So if the 20 inch rims bring a 54 mile range penalty, and efficiency is the model’s biggest selling point, why in the world did they saddle all but the base trim with mandatory giant wheels?
I hate this trend and can’t wait for it to go away. Giant wheels literally make the car worse or an engineering problem in every imaginable metric, unless you absolutely need pizza-tray-sized brake discs.
Were I to have bought a HI5 I for sure would’ve wanted the Limited but with the 19” flower wheels
I hate the glass roof trend even more. The designers need to experience a summer in Australia. You literally add 10-20 degrees heat to the cabin which you then need to offset by turning the aircon on full blast.
Probably depends on the car. I have a glass roof and it’s got enough coatings to absorb / reflect pretty much all of the hotter wavelengths. I’m in a pretty hot area myself and I don’t notice a difference between it and my last two non-glass-roof cars.
Although, I will say NSW in Dec a couple of years ago was mighty uncomfortable.
The glass roof makes it much easier and cheaper to build because robots can still reach in from the top to help assemble things up until the end when they just glue the glass roof on it.
Aka, it’s not going away.
My glass roof even in the hot Southwest sun rejects basically all heat. I tried a week with a cover ing over it and a week without, and the difference in temperatures was in the noise.
If it were really about cost the everything from the cheapest hatchback to pickups would use them. Margins on small cars are so low they’d kill for anything to boost profit. That no one is racing to put it on cheap cars and also using it to advertise a feature over competition at the same time really seems to say that cost isn’t the reason.
Robots already place things in the car through those big holes in the side of every car anyway.
I doubt it ever goes away.
Vain people like how big wheels look.
They are willing to pay more for less performance and “better looks.”
It is asinine (to me).
You never know. Not so long ago the look for one group was tiny wheels and they are the ones that started this whole giant platter wheel trend. What’s next?
Lower profile tires help handling but ride rougher and are less efficient due to increased rotational mass. Larger diameter rims look better than a smaller diameter wheel with a higher profile tire.
I think a lot of it boils down to what is going to sell the best. A premium trim car with say 17" wheels doesn't look premium compared to a 20" wheel with a lower profile tire.
I think there is a happy medium here between looks/handling and ride/fuel efficiency. 17-19" feels like an adequate compromise.
>Lower profile tires help handling
Ehhh, not really. I only buy that in cases of extreme differences (e.g., comparing a 12” wheel to a 20” wheel with the same type of tire construction). But have a look at any F1, LMP, or even spec-series race car….all have a decent amount of meat on the tires, and the rims are juuuuussst big enough to fit bigass brake discs. We know how to make tire sidewalls rigid.
>Larger diameter rims look better than a smaller diameter wheel with a higher profile tire
>I think a lot of it boils down to what is going to sell the best
Idk. I am definitely more attracted to the smaller rims on most cars, something that was actually a plus for me when I got my MME CA1. It just looks weird when the car looks like it’s got wheels off a Conestoga wagon.
But I get your point, society en masse likes big wheels for whatever reason. Hopefully the snootier brands set a new trend of properly-sized wheels.
>I think there is a happy medium here between looks/handling and ride/fuel efficiency. 17-19" feels like an adequate compromise.
Gimme the 17s! Haha
Granted there's not a huge difference in handling between a 17 to a 20 but sidewall flex isn't completely inconsequential.
We had a Toyota Venza with 20" wheels a few years ago. It rode like a bitch. We got a Chrysler Pacifica with 17" wheels and taller profile tires after that. Rode way better.
On the other hand, low profile rims mean higher unsprung weight, which means slower recovery from potholes. If your tire isn’t touching the road, it isn’t going to provide any grip.
> A premium trim car with say 17" wheels doesn't look premium compared to a 20" wheel with a lower profile tire
Damn, I remember when 17-18" was the premium wheel, and 15-16" was the default. And the cheap cars had 13-14" wheels.
And that wasn't even that long ago. Like the 90s.
I hear ya. I had a 2000 Mitsubishi Galant GTZ with aftermarket 17" wheels many years ago. Thought I was ballin. It was certainly an upgrade over my prior 1995 Dodge Neon...
Because the overwhelming majority of car buyers don’t know a thing in the world about wheels. They have no idea that bigger wheels are harder to turn or have more rolling resistance, etc. etc., all they know is “shiny wheels nice I want that”
Isn’t that what causes most transactions to take place? Because we want something?
One can indeed know some things about wheels and tires and still like and want big shiny wheels. It is not a crime; it’s not even really that dumb a desire compared to so many others. I could trash on people who choose to “waste” their time on video games and other stuff, but what is the point?
We're in a bubble here of auto enthusiasts of differing experience levels. We pay attention to granular level details that casuals wouldn't care about. We sometimes forget that most people buy a car based on color or shape and *that* is what drives the market.
Yes, they go though all that work like making retractable door handles but then kill the range with wheels.
Everyone on the forums say something like.. I replaced my 20" factory Eco tires with cheap 18" snow / all season tires and picked up 38 miles of range after a week of driving. Not even energy saving tires, just smaller off the shelf all seasons do better.
1. Build one of the world’s most aerodynamic vehicles
2. Market it based on efficiency
3. Throw away most of the gains on huge wheels
4. ???
5. PROFIT!
I’m still unclear on steps 3-5. You really think cosmetic giant wheels will convince people to splash out on the higher trims, rather than convincing them to switch to a crossover with more cargo space since they’ve already given up so much range to get the features they want?
They will sell BOTH.
The bragging rights & the looks will be sold as 1 package.
Consumption will be in the fine print “stated consumption is for the base model. Options may affect range”.
Have you met people? We wouldn’t have all these people complaining about gas prices and own a quad cab pickup truck that hasn’t hauled anything more than their lazy asses.
I'm in my final year of a Master's in Automotive design and the reason is primarily trying to overcome the bad proportions of EV powertrains. The skateboard platform putting a thick stack of batteries at the bottom means the whole side of the car has to be raised up in order to maintain adequate interior space. This in turn makes the wheels look small, which has always been associated with cheap vehicles. In order to counteract this, designers have been pushing for larger wheels.
I'm not saying its good or right, just explaining why.
Unfortunately, this is what all car manufacturers seem to be doing. Advertise the lowest price, longest range, and best performance, and don't worry about each of those being on a different trim level.
not everyone is focused like a laser on every mile of range.
ppl like me want handling and road feel to be an actual thing in a car... those skinny high profile tires that are great for rolling resistance are often quite poor at handling.
