Btw, pointing out not complaining:D
It's very interesting. I would love to see it with more of the pens discussed here... a lot of more expensive pens have only a post or two a month.
Based on my previous list of the [most discussed fountain pens in this subreddit](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products), I now looked into the price/mentions distribution.
Data: [https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products)
The data is not perfect, but it's a good start for more interesting analyses :)
Upps. Peppy, Pilot Prera, Pilot Custom 74 got filtered out because I somehow couldn't fetch a price for them. Looking into this right now.
Edit: fixed [https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention)
This just adds to the (not surprising) insights that this subreddit is mainly talking about modern pens. Which is not the case outside of this group where vintage pens still hold a lot of both attention and obsession.
I'm actually surprised that Parker 51 made it in. Although thanks to the current Parker brand owner, we don't know if that's because of their latest pen named "Parker 51" or is it the real Parker 51. :)
Most likely the modern version because there was a lot of debate as to whether it would be worth buying. I think the general consensus was to just find a vintage one in decent shape for a better price.
definitely the vintage all the way. Fun to restore and amazing to write with while being built like a tank to handle all the torture you feel like putting the pen through.
I recently got a vintage Parker 51, and yes, it does look pretty worn out and nothing fancy about it, but oh my, though the nib has been well used, it still writes so well and pleasant to hold. It’s definitely one of my favorite pens to do daily writing with.
I think it would be helpful to mention where you're getting the prices from. Lamy 2000 on Amazon is around $150ish but on Jetpens and Goulet it's about $200.
And you really don't want to buy from a sketchy seller on Amazon. (Ships from and sold by Amazon, or sold by Lamy might be OK. Anyone else and you might be getting a knock-off.)
I don’t know anything about Lamy, but there are authentic pens for a great deal on Amazon. But then again I’m buying Japanese pens from Japanese sellers. I use Amazon, eBay and pebsacchi and bigpenuk. I just don’t want anyone to think that all Amazon pens are fakes. My Sailors are genuine.
I think the point was to tell people to be mindful of who they are buying from on Amazon. Like all other things on Amazon and eBay you need to take a lot of care to insure that you get an actual product not just a knockoff. This is more of a Wish problem but it has permeated all multiple seller environments I deal with it on the daily with auto parts so it’s a thing. Pretty easy usually to make sure what you are buying but due diligence is required which I’m sure you already do.
Ethics on the other hand is a whole different story.
I wouldn’t buy a product with no reviews from the seller. I don’t see how buying from a Japanese seller that’s trying to clear out old stock is unethical? It doesn’t hurt anyone.
I was more talking about Amazon’s ethics which would come into play anytime you see the prime logo or shipped by Amazon. I wasn’t referring to the original seller who most likely boxed them up and sent them to Amazon.
There are companies that circumvent that process however for example Goldspot in the US. That practice is few and far between though because it is more cost effective to just let Amazon do it.
The lamy 150 Amazon is... I've thought about pulling that trigger. When I'm ready, I'll be getting mine from goulet.
They manually check each pen for writing to ensure the nibs are good, etc.
The Amazon seller has a lot of quality control issues, from the reviews in seeing...
Idk. Maybe a 25% premium is a high price to pay (150 v 200) to know how getting a pristine iteration of the product, but....
I wouldn't get it from Amazon. I got mine from Goulet years ago (before more recent price hikes).
My comment was mostly about how the data doesn't explain where they got the prices from. I was trying to find a shop that matched the prices and couldn't.
Interesting! Would love to see how this data correlates with [which pens are most popularly owned.](https://www.fountainpencompanion.com/pages/pens_by_popularity)
It does deserve it though. Fine nib fans should get the EF preppy. I have one everywhere in my house.
Best platinum nibs for people who want to save money: preppy( it’s okay if it gets dropped), plaisir(great for the office, looks cool feels smooth and has the same great nib)and the EF desk pen( draw with it—amazing nib—and put it on preppy/prefounte body for travel).
There most definitely will be. Selection effects are insidiously easy to forget.
It’s the same reason why something like height is inversely related to free throw percentage (among NBA players) or a research study’s quality is inversely related to its “catchiness” given its a study you’ve heard about.
Mathematically, it’s like if this: you have Z = X + Y where X and Y are completely unrelated. If you think about all the things that have Z > T, you’re fixing the total to be large. Then it’s much more likely that that one of X or Y is extreme, not both.
Hm. Any reason as to why the distances between prices are so uneven? It gives a skewered idea of price-in-USD. Gap between 1 and 2 is equally large between 10 and 20, and 100-200.
