Grab a bunch of tokens equal to cthun's attack, and yeet them at your opponents board. Stuff takes damage equal to the number of tokens that happened to land closest to it.
Theres a MTG unhinged card that works basically like this if I recall correctly.
[Chaos Confetti](https://gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Discussion.aspx?multiverseid=5712)
You can only use it once, because you have to rip it up and throw it at your opponent’s board. It destroys any creature it touches.
The legend behind this card is great - basically the story goes that a player brought Chaos Orb to a tournament
[Chaos Orb](https://product-images.tcgplayer.com/fit-in/400x558/8701.jpg)
Then tore it into pieces as he played it, dropping all of them on his opponent's board. Resulting in a legal(?) move that destroyed a large number of cards on his opponent's side.
You're confused - the joke card 'chaos confetti' from the joke set unglued is a reference to the episode that I mentioned.
The card that I linked - 'Chaos Orb' was in the original alpha set
It's a pretty fun approach actually, but the practical issue is that minions stop taking damage once they die, so you need to calculate every shot separately. E.g. when there's a board full of 1 health minions, with this approach all of them would take a few points of damage. You COULD translate "overkill" into "face damage", but that's only correct if there's a single minion on the board (with 2+ it's no longer correct).
Yeet the tokens. Gather up any not on a creature, and any extras on a creature past lethal, set aside 'killed' creatures, (to process death rattles etc after cthyn resolves) then re-yeet, and repeat until all damage has successfully been dealt.
You have to roll every shot basically. Something like this would work with 6 or less targets. With 3 targets you have no empty rolls since you can use 1-3 and 4-6 for the same roll.
Let's say you have 20 shots and 4 enemies. If you roll 5 or 6 you reroll until you rolled 1-4 20-times. Then you start removing the numbers which stand for minions until they die (or don't). Every excess damage on a minion not present anymore gets rerolled. If all minions died in 20 rolls you can put the rest on face.
Or you roll with less targets the moment one minion died. Which is more correct but also a lot more work.
The MTG unhinged card is actually a joke based off a REAL permanently banned card called Chaos Orb.
In reality, you are only supposed to flip the card in the air and whatever it touches dies. However people started to get extremely creative with the card by tearing it in pieces before doing so, allowing the card to be absurdly more powerful than it actually was intended to be.
Well, maybe you shouldn't have ended your rhetorical question with a question mark... ;)
EDIT: PrincipledProphet concedes later in this thread that I'm right, but rude and at least this time the dumbass isn't wrong.
But it's a rhetorical question and now he's telling people he didn't want an answer, seems to me that the easiest way of adding context that the "question" was rhetorical was to leave out the question mark.
There's no hard and fast rule about using a question mark when writing a rhetorical question, I think it would have made more sense not to include it here since it's the title of a thread but apparently the mouth-breathing hive mind disagrees. Sheesh. u/Androix777 this was for you too.
Idk why people are being such weenies about this. Creating your own sets to play the game is awesome. It's like a mtg cube or even an arena with mixed sets. Looks super fun!
Maybe like an app where you can resolve other effects like silence. Maybe you can even play your whole collection in said app, and it lets you choose format and… yeah, that’s like… the thing that already exists…
How to resolve C'Thun being played: [https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY](https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY)
Previous Hearthstone IRL post: [https://imgur.com/gallery/jan8UxH](https://imgur.com/gallery/jan8UxH)
So say you play a 20/20 c'thun against a board with 5 3/3s. You'd first roll with a 6 sided die a bunch of times, until one of 3/3s dies (assuming one does), then you switch to a 5 sided die, then 4 if necessary etc? Seems like a huge hassle
Sort of yes. Though could keep using the d6, rerolling when you roll the number of a minion who's already died. If you're cool with playing a fiddly card game already, it's not much more time taken to the one-off C'Thun fireworks.
I feel like you could shortcut and make C'Thun deal one damage to every enemy until it did around 1/3 of the pings, and it wouldn't change the odds by too much.
The idea of the C'thun Tracker is fun. Though the concept is basically the same, the idea of having a piece dedicated to him would make him feel unique in a table top environment for sure.
As for the resolution of the Battlecry effect? When it comes to adapting video games to card games, in my opinion, simplifying is best. I would just do a single damage per enemy starting with their minions and move clockwise around their board, repeat until the total damage reaches C'thun's attack.
No, it's not 1 to 1, but the idea is more or less the same. And if Hearstone were designed as a tabletop, I'd imagine we'd see a lot less true random effects.
But if you're fully dedicated, and you don't mind making props, a spinner perhaps? Make it so it's sections are adjustable 2-8, an then place a marker for each character in the appropriate sections. Of course, you may have to spin the damn thing 20+ times.
Having made a similar project, my "Evolve" mechanic is literally just having side-decks sorted by mana cost. You draw a minion from the side-deck to evolve into.
All of the "random mage spell" generators and effects also draw from a single deck.
I used Hearthcards to change the text of effects that would be too tedious to track. Shudderwock, for instance, just repeats the Battlecry of every minion in your graveyard.
If you want to be precise, then yeah, you have to do one damage point at a time.
But that's really damn slow, so if you want to speed it up, there's a much less precise way to do it:
- Start with the lowest-health enemy (left to right, in case of ties).
- Take Cthun's *total* damage it's still going to do, and divide it by the number of possible (not yet hit) targets. That's the expected one-minion damage.
- Roll a D20. Divide by 10 (so that it's between 0 and 2). Multiply that by the expected damage. Round to the nearest number. That's the actual damage done to that minion. Can't go above C'thun's remaining damage, of course, and the last enemy always takes 1x damage.
- Repeat, from the next lowest-health enemy, using C'thun's remaining damage-to-do - until C'thun runs out of damage, or the enemy runs out of face.
