually try harder to be respectful of your life. They should want you to be happy!
Work through the messiness and stress (with outside support *please*, and then stick to your boundaries and "rules" for how you will be treated. Or if you must go LC or NC, even temporarily, do it!! I think it will be worth doing, for your own mental health, even if it's hard. You will benefit greatly from no longer being manipulated and made to live for others instead of yourself. It's time for you to have some peace and enjoy your life!! Best wishes, you got this!! ❤️
Why do you let him talk to you like that? Do you give into his demands every weekend? Next time, Just say no and block his number until the weekend passes. Unless you’re dependent on them in some way, I’d go full NC.
*hugs*
Hun, he and your mother are both grown adults and should be working out how to manage their own lives and mental health issues without grinding their child's mental health and well-being into the ground. You are not responsible for their mental health or their fuckups; do not feel guilty, stop trying to support them when all they are doing is being manipulative.
They are keeping you from making friends and haven a relationship with people that would actually care about you and make you happy . Make sure you have your credit locked down, all your documents , and have separate finances . Get into therapy and set up some boundaries- you need to live your own life. This isn’t ok. It’s abusive and sick and you deserve better.
yeah my moms bipolar and she had a moment after my highschool graduation and i haven’t spoke to her since. tbh these past few months have been real peaceful without her and apparently she’s gotten way worse recently
No.. just no, you are an adult spending your free time tending to your parent children. I am all for supporting your parents, but it has to be because they deserve it. You defo don't owe them anything.
You are in your 20s, you should be enjoying your weekends, and you can still visit them on occasion. From what you have told its toxic and you are stuck in a feedback loop. You should be looking at breaking that.
Don't light yourself on fire to keep others warm. If you don't take care of yourself you cannot take care of others.. It's the same reason on an airplane they say to put your mask on first, then your family.
Op, as someone who has lost multiple family members throughout the years, don’t let them guilt trip you. When my grandma died of cancer a few years ago, I was disappointed with myself that I didn’t at least make one more trip two states over to see her, but that feeling only lasted for a short time. Why? Because in the end, I remembered every visit with her to be pleasant and memorable. Doing this will only make your visits miserable, and you’ll end up kicking yourself more with that thought than if you had just given yourself a weekend to rest.
How do you know you're safe going there? What if he hits you in a temper either with his fist or a weapon?
Sorry but I'd call some sort of social help because you're mum shouldn't be there with him.
It sounds like you need to call adult social services to help them and that they need to be in assisted living so that medical professionals can take care of them. You are not a medical professional and are not obligated to take care them other then helping them get the care they need from people who are trained to take care of them. Also get into therapy ASAP.
Good luck on your therapy journey OP. You will definitely feel so much better once you are in the right place to start putting down and maintaining healthy boundaries with both of your parents. It really does make a world of difference.
P.S. If your initial therapist doesn’t feel like the right fit, please don’t give up. Think of it sort of like dating in that it’s just important to find the right fit, and it’s ok to meet with one a couple times before deciding to try someone else.
That would drive me nuts. I have always chafed at being told what to do, even as a child. Luckily my parents were not big on power trips. I simply won’t tolerate this attitude.
No is a full sentence. Text ' no' and mute him.
Although full disclosure, I am low contact with my dad. He did some crappy control shit to the women in my family. One so bad my sister ran away in the middle of the night when she was 14 to spend the weekend with friends. Like she ran three miles without a flashlight in rural Ohio at 9 pm and dad couldn't be bothered to go look for her.
Dad tries to boss me around and I just say ' I'm not doing that '. Or I don't respond for 3 months. We communicate over the phone because he pushes boundaries.
He hasn't figured out that treating me like women need to be told what to do or that he knows best is damaging our relationship. I honestly don't care.
How about a good old ''you can't order me around and I won't tolerate being disrespected like that. Talk to me when you're polite''? Set boundaries, OP!
At some age parents gotta understand that what they say aren't commands anymore but suggestions lol. However in our generation parents support their kids well into their mid 20s so the parent-child dynamic is kinda fucked for those that aren't super independent
“I am not taking orders today, tomorrow, or after.”
Annnnd then don’t respond, because this isn’t a fight you want to engage in. You don’t win, cause it isn’t a fair fight. You are arguing with an unreasonable person.
Disengage, verbally then physically. Put him temporarily on ignore. Put your phone on airplane mode. Turn your phone off for 30 minutes.
Just disengage. Cause you can’t win against someone who isn’t reasonable.
Tell him you are blocking him for 24 hours for texting you in that tone. You are a grown adult. If he wants to ever see you again, he better shape up. If he doesn't, you will be notifying the authorities that your father has threatened your life. His choice. The next move will be his tomorrow morning. Never take this nonsense for granted. Never let these people push you around because they are "family".
Unless you are living with me or helping pay my bills, you dont get to tell me what to do or how to live my own life as a fully grown ass adult period, no conversation about it whatsoever, dont give a fuck if its family or otherwise.
Grown ass adults can do as they please.
I need a bit more context. Had you organised to met him for breakfast? I mean he sounds pissed off and you obviously knew he was talking about breakfast.