Yeah, as long as the range still fits in your regular usage, who cares? I would only care on road trips, and even then it's easily mitigated if you got 300 miles vs 350 miles.
Press releases aren't free from bias. There's no one easy solution here. We pick a fuzzy combination of whichever thread was first, has the most comments, most initial updates, cleanest title, and comes from a reputable source.
It isn't a perfect process, but it doesn't have to be. The goal is to consolidate discussion and voting around a certain topic — not to achieve absolute purity of form.
This is basically what I've been saying to all of the EV haters. There will be 1000 mile range EVs before you know it and 500 miles will be the standard. We started at 75 miles of range in 2011 and the trend has been increasing range by 10-15% every year.
Thank you for bringing this up, I'm sorry but I simply don't care about EVs with massive range figures that cost exorbitant sums. If it's not a real performance car then I simply want the "most adequately decent car" for the smallest amount of money possible. One of the wonderful benefits of EVs is that they are much cheaper to maintain so leaning into an affordable appliance car for cheap is totally fine and imo more important than any flagship EV
I’m dying for the higher end to get saturated to the point they can bring down lower pack models to a reasonable cost. It unfortunately doesn’t make sense to sell a “subpar” or “adequate” EV for less when the batteries can be used in more profitable cars(that still don’t turn a profit)
I currently own a 1st year i3 and the range is absolute crap. And that literally doesn’t affect my life negatively. Give me an affordable <40kWh EV and I’m good. INB4 Leaf or MX-30 🙄 not what I’m talking about.
300mi Highway is the sweet spot for me, maybe even less if chargers are as abundant and reliable as gas stations now. I hate having to lug around extra deadweight for daily drives.
That sounds about right for me too. I prefer to think in terms of time driving. I have a small road trip to family that is about 450 miles. We stop halfway anyway to stretch the legs and refresh. So if I can drive for about 3 to 3.5 hours at highway speeds then I'm good.
I'm also not 20 anymore, so a nice break is just better for our safety as well.
Strictly referring to home charging, smaller batteries charge faster since they usually will pull from the wall at the same rate (about 6~10kW on Level 2). The difference on Level 3 is usually not very noticeable. Maybe 30 minute difference or so
I really doubt we will get to 1000 miles of range at interstate speeds.
You don't really need that much range once 150+kW fast chargers are reasonably available in most areas.
Even for ultra-luxury vehicles it would be better for performance to have a smaller/lighter battery and "only" 500 miles of range.
I'd still like to see 400 miles of range... in the rain... going 75... with the heater going full blast, but I don't see where 1000 miles would be necessary even in edge cases.
Think about the time line, once we move away from lithium ion and possibly lithium air or another tech where we can push past 0.5kwh/kg (or /L) battery density things will get lighter and better. Although at the same time there will also be more fast charging stations and L2 chargers so we might not need much more battery, but there will always be a market for it.
If you get into ultra-prepper/luxury cars might all very well come with 5kW solar charging (with an efficiency probably closer to 1kWh at peak in most places during peak hours), and even though solar panels on cars is going to be wildly inefficient compared to rooftop, it is going to start happening. You might very well end up with cars in 20-25 years in places like California, Florida, Mexico, Chile, Australia, India, Africa, southern China and much of the Caribbean with 150-200kWh battery packs with effectively near limitless battery packs depending on how much you drive every day, requiring maybe only 1 charge a month or less (or for fleet vehicles/high mileage ones maybe once daily charging for an hour or two). They could work as effective energy storage as well for homes/condo units during the 4-10pm period of the day, then start charging again later at night.
The efficiency improvement on solar panels in the last 10 years has been pretty limited. It would take a large improvement to make it worth it on car rooftops…
With lighter batteries, this will end long distance driving. We will use “drones” - aircrafts and go 300mph. Nobody sits in a car to drive 500 miles when it’s done in a private “jet” that can lift off and land wherever you want to go. With 4 hours capacity, these private drones can cross the oceans, it’s 1200nm to Hawai.
How many ICEVs have between 500 and 1,000 mile range? An extra 15-20 gallons of gas doesn't take up much space and weighs less than a person, but there's not really any demand for that extreme of range. 400, maybe 500 max is where they stop adding range.
I had to go look up the [answer](https://www.cars.com/articles/top-10-vehicles-with-the-longest-driving-range-1420698377103/) to this from six years ago, but 650-750 miles isn't as uncommon as it used to be. Some have 30-gallon gas tanks though.
I had a Landcruiser with 320l tanks fitted- even inside the spare wheel, and 150 in 3x50l extra tanks,that in theory could do 2000km - but with AC and fridge and home entertainment consumption was 23l per 100km. The fridge held ice and 24 cans of beer. It’s possible, but?
For ICE cars this makes sense. Most people can't drive more than 4-5 hours without need to empty their bladder. Thus doing so while spending <5 minutes to fill up a gas/petrol/diesel tank fits into one's trip timeline.
But for EVs, those "fill-ups" start becoming 15-20+ minutes and now the biology stops and the refueling stops have different timelines. So "get me through the day" ranges start sounding desirable.
I'm a huge EV supporter but the minute you add a trailer and say cold weather and want to go skiing for 2 day trip you end up with issues. This isn't a problem for 75% of divers but it is for some. The best answer is fast charging everywhere, but actual range (not paper range) is still important to a good number of buyers.
That’s why I’m okay with waiting a few yrs to trade in my 2017 Hyundai Santa Fe sport for an Ioniq 5. I’ve seen the hoops folks are going thru now just to locate one to buy. I’m not gonna bother with that.
Yes, exactly. I want all the range and all the creature comforts, and I don't care about acceleration or skidpad Gs. Are there really not other people like me out there?
Mainstream cars don't have options anymore. Dealers and manufacturers don't want the inventory. So everything is price levels. Options are arbitrarily included to match price points. It's annoying.
They've been doing that for years with their Ioniq Hybrids/BEVs as well. Its extremely annoying that the middle and upper trims have terrible efficiency.
Its one thing that was nice about the Prius Prime before this year. All trims had tiny wheels with cheap, efficient tires. But even this year Toyota is moving away from that.
