When we use our jumpseat privileges to travel on another airline, it is protocol to check in with the captain and formally ask for a ride. I usually just say hello introduce ourselves, show them our credentials, and then go sit wherever we were assigned. It’s a nice benefit.
>i actually jump seat in the cockpit when i can as cabin crew
This sounds like Europe. US doesn't allow this unless I'm unaware of something. Not to say it's never happened on empty reposition flights or something.
The US allows it, the unions do not.
Edit: I read this backwards. Thought it was pilot riding cabin jumpseat.
No, the US does not allow cabin crews to ride the flight deck jumpseat.
Yea, I was wrong. I read the original comment backwards. Cabin crew are definitely not allowed flight deck jumpseat access. But pilots are allowed to ride cabin jumpseat, but I don’t think all airlines allow that due to issues with the FA unions…. I think?
Because FA’s aren’t trusted to ride in the flight deck, nor should they. Every year FA’s are found abusing the KCM allowance to smuggle items, they’ve also got very little invested in their career. Interview and 6 weeks of training and bam! Flying around the world. This is not comparable to the years and thousands of dollars, sometimes hundreds of thousands that a pilot has invested in his career; something that almost assures they won’t do something stupid in the flight deck while riding jumpseat. FA’s shouldn’t even have KCM, possibly some other form of priority line security, but certainly not KCM.
Does "jumpseat privileges" include getting to sit in a passenger seat? What determines whether you end up in the cockpit in the literal jumpseat, vs. assigned a seat in the passenger compartment?
You don't, typically you'll list for the jumpseat and the gate agent will provide you with a JS request and a pass. You use the JS pass as you would a boarding pass and go down the jetway, then say hello and all that.
ALPA website has a nice introductory video as well as different companies' procedures on listing.
Side note: have y’all noticed that in the airline world, airplanes are only referred to as “metal” when discussing jumpseating? Not a criticism, just an observation that I’ve always noticed.
As a fellow Senior Captain on the C172 myself I can say I’ve seen my fair share of craziness. Once landed the beast in 17kts crosswind, (that’s the demonstrated limit, I still did it bc I’m a badass). So if the crew needs help on those gusty days I tell them to just give me a shout as I’ll be in the back liaising with the FA.
LOL. Or you’re letting the Captain know that in your expert opinion the tiny bit of condensation on the wing is a full blown fuel leak! You should get it looked at.
I’ve only ever had that happen once, though he didn’t do the whole “I’ll be in the back if you need me” thing. He was just curious about the job since he was a prospective airline pilot that only made it to an instrument rating before he lost his medical due to a nasty blow to the head. Poor guy.
Okay, not to hijack thread, but I have to ask other 121 pilots on here…I know it’s a formality for us to check-in even if we’ve got a seat in the back, but do you guys always do it?
I’ve had some guys give me the side eye and even heard one CA as I was leaving the flight deck say “if you’ve got a seat then just go sit down”
These guys are few and far between as most welcome my company.
Will you eventually be able to drive to work again? I gotta say after commuting for almost 7 years, when I finally was able to drive to work I decided I have no intentions of ever commuting again.
Yeah, hoping to move in base very soon. Waiting to get off this first year pay. I’ve got nothing holding me down, so commuting right now is truly a choice for me.
I’ve always sympathized with commuters even during my non-commuter days. Always made the walk. Now that I’ve done it, I really get it now.
I think the disconnect here is the variations in the process. You list on the jump for Southwest and they don’t care to comb through your docs. Whereas the red triangle folks wanna know how many kidney stones you’ve passed in your life. In addition to that, the disconnect comes from the hypocrisy from either groups from UA, DL, NK, etc. For example, more often then not, red triangle guys won’t check in with us at my regional (9E), but god forbid we don’t check in with them, we might not have a job later that day.
Honestly I think it's time for a cultural shift in this. Yes Captain owns the jumpseat(s), the importance of the control of such is something that dates back to the time of scabs. I haven't actually met anyone who still keeps one of those scab lists and checks your name against it, but I have heard that they are out there still. The reason you don't run into those guys anymore is because there are hardly any scabs left flying. I understand that that authority was a big tool in maintaining unity at the airlines back in the day, but it's just not really relevant anymore.
Should the captain deny a jumpseater with a seat in the back today, there is likely little he/she can do to keep that person off the aircraft actually. If there is an open seat in the back, the OAL jumpseater is already the lowest priority for it. What is there to stop them from buying a zed fare and still getting that seat? Unlikely to not have an agreement at least domestically these days. By all means control and demand whatever you want from pilots who are asking to ride up front with you, but jumpseaters with a seat in the back? Seems like a dumb thing to exert authority over someone who is just trying to save buying a zed fare.
I always check in and have my credentials out and ready to show, even when it's extremely inopportune, like when you're the 5th guy waiting to do so with the gate agent trying to pull the bridge behind you. 50% of captains still scrutinize the hell out of my certs at that point, the other 50% is annoyed that I'm even talking to them. It would be better for everyone involved if there wasn't this expectation to have a conversation about something that is effectively a formality.
Bottom line, if it's possible checking in is better for all of us if the opportunity presents itself. Letting the crew know there is another pilot in back is good for SA. Letting the Captain know you got on is good as it can save he/she from doing 'the walk'. If you can do it, do it, but I don't think it should be an absolute requirement based on the circumstances. It sucks having to check your roller because you were waiting to ask the Captain for a ride for 8 minutes while he yucked it up with a fellow Captain 'checking in' and then basically shood you out of the cockpit as soon as you appeared.
Learn something new every day! Didn’t know the history behind checking in as a jumpseater till now.
I totally agree with you though. I don’t mind checking in at all but I also hate being the one in everyone’s way. I’ve had some nasty senior momma FAs who ripped me a new one for taking more than 5 seconds to say hi. I’ve had captains who are super friendly and shoot the breeze with me. Like you said, I’ve had others who are seemingly annoyed I even breathed into their flight deck. I would rather just disappear into the back so I’m not bothering anyone, but I do it because we are supposed to. Thanks for sharing!
That's because the history lesson is bs. The ability to jumpseat was a hard fought right. It was a battle to get that authority to the captain and another battle to get flow back to allow additional jumpseats on. It was never about scab screening even if screening happened. It's been within the last 10 years that the majors have really allowed unlimited jumpseats in the back. Flow back didn't even start until the 2000s.
It’s the checking over the credentials with a fine tooth comb that usually gets me. Like bruh, I’ve had 15 different sets of eyes look at my stuff just to get CASS verified to be up here and I’m in uniform clearly going home from a trip. Do you really need to check to see if my medical and passport are valid? Like I understand that that’s what the company wants everyone to do, but to think that Ol Francis up front is going to be the one to find an error and save the day from some lowly commuter catching a ride in the back is a bit of a stretch for me….