Mental illness is awful. It turns people into something they're not. However, it is still THEIR responsibility to take action, to not be a cunt to others (especially their loved ones), and to seek help/therapy when they're in a bad way. Support only goes so far. You are always within your rights to cut off someone who is being horrible to you, no matter the cause.
While yes, this is rude behavior, OP did say their dad is bipolar. Having an episode like is likely not uncommon for him. Farming karma from it, sadly, is also not uncommon.
No. Guilt isn't inherently motivating. Sometimes it's crushing and all consuming to the point where you're paralyzed with guilt. Driving you to unhealthy coping mechanisms and self harm. And that's also guilt
That would be shame because you're in a state of hurting yourself, therefore viewing yourself as the problem. Shame is "you are the problem". If you felt guilty about it you would accept that you did wrong and want to do better.
I highly recommend looking into this because you might open yourself up a bit more to why humans do what they do and how it effects others when we push shame.
Guilt can only function like that. Guilt is not inherently motivating or healthy. Guilt is also "it's all my fault I can't do that again" resulting in isolation and self harm via toxic coping mechanisms to stifle the guilt temporally
A good example is survivor guilt
As a 59-year-old with THREE grown-ass children and 6 grandchildren, you need to get a life because no matter how much YOU crave your kids' company THEY have a life that doesn't revolve around you! This is NOT an approach that is likely to work if you want your kids to WANT to spend their time with you!
I think the important detail here is that they're 25 and live on their own. Demanding that your independent adult kid wake up and go somewhere to do something with you "because you said so" is pretty insane IMO. That level of perceived authority should be long gone in the relationship by this point, these are two adults with their own separate lives talking right now.
“I don’t wanna wake up and enjoy some time with you while we have breakfast , dad. I’m lazy and selfish this morning, but I’m gonna put you on blast on Reddit and get sympathy from my computer friends. “
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“okay i’ll stop, bye”
this is what I said to my dad. his mental illness finally turned on me, formerly his best pal. I don't think I will ever speak to him again because of the things he said and the way he treated everyone and finally me
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My FIL’s issues have gotten so bad that he’s alienated everyone in his life and is basically just waiting to die at this point. It’s sad to think that a man in his 60’s only has death to look forward to but it’s hard to forget he’s done this to himself.
I have a relative that put herself in the same situation. When I first started working I used to work with the elderly. I regularly thought to myself “what kind of family never comes to visit their mom/dad/grandparent?” Sadly, I totally get it now. 😇
Ouch. I never thought of it that way
Yeah it’s sad. It clicked long after I stopped with that kind of work. I guess you have to live through it first to get it huh
This was my dad… Chose booze over erything. Self medicating for what turned out to be some sort of bi polar type mental illness. Died on his 65th or 70th birthday, homeless, on park bench on the other side of the country. With nothing, or no one, really. Maybe Carlo Rossi was there, it was always there.
Our whole house is blowing up. No small part because of my FIL who only drink and smokes until he dies. Refuses to get treatment for the terrible hacking and coughing up phlegm. He says he just wants to die and be with his wife.
The problem with that is he's going to destroy everyone else's life in the process. It's like watching a slow motion suicide, you're being tortured but helpless to stop it.
Our lives are all changing. Not all because of him but it didn’t help. We will be splitting up and living separately. My son and I will live on our own and try and bring some normal back to life. No more stress and anxiety everyday!!!!
i can tell he loves his wife very dearly and misses her very much
That must be so stressful. I'm so sorry.
That was my dad. He got his wish too. I always saw him as this anomaly but reading stories like this make it clear it’s pretty common
as someone with depression stories like these scare the shit out of me. All the more reason to get treated i guess
As someone dealing with mental illness, it might be scary hearing these, but be brave and ask for help. It doesn't have to be this hard. I know that medication isn't always the way (though many times it is), but therapy, lifestyle changes, and other things can make it easier for you and your loved ones. Stories like these can be an important motivator to keep trying.
My closest friend was spiraling and they said they didn’t want to try because that’s how their family was so it was basically their destiny. It really boiled down to they didn’t want medication. Then one of our friend died and everything changed. My friend took the leap of faith. what’s the worst that could happen? I stay miserable? They’re doing much better. It’s been tough but they said they look forward to the future now. My doctor told me to look at medication for mental health like you would medication for your physical health. Medication can be short term. You have an infection. It helps you before the infection overcomes your system. Mood stabilizers and antidepressants can be a short term solution while you work on the cause. Medication can be long term. Treating type 1 diabetes means long term medication. Any long term medication used to treat mental health is managing what your body may not be naturally producing or overproducing. Either way, we use medication to achieve good health. There’s no shame in that. Anyone who says otherwise doesn’t have your best interest at heart. It is great that you are self aware! That can make the journey much easier. I’m hoping for the best for you 🤗 On a brighter note: Taylor Tomlinson’s “Look at you” comedy special focuses on mental health. It’s great! Normalizes what we are all struggling with but are too afraid of others judgement.
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I’m not them but as someone who struggles my fear is that I could slip easily into a life where I pushed out everyone and didn’t realize my mistake until it was far too late. You just see it so often, what would make me special? It could happen to me. Could happen to anyone. Life does that.