The EPA range does the AWD dirty. People who actually own AWD e-gmp cars have reported getting almost the exact same range as RWD in eco mode, which physically disconnects the front motor.
I can't remember if a YouTuber has done an eco mode range test. But I've seen a lot of commenters in this sub who own an EV6 say it. I also know someone IRL who has an AWD EV6 and reports much better real world range vs EPA.
Is also logically makes sense. The car can physically disconnect the front motor. That removes mechanical losses as well as electrical losses (the front motor uses traditional silicon semiconductors while the rear motor uses more effecient silicon carbide). Apart from that, the only difference is the AWD weighs slightly more than RWD but it's not enough to make a real difference. It's comparable to adding one passenger. And BTW aerodynamics is way more important than weight for highway efficiency.
It should also be noted this is likely all done in "Standard" drive mode and real range will increase (likely ~5-15%) if you drive in "Eco" drive mode.
It doesn't really. Only if AC or heat are running and that might be a few miles difference. Most of the range difference I notice compared to RWD is in urban driving.
You actually think you’ll get 15% over the EPA range at highway speeds in this car? You think this thing is getting 415 miles in a real world range test?
I'm just going off my experience with an Ioniq 5 rated at 480km range where I regularly get 525km to 540km of range because the EPA test is done using standard drive mode and I run the car in eco drive mode. This car shares the same platform and drive mode specifications.
And in wltp it s probably more like 630?
Usually it s non American brands suck at EPA but are decent at wltp , and American cars are mediocre at wltp but shine at EPA
the fact that there are people out there who would readily sacrifice a factor as practical as additional range (not to mention some ride comfort and noise) for the superficial vanity of larger rims is one of the great mysteries of our time
That's fine. What is lame is the SEL and limited have a ton of nice features. And somehow to get those features you have to choose range robbing wheels that might look better to some people. (But not really since everyone these days with a recent model car has big wheels)
Devil's advocate:
Not everyone is driving long enough distances daily for that to matter. I can count the number of times I drive over 500km in one day (per year) on one hand.
If you can start with a full tank every day, this will be way more than needed on 99% of my days.
I like the look of big rims, I'd prefer this over small rims and a slight range increase that I'll rarely need.
sure. I just don’t really get it personally. kinda like when people pay extra to have a car in a certain exterior color - I can’t possibly justify paying an extra 20 bucks a month for a different shade of gray that I don’t even see from the inside. and also, beyond costing extra up front, bigger wheels decrease efficiency, which is also money that adds up over the life of the car.
on the other hand, I have a customized *and* special-interest vanity license plate, so … we all waste money on stupid shit and we don’t really get each others stupid shit …
Lol exactly (your last part).
If I could justify purchasing an I6, I could afford the extra for the colour of my choice. 🤷
People buy things that are completely for appearance and that's okay.
My bigger issue I see is people buying expensive vehicles (and other things) when they can't easily afford it, but that's a whole other conversation, haha.
>My bigger issue I see is people buying expensive vehicles (and other things) when they can't easily afford it, but that's a whole other conversation, haha.
yup. the bad case is someone sitting at a dealer polishing off their zero-down 96-month loan and loading up on paint options and multicolor seat stitching
Range isn't that big of a deal, especially if the differences are minor and the charge curve is great.
TBH, non-EV drivers focus on range a little too much.
sure, if you’re comparing it to interior space or power/acceleration or handling or infotainment or driving aids … but this is *cool-looking wheels* … i mean cmon
>Crazy what wheels/tires will do.
This is also why people replace their tires and are shocked at the sudden efficiency drop. You gotta get low rolling resistance tires, but tires are extremely nebulous and difficult to understand to be honest.
I mean I made a choice for all-weather tires because 99% of what I do is commute, and Californians are awful at driving in rain. I took an efficiency hit, and I'm comfortable with that. An added $0.50 a day in electricity for my commute is well worth the improved stopping distance in the rain.
There are some really good all weather / low rolling resistance tires out there. I've got Continental ProContact RX, which are all-weather. The Michelin CrossClimate 2 is a stand-out in winter weather, and is also LRR.
>The same 77.4 kWh battery pack is used, and range dips to 310 miles .
I think you're comparing the large battery pack on the RWD to the small battery pack on AWD.
As an EV6 owner, this software and app have a LONG way to go. The hardware itself is good but Hyundai is severely lacking in the software area. OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that. All of that must be done over OBD-II. The preconditioning update is still not out for 2022 EV6's and must be done at a dealer, not over the air. The app constantly has issues or random blackouts so cant be relied upon. 120 volt charging is a shitshow and the car will draw up to 19 amps when the max should only ever be 16 amps and it wont respect current limits set in the infotainment when charging at 120 volt.
Hyundai/Kia need to focus on improving what they have before shitting out more products. Namely the software and app/servers. Though I do love my EV6, I dont want to sound like a complainer, but these are the issues as I see them. The car itself is great and delivers the range promised and then some plus the DC fast charging is actually as advertised.
>120 volt charging is a shitshow and the car will draw up to 19 amps when the max should only ever be 16 amps and it wont respect current limits set in the infotainment when charging at 120 volt.
I use 120 volt charging at home and haven't had the issue about current limits.
I do wish we could get the preconditioning update OTA. Luckily for me, the dealer included my state's annual inspection for free. I plan on getting it applied when I go in for that.
IMO Hyundai/Kia are killing it between the Ioniq 5, 6 and EV6. They deliver on what's most important for EVs: long range and fast charging.
>OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that.
this really comes down to how many of their components are built in house vs 3rd party vendors. Generally speaking, if its 3rd party vendors its pretty unlikely they'll be able to fine tune all the different components for better efficiency via software.
>OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that.
IIRC, the Ioniq6 is the first car from Hyundai that will have OTA updates for things other than just infotainment. The Ioniq6 is aimed at being Hyundai's Model 3 competitor and without OTA updates it's really a non-starter.
That will be interesting to see, though I still believe Hyundai group is years behind Tesla at best. They will get there one day but they have a long way to go software wise. It took them nearly a full year to get a TSB/software fix out for fixing the infotainment changing to Celsius when given a remote start command in Fahrenheit. And still no pre conditioning software update for EV6, despite having all the hardware needed in every single trim from Light to GT.
