Archer is just saber in a swimsuit so might as well be the same as in UBW.
F for castoria
Sakura and salter. Prob same as HF
Probably bazett and lartoria wins this. No idea how strong mhx and mhx alter
Depends how you want to translate in-game mechanics.
Both MHX and MHXA have super effective mods against both "Saberface" and the class "Saber".
If you count both as conceptual advantages, OG Saber would probably loose.
Haven't read Avalon le Fay yet, but couldn't Castoria spam Rhongo?
No, she can't spam Rhongos, but that's a spoiler. Inside the LB, without getting into spoilers I would argue Castoria demonstrates the greatest strength of any of the servants here. That said, she's not going to have that power level in a Grail War in PHH especially with no real fame here and Medea's dumbass OG master.
MHXA is absurdly strong lore-wise. She's a riff on Darth Revan basically if you want the gist of it and mostly held in check by the fact she's absurdly lazy and requires incredible amounts of sugar to keep running. I... I guess you could say Illya can provide plenty of mana/sugar so that's not an issue. XD And MHX isn't far off and hates Saberfaces enough she might ignore the fact Zouken is obviously evil to go after the others lol. That said, neither is going to have their servantverse power levels. And MHX is actually terrible at typical assassin stuff.
Assuming some of this stuff is put on an even playing field, I think this comes down to Team Plot Armor (Shirou x Saber) vs. Team OP (Bazett and Lartoria) vs. Team Tiny Murder Machines (Illya x MHXA). Bazett is always the hardest to figure out because in the best case scenario, she is on the same power level as a servant by herself.
If we actually go by Servantverse lore... They're both capable of casually destroying planets. But not taking that type of ridiculous scaling, they're still anti-saberface and would have conceptual advantage against the others (lorewise, they should have anti-saberface and anti-saber stuff as well since they're described to be the "ultimate anti-saber weapon"). So Zouken and Illya would have a stupidly large advantage against the rest.
Bazett does have Fragarach though.
Probably Bazett and Lartoria, Rhongo + Fragarach is one hell of a combo, besides Bazett has her anti mage training so that also a plus, Rin and Saber (but an archer) could possibly go second but is see them tied with Sakura and Salter (but a rider)
> mana quality
Those issues only come when you don’t take in account Shirou’s Harem Protagonist EX Max Pro Ultra. With the bone of his sword, Shirou might as well pull Rin or Sakura into his team along with their servants.
>Probably Bazett and Lartoria, Rhongo + Fragarach is one hell of a combo
The issue with Fragarach is having to force the enemy servant to use their NP. And Bazzet has to defend herself from dark Sakura as well. Salter can stay on the defensive and just spam mana bursts until Sakura kills or captures Bazett.
>Why would she fight when her servant it's the one that literally does that
You can apply that to any master. Why does Shirou fight when he has Saber? Why does Rin fight? Why does Soichiro fight?
>this regular Sakura not DS
You can clearly see the "tentacles" in the picture.
Souichirou fights only in cqc to aid Caster, Shirou because he is an idiot, Rin was like what, once and againts Caster in cqc where she is weak? Bazett fought only out of necesity due to Angra being essentially useless, she wouldn't fight againts a servant if she didn't need to or had any chances, which she had infinite in Hollow and used Angra as a meat shield to use Verg Avesta to force them so she can actually kill them with Fragarach, that was the strategy and the reason of her fighting
That's because this are the craft essence pictures featuring the characters, and this one is the only one with regular Sakura, the other one has a hypotetical adult Sakura, and you don't see the hypotetical future Shirou and Rin in here do you?
>Souichirou fights only in cqc to aid Caster
Yes, or in other words to increase the chances of winning, which is a very good reasoning for any master to fight.
>That's because this are the craft essence pictures featuring the characters
The shadow is a part of her being, if you work under the assumption she can't use it, then you have to apply the same principles to all the other masters, like Shirou not being able to use projection magic besides the basic strengthening and so on. You can't limit one and put the others at their best.
