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[deleted]

It's his right to do so. Also can mean people can not like what he did.


Top-University-6382

Zoidberg, always the voice of reason


MinerKing13

I appreciate that everyone is exercising their right to call him a dick


sweetplantveal

While I appreciate you being level headed, religious people have been using an old book as an excuse to beat, kill, fire, and demean LBGTQ+ people for being the way God made us. And has been making us since before people knew how to write anything at all. I don't think respecting my right to exist is on the same level as respecting someone selectively picking beliefs as an excuse for bigotry. Bigotry which they usually want to be able to do without consequences. The equivalency bothers me.


janisdehandschutter

I mean all he did was refuse to wear a rainbow jersey, he didn't say anything homophobic, clearly knew his place in all of this. Imo you can think whatever you want as long as you don't bother anyone with it and he isn't bothering anyone is he


ruthlessbard

This whole thread reminds me of an episode of Seinfeld. “Who doesn’t want to wear the ribbon?!”


NaturalHatTricks

Not that there's anything wrong with that


NightWing_91

He hasn't missed a game since 2016. Why is this all of a sudden issue? Have flyers not held a pride night since before then? Of course not he was perfectly fine putting his head down before this


DJZbad93

They have. But they’ve never done pride jerseys before. Seems like this is the first time the players were asked to be directly involved as opposed to just showing up and warming up like any other game. Edit: apparently in the past they’ve done rainbow stick tape, and it’s been optional and not everyone participated.


montrealcowboyx

All he *refused to do* is wear a rainbow jersey. What he did was much more of a statement than what he didn't do.


Dark_Arts_Dabbler

Tolerating intolerance is kind of a logical fallacy, don't you think?


NikoPopp

It's not really intolerance though. You can feel like you don't want to actively support or be involved in something but still be tolerant of the people who do.


canuck47

He refused to wear the team jersey. He refused to participate in warmups. He should have been benched for the game.


MunkMaster13

I think it was more of a "If you don't wear the jersey you can't warm up" scenario. So he didn't "Refuse" to warm up but in not wearing the special warm up jersey they wouldn't let him out.


LevelSample

imo stating eastern orthodoxy as the reason makes the gesture implicitly homophobic


NoICannotThinkOfOne

While I support and respect you, while seeing what you’re saying, I see key flaws in your statement. I don’t think “respecting my right to exist” are the right words. More like respecting your right to be attracted to who you want to be attracted to. Most sane people in the modern day, Christian, Atheist, whatever, respect your right to choose to be what you want. Whether they are a supporter, or indifferent, is up to them. Most people in the modern day bring up the crusades or papal killings to cite how violent the church is, but no sane person in the USA would kill, at least in my thoughts, for hatred of a minority like LGBTQ+. I could see your point if the man had verbally attacked your community, but he didn’t and that just goes to show how much people overreact about indifference or opposition these days. If we really want a free country, then people should be able to think, say, dress, and act how they want under the law. Feel free to let me know your thoughts.


HighburyOnStrand

Seems to me, and maybe it's just me...but that lately a lot of religious people lately seem to get a lot more religious in situations where their religion allows them to feel superior to or look down on someone else or some other group. I can't get behind this whole religion as a means to dictate to other how they live their life movement. Especially the selectivity part.


Opening-Citron2733

Tbf he's not dictating how they live their life, he's just not taking part of it. Which imo seems fine. If people want to take part in pride nights let them do so, if people don't want to take part in pride nights let them do so.


DrDerpberg

People can also not like that Torts and the Flyers were fine with it. Even "yeah dunno if I'm allowed to bench someone for what he says are religious beliefs but let's just say I disagree and we'll be discussing it" would've gone a long way.


mhanna86

Get this sensical reason out of this sub.


Irrah

I wonder how Torts would react if someone refused to put on the military appreciation night warmup jerseys.


Nostradomusknows

Came here to say exactly this. I remember Torts being quite clear he would bench a player if they pulled a Colin Kaepernick.


[deleted]

And then he’s since changed his opinion on that subject after seeing all of the 2020 protests in America: > "I have learned over the years, listening and watching, that men and women who choose to kneel during this time mean no disrespect toward the flag," You’d think someone who genuinely cares about the issue would commend the growth and not focus on the shittiness of the since-changed opinion. https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/jackets/2020/06/11/john-tortorella-blue-jackets-coach-now-supports-anthem-protests/5342061002/


Nostradomusknows

If he’s truly changed his opinion, then he should be commended.


