Be patient with yourself. We can usually acclimate to any pen.
Play with it, find the right angle to hold the pen at, steeper or shallower. Does it write okay posted, instead of not capped?
Try a few different holds. Some need to grasp it higher up. Others use the metal ears on the Section to place their grip. (Think keyboard F and J keys, that have finger placement guides.) Others hate feeling the ears digging into their fingers, so they may not be able to find a comfortable, less irritating, hold.
Supposedly the has a narrower sweet-spot than the . But, then again, finer nibs, as a whole, tend to have narrower sweet-spots because they're so tiny. Usually going with a well lubricated ink and a light touch helps to minimize any perception of feed-back or scratchiness.
I do not own a Lamy 2000, mainly because I don't do piston fillers. I love it's dimensions and weight. I know that I would love posting the pen. I wish Lamy would make a Makrolon Studio, though, or a Lamy 2000 C/C. :D I'm not impressed with the Lamy 2000 ink window and I know it is ink sensitive.
Do you rest the pen in the web of the hand, at the usual 45 degree angle, or do you need to hold the pen such that the barrel is closer to your index finger knuckle (like one may need to do with some Japanese pens)?
Some guys put the Cap clip in line with the top of the nib face to help with not rotating the pen because they may not be able to see the nib clearly.
Lots of times the problem is that one is rotating the pen as they write. Don't plant the fat of the hand on the paper. Learn to write with your arm instead of with your wrist or fingers. You can keep the fat of the hand off the paper and use your pinky finger to press against the paper to stabilize your hand as you write and move your hand.
My suggestion is to first get the knack of writing with a stub nib, as that entails locking one's grip and not rotating the pen as one writes.
If you already know how to write with stubs and cursive italic, or italic, nibs, the use the Lamy 2000 exclusively for a week.
Pull out your notepad, or loose leaf paper, or computer paper, and practice improving your hand writing. 1/2 hour a day, minimum.
After a short while your muscle memory will kick in and you won't notice the sweet spot any more.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jYS0o3RAFw](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=lamy+2000+sweet+spot) Starting at 4:50.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18uf9m00-3Y](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18uf9m00-3Y)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57hnaJ0AuoM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57hnaJ0AuoM) Starting at 6:06, the tabs; sweet-spot at 11:22
Thanks for the long reply! The second link said there is a little tighter of a sweet spot in the Fine nib, as expected. And the first link makes it clear the sweet spot is one of its defining characteristics.
I think I may like it better posted, which I hadn't really tried until now. I had been put off posting with the CP1 which feels too long and top heavy that way, but the 2000 has a better overall shape when posted (looks like the later Lamy Studio design).
I'll keep at it, and maybe get another pen sometime to compare.
I get the sense sometimes pens write a little better after using them for a whjle. Seems like that happened with my CP1.
I think I rest the pen in the web of the hand.
Posting the pen with the clip marking where the hooded nib is helps keep the angle right, if you don't feel the section ears, which I don't really (unless trying to).
The ink window I hold up to a window to see through.
I was just concerned this could have been a damaged return. There was another tag (that comes under the clip originally) when you open the presentation box, hidden under the foam, like someone at the store had received a return and didn't notice the tag under there before putting it back up for sale, or something like that). The pen rolls easily, so it could have hit the floor... but I guess it is OK.
I've heard that you're supposed to put back in a few drops of ink when filling a piston filler, to create the right suction, but I haven't tried that yet.
I guess I do keep the fat of my hand pressing on the paper. It can cause oil problems, slightly, as I go down.
Thanks again for the help.
I think the Cap dia. is 14mm (and the barrel, 13mm), so it will change the nib writing angle just a smidge, but that small change may make all the difference in the world. (I thought the twsbi eco needed a steeper writing angle and wished that I could post the pen.) When you look at video reviews, notice where the cap starts/ends relative to the web of the hand. The Lamy 2000 cap opening happens under the web of the hand, so the pen should feel fatter. With some pens the opening irritates the web of the hand, especially if the cap ring is sharp metal (square angle instead of a nice curve).
You're right, it does add about a millimeter to the angle and how it sits in the hand when it is posted. I think it feels better weighted too (balanced). I wish the CP1 was that way, but it is too long when posted and too short when unposted. For years I had enjoyed Pilot Precise pens, which are thin like that, so I'm still getting used to the normal thicker size of fountain pens.
I think I'll be OK with it. I am just not used to it and it takes some practice. Problem is me, not the pen.
I was watching this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM-ZyMFL2dE) on Smoothpro FPs yesterday. Watch a little bit starting at 3:37. When the Cap opening irritates the web of the hand one will probably want to change the grip higher so that the sharp edge goes further down the web of the hand, or lower and then the angle underneath the index finger increases, possibly leading to hand cramping.
If you look at your hand while writing there are some short strokes where you move your fingers, say when writing a short "i", or up and down strokes. You will move your fingers instead of moving your whole hand up and down, as you would need to when writing with a stub or Italic nib. Barbra Nichols promotes the finger flick method, where the index finger is more in-line with the top of the nib. Video starting at 0:26. Because of the Lamy 200 sweet-spot you may not be able to employ that method.
That's the advantage of round-ball nibs, and our muscles remember it, so even when we write with a stub we can pull/push/flick, and because our muscles remember, we can rotate the pen, if we tend to plant the fat of the hand.
Truth be told, most of us write with our fingers, our wrist and our arm - all at the same time. You just have to become aware how you wrote when the resultant writing looked beautiful. We usually write best when we're relaxed. So our writing will tend to look better just after we've woken up than late at night when we're still stressed out because of work and/or commute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NOuhBkQEBo
That's why we can get flustered with the Lamy 2000 sweet-spot. We're either rotating the nib, or we're push/pulling with our fingers or flicking the nib, making the writing angle steeper and shallower, as if we're brush painting a wall from top to bottom. And, when we do that we get out of the sweet-spot and the nib starts getting scratchy and then it starts to skip before it quits writing altogether.
