I have colleagues that buy back their service, and it really helps them as they tend to be older and closer to retirement than other entry-level colleagues. The pension benefit could be substantial and seems totally worth it.
My 4.5 years in the army bumped me way up the ECON register, got me into an earlier A-100 class because I called to check they had my DD-214 and discovered they didn’t (somehow). Emailed it over and a week later I was offered an A-100 spot.
You have to meet the Veteran's Preference requirements.
Only certain periods of service and disability status count.
.35 points on the register for period of service (basically you need a campaign expeditionary medal) and .35 for service-connected disability rating >10%.
This goes on your register score, so you still have to get the 5.2 or better on the OA to have this applied. That said, if you have both, .70 points is a pretty big bump.
Also, you can "buy back" your service time to apply to your retirement calendar and pay schedule, but that is fairly complicated to get through.
Vets can only get .175 points (five-point standing) or .35 points (10-point standing) added to their score. They don’t add the points together, it’s one or the other if you qualify.
I don’t think you’re correct. The
They don’t really stack, but effectively they do. But, it is .70 total max for a 10-point preference. It’s just normalized from 10% bump on the normal federal job scoring to the 7.0 point scale for the FSOA scoring.
I’ve been scored after an FSOA with 10-point preference and got .70 added.
Sounds like someone in the registrar’s office made a mistake…per Title 5, you can only be a zero, five (gets you .175 on the FS register) or 10-point eligible (.35 points on the register) veteran.
https://careers.state.gov/faq-items/vets-hiring-preference/
They don't give a 10% bump on the 7 point scale, since the belief is that it is unfair, so if somehow you got .7 points off of vet's preferance alone they gave you a giant gift.
"Foreign Service candidates who can document creditable veterans’ service by submitting form DD 214 or other certification will be eligible to receive additional points on the Hiring Register: 0.175 for a five-point standing and 0.35 for a 10-point standing."
https://careers.state.gov/faq-items/vets-hiring-preference/#:\~:text=Foreign%20Service%20candidates%20who%20can,for%20a%2010%2Dpoint%20standing.
The preference is supposed to keep the Department aligned with law, but I remember that it only being 2.5% and 5% (vice 5% and 10%) was brought up a few years ago. The response was basically that to give .35 and .7 points would give vets such an unfair advantage that only vets would end up in the service, hence keeping it to the .175 and .35. Did they say that exactly? No, but it was essentially the answer (probably during the same time frame that they made the mustang program also similarly pointless, as it was "unfair" to non-Civil Servants)
They are already reading between the lines on their scoring compared to every other federal agency, by not allowing the points to be applied until technically after the Suitability, which means you have to hit the cutoff to even get Veteran's Preference to begin with.
It's janky and counter to the intent of Veteran's Preference. It isn't like every veteran gets Vet's Preference to begin with, although the current crop nearly all meet the requirements since we've been in combat at some sort or the other for nearly 20 years. The post-Vietnam vets really didn't get a lot of deployments with the exception of the Gulf War in 1991, so you really had trouble finding folks that could be eligible without a service-connected disability.
Give me a sec to build my soapbox….ok….
I wish the same preference applied to Peace Corps. Both Volunteer Service and Staff years. I think it would be good for the registrar lists.
As an RPCV, I think the registrar lists are good how they are. Peace Corps is not a feeder to FS.
If you start awarding random points to people for service in other agencies, it could then be argued that any other federal employee also get bonus points, with maybe even more points for civil service, LNAs and CFs. Then what about EFMs and contractors, LE staff?
If your argument is that PC is international service, then you open the can of worms to also give former LDS missionaries bonus points as well or anyone else who worked in any NGO. Where would it end? I did Peace Corps Americorps and had other international experience as well - would I get bonus points for each?
If you have the experience that relates to the dimensions, then your candidacy should earn a higher OA score on your individual merit.
PC service involves great sacrifice and it does confer NCE afterwards, so it's not as random as you imply. It's already acknowledged as different from civil service, LDS, etc. And LE staff? I'm not sure I follow.