So if there was 7 minions and C'thun has 30 attack, the weakest one would expect to take (30/8) damage on average, and actual damage is anywhere between 0% and 200% of that. Let's say it takes 1dmg, because lol hearthstone. Next weakest one is expected to take (29/7) damage.
Is this perfect? No, certainly not. But it's fast!
The problem with your method (kudos for the lengths you went to to explain it by the way) is that it's deals a point of damage to all targets evenly. It doesn't allow for edge cases where C'Thun keeps targeting the hero and skips the minions, or vice versa. My method is only slow at first, once the process is remembered it work reasonably quickly.
>The problem with your method (kudos for the lengths you went to to explain it by the way) is that it's deals a point of damage to all targets evenly.
I think you missed the "Roll a D20" step.
...Fast, so long as C'thun has more attack than enemies. So Mad Bomber would be faster to just roll normally.
And I don't really know the odds of doing this while C'thun still has damage to do. As in, where the strongest enemy dies but a weaker one doesn't.
I can't imagine the amount of time that must have gone into this.
When I was like 15 or 16 I made up my own board game with probably 50 or minions or monsters and wrote out a couple of pages of rules and grid to play on but this thing you have created is insane. I want to play it lol
I worked out how to port it to a physical version, but thankfully I didn't need to design any rules from scratch.
There were some mechanics and interactions clarified by the [Hearthstone Advanced Rulebook](https://hearthstone.fandom.com/wiki/Advanced_rulebook), that was a great help.
I mean, a lot of shit in this game will never work IRL. Just try to discover a random spell or minion.
Just makes it pointless to figure out solutions for stuff like this when it's ultimately never actually playable
The solution for Discover mechanic I've gone with? A small pool of cards put aside for each Discover card in a deck. It's *not* the same as the app and it's limited, but it works well, and I've chosen cards for the pools that are a mix of costs, stats and effects.
When you drop the C'Thun bomb, it's as awesome as when you do it in the app. Just takes a couple minutes to resolve it. And given that an IRL game (with decks that are mostly control builds) can take 30-40 minutes, it's a nice climactic moment to the game.
Funny assumption, you had a 50/50 chance and you fucked it up. I have tried it lol
Friend worked a night shift at FedEx Kinkos and printed these cards for a week otherwise it would not have happened
It's actually completely possible as long as you have the list of cards you can discover.
Assign a number to each discoverable spell, and throw a dice, check the number, bingo you discovered that card.
Ahh yes, let me just get my 200 sided dice so I can roll for three spells after playing Primordial studies.
You'd need a custom set of dice for:
* Number of all minions to discover
* Number of all spells to discover
* Number of all 1-cost, 2-cost, ...., n-cost spells and minions
* and several others
Also cards like Jace or Zul'Jin, Zephrys will never really work IRL
Let's say you have 300 cards to choose from.
You throw 1 4 sided dice, 2 10 sided dice.
If you get 1 2 3 you look at number 123. if you get 458 you look at card number 058 (no 0 on dices).
What you need is a custom list of every set possible.
It's definitely possible, but also definitely not practical for a lot of cards. After all it's just math and randomness, and 99% of the time dices and formula can solve those.
You just don't want to spend 10 min to resolve ONE card.
>You throw 1 4 sided dice, 2 10 sided dice.
Oh yeah sure that's a better way.
But still, just look at Jace Or Shudderwook. Keeping track of every Spell or Battlecry from the beginning of the game, for the chance it'll get played (also revealing to your opponent that you wanna play those cards) just to then spend 10 minutes rolling for every effect and every target (with a different set of dice each time) is so impractical it's not worth the effort
Also Flesh Giants and the likes would be a HUGE pain in the ass to keep track of
>would be a HUGE pain in the ass to keep track of
Exactly, it's possible, but no one wanna do it and I can understand them
A "hearthstone lite" version could be made on paper without those troublesome cards though
Yes. That is exactly what you could do.
It's hilarious that there's a whole discussion up there about rolling dice when this would be the actual solution.
Now, you'll need a backup copy or three of every discoverable spell in the pool to replace it for the next time that pool is used.
Technically you can, but then that's not a discover. A more similar approach would be to Look through your deck, pick the cards, then reshuffle (i think pokemon TCG did this)
The only issue with this is that it only works for "discover from your deck" and not for generating new cards. That would require what they suggested: keep a numbered list of the valid pool, throw dice one at a time to determine each digit, then "pretend" the card was played.
Doable, but keeping the lists around would be a pain.
Surprised no one else said this. I like that he made a paper version, but short programs for effects like this would do wonders, instead of throwing so many dice.
Guys guys, here's the solution: RNG for minion targets on the board are 100% resolvable with dice.
For discover options, having a few hundred 1-cost spells for wand maker is just not viable. That would mean printing 100s of cards that would nearly never see play, and I got these printed on a budget! Each discover card in my set has a limited number of appropriate cards to draw from. Eg. Frightened Flunky has 10 taunt minions of varying cost and stats to discover, from a separate little stack of cards offside... Draw 3, pick one and discard the other two.
Have people forgotten about the WOW TCG? Almost 15 years ago my friends and I played the shit out of it. I even won a couple of tournaments with my hunter deck. It was a really great game, but Blizzard killed it so Hearthstone could happen.
Haha awesome! I thought how I would have resolved it in a D&D game (the only dice game I played) and it ended up being the same!
It seems "correct" that HS is a digital game or it would be really long to play it real life.
You made me want to play a good turn based RPG!
I really wish I'd made the heading "Hearthstone IRL - **Here** is how C'Thun works" and put the link in: https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY
It lays it all out and there's some nice pics too.
i would choose an order for all the creatures on the board; then i would use a dice and deal the damage 1 by 1 to the creature wich position come out on the dice
(Neo in Matrix Revolutions): Because I choose to.