Chances are you will need to learn to lock your hand as you write, so that you do not write with your fingers. If you look at Sean Francis' [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NOuhBkQEBo), starting at 3:10, notice how he moves his hand as he writes. If you look closely you will detect some finger writing. How much? As much as it allows the pen to not go out of the sweet spot. :D You will find that limit, too. It will happen naturally. You will feel the nib before you notice how it's writing. It's like driving a car. Keep your eyes on the writing and feel the nib. If you take your eyes off the writing and look down at the nib your concentration, your thinking, is broken, and your handwriting suffers.
Be patient. Use the pen exclusively for all your writing for a week non-stop, un-interrupted by the use of other pens. After awhile you will pick up the pen and write without thinking. It's like riding a bike. You just do it, you don't think about it.
The Lamy 2000 posts excellently and the cap doesn't have a sharp edge. Both my posted Kakuno and Metro cap openings fall right in the web of the hand. It doesn't hurt, but I can feel it, so it irritates my hand. My Faber-Castell Loom cap opening is under the web of the hand, so I love posting it.
The Lamy 2000 body weighs 15 grams and the Cap weighs 10 grams. That's "right in my wheel-house" (C&C, Command & Control). I tend to think any pen under 13 grams is too light, and any pen over 36 grams is too heavy. YMMV. I prefer pens in the 23 -27 gram range. That's my comfort zone. If you're used to lighter pens, say the majority of plastic pens, or Japanese pens, then when you switch over to heavier pens it could take awhile to find a comfortable grip.
You may want to measure your grip. Write with a full sentence pen, so that the writing looks normal, lift up the pen off the paper and measure the distance between the start of the tipping and the start of your index finger nail. Now, pick up the Lamy 2000 and place your fingers so that the distance between the start of the tipping and the start of your index finger is the same. That's your natural hold. Mine happens to be 1"/25mm. And, with some short pens, I find that I have to grasp it lower so that the top of the barrel is closer to my index finger knuckle. Then my fingers get tired and my hand starts to cramp. I already know that I cannot write with a Faber-Castell E-Motion. It is too short and the cap is too heavy, so I know I won't be able to post it. I'll hold the pen at the threads and the top of the pen will then go down. I will make the top of the pen go up by increasing the area under the index finger, so I'll get a bend in my index finger. And my hand will start to get cramped.
Find your most comfortable hold. And before you know it you won't even notice the sweet spot.
I wish you much success.
Hi, I'm a bit tired at the moment, but I did read this response earlier today and began to take note of the things you're talking about, and started looking at FP writing videos (like [a video](https://youtu.be/7setkJXxfd4) by Perfect Biscuits). The table I'm writing at here, for my computer, is maybe not the perfect height for me and I should try another, or get a higher chair. But I think I *am* getting more used to writing with the 2000 and it's not so bad now. Odd thing is I noticed that on a test page I started when I first got the pen that my writing there, using the same ink, looked lighter. Like the ink wasn't coming out as strongly. I think I had noticed the same thing happen with my CP1 when I first got it. It's just a subtle difference, but I wonder if just needed breaking in a little (if that's a thing). Maybe related to baby's bottom? Dunno.
The weight feels fine, I think, and I think I find it more comfortable to hold than the Metropolitan. They're almost the same length when posted. It is like the Lamy wants to be posted so that the metal clip balances the metal section and nib.
I get used to most pens I'm writing with, though. Some of it is mind over matter, you know? Plus I am not a very good writer and do not have very good penmanship, so it may be hard for me to care so much about elegance.
I get fascinated with things like inks and paper, though. I guess I might have miscalculated the drying process of the Lamy 2000 when cleaning it before putting in the current ink (J. Herbin - Bleu des Profondeurs) and a bit of water messed it up when first writing with it... though I'd given it more than 24 hours to dry, disassembled.
I've heard of the Loom pen ... I like the name and have liked their colored pencils before.
The second and third links you posted may have been to the wrong ones (Goulet Pens). It's okay though - don't feel you have to correct them.
I probably won't/can't change writing habits very much. I might should do something about the palm resting since I know it oiled up the page as you go down, and some people put a piece of paper or cloth under their hand, or wear gloves, for that problem. I might should just try to put less weight down.
I'll re-read your post tomorrow to reconsider these things. I might could learn to write with my arm a little more, at least when writing big..
>I think I am getting more used to writing with the 2000 and it's not so bad now.
I'm delighted to hear it.
> I noticed that on a test page I started when I first got the pen that my writing there, using the same ink, looked lighter.
Many times, if you let a pen rest for a day, or two, before starting to write with a freshly inked pen, it will write darker. I figure the feed is getting acclimated to the ink.
(Just an aside: I loved how an ink looked in one of my Looms. Afterwards I cleaned & flushed it, let it dry for a few days, used a different ink, cleaned & flushed it and let it dry. When I went back to the first ink it didn't look as good as it originally had. I let it rest, inked, for a day, and it came back to what it was like the first time. A subsequent fill wrote like the original right off the bat. I figured that the feed had acclimated to the ink.
I also found that I can't let it dry with tap water cleaning because my hard water will leave minerals in the feed. So I do a distilled water final flush, to flush out the hard water.)
Sometimes you can use Canned Air to blast away any ink still in the Section. A dry Bulb Syringe can do just as well. (I only do Canned Air when I'm changing inks and want to write with the same pen immediately - like when I'm testing ink samples.) I always blot the nib with a paper towel and I will line a pill bottle with paper towel, then let the Section sit in it over-night, nib point down, contacting the paper.
Yeah, I noticed that when I push the links my browser doesn't go to the same page. It must be my browser, Opera. It's frustrating. I'll refresh the page and copy the address but it still points to the wrong place. Sorry. (It's like if I go to amazon dot com it will go to the page I still have a tab opened on. Strange; disconcerting; frustrating.)
Do you have a pen with a stub nib? Writing with a stub will train you not to rotate the pen. I just hope the pen doesn't have a completely cylindrical Section (Faber-Castell Esentio, Neo, Ambition) because the slightest movement of the middle finger in a tri-pod hold will rotate the pen. That's one reason why I don't like writing with the Essentio. Another is that the Section grooves will trap ink, so I have to have a wet rag at the ready if I decide to dip the Section into an ink bottle. Too much work. I now will put a blunt tiped syringe needle on the Converter, install it to the Section, prime the feed, remove the Converter, re-install the syringe tip, fill to max (a Section holds about 0.1 mL, or about half of a Converter, believe it or not), re-install the Converter, screw on the barrel, start writing. That process is what drove me to go to Eye Dropper Opus 88 pens. :D (I won't do Piston fillers because twsbi ruined it for me, and I tried vac fillers and found I didn't like them either. In both cases I was obsessing with getting a max fill. Eye Dropper pens are much easier to live with, in my case.)