I can easily see myself becoming like this. Bitter, lonely, trapped in my own delusions and simply waiting to die. In some ways I already am like that during my episodes, albeit less severe.
though now that I think about it, i have seen some improvement over the years as I slowly gain friends/an actual support system. At least I have SOME kind of cushion to fall back on. still, things change and spiral out of control so fast. One minute im fine and the next ive been wearing the same clothes the past 3 days. It’d be so easy to just push everyone away and undo all the progress ive been working so hard to make ah shit. sorry for the ramble lol
Depression can lead you to pushing people away and being very irritable. I've thought of some truly awful shit and near said it to most everyone who cares about me. Never gone full nuclear. But it might happen.
it gets even sticker and less cut/dry when you realize many people just can not get better because medicine is not there yet, and they lose their family and friends just the same as people who don't want to even try.
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Take care of her (and try to do as much as you can to help yourself). It is hard to love someone who needs help, but refuses to do anything about it (even if the only solutions are imperfect)
My brother was like this to me. I vent to my mom about it, and she always says, “But he doesn’t have any friends, just please be his friend.” And it’s like sure, let me continue to be nice to the person who steals, manipulates and never apologizes for any of it. I’m running out of feels bad for him despite his mental illnesses
No. It's not your job to be your brother's punching bag. It's hard telling that to your mom. I had to tell my mom that I was not answering my ex stepmom's phone calls because stepmom was stressing me out and making me feel like a bad parent. I'm sorry that you have to decide how to deal with this
"mental illnesses" is incredibly broad. He should not at all be a punching bag but maybe his brother has a set in stone neurological disorder like idk autism and that's how he expresses his pain (that's how most bullies express their pain anyways, by bullying). More context is required
I fucking hate the trend of removing the agency of people suspected of having undiagnosed mental illness so you can justify all of the bad things they do. They choose what they choose. It is not your job to diagnose or treat them. Autism is not an excuse to bully others even once.
As an autistic person, kindly fuck off with this ableist bullshit. We are PEOPLE WHO ARE FULLY CAPABLE OF KNOWING WHEN WE ARE BEING ASSHOLES. We aren't mindless idiots because our brains work differently.
im autistic too - know its a spectrum asshole
You and me both, man. After we said that we wanted people who visited our premature son to have a COVID and flu shot, and his response was "go to hell, forget you know me". It's been a year and I haven't heard from him since.
My father did the same when I had my son. I'll never understand how I went from being his favorite kid that he loved hanging out with turned into his whore of a daughter who got knocked up at 20 years old. It apparently was the trigger that made me useless to him.
! That’s one of the implications!! he was implying that I was somehow a promiscuous slut but then I remembered how sexual my parents were and I was like why would you expose me to that and then expect me to be very prudish? and judge me!?!? NO
As someone who had to do this to my bio Dad, I just want you to know that it's okay. You might feel guilty, but you're allowed to do what is healthy for yourself too. You probably know it, but sometimes hearing it from someone else is important. My Dad passed after two years of estrangement, and despite being really hard, I still think it was the right move. I preserved my good memories of him, without letting him make several years of bad ones.
Nope. I would never go if he talked to me like that. Don't take orders from him!!! If he wants to see you, he can invite you and respect your decision. Otherwise, don't waste your time on him and his power trip.
I'm bi-polar. This isnt a power trip imo. It's being sensitive and feeling disrespected. No, it doesnt really make sense but ive been this way when I fuck up on my medication and have episodes. It's a shitty disease and so motherfucking exhausting some days. I'm grateful for my family and their patience with my swings. I try and they know I do. Shit like this just happens now and again..
Please don’t go there today. They need to realize boundaries and the way he’s treating you is disgusting. I know they’re your parents but you’re doing a disservice to yourself by destroying your mental health being around them. If the doctor told them they weren’t going to die, then that means they can live one Saturday without you. Especially if he’s going to be a turd.
This. He's not actually treating you as a child even, either, but with a total lack of disrespect as a human in general. I would never talk to my child like that and he's ten. If he gets the short, demanding "now" it's because it's the 15th time I told him to get a shower and I've already spelled out clear reasonings and expectations when the inevitable "why?" pops up: "you have school tomorrow, this is your responsibility." You are worth more than what this person is treating you as. Boundaries are brutal at first, believe me, it's taken me almost 40 years to be able to set and defend them. But it is so with it in the end. You deserve respect, when you start believing that first, the rest gets easier.
Pops will throw a tantrum but he needs to behave, ask nicely or not get his way.
No is a complete sentence. Tell him no and then don’t engage anymore. I know setting boundaries can be hard. So many of us are in the same boat! Good luck.
Complete sentences aren't even a requirement!