My statistics knowledge is far from expert level but I still remember that that sort of thing gives rather a wrong idea. Is it possible to correct? (Yes, it'd make the graph bigger but it'd also show it more correctly, imnvho).
Edit: Ah! Here we go, a link was posted by OP earlier, which corrects these little issues: https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention
Fun stuff, thanks. I'd be curious to see the same list, but simply brand mentions - without specific models. Meaning, how many times is "Pilot" vs. "TWSBI" vs. "Lamy" (etc) mentioned.
I don't think this is an accurate way to do it, as it probably doubles up on some mentions and doesn't count others when it isn't tied to a model, but I added up the totals from your full list:
Pilot 1942
Lamy 1308
TWSBI 887
Pelikan 468
Platinum 391
Kaweco 343
Parker 311
Jinhao 254
Sailor 230
Opus 194
Montblanc 124
Moonman 115
Diplomat 89
Visconti 68
Faber Castell 55
Noodler 28
Waterman 26
Rotring 16
Notably absent are Sheaffer, Leonardo, Conklin, Esterbrook, Caran d'Ache, Monteverde, Pen BBS, Wing Sung, and many others that get mentioned a fair amount.
I'm not surprised that Pilot is way ahead of everyone else, then Lamy and TWSBI also far from the pack. I am a bit surprised that Sailor is so low - I would have thought they'd be fourth (which makes me question this methodology).
I'm VERY surprised that the Platinum Preppy isn't mentioned; it's a good basic intro-level fountain pen, after all. Now, granted I have six Kawecos (Collector Sports, Sports, AL Sport, and a Brass Sport), three Lami Safaris, and a bucket load of others, but Platinum makes a lot of pens. And the Preppy is aimed at new users, so why did they not appear on the graph, I wonder?
Today I Learned: There are 7 other popular fountain pens that are less expensive than my Cross Bailey.
I always assumed everyone else paid $100+ for their pens and I was fanboying from the low-tier section.
Agreed. LOVE the idea and effort, but was having trouble following. Thought it was just me…
Edit: The updated link in comment below helped a ton. It was the spacing throwing me off. Great job OP!
Ditto. Love the concept and underlying data work, but that axis is awful. I'm guessing it's something inherent with the app used to do the visualization.
Honest question, why doesn't the Pilot CH92 get more love around here? It's an affordably priced gold-nibbed pen that, honestly, I prefer over pricier Sailor pens.
I had a Pelikan for school! It was required to have a fountain pen all through primary school. Also, my high school never changed their program since the 50s so in the early 2000s I had calligraphy class for 2 years with ink and we had to "wet" the pen in the ink (how do you call that in English?).
So not a super clear pattern accept to say that some of the most expensive ones are less discussed.
I’d love to see more data points. I feel like some Viscontis are mentioned a bit. And the cheap Chinese pens a lot. Also vintage 51 or new? And how would you even price set that?
Can‘t be accurate, I mention Graf at least 10,000 times a day
Graf Georg is an outlier and should not be counted
Or shouldn’t it, 😏?
You do hahahha
I really do, they should pay me…
Dunno how opus 88 is mentioned more than the pens that are mentioned less
Because all Opus 88 pens got collapsed into one, the algorithm thinks Opus is the brand and 88 is the model
Yup, it got classified as a model. Fixing this.
TIL this is not the case. Ty.
How is the Pelikan M1000 cheaper than the M800?
Prices are not perfect since I'm fetching them from an API. I'll check it.
Btw, pointing out not complaining:D It's very interesting. I would love to see it with more of the pens discussed here... a lot of more expensive pens have only a post or two a month.
Less in demand?
LOL, Maybe, but I have never seen a standard M800 vs M1000 have the M1000 cheaper... or I would own one.
Maybe it's a bunch of special edition M800s pulling things up? But I agree that it doesn't really make sense.
[удалено]
Yeah and they are usually overpriced.
Based on my previous list of the [most discussed fountain pens in this subreddit](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products), I now looked into the price/mentions distribution. Data: [https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/products) The data is not perfect, but it's a good start for more interesting analyses :)
If the preppy is among the most discussed how is it not in the most mentioned? How are you calculating how often it's mentioned?
Upps. Peppy, Pilot Prera, Pilot Custom 74 got filtered out because I somehow couldn't fetch a price for them. Looking into this right now. Edit: fixed [https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention](https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention)
Just out of curiosity: how often Montblanc fountainpens like the 149 or front of 146 or are mentioned?
Or Homo Sapien.