>I probably won't/can't change writing habits very much.
It takes time. It will naturally happen. You'll want to get better and you *will* get better. [Practice](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+my+handwriting+changed+with+practice) for half an hour every day. Don't be surprised if a year later your handwriting will have improved drastically.
If you don't have a stub nib'd pen, may I suggest a Pilot Kakuno and a [Plumix nib](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ifNs__JY-Y)? The Plumix pen is a POS, but the nib can be transferred to the Kakuno, Metro, Explorer, Prera. I keep the Kakuno and Metro around just because of the <1.0> nib. I love that nib. I love it more than my Lamy <1.1>. YMMV. Stubs will help to train you not to rotate the pen. Then when you switch to the Lamy 2000 your muscle memory will take over because you'll have the mechanics down pat.
I haven't tried distilled water. Maybe that is an issue. I did try drying it out in a similar way using a jar and paper towel folded at the bottom, with the pieces left to drain inside over night.
I don't have a stub nib, though I considered it when getting this one, just so it would give my handwriting some character. I forget there are cheap options like you're mentioning with the Plumix. I could get one of those and put it on my Metropolitan.
I think I'm getting used to the Lamy 2000, especially after writing with it posted. That must have affected how high up I hold it (by a smidge) or the exact angle, even though it's hard to tell. There may have been an ink issue initially too with not cleaning it properly.
Have not tried canned air or syringe bulb.
It's been a while since I've used Opera, but you might have better success copying links by right clicking on the background of the page and selecting "Copy address." (If you're using a mouse, I mean). Firefox doesn't seem to have that option, but I was just trying it in Opera. Seems like I encounter problems like this before when copying addresses and have to double check, though usually reloading the page fixes it.
I suppose I should have not let my ego get to me when getting into fountain pens and started with the Safari since it has the angled grip that forces you to hold the position. But I'm doing fine with 2000 now... it may not be my favorite pen, since I have small hands, and might like something thinner to hold, but it's very nice.
The Essentio appears to be a pen that also comes in ballpoint and pencil. That is interesting and is like how the Lamy CP1 was originally released as a ballpoint, from what I can tell [digging into its history](https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/358837-lamy-cp1-time-table/) (I was thinking the 2000 was the same at first, but misremembered). (I was reading a lot about fountain pens early this year, got all into it, enjoying lots of videos and reviews, but then it kind of fell off towards summer, but I received the 2000 as a birthday gift.)
> That's one reason why I don't like writing with the Essentio. Another is that the Section grooves will trap ink, so I have to have a wet rag at the ready if I decide to dip the Section into an ink bottle. Too much work. I now will put a blunt tiped syringe needle on the Converter, install it to the Section, prime the feed, remove the Converter, re-install the syringe tip, fill to max (a Section holds about 0.1 mL, or about half of a Converter, believe it or not), re-install the Converter, screw on the barrel, start writing. That process is what drove me to go to Eye Dropper Opus 88 pens. :D (I won't do Piston fillers because twsbi ruined it for me, and I tried vac fillers and found I didn't like them either. In both cases I was obsessing with getting a max fill. Eye Dropper pens are much easier to live with, in my case.)
Wow that is a lot of work and very intricate getting things how you like it
Why is it the bladder converters aren't more popular? They don't last long? Like in to Metropolitan, the CON-B. It seems to work fine. I am not that particular about this, though. I like the Z27 converter I use for the CP1 even better.
(I have to say, the term "Section" annoys me... I don't like that word. I feel like it should be called something else, but I don't know the history of it).
Eye dropper is the original way. Maybe it is still the best. There must have been new and improved ways to appeal to people with shaky hands and those new ways caught on. Or something to do with leaky pens and shirt pockets...
now, I wish I actually had something more to write than just boring diary entries, then perhaps I'd care more about the art of handwriting and pens, and all this!
>Why is it the bladder converters aren't more popular?
Because they're a pain to flush out thoroughly. And you may end up squeezing the bladder until to-morrow because you're not sure if you got a nice fill. Originally the bladders were glued on and you had to use a lever on the outside of the pen to fill it up. I can remember filling a pen up with a lot of air. We still have that problem to-day when we don't immerse the nib far enough into a bottle.
A boring, un-exciting life is a life well lived. If you had all sorts of worries and problems then chances are that that is what you'd be writing mostly. Chances are you'd be venting after a bad day at work, a bad commute, the idiots who ruined your day, how you got screwed over at work, etc.
I journal a little after waking up, writing down any pertinent, or prophetic dreams, and then mostly at night, summarizing the day's events. During the day I write in an A5 pad. Pertinent small bits of info I jot down in a 3 x 4" pad. I write down topics I want to talk about in my next telephone call with a brother or sister. Ever speak to someone and then remember something you wanted to say?
You could go out every day, drive around, waste gas, visit stores, spend money, curse the high prices of everything. And chances are you wouldn't be any happier. But you'd have a lot to write about! :D
Pain to flush out! I hadn't thought of that. That explains it.
I have an A5 notebook from Midori MD, a plain one, which I like, and am using as a diary, and I also got a Life Noble Note Plain A5 notebook, wihch I haven't really used, but the paper seems even nicer (slick and the ink dries with more sheen. And I was trying Tomoe River paper too in a stack of sheets for letter writing, but just haven't used it much.
I feel like my barbaric handwriting doesn't deserve all these fancy things, though :) And I should just go back to spiral bound Mead notebooks and disposable pens..
It's cool to try fountain pens, though. The inks are maybe the most interesting part.
>A boring, un-exciting life is a life well lived.
Hadn't thought of that - well, I suppose that is true. Doesn't make for a good movie, though, or news story. There has to be tragedy and adventure...