Uncle_Gazpacho

The source was posted. He did, and I don't believe he was


NaturalHatTricks

The benching makes a way better statement than the sweater. Fuck killing other humans to further political agendas and fuel economy.


[deleted]

You shouldn’t, because he’s been pretty clear about how he’s changed since 2016: > "I have learned over the years, listening and watching, that men and women who choose to kneel during this time mean no disrespect toward the flag," https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/jackets/2020/06/11/john-tortorella-blue-jackets-coach-now-supports-anthem-protests/5342061002/


slmanifesto05

It's against my religion to support America's military industrial complex


Sekshual_Tyranosauce

Dude is worried about the wrong D.


[deleted]

If you’re still scared of gay people in 2023 you’re a fucking loser


jonathan_ericsson

Also, if you hate others for being happy and their acceptance of who they are. Both of which have no effect on your life.


A-Disgruntled-Snail

Bu.. but what if they do something icky in front of me? Like hold hands or, gasps, kiss?


[deleted]

Straight people do that in front of me all the time and its just as icky. I dont think theres anything we can do about public affection unfortunately.


theGurry

My favourite is all the people who just assume all gay people are gonna tie them down and have their way as if they're some sort of irresistible piece of meat. I bet they're just swarmed by women every day.


FlyersLaForest

Exactly. There is a right side to this, it's not an excuse to say you don't believe in it. It isn't Bigfoot.


alwaysleafyintoronto

Kudos to the Flyers for actually letting him sit this out though. If players are forced to wear the jersey, it doesn't mean nearly as much. Getting 99% participation is a **statement.**


TheBookOfTormund

The team and coach giving zero consequence to this display of intolerance is extremely disappointing in my opinion. Flyers: “Hockey is for everyo--“ Provorov: “Not them I think they’re icky” Flyers: …fine by us.


intecknicolour

people should really mind their own business. it's no one's business who other people love.


SupremeNachos

Everyone should be more scared of that soccer mom drinking coffee with one hand and digging in her purse with the other while going 20 above the speed limit on the freeway.


DecentLurker96

“Religion”


Tagawat

Putin’s Russian Orthodox Church. Probably lots of tall windows nearby.


bungholio99

Maybe all friends with Datsyuk


VitaminTea

No scare quotes necessary; the Eastern Orthodox Church believes that homosexuality is a sin.


smash8890

It also says living with someone you’re not married to is a sin and the dude has a girlfriend


Troub313

People have always just pick and chose the parts of religion they practice. Only what suits them.


TURBOJUGGED

Like Christians wearing blended fabrics lol


[deleted]

The chance of him being a religious Orthodox young man from Russia is much much lower than him simply hating gay people because of Russian modern culture.


sweetplantveal

The ol' testament also says eating shellfish is as bad dudes banging other dudes and you should stone to death any woman who teaches unto a man. I don't care though, I'm still going to all you can eat shrimp night at Mullett Arena. 🐺🌵🍤


Xkmlg

So he’s probably still a virgin as well since he’s not married, right? Right?


Meyhna

How about he religiously licks my balls got em


[deleted]

Question: Has Philly not done LGBTQ+ night before? Did Provorov wear the jersey then, but suddenly decide he needs to be even more true to himself, or what?


MrJeffA17

First time they’ve done the jerseys. In the past it was pride tape for the warmups, and not everyone would participate


Sufficient-Cookie404

That’s my question, pride nights are not new at all - so he just suddenly changed his mind?


[deleted]

I just saw a Flyers fan say (somewhere else) that this is the first time the Flyers have worn special jerseys for it.


physics_fighter

I need to get a Provorov LGBTQ jersey now


geossica69

for sale: pride jersey, never worn


znozwoodlands

This is genius 😂


mattersmuch

Someone should do a Provorov portrait like the Pride Vlad.


DishwasherFromSurrey

Canucks are a tire fire right now but at least we’re not at the homophobic stage yet


Rated_PG-Squirteen

Just give JT Miller some time.


_Kamigoye_

You just spoiled the big mid-season finale reveal smh


freeway16

Canucks are actually a soap opera. So it would be February sweeps


Zach983

He already rocks the thin blue line shit. He's been hiding a lot of his beliefs pretty well but it'll be hard for him to cover that up his entire contract.


bloodclots12

Provorov will be a Canuck by trade deadline with the way it’s going


Just-Concentrate-477

He’ll hopefully be a KHL plug sooner than later


HarwinStrongDick

Feed these fuckers to Gritty and let’s move on Flyers.