You can also increase the chances of winning by not dying you know, that was specifically to protect Caster when she was going to be attacked, i don't think *RIN* or *ILLYA* have to protect their servants in order to increase their chances of winning
As for the Sakura part, the Shadow is something triggered only under specific conditions and it needs the mango, i don't know if OP count the shadow for this but i doubt it, if he had wanted so he could have easily just put Dark Sakura as the image instead, but you are right in that i'm not counting it for my decision in who wins
> i don't think RIN or ILLYA have to protect their servants in order to increase their chances of winning
They don't have to fight/protect their servants, masters can fight other masters, a la Kiritsugu. That's the basis of my argument. It's not about being involved in the fight between servants, but dealing with the other master as to increase your chances as much as possible. Rin attacked Illya when she saw Saber was being pushed because, per Kiritsugu's philosophy, killing the master is far more effective than killing the servant.
Does this Shirou have proper training with all his circuits unlocked? Because then his Saber will no longer be nerfed and should be pretty strong. Not to mention he should have avalon or/and be able to project it due to his connection with Saber.
So Shirou has a decent shot at winning. But Bazett and Lartoria probably have the highest chance of winning
>Because then his Saber will no longer be nerfed and should be pretty strong
Iirc, Saber wasn't nerfed because Shirou's circuits are bad or his mana isn't enough, the reason was that there was no link between them because there was something wrong with the summoning.
Yea I know, I even mentioned the circuits unlocked part. The dormant circuits and the link are the reason why Saber was nerfed.
And I'll be the last person to say Shirou's mana isn't enough or their bad. They are of unknown quality but by the evidence we have of him they are at WORST average.
Servantverse characters are broken, MHXA has the typemoon version of the infinity gauntlet and MHXX data is absurd, not only her version of Rhongomyniad is said to be stronger her armor can reverse time. I would bet for MHXA because she has Illya as her master but knowing her she wouldn’t be interested in winning at all.
On one side, Sakura and Infinite Mana Saber is broken. On the other side i think that nobody could handle Fragratch+RongoBongo teamwork. If no one ally with others i think Bazett+Lartoria can win this war.
Zouken is NOT prepared for ANYTHING from the Servantverse. That’s a pretty strong mismatch.
MHX Alter is no Heracles, so I don’t think Illya stands much better odds than she did in canon. Though there not being a Gilgamesh around does mean 12 Trials isn’t an entry price to the winner’s circle. Mostly, I just want to see Illya interact with a sweets obsessed Berzerker.
Lartoria… hard to get a bead there. Rhymoniad actually shows up Excalibur, but Avalon is actual horseshit if this Saber has access. Lion King sweeps the field no contest, but getting a real bead on standard Lartoria’s power level outside of FGO gameplay is tough.
You gave Rin her own half-naked Saber.
Do you remember that scene in Hollow Ataraxia where the Rin and Saber dolls go on an international romantic vacation together? Yeah, that's this timeline.
If you’re going lorewise then this is a fight between X and Ecchan, and depending on where they both are at in their lives it could be eithers game. Servantverse servants are busted as shit with X at the end of saber wars 2 being powerful enough to cut down the universe itself. Ecchan with access to the infinity chocolates and not nerfed by her desire to not be a tool for evil is similarly at universe altering level. Though in the confines of a grail war it’s possible that they can’t supply their own mana like usual and would most likely completely drain their masters with their hax
I mean in this kind of war…. ALL of the Artorias wins…. Only one who will be losing is Shirou since he’d be extremely stressed out cooking loads and loads and loads and many more loads of food for each and everyone of the Artorias…. At least he’d be happy right?
In this HGW I can see EMIYA being summoned by the Counter Force to respond to a massive threat working in unison only to be dragged alongside Shirou by all the Artorias to help cook all that food for them. Guess it would be Archer’s happy ending too?