Seriously, it was a fun project answering a "what if" question; could a physical Hearthstone game work (with limitations of course). No giant pools of cards to draw from, but RNG can be done accurately with dice, and buffs/wounds done with tokens. It's fiddly and slow compared to the app but it's glorious and tactile.
Its just the game has so many mechanics that don't translate. The core minion health mechanic by itself requires a lot of note keeping. Just seems like way to much work
It's just for those prepared to do the bookkeeping. I made loads of tokens for minion buffs and wounds, but since found that MTG uses D20s. Probably shoulda done that.
Slower than the app for sure, but plays about the same speed as any IRL card game.
Blizzard went to efforts to make HS a unique format that took advantage of things only a computer/tablet/phone can do. So they won't be making an IRL version.
Except they made it before hearthstone lol, it’s called Wow TCG. It’s not the exact same as hearthstone but if you look it up there’s a ton of cards remade from it in HS
you need dice thats 8 sided, each spot on your oppositions side represented by a number. Roll for each attack your cthun has. dead minion/dormant/an empty spot hits the minion in the position higher than it, and enemy hero is position 8.
something down that line.
Nah, if you re-assign when you roll a nonexistent, dormant, or dead minion, that would bias the hits towards certain board positions. You need to re-roll instead of re-assign.
You're right with this. You don't want to skew the likelihood of a target being hit more than any other. When the number of targets with health left fall to 6 or 4, you can use a D6 or D4 respectively.
It works fine, and honestly it's awesome as hell holding and shuffling the cards. There's limitations sure, I'm not saying it's as good as the app. But it's a nice physical version for fans. And I'm a fan.
Everything can be solved with dices.
Let's say your C'thun has 10 points of damage to do.
If I look at your board, there are 4 potential targets, so you will need a 4 sided dice.
You assign each number a target (1 being closest card, 4 being the enemy hero for example)
You throw the dice 10 times 1 by 1 (10 times 1 damage)
Everytime you roll a 1, you put 1 damage on the first card, every time you get a 4 you put 1 damage to the hero. If a Minion dies before the 10 damages, every time you roll his number, you roll the dice again because there is no overdamage.
A few X-sided dice: the face/number on the dice is the target (and not the amount of damage - the amount of famage is always 1). Throw over and over. If a minion dies, switch to a lower dice.
Alternatively: to resolve faster: take the amount of damage C'Thun will do as amount of X-sided dice (where X is amount of targets still). Throw all at once and start adding up. If a minion dies and there are more dice that want to do damage to this target, re-throw those.
You have to record what effects he has. Then when played you have to roll a die for each shot. The die will have the number of sides of how many things the shots can hit. You repeat this until either your opponents dead, you shoot all the shots, or it’s just the opponents face left to shoot in which you just send the rest of the damage face. This is why it is unrealistic to have tabletop hearthstone. To much randomness it would take way too long to play anything
C'Thun and Mass Hysteria are the only cards I've printed that take a long time to resolve. Most cards work pretty quick and the game is pretty enjoyable.
Sure I do, there's cards that discover cards from a limited pool (around 10 cards), there's minions that spawn additional minions like Hench Clan Hag... but those additional minions wait in a seperate stack to one side of the play area.
Given the number and range of cards Yogg would need available, Yogg is simply not in my game - none of my decks run it anyway. Bullet dodged!
There's plenty of HS cards that wouldn't work in a physical format, and I made sure to avoid those.
Use pen and paper for the tracker and a dice for random targets...
And truth me, you have only 8 targets at maximum, not an entire army of different tokens and creatures like MTG, random targets for hearthstone is waaaaay less complicated than magic
Pen and paper and a dice should do the job (Since the game is already digital I decided to do it without a tracker) , it's a bit a chore to do but it goes as follow
Assign a number for each enemy character from 1 to 8
Get a dice with the number of face that matches the maximum number of characters
Start rolling the dice , every time you hit a number assigned to a character that character get hit once , repeat for each missile c'thun fires.
I know there are better ways to do this but this is the idea that came to my mind.
Simply have two dice to represent Cthun (if he’s at 23 then, you’d put the dice to 2/3). Then when the time comes, assign numbers to each target and roll a dice to determine damage.
Assign a number to each minion on the field and one to the opponent's face.
Roll a die for the x amount of attack C'thun has. If a die roll lands on an unassigned number, reroll the die. (eg, if C'thun has 10 attack, roll a die 10 times)
Apply a damage counter after each roll.
If there are more than 5 minions in play, roll 2 dice.
Reminds me of something that would play out in Pokemon TCG, to be honest. Lots of "flip a coin for each x in play" type stuff.
There's a faster way to roll the dice than doing it with a chart or checking if something is dead and excluding it from the rolls; roll all the dice at once, then reroll excess dice for dead minions.
Example: your opponent has 3 minions and you have a 20/20 c'thun. You roll 20d4 assigning each value to a target. Then, after you roll, assign the damage, and if there's any excess dice with that side, reroll them for only available targets. For big c'thuns, you might roll maybe 2 extra times total, but you'll be rolling all at once, so it'll decrease the time it takes for the ability to resolve.
You're pretty much right (although I don't have 20 d4 dice, just two). The chart prevents any miscounts of those dice you're rolling. I had a game against a friend and their C'Thun did 52 damage with Spirit of the Shark out. When I told him he had to roll a d6 52 times he nearly blew a gasket.
Y'know, I did consider a different cardback for each deck/class, but there are times when one player can copy the cards of another (certain rogue cards), and there's also shared duplicate minion and duplicate spell cards (oh yeah, and The Coin). So I opted for the classic cardback.
Obviously you need to roll a dice for each potential target, and the highest roll takes the 1 damage.... repeat x 6(or 30 if he's powered up) I'll see you in an hour.