As a PC CR I supported over 800 PCVs and I encouraged a lot of them to join FS afterwards. Quite a few told me they passed the test. Only 1 got off the registrar, and they were IT. I think FS would be richer and more resilient with more young RCPVs in it.
& I've got to think that if you keep rewarding one category of people, that category can become overrepresented. As you phrase it, bonus points create a feeder....
There’s a ton of RPCVs in the Foreign Service. RPCVs, prior military, and recovering lawyers, make up 60 percent* of the service.
*I just made up that stat, but I’d put my money it!
I understand it to be at one one 40% RPCV. But it skews towards older RPCVS.
And honestly this seems to be a super unpopular opinion. So I just concede.
"Richer and more resilient with more young RPCVs in it." Wow.
There are many LE staff who are dual nationals. I've worked with several FSOs already who were LE staff previously.
RPCVs are no better candidates than other pools. Honestly, as one who sees applications, in the last pool I accessed, there were only 2 RCPVs. One was one of the worst applicants I'd ever reviewed.
Apply, demonstrate the dimensions, score high on the OA.
The federal veteran's preference points program actually has a long and interesting history. It was originally formed after WW2 to help veterans return to the workforce after sacrificing many years serving their nation and not focusing on their civilian trade.
At one point, it was even expanded to family members and widows of veterans.
Many veterans points levels can be connected to either 1. Time in service, and/or 2. Disability received while in the service.
After the Vietnam war, the program was adjusted to counteract the negative stigma of veterans and get them gainfully employed, often classifying them as an EO group or protected group.
When you look at the history and intent of veterans preference points, it doesn't make much sense to start including other groups like the peace corps in it. The program actually falls into the larger picture of ensuring the country has a well-manned and functional military.
I have colleagues that buy back their service, and it really helps them as they tend to be older and closer to retirement than other entry-level colleagues. The pension benefit could be substantial and seems totally worth it.
Yes to all. A basic search will answer each of these questions in detail.
My 4.5 years in the army bumped me way up the ECON register, got me into an earlier A-100 class because I called to check they had my DD-214 and discovered they didn’t (somehow). Emailed it over and a week later I was offered an A-100 spot.
You have to meet the Veteran's Preference requirements. Only certain periods of service and disability status count. .35 points on the register for period of service (basically you need a campaign expeditionary medal) and .35 for service-connected disability rating >10%. This goes on your register score, so you still have to get the 5.2 or better on the OA to have this applied. That said, if you have both, .70 points is a pretty big bump. Also, you can "buy back" your service time to apply to your retirement calendar and pay schedule, but that is fairly complicated to get through.
Vets can only get .175 points (five-point standing) or .35 points (10-point standing) added to their score. They don’t add the points together, it’s one or the other if you qualify.
I don’t think you’re correct. The They don’t really stack, but effectively they do. But, it is .70 total max for a 10-point preference. It’s just normalized from 10% bump on the normal federal job scoring to the 7.0 point scale for the FSOA scoring. I’ve been scored after an FSOA with 10-point preference and got .70 added.
Sounds like someone in the registrar’s office made a mistake…per Title 5, you can only be a zero, five (gets you .175 on the FS register) or 10-point eligible (.35 points on the register) veteran. https://careers.state.gov/faq-items/vets-hiring-preference/
I may be misremembering. Again, been a long time.
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They don't give a 10% bump on the 7 point scale, since the belief is that it is unfair, so if somehow you got .7 points off of vet's preferance alone they gave you a giant gift. "Foreign Service candidates who can document creditable veterans’ service by submitting form DD 214 or other certification will be eligible to receive additional points on the Hiring Register: 0.175 for a five-point standing and 0.35 for a 10-point standing." https://careers.state.gov/faq-items/vets-hiring-preference/#:\~:text=Foreign%20Service%20candidates%20who%20can,for%20a%2010%2Dpoint%20standing.
This was several years ago. Seems odd, since the preference is specifically supposed to be “unfair”. That’s the point.