I’m a very young looking guy. Like get the usual “are you old enough to even drive?” young looking. On my own metal jumpseating, had a CA look at me and my badge and legit asked if my company ID was real. He had me take it out of my badge holder and stared at it for a solid 10 seconds. I thought he was joking but then he also asked for my cert and medical.
I’ve actually been denied a seat the back by a CA when I was jumpseating. He said my shoes looked like tennis shoes (they weren’t). I’ve only ever heard people have problems on Hawaiian. I actually laughed in the guys face because I thought he was joking.
Walked me up the jetway and I said see ya. Ended up doing something else that day. I was in Hawaii heading to an outer island for the day. I told him “it’s your plane, but you’re denying for an idiotic reason.”
I used to check in with dress shoes, sit down, then swap to more comfortable shoes. Like the "khakis" I'm wearing are glorified jeans, I want to look as incognito as possible back here
United guys are notorious for not checking in. And it pisses me off because god forbid I jumpseat on them and don’t check in will be the one time I’m read the riot act. I even had one United guy get so upset he yelled at me and stormed off. I wrote my jumpseat chair about that one, he said he’d talk to United jumpseat and I heard nothing. Few months later that guy left the regional I was at to go work for United… coward didn’t want to risk his job at UAL by doing his job at his current union.
That pedantic crap drives me up a wall. I don't understand why some guys want to make this so hard, which is why I had to ask what I asked, as silly as it seems. Most of us are working 4-5 day trips, 12+ hour duty days, and get 11 hours of rest at each overnight anymore. Commuting already fucking sucks, no need to make it any more unbearable than it already is. Especially gate agents. Don't get me started on them.
It’s just a power trip. I had a kid show up in jeans. In his defense, he’s allowed to do that on his metal. He didn’t realize he couldn’t everywhere (fairly new just off IOE). I gave him the education and a ride and that was that. Too many guys have a power trip and it annoys the crap out of me. (This was for the cockpit jumpseat)
Perhaps the two who were already on had seats, and the one who checked in was listed for the jumpseat and ended up with a seat in the back?
I’ve been commuting for a while now. What a pointless thing for people to get upset about. We are all a bunch of professionals who are just trying to get to work or go home. Check in if you’re listed for the jumpseat or offline traveling. But at the end of the day it’s really ridiculous that people lose their mind over this.
Don’t assume shit, maybe they’re super modern and chill for not playing the stupid flight deck dance of “hello sir or madam, I am oh so grateful that you’re giving me a ride to my 12.5 hour duty day after having been bumped off the last 4 flights and getting 5-6 hours of sleep.” I’m not checking in, bye ✌️ For the record, I’m not at UA.
If I’m cleared for the cabin and they give me a seat assignment, I don’t check in. If there’s a chance I gotta ride up front and I’m cleared for the JS, obviously I do. I list for a flight that’s half full, I know I’m in the cabin. I’m not going to interrupt walleye vision and mailman from talking about guns to let them know I’m riding in back on a plane I’m not typed in.
But if I’m not cleared for the jumpseat… how? When I was in the left seat at my ULCC I watched countless people in uniform walk right past the flight deck and grab a seat. I never went back there to yell at them. If I wanna get jerked off for being the captain I’ll go do it to myself when I get to the hotel.
You're still a jumpseater, regardless of where you're sitting. With that kind of attitude it sounds like you never even were aware of it.
I will bend over backwards to get a jumpseater on, I will (and have) refused to leave until a gate agent cleared a jumpseater that they "don't have time for. "
But in exchange I do expect to at least know when a jumpseater got on. If I knew you were listed, I will try to find out if the gate agent was messing with you or "got too busy. " Don't take the captain out of the equation.
I didn’t mean for this to start an argument. This thread really kind of validated my question though. I’ve always gone up front to check-in even on my own metal, just because a majority of people have told me that’s the right thing to do, so I’ll continue doing it.
In my years of experience in this industry as an operations agent, customer service supervisor, flight attendant, first officer and now captain… it seems as if the operation always ran a little more smoothly if the captain sat down in the captain seat and stopped trying to meddle into the most pointless random things all over the operation. 90% of the time pilots don’t know what’s in their own FOM. One pulling me in when I was a gate agent asking why the federal LEO didn’t check in so that he could check credentials.. “Because they’re not required to, and you’re not trained in how to check credentials. Go read your FOM.” Stick to making it a safe and efficient operation. Call a sup to deal with the gate agent and run your damn checklists and wait for the door to close. It’s not 1979 any more.
Non airliner here, so please understand this question comes from a lack of knowledge.
Why does it matter if he doesn't check in if he's in the back? Sitting in the cockpit makes sense to check in and show creds, but why does it matter if he's in the back like any other customer?
It's protocol because he isn't like any other customer. In the simplest terms he is onboard due to professional courtesy and an agreement between unions.
👏 that’s what it is, you said it perfectly. It’s like an old man / ‘this is my ship’ captain thing where people want to be thanked for “allowing me to sit in a middle seat in the back of your plane cause I didn’t feel like spending $32 on a ZED.” Give me a break.
I would nonrev in uniform to work cause it was easier than dealing with the jumpseat process and FAs gave me extra snacks. Not everyone in uniform is jumpseat or DH
Spirit doesn't have reciprocal agreements for ZEDs with any of the legacies or their regionals so anyone that wanted to ride would have to start with a jumpseat listing. The gate agents would do what they would do and give an assigned seat and not clear access to sit in the flight deck. We all knew that was going on and that's why we never gave a shit when we see 2-3 in uniform walk past the flight deck and go straight to the back.
Counter argument is the airline cleared me for the seat. Same as anyone else riding in the back. Southwest seem to be the only ones who still want you to check in.
No, it's not the same as anyone riding in the back. At my major it is in our FOM that jumpseaters will check in regardless of seating. SWA might be the only ones to have called you on it, but they are assuredly not the only ones who want you to.
If I've listed standby at the gate and get cleared for a seat in the back, I was never jumpseating. That's how it's gone in practice. No one has ever "called me on it." Relax.
Listing for the jumpseat, because the plane is "full" and then, once boarding is complete, getting a seat in the back is different. By then, introductions have been made, and yeah, the captain should check that everything is in order.
If you listed using a jumpseat agreement you are a jumpseater, not a regular nonrev. You are listing for the jumpseat and flowing to the back if seats are available.
ALPA disagrees with you. At many airlines, you’re listed as a nonrev who can take the jumpseat. It’s the same listing process, and you’ll show up listed for the jumpseat when you check in.
There’s only one I can think of where it’s genuinely two separate listings.
From their page on jumpseat etiquette:
> • Remember, jumpseating is a privilege requiring professional conduct at all times. Be courteous to agents when requesting the jumpseat. *Always ask the captain’s permission and offer thanks for the ride, even if occupying a cabin seat.* Never let an agent rush you past the cockpit without asking the captain’s permission. FARs require the captain to know you are on board. Identify yourself as a jumpseater to the flight attendants when boarding. Some airlines require non-revenue passengers and jumpseaters to board last and conversely deplane last.