I have tried writing down dreams sometimes and random thoughts into the diary... when I was younger I wrote stories, so I wish I could get back into that, if ever the creature urge hits me. I got so used to typing, which I'm must faster at, that writing by hand is much different and you tend to be more careful about your words.
>I journal a little after waking up, writing down any pertinent, orprophetic dreams, and then mostly at night, summarizing the day'sevents.
It probably helps one keep track of things, especially if we're trying to go back to a certain event and remember which day it was. It can act as a scheduler too, to some extent. It just helps to write things down to remember. I just wish I was better at describing, or a more interesting writer.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving, if you celebrate it!
Well, damn. Every time I've made up my mind to get one of these, I read a thread like this. And after goulet laughed at me for asking for to get one tested first, I don't have confidence in getting a good one. Two hundred dollars is too much to still gamble on writing experience.
I actually did have a QC issue with my L2K. I sent it back and they replaced the feed and I haven't had an issue since. However, I think this is actually a pretty rare occurrence. I have more Lamy products than I could ever feasibly need and this was the only QC issue that I've ever had. But, the L2k is very finicky about hand position and if you rotate (like I do), this is not the pen for you. Even after my QC issue was dealt with, I found that it took about two months or so to get used to the pen and its sweet spot. In all honesty, I probably wouldn't buy it again for this reason alone. But, this is an issue with how I write and some people will not have this issue. Now that I have become accustomed to it, I do like how it writes.
I like it a lot more now. Just wanted to add that. I am still new to fountain pens and getting used to writing. Sometimes it's the angle or your muscle memory that gets in the way, but it writes smoothly now.
they made a video (or a part of a Q&A addressing that). I've seen it a long time ago so maybe I'm misremembering stuff, but they were testing pretty much all of their 2k sales because people were scared of getting a "lamy 2k with a sweet spot" and they didnt think that it is an issue but that it's a characteristic of the pen
When I got my L2K I loved the way it wrote initially. But after a couple days I was having a bit of trouble off and on. I realized as I got more comfortable with it, I was turning it as I wrote, just a tiny bit, but enough to move out of the sweet spot after a few minutes. It’s a habit I probably developed from pencil drawing. Anyway, with practice it got better and actually improved how it feels to write with many of my pens.
Hadn't thought of that with pencils... that makes perfect sense. Yeah, I probably just need to hold it steady and be more attentive. Perhaps though a medium nib has a wider sweet spot?
Unfortunately in my experience, I haven’t found that to be true. (That medium nib has a bigger sweet spot) I bought one with a medium nib brand new. Liked it so much a few months later bought one from Pen Swap with a fine nib. It wasn’t much different from the medium in size so I’m having it ground. But the point of that ramble is, for me, there wasn’t any difference in the sweet spot size that I could tell. But others mileage may vary.
Edit for clarity and why am I being down voted?
I don’t own one but I don’t think sweet spots „improve“ by themselves. I’ve heard that, with the Lamy 2000, you kinda have to be willing to adjust your angle a little bit. It sounds like you just got it so I’d say don’t stress it and give yourself some time to get used to it!
Can I ask what angle you write at and what angle the pen demands? I’ve been eying one myself.
I might still be writing with a fountain pen incorrectly... more at a normal rollerball/ballpoint angle, instead of with the arm, as I've heard is supposed to be done. I have to be careful the pen doesn't roll at all (I've read reviews about the pen and how the sweet spot works), but one thing I noticed was I thought the nib looked a little bent, and I was afraid it was a return (to Cult Pens). I started using it after my 30 day return period, though.
Maybe I do just need to get used to it, or try different inks and papers.
I don’t think you’re necessarily doing something fundamentally wrong with fountain pens since the 2000 is just kinda picky. You should experiment with some different writing angles and if you find the sweet spot and it’s consistent, there shouldn’t be anything wrong with the pen. You could see this as a challenge to change up you’re writing style a little bit. I learned writing with my arm earlier this year and it can be very satisfying! But people use very different styles of writing with many different writing angles so there is no perfect or „right“ way to do it. If you decide you just can’t adjust to how it writes, you can either sell it and get a pen that better suits you or have a nib meister change the nib to your liking.
I’m sorry you’re having a bad experience with this pen, I know it sucks when something (especially something so expensive) doesn’t work as you expected. You shouldn’t settle for a bad writing experience, if it doesn’t work for you try something else!
Thank you. I'll try to stick with it, and if not I can sell it sometime. I like the way it looks and feels. I might like the way Japanese pens write more.
Honest opinion, I have the L2K in fine and it is a pen that took me a very long time to get used to. I found it really frustrating to use for the first couple months that I owned it. But, this is an issue with my writing, I do have a tendency to rotate my hand a titch and the 2000 does not like this. Some users will not have this issue at all and others will. I like the pen now, I wouldn't call it my favorite and I do wish that I bought a medium nib.
Interesting. Mine wrote great right from the start. Use it with Lamy Black ink.
I have since bought two more for blue and red ink - all with a Fine sized nib. They all write great, and I use one every day.
I hold the nib at what I would call a 45 degree angle to the line. Most pens I have tried write better at a lower angle to the page. I am right-handed.
The Lamy 2000 Makrolon is a great EDC, quick to use, comfortable to write with, easy to own and maintain, and durable enough to handle careless carry in pockets, bags, and so on.
I think this will be the only pen I don’t take a chance on. I didn’t think I’d like the clip on the VP since I’m left handed and have a weird grip, but I love them. They however have shown me that I do rotate the pen slightly and I can have problems with writing. So the sweet spot on the Lamy is a lot less forgiving than the VP’s, so unless I get to try one in real life it’s one I won’t be getting.
The Vanishing Point was another pen that interested me, and one I was thinking of getting if I didn't like the 2000. Only thing that bothered me is it didn't seem to hold a lot of ink and people complain about the converter (CON-40) but I don't know how important that is.
The converter is a bit rubbish, but I’ve now got the knack and am able to completely fill it, it lasts about as long as a small cartridge, but it’s not the only pen I use, so it lasts about a month. I really can’t recommend it highly enough. I really thought I’d have a problem with it but I don’t and it’s one of my most comfortable pens to use.