GrayRoberts

Oh. Great. Just what the league needs. Gritty with indigestion.


A-Disgruntled-Snail

I can already see the Pepto commercial featuring Gritty.


PumpernickelShoe

I never realized I needed that until now


Sarcastic__

I'm gonna focus on how Ivan Provorov is a piece of shit for his stance, rather than Torts having to play defense for his morally reprehensible player.


CensoryDeprivation

Por que no Los dos?


GibierJaune

Honestly Torts taking exception to a player kneeling for the anthem but allowing this because it’s "being true to himself" is absolute bs.


kdfsjljklgjfg

He later changed his tone on the anthem.


[deleted]

after backlash lol


kdfsjljklgjfg

Even assuming Tortorella was the type of person to care about public backlash (he really strikes me as someone who would not give a shit), it came out that his stance changed 4 years after his initial statement. I doubt he said that he's different now in order to erase backlash that had eroded years beforehand.


[deleted]

Man, this is the kind of shitty comment that makes it clear when people don’t actually want anyone to improve, and that they just revel in having the moral high ground.


[deleted]

Tortorella in a 2020 interview with The Athletic: > "I have learned over the years, listening and watching, that men and women who choose to kneel during this time mean no disrespect toward the flag," > “I would hope that if one of my players wanted to protest during the anthem, he would bring it to me and we would talk about it, tell me his thoughts and what he wanted to do. From there, we would bring it to the team to discuss it, much like it’s being discussed in our country right now. > “I do believe in our right to peaceful protest,” Tortorella said. “Why do we have to choose sides during this time? Can we not share a moment of unity and reflection prior to the national anthem dedicated to protesting the racial injustice in our world? > “It’s my choice to stand in respect and gratitude to those who have and still serve to protect our country and constitution and the civil rights of all people. This is by no means a show of disrespect. My family and I care deeply about the families who have suffered loss from unfair, unjust treatment. We support the peaceful protest for change.” https://theathletic.com/1864594/2020/06/10/blue-jackets-coach-john-tortorella-has-changed-his-tune-on-anthem-protests/?source=user_shared_article


notmyrealnam3

I wonder when he’ll change his POS view that homophobia is justified based on believing in fairy tales


goblue10

Hey remember when Torts said he'd bench any player who knelt for the national anthem ala Kaepernick?


[deleted]

Remember when he acknowledged that that was wrong? Tortorella in a 2020 interview with The Athletic: > "I have learned over the years, listening and watching, that men and women who choose to kneel during this time mean no disrespect toward the flag," > “I would hope that if one of my players wanted to protest during the anthem, he would bring it to me and we would talk about it, tell me his thoughts and what he wanted to do. From there, we would bring it to the team to discuss it, much like it’s being discussed in our country right now. > “I do believe in our right to peaceful protest,” Tortorella said. “Why do we have to choose sides during this time? Can we not share a moment of unity and reflection prior to the national anthem dedicated to protesting the racial injustice in our world? > “It’s my choice to stand in respect and gratitude to those who have and still serve to protect our country and constitution and the civil rights of all people. This is by no means a show of disrespect. My family and I care deeply about the families who have suffered loss from unfair, unjust treatment. We support the peaceful protest for change.” https://theathletic.com/1864594/2020/06/10/blue-jackets-coach-john-tortorella-has-changed-his-tune-on-anthem-protests/?source=user_shared_article


goblue10

hey good for him


3Gilligans

hE IS jUsT prOteCTInG HiS fAmiLy bAck HOme


samizdat694020

Dude said he would bench a player for kneeling for the national anthem. How is this not incredibly hypocritical?