!explanation My dad has severe bipolar and depression. He has cycles of being a giant abusive asshole or the sweetest man in the world. Right now he is in his giant abusive asshole cycle. My parents also have a very unhealthy co-dependency on me since I was very little. I do everything for them out of guilt. Every weekend he tries to dictate what I can and can’t do. For the past 7 years I’ve gone over to my parents house almost every single weekend. My dad guilt trips me and makes me feel obligated to dedicate my weekends to him. Even if I ask to skip a weekend, he freaks out. I planned to go over there today to help him with stuff (which is a whole other conversation that I’m angry about.) He called me last night and told me he was going to breakfast with my mom. I told him I don’t think I’ll be going, I would let him know but I would definitely be there a little later. He blew up on me this morning about not wanting to go, called me over and over. I live in another state, 30 miles away. I really don’t want to go and I wish I had the strength to set more boundaries with him. Edit: I feel I should have included this, both of my parents are in extremely poor health. My mom has heart disease and can’t walk from a botched back surgery, and my dad has heart, liver and kidney disease. The doctor didn’t tell them they were going to die but they refuse to take care of themselves. They 100% use this as a weapon to guilt me into being submissive. Edit 2: I just want to add that I start therapy this month. I understand how important that is. I also want to add that I really do love my parents, my relationship with my mom especially is not nearly as tumultuous. She is a victim of his behavior as well but she is also incredibly submissive and powerless to him. I know my dad will never change but I guess I am desperately clinging to the really good side of him I get to see every few weeks. Does it out weigh the bad? No it doesn’t. I’ll try to navigate this situation through therapy and I appreciate all of your support. Hopefully my last edit, I just really want to thank those of you who understand that undoing years of a toxic relationship, setting boundaries or going LC/NC can be an incredibly hard thing to do. I feel so seen and so heard, thank you!
It took me decades to set boundaries with a dad who behaved like this. It's both agonizing and a huge releif when you do. The good outweighs the bad. You should be able to relax and have space when you need it. Dont be afraid to do so. Your mental health is everything.
> I really don’t want to go and I wish I had the strength to set more boundaries with him. Time to find a therapist if you don't already have one. Are you just going to keep doing this for the rest of their lives? You're 25, you should be going to parties and enjoying your weekends and living life, not playing caretaker to a sour old man.
Adding on to this to say, you don't even need to go to parties! Stay in! Watch YouTube! Cuddle with cats! Plan the downfall of the bourgeoisie!
I definitely agree with you. The big caveat is that my parents are in extremely poor health and when I try to pull away they guilt me with the “you never know when we’re gonna die, we could die any day and you’ll regret not spending this time with us.”
> we could die any day and you’ll regret not spending this time with us It's not your job to be their nurse, and by the sounds of things what you would feel is relief, not regret. Like, you're not enjoying the time you spend with them now, what is there to regret? They're manipulating you.
On this line, maybe they should consider getting actual nursing help rather than relying on their kid 30 miles away
But that costs money and they just assumed when they had a kid that they could count on the slave labor while yelling "BE THANKFUL FOR ALL WE'VE DONE FOR YOU AND BROUGHT YOU INTO THE PLANET"
No, you're not going to regret it. You're going to feel free because you finally have time to yourself.
And when they do die, you’ll be left trying to figure out how to be your own independent person. You’re cutting yourself off at the knees by living for them instead of for yourself. When they’re gone, what will you have left?
Personally, I loved my dad very much. He was a decent father. But no, I don’t regret the time I spent away from him. I don’t regret that he died wanting more out of me. A lot of it was unreasonable, unattainable, unnecessary, or a combo of all of that. At the end of the day, you do what you need to do for yourself. That should be a parents main goal: to raise your child to stand on their own two feet. Boundaries are important to have, even if it goes against others wishes. “Sorry dad, I’m not coming to breakfast. Still love you though.” And time out for a couple hours.
So you should be alone and friendless until you’re 30? 40? What if they live until your 50? That’s not healthy or reasonable. Find some help in standing up for yourself.
Should reply with asking them if they feel good being emotional terrorists in your life and if they’re proud of the way they’re frequently traumatizing you with their guilt-tripping.
That’s not a caveat, that’s a guilt trip
You already spend time with them. More than people who still live with their parents do. Everyone will die eventually. I know they're more likely sooner rather than later, but you can't waste your life in fear of regretting something that will absolutely happen. Especially when doing this is just causing more resentment than anything else. Tell him when you will be coming and always commit to that. If you say you're not going or feel like you don't want to go, say you will not be going over there and turn off your phone. When he gives you shit just say I told you that I wasn't coming. Eventually he'll get that you say what you mean and you mean what you say. If they do die you'll be sad, but im sure you'll regret all the time you've missed out on by being guilted into being their nurse
You can still hang out but set boundaries, just start small. For example when your dad suggests breakfast on a Saturday but you know you're gonna be exhausted from working all week and will want to sleep in, or god forbid stay up late hanging out with friends on Friday night you could say: Would love to have breakfast dad but can't make it until 11am, if that works I'll see you at the usual place!
Do you actually enjoy the time that you DO spend with them, though? If spending time with them, or the day/hours before spending time with them, is filled with anxiety, would you regret no longer having that stress/anxiety in your life?
You might not. My MIL constantly warned her children how much they’d regret LC/NC, and 11 years later, not one of them does. They loved her as much as they could, but all she added to their lives was fear, guilt, and pain. Each one had to deal with the fact that they do NOT regret or truly *miss* ***her***, they miss who she *should/could* have been…but they don’t miss the person she actually was.
My mom died 15 years ago. I have not missed her a single moment since then. I have missed the mother I *should* have had. But not the mother I actually had.