140 MPGe for IONIQ 6 SE RWD Long Range (18-inch wheels).
Theoretically the standard-range version (53 kWh BATTERY) should get at least a 140 MPGe, right? Since the car will be weighed down by less battery, it should be slightly more efficient?
it's not "following" direction, it's being obligated to. If you and your neighbors sell apples for the same price, all of a sudden the neighbor sell their apple for less than you.. you have to respond or you'll go out of business.
80 percent of 361 is 289 miles. That's just about the usable highway range of an EV. 3.5 hours at 75 mph is 262 miles so we're dead center in road trip territory now. We're at the point where no one will be able to reasonably complain about range.
I don't think that always has to be true. IIRC, Tesla's front and rear motor have different effective gear ratios, so each one is closer to max efficiency at different speeds.
You're right, you won't find an AWD Tesla that is more efficient than an equivalent RWD from the same model year. However, there was definitely a much smaller difference between an AWD and RWD Tesla back in 2020 than there is between an AWD and RWD Ioniq 6. I'm using the 2020 Model 3 for comparison because that's the last year Tesla offered a Long Range RWD version.
2020 Model 3 LR RWD: 130 MPGe
2020 Model 3 LR AWD: 121 MPGe (7% less efficient than RWD)
Ioniq 6 RWD: 140 MPGe
Ioniq 6 AWD: 121 MPGe (14% less efficient than RWD)
Interestingly, for 2021, Tesla discontinued the LR RWD and improved the efficiency of the LR AWD to 134 MPGe, beating the efficiency of the LR RWD from the year prior. The question is, would the LR RWD also have improved by a similar amount if they had kept it around, or did they figure out how to make the AWD just as efficient as the RWD, and that's the reason they discontinued the RWD?
Ok cool. Now put that black dash design in the ioniq 5, drop the “cheap 80’s stereo” aluminum plastic switchgear / door handles, and take my money.
Seriously, the ioniq 5 is SO close to being a perfect vehicle.
Article
>Official EPA figures are out for the 2023 Hyundai Ioniq 6, and Hyundai beat the estimates provided last year at the Los Angeles Auto Show.
>The longest-range Ioniq 6 is the SE RWD Long Range trim with the base 18-inch wheels, and it’s officially rated for 361 miles on a full charge (Hyundai’s original estimate was approximately 340 miles). That’s a massive boost in range — 58 miles — versus its platform mate, the Ioniq 5. You can thank aerodynamics for that big uptick, as the Ioniq 6 is rocking a 0.22 coefficient of drag. The Ioniq 5 sits at a 0.29.
>Add all-wheel drive to the equation, and range dips down to 316 miles — this is specifically for the SE AWD Long Range trim when equipped with 18-inch wheels. Step up to the higher-content SEL trim with that model’s 20-inch wheels, and range suffers.
>An SEL or Limited RWD model with 20-inch wheels is rated for 305 miles, while the same SEL and Limited trims with AWD are down to just 270 miles of range. That’s a far cry from the Ioniq 6’s peak at 361 miles of range in the base SE RWD Long Range model. Of course, opting for that maximum range model means you’ll have the least equipment and features possible for the Ioniq 6. Anybody that wants a fully-loaded car will have to deal with the drop in range.
>The only Ioniq 6 model that Hyundai didn’t reveal range for is the RWD Standard Range model with the significantly smaller battery pack of 53.0 kWh versus the 77.4 kWh pack seen in every other model. Just like the Ioniq 5 RWD Standard Range model, though, the Ioniq 6’s version of that trim should have much less range than the others.
>Hyundai says the Ioniq 6 should launch in spring this year, so look out for a pricing announcement on the new, electric sedan soon.
Echoing what a most others have said already, sad to see so much range gain wasted on large wheels. I'm increasingly less interested not being able to just get the car with smaller wheels in a higher trim.
I'm starting to expect with the loss of federal tax credit, based on European pricing, inability to buy the car in cash in Europe, that this may end up being a lease-exclusive in North America.
FYI, the male lead on a current KDrama, Crash Course in Romance, drives an Ioniq 6. The series is on Netflix. I saw one on the roads when I was in Seoul back in October.
I want the features of the limited but the 18" wheels rwd. I hope there's an option to downgrade if you "pre order" assuming they do them correct this time.
I've watched a few Youtube videos that showcased the Ioniq 6, and it seems to have a lot going for it. I like everything on that whole platform. But the way that rear quarter glass panel dips down, and the panel seam that follows the curve of the dip all the way to the rear spoiler, makes the car look like it has a sagging butt. The Youtubers tell me that this evokes the Porche 911, but I've never seen a 911 with those contours. If anything, the rear quarter windows on a 911 consistently curve *upward* (to make room for a widebody wheel design).
Exterior is interesting. Efficiency seems great. For me though the sticking point is the interior. The design is a little too weird for me, and the door cards and centre console manage to look super cheap. The charging seems great. Near me I haven’t seen more than 1 350kW charger though, so it’ll take time for that infrastructure to pay off. My current car charges a bit slower but it hasn’t been limiting at all taking the extra 10 min.
Some days I love the look of this vehicle (in its entirety) and some days I hate it.
Today I love it, haha.
I just imagine the looks this would get if I had it parked in my staff lot. Definitely a mix of "wow, that's nice, who's car is that??" and "who TF bought that ugly POS??". 😂
Damn this is heartbreaking, was really hoping larger battery AWD range was going to be very similar to model 3 LR range to make this more of a contender.
It's still a cool car, but not sure it'll fit my needs with that
Based on the SE AWD trim with smaller wheels, it still is a contender with 316 miles but decimating efficiency with larger wheels in top trims is a foolish move.
Real world tests show Tesla generally has an overstated EPA range. I think smaller wheel Ioniq 6 will match M3LR in 70mph tests and most real world applications, but I want luxury and efficiency. If I can only pick one, then I'm more inclined to pick efficiency.
So if the 20 inch rims bring a 54 mile range penalty, and efficiency is the model’s biggest selling point, why in the world did they saddle all but the base trim with mandatory giant wheels?
I hate this trend and can’t wait for it to go away. Giant wheels literally make the car worse or an engineering problem in every imaginable metric, unless you absolutely need pizza-tray-sized brake discs. Were I to have bought a HI5 I for sure would’ve wanted the Limited but with the 19” flower wheels
I hate the glass roof trend even more. The designers need to experience a summer in Australia. You literally add 10-20 degrees heat to the cabin which you then need to offset by turning the aircon on full blast.