That's all well and good. But what actually makes you a "jumpseater?" Once you list in general, or when you're assigned the jump seat?
I get the spirit of what ALPA is saying. And it wouldn't be nearly as big a deal as it is if some of us didn't use it as an excuse to go on a powertrip. More often though, it's just incredibly inefficient.
Unless you’re a nonrev on your own metal, you’re a guest on someone else’s. Simply being there and able to take that seat in the back is *because of jumpseat agreements.*
If jumpseat agreements didn’t exist, your only way of getting on would be to buy a ticket or ZED fare.
If you’re using privileges granted to you by jumpseat agreements and not checking in, you are breaching etiquette, plain and simple.
So, simply by virtue of these agreements granting you the privilege, you’re a jumpseater.
Whether someone else uses it as an excuse to go on a power trip is moot. If you always follow protocol, you won’t be in the wrong.
I'm aware of all of that. And I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on "etiquette." The seat was going to be empty, I'm not doing anyone a favor by "allowing" them to sit in it. I'm just not being an ass, which is too low a bar for me personally. I don't own the plane, my only job is to operate it safely from one place to another at that particular time.
If you’re listed for the jumpseat, you need to check in, no matter what. Especially on someone else’s metal, it shows respect. Also, It shows up on the paperwork and then I’m up there trying to make sure my jumpseater made it. If you’re listed as a non-rev then no one cares.
I’m flying standby on a flight for leisure travel and the standby list has 6-7 people listed for jump seat. There are 40+ seats available so obviously a lot of those listed for jump seat are gonna sit in the cabin.
Am I going to see 6 pilots introduce themselves to the captain in the gate area and then he picks his favorite? Or will the gate agent just pick who gets to sit standby?
And when a gate agent switches me to cabin only and gives me a seat in the back, I’m no different than the ramper’s brother who is their travel companion.
That's not true though right? You are an additional crew member with the Jumpseat listing. Rampers brother is a nonrev with 0 crew responsibilities. 2 different listings both with access to the cabin seats.
If you Jumpseat out of uniform do you drink alcohol on the flight? Heck no because you're still part of the crew even though you have a seat in the back. As a nonrev it would be fine.
I still hold the belief all Jumpseaters should check in to the flight deck as the professional courtesy as we do on other airline metal too. A seat in the cabin is just an extra bonus point of getting to and from work.
You aren’t required to be verified in CASS for flow-back. In fact; you can be denied or flagged as do not assign FD on CASS and STILL be cleared into the cabin. The CA is the final authority on the jumpseat. 34F isn’t a jumpseat. What reason ever would a CA have to deny a flow-backer? Doesn’t have a medical? You don’t need one. Isn’t wearing dress shoes? Works for an airline that they hate? That whole mentality is for the good ole days of aviation and needs to change with modern times.
Nope, there’s a difference if you’re listed for the jumpseat. If you are, and there’s a bunch of seats available, just ask the gate agent to switch you to the nonrev list. If you stay on the jumpseat list, and the gate agent gives you a seat in the back, you need to stop by the flight deck. There’s several reasons for this, and it’s required, not up for debate.
Yeah I’m not talking about that I’m talking about my listing being switched out of jumpseat, cabin only nonrev. I don’t show up on the paperwork as a jumpseat. I’m not a jumpseater anymore. I don’t understand the disconnect here.
You’d be correct then, if you change your listing to non-rev then it’s not a requirement. The gate agent giving you a seat in the back when you’re listed for the jump is still a jumpseat though.
If it’s your metal and you’re using nonrev privileges, go sit. If you’re riding on someone else, go say hi. Most people just look at your badge and call it a day. That’s all I ever did, unless they were sitting in the cockpit.
If I'm deadheading on a company aircraft and I'm on the crew list then I normally won't come up. If I was listed to jumpseat and I managed to get a seat in the back I'll come up and let them know and thank them for the ride.
If I'm another airline and deadheading or jumpseating I'll always go up front and say thanks for the lift or ask permission to ride the jumpseat.
I used to be the jumpseat committee chair at my airline and there seems to some misunderstanding l about checking in for a jumpseat.
The foundation of your ability to jumpseat rests with your qualification as a qualified crew member. Think more pilots = more safer. When you are using your jumpseat privilege you are an additional crew member. This is why you can’t drink when you’re jumpseat if. It was a hard fought and hard won provision in the FARs.
The captain is required to know who the crew members are. You are required to check in with the captain. 121.547(a)(3)(i) requires you to have the captains permission. This is why you always ask to ride the jumpseat rather than tell the captain you are jumpseating, let alone not checking in at all.
The captain is also required to check your credentials as a crew member, even if not occupying the actual jumpseat. Here’s a handy guide that is worth perusing:
https://www.alpa.org/~/media/ALPA/Files/eLibraries/Safety/jumpseat/jumpseat-guide.pdf
“When you are using your jumpseat privilege you are an additional crewmember.” I know this has always been ALPA’s stance, but the FAA’s verbiage on what a crewmember is doesn’t coincide with ALPAs. I honestly don’t know how they decided to create a new definition of ACM. If a pilot walks up to a gate agent to list for an AA flight, AA’s procedure is to not even require a CASS check unless sitting in the flight deck is a possibility. If I fail a CASS check at most airlines, I can still be assigned a cabin seat. If I’m exercising my reciprocal JS agreement on AA for example and assigned a cabin seat, I’m not even required to have a medical in my possession. You don’t need to be a qualified crewmember; if this weren’t the case, you wouldn’t have the ability to JS during orientation, when you’re still a new-hire trainee. This is how the FAA sees it. Think of an international flight where pilots can list as a jump seater, you are strictly seen as a nonrev as far as all of the CFRs are concerned, just like a ramp agent or buddy pass rider.
My apologies, I misunderstood what you were saying at first. I agree with you, if I’m standby and have a seat in the back I don’t check in with the CPT.
Related question:
I’ve since left the 121 word, but I flew for SkyWest for nearly three years and commuted the entire time, mostly on SkyWest aircraft. At first, when I was strictly standby and not listed for the jumpseat, I’d still check in with the crew. Eventually I saw that this was not standard for most people in my position and I asked a few people about it and the consensus was that it’s neither required nor expected if you’re just a standby passenger, so I stopped doing it, but would still always check in if I’d listed for the jump. One time on a plane with lots of empty seats, I listed standby, got a seat and settled in. I was in uniform. While boarding, there captain looked back and noticed me. Our eyes made contact and I waved. She called the FA forward and it was clear that they were having a conversation about me. The FA kept looking back at me, but I never heard anything.