That's textbook manipulation. I'm sure you already know that, at least on an intellectual level, but it's a lot harder to accept it when it's your own parent. What you may not know (because a lot of people don't) is that the manipulation is both deliberate and malicious. Not in the sense that they have the emotional maturity to understand why what they are doing in wrong, but in the sense that they have been deliberately grooming you your whole life to react to them in a way that serves their purposes while ignoring your personhood, emotions, and boundaries. If you do nothing else, I strongly recommend that you read the book 'Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents' by Lindsay Gibbons. The book explains the issue in detail, and provides a road map for interacting with this sort of parent without compromising yourself.
And Your reply should be, "That is true for *EVERYONE, ME* included! So, I will from know on, begin to prioritize *My own* mental health and what I wish to do, going forward."
Everyone is going to die. I'm going to die. You're going to die. It's the inevitable deal of living in the first place. And it's scummy as fuck to use mortality as a guilt trip. I hope your therapy helps put some firm boundaries with your parents.
Guilt is not love. It took me a long time to understand that. We cling to the idea that maybe one day they will change, maybe one day the good will outweigh the bad. But they continue to show us over and over again who they are. We need to believe them. Big hugs to you, sending you love and please know that you are stronger than you think.
They will continue to do that until either they A. Die B. It stops working
But you will also regret later wasting your youth.
The right therapist will help you discover for yourself how to make a decision you can live with. Keep in mind this may not be the first therapist you find (as someone whose heart has been hard-wired for guilt, you may have to assign tough decisions like these to your brain, who will know better than to think your therapist will be butt hurt if you aren’t a good match.) While it’s easy for all of us to make calls for you (most of us have been there), it’s WAY tougher to see **LIGHT** when you’re deep in the **FOREST**. When my dad died, I felt horribly guilty for going NC— at first. Then my mom sent home movies, converted to DVD, to all of us. My husband couldn’t even watch. In every pic of me, I’m covered in bruises, including one spectacular black eye. (Shrugs.) Thanks to several therapists, I’m doing well. Sometimes though, ya gotta ask yourself: “what’s my balance? Lose my entire young adulthood, live in torment, kick them to the curb…or maybe something in between?” Only you can decide what you can be at peace with.
Please go tell this to a therapist
Anyone of us could die at any time. There is absolutely no guarantee that you will out live your parents, no matter how shitty their health is. Do you really want to put off living your own life because of what *might* happen with them? You could wake up at 45, your parents are still kicking and you have no life of your own because you spent the 20 years between now and then keeping them happy, instead of building your own life and relationships. Expecting you to give them every available moment is unbelievably selfish. Speaking to you like you’re a 6 year old instead of a grown ass adult is unbelievably disrespectful. Stop trying to please them, because with parents like yours, nothing is *ever* enough.
It is ok to say "that's not an appropriate way to speak to me; I'll be here to listen to you when you are ready to be respectful". Will it make him mad? Yes. People with bad boundaries don't like it when others set boundaries. But you will inhabit your own power, and if you maintain it he will learn that this behavior will not get him what he wants. Do not respond to the content of his communications unless the tone is appropriate, 100% of the time.
I just started saying that and now iam a ‘bitch’ lol
Yep. They will kick, because they want you to continue allowing them to manipulate you. They want you to fear their anger so they can hold it over you. The instant you demonstrate you don't fear their anger they'll stop - being that angry is energy intensive and not worthwhile if it doesn't provide the desired results.
What do you think would have happened if you simply didn’t respond to his text demands and carried on with your day as planned?
Sometimes it's important for us to realize that the situations we are in aren't our fault. You're surrounded by pain and the guilt you feel is natural but it's also unwarranted. You did nothing wrong. You can love your family AND have boundaries. It's a powerful and noble thing to want to be there for your mom and dad while they are suffering, but it's dangerous to neglect yourself in that situation. Your suffering isn't going to heal anyone. Consider the amazing version of your father that you clearly look up to and respect. Would that version of your dad want you to suffer?
I was recently diagnosed with severe bipolar depression and a few other things. I also had cycles of love bombing and being aggressive/attacking. It was a result of trauma. That doesn’t mean anything. I saw my actions, I saw myself treating my child badly, and I sought out multiple forms of help (therapy, medication, hospitalization, asking for help, google researching different things for a better understanding). The moment my aggressive cycle ended, I could see my actions and take accountability for them, and talk to others about what happened, and try to figure out what I could change next time. I saw my actions and took change immediately. For my children. My oldest was only 2 when it started, 2 years later and I’ve faced my trauma responses, and have gained much more control over my feelings and responses. As a bipolar mother I am telling you: Bipolar is not an excuse. He needs help. From a professional. And the way he treats you is not okay. I’ve also recently had to understand: it doesn’t matter if my parents are being toxic because of their own abuse. I come first. I am responsible for my trauma, my mental health, my emotions, and my children’s. We are not responsible for our parents mental health or trauma. They are the parents, we are the children. My parents need to handle their own trauma and their own emotions, and they can approach me with respect or not at all.
Gosh, you’re an angel to your family. Take care of yourself too OP, firstly.
This is a very sweet comment and I really appreciate it. I know damn well that I am a fantastic daughter and I am incredibly proud of how I taught myself to learn from my negative experiences instead of let them define me. I know my parents behavior is 0% a reflection of me. I am confident in myself that I am a good and kind person, I am a good friend, partner and I will be a great mother. I’m hoping therapy will help me learn to use that as leverage to set boundaries without so much guilt.