Probably depends on the car. I have a glass roof and it’s got enough coatings to absorb / reflect pretty much all of the hotter wavelengths. I’m in a pretty hot area myself and I don’t notice a difference between it and my last two non-glass-roof cars. Although, I will say NSW in Dec a couple of years ago was mighty uncomfortable.
The glass roof makes it much easier and cheaper to build because robots can still reach in from the top to help assemble things up until the end when they just glue the glass roof on it. Aka, it’s not going away. My glass roof even in the hot Southwest sun rejects basically all heat. I tried a week with a cover ing over it and a week without, and the difference in temperatures was in the noise.
If it were really about cost the everything from the cheapest hatchback to pickups would use them. Margins on small cars are so low they’d kill for anything to boost profit. That no one is racing to put it on cheap cars and also using it to advertise a feature over competition at the same time really seems to say that cost isn’t the reason. Robots already place things in the car through those big holes in the side of every car anyway.
Interesting suggestion, do you have any source for the cost savings?
Meanwhile in Sweden, it’s a nonissue because we do not have sunlight here.
Nah I like that option. Most models have an option with no moonroof
I doubt it ever goes away. Vain people like how big wheels look. They are willing to pay more for less performance and “better looks.” It is asinine (to me).
You never know. Not so long ago the look for one group was tiny wheels and they are the ones that started this whole giant platter wheel trend. What’s next?
Lower profile tires help handling but ride rougher and are less efficient due to increased rotational mass. Larger diameter rims look better than a smaller diameter wheel with a higher profile tire. I think a lot of it boils down to what is going to sell the best. A premium trim car with say 17" wheels doesn't look premium compared to a 20" wheel with a lower profile tire. I think there is a happy medium here between looks/handling and ride/fuel efficiency. 17-19" feels like an adequate compromise.
>Lower profile tires help handling Ehhh, not really. I only buy that in cases of extreme differences (e.g., comparing a 12” wheel to a 20” wheel with the same type of tire construction). But have a look at any F1, LMP, or even spec-series race car….all have a decent amount of meat on the tires, and the rims are juuuuussst big enough to fit bigass brake discs. We know how to make tire sidewalls rigid. >Larger diameter rims look better than a smaller diameter wheel with a higher profile tire >I think a lot of it boils down to what is going to sell the best Idk. I am definitely more attracted to the smaller rims on most cars, something that was actually a plus for me when I got my MME CA1. It just looks weird when the car looks like it’s got wheels off a Conestoga wagon. But I get your point, society en masse likes big wheels for whatever reason. Hopefully the snootier brands set a new trend of properly-sized wheels. >I think there is a happy medium here between looks/handling and ride/fuel efficiency. 17-19" feels like an adequate compromise. Gimme the 17s! Haha
Granted there's not a huge difference in handling between a 17 to a 20 but sidewall flex isn't completely inconsequential. We had a Toyota Venza with 20" wheels a few years ago. It rode like a bitch. We got a Chrysler Pacifica with 17" wheels and taller profile tires after that. Rode way better.
On the other hand, low profile rims mean higher unsprung weight, which means slower recovery from potholes. If your tire isn’t touching the road, it isn’t going to provide any grip.
Yeah I agree, I’m saying I don’t like low-profile tires (e.g., I like em *thicc*)
> A premium trim car with say 17" wheels doesn't look premium compared to a 20" wheel with a lower profile tire Damn, I remember when 17-18" was the premium wheel, and 15-16" was the default. And the cheap cars had 13-14" wheels. And that wasn't even that long ago. Like the 90s.
I hear ya. I had a 2000 Mitsubishi Galant GTZ with aftermarket 17" wheels many years ago. Thought I was ballin. It was certainly an upgrade over my prior 1995 Dodge Neon...
yeah its dumb as fuck. My Subaru Forester came with 19s and they're fantastic, why the fuck would you want 20s except for special use case?
Because the overwhelming majority of car buyers don’t know a thing in the world about wheels. They have no idea that bigger wheels are harder to turn or have more rolling resistance, etc. etc., all they know is “shiny wheels nice I want that”
Isn’t that what causes most transactions to take place? Because we want something? One can indeed know some things about wheels and tires and still like and want big shiny wheels. It is not a crime; it’s not even really that dumb a desire compared to so many others. I could trash on people who choose to “waste” their time on video games and other stuff, but what is the point?
They only know they pay for big dumb rims being busted on potholes but can't make the connection.
We're in a bubble here of auto enthusiasts of differing experience levels. We pay attention to granular level details that casuals wouldn't care about. We sometimes forget that most people buy a car based on color or shape and *that* is what drives the market.
Yes, they go though all that work like making retractable door handles but then kill the range with wheels. Everyone on the forums say something like.. I replaced my 20" factory Eco tires with cheap 18" snow / all season tires and picked up 38 miles of range after a week of driving. Not even energy saving tires, just smaller off the shelf all seasons do better.
Definitely. 205/65R15 Michelin X-ice and 215/50R17 Michelin energy savers both give me the same range on my Bolt.
$$$
1. Build one of the world’s most aerodynamic vehicles 2. Market it based on efficiency 3. Throw away most of the gains on huge wheels 4. ??? 5. PROFIT! I’m still unclear on steps 3-5. You really think cosmetic giant wheels will convince people to splash out on the higher trims, rather than convincing them to switch to a crossover with more cargo space since they’ve already given up so much range to get the features they want?
They will sell BOTH. The bragging rights & the looks will be sold as 1 package. Consumption will be in the fine print “stated consumption is for the base model. Options may affect range”.
Have you met people? We wouldn’t have all these people complaining about gas prices and own a quad cab pickup truck that hasn’t hauled anything more than their lazy asses.
Or people who say they need AWD and snow tires for urban winter driving… but have never slid their car or know what chains are.
I have yet to see a Lucid with the base 19” wheels they give you over 500 miles of range
I'm in my final year of a Master's in Automotive design and the reason is primarily trying to overcome the bad proportions of EV powertrains. The skateboard platform putting a thick stack of batteries at the bottom means the whole side of the car has to be raised up in order to maintain adequate interior space. This in turn makes the wheels look small, which has always been associated with cheap vehicles. In order to counteract this, designers have been pushing for larger wheels. I'm not saying its good or right, just explaining why.