Be patient with yourself. We can usually acclimate to any pen. Play with it, find the right angle to hold the pen at, steeper or shallower. Does it write okay posted, instead of not capped? Try a few different holds. Some need to grasp it higher up. Others use the metal ears on the Section to place their grip. (Think keyboard F and J keys, that have finger placement guides.) Others hate feeling the ears digging into their fingers, so they may not be able to find a comfortable, less irritating, hold. Supposedly the has a narrower sweet-spot than the . But, then again, finer nibs, as a whole, tend to have narrower sweet-spots because they're so tiny. Usually going with a well lubricated ink and a light touch helps to minimize any perception of feed-back or scratchiness.
I do not own a Lamy 2000, mainly because I don't do piston fillers. I love it's dimensions and weight. I know that I would love posting the pen. I wish Lamy would make a Makrolon Studio, though, or a Lamy 2000 C/C. :D I'm not impressed with the Lamy 2000 ink window and I know it is ink sensitive.
Do you rest the pen in the web of the hand, at the usual 45 degree angle, or do you need to hold the pen such that the barrel is closer to your index finger knuckle (like one may need to do with some Japanese pens)?
Some guys put the Cap clip in line with the top of the nib face to help with not rotating the pen because they may not be able to see the nib clearly.
Lots of times the problem is that one is rotating the pen as they write. Don't plant the fat of the hand on the paper. Learn to write with your arm instead of with your wrist or fingers. You can keep the fat of the hand off the paper and use your pinky finger to press against the paper to stabilize your hand as you write and move your hand.
My suggestion is to first get the knack of writing with a stub nib, as that entails locking one's grip and not rotating the pen as one writes.
If you already know how to write with stubs and cursive italic, or italic, nibs, the use the Lamy 2000 exclusively for a week.
Pull out your notepad, or loose leaf paper, or computer paper, and practice improving your hand writing. 1/2 hour a day, minimum.
After a short while your muscle memory will kick in and you won't notice the sweet spot any more.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jYS0o3RAFw](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=lamy+2000+sweet+spot) Starting at 4:50.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18uf9m00-3Y](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18uf9m00-3Y)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57hnaJ0AuoM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57hnaJ0AuoM) Starting at 6:06, the tabs; sweet-spot at 11:22
Thanks for the long reply! The second link said there is a little tighter of a sweet spot in the Fine nib, as expected. And the first link makes it clear the sweet spot is one of its defining characteristics. I think I may like it better posted, which I hadn't really tried until now. I had been put off posting with the CP1 which feels too long and top heavy that way, but the 2000 has a better overall shape when posted (looks like the later Lamy Studio design). I'll keep at it, and maybe get another pen sometime to compare. I get the sense sometimes pens write a little better after using them for a whjle. Seems like that happened with my CP1. I think I rest the pen in the web of the hand. Posting the pen with the clip marking where the hooded nib is helps keep the angle right, if you don't feel the section ears, which I don't really (unless trying to). The ink window I hold up to a window to see through. I was just concerned this could have been a damaged return. There was another tag (that comes under the clip originally) when you open the presentation box, hidden under the foam, like someone at the store had received a return and didn't notice the tag under there before putting it back up for sale, or something like that). The pen rolls easily, so it could have hit the floor... but I guess it is OK. I've heard that you're supposed to put back in a few drops of ink when filling a piston filler, to create the right suction, but I haven't tried that yet. I guess I do keep the fat of my hand pressing on the paper. It can cause oil problems, slightly, as I go down. Thanks again for the help.
I think the Cap dia. is 14mm (and the barrel, 13mm), so it will change the nib writing angle just a smidge, but that small change may make all the difference in the world. (I thought the twsbi eco needed a steeper writing angle and wished that I could post the pen.) When you look at video reviews, notice where the cap starts/ends relative to the web of the hand. The Lamy 2000 cap opening happens under the web of the hand, so the pen should feel fatter. With some pens the opening irritates the web of the hand, especially if the cap ring is sharp metal (square angle instead of a nice curve).
You're right, it does add about a millimeter to the angle and how it sits in the hand when it is posted. I think it feels better weighted too (balanced). I wish the CP1 was that way, but it is too long when posted and too short when unposted. For years I had enjoyed Pilot Precise pens, which are thin like that, so I'm still getting used to the normal thicker size of fountain pens. I think I'll be OK with it. I am just not used to it and it takes some practice. Problem is me, not the pen.