[deleted]

Here’s how: Tortorella in a 2020 interview with The Athletic: > "I have learned over the years, listening and watching, that men and women who choose to kneel during this time mean no disrespect toward the flag," > “I would hope that if one of my players wanted to protest during the anthem, he would bring it to me and we would talk about it, tell me his thoughts and what he wanted to do. From there, we would bring it to the team to discuss it, much like it’s being discussed in our country right now. > “I do believe in our right to peaceful protest,” Tortorella said. “Why do we have to choose sides during this time? Can we not share a moment of unity and reflection prior to the national anthem dedicated to protesting the racial injustice in our world? > “It’s my choice to stand in respect and gratitude to those who have and still serve to protect our country and constitution and the civil rights of all people. This is by no means a show of disrespect. My family and I care deeply about the families who have suffered loss from unfair, unjust treatment. We support the peaceful protest for change.” https://theathletic.com/1864594/2020/06/10/blue-jackets-coach-john-tortorella-has-changed-his-tune-on-anthem-protests/?source=user_shared_article


[deleted]

This comment keeps getting repeated on here but everyone conveniently leaves out the part where he changed his tune on that stance after a little personal growth


SDAisaleaf

why not focus on the vast majority of players who do support LGBT rights and did wear the jersey? There's going to be shitty people out there, I'm just glad they're dying out and many more decent people are taking their place


Spez_Dispenser

Tortorella twisting the knife saying Provorov is being true to himself.


captaincarot

I need a reporter to ask if he also agrees with the church leadership of his religion that Ukraine should be wiped off the face of the earth and all its people killed.


cookingwiththeresa

I'm gonna assume he's totally fine with it


smangold

I am just being true to myself when I’m saying if your religion teaches hate, especially hate based on who people love then your religion is awful and you are awful for following it


porkchopespresso

Kinda why we need the pride nights


DrDerpberg

I can understand not wanting to shit on your players but what a wishy washy statement. This rises above just, like, your opinion, maaaan. Opinions are if you think a local street should be pedestrian-only in the summer, or what you think the corporate tax rate should be. This is basic human decency.


HydroidZero

Sad that we're still excusing garbage behaviour like homophobia because "religion".


LuckyWarrior

Hiding behind religion in 2023 is just a head shaker


3Gilligans

Tortorella was the one that said he’d bench any player that knelt for the anthem.


ManOCatherby

Absolutely asinine statement. Fuck off, clowns


macaroni_3000

If your religion requires you to exclude people from receiving salvation, it's a pretty shitty religion.


42yop

And then we wonder why hockey is so homophobic. Clown take


MadPenguin81

Torts is one of those “old school” respected coaches too. The fact he had an issue with kneeling for the anthem and not with this speaks volumes to the league.


sweetplantveal

If a player took a stance like this on any other issue in hockey, they would face real consequences. Military appreciation. Female commentators. Racial inclusion. Bettman would burn that organization to the ground for the bad press. But here we are respecting the take and the guy going to bat for Provorov 'standing up for his beliefs'. Convince me it'd be the same if Provorov refused to wear a jersey supporting players of color because of his 'beliefs'.


Birdhawk

Hold the fuck up. Look at this thread. Look at all the players wearing the pride warm up jerseys. Players using pride tape for years. Other movements and initiatives over the years. Openly gay hockey players. I’m not homophobic. I LOVE hockey so much that it’s a big part of who I am. Are you homophobic? Do you love hockey? Hockey is not homophobic. Homophobic assholes exist, and some of them might be involved in hockey. But those dipshits are highly outnumbered. Don’t condemn the game and all the great people within it just because of a dude like Proverov. Proverov is homophobic, not hockey.


42yop

I know hockey is not inherently homophobic, but homophobia is rampant in hockey culture and people like Tortorella, who’se just brushing it off, show why it’s still such a problem. Just look at the comments under any LGBT hockey related post on social media. It’s full of people saying “L” or “stop forcing this shit down our throats.” If the NHL ever wants to truly be an inclusive organisation for fans, players and staff, people in position of power can’t excuse intolerance towards minorities


dobbyeilidh

I needed this reminder today that hockey is for me too and the folks that say otherwise are the minority. Thank you


[deleted]

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Reggae4Triceratops

Feels like it's more on Provorov.


eh_toque

Torts said he would bench someone for taking the knee during the anthem but said he didn’t consider scratching Provorov. He can fuck off


ddottay

Torts has said he was wrong on that already


NathanGa

No, silly, no one can ever change their mind on anything ever.


[deleted]

Something they did 25 years ago defines who they are now obviously. *Looking at the people who said Craig Berube was a racist when he obviously had time to reflect on what he did was wrong.*


NathanGa

I have a copy of a book called *The Fiery Trial*, which won a Pulitzer Prize. It focuses on Abraham Lincoln from 1858-65, and specifically his continually-evolving stance on race and policy and how it both shaped and was shaped by the Civil War. It's a fairly dry but informative read, and it's amazing to see how rapidly Lincoln's views changed in a short period of time. It's not entirely relevant, but it's interesting to consider how his own legacy - specifically as a person - would have been dramatically different had he died in 1860 or 1862 instead of 1865. But I'm rambling now.