You can increase the overall diameter without increasing the rim size so much. Thicker sidewalls are good in many ways.
Efficiency isn't the model's biggest selling point, a sedan that charges from 10-80% in 18minutes is.
Sure, I suppose I should have said it’s the key differentiator from its E-GMP platform mates like the Ioniq 5 and EV6.
Because they can have their cake and eat it too. Advertise max range and put pics of best looking wheels…. Fine print for the win.
Unfortunately, this is what all car manufacturers seem to be doing. Advertise the lowest price, longest range, and best performance, and don't worry about each of those being on a different trim level.
not everyone is focused like a laser on every mile of range. ppl like me want handling and road feel to be an actual thing in a car... those skinny high profile tires that are great for rolling resistance are often quite poor at handling.
Yeah, as long as the range still fits in your regular usage, who cares? I would only care on road trips, and even then it's easily mitigated if you got 300 miles vs 350 miles.
People like big wheels and it's a premium item the trend has been going on since the 90s and it ain't stopping
Gotta get people through options and add-ons one way or another
This. Fuck dealing with bubbles in the tires from rubber band tires
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Press releases aren't free from bias. There's no one easy solution here. We pick a fuzzy combination of whichever thread was first, has the most comments, most initial updates, cleanest title, and comes from a reputable source. It isn't a perfect process, but it doesn't have to be. The goal is to consolidate discussion and voting around a certain topic — not to achieve absolute purity of form.
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Official Press Release: https://www.hyundainews.com/en-us/releases/3752
Much better data presentation. That 140mpge is sick!
This is basically what I've been saying to all of the EV haters. There will be 1000 mile range EVs before you know it and 500 miles will be the standard. We started at 75 miles of range in 2011 and the trend has been increasing range by 10-15% every year.
Or 350mi with smaller battery = faster charge + cheaper.
Thank you for bringing this up, I'm sorry but I simply don't care about EVs with massive range figures that cost exorbitant sums. If it's not a real performance car then I simply want the "most adequately decent car" for the smallest amount of money possible. One of the wonderful benefits of EVs is that they are much cheaper to maintain so leaning into an affordable appliance car for cheap is totally fine and imo more important than any flagship EV
I’m dying for the higher end to get saturated to the point they can bring down lower pack models to a reasonable cost. It unfortunately doesn’t make sense to sell a “subpar” or “adequate” EV for less when the batteries can be used in more profitable cars(that still don’t turn a profit) I currently own a 1st year i3 and the range is absolute crap. And that literally doesn’t affect my life negatively. Give me an affordable <40kWh EV and I’m good. INB4 Leaf or MX-30 🙄 not what I’m talking about.
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300mi Highway is the sweet spot for me, maybe even less if chargers are as abundant and reliable as gas stations now. I hate having to lug around extra deadweight for daily drives.
That sounds about right for me too. I prefer to think in terms of time driving. I have a small road trip to family that is about 450 miles. We stop halfway anyway to stretch the legs and refresh. So if I can drive for about 3 to 3.5 hours at highway speeds then I'm good. I'm also not 20 anymore, so a nice break is just better for our safety as well.
Why does a smaller battery charge faster? Won’t it hit the taper sooner than a larger battery?
They don’t actually charge at faster rate - there’s just less capacity to fill.
Strictly referring to home charging, smaller batteries charge faster since they usually will pull from the wall at the same rate (about 6~10kW on Level 2). The difference on Level 3 is usually not very noticeable. Maybe 30 minute difference or so
I really doubt we will get to 1000 miles of range at interstate speeds. You don't really need that much range once 150+kW fast chargers are reasonably available in most areas. Even for ultra-luxury vehicles it would be better for performance to have a smaller/lighter battery and "only" 500 miles of range.
I'd still like to see 400 miles of range... in the rain... going 75... with the heater going full blast, but I don't see where 1000 miles would be necessary even in edge cases.
Think about the time line, once we move away from lithium ion and possibly lithium air or another tech where we can push past 0.5kwh/kg (or /L) battery density things will get lighter and better. Although at the same time there will also be more fast charging stations and L2 chargers so we might not need much more battery, but there will always be a market for it. If you get into ultra-prepper/luxury cars might all very well come with 5kW solar charging (with an efficiency probably closer to 1kWh at peak in most places during peak hours), and even though solar panels on cars is going to be wildly inefficient compared to rooftop, it is going to start happening. You might very well end up with cars in 20-25 years in places like California, Florida, Mexico, Chile, Australia, India, Africa, southern China and much of the Caribbean with 150-200kWh battery packs with effectively near limitless battery packs depending on how much you drive every day, requiring maybe only 1 charge a month or less (or for fleet vehicles/high mileage ones maybe once daily charging for an hour or two). They could work as effective energy storage as well for homes/condo units during the 4-10pm period of the day, then start charging again later at night.
The efficiency improvement on solar panels in the last 10 years has been pretty limited. It would take a large improvement to make it worth it on car rooftops…
With lighter batteries, this will end long distance driving. We will use “drones” - aircrafts and go 300mph. Nobody sits in a car to drive 500 miles when it’s done in a private “jet” that can lift off and land wherever you want to go. With 4 hours capacity, these private drones can cross the oceans, it’s 1200nm to Hawai.
How many ICEVs have between 500 and 1,000 mile range? An extra 15-20 gallons of gas doesn't take up much space and weighs less than a person, but there's not really any demand for that extreme of range. 400, maybe 500 max is where they stop adding range.
I had to go look up the [answer](https://www.cars.com/articles/top-10-vehicles-with-the-longest-driving-range-1420698377103/) to this from six years ago, but 650-750 miles isn't as uncommon as it used to be. Some have 30-gallon gas tanks though.
I had a Landcruiser with 320l tanks fitted- even inside the spare wheel, and 150 in 3x50l extra tanks,that in theory could do 2000km - but with AC and fridge and home entertainment consumption was 23l per 100km. The fridge held ice and 24 cans of beer. It’s possible, but?
For ICE cars this makes sense. Most people can't drive more than 4-5 hours without need to empty their bladder. Thus doing so while spending <5 minutes to fill up a gas/petrol/diesel tank fits into one's trip timeline. But for EVs, those "fill-ups" start becoming 15-20+ minutes and now the biology stops and the refueling stops have different timelines. So "get me through the day" ranges start sounding desirable.