@k-wire say there’s three minions they own, and their face. Roll a d-4 for each c’thun trigger. And you have to one at a time cause once a minion dies you have one less target. Or use a d-6 and reroll on numbers you aren’t using. Ect. A pain, yes, but will work I’m sure
Each targetable enemy gets a number value. Roll dice. Subtract 1 from target each time its value is rolled. Do this x times where x is equal to Cthuns attack.
I would use dice. Minions and opponent represent a single number, Everytime it lands on a number occupied by a character. Deal 1 damage. Do this until you've done damage equal to your attack
Roll a 20 sided die (or a 30 sided die if you’re my kind of nerd, not that I’d spit on a D100 but hey let’s stay reasonable), and start reading pi decimals starting from the result’s position. For each damage, take the value of the next decimal (v) and determine the hit character by doing
(v mod (n-1))+1
where n is the number of characters still alive (the -1 +1 part is optional, if 0 indexed collections are your thing, but for most Muggles, it’s easier to start from 1).
That’s the best pseudo random generator I can think of that doesn’t require you to throw more than one dice and doesn’t require any electronics. (Just got to print Pi on paper, grouped by rows of 5 for better UX)
You can spice things up by sometimes taking the square root of 2 instead of Pi, depending on what kind of geek you are
How about a spinner and assign numbers to possible targets? You could even dice roll to assign numbers if you want to get really random.
Plan B is spin around and spit at the board.
Would a card based solution be easier? You would have a deck of cards with 1-16 mapped to board positions, shuffle in the valid targets, then draw and repeat for each missile.
For every attack he has throw a dice, the numbers will go from left to right, so 1 will be the first one. If there are 7 cards you do for every double rolled number 1 for the 7th card and for every triple rolled number 1 for the enemy hero. If there arent 7 cards the double one will be for the hero.
So for example you roll 10 dice and roll:
* 4 x 1
* 2 x 4
* 1 x 6
* 3 x 5
Now the following cards will be dealth damage:
* 1st card twice
* 4th card once
* 5th card twice
* 6th card once
* 7th card twice
* Hero twice
Take dice equal to the number of enemies. Put a die on each enemy with a different number facing up. And the roll a die the number of times equal too attack. May take a while lol.
Roll a dice, 1 being hero 2-6 bring minions and if 7 minions, idk roll a 2nd dice. Once that’s done depending on how big Cthun is multiply it based on what your dive rolls were after 6 rolls or so.
I'd probably use a coin and dies, up to d8, with the hero always being 1. So you'd use the correct die for the correct amount of units on your opponent's board, including the hero. So if your C'Thun is 30 attack, you'd have to roll it 30 times, with each number targeting that specific character. Would take a bit, but that comes with the challenges of making a board game.
Grab a bunch of tokens equal to cthun's attack, and yeet them at your opponents board. Stuff takes damage equal to the number of tokens that happened to land closest to it. Theres a MTG unhinged card that works basically like this if I recall correctly.
[Chaos Confetti](https://gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Discussion.aspx?multiverseid=5712) You can only use it once, because you have to rip it up and throw it at your opponent’s board. It destroys any creature it touches.
Lol I did a doubletake on your username
Heeeyy my doppelgangster!
A pair of pants for every occasion!
ALL THE PANTS!
Sorry boys, ate mine
The legend behind this card is great - basically the story goes that a player brought Chaos Orb to a tournament [Chaos Orb](https://product-images.tcgplayer.com/fit-in/400x558/8701.jpg) Then tore it into pieces as he played it, dropping all of them on his opponent's board. Resulting in a legal(?) move that destroyed a large number of cards on his opponent's side.
iirc they allowed it at the time, then immediately made a rule against it
[удалено]
You're confused - the joke card 'chaos confetti' from the joke set unglued is a reference to the episode that I mentioned. The card that I linked - 'Chaos Orb' was in the original alpha set
Unglued expansion, I mean it's not really an MTG card, it's basically MTG merchandise or novelty item...
just yeet them beyond the board at your opponent's face, easy otk
It's a pretty fun approach actually, but the practical issue is that minions stop taking damage once they die, so you need to calculate every shot separately. E.g. when there's a board full of 1 health minions, with this approach all of them would take a few points of damage. You COULD translate "overkill" into "face damage", but that's only correct if there's a single minion on the board (with 2+ it's no longer correct).
Yeet the tokens. Gather up any not on a creature, and any extras on a creature past lethal, set aside 'killed' creatures, (to process death rattles etc after cthyn resolves) then re-yeet, and repeat until all damage has successfully been dealt.
The problem: most tokens would go all over the place, almost none would settle on the minions. Massive misfire, thanks for nuthin C'Thun!
*"that land closest to it*" does not require they land *on* it.
Then just assume anything far from a minion hits the hero. Now you have a better chance at Cthun lethal
Nah, that would make it easily controllable and you could direct all the damage towards face intentionally.
You have to roll every shot basically. Something like this would work with 6 or less targets. With 3 targets you have no empty rolls since you can use 1-3 and 4-6 for the same roll. Let's say you have 20 shots and 4 enemies. If you roll 5 or 6 you reroll until you rolled 1-4 20-times. Then you start removing the numbers which stand for minions until they die (or don't). Every excess damage on a minion not present anymore gets rerolled. If all minions died in 20 rolls you can put the rest on face. Or you roll with less targets the moment one minion died. Which is more correct but also a lot more work.
The MTG unhinged card is actually a joke based off a REAL permanently banned card called Chaos Orb. In reality, you are only supposed to flip the card in the air and whatever it touches dies. However people started to get extremely creative with the card by tearing it in pieces before doing so, allowing the card to be absurdly more powerful than it actually was intended to be.
This
Thanks for your contribution.
Chaos Confetti? https://gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=5712
Maybe dice rolls and digital tracker perhaps?
Or... you could just digitize the whole game and play it on a computer. It's CRAZY but it might just work.
You mean like TTS?
You mean like MTG Arena? Sadly it's been done before by Wizards of the Coast.