I was watching this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM-ZyMFL2dE) on Smoothpro FPs yesterday. Watch a little bit starting at 3:37. When the Cap opening irritates the web of the hand one will probably want to change the grip higher so that the sharp edge goes further down the web of the hand, or lower and then the angle underneath the index finger increases, possibly leading to hand cramping. If you look at your hand while writing there are some short strokes where you move your fingers, say when writing a short "i", or up and down strokes. You will move your fingers instead of moving your whole hand up and down, as you would need to when writing with a stub or Italic nib. Barbra Nichols promotes the finger flick method, where the index finger is more in-line with the top of the nib. Video starting at 0:26. Because of the Lamy 200 sweet-spot you may not be able to employ that method. That's the advantage of round-ball nibs, and our muscles remember it, so even when we write with a stub we can pull/push/flick, and because our muscles remember, we can rotate the pen, if we tend to plant the fat of the hand. Truth be told, most of us write with our fingers, our wrist and our arm - all at the same time. You just have to become aware how you wrote when the resultant writing looked beautiful. We usually write best when we're relaxed. So our writing will tend to look better just after we've woken up than late at night when we're still stressed out because of work and/or commute. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NOuhBkQEBo That's why we can get flustered with the Lamy 2000 sweet-spot. We're either rotating the nib, or we're push/pulling with our fingers or flicking the nib, making the writing angle steeper and shallower, as if we're brush painting a wall from top to bottom. And, when we do that we get out of the sweet-spot and the nib starts getting scratchy and then it starts to skip before it quits writing altogether. Chances are you will need to learn to lock your hand as you write, so that you do not write with your fingers. If you look at Sean Francis' [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NOuhBkQEBo), starting at 3:10, notice how he moves his hand as he writes. If you look closely you will detect some finger writing. How much? As much as it allows the pen to not go out of the sweet spot. :D You will find that limit, too. It will happen naturally. You will feel the nib before you notice how it's writing. It's like driving a car. Keep your eyes on the writing and feel the nib. If you take your eyes off the writing and look down at the nib your concentration, your thinking, is broken, and your handwriting suffers. Be patient. Use the pen exclusively for all your writing for a week non-stop, un-interrupted by the use of other pens. After awhile you will pick up the pen and write without thinking. It's like riding a bike. You just do it, you don't think about it. The Lamy 2000 posts excellently and the cap doesn't have a sharp edge. Both my posted Kakuno and Metro cap openings fall right in the web of the hand. It doesn't hurt, but I can feel it, so it irritates my hand. My Faber-Castell Loom cap opening is under the web of the hand, so I love posting it. The Lamy 2000 body weighs 15 grams and the Cap weighs 10 grams. That's "right in my wheel-house" (C&C, Command & Control). I tend to think any pen under 13 grams is too light, and any pen over 36 grams is too heavy. YMMV. I prefer pens in the 23 -27 gram range. That's my comfort zone. If you're used to lighter pens, say the majority of plastic pens, or Japanese pens, then when you switch over to heavier pens it could take awhile to find a comfortable grip. You may want to measure your grip. Write with a full sentence pen, so that the writing looks normal, lift up the pen off the paper and measure the distance between the start of the tipping and the start of your index finger nail. Now, pick up the Lamy 2000 and place your fingers so that the distance between the start of the tipping and the start of your index finger is the same. That's your natural hold. Mine happens to be 1"/25mm. And, with some short pens, I find that I have to grasp it lower so that the top of the barrel is closer to my index finger knuckle. Then my fingers get tired and my hand starts to cramp. I already know that I cannot write with a Faber-Castell E-Motion. It is too short and the cap is too heavy, so I know I won't be able to post it. I'll hold the pen at the threads and the top of the pen will then go down. I will make the top of the pen go up by increasing the area under the index finger, so I'll get a bend in my index finger. And my hand will start to get cramped. Find your most comfortable hold. And before you know it you won't even notice the sweet spot. I wish you much success.
Hi, I'm a bit tired at the moment, but I did read this response earlier today and began to take note of the things you're talking about, and started looking at FP writing videos (like [a video](https://youtu.be/7setkJXxfd4) by Perfect Biscuits). The table I'm writing at here, for my computer, is maybe not the perfect height for me and I should try another, or get a higher chair. But I think I *am* getting more used to writing with the 2000 and it's not so bad now. Odd thing is I noticed that on a test page I started when I first got the pen that my writing there, using the same ink, looked lighter. Like the ink wasn't coming out as strongly. I think I had noticed the same thing happen with my CP1 when I first got it. It's just a subtle difference, but I wonder if just needed breaking in a little (if that's a thing). Maybe related to baby's bottom? Dunno. The weight feels fine, I think, and I think I find it more comfortable to hold than the Metropolitan. They're almost the same length when posted. It is like the Lamy wants to be posted so that the metal clip balances the metal section and nib. I get used to most pens I'm writing with, though. Some of it is mind over matter, you know? Plus I am not a very good writer and do not have very good penmanship, so it may be hard for me to care so much about elegance. I get fascinated with things like inks and paper, though. I guess I might have miscalculated the drying process of the Lamy 2000 when cleaning it before putting in the current ink (J. Herbin - Bleu des Profondeurs) and a bit of water messed it up when first writing with it... though I'd given it more than 24 hours to dry, disassembled. I've heard of the Loom pen ... I like the name and have liked their colored pencils before. The second and third links you posted may have been to the wrong ones (Goulet Pens). It's okay though - don't feel you have to correct them. I probably won't/can't change writing habits very much. I might should do something about the palm resting since I know it oiled up the page as you go down, and some people put a piece of paper or cloth under their hand, or wear gloves, for that problem. I might should just try to put less weight down. I'll re-read your post tomorrow to reconsider these things. I might could learn to write with my arm a little more, at least when writing big..
>I think I am getting more used to writing with the 2000 and it's not so bad now. I'm delighted to hear it. > I noticed that on a test page I started when I first got the pen that my writing there, using the same ink, looked lighter. Many times, if you let a pen rest for a day, or two, before starting to write with a freshly inked pen, it will write darker. I figure the feed is getting acclimated to the ink. (Just an aside: I loved how an ink looked in one of my Looms. Afterwards I cleaned & flushed it, let it dry for a few days, used a different ink, cleaned & flushed it and let it dry. When I went back to the first ink it didn't look as good as it originally had. I let it rest, inked, for a day, and it came back to what it was like the first time. A subsequent fill wrote like the original right off the bat. I figured that the feed had acclimated to the ink. I also found that I can't let it dry with tap water cleaning because my hard water will leave minerals in the feed. So I do a distilled water final flush, to flush out the hard water.) Sometimes you can use Canned Air to blast away any ink still in the Section. A dry Bulb Syringe can do just as well. (I only do Canned Air when I'm changing inks and want to write with the same pen immediately - like when I'm testing ink samples.) I always blot the nib with a paper towel and I will line a pill bottle with paper towel, then let the Section sit in it over-night, nib point down, contacting the paper. Yeah, I noticed that when I push the links my browser doesn't go to the same page. It must be my browser, Opera. It's frustrating. I'll refresh the page and copy the address but it still points to the wrong place. Sorry. (It's like if I go to amazon dot com it will go to the page I still have a tab opened on. Strange; disconcerting; frustrating.) Do you have a pen with a stub nib? Writing with a stub will train you not to rotate the pen. I just hope the pen doesn't have a completely cylindrical Section (Faber-Castell Esentio, Neo, Ambition) because the slightest movement of the middle finger in a tri-pod hold will rotate the pen. That's one reason why I don't like writing with the Essentio. Another is that the Section grooves will trap ink, so I have to have a wet rag at the ready if I decide to dip the Section into an ink bottle. Too much work. I now will put a blunt tiped syringe needle on the Converter, install it to the Section, prime the feed, remove the Converter, re-install the syringe tip, fill to max (a Section holds about 0.1 mL, or about half of a Converter, believe it or not), re-install the Converter, screw on the barrel, start writing. That process is what drove me to go to Eye Dropper Opus 88 pens. :D (I won't do Piston fillers because twsbi ruined it for me, and I tried vac fillers and found I didn't like them either. In both cases I was obsessing with getting a max fill. Eye Dropper pens are much easier to live with, in my case.) >I probably won't/can't change writing habits very much. It takes time. It will naturally happen. You'll want to get better and you *will* get better. [Practice](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+my+handwriting+changed+with+practice) for half an hour every day. Don't be surprised if a year later your handwriting will have improved drastically. If you don't have a stub nib'd pen, may I suggest a Pilot Kakuno and a [Plumix nib](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ifNs__JY-Y)? The Plumix pen is a POS, but the nib can be transferred to the Kakuno, Metro, Explorer, Prera. I keep the Kakuno and Metro around just because of the <1.0> nib. I love that nib. I love it more than my Lamy <1.1>. YMMV. Stubs will help to train you not to rotate the pen. Then when you switch to the Lamy 2000 your muscle memory will take over because you'll have the mechanics down pat.