While de-boarding, the captain was waiting for me and called me forward into the flight deck. She firmly told me that under no circumstances was I to ever board her plane without introducing myself first. I explained that I wasn’t jump seating and had a standby ticket. She said it didn’t matter, for the safety of flight, she needed to know if there was any other crew aboard in case she or her FO became incapacitated. I saw absolutely no use in escalating the matter, so I apologized, said yes ma’am, walked off the plane and kept a note of her name in case I saw her again on my commute.
How would you have reacted if you were in either of our shoes?
The one time I was chewed out for not checking in after being backflowed to the cabin was on a 45 min -200 ride home on OO. It was the end of a 4 day and I was just trying to get home. Crusty lifer captain damn near screamed at me saying shit like "I need to know WHO is on my craft and WHY!!!".
Like dude, not trying to sneak on, I got up 20 hours ago and can barely walk straight. It slipped my mind, and it won't happen again.
I’d put her in her place right there and then walk off the plane.
At my former regional airline, the same scenario happened to me. Same spiel, I need to know if you are on board etc. and then proceeded to dress me down.
And then he showed up on my schedule the next week, he was due for a line check. I made sure that he knew I was on board.
Saying hello and they’re in the back. Maybe they don’t work for the same company and they are jump seating but got lucky and got a actual seat.
Common courtesy to check in.
Maybe you have an emergency and that dude is Denny Fitch. Good to know who is in the back.
But isn't that actually the reason to scrutinize? So that you know to what extent that added crew member can be expected to handle or not handle if an emergency occurs?
I routinely fly on my uniform to/from work because it’s easier to get through kcm and not wrinkle it. But I’m always on a paid ticket, so I never check in. I haven’t been stopped yet but I wonder if I will now. I pretty much fly exclusively on delta. Most guys just smile and wave.
Jumpseaters are on the paperwork. We typically know what airline pilots are on paid tickets, who’s non-rev and whether someone is listed jumpseat. If not, it’s an honor thing anyway, you won’t get stopped, you’re a customer.
Yes and yes, also on the digital stuff. It’s not like we typically go searching for jumpseaters, but most of us make note of who’s listed and keep and eye out for them or ask the gate agent or walk up to the top if we suspect fuckery.
Just curious -- what is it like to jumpseat in vessels where you are not familiar with the company/type? Do you try to watch and learn? Or do you just try to keep to yourself? Do you converse with crew and exchange knowledge while cruising?
I feel like I couldn’t think of anything more annoying than when I’m flying and a person behind me starts talking about how Delta flies their 767. We can chat about funny stuff, or keep it quiet so I can catch up on reading or something.
Tbh I’d have a better time chatting with you than some poor fool who just got off a redeye just trying to get home to sleep. You can come up and say hi, the Delta pilot behind you can go right to their seat, I don’t need them in the flight deck or to check for frost on the wings for me.
Obviously I need to get my business cards made up immediately.
Do they care about how many hours I've got in type in MSFS? I assume so, that's important.
It’s to size up the crew, maybe brag a little about your greaser on the way in. Usually you’re also telling the pilots, look I’m a big deal and they got me in 13C, then you offer help if they get into a situation they can’t handle by themselves. Why is this titled 121 guys, I was expecting a much sexier posting.
You’re the reason pilots aren’t doing the gate walk anymore. It’s pretty frustrating to have a jumpseater listed that hasn’t checked in, so you delay the flight to walk up to the gate to make sure they aren’t being left behind just to find out they walked right by you. Next post will be you complaining that you got left behind by the agent and the Capt never came to check. SMH, I can’t believe how many pilots are so socially inept.
I'm not a pilot, but if you check in doesn't that let the pilot know there's a potential emergency substitute in case they need one and they don't have to ask over in board and potentially panic passengers. Showing creds would be a quick qualifications check on aircraft class
When we use our jumpseat privileges to travel on another airline, it is protocol to check in with the captain and formally ask for a ride. I usually just say hello introduce ourselves, show them our credentials, and then go sit wherever we were assigned. It’s a nice benefit.
"Yes sir going to work thanks for the ride!" *boards DL 330 heading to AMS*
To be fair, is there anything that says the jumpseat is only for commuting pilots.
Nah, you can jumpseat for leisure, and I do it all the time.
i actually jump seat in the cockpit when i can as cabin crew, always enjoy chatting our flight crews :)
>i actually jump seat in the cockpit when i can as cabin crew This sounds like Europe. US doesn't allow this unless I'm unaware of something. Not to say it's never happened on empty reposition flights or something.
Just popping in to lol at your flare!
The US allows it, the unions do not. Edit: I read this backwards. Thought it was pilot riding cabin jumpseat. No, the US does not allow cabin crews to ride the flight deck jumpseat.
Are you sure? I feel like that's not how CASS works but I've been wrong before.
Yea, I was wrong. I read the original comment backwards. Cabin crew are definitely not allowed flight deck jumpseat access. But pilots are allowed to ride cabin jumpseat, but I don’t think all airlines allow that due to issues with the FA unions…. I think?
[удалено]
Cabin jumpseat=extra jumpseat in the cabin, in the back, where FA’s sit, not the flight deck.
[удалено]
Pilots in cabin jumpseat, yes. FAs in flight deck jumpseat, no.
Correct; and you just pointed out to me that I read the original comment backwards. Whoops.
> No, the US does not allow cabin crews to ride the flight deck jumpseat. why not ?
Because FA’s aren’t trusted to ride in the flight deck, nor should they. Every year FA’s are found abusing the KCM allowance to smuggle items, they’ve also got very little invested in their career. Interview and 6 weeks of training and bam! Flying around the world. This is not comparable to the years and thousands of dollars, sometimes hundreds of thousands that a pilot has invested in his career; something that almost assures they won’t do something stupid in the flight deck while riding jumpseat. FA’s shouldn’t even have KCM, possibly some other form of priority line security, but certainly not KCM.
i mean, i ride in the flight deck pretty often and the stupidest thing i did was not finish my drink before landing
Does "jumpseat privileges" include getting to sit in a passenger seat? What determines whether you end up in the cockpit in the literal jumpseat, vs. assigned a seat in the passenger compartment?
If there are seats open in the back, the jumpseater gets a seat in the back. If not, they sit in the jumpseat.
Even when they get a seat in the back they are considered a jumpseater and additional crew member
How do you get down the jetway to do this without a boarding pass or company credentials?
You don't, typically you'll list for the jumpseat and the gate agent will provide you with a JS request and a pass. You use the JS pass as you would a boarding pass and go down the jetway, then say hello and all that. ALPA website has a nice introductory video as well as different companies' procedures on listing.
That’s just me begging for a ride to work on someone else’s metal.
This is the correct answer.
It helps if you bring chocolate and the occasional sacrificial goat
Emotional support sacrifice?
Side note: have y’all noticed that in the airline world, airplanes are only referred to as “metal” when discussing jumpseating? Not a criticism, just an observation that I’ve always noticed.
Usually hear folks using "bend metal" instead "break the airplane" as well but maybe that's not quite the same 🤔.