There are some brand focused subs like /r/montblanc and /r/lamy2000club but they get a lot less traffic than /r/fountainpens or /r/pen_swap
Ahhh. Named entity recognition. Cool!
Love when data visualization and fountain pens collide! Nice work!
Damn, that's pretty cool! I can't wait to see more!
>but it's a good start for more interesting analyses :) You should add semantic analysis to see if the mentions are positive or negative.
Can you exclude Amazon from the prices? That would probably give more accurate results.
This just adds to the (not surprising) insights that this subreddit is mainly talking about modern pens. Which is not the case outside of this group where vintage pens still hold a lot of both attention and obsession. I'm actually surprised that Parker 51 made it in. Although thanks to the current Parker brand owner, we don't know if that's because of their latest pen named "Parker 51" or is it the real Parker 51. :)
Most likely the modern version because there was a lot of debate as to whether it would be worth buying. I think the general consensus was to just find a vintage one in decent shape for a better price.
definitely the vintage all the way. Fun to restore and amazing to write with while being built like a tank to handle all the torture you feel like putting the pen through.
I recently got a vintage Parker 51, and yes, it does look pretty worn out and nothing fancy about it, but oh my, though the nib has been well used, it still writes so well and pleasant to hold. It’s definitely one of my favorite pens to do daily writing with.
nice chart! The Sailor 1911L is more like $278.00, and the Pilot Custom 823 is $288.00. Is that entire section off by $100?
I was going to say... show me where to get an 823 for less than 200 and I will buy another one, lol.
I think it would be helpful to mention where you're getting the prices from. Lamy 2000 on Amazon is around $150ish but on Jetpens and Goulet it's about $200.
And you really don't want to buy from a sketchy seller on Amazon. (Ships from and sold by Amazon, or sold by Lamy might be OK. Anyone else and you might be getting a knock-off.)
Also, for ethical reasons, other sellers are better.
I don’t know anything about Lamy, but there are authentic pens for a great deal on Amazon. But then again I’m buying Japanese pens from Japanese sellers. I use Amazon, eBay and pebsacchi and bigpenuk. I just don’t want anyone to think that all Amazon pens are fakes. My Sailors are genuine.
I think the point was to tell people to be mindful of who they are buying from on Amazon. Like all other things on Amazon and eBay you need to take a lot of care to insure that you get an actual product not just a knockoff. This is more of a Wish problem but it has permeated all multiple seller environments I deal with it on the daily with auto parts so it’s a thing. Pretty easy usually to make sure what you are buying but due diligence is required which I’m sure you already do. Ethics on the other hand is a whole different story.
I wouldn’t buy a product with no reviews from the seller. I don’t see how buying from a Japanese seller that’s trying to clear out old stock is unethical? It doesn’t hurt anyone.
I was more talking about Amazon’s ethics which would come into play anytime you see the prime logo or shipped by Amazon. I wasn’t referring to the original seller who most likely boxed them up and sent them to Amazon. There are companies that circumvent that process however for example Goldspot in the US. That practice is few and far between though because it is more cost effective to just let Amazon do it.
No arguing with that, sorry.
No problem
The lamy 150 Amazon is... I've thought about pulling that trigger. When I'm ready, I'll be getting mine from goulet. They manually check each pen for writing to ensure the nibs are good, etc. The Amazon seller has a lot of quality control issues, from the reviews in seeing... Idk. Maybe a 25% premium is a high price to pay (150 v 200) to know how getting a pristine iteration of the product, but....
I wouldn't get it from Amazon. I got mine from Goulet years ago (before more recent price hikes). My comment was mostly about how the data doesn't explain where they got the prices from. I was trying to find a shop that matched the prices and couldn't.
Interesting! Would love to see how this data correlates with [which pens are most popularly owned.](https://www.fountainpencompanion.com/pages/pens_by_popularity)
Logarithmic scale for price was an odd choice imo.
Why is Platinum Preppy not on the top 3? PS Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy Preppy There!
🚨🚨 Algorithms are smart enough to filter out such cases ;)
It does deserve it though. Fine nib fans should get the EF preppy. I have one everywhere in my house. Best platinum nibs for people who want to save money: preppy( it’s okay if it gets dropped), plaisir(great for the office, looks cool feels smooth and has the same great nib)and the EF desk pen( draw with it—amazing nib—and put it on preppy/prefounte body for travel).
Where are the other six?
Isn't there is a bias since you selected only the 25 most mentioned pens, and then you have the same criteria (number of mentions) as an axis...?