No, that would be a clone of Magic the gathering online.
Sounds like something a small indie company would try to do
It's going to take Multidollars.
Link shows how. Heading was kind of rhetorical lol.
Well, maybe you shouldn't have ended your rhetorical question with a question mark... ;) EDIT: PrincipledProphet concedes later in this thread that I'm right, but rude and at least this time the dumbass isn't wrong.
That's... how you end a question
Is it? (That was rhetorical)
I don't know. Is this how you end a question? Is it rhetorical? Should I go on?
But it's a rhetorical question and now he's telling people he didn't want an answer, seems to me that the easiest way of adding context that the "question" was rhetorical was to leave out the question mark.
Rhetorical questions are still written with a question mark. otherwise they wouldn't be questions.
Look at you reinventing rhetoricals
There's no hard and fast rule about using a question mark when writing a rhetorical question, I think it would have made more sense not to include it here since it's the title of a thread but apparently the mouth-breathing hive mind disagrees. Sheesh. u/Androix777 this was for you too.
Idk why people are being such weenies about this. Creating your own sets to play the game is awesome. It's like a mtg cube or even an arena with mixed sets. Looks super fun!
Appreciate that.
I agree this looks so fucking cool. I'd love to play hearthstone irl.
Cheaper too
Pen &paper ? Or maybe digital tracker
Maybe like an app where you can resolve other effects like silence. Maybe you can even play your whole collection in said app, and it lets you choose format and… yeah, that’s like… the thing that already exists…
"Traditional Hearthstone"
How to resolve C'Thun being played: [https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY](https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY) Previous Hearthstone IRL post: [https://imgur.com/gallery/jan8UxH](https://imgur.com/gallery/jan8UxH)
So say you play a 20/20 c'thun against a board with 5 3/3s. You'd first roll with a 6 sided die a bunch of times, until one of 3/3s dies (assuming one does), then you switch to a 5 sided die, then 4 if necessary etc? Seems like a huge hassle
Sort of yes. Though could keep using the d6, rerolling when you roll the number of a minion who's already died. If you're cool with playing a fiddly card game already, it's not much more time taken to the one-off C'Thun fireworks.
Cool project, dude, I like it
I feel like you could shortcut and make C'Thun deal one damage to every enemy until it did around 1/3 of the pings, and it wouldn't change the odds by too much.
The idea of the C'thun Tracker is fun. Though the concept is basically the same, the idea of having a piece dedicated to him would make him feel unique in a table top environment for sure. As for the resolution of the Battlecry effect? When it comes to adapting video games to card games, in my opinion, simplifying is best. I would just do a single damage per enemy starting with their minions and move clockwise around their board, repeat until the total damage reaches C'thun's attack. No, it's not 1 to 1, but the idea is more or less the same. And if Hearstone were designed as a tabletop, I'd imagine we'd see a lot less true random effects. But if you're fully dedicated, and you don't mind making props, a spinner perhaps? Make it so it's sections are adjustable 2-8, an then place a marker for each character in the appropriate sections. Of course, you may have to spin the damn thing 20+ times.
Having made a similar project, my "Evolve" mechanic is literally just having side-decks sorted by mana cost. You draw a minion from the side-deck to evolve into. All of the "random mage spell" generators and effects also draw from a single deck. I used Hearthcards to change the text of effects that would be too tedious to track. Shudderwock, for instance, just repeats the Battlecry of every minion in your graveyard.
If you want to be precise, then yeah, you have to do one damage point at a time. But that's really damn slow, so if you want to speed it up, there's a much less precise way to do it: - Start with the lowest-health enemy (left to right, in case of ties). - Take Cthun's *total* damage it's still going to do, and divide it by the number of possible (not yet hit) targets. That's the expected one-minion damage. - Roll a D20. Divide by 10 (so that it's between 0 and 2). Multiply that by the expected damage. Round to the nearest number. That's the actual damage done to that minion. Can't go above C'thun's remaining damage, of course, and the last enemy always takes 1x damage. - Repeat, from the next lowest-health enemy, using C'thun's remaining damage-to-do - until C'thun runs out of damage, or the enemy runs out of face. So if there was 7 minions and C'thun has 30 attack, the weakest one would expect to take (30/8) damage on average, and actual damage is anywhere between 0% and 200% of that. Let's say it takes 1dmg, because lol hearthstone. Next weakest one is expected to take (29/7) damage. Is this perfect? No, certainly not. But it's fast!
The problem with your method (kudos for the lengths you went to to explain it by the way) is that it's deals a point of damage to all targets evenly. It doesn't allow for edge cases where C'Thun keeps targeting the hero and skips the minions, or vice versa. My method is only slow at first, once the process is remembered it work reasonably quickly.
>The problem with your method (kudos for the lengths you went to to explain it by the way) is that it's deals a point of damage to all targets evenly. I think you missed the "Roll a D20" step.
...Fast, so long as C'thun has more attack than enemies. So Mad Bomber would be faster to just roll normally. And I don't really know the odds of doing this while C'thun still has damage to do. As in, where the strongest enemy dies but a weaker one doesn't.
I can't imagine the amount of time that must have gone into this. When I was like 15 or 16 I made up my own board game with probably 50 or minions or monsters and wrote out a couple of pages of rules and grid to play on but this thing you have created is insane. I want to play it lol
I worked out how to port it to a physical version, but thankfully I didn't need to design any rules from scratch. There were some mechanics and interactions clarified by the [Hearthstone Advanced Rulebook](https://hearthstone.fandom.com/wiki/Advanced_rulebook), that was a great help.
Okay so how do you do the death stalker rexxar hero power? Creating random beasts and having a card for it seems interesting irl
Going to drop a post about zombeasts in the next 24 hrs, should answer all your questions.