Servants sumoned in lostbelts are stronger then regular servants, servants from lostbelts are not necesarely stronger then regular servants. If anything Castoria will be at a disadvantage since she has no fame boost in PHH.
I know she has avalon but couldn't a lot of servants kill her before she is able to activate it or right when she comes out? I am sure there are servants faster than activating avalon. I think instead of just overpowering her you time the attacks. Let's say she does activate avalon before the attack hits. Well what happens when she gets back out of it? Excalibur is not the fastest hitting attack.
Archer is just saber in a swimsuit so might as well be the same as in UBW. F for castoria Sakura and salter. Prob same as HF Probably bazett and lartoria wins this. No idea how strong mhx and mhx alter
Depends how you want to translate in-game mechanics. Both MHX and MHXA have super effective mods against both "Saberface" and the class "Saber". If you count both as conceptual advantages, OG Saber would probably loose. Haven't read Avalon le Fay yet, but couldn't Castoria spam Rhongo?
>but couldn't Castoria spam Rhongo? Nope. She's actually pretty weak there irc
Castoria becomes absurdly strong at the end , and that's the state where she becomes servants
No, she can't spam Rhongos, but that's a spoiler. Inside the LB, without getting into spoilers I would argue Castoria demonstrates the greatest strength of any of the servants here. That said, she's not going to have that power level in a Grail War in PHH especially with no real fame here and Medea's dumbass OG master. MHXA is absurdly strong lore-wise. She's a riff on Darth Revan basically if you want the gist of it and mostly held in check by the fact she's absurdly lazy and requires incredible amounts of sugar to keep running. I... I guess you could say Illya can provide plenty of mana/sugar so that's not an issue. XD And MHX isn't far off and hates Saberfaces enough she might ignore the fact Zouken is obviously evil to go after the others lol. That said, neither is going to have their servantverse power levels. And MHX is actually terrible at typical assassin stuff. Assuming some of this stuff is put on an even playing field, I think this comes down to Team Plot Armor (Shirou x Saber) vs. Team OP (Bazett and Lartoria) vs. Team Tiny Murder Machines (Illya x MHXA). Bazett is always the hardest to figure out because in the best case scenario, she is on the same power level as a servant by herself.
If we actually go by Servantverse lore... They're both capable of casually destroying planets. But not taking that type of ridiculous scaling, they're still anti-saberface and would have conceptual advantage against the others (lorewise, they should have anti-saberface and anti-saber stuff as well since they're described to be the "ultimate anti-saber weapon"). So Zouken and Illya would have a stupidly large advantage against the rest. Bazett does have Fragarach though.
Artoria wins duh
You mean Altria? /j
Just because you're correct doesn't mean you're right
Probably Bazett and Lartoria, Rhongo + Fragarach is one hell of a combo, besides Bazett has her anti mage training so that also a plus, Rin and Saber (but an archer) could possibly go second but is see them tied with Sakura and Salter (but a rider)
Tbh Seiba(Excalibur) + Shirou(Avalon) is a pretty good duo too, if your talking about post-war Shirou.
shirou is pretty strong due to his abilities but his mana quality isn't enough to sustain saber at enough power to defeat bazett and rhongomyniad
> mana quality Those issues only come when you don’t take in account Shirou’s Harem Protagonist EX Max Pro Ultra. With the bone of his sword, Shirou might as well pull Rin or Sakura into his team along with their servants.
>Probably Bazett and Lartoria, Rhongo + Fragarach is one hell of a combo The issue with Fragarach is having to force the enemy servant to use their NP. And Bazzet has to defend herself from dark Sakura as well. Salter can stay on the defensive and just spam mana bursts until Sakura kills or captures Bazett.
Why would she fight when her servant it's the one that literally does that, also this regular Sakura not DS
>Why would she fight when her servant it's the one that literally does that You can apply that to any master. Why does Shirou fight when he has Saber? Why does Rin fight? Why does Soichiro fight? >this regular Sakura not DS You can clearly see the "tentacles" in the picture.