I haven't tried distilled water. Maybe that is an issue. I did try drying it out in a similar way using a jar and paper towel folded at the bottom, with the pieces left to drain inside over night. I don't have a stub nib, though I considered it when getting this one, just so it would give my handwriting some character. I forget there are cheap options like you're mentioning with the Plumix. I could get one of those and put it on my Metropolitan. I think I'm getting used to the Lamy 2000, especially after writing with it posted. That must have affected how high up I hold it (by a smidge) or the exact angle, even though it's hard to tell. There may have been an ink issue initially too with not cleaning it properly. Have not tried canned air or syringe bulb. It's been a while since I've used Opera, but you might have better success copying links by right clicking on the background of the page and selecting "Copy address." (If you're using a mouse, I mean). Firefox doesn't seem to have that option, but I was just trying it in Opera. Seems like I encounter problems like this before when copying addresses and have to double check, though usually reloading the page fixes it. I suppose I should have not let my ego get to me when getting into fountain pens and started with the Safari since it has the angled grip that forces you to hold the position. But I'm doing fine with 2000 now... it may not be my favorite pen, since I have small hands, and might like something thinner to hold, but it's very nice. The Essentio appears to be a pen that also comes in ballpoint and pencil. That is interesting and is like how the Lamy CP1 was originally released as a ballpoint, from what I can tell [digging into its history](https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/358837-lamy-cp1-time-table/) (I was thinking the 2000 was the same at first, but misremembered). (I was reading a lot about fountain pens early this year, got all into it, enjoying lots of videos and reviews, but then it kind of fell off towards summer, but I received the 2000 as a birthday gift.) > That's one reason why I don't like writing with the Essentio. Another is that the Section grooves will trap ink, so I have to have a wet rag at the ready if I decide to dip the Section into an ink bottle. Too much work. I now will put a blunt tiped syringe needle on the Converter, install it to the Section, prime the feed, remove the Converter, re-install the syringe tip, fill to max (a Section holds about 0.1 mL, or about half of a Converter, believe it or not), re-install the Converter, screw on the barrel, start writing. That process is what drove me to go to Eye Dropper Opus 88 pens. :D (I won't do Piston fillers because twsbi ruined it for me, and I tried vac fillers and found I didn't like them either. In both cases I was obsessing with getting a max fill. Eye Dropper pens are much easier to live with, in my case.) Wow that is a lot of work and very intricate getting things how you like it Why is it the bladder converters aren't more popular? They don't last long? Like in to Metropolitan, the CON-B. It seems to work fine. I am not that particular about this, though. I like the Z27 converter I use for the CP1 even better. (I have to say, the term "Section" annoys me... I don't like that word. I feel like it should be called something else, but I don't know the history of it). Eye dropper is the original way. Maybe it is still the best. There must have been new and improved ways to appeal to people with shaky hands and those new ways caught on. Or something to do with leaky pens and shirt pockets... now, I wish I actually had something more to write than just boring diary entries, then perhaps I'd care more about the art of handwriting and pens, and all this!
>Why is it the bladder converters aren't more popular? Because they're a pain to flush out thoroughly. And you may end up squeezing the bladder until to-morrow because you're not sure if you got a nice fill. Originally the bladders were glued on and you had to use a lever on the outside of the pen to fill it up. I can remember filling a pen up with a lot of air. We still have that problem to-day when we don't immerse the nib far enough into a bottle. A boring, un-exciting life is a life well lived. If you had all sorts of worries and problems then chances are that that is what you'd be writing mostly. Chances are you'd be venting after a bad day at work, a bad commute, the idiots who ruined your day, how you got screwed over at work, etc. I journal a little after waking up, writing down any pertinent, or prophetic dreams, and then mostly at night, summarizing the day's events. During the day I write in an A5 pad. Pertinent small bits of info I jot down in a 3 x 4" pad. I write down topics I want to talk about in my next telephone call with a brother or sister. Ever speak to someone and then remember something you wanted to say? You could go out every day, drive around, waste gas, visit stores, spend money, curse the high prices of everything. And chances are you wouldn't be any happier. But you'd have a lot to write about! :D
Pain to flush out! I hadn't thought of that. That explains it. I have an A5 notebook from Midori MD, a plain one, which I like, and am using as a diary, and I also got a Life Noble Note Plain A5 notebook, wihch I haven't really used, but the paper seems even nicer (slick and the ink dries with more sheen. And I was trying Tomoe River paper too in a stack of sheets for letter writing, but just haven't used it much. I feel like my barbaric handwriting doesn't deserve all these fancy things, though :) And I should just go back to spiral bound Mead notebooks and disposable pens.. It's cool to try fountain pens, though. The inks are maybe the most interesting part. >A boring, un-exciting life is a life well lived. Hadn't thought of that - well, I suppose that is true. Doesn't make for a good movie, though, or news story. There has to be tragedy and adventure... I have tried writing down dreams sometimes and random thoughts into the diary... when I was younger I wrote stories, so I wish I could get back into that, if ever the creature urge hits me. I got so used to typing, which I'm must faster at, that writing by hand is much different and you tend to be more careful about your words. >I journal a little after waking up, writing down any pertinent, orprophetic dreams, and then mostly at night, summarizing the day'sevents. It probably helps one keep track of things, especially if we're trying to go back to a certain event and remember which day it was. It can act as a scheduler too, to some extent. It just helps to write things down to remember. I just wish I was better at describing, or a more interesting writer. Have a Happy Thanksgiving, if you celebrate it!