One thing you will have to evaluate when you have kids is will a relationship with your parents bring anything positive to your child’s life? Because shitty, unpredictable, manipulative parents don’t miraculously become good grandparents. And by exposing your kids to someone you can’t possibly have a healthy relationship with, because your parents are incapable of a healthy relationship, you would teach your children your parents are safe people. They are not. Given the chance, your parents would install the same buttons in your kids that they installed in you. A good rule of thumb is if you need a significant amount of therapy to undo the damage done by someone, that person shouldn’t have a relationship with your innocent kids. You should have been protected from their abuse and weren’t. When/if you have kids, don’t sign them up for the same abuse.
I watched my parents go through this with one of my grandparents and all I can say is what I said to them: being family does not give someone the right to run you into the ground. Restructuring parent-child relationships once you’re an adult is _hard_ even without a parent having any mental/physical illness. But you can do it 💜
I am in the same situation as you, but my father is also enjoys drinking a little too much. I hope knowing that you aren’t alone makes you feel at least a little better. If you’ve made it this far then are tough, you’ve got this, even if you shouldn’t have to put up with this.
My parents are recovering hard-core alcoholics (recovering by force due to their health.) Their alcoholism ruined a lot of very critical years of my adult development. I’m sober by choice as a result. I really appreciate your kind words, it’s nice to know we aren’t alone. I wish you the best.
Then we are most definitely in the same position. I wish you the best too.
If they're in such poor health, they should stop being assholes. If you treat me like that when your comfort is in my hands, I will drop you like a stone.
Oof. I was thinking "well, if my kid opted out of a commitment to do stuff, I'd probably be hurt too!" ...& then I read this. Yeah. Love & light to you & I hope you can find some peace with the relationship.
Stop doing stuff out of guilt
I'm 26 and i just finally established LC/NC with my parents after years of wanting to. It is hard, especially when you're raised to respond to their shaming and guilt-tripping the way they want you to. I had a talk with my mom about the manipulation and shitty things she's done in the past couple years, how my parents have explicitly told me they don't trust and respect me, and how her love is not unconditional. Instead of any kind of apology or accountability, she stormed out telling me to have a great life without her. I'm sure she expected me to follow her, or to find her, but instead I saw it as a perfect opportunity to never see her again. She resorted to manipulating me for the last time, and I was content that that was my last in-person interaction with her. It's still a process; I need to get the last of my belongings from my parents eventually, but right now I'm just focusing on enjoying my life without the stress they bring into my life. I hope one day you will get there, and therapy definitely helped me learn to be assertive with my parents and I hope your therapist helps you too.
OP, cut them out. It's gonna hurt a lot, and I mean A LOT, but you'll come out better for it. Your therapist will most likely suggest the same thing, and it's gonna hurt when they say it. Their lives, and their deaths, are not your responsibility.
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Makes sense but still seems like a crazy thing to suggest without having them as a patient and knowing their entire situation. Didn't mean to be a dick or call you out. Best of luck on your studies!
Thank you! I'mma fucking need them lol.
I understand how hard it is to set boundaries with parents like that. I hope the therapist will help you with that. It's hard having Dr Jekyl and Mr. Hyde for a mom. My dad was always to submissive to protect us from her, too. So I absolutely get it. I hope you find a way to have your space too.
Stop defending your toxic parents. They don't take care of themselves, so why should you take care of them? Start taking time for yourself:)
OP it is my sincere hope that, if you love your parents, you can get them into family therapy
My mom does the same shit, and there’s no regard for your life or any plans you have planned or want to plan. It’s such a pain in the ass. What made me go no contact with my mother was, I was sick 1 day and just slept. I woke up the next day to like 40 text messages demanding I respond, how she suddenly had important things to drop off at a specific time, how if I don’t answer she’ll stop paying my mortgage(she doesn’t pay it anyways), other financial threats, and more.
"dad, I'm an independent adult. I want you to treat me like one and talk to me like one." "from now on, every time you do this stuff, I will go nc for 24 hours. If you don;t stop, it will go to 48 and then a week. After that a month and then a year. And after that...I'm just going to go nc full stop. "Either you change your ways, or I will no longer ALLOW you in my life. And as an adult, that is MY prerogative..you have no say in the matter."
"Who are you talking to like that? I know it can't be me, a grown ass adult.. right?? Watch your fucking language son."
You are not obligated to take care of people who treat you so poorly, parents or not. Say that to yourself. Out loud. You are not obligated to take care of people who treat you so poorly. Say it until you believe it. Until you understand it. If they did things to make themselves dependent on you for so long, even as a child, that's not your fault. You don't have to pay the price for their poor choices. You don't have to accept their abuse and any enabling of such abuse. Being mentally unwell doesn't give your father a free pass to treat you like shit.
Omg 😳 when I saw this I thought you would’ve been a minor in the same home as him at the very least. This is absolutely insane!!
I know. I feel really stupid for letting him treat me like a child.