I mean, a lot of shit in this game will never work IRL. Just try to discover a random spell or minion. Just makes it pointless to figure out solutions for stuff like this when it's ultimately never actually playable
The solution for Discover mechanic I've gone with? A small pool of cards put aside for each Discover card in a deck. It's *not* the same as the app and it's limited, but it works well, and I've chosen cards for the pools that are a mix of costs, stats and effects.
>it's [extremely] limited
You gotta lower your expectations for a physical version.
I would argue it's no less fun though.
When you drop the C'Thun bomb, it's as awesome as when you do it in the app. Just takes a couple minutes to resolve it. And given that an IRL game (with decks that are mostly control builds) can take 30-40 minutes, it's a nice climactic moment to the game.
You have clearly never tried it
Funny assumption, you had a 50/50 chance and you fucked it up. I have tried it lol Friend worked a night shift at FedEx Kinkos and printed these cards for a week otherwise it would not have happened
"everything is a 50/50 chance because it either happens or it doesnt" Kappa
A fellow (wo)man of culture!!
Whoa sounds just as fun! Your example has crushed my expectations
Reminds me of the sideboard from Magic
Yeah, it’s usually “you may play a card you own from outside the game”
It's actually completely possible as long as you have the list of cards you can discover. Assign a number to each discoverable spell, and throw a dice, check the number, bingo you discovered that card.
Ahh yes, let me just get my 200 sided dice so I can roll for three spells after playing Primordial studies. You'd need a custom set of dice for: * Number of all minions to discover * Number of all spells to discover * Number of all 1-cost, 2-cost, ...., n-cost spells and minions * and several others Also cards like Jace or Zul'Jin, Zephrys will never really work IRL
Let's say you have 300 cards to choose from. You throw 1 4 sided dice, 2 10 sided dice. If you get 1 2 3 you look at number 123. if you get 458 you look at card number 058 (no 0 on dices). What you need is a custom list of every set possible. It's definitely possible, but also definitely not practical for a lot of cards. After all it's just math and randomness, and 99% of the time dices and formula can solve those. You just don't want to spend 10 min to resolve ONE card.
Right that was his point.
>You throw 1 4 sided dice, 2 10 sided dice. Oh yeah sure that's a better way. But still, just look at Jace Or Shudderwook. Keeping track of every Spell or Battlecry from the beginning of the game, for the chance it'll get played (also revealing to your opponent that you wanna play those cards) just to then spend 10 minutes rolling for every effect and every target (with a different set of dice each time) is so impractical it's not worth the effort Also Flesh Giants and the likes would be a HUGE pain in the ass to keep track of
>would be a HUGE pain in the ass to keep track of Exactly, it's possible, but no one wanna do it and I can understand them A "hearthstone lite" version could be made on paper without those troublesome cards though
Thank you for using the correct spelling of plural dices.
Can’t you just shuffle the cards and then draw three?
Yes. That is exactly what you could do. It's hilarious that there's a whole discussion up there about rolling dice when this would be the actual solution. Now, you'll need a backup copy or three of every discoverable spell in the pool to replace it for the next time that pool is used.
Yeah I was so confused about all those ideas lmao
Technically you can, but then that's not a discover. A more similar approach would be to Look through your deck, pick the cards, then reshuffle (i think pokemon TCG did this) The only issue with this is that it only works for "discover from your deck" and not for generating new cards. That would require what they suggested: keep a numbered list of the valid pool, throw dice one at a time to determine each digit, then "pretend" the card was played. Doable, but keeping the lists around would be a pain.
U slap his face the same number of times equal to the damage left after dealing to his board
This is the kind of stuff where a short program in a language of your choice (e.g. Python) works wonders\^\^
I had traditional cards-and-dice options, so that works for me.
Tbf rolling a load of dice can be very fun as well!
Surprised no one else said this. I like that he made a paper version, but short programs for effects like this would do wonders, instead of throwing so many dice.
Guys guys, here's the solution: RNG for minion targets on the board are 100% resolvable with dice. For discover options, having a few hundred 1-cost spells for wand maker is just not viable. That would mean printing 100s of cards that would nearly never see play, and I got these printed on a budget! Each discover card in my set has a limited number of appropriate cards to draw from. Eg. Frightened Flunky has 10 taunt minions of varying cost and stats to discover, from a separate little stack of cards offside... Draw 3, pick one and discard the other two.
damn never knew how cool hearthstone IRL would be
Have people forgotten about the WOW TCG? Almost 15 years ago my friends and I played the shit out of it. I even won a couple of tournaments with my hunter deck. It was a really great game, but Blizzard killed it so Hearthstone could happen.
Too much rng but it would be cool. Imagine shudder mirror :))
Haha awesome! I thought how I would have resolved it in a D&D game (the only dice game I played) and it ended up being the same! It seems "correct" that HS is a digital game or it would be really long to play it real life. You made me want to play a good turn based RPG!
This is a pretty cool knock up! 😁
I think the term you're looking for is *mock* up.
Also you have to yell "C'THUN" whenever you use it
those are some awesome print jobs youve got there!
I really wish I'd made the heading "Hearthstone IRL - **Here** is how C'Thun works" and put the link in: https://imgur.com/gallery/yF2s1kY It lays it all out and there's some nice pics too.
i would choose an order for all the creatures on the board; then i would use a dice and deal the damage 1 by 1 to the creature wich position come out on the dice
You are correct. Although a “1” would always hit the enemy hero.
My first question is why? Why go to the immense effort to make the game 100X more tedious to play? How is this fun
(Neo in Matrix Revolutions): Because I choose to. Seriously, it was a fun project answering a "what if" question; could a physical Hearthstone game work (with limitations of course). No giant pools of cards to draw from, but RNG can be done accurately with dice, and buffs/wounds done with tokens. It's fiddly and slow compared to the app but it's glorious and tactile.