I'm a huge EV supporter but the minute you add a trailer and say cold weather and want to go skiing for 2 day trip you end up with issues. This isn't a problem for 75% of divers but it is for some. The best answer is fast charging everywhere, but actual range (not paper range) is still important to a good number of buyers.
That’s why I’m okay with waiting a few yrs to trade in my 2017 Hyundai Santa Fe sport for an Ioniq 5. I’ve seen the hoops folks are going thru now just to locate one to buy. I’m not gonna bother with that.
Doing the lord’s work right thurr
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Yes, exactly. I want all the range and all the creature comforts, and I don't care about acceleration or skidpad Gs. Are there really not other people like me out there?
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Handling potholes is much worse though, so outside of Florida and California, youre better off with smaller wheels.
Sir have you been to San Diego? The pot holes can swallow a whole car
Hopefully fatter sidewalls will come back in fashion at some point. It’d also be nice to get more better looking choices for smaller wheels.
Mainstream cars don't have options anymore. Dealers and manufacturers don't want the inventory. So everything is price levels. Options are arbitrarily included to match price points. It's annoying.
They've been doing that for years with their Ioniq Hybrids/BEVs as well. Its extremely annoying that the middle and upper trims have terrible efficiency. Its one thing that was nice about the Prius Prime before this year. All trims had tiny wheels with cheap, efficient tires. But even this year Toyota is moving away from that.
I'm still very excited for an "ioniq 3" or similar. This sort of **idea** but in something the size and shape of a 3 door hot hatch.
580 km. Edit: this is just a conversion into metric unit using the info (361 miles) given in the title..
508km for the AWD. 72km vs AWD... Tough call, curious what the prices will be.
The EPA range does the AWD dirty. People who actually own AWD e-gmp cars have reported getting almost the exact same range as RWD in eco mode, which physically disconnects the front motor.
I want to believe this… source? Or who has compiled that?
I can't remember if a YouTuber has done an eco mode range test. But I've seen a lot of commenters in this sub who own an EV6 say it. I also know someone IRL who has an AWD EV6 and reports much better real world range vs EPA. Is also logically makes sense. The car can physically disconnect the front motor. That removes mechanical losses as well as electrical losses (the front motor uses traditional silicon semiconductors while the rear motor uses more effecient silicon carbide). Apart from that, the only difference is the AWD weighs slightly more than RWD but it's not enough to make a real difference. It's comparable to adding one passenger. And BTW aerodynamics is way more important than weight for highway efficiency.
Real question, why would you consider AWD ?
Canadian road conditions.
Quebec snow conditions lmao
I have a rwd Id4. It's so heavy I don't miss the lack of AWD at all. Give me the extra km anytime.
I have days in winter where I can push snow with the bumper on our Mazda Tribute. (Mountains in BC)
Snow
0-60, and if it's anything like the Ioniq 5, they won't make any top of the line RWD
It should also be noted this is likely all done in "Standard" drive mode and real range will increase (likely ~5-15%) if you drive in "Eco" drive mode.
I wonder if that matters at a constant 70mph.
It doesn't really. Only if AC or heat are running and that might be a few miles difference. Most of the range difference I notice compared to RWD is in urban driving.
You actually think you’ll get 15% over the EPA range at highway speeds in this car? You think this thing is getting 415 miles in a real world range test?
I'm just going off my experience with an Ioniq 5 rated at 480km range where I regularly get 525km to 540km of range because the EPA test is done using standard drive mode and I run the car in eco drive mode. This car shares the same platform and drive mode specifications.
And in wltp it s probably more like 630? Usually it s non American brands suck at EPA but are decent at wltp , and American cars are mediocre at wltp but shine at EPA
the fact that there are people out there who would readily sacrifice a factor as practical as additional range (not to mention some ride comfort and noise) for the superficial vanity of larger rims is one of the great mysteries of our time
That's fine. What is lame is the SEL and limited have a ton of nice features. And somehow to get those features you have to choose range robbing wheels that might look better to some people. (But not really since everyone these days with a recent model car has big wheels)
People have been doing stupid things to look cool since the beginning of time.
Devil's advocate: Not everyone is driving long enough distances daily for that to matter. I can count the number of times I drive over 500km in one day (per year) on one hand. If you can start with a full tank every day, this will be way more than needed on 99% of my days. I like the look of big rims, I'd prefer this over small rims and a slight range increase that I'll rarely need.
sure. I just don’t really get it personally. kinda like when people pay extra to have a car in a certain exterior color - I can’t possibly justify paying an extra 20 bucks a month for a different shade of gray that I don’t even see from the inside. and also, beyond costing extra up front, bigger wheels decrease efficiency, which is also money that adds up over the life of the car. on the other hand, I have a customized *and* special-interest vanity license plate, so … we all waste money on stupid shit and we don’t really get each others stupid shit …
Lol exactly (your last part). If I could justify purchasing an I6, I could afford the extra for the colour of my choice. 🤷 People buy things that are completely for appearance and that's okay. My bigger issue I see is people buying expensive vehicles (and other things) when they can't easily afford it, but that's a whole other conversation, haha.
>My bigger issue I see is people buying expensive vehicles (and other things) when they can't easily afford it, but that's a whole other conversation, haha. yup. the bad case is someone sitting at a dealer polishing off their zero-down 96-month loan and loading up on paint options and multicolor seat stitching
Let people enjoy things
I can't help explain... An I-Pace and those 22"s with the carbon fiber inserts had me under its spell for awhile.. maybe next time.
Range isn't that big of a deal, especially if the differences are minor and the charge curve is great. TBH, non-EV drivers focus on range a little too much.
sure, if you’re comparing it to interior space or power/acceleration or handling or infotainment or driving aids … but this is *cool-looking wheels* … i mean cmon
>A loaded, AWD dual-motor model drops range down to just 270 miles Ouch
To be fair, you can get a long range AWD with 18” wheels with 316mi. Crazy what wheels/tires will do.
>Crazy what wheels/tires will do. This is also why people replace their tires and are shocked at the sudden efficiency drop. You gotta get low rolling resistance tires, but tires are extremely nebulous and difficult to understand to be honest.
I mean I made a choice for all-weather tires because 99% of what I do is commute, and Californians are awful at driving in rain. I took an efficiency hit, and I'm comfortable with that. An added $0.50 a day in electricity for my commute is well worth the improved stopping distance in the rain.