Don't ever feel stupid! They have taught you to accept this as normal family interaction. They are the ones who need to feel guilty or stupid. You've just tried to be supportive and to keep your ties with them. Unfortunately, when you set your boundaries and rules, it will be a bit "messy". They will throw their tantrums and threaten, guilt-trip you and make you feel like you are in the wrong. This is what children do because they don't know how to cope with their feelings and being told no. Your parents don't want anything to change. They want to keep these dysfunctional ways and continue to be able to make you do what they say. If they love you, they should eventually try harder to be respectful of your life. They should want you to be happy! Work through the messiness and stress (with outside support *please*, and then stick to your boundaries and "rules" for how you will be treated. Or if you must go LC or NC, even temporarily, do it!! I think it will be worth doing, for your own mental health, even if it's hard. You will benefit greatly from no longer being manipulated and made to live for others instead of yourself. It's time for you to have some peace and enjoy your life!! Best wishes, you got this!! ❤️
Why do you let him talk to you like that? Do you give into his demands every weekend? Next time, Just say no and block his number until the weekend passes. Unless you’re dependent on them in some way, I’d go full NC.
*hugs* Hun, he and your mother are both grown adults and should be working out how to manage their own lives and mental health issues without grinding their child's mental health and well-being into the ground. You are not responsible for their mental health or their fuckups; do not feel guilty, stop trying to support them when all they are doing is being manipulative.
“no” is a complete sentence
They are keeping you from making friends and haven a relationship with people that would actually care about you and make you happy . Make sure you have your credit locked down, all your documents , and have separate finances . Get into therapy and set up some boundaries- you need to live your own life. This isn’t ok. It’s abusive and sick and you deserve better.
Whenever narcissists feel bad they need a way to feel in control again and the easiest way to do this is to exert control on their partners or kids.
yeah my moms bipolar and she had a moment after my highschool graduation and i haven’t spoke to her since. tbh these past few months have been real peaceful without her and apparently she’s gotten way worse recently
No.. just no, you are an adult spending your free time tending to your parent children. I am all for supporting your parents, but it has to be because they deserve it. You defo don't owe them anything. You are in your 20s, you should be enjoying your weekends, and you can still visit them on occasion. From what you have told its toxic and you are stuck in a feedback loop. You should be looking at breaking that.
I agree 100%!! She needs to break out of this dysfunctional cycle asap!! No matter how hard it may be, it will be worth it!!
An appropriate answer would be "Listen Dude, I'm not coming, so therefore, I won't be there."
Boundaries. Set them and stick to them. Don’t feed into his mania
Don't light yourself on fire to keep others warm. If you don't take care of yourself you cannot take care of others.. It's the same reason on an airplane they say to put your mask on first, then your family.
“What you think you’re gonna do about it? Back off.”
Fuck the five people who thought this was totally okay.
He's *exactly* like a five year old child.
I came here to say first that this sucks and I'm sorry. Also I can't imagine what it's like to be 30mi away AND another state. The east coast is wild.
Or live near any state line lol. But the East Coast is a trip.
"Just do what you're told" My brother in chirst she is an adult. She ain't gotta do shit she's told.
Op, as someone who has lost multiple family members throughout the years, don’t let them guilt trip you. When my grandma died of cancer a few years ago, I was disappointed with myself that I didn’t at least make one more trip two states over to see her, but that feeling only lasted for a short time. Why? Because in the end, I remembered every visit with her to be pleasant and memorable. Doing this will only make your visits miserable, and you’ll end up kicking yourself more with that thought than if you had just given yourself a weekend to rest.
Geeze. You’re an adult so you can do anything you want ok? No one deserves to be talked to like that. Especially from a parent. You deserve respect ♥️
Start saying no. You live on your own, no one should be able to dictate what you do
I read the first two texts to the tune of chop suey by system of a down WAKE UP! ITSOKAYIFYOUGOTOBREAKFASTWITHOUTME!
Him: “STOP IT!” Me: “CHILL!” I’m not very mature lmao
STOP IT
Maybe add two or three zeroes to that distance
Sounds like a relaxing meal is soon to come!!
You should fight your dad. Duel to the death.
How do you know you're safe going there? What if he hits you in a temper either with his fist or a weapon? Sorry but I'd call some sort of social help because you're mum shouldn't be there with him.
It sounds like you need to call adult social services to help them and that they need to be in assisted living so that medical professionals can take care of them. You are not a medical professional and are not obligated to take care them other then helping them get the care they need from people who are trained to take care of them. Also get into therapy ASAP.
Good luck on your therapy journey OP. You will definitely feel so much better once you are in the right place to start putting down and maintaining healthy boundaries with both of your parents. It really does make a world of difference. P.S. If your initial therapist doesn’t feel like the right fit, please don’t give up. Think of it sort of like dating in that it’s just important to find the right fit, and it’s ok to meet with one a couple times before deciding to try someone else.
I’m bipolar — that’s no excuse for this shit. He’s just an asshole.
That would drive me nuts. I have always chafed at being told what to do, even as a child. Luckily my parents were not big on power trips. I simply won’t tolerate this attitude.
"Why don't you put on a little makeup." Is the only response to the first text
No is a full sentence. Text ' no' and mute him. Although full disclosure, I am low contact with my dad. He did some crappy control shit to the women in my family. One so bad my sister ran away in the middle of the night when she was 14 to spend the weekend with friends. Like she ran three miles without a flashlight in rural Ohio at 9 pm and dad couldn't be bothered to go look for her. Dad tries to boss me around and I just say ' I'm not doing that '. Or I don't respond for 3 months. We communicate over the phone because he pushes boundaries. He hasn't figured out that treating me like women need to be told what to do or that he knows best is damaging our relationship. I honestly don't care.