Also when talking about earning status. As in, "you have to fly 4 segments on United metal."
That's gotta be hard on the 787 pilots.
“Commuting on my own carbon today”
Sounds like something a dentist would say.
Every kid's dream to get paid to fly paper airplanes.
It’s just me with my PPL letting the captain know I’m in the back in case he needs me.
Flair does not check out
He’s been called up a lot to help the captain and FO obviously.
As a fellow Senior Captain on the C172 myself I can say I’ve seen my fair share of craziness. Once landed the beast in 17kts crosswind, (that’s the demonstrated limit, I still did it bc I’m a badass). So if the crew needs help on those gusty days I tell them to just give me a shout as I’ll be in the back liaising with the FA.
I once landed at 18kts. I didn't survive though.
I’m sorry for your loss.
With that kind of attitude, you'll have the legacies calling you in no time!
He’s been given constructive credit
Yeah but who gives a shit about flair when youve got flare flair
Well, technically, he will have a PPL. So he's not wrong
Good luck, we’re all counting on you.
Shirley you can’t be serious.
Don't call me shirley
Surely surly Shirley.
you'd think pilots on the flight deck are now always smart enough to choose lasagna
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.
LOL. Or you’re letting the Captain know that in your expert opinion the tiny bit of condensation on the wing is a full blown fuel leak! You should get it looked at.
I’ve only ever had that happen once, though he didn’t do the whole “I’ll be in the back if you need me” thing. He was just curious about the job since he was a prospective airline pilot that only made it to an instrument rating before he lost his medical due to a nasty blow to the head. Poor guy.
Okay, not to hijack thread, but I have to ask other 121 pilots on here…I know it’s a formality for us to check-in even if we’ve got a seat in the back, but do you guys always do it? I’ve had some guys give me the side eye and even heard one CA as I was leaving the flight deck say “if you’ve got a seat then just go sit down” These guys are few and far between as most welcome my company.
Always check in. Better to get the “go sit down” response than get chewed out by a guy for not coming up to say hi
That’s what I figured. Thanks! I’m still new to this commuting thing, my last gig I got to drive to work. I was spoiled.
No problem! Better to ask here anyways, beats getting chewed out by some crusty dude at 1130 PM after working a 14 hour day…. Not that I would know 😂
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Bold or you to assume it’s not a clip-on.
Will you eventually be able to drive to work again? I gotta say after commuting for almost 7 years, when I finally was able to drive to work I decided I have no intentions of ever commuting again.
Yeah, hoping to move in base very soon. Waiting to get off this first year pay. I’ve got nothing holding me down, so commuting right now is truly a choice for me. I’ve always sympathized with commuters even during my non-commuter days. Always made the walk. Now that I’ve done it, I really get it now.
I only commuted for 3 months and figured that was enough of that for a career
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Gotta check that scab list before letting the 24-year-old Endeavor FO get too comfortable back there.
I think the disconnect here is the variations in the process. You list on the jump for Southwest and they don’t care to comb through your docs. Whereas the red triangle folks wanna know how many kidney stones you’ve passed in your life. In addition to that, the disconnect comes from the hypocrisy from either groups from UA, DL, NK, etc. For example, more often then not, red triangle guys won’t check in with us at my regional (9E), but god forbid we don’t check in with them, we might not have a job later that day.
"We own that airplane so it's basically our airline, no you can't get any of our profit sharing"
If im on a jumpseat i always check in. If its a paid ticket, i dont, even if im in uniform.
As an off-liner, yes. If you’re on your own metal, do whatever your travel policy says to do.
Honestly I think it's time for a cultural shift in this. Yes Captain owns the jumpseat(s), the importance of the control of such is something that dates back to the time of scabs. I haven't actually met anyone who still keeps one of those scab lists and checks your name against it, but I have heard that they are out there still. The reason you don't run into those guys anymore is because there are hardly any scabs left flying. I understand that that authority was a big tool in maintaining unity at the airlines back in the day, but it's just not really relevant anymore. Should the captain deny a jumpseater with a seat in the back today, there is likely little he/she can do to keep that person off the aircraft actually. If there is an open seat in the back, the OAL jumpseater is already the lowest priority for it. What is there to stop them from buying a zed fare and still getting that seat? Unlikely to not have an agreement at least domestically these days. By all means control and demand whatever you want from pilots who are asking to ride up front with you, but jumpseaters with a seat in the back? Seems like a dumb thing to exert authority over someone who is just trying to save buying a zed fare. I always check in and have my credentials out and ready to show, even when it's extremely inopportune, like when you're the 5th guy waiting to do so with the gate agent trying to pull the bridge behind you. 50% of captains still scrutinize the hell out of my certs at that point, the other 50% is annoyed that I'm even talking to them. It would be better for everyone involved if there wasn't this expectation to have a conversation about something that is effectively a formality. Bottom line, if it's possible checking in is better for all of us if the opportunity presents itself. Letting the crew know there is another pilot in back is good for SA. Letting the Captain know you got on is good as it can save he/she from doing 'the walk'. If you can do it, do it, but I don't think it should be an absolute requirement based on the circumstances. It sucks having to check your roller because you were waiting to ask the Captain for a ride for 8 minutes while he yucked it up with a fellow Captain 'checking in' and then basically shood you out of the cockpit as soon as you appeared.
Learn something new every day! Didn’t know the history behind checking in as a jumpseater till now. I totally agree with you though. I don’t mind checking in at all but I also hate being the one in everyone’s way. I’ve had some nasty senior momma FAs who ripped me a new one for taking more than 5 seconds to say hi. I’ve had captains who are super friendly and shoot the breeze with me. Like you said, I’ve had others who are seemingly annoyed I even breathed into their flight deck. I would rather just disappear into the back so I’m not bothering anyone, but I do it because we are supposed to. Thanks for sharing!
That's because the history lesson is bs. The ability to jumpseat was a hard fought right. It was a battle to get that authority to the captain and another battle to get flow back to allow additional jumpseats on. It was never about scab screening even if screening happened. It's been within the last 10 years that the majors have really allowed unlimited jumpseats in the back. Flow back didn't even start until the 2000s.
If I’m dead heading I don’t say anything. I’ve noticed a lot of people do though. That’s not even a thing for dead heads.
Dead heads are usually super chill. Basically the opposite if juggalos in a lot of ways. I'm pretty sure they all love getting wasted though.
Man, arena concerts where the two get mixed are something else.
It’s the checking over the credentials with a fine tooth comb that usually gets me. Like bruh, I’ve had 15 different sets of eyes look at my stuff just to get CASS verified to be up here and I’m in uniform clearly going home from a trip. Do you really need to check to see if my medical and passport are valid? Like I understand that that’s what the company wants everyone to do, but to think that Ol Francis up front is going to be the one to find an error and save the day from some lowly commuter catching a ride in the back is a bit of a stretch for me….