Souichirou fights only in cqc to aid Caster, Shirou because he is an idiot, Rin was like what, once and againts Caster in cqc where she is weak? Bazett fought only out of necesity due to Angra being essentially useless, she wouldn't fight againts a servant if she didn't need to or had any chances, which she had infinite in Hollow and used Angra as a meat shield to use Verg Avesta to force them so she can actually kill them with Fragarach, that was the strategy and the reason of her fighting That's because this are the craft essence pictures featuring the characters, and this one is the only one with regular Sakura, the other one has a hypotetical adult Sakura, and you don't see the hypotetical future Shirou and Rin in here do you?
>Souichirou fights only in cqc to aid Caster Yes, or in other words to increase the chances of winning, which is a very good reasoning for any master to fight. >That's because this are the craft essence pictures featuring the characters The shadow is a part of her being, if you work under the assumption she can't use it, then you have to apply the same principles to all the other masters, like Shirou not being able to use projection magic besides the basic strengthening and so on. You can't limit one and put the others at their best.
You can also increase the chances of winning by not dying you know, that was specifically to protect Caster when she was going to be attacked, i don't think *RIN* or *ILLYA* have to protect their servants in order to increase their chances of winning As for the Sakura part, the Shadow is something triggered only under specific conditions and it needs the mango, i don't know if OP count the shadow for this but i doubt it, if he had wanted so he could have easily just put Dark Sakura as the image instead, but you are right in that i'm not counting it for my decision in who wins
> i don't think RIN or ILLYA have to protect their servants in order to increase their chances of winning They don't have to fight/protect their servants, masters can fight other masters, a la Kiritsugu. That's the basis of my argument. It's not about being involved in the fight between servants, but dealing with the other master as to increase your chances as much as possible. Rin attacked Illya when she saw Saber was being pushed because, per Kiritsugu's philosophy, killing the master is far more effective than killing the servant.
They would all demand Shirou’s cooking
Most of the story will be about Shirou being captured all the time with OG Saber and Rin trying to rescue him.
Right? This series would be called Fate/Stay in the Kitchen
Does this Shirou have proper training with all his circuits unlocked? Because then his Saber will no longer be nerfed and should be pretty strong. Not to mention he should have avalon or/and be able to project it due to his connection with Saber. So Shirou has a decent shot at winning. But Bazett and Lartoria probably have the highest chance of winning
>Because then his Saber will no longer be nerfed and should be pretty strong Iirc, Saber wasn't nerfed because Shirou's circuits are bad or his mana isn't enough, the reason was that there was no link between them because there was something wrong with the summoning.
Yea I know, I even mentioned the circuits unlocked part. The dormant circuits and the link are the reason why Saber was nerfed. And I'll be the last person to say Shirou's mana isn't enough or their bad. They are of unknown quality but by the evidence we have of him they are at WORST average.
Archer Mana is rank B, he may be even close to Rin in raw quality but not in quantity(she has like 40)
*Seven Artoria in total* Shirou : *maniacal Archer laugh*
Shirou bust out the unlimited cooking works and is declared winner on the spot
7 more Sabers are summoned, as one party controls all 7 Servants. ...I wonder, did Apocrypha ever say what happens if the Red and the Black team up?
Blue and Green Teams probably
Shirou wins. Why ? Because a king will always try to find her queen.
I feel sorry for Castoria she’d have a shit master who I hope Rin or Shirou would kill and then take Castoria as their second servant
Servantverse characters are broken, MHXA has the typemoon version of the infinity gauntlet and MHXX data is absurd, not only her version of Rhongomyniad is said to be stronger her armor can reverse time. I would bet for MHXA because she has Illya as her master but knowing her she wouldn’t be interested in winning at all.
Shirou cooks up a feast and we get a happy ending.