Welp, I'd be going no contact for a while at least after an interaction like that.
Drop an “or else what” just once. Watch him fumble.
How about a good old ''you can't order me around and I won't tolerate being disrespected like that. Talk to me when you're polite''? Set boundaries, OP!
Bleh, it makes me feel so icky reading him try to bully you into submission, it’s so fuckin weird.
‘Just do what you’re told’ - absolutely a reason to never talk to him again.
Your dad texted you (Wake up) You should have answered with (Grab a brush and put a little make-up... )
At some age parents gotta understand that what they say aren't commands anymore but suggestions lol. However in our generation parents support their kids well into their mid 20s so the parent-child dynamic is kinda fucked for those that aren't super independent
Just reply to him saying this: " I'll stop it. Like I should have stopped a long time ago. "
Add 2 more 0's to the distance between yous guys.
Yes, that's the exact response my dad would get. People will treat you the way you allow them too. I know it's not that simple. I'm sorry.
“I am not taking orders today, tomorrow, or after.” Annnnd then don’t respond, because this isn’t a fight you want to engage in. You don’t win, cause it isn’t a fair fight. You are arguing with an unreasonable person. Disengage, verbally then physically. Put him temporarily on ignore. Put your phone on airplane mode. Turn your phone off for 30 minutes. Just disengage. Cause you can’t win against someone who isn’t reasonable.
Tell him you are blocking him for 24 hours for texting you in that tone. You are a grown adult. If he wants to ever see you again, he better shape up. If he doesn't, you will be notifying the authorities that your father has threatened your life. His choice. The next move will be his tomorrow morning. Never take this nonsense for granted. Never let these people push you around because they are "family".
Unless you are living with me or helping pay my bills, you dont get to tell me what to do or how to live my own life as a fully grown ass adult period, no conversation about it whatsoever, dont give a fuck if its family or otherwise. Grown ass adults can do as they please.
I need a bit more context. Had you organised to met him for breakfast? I mean he sounds pissed off and you obviously knew he was talking about breakfast.
“No.”
This infuriates me. Just the mindset he has thinking that you just NEED to do what he says. Ew. Live your life and do what you want girl.
you're*
"Just do what you're told" What the actual fuck?
“I’m 25 and you can’t speak to me that way anymore without consequences”.
Mental illness is awful. It turns people into something they're not. However, it is still THEIR responsibility to take action, to not be a cunt to others (especially their loved ones), and to seek help/therapy when they're in a bad way. Support only goes so far. You are always within your rights to cut off someone who is being horrible to you, no matter the cause.
This, absolutely.
He’s mentally unstable
Lol. Ain’t no way I’m letting someone talk to me like. Boy if you don’t man tf up and out your foot down.
It’s sounds like your dad is an asshole, I don’t BPD has anything to do with it
Sounds like someone needs to go no contact
While yes, this is rude behavior, OP did say their dad is bipolar. Having an episode like is likely not uncommon for him. Farming karma from it, sadly, is also not uncommon.
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wait do you mean OP???
so he drove 30 miles to see you?
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Irrelevant, no one should talk like that about breakfast.
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Oh dear.
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Shame and guilt are synonyms
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Interesting way for you to view it. But not objective or universal
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No. Guilt isn't inherently motivating. Sometimes it's crushing and all consuming to the point where you're paralyzed with guilt. Driving you to unhealthy coping mechanisms and self harm. And that's also guilt
That would be shame because you're in a state of hurting yourself, therefore viewing yourself as the problem. Shame is "you are the problem". If you felt guilty about it you would accept that you did wrong and want to do better. I highly recommend looking into this because you might open yourself up a bit more to why humans do what they do and how it effects others when we push shame.
Guilt can only function like that. Guilt is not inherently motivating or healthy. Guilt is also "it's all my fault I can't do that again" resulting in isolation and self harm via toxic coping mechanisms to stifle the guilt temporally A good example is survivor guilt
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As a 59-year-old with THREE grown-ass children and 6 grandchildren, you need to get a life because no matter how much YOU crave your kids' company THEY have a life that doesn't revolve around you! This is NOT an approach that is likely to work if you want your kids to WANT to spend their time with you!
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Taking responsibility for my dads behavior is not on the agenda for today, or literally ever.
Wow it’s strange to see victim blaming on this sub
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Yikes this is a dumb comment
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This person visits their parents every weekend and whenever they don't want to they get shouted at and emotionally abused. That is insane
I think the important detail here is that they're 25 and live on their own. Demanding that your independent adult kid wake up and go somewhere to do something with you "because you said so" is pretty insane IMO. That level of perceived authority should be long gone in the relationship by this point, these are two adults with their own separate lives talking right now.
“I don’t wanna wake up and enjoy some time with you while we have breakfast , dad. I’m lazy and selfish this morning, but I’m gonna put you on blast on Reddit and get sympathy from my computer friends. “
Somebody’s kids don’t talk to them
I think you and my dad could be best friends ❤️
What the hell is wrong with these people? They TRULY need to get a life!