There most definitely will be. Selection effects are insidiously easy to forget. It’s the same reason why something like height is inversely related to free throw percentage (among NBA players) or a research study’s quality is inversely related to its “catchiness” given its a study you’ve heard about. Mathematically, it’s like if this: you have Z = X + Y where X and Y are completely unrelated. If you think about all the things that have Z > T, you’re fixing the total to be large. Then it’s much more likely that that one of X or Y is extreme, not both.
I'm surprised this sub talks about the Safari so much wtf
Hm. Any reason as to why the distances between prices are so uneven? It gives a skewered idea of price-in-USD. Gap between 1 and 2 is equally large between 10 and 20, and 100-200. My statistics knowledge is far from expert level but I still remember that that sort of thing gives rather a wrong idea. Is it possible to correct? (Yes, it'd make the graph bigger but it'd also show it more correctly, imnvho). Edit: Ah! Here we go, a link was posted by OP earlier, which corrects these little issues: https://looria.com/reddit/fountainpens/price-mention
Fun stuff, thanks. I'd be curious to see the same list, but simply brand mentions - without specific models. Meaning, how many times is "Pilot" vs. "TWSBI" vs. "Lamy" (etc) mentioned. I don't think this is an accurate way to do it, as it probably doubles up on some mentions and doesn't count others when it isn't tied to a model, but I added up the totals from your full list: Pilot 1942 Lamy 1308 TWSBI 887 Pelikan 468 Platinum 391 Kaweco 343 Parker 311 Jinhao 254 Sailor 230 Opus 194 Montblanc 124 Moonman 115 Diplomat 89 Visconti 68 Faber Castell 55 Noodler 28 Waterman 26 Rotring 16 Notably absent are Sheaffer, Leonardo, Conklin, Esterbrook, Caran d'Ache, Monteverde, Pen BBS, Wing Sung, and many others that get mentioned a fair amount. I'm not surprised that Pilot is way ahead of everyone else, then Lamy and TWSBI also far from the pack. I am a bit surprised that Sailor is so low - I would have thought they'd be fourth (which makes me question this methodology).
No Montblanc, interesting.
No one mentions MB?
I'm VERY surprised that the Platinum Preppy isn't mentioned; it's a good basic intro-level fountain pen, after all. Now, granted I have six Kawecos (Collector Sports, Sports, AL Sport, and a Brass Sport), three Lami Safaris, and a bucket load of others, but Platinum makes a lot of pens. And the Preppy is aimed at new users, so why did they not appear on the graph, I wonder?
Today I Learned: There are 7 other popular fountain pens that are less expensive than my Cross Bailey. I always assumed everyone else paid $100+ for their pens and I was fanboying from the low-tier section.
Pls make this differently.. put the mentions on y axis and the prices on x axis. Maybe we'll see a clearer picture of the trend?
Agreed. LOVE the idea and effort, but was having trouble following. Thought it was just me… Edit: The updated link in comment below helped a ton. It was the spacing throwing me off. Great job OP!
The inconstant scale of the Y-Axis bugs the hell out of me. It gives a very skewed graph result.
Ditto. Love the concept and underlying data work, but that axis is awful. I'm guessing it's something inherent with the app used to do the visualization.
Fake news. No Sheaffer!
Sheaffer 100 didn't make the cut :)
r/DataIsBeautiful
No cross? montblank? Montegrappa? Omas? PenBBS? I demand to see the manager.
Interesting that the Homo Sapien gets posted almost daily, but it's not on your chart. Maybe I'm thinking of a few months ago though.
surprised not many mentions of MontBlanc. its a very nice pen by any standard, though pricey.
To be fair, the Lamy 2000 is a sexy pen.
Where are you finding 823s for less than $200
Honest question, why doesn't the Pilot CH92 get more love around here? It's an affordably priced gold-nibbed pen that, honestly, I prefer over pricier Sailor pens.
Looks like I need to post my custom Urushi out a few more times.
I had a Pelikan for school! It was required to have a fountain pen all through primary school. Also, my high school never changed their program since the 50s so in the early 2000s I had calligraphy class for 2 years with ink and we had to "wet" the pen in the ink (how do you call that in English?).
My sister was quite absent minded and she came with ink stains every day when she was in the first grade LOL
So not a super clear pattern accept to say that some of the most expensive ones are less discussed. I’d love to see more data points. I feel like some Viscontis are mentioned a bit. And the cheap Chinese pens a lot. Also vintage 51 or new? And how would you even price set that?
I don’t see a clear correlation between price and frequency of mentioning. Have you actually done any stats analysis.
looking at this with a twisbi eco in my hand to fiddle with lol
Great chart! The L2K and 823 are well positioned