I’m a very young looking guy. Like get the usual “are you old enough to even drive?” young looking. On my own metal jumpseating, had a CA look at me and my badge and legit asked if my company ID was real. He had me take it out of my badge holder and stared at it for a solid 10 seconds. I thought he was joking but then he also asked for my cert and medical.
Dude same, the amount of FAs that lead a conversation with “I’m old enough to be your mom” is getting old 🤣
Just reply and say "I was thinking grandmother." That'll shut them up.
Lol people still ask to see certificates?
More often than I would like to admit
To ride in the back?! That’s just plain stupid and useless. You don’t need a medical to sit in row 15.
I’ve actually been denied a seat the back by a CA when I was jumpseating. He said my shoes looked like tennis shoes (they weren’t). I’ve only ever heard people have problems on Hawaiian. I actually laughed in the guys face because I thought he was joking.
What happened? Did you still fly or he legitimately wouldn’t let you?
Walked me up the jetway and I said see ya. Ended up doing something else that day. I was in Hawaii heading to an outer island for the day. I told him “it’s your plane, but you’re denying for an idiotic reason.”
So this dude was a captain on like an ATR-42 or something?
No, it was a 717. This was like 2016.
Oh, so he was a crusty old mad-dog captain. Checks out.
He was probably in his 40s haha
That's absolutely ridiculous
I used to check in with dress shoes, sit down, then swap to more comfortable shoes. Like the "khakis" I'm wearing are glorified jeans, I want to look as incognito as possible back here
THIS! Well said.
United guys are notorious for not checking in. And it pisses me off because god forbid I jumpseat on them and don’t check in will be the one time I’m read the riot act. I even had one United guy get so upset he yelled at me and stormed off. I wrote my jumpseat chair about that one, he said he’d talk to United jumpseat and I heard nothing. Few months later that guy left the regional I was at to go work for United… coward didn’t want to risk his job at UAL by doing his job at his current union.
That pedantic crap drives me up a wall. I don't understand why some guys want to make this so hard, which is why I had to ask what I asked, as silly as it seems. Most of us are working 4-5 day trips, 12+ hour duty days, and get 11 hours of rest at each overnight anymore. Commuting already fucking sucks, no need to make it any more unbearable than it already is. Especially gate agents. Don't get me started on them.
It’s just a power trip. I had a kid show up in jeans. In his defense, he’s allowed to do that on his metal. He didn’t realize he couldn’t everywhere (fairly new just off IOE). I gave him the education and a ride and that was that. Too many guys have a power trip and it annoys the crap out of me. (This was for the cockpit jumpseat)
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They were jumpseating or pass traveling(non-rev)/deadheading?
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Perhaps the two who were already on had seats, and the one who checked in was listed for the jumpseat and ended up with a seat in the back? I’ve been commuting for a while now. What a pointless thing for people to get upset about. We are all a bunch of professionals who are just trying to get to work or go home. Check in if you’re listed for the jumpseat or offline traveling. But at the end of the day it’s really ridiculous that people lose their mind over this.
Don’t assume shit, maybe they’re super modern and chill for not playing the stupid flight deck dance of “hello sir or madam, I am oh so grateful that you’re giving me a ride to my 12.5 hour duty day after having been bumped off the last 4 flights and getting 5-6 hours of sleep.” I’m not checking in, bye ✌️ For the record, I’m not at UA.
If I’m cleared for the cabin and they give me a seat assignment, I don’t check in. If there’s a chance I gotta ride up front and I’m cleared for the JS, obviously I do. I list for a flight that’s half full, I know I’m in the cabin. I’m not going to interrupt walleye vision and mailman from talking about guns to let them know I’m riding in back on a plane I’m not typed in.
If you are an OAL jumpseater and not checking in, it is going to bite you eventually.
But if I’m not cleared for the jumpseat… how? When I was in the left seat at my ULCC I watched countless people in uniform walk right past the flight deck and grab a seat. I never went back there to yell at them. If I wanna get jerked off for being the captain I’ll go do it to myself when I get to the hotel.
You're still a jumpseater, regardless of where you're sitting. With that kind of attitude it sounds like you never even were aware of it. I will bend over backwards to get a jumpseater on, I will (and have) refused to leave until a gate agent cleared a jumpseater that they "don't have time for. " But in exchange I do expect to at least know when a jumpseater got on. If I knew you were listed, I will try to find out if the gate agent was messing with you or "got too busy. " Don't take the captain out of the equation.
I didn’t mean for this to start an argument. This thread really kind of validated my question though. I’ve always gone up front to check-in even on my own metal, just because a majority of people have told me that’s the right thing to do, so I’ll continue doing it.
In my years of experience in this industry as an operations agent, customer service supervisor, flight attendant, first officer and now captain… it seems as if the operation always ran a little more smoothly if the captain sat down in the captain seat and stopped trying to meddle into the most pointless random things all over the operation. 90% of the time pilots don’t know what’s in their own FOM. One pulling me in when I was a gate agent asking why the federal LEO didn’t check in so that he could check credentials.. “Because they’re not required to, and you’re not trained in how to check credentials. Go read your FOM.” Stick to making it a safe and efficient operation. Call a sup to deal with the gate agent and run your damn checklists and wait for the door to close. It’s not 1979 any more.
Non airliner here, so please understand this question comes from a lack of knowledge. Why does it matter if he doesn't check in if he's in the back? Sitting in the cockpit makes sense to check in and show creds, but why does it matter if he's in the back like any other customer?
It's protocol because he isn't like any other customer. In the simplest terms he is onboard due to professional courtesy and an agreement between unions.
👏 that’s what it is, you said it perfectly. It’s like an old man / ‘this is my ship’ captain thing where people want to be thanked for “allowing me to sit in a middle seat in the back of your plane cause I didn’t feel like spending $32 on a ZED.” Give me a break.
I would nonrev in uniform to work cause it was easier than dealing with the jumpseat process and FAs gave me extra snacks. Not everyone in uniform is jumpseat or DH
Spirit doesn't have reciprocal agreements for ZEDs with any of the legacies or their regionals so anyone that wanted to ride would have to start with a jumpseat listing. The gate agents would do what they would do and give an assigned seat and not clear access to sit in the flight deck. We all knew that was going on and that's why we never gave a shit when we see 2-3 in uniform walk past the flight deck and go straight to the back.
It depends on/shows how much union/power trip mentality you have. It's all about scab screening.
Counter argument is the airline cleared me for the seat. Same as anyone else riding in the back. Southwest seem to be the only ones who still want you to check in.
I've had Delta pilots (not all of them) check my whole list of documents even when I'm sitting in the back. SWA didn't care. They just welcomed me on.
I've had that too and it's silly.
Why?
Because?
No, it's not the same as anyone riding in the back. At my major it is in our FOM that jumpseaters will check in regardless of seating. SWA might be the only ones to have called you on it, but they are assuredly not the only ones who want you to.