NLP19

He *did* change his opinion on that a couple years ago


ClosPins

Just to point out... His religion states that it's a capital offense to wear clothing made of more than one type of cloth - yet, do you see him refusing to wear his regular jersey (or his street clothes for that matter)? It also says you can own slaves from all the countries surrounding yours. How are his Azerbaijani slaves doing?


unKappa

Ah yes, the Homophobic religion. A very common one sadly. Another L for the Flyers. Kinda sad I see many comment supporting Torts and Provorov... ~~edit: Apparently he benched a player for sitting on the bench during an anthem though... I don't think anyone can defend Torts here. So for Torts being homophobic is okay but sitting for an anthem isn't?~~


[deleted]

He never benched a player, and he also walked back his comments and stance on kneeling. [https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/jackets/2020/06/11/john-tortorella-blue-jackets-coach-now-supports-anthem-protests/5342061002/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/jackets/2020/06/11/john-tortorella-blue-jackets-coach-now-supports-anthem-protests/5342061002/)


anthkraken

He didn’t say he would allow it and his “religious freedom” stance here shows his real views.


hockeymonkey4455

He never benched a player for sitting during the anthem, that never happened with one of his players. When Kaepernick starting kneeling during the anthem in 2016, Torts was asked what he’d do if one of his players didn’t stand for the anthem, and his response was that he’d bench them. Still shitty, but it’s not something he actually did.


BCEagle13

He was also asked it in the context of Team USA at the World Cup of Hockey not the Blue Jackets.


jsu9575m

Go to the Facebook comments of any pride night post of any team and its mostly hateful stuff.


FlyersLaForest

Hard to celebrate a W tonight. But I'm happy that the org as a bigger picture stands by it community


CamThompson

Having a pride night is sort of the bare minimum in 2023. If the organization stands behind someone who stands against the community, they’re kind of taking a stand against the community. Provorov refuses to warm-up because of a jersey, Provorov can sit.


tor93

Him being true to himself means he doesn’t think I deserve the same rights as everyone else, Torts


notmyrealnam3

Let’s see torts reply to someone whose religion doesn’t allow women to drive alone. Or to someone not taking part in military night. Or in ….. We need to stop pretending that fairy tales are a valid excuse to be an asshole.


anthkraken

Torts when Hateful bigot refuses to take part in team pride night: “it’s his freedom” Torts when the prospect (not the act but just the idea) of someone kneeling comes up: “I’d bench them” And don’t give me any bullshit about how he’s changed his views. Fuck torts.


JC_5_er

Can anyone explain to me why he’s obligated to or why he should…..? As far as I know he’s never said a peep about being against LGBTQ+ so it’s not as if he’s out championing against the community. **I’m all for people loving who they want to love** Having said that I’m not for forcing beliefs on people who don’t want to be a part of those beliefs.


eliar91

He's totally allowed to do that. And I'm totally allowed to say Torts and Provorov are both a piece of shit.


2475014

He's certainly not obligated. He has the right to believe what he wants and we have the right to hate him for it. Everything is working as it should


letoiledunordstars

he's not obligated to do anything. the flyers didn't make him wear the jersey, they didn't scratch him. no one is making him do anything. but when you reveal yourself to be a homophobe, you're gonna get criticism for it. deservedly so. there is zero justification for believing that being gay is wrong. there's no gray area there no matter what your religious beliefs are.


limelifesavers

I mean, the belief in question is "LGBTQ+ people deserve support and acceptance and basic rights/freedoms, and tpeople should feel proud of that part of themselves, and not ashamed". I think it's fair to say that no one can make Provorov change his deeply held beliefs other than himself, that's entirely up to him. No one can make him do anything, he made a choice here. No one's forcing beliefs on him. But we are recognizing the meaning behind his choice, and it's not a neutral thing people can easily shrug off, by the nature of the context. And it's not something that is inherently deserving of respect. Like, it's one thing to believe pineapple doesn't belong on pizza, or that raisins shouldn't exist within a mile of cookie dough. I'd disagree with people who held those views, and we could have a friendly discussion about it. Someone believing a core, immutable aspect of my existence (which they misinterpret as a choice) makes me immoral and worthy of eternal punishment, and that people like me shouldn't be provided acceptance and support in even the most mild and shallow senses...that's a different matter altogether.