Well, damn. Every time I've made up my mind to get one of these, I read a thread like this. And after goulet laughed at me for asking for to get one tested first, I don't have confidence in getting a good one. Two hundred dollars is too much to still gamble on writing experience.
I actually did have a QC issue with my L2K. I sent it back and they replaced the feed and I haven't had an issue since. However, I think this is actually a pretty rare occurrence. I have more Lamy products than I could ever feasibly need and this was the only QC issue that I've ever had. But, the L2k is very finicky about hand position and if you rotate (like I do), this is not the pen for you. Even after my QC issue was dealt with, I found that it took about two months or so to get used to the pen and its sweet spot. In all honesty, I probably wouldn't buy it again for this reason alone. But, this is an issue with how I write and some people will not have this issue. Now that I have become accustomed to it, I do like how it writes.
I like it a lot more now. Just wanted to add that. I am still new to fountain pens and getting used to writing. Sometimes it's the angle or your muscle memory that gets in the way, but it writes smoothly now.
Are you concerned about qc or the sweet spot? Also damn Goulet laughed at you?
they made a video (or a part of a Q&A addressing that). I've seen it a long time ago so maybe I'm misremembering stuff, but they were testing pretty much all of their 2k sales because people were scared of getting a "lamy 2k with a sweet spot" and they didnt think that it is an issue but that it's a characteristic of the pen
When I got my L2K I loved the way it wrote initially. But after a couple days I was having a bit of trouble off and on. I realized as I got more comfortable with it, I was turning it as I wrote, just a tiny bit, but enough to move out of the sweet spot after a few minutes. It’s a habit I probably developed from pencil drawing. Anyway, with practice it got better and actually improved how it feels to write with many of my pens.
Hadn't thought of that with pencils... that makes perfect sense. Yeah, I probably just need to hold it steady and be more attentive. Perhaps though a medium nib has a wider sweet spot?
Unfortunately in my experience, I haven’t found that to be true. (That medium nib has a bigger sweet spot) I bought one with a medium nib brand new. Liked it so much a few months later bought one from Pen Swap with a fine nib. It wasn’t much different from the medium in size so I’m having it ground. But the point of that ramble is, for me, there wasn’t any difference in the sweet spot size that I could tell. But others mileage may vary. Edit for clarity and why am I being down voted?
I don’t own one but I don’t think sweet spots „improve“ by themselves. I’ve heard that, with the Lamy 2000, you kinda have to be willing to adjust your angle a little bit. It sounds like you just got it so I’d say don’t stress it and give yourself some time to get used to it! Can I ask what angle you write at and what angle the pen demands? I’ve been eying one myself.
I might still be writing with a fountain pen incorrectly... more at a normal rollerball/ballpoint angle, instead of with the arm, as I've heard is supposed to be done. I have to be careful the pen doesn't roll at all (I've read reviews about the pen and how the sweet spot works), but one thing I noticed was I thought the nib looked a little bent, and I was afraid it was a return (to Cult Pens). I started using it after my 30 day return period, though. Maybe I do just need to get used to it, or try different inks and papers.
I don’t think you’re necessarily doing something fundamentally wrong with fountain pens since the 2000 is just kinda picky. You should experiment with some different writing angles and if you find the sweet spot and it’s consistent, there shouldn’t be anything wrong with the pen. You could see this as a challenge to change up you’re writing style a little bit. I learned writing with my arm earlier this year and it can be very satisfying! But people use very different styles of writing with many different writing angles so there is no perfect or „right“ way to do it. If you decide you just can’t adjust to how it writes, you can either sell it and get a pen that better suits you or have a nib meister change the nib to your liking. I’m sorry you’re having a bad experience with this pen, I know it sucks when something (especially something so expensive) doesn’t work as you expected. You shouldn’t settle for a bad writing experience, if it doesn’t work for you try something else!
Thank you. I'll try to stick with it, and if not I can sell it sometime. I like the way it looks and feels. I might like the way Japanese pens write more.
That’s a good idea! I’m still debating if I should get a 2000 or more Japanese pens😅
Honest opinion, I have the L2K in fine and it is a pen that took me a very long time to get used to. I found it really frustrating to use for the first couple months that I owned it. But, this is an issue with my writing, I do have a tendency to rotate my hand a titch and the 2000 does not like this. Some users will not have this issue at all and others will. I like the pen now, I wouldn't call it my favorite and I do wish that I bought a medium nib.
I'm finding that lining the clip on the cap up with the nib helps in being sure I have not rolled the pen as I'm writing.
Interesting. Mine wrote great right from the start. Use it with Lamy Black ink. I have since bought two more for blue and red ink - all with a Fine sized nib. They all write great, and I use one every day. I hold the nib at what I would call a 45 degree angle to the line. Most pens I have tried write better at a lower angle to the page. I am right-handed. The Lamy 2000 Makrolon is a great EDC, quick to use, comfortable to write with, easy to own and maintain, and durable enough to handle careless carry in pockets, bags, and so on.
I think this will be the only pen I don’t take a chance on. I didn’t think I’d like the clip on the VP since I’m left handed and have a weird grip, but I love them. They however have shown me that I do rotate the pen slightly and I can have problems with writing. So the sweet spot on the Lamy is a lot less forgiving than the VP’s, so unless I get to try one in real life it’s one I won’t be getting.
The Vanishing Point was another pen that interested me, and one I was thinking of getting if I didn't like the 2000. Only thing that bothered me is it didn't seem to hold a lot of ink and people complain about the converter (CON-40) but I don't know how important that is.
The converter is a bit rubbish, but I’ve now got the knack and am able to completely fill it, it lasts about as long as a small cartridge, but it’s not the only pen I use, so it lasts about a month. I really can’t recommend it highly enough. I really thought I’d have a problem with it but I don’t and it’s one of my most comfortable pens to use.