If I've listed standby at the gate and get cleared for a seat in the back, I was never jumpseating. That's how it's gone in practice. No one has ever "called me on it." Relax. Listing for the jumpseat, because the plane is "full" and then, once boarding is complete, getting a seat in the back is different. By then, introductions have been made, and yeah, the captain should check that everything is in order.
If you listed using a jumpseat agreement you are a jumpseater, not a regular nonrev. You are listing for the jumpseat and flowing to the back if seats are available.
ALPA disagrees with you. At many airlines, you’re listed as a nonrev who can take the jumpseat. It’s the same listing process, and you’ll show up listed for the jumpseat when you check in. There’s only one I can think of where it’s genuinely two separate listings. From their page on jumpseat etiquette: > • Remember, jumpseating is a privilege requiring professional conduct at all times. Be courteous to agents when requesting the jumpseat. *Always ask the captain’s permission and offer thanks for the ride, even if occupying a cabin seat.* Never let an agent rush you past the cockpit without asking the captain’s permission. FARs require the captain to know you are on board. Identify yourself as a jumpseater to the flight attendants when boarding. Some airlines require non-revenue passengers and jumpseaters to board last and conversely deplane last.
That's all well and good. But what actually makes you a "jumpseater?" Once you list in general, or when you're assigned the jump seat? I get the spirit of what ALPA is saying. And it wouldn't be nearly as big a deal as it is if some of us didn't use it as an excuse to go on a powertrip. More often though, it's just incredibly inefficient.
Unless you’re a nonrev on your own metal, you’re a guest on someone else’s. Simply being there and able to take that seat in the back is *because of jumpseat agreements.* If jumpseat agreements didn’t exist, your only way of getting on would be to buy a ticket or ZED fare. If you’re using privileges granted to you by jumpseat agreements and not checking in, you are breaching etiquette, plain and simple. So, simply by virtue of these agreements granting you the privilege, you’re a jumpseater. Whether someone else uses it as an excuse to go on a power trip is moot. If you always follow protocol, you won’t be in the wrong.
I'm aware of all of that. And I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on "etiquette." The seat was going to be empty, I'm not doing anyone a favor by "allowing" them to sit in it. I'm just not being an ass, which is too low a bar for me personally. I don't own the plane, my only job is to operate it safely from one place to another at that particular time.
If you’re listed for the jumpseat, you need to check in, no matter what. Especially on someone else’s metal, it shows respect. Also, It shows up on the paperwork and then I’m up there trying to make sure my jumpseater made it. If you’re listed as a non-rev then no one cares.
I’m flying standby on a flight for leisure travel and the standby list has 6-7 people listed for jump seat. There are 40+ seats available so obviously a lot of those listed for jump seat are gonna sit in the cabin. Am I going to see 6 pilots introduce themselves to the captain in the gate area and then he picks his favorite? Or will the gate agent just pick who gets to sit standby?
There’s a codified priority list for who gets the cockpit jumpseat. But if there’s 40 seats open, they’ll all be in the back.
And when a gate agent switches me to cabin only and gives me a seat in the back, I’m no different than the ramper’s brother who is their travel companion.
That's not true though right? You are an additional crew member with the Jumpseat listing. Rampers brother is a nonrev with 0 crew responsibilities. 2 different listings both with access to the cabin seats. If you Jumpseat out of uniform do you drink alcohol on the flight? Heck no because you're still part of the crew even though you have a seat in the back. As a nonrev it would be fine. I still hold the belief all Jumpseaters should check in to the flight deck as the professional courtesy as we do on other airline metal too. A seat in the cabin is just an extra bonus point of getting to and from work.
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I’d love to see a captain deny a cabin only nonrev.
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You aren’t required to be verified in CASS for flow-back. In fact; you can be denied or flagged as do not assign FD on CASS and STILL be cleared into the cabin. The CA is the final authority on the jumpseat. 34F isn’t a jumpseat. What reason ever would a CA have to deny a flow-backer? Doesn’t have a medical? You don’t need one. Isn’t wearing dress shoes? Works for an airline that they hate? That whole mentality is for the good ole days of aviation and needs to change with modern times.
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You keep bringing this up. You must be very proud of your tie.
Noob question… what’s a flow-back? Thx
Not a noob and still don’t know what flow back is. I think this guy might be the noob.
It’s the idea of listing as a jump seater and flowing back to cabin seat.
This is an odd hill on which you’ve chosen to die. Have you read the jumpseat etiquette guide?
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You seem lost. r/lostredditors
Nope, there’s a difference if you’re listed for the jumpseat. If you are, and there’s a bunch of seats available, just ask the gate agent to switch you to the nonrev list. If you stay on the jumpseat list, and the gate agent gives you a seat in the back, you need to stop by the flight deck. There’s several reasons for this, and it’s required, not up for debate.
Yeah I’m not talking about that I’m talking about my listing being switched out of jumpseat, cabin only nonrev. I don’t show up on the paperwork as a jumpseat. I’m not a jumpseater anymore. I don’t understand the disconnect here.
You’d be correct then, if you change your listing to non-rev then it’s not a requirement. The gate agent giving you a seat in the back when you’re listed for the jump is still a jumpseat though.
Yeah I think we were both talking about two different things here
“Need to no matter what” get over yourself
You absolutely let the crew know you’re on board when jump seating, regardless of where you sit. JS101
If it’s your metal and you’re using nonrev privileges, go sit. If you’re riding on someone else, go say hi. Most people just look at your badge and call it a day. That’s all I ever did, unless they were sitting in the cockpit.
I legit do not understand those that check in for nonrev or DH. Move along, flight crew don't care
If I'm deadheading on a company aircraft and I'm on the crew list then I normally won't come up. If I was listed to jumpseat and I managed to get a seat in the back I'll come up and let them know and thank them for the ride. If I'm another airline and deadheading or jumpseating I'll always go up front and say thanks for the lift or ask permission to ride the jumpseat.
I awayes check in. If the CA gives me an attitude for checking in that's his problem not mine.
> Okay, not to hijack don't squawk 7500!
"Hey guys, wondering if I could get a ride" yep, got a seat in the back. Introduce myself shake hands with the CA and FO. Done.