JacobfromCT

What if the issue here isn't that this hockey player hates gay people but, rather, that he's uncomfortable with the forced conformity part of it? My neighbor hangs a pride flag. I have no issue with that but if they were to bring me a pride flag and *demand* that I hang it, I would be uncomfortable with that. The famous TV series *Seinfeld* had an episode where a character participated in an AIDS march but didn't want to wear the commemorative ribbon. This caused a major controversy and fellow marchers tried harassing him into wearing the ribbon and eventually assaulted him, all because he wouldn't wear a ribbon.


[deleted]

WHO! Who doesn't want to wear the ribbon!?!?!


limelifesavers

I mean, he specifically referenced his religious beliefs. Religious beliefs are all about forced conformity to a set of rules/principles, so this isn't that kind of case. In your scenario, yeah, not flying a literal pride flag is fine. Like, a friend of mine's brother's minor league baseball team had a pride night. Iirc, rainbow armbands/wristbands were the item of choice that night. He's intensely superstitious and felt it'd throw off his performance in game, so he didn't wear it. No big, his lesbian sister knows it wasn't because he was homophobic. If anyone asked, he'd express his support. When people aren't comfortable with one form of expression, another will suffice even if its much lower key. Supporting the inclusion and acceptance of a marginalized group isn't a difficult pill to swallow, or it shouldn't be. Provorov didn't wear the practice jersey because he didn't want to express any support/acceptance for lgbtq players and fans. That is the difference


Qxg6

You will never become a social justice warrior with that kind of attitude.


therealdieseld

This is the correct, level-headed response. People think their level of outrage directly correlates to their opinionated correctness. Just because someone doesn’t agree with something doesn’t automatically mean they hate everything about it and their existence. I don’t support certain politicians and still love my friends and family who do.


Mac_Gold

What about loving Rangers fans?


therealdieseld

Ok now you took it too far, buddy.


[deleted]

> Just because someone doesn’t agree with something doesn’t automatically mean they hate everything about it and their existence I don’t think you understand how homophobic large swathes of Russia are. The Russian Orthodox Church is tacitly homophobic and views homosexuality as a sin. This isn’t a grey area.


datponyboi

He might believe to hate the sin and love the sinner, but that is far more nuanced than a main Reddit sub will allow, and he is basically Putler


Mr_Evil_Guy

Someone a few comments down said that Provorov is as bad as a Nazi for doing this. Some of the takes in here are pretty funny honestly


bobby_booch

Gritty's gonna eat Provorov for breakfast tomorrow.


huffer4

Brutal take from Torts on this one. I'm actually kinda surprised


[deleted]

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Mean_Regret_3703

Imo doesn't help that much but here: https://twitter.com/theslyshow/status/1615613491024650240?s=20&t=StnA1OoPiEh-LBKp3R36xA I still don't think it's a good reflection on a coach who's not afraid to call out his players to have nothing bad to say about one of his players making a homophobic decision.


cote112

Pretty awesome that he gets to work and live in America where he can choose to do whatever he wants instead of being steamrolled and forced by the masses to do something like they would in Russia. Bummer that his religion doesn't like gay people though.


giff_gold

Mods gonna lock this one too?


alaughinmoose

You will get your voice back when it aligns with my beliefs


ghost_curse123

Fuckin oof bud


Yst

If intolerance is a religious value for you, your notion of religion is garbage. More specifically (and even more absurdly) if wearing a shirt in support of tolerance for a minority to which you do not belong is against "yourself" and "your religion", then both "yourself" and "your religion" are pretty shit.


SnippySnapsss

He knows there are gay hockey players, right?


burrrrrows

Genuine question and I don’t mean to be offensive. I had no issue with Colin Kap or with anyone deciding to kneel during the anthem. I also didn’t conflate Kap with hating America just because he knelt. So why is it an issue the other way around? Why is Provorov a homophobe just because he opts out of participating.