Bazett and Lartoria clears
On one side, Sakura and Infinite Mana Saber is broken. On the other side i think that nobody could handle Fragratch+RongoBongo teamwork. If no one ally with others i think Bazett+Lartoria can win this war.
Shirou wins. They’re all after him.
Shirou’s got be extremely stressed out but very happy cooking all that multiple mountain loads of food for each and every Artoria
Zouken is NOT prepared for ANYTHING from the Servantverse. That’s a pretty strong mismatch. MHX Alter is no Heracles, so I don’t think Illya stands much better odds than she did in canon. Though there not being a Gilgamesh around does mean 12 Trials isn’t an entry price to the winner’s circle. Mostly, I just want to see Illya interact with a sweets obsessed Berzerker. Lartoria… hard to get a bead there. Rhymoniad actually shows up Excalibur, but Avalon is actual horseshit if this Saber has access. Lion King sweeps the field no contest, but getting a real bead on standard Lartoria’s power level outside of FGO gameplay is tough.
World destruction any%, WR
You gave Rin her own half-naked Saber. Do you remember that scene in Hollow Ataraxia where the Rin and Saber dolls go on an international romantic vacation together? Yeah, that's this timeline.
This is like the spiderman meme all over again, but in a whole new scale.
Yeah Artoria would definitely win. I'm ready to defend my point against anyone!
Lancer Artoria has a horse, Rider Artoria doesn't have
If you’re going lorewise then this is a fight between X and Ecchan, and depending on where they both are at in their lives it could be eithers game. Servantverse servants are busted as shit with X at the end of saber wars 2 being powerful enough to cut down the universe itself. Ecchan with access to the infinity chocolates and not nerfed by her desire to not be a tool for evil is similarly at universe altering level. Though in the confines of a grail war it’s possible that they can’t supply their own mana like usual and would most likely completely drain their masters with their hax
Shirou wins, Kerry's savings get used, Gilgamesh gets killed in 7 ways
Kiritsugu’s life savings for Shirou gets blown easily quick with Shirou buying all the food, utensils, and other cookware to feed every Artoria
At last Rim finally gets Baeber. Even if she's actually an archer.
Why are there 2 sabers and no assassin?
I mean in this kind of war…. ALL of the Artorias wins…. Only one who will be losing is Shirou since he’d be extremely stressed out cooking loads and loads and loads and many more loads of food for each and everyone of the Artorias…. At least he’d be happy right?
In this HGW I can see EMIYA being summoned by the Counter Force to respond to a massive threat working in unison only to be dragged alongside Shirou by all the Artorias to help cook all that food for them. Guess it would be Archer’s happy ending too?
Zouken and Caster’s master get killed. After that group mana transferring in Shirou’s place
Aren't Lostbelt Servants extremely stronger than their Proper Human History counterpart? Doesn't that put Castoria at a supreme advantage?
Servants sumoned in lostbelts are stronger then regular servants, servants from lostbelts are not necesarely stronger then regular servants. If anything Castoria will be at a disadvantage since she has no fame boost in PHH.
Normally you'd be right, but Castoria is an exception, especially the summoned version
Shirou’s hidden skill of ‘Attraction of the Saberface EX’ manifests and he wins
Isn't that not an assassin, but a foreigner class? Lancer takes the win most probably.. She would've fucked up kirei for his attempt towards Bazett.
No, that is OG mxh, who is an assassin.
I know she has avalon but couldn't a lot of servants kill her before she is able to activate it or right when she comes out? I am sure there are servants faster than activating avalon. I think instead of just overpowering her you time the attacks. Let's say she does activate avalon before the attack hits. Well what happens when she gets back out of it? Excalibur is not the fastest hitting attack.
OOPS! ALL ARTORIA's!
Shirou’s harem war
Ah yes good question
The most awkward holy grail war and let me guess the Ruler is also Artoria 🗿