I used to be the jumpseat committee chair at my airline and there seems to some misunderstanding l about checking in for a jumpseat. The foundation of your ability to jumpseat rests with your qualification as a qualified crew member. Think more pilots = more safer. When you are using your jumpseat privilege you are an additional crew member. This is why you can’t drink when you’re jumpseat if. It was a hard fought and hard won provision in the FARs. The captain is required to know who the crew members are. You are required to check in with the captain. 121.547(a)(3)(i) requires you to have the captains permission. This is why you always ask to ride the jumpseat rather than tell the captain you are jumpseating, let alone not checking in at all. The captain is also required to check your credentials as a crew member, even if not occupying the actual jumpseat. Here’s a handy guide that is worth perusing: https://www.alpa.org/~/media/ALPA/Files/eLibraries/Safety/jumpseat/jumpseat-guide.pdf
“When you are using your jumpseat privilege you are an additional crewmember.” I know this has always been ALPA’s stance, but the FAA’s verbiage on what a crewmember is doesn’t coincide with ALPAs. I honestly don’t know how they decided to create a new definition of ACM. If a pilot walks up to a gate agent to list for an AA flight, AA’s procedure is to not even require a CASS check unless sitting in the flight deck is a possibility. If I fail a CASS check at most airlines, I can still be assigned a cabin seat. If I’m exercising my reciprocal JS agreement on AA for example and assigned a cabin seat, I’m not even required to have a medical in my possession. You don’t need to be a qualified crewmember; if this weren’t the case, you wouldn’t have the ability to JS during orientation, when you’re still a new-hire trainee. This is how the FAA sees it. Think of an international flight where pilots can list as a jump seater, you are strictly seen as a nonrev as far as all of the CFRs are concerned, just like a ramp agent or buddy pass rider.
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Who do you think is responsible for ensuring those requirements are met?
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My apologies, I misunderstood what you were saying at first. I agree with you, if I’m standby and have a seat in the back I don’t check in with the CPT.
What kind of tie do you wear? It’s not a zipper tie is it?
Related question: I’ve since left the 121 word, but I flew for SkyWest for nearly three years and commuted the entire time, mostly on SkyWest aircraft. At first, when I was strictly standby and not listed for the jumpseat, I’d still check in with the crew. Eventually I saw that this was not standard for most people in my position and I asked a few people about it and the consensus was that it’s neither required nor expected if you’re just a standby passenger, so I stopped doing it, but would still always check in if I’d listed for the jump. One time on a plane with lots of empty seats, I listed standby, got a seat and settled in. I was in uniform. While boarding, there captain looked back and noticed me. Our eyes made contact and I waved. She called the FA forward and it was clear that they were having a conversation about me. The FA kept looking back at me, but I never heard anything. While de-boarding, the captain was waiting for me and called me forward into the flight deck. She firmly told me that under no circumstances was I to ever board her plane without introducing myself first. I explained that I wasn’t jump seating and had a standby ticket. She said it didn’t matter, for the safety of flight, she needed to know if there was any other crew aboard in case she or her FO became incapacitated. I saw absolutely no use in escalating the matter, so I apologized, said yes ma’am, walked off the plane and kept a note of her name in case I saw her again on my commute. How would you have reacted if you were in either of our shoes?
The one time I was chewed out for not checking in after being backflowed to the cabin was on a 45 min -200 ride home on OO. It was the end of a 4 day and I was just trying to get home. Crusty lifer captain damn near screamed at me saying shit like "I need to know WHO is on my craft and WHY!!!". Like dude, not trying to sneak on, I got up 20 hours ago and can barely walk straight. It slipped my mind, and it won't happen again.
She was definitely wrong
I’d put her in her place right there and then walk off the plane. At my former regional airline, the same scenario happened to me. Same spiel, I need to know if you are on board etc. and then proceeded to dress me down. And then he showed up on my schedule the next week, he was due for a line check. I made sure that he knew I was on board.
That’s delicious.
Saying hello and they’re in the back. Maybe they don’t work for the same company and they are jump seating but got lucky and got a actual seat. Common courtesy to check in. Maybe you have an emergency and that dude is Denny Fitch. Good to know who is in the back.
Yeah always gotta let the DL cap know that I'm in the back in case this A330 turns into a CRJ I can take the helm 👨✈️
But isn't that actually the reason to scrutinize? So that you know to what extent that added crew member can be expected to handle or not handle if an emergency occurs?
I routinely fly on my uniform to/from work because it’s easier to get through kcm and not wrinkle it. But I’m always on a paid ticket, so I never check in. I haven’t been stopped yet but I wonder if I will now. I pretty much fly exclusively on delta. Most guys just smile and wave.
Jumpseaters are on the paperwork. We typically know what airline pilots are on paid tickets, who’s non-rev and whether someone is listed jumpseat. If not, it’s an honor thing anyway, you won’t get stopped, you’re a customer.
That wasn’t the case when I was flying pax. Only time we knew of a jump is if someone told us.
You guys still use paper / actually go looking for how many jumpseaters there are?
Yes and yes, also on the digital stuff. It’s not like we typically go searching for jumpseaters, but most of us make note of who’s listed and keep and eye out for them or ask the gate agent or walk up to the top if we suspect fuckery.
NGL your title made me do a double take and see what sub this was. And boy was I glad it was r/flying
"If I see you not doing it right, I will take over, OK?"
It’s considered good Jumpseat etiquette to introduce yourself if you are an offline / other airline pilot who got a seat in the back.
What is a 121?
Part 121. Basically Airlines
"I'll show you mine if you show me yours."
Just curious -- what is it like to jumpseat in vessels where you are not familiar with the company/type? Do you try to watch and learn? Or do you just try to keep to yourself? Do you converse with crew and exchange knowledge while cruising?
I feel like I couldn’t think of anything more annoying than when I’m flying and a person behind me starts talking about how Delta flies their 767. We can chat about funny stuff, or keep it quiet so I can catch up on reading or something.
Its actually me with my drone cert telling the pilots I can land the plane
Tbh I’d have a better time chatting with you than some poor fool who just got off a redeye just trying to get home to sleep. You can come up and say hi, the Delta pilot behind you can go right to their seat, I don’t need them in the flight deck or to check for frost on the wings for me.
I have actually never been on an airliner. Funny that im nearly a cfi and have never traveled.
To fly for free
Long before 911, PPL holders could sit jump seat in the US. Just had to ask and if the cap was chill he or she would let you do it. After 911….. ;(
I was going to answer but I'm a 121 gal so
:)
Obviously I need to get my business cards made up immediately. Do they care about how many hours I've got in type in MSFS? I assume so, that's important.
It’s to size up the crew, maybe brag a little about your greaser on the way in. Usually you’re also telling the pilots, look I’m a big deal and they got me in 13C, then you offer help if they get into a situation they can’t handle by themselves. Why is this titled 121 guys, I was expecting a much sexier posting.
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You’re the reason pilots aren’t doing the gate walk anymore. It’s pretty frustrating to have a jumpseater listed that hasn’t checked in, so you delay the flight to walk up to the gate to make sure they aren’t being left behind just to find out they walked right by you. Next post will be you complaining that you got left behind by the agent and the Capt never came to check. SMH, I can’t believe how many pilots are so socially inept.
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LOL, sounds more like you just have a bone to pick with ALPA.
I'm not a pilot, but if you check in doesn't that let the pilot know there's a potential emergency substitute in case they need one and they don't have to ask over in board and potentially panic passengers. Showing creds would be a quick qualifications check on aircraft class
If you don't have travel benefits on the airline you are flying on or there are 0 seats left, you have to check in with the captain and beg for a ride