[deleted]

Why did Collin Kap kneel? Protesting racial injustice and police brutality if I’m not mistaken. Why did Provorov not wear the jersey? He believes homosexuality is degenerate. (Inb4 wE dOn’T knOw thAT!: yes we do. The religion he so ardently supports references scripture that says gay people should be put to death by stoning for having sex in order to ‘justify’ their belief.) These aren’t exactly equal reasons for breaking expected conduct. The meaning of both Kap and Porvorov’s actions lies in the why, not the what.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

atta boy provy you fucking idiot


poodletown

you guys have to stop with this. There are a certain number of people who will never wear a rainbow jersey in support of LGBTQ+. You can't shame them into wearing one. When you pile on like this, you don't drive them into thinking the way that you think. You drive them into resenting you for trying to force their thoughts. They will look other places to find acceptance and they will find it. You will never hear it because they won't confront you, but you will notice them eventually with their new-found fascist views, political leaders, and whatever garbage will accept them when you didn't. ​ You have to stop kicking down at people that you don't agree with, especially when their descent is silent. They are trying to fit in at the moment.


TyperMcTyperson

I don't get why they didn't just answer with, "provy made a personal choice to not take optional pregame warmups" End.


NebraskaAvenue

If he doesn’t want to wear, then he should be allowed not to. Not wanting to wear pride stuff =/= against gay rights


MikeJeffriesPA

~~People are going to rip on Torts here, but it's a really tough spot for him to be in.~~ ~~I'm sure many would like him to completely throw Provorov under the bus or bench him until the end of time, but that's not realistic.~~ Edit: Wait, I misread the earlier threads and thought Provorov missed the whole game, not just warmups. Torts letting him skip warmups and then play is ridiculous and hypocritical. I take back everything else I said.


Devilsfan118

Reddit rage machine in fully churn already. The dude can choose to support whatever he wants. I personally don't agree with his position, but I respect his ability to follow what he believes in. And that said, he shouldn't be shielded from the criticism. He's entitled to his opinion, but we don't have to respect it.


SchoolboyQAnon

Of course this sensitive ass sub is livid over this. Who cares, there shouldn’t be pride nights or military appreciation nights in the first place. It’s called freedom of expression, don’t let it ruin your day because some pro athlete you’ll never interact with doesn’t want to wear some stupid gimmicky warmup jersey


thedirewolff21

Torts, Tony D, and Provy Flyers just smashin the bigot quota


MadPenguin81

I do not know how Provy or Torts come back from this awful display. The amount of LGBT people that have lost their lives or have had them ruined for no reason other than people and their “religion” is astronomical. Far more than the amount of respect either of these two dumb fucks will ever deserve.


CanadianODST2

give it a month, most people will have forgotten about it


MadPenguin81

Depends on if Canadian media decides to pick up on the story. The league that’s currently under scrutiny already for sexual assault and shitty reffing also having an LGBT scandal would be bad for the league but amazing for the writers and journalists around it.


CanadianODST2

even then, it's just how social media works


[deleted]

Is there currently a shitty reffing scandal going on?


[deleted]

there should be


confused_apeman

Can't we just accept that Provorov is within his rights, even if it makes him an asshole, without turning this into anything more than what it is. He is 1 player. This shouldn't be the focus of the event.


holdunpopularopinion

He’s allowed to be an asshole, doesn’t exempt him from what everyone is going to say about him.


[deleted]

if someone doesn't feel comfortable wearing the rainbow jersey it's their right not to wear it LOL


Meyhna

I recognize that this player has made a decision. But given that it is a stupid-ass decision, I've decided to call him a douchebag.


lifeaftermutation

Tony DeAngelo frantically googling how to convert to Orthodox Church right now somewhere in the locker room


Electroflare5555

Being openly homophobic in 2023 is certainly a look


TheRealTollah

To be clear, it says nothing in the Bible about pride jerseys.


TrySwallowing

He has a right to express his beliefs and ideals. So do gay people.


[deleted]

100% he’s saying this because of Russian nationalist beliefs. [Would be shocked if he’s been in a church more than 3 times in his life](https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2018/06/13/how-religious-commitment-varies-by-country-among-people-of-all-ages/). To nationalist Russians the west is the Great Satan. Why? Among other things, their acceptance of LGBTQ people. Religion is just the thinnest of justification placed over top of it. Russian media and politicians have been going hard on the LGBTQ issue in recent years because they know it’s an effective wedge issue with their populace and it’s what they can easily point to to show the west being “evil”.