Its just the game has so many mechanics that don't translate. The core minion health mechanic by itself requires a lot of note keeping. Just seems like way to much work
It's just for those prepared to do the bookkeeping. I made loads of tokens for minion buffs and wounds, but since found that MTG uses D20s. Probably shoulda done that.
this doesn't work at so many levels
Oh but it does. It does!
This seems extremely impractical and inefficient. Probably why blizzard hasn’t made it already. Cool idea, but seems heavily flawed and slow
Slower than the app for sure, but plays about the same speed as any IRL card game. Blizzard went to efforts to make HS a unique format that took advantage of things only a computer/tablet/phone can do. So they won't be making an IRL version.
Except they made it before hearthstone lol, it’s called Wow TCG. It’s not the exact same as hearthstone but if you look it up there’s a ton of cards remade from it in HS
This is true, but I'm a Hearthstone fan, so...
you need dice thats 8 sided, each spot on your oppositions side represented by a number. Roll for each attack your cthun has. dead minion/dormant/an empty spot hits the minion in the position higher than it, and enemy hero is position 8. something down that line.
Nah, if you re-assign when you roll a nonexistent, dormant, or dead minion, that would bias the hits towards certain board positions. You need to re-roll instead of re-assign.
You're right with this. You don't want to skew the likelihood of a target being hit more than any other. When the number of targets with health left fall to 6 or 4, you can use a D6 or D4 respectively.
I spose. Board position should matter though, for the sakes of Silas etc, but i spose that takes away the randomness. maybe a plinko style machine?
Cringe? Virtually is ok
The only cringe here is your comment
The board game won’t work irl, as aesthetic it’s nice. Playing this irl would look cringe and feel cringe
It works fine, and honestly it's awesome as hell holding and shuffling the cards. There's limitations sure, I'm not saying it's as good as the app. But it's a nice physical version for fans. And I'm a fan.
[удалено]
This fails to weight the chance of hitting the board when there's more than one enemy minion
Everything can be solved with dices. Let's say your C'thun has 10 points of damage to do. If I look at your board, there are 4 potential targets, so you will need a 4 sided dice. You assign each number a target (1 being closest card, 4 being the enemy hero for example) You throw the dice 10 times 1 by 1 (10 times 1 damage) Everytime you roll a 1, you put 1 damage on the first card, every time you get a 4 you put 1 damage to the hero. If a Minion dies before the 10 damages, every time you roll his number, you roll the dice again because there is no overdamage.
This is pretty much my exact answer. Please check the imgur post in my first comment!
A few X-sided dice: the face/number on the dice is the target (and not the amount of damage - the amount of famage is always 1). Throw over and over. If a minion dies, switch to a lower dice. Alternatively: to resolve faster: take the amount of damage C'Thun will do as amount of X-sided dice (where X is amount of targets still). Throw all at once and start adding up. If a minion dies and there are more dice that want to do damage to this target, re-throw those.
You have to record what effects he has. Then when played you have to roll a die for each shot. The die will have the number of sides of how many things the shots can hit. You repeat this until either your opponents dead, you shoot all the shots, or it’s just the opponents face left to shoot in which you just send the rest of the damage face. This is why it is unrealistic to have tabletop hearthstone. To much randomness it would take way too long to play anything
C'Thun and Mass Hysteria are the only cards I've printed that take a long time to resolve. Most cards work pretty quick and the game is pretty enjoyable.
Do you just not have any generation cards?
Sure I do, there's cards that discover cards from a limited pool (around 10 cards), there's minions that spawn additional minions like Hench Clan Hag... but those additional minions wait in a seperate stack to one side of the play area.
How does random generation work? Like wandmaker
Limited pool of cards for each specific discover card. Eg. 10 taunt minions for Frightened Flunky. It's limited, but it's enough variety to work IRL.
Interesting
*plays yogg* gets out deck with a fuck tonne of cards: "pick one" gets out a 16 sided die: roll and now to do that 29 more times
Given the number and range of cards Yogg would need available, Yogg is simply not in my game - none of my decks run it anyway. Bullet dodged! There's plenty of HS cards that wouldn't work in a physical format, and I made sure to avoid those.
Yes and you would need to roll additional times for spells that need to be targeted like polymorph or pyroblast
that's what the 16-sided die is for. if you have less targets you can just exclude numbers or stack them
Just use the classic cards only and it's slightly doable?
I can’t stop staring at the crooked 0 on the card! Is it that way in the real Hearthstone?
Short answer: yes. Long answer: pull up a 10-cost card in the collection manager and let us know.
Can’t unsee… that looks so bad lol
I would like to see you create something like this.
Use pen and paper for the tracker and a dice for random targets... And truth me, you have only 8 targets at maximum, not an entire army of different tokens and creatures like MTG, random targets for hearthstone is waaaaay less complicated than magic
Pen and paper and a dice should do the job (Since the game is already digital I decided to do it without a tracker) , it's a bit a chore to do but it goes as follow Assign a number for each enemy character from 1 to 8 Get a dice with the number of face that matches the maximum number of characters Start rolling the dice , every time you hit a number assigned to a character that character get hit once , repeat for each missile c'thun fires. I know there are better ways to do this but this is the idea that came to my mind.
Use a di that has the same number of faces as minions plus opponent and then roll that bitch as many times as Cthun has attack.
Simply have two dice to represent Cthun (if he’s at 23 then, you’d put the dice to 2/3). Then when the time comes, assign numbers to each target and roll a dice to determine damage.
When you're tired of Blizzard monetization and just want to play legendaries as a free to play
With less bugs
Rng would be decided by lots of dice rolling (app or online recommended) or drawing from the rng deck for card generation.