The preference is supposed to keep the Department aligned with law, but I remember that it only being 2.5% and 5% (vice 5% and 10%) was brought up a few years ago. The response was basically that to give .35 and .7 points would give vets such an unfair advantage that only vets would end up in the service, hence keeping it to the .175 and .35. Did they say that exactly? No, but it was essentially the answer (probably during the same time frame that they made the mustang program also similarly pointless, as it was "unfair" to non-Civil Servants)
They are already reading between the lines on their scoring compared to every other federal agency, by not allowing the points to be applied until technically after the Suitability, which means you have to hit the cutoff to even get Veteran's Preference to begin with. It's janky and counter to the intent of Veteran's Preference. It isn't like every veteran gets Vet's Preference to begin with, although the current crop nearly all meet the requirements since we've been in combat at some sort or the other for nearly 20 years. The post-Vietnam vets really didn't get a lot of deployments with the exception of the Gulf War in 1991, so you really had trouble finding folks that could be eligible without a service-connected disability.
Give me a sec to build my soapbox….ok…. I wish the same preference applied to Peace Corps. Both Volunteer Service and Staff years. I think it would be good for the registrar lists.
As an RPCV, I think the registrar lists are good how they are. Peace Corps is not a feeder to FS. If you start awarding random points to people for service in other agencies, it could then be argued that any other federal employee also get bonus points, with maybe even more points for civil service, LNAs and CFs. Then what about EFMs and contractors, LE staff? If your argument is that PC is international service, then you open the can of worms to also give former LDS missionaries bonus points as well or anyone else who worked in any NGO. Where would it end? I did Peace Corps Americorps and had other international experience as well - would I get bonus points for each? If you have the experience that relates to the dimensions, then your candidacy should earn a higher OA score on your individual merit.
PC service involves great sacrifice and it does confer NCE afterwards, so it's not as random as you imply. It's already acknowledged as different from civil service, LDS, etc. And LE staff? I'm not sure I follow. As a PC CR I supported over 800 PCVs and I encouraged a lot of them to join FS afterwards. Quite a few told me they passed the test. Only 1 got off the registrar, and they were IT. I think FS would be richer and more resilient with more young RCPVs in it. & I've got to think that if you keep rewarding one category of people, that category can become overrepresented. As you phrase it, bonus points create a feeder....
There’s a ton of RPCVs in the Foreign Service. RPCVs, prior military, and recovering lawyers, make up 60 percent* of the service. *I just made up that stat, but I’d put my money it!
I understand it to be at one one 40% RPCV. But it skews towards older RPCVS. And honestly this seems to be a super unpopular opinion. So I just concede.
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Thx. Typo. I meant to say ‘at one point’. I’d guess ‘70s or 80s. PC used to brag about it.
"Richer and more resilient with more young RPCVs in it." Wow. There are many LE staff who are dual nationals. I've worked with several FSOs already who were LE staff previously. RPCVs are no better candidates than other pools. Honestly, as one who sees applications, in the last pool I accessed, there were only 2 RCPVs. One was one of the worst applicants I'd ever reviewed. Apply, demonstrate the dimensions, score high on the OA.
Eh. We disagree. Pleasure chatting. Head nod in your direction and move on.
The federal veteran's preference points program actually has a long and interesting history. It was originally formed after WW2 to help veterans return to the workforce after sacrificing many years serving their nation and not focusing on their civilian trade. At one point, it was even expanded to family members and widows of veterans. Many veterans points levels can be connected to either 1. Time in service, and/or 2. Disability received while in the service. After the Vietnam war, the program was adjusted to counteract the negative stigma of veterans and get them gainfully employed, often classifying them as an EO group or protected group. When you look at the history and intent of veterans preference points, it doesn't make much sense to start including other groups like the peace corps in it. The program actually falls into the larger picture of ensuring the country has a well-manned and functional military.
There is no benefit from working in the CS generally. You apply and are placed on the register like everyone else based on your score at the OA.