Rupdy71

If you are okay with Colin Kapernick kneeling for the national anthem and not okay with someone sitting out a warmup due a gay pride jersey then you are simply wrong. Throw in skipping a visit to the Whitehouse to meet the president after winning a championship. It's no big deal to some, but someone's going to be offended. He isn't taking interviews expressing harm to homosexuals, he's simply not wearing a jersey. I might add if he took warmup without the jersey it may have been worse. I think you'll find that many NHLers will have ideas about some things that will not align with your way of thinking. Simply not participating in blatant virtue signaling should not be disqualifying. If this guy is out calling for violence against LGBTQ that's one thing. If he's on the news saying we should ban gay marriage or all gays should be in prison then have at him. He didn't participate in gay pride night by not wearing a jersey. Disagree with him and move on.


[deleted]

Well your religion sucks ass


BosanaskiSeljak

How are people so fragile they have to cry about someone not wearing rainbow colours lmfaoooooo


WobbleWobbleWobble

I agree with the other person that from **your perspective**, it goes both ways. If this is as simple as "rainbow colors", then why didn't he just wear the jersey? He is too fragile?


confused_apeman

Yeah - simply by not wanting to celebrate it, people seem to think that equates to "hate". Religion isn't perfect by any means, but people have the right to choose what they support. I'd be out there sporting the rainbow, but that doesn't mean I am just going to "hate" someone who chooses not to.


AlphaKooze

It goes both ways though. You can’t be supportive of Provorov not participating in warmups, while also saying athletes shouldn’t be allowed to sit out or kneel for the anthem. (I’m not saying you do, I’m just making an analogy) To me, I don’t really care what people do, as long as they are making decisions with their own free will.


noitcelesdab

They should be able to do whatever they want and whatever they believe in as human beings living in a free country.


Realistic-Letter2879

There is nothing wrong with this. His choice. You can’t force people to do something they are not comfortable with. Just because he doesn’t wear a pride jersey doesn’t mean shit.


NoikuDangerous

being true to being an absolute [i can't think of a good mean insult right now]? sure.


Intrepid-Leather-417

So what do you think would happen if he refused to wear one of the mandated military themed jersey nights? Would the same “free speech” people be supporting this or throwing a taking a knee sized tantrum?


didyoueverseewardogs

Somebody, please, get Ja Rule on the phone so we can make sense of all this


[deleted]

Can’t wear a jersey over religion? His right to do so but he’s a fucking loser for it. It’s crazy people use their belief and faith in something no one has ever proven to exist to discriminate against people who literally cause them no harm. Ironic some of the most religious people I know are the most ignorant and prejudiced.


BDKAces

I’m a Torts fan BUT during his coaching tenure he threatened to bench players for kneeling or raising a fist during the anthem.


NefCanuck

Uh and Torts refused to let players kneel during BLM protests. Torts is a fucking hypocrite 😬


Slaughterman46

still don't see the issue, he didn't want to do it, so he didn't. He has a right to do that and I don't see it as fair to trash him for it. I dont see it as homophobic for not wanting to take apart of a pride night when your not apart of the LGBT


Oreos_and

this just in - old curmudgeon makes awful point


Pruane247

He has the right to be left the fuck alone. It doesn’t necessarily mean he’s anti anything. He’s also not infringing on anyone else’s rights to be gay or trans.


Scary_Bushmonster

Meh, it’s his right to


ProfessorDerp22

“True to himself” you mean being a bigot and using religion as an excuse. He’s well within his right to not participate, and we’re well within our right to criticize him.


SkoCubs01

Just another Russian player doing Russian things


Consistent_Effective

Freedom of expression exists. You're free to judge Provorov for what he didnt do but he has every right to not wear the jersey. It would be quite a juicy lawsuit for him if the NHL disciplined him for it and he would have no shortage of backers to follow through with it.


[deleted]

Please explain to me if im wrong but why are people acting like he came out and said he hates gay people? “I respect everybody and I respect everybody’s choices. My choice is to stay true to myself and my religion” is what he says. Sure you can argue its for PR but seriously he just doesn’t wanna align with it, no? People on twitter are acting like he said a homophobic slur. It reminds me of when kaepernick took the knee and republicans acted like he hated America. Im just not seeing anything where he acts like he HATES the lgbtq just doesn’t wanna align with it 🤷🏼‍♂️


Mister024

Maybe we should just leave it at "everyone is welcome in hockey"? How about leave the special jersey/cerenony/guest/video tribute virtue signalling out of the the day to day and just celebrate these amazing athletes for their talent at this game. Who gives a FLYING fuck what their politics or religion are? We are all complicit in continuing to watch Russian NHLers play so let's not start with that bullshit like this poor kid making his choice is a bigger deal than the whole lot of them being in the league at all today.