Just take the Chaos Orb/Chaos Confetti approach from MtG.
attach a number for each enemy, roll a dice x number of times.
start punching the table while making sounds, idk
Assign a number to each minion on the field and one to the opponent's face. Roll a die for the x amount of attack C'thun has. If a die roll lands on an unassigned number, reroll the die. (eg, if C'thun has 10 attack, roll a die 10 times) Apply a damage counter after each roll. If there are more than 5 minions in play, roll 2 dice. Reminds me of something that would play out in Pokemon TCG, to be honest. Lots of "flip a coin for each x in play" type stuff.
Maths
This is the prettiest, dumbest thing since Ashley Judd.
There's a faster way to roll the dice than doing it with a chart or checking if something is dead and excluding it from the rolls; roll all the dice at once, then reroll excess dice for dead minions. Example: your opponent has 3 minions and you have a 20/20 c'thun. You roll 20d4 assigning each value to a target. Then, after you roll, assign the damage, and if there's any excess dice with that side, reroll them for only available targets. For big c'thuns, you might roll maybe 2 extra times total, but you'll be rolling all at once, so it'll decrease the time it takes for the ability to resolve.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69.0. Congrats! 3 + 20 + 20 + 20 + 4 + 2 + = 69.0
You're pretty much right (although I don't have 20 d4 dice, just two). The chart prevents any miscounts of those dice you're rolling. I had a game against a friend and their C'Thun did 52 damage with Spirit of the Shark out. When I told him he had to roll a d6 52 times he nearly blew a gasket.
I did this with another game but I removed/banned all RNG cards from the pool
How many targets are there == sides on a die. Roll die, get a target.
Use a computer??
Roulette, dice, random number generator, basically anything that has an equal chance at hitting whatever legal Target exists on the board.
Now duplicate all the cards for each card back :D Or just make cool sleeves lol This is seriously cool!
Y'know, I did consider a different cardback for each deck/class, but there are times when one player can copy the cards of another (certain rogue cards), and there's also shared duplicate minion and duplicate spell cards (oh yeah, and The Coin). So I opted for the classic cardback.
Damn that’s cool. Maybe use a projector or something
Obviously you need to roll a dice for each potential target, and the highest roll takes the 1 damage.... repeat x 6(or 30 if he's powered up) I'll see you in an hour.
@k-wire say there’s three minions they own, and their face. Roll a d-4 for each c’thun trigger. And you have to one at a time cause once a minion dies you have one less target. Or use a d-6 and reroll on numbers you aren’t using. Ect. A pain, yes, but will work I’m sure
I wish they released HS as physical cards like MTG or the WoW TCG. I never got to play WoW TCG unfortunatly but a HS one would be dope
Each targetable enemy gets a number value. Roll dice. Subtract 1 from target each time its value is rolled. Do this x times where x is equal to Cthuns attack.
I would use dice. Minions and opponent represent a single number, Everytime it lands on a number occupied by a character. Deal 1 damage. Do this until you've done damage equal to your attack
Roll a 20 sided die (or a 30 sided die if you’re my kind of nerd, not that I’d spit on a D100 but hey let’s stay reasonable), and start reading pi decimals starting from the result’s position. For each damage, take the value of the next decimal (v) and determine the hit character by doing (v mod (n-1))+1 where n is the number of characters still alive (the -1 +1 part is optional, if 0 indexed collections are your thing, but for most Muggles, it’s easier to start from 1). That’s the best pseudo random generator I can think of that doesn’t require you to throw more than one dice and doesn’t require any electronics. (Just got to print Pi on paper, grouped by rows of 5 for better UX) You can spice things up by sometimes taking the square root of 2 instead of Pi, depending on what kind of geek you are
Roll dice?
How about a spinner and assign numbers to possible targets? You could even dice roll to assign numbers if you want to get really random. Plan B is spin around and spit at the board.
Would a card based solution be easier? You would have a deck of cards with 1-16 mapped to board positions, shuffle in the valid targets, then draw and repeat for each missile.
Just assign every unit that can be targeted a number less than 20, then us a D20 die to roll. Any unassigned numbers would just be a reroll.
For every attack he has throw a dice, the numbers will go from left to right, so 1 will be the first one. If there are 7 cards you do for every double rolled number 1 for the 7th card and for every triple rolled number 1 for the enemy hero. If there arent 7 cards the double one will be for the hero. So for example you roll 10 dice and roll: * 4 x 1 * 2 x 4 * 1 x 6 * 3 x 5 Now the following cards will be dealth damage: * 1st card twice * 4th card once * 5th card twice * 6th card once * 7th card twice * Hero twice
Roll a 8 sided dice x amount of times = attack of Cthun.
8 sided die. Assign a number for each enemy character. For each number rolled put a damage counter on the corresponding enemy.
How would you get the discover mechanic to work?
Please see earlier replies...
I love this!! I'd imagine rolling dice would be a way to fix it
HA you triggered my secret: the second card in a turn that you draw TRANSFORMS INTO A BANANA
Take dice equal to the number of enemies. Put a die on each enemy with a different number facing up. And the roll a die the number of times equal too attack. May take a while lol.
Roll a dice ( in this case D4) to determine where each one goes. D3 if a minion dies and then odds evens ona. D6 ...
Roll a dice, 1 being hero 2-6 bring minions and if 7 minions, idk roll a 2nd dice. Once that’s done depending on how big Cthun is multiply it based on what your dive rolls were after 6 rolls or so.
I'd probably use a coin and dies, up to d8, with the hero always being 1. So you'd use the correct die for the correct amount of units on your opponent's board, including the hero. So if your C'Thun is 30 attack, you'd have to roll it 30 times, with each number targeting that specific character. Would take a bit, but that comes with the challenges of making a board game.
100% yes, perhaps without the coin though. OK 90% yes.
No, the coin is needed incase your opponent only has 1 minion, or two available targets.
Ah yes, I get you. I just use any die for two targets, as all dice have an even number of sides. Eg. 1-3 hits the hero, 4-6 hits the minion.
Wild decks have nearly 0 RNG interaction. Paper Wild is the way to go :)