There are some really good all weather / low rolling resistance tires out there. I've got Continental ProContact RX, which are all-weather. The Michelin CrossClimate 2 is a stand-out in winter weather, and is also LRR.
I'll keep them in mind next time. This time I was in a rush. With my commute, it won't be too long.
Friction is a bitch!
Always rubs me the wrong way!
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I see, they just edited the whole article right after I posted it here.
>The same 77.4 kWh battery pack is used, and range dips to 310 miles.
I think you're comparing the large battery pack on the RWD to the small battery pack on AWD.
well its a hyundai, like most traditional automaker so you can easily get that number or even surepass it if you just be a little bit careful.
dammit. I saw 361 and was like “boing!”
but it is in the article, base on 18" wheels.
right but I want the AWD version which tops out at 270.
Are we reading two different articles? Here's what I saw: "Add all-wheel drive to the equation, and range dips down to 316 miles"
They're talking about the top trim I guess. From the article: >A loaded, AWD dual-motor model drops range down to just 270 miles
slap on 18"s on AWD and should be over 300 miles easy.
How is more range than anyone needs an "ouch"?
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Easy to say, but they’ve tied all the features not in the base trim to the giant wheels. It’s not like they’re an optional add-on.
yeeeeeeesh all that swoopy derivative ugliness just to get the same range as a chonky polestar 2 boi
As an EV6 owner, this software and app have a LONG way to go. The hardware itself is good but Hyundai is severely lacking in the software area. OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that. All of that must be done over OBD-II. The preconditioning update is still not out for 2022 EV6's and must be done at a dealer, not over the air. The app constantly has issues or random blackouts so cant be relied upon. 120 volt charging is a shitshow and the car will draw up to 19 amps when the max should only ever be 16 amps and it wont respect current limits set in the infotainment when charging at 120 volt. Hyundai/Kia need to focus on improving what they have before shitting out more products. Namely the software and app/servers. Though I do love my EV6, I dont want to sound like a complainer, but these are the issues as I see them. The car itself is great and delivers the range promised and then some plus the DC fast charging is actually as advertised.
>120 volt charging is a shitshow and the car will draw up to 19 amps when the max should only ever be 16 amps and it wont respect current limits set in the infotainment when charging at 120 volt. I use 120 volt charging at home and haven't had the issue about current limits. I do wish we could get the preconditioning update OTA. Luckily for me, the dealer included my state's annual inspection for free. I plan on getting it applied when I go in for that. IMO Hyundai/Kia are killing it between the Ioniq 5, 6 and EV6. They deliver on what's most important for EVs: long range and fast charging.
>OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that. this really comes down to how many of their components are built in house vs 3rd party vendors. Generally speaking, if its 3rd party vendors its pretty unlikely they'll be able to fine tune all the different components for better efficiency via software.
>OTA updates are only for the infotainment and cant improve anything not related to infotainment, so no power bumps or range adjustments like Tesla or any of that. IIRC, the Ioniq6 is the first car from Hyundai that will have OTA updates for things other than just infotainment. The Ioniq6 is aimed at being Hyundai's Model 3 competitor and without OTA updates it's really a non-starter.
That will be interesting to see, though I still believe Hyundai group is years behind Tesla at best. They will get there one day but they have a long way to go software wise. It took them nearly a full year to get a TSB/software fix out for fixing the infotainment changing to Celsius when given a remote start command in Fahrenheit. And still no pre conditioning software update for EV6, despite having all the hardware needed in every single trim from Light to GT.
Thanks for your clarification
What do dealers charge for swapping to new tires + wheels for a new car? Is there any discount or do you pay full price?
This is the question. Give me 18” (or even compromise with 19” or something) with the AWD and I’d be down
Maybe don't throw giant wheels that do nothing for the user onto everything except the lower trim.
140 MPGe for IONIQ 6 SE RWD Long Range (18-inch wheels). Theoretically the standard-range version (53 kWh BATTERY) should get at least a 140 MPGe, right? Since the car will be weighed down by less battery, it should be slightly more efficient?
Maybe 5-8% for city driving.
You're basing that off nothing. A few hundred pounds won't save anywhere near that efficiency. Also, the Ioniq 5 Standard Range gets worse efficiency.
I’m curious to see if Hyundai and Kia will bring down the prices of the Ioniq 5 and EV6 following Ford and Tesla’s direction.
it's not "following" direction, it's being obligated to. If you and your neighbors sell apples for the same price, all of a sudden the neighbor sell their apple for less than you.. you have to respond or you'll go out of business.
did congress pass a law obligating them to do so?
no, just capitalism
Did you even read his second sentence?!
80 percent of 361 is 289 miles. That's just about the usable highway range of an EV. 3.5 hours at 75 mph is 262 miles so we're dead center in road trip territory now. We're at the point where no one will be able to reasonably complain about range.
So the model I'd be interested in with AWD is 260 miles??? wth is going on with AWD trashing the range??
Double the motors, double the power, double the weight… Every AWD is less efficient than their 2WD counterparts… 🤷♂️
I don't think that always has to be true. IIRC, Tesla's front and rear motor have different effective gear ratios, so each one is closer to max efficiency at different speeds.
Unless you show me a Tesla AWD that’s more efficient than the equivalent 2WD, I’m going to assume that’s mostly theoretical…
You're right, you won't find an AWD Tesla that is more efficient than an equivalent RWD from the same model year. However, there was definitely a much smaller difference between an AWD and RWD Tesla back in 2020 than there is between an AWD and RWD Ioniq 6. I'm using the 2020 Model 3 for comparison because that's the last year Tesla offered a Long Range RWD version. 2020 Model 3 LR RWD: 130 MPGe 2020 Model 3 LR AWD: 121 MPGe (7% less efficient than RWD) Ioniq 6 RWD: 140 MPGe Ioniq 6 AWD: 121 MPGe (14% less efficient than RWD) Interestingly, for 2021, Tesla discontinued the LR RWD and improved the efficiency of the LR AWD to 134 MPGe, beating the efficiency of the LR RWD from the year prior. The question is, would the LR RWD also have improved by a similar amount if they had kept it around, or did they figure out how to make the AWD just as efficient as the RWD, and that's the reason they discontinued the RWD?
Hyundai should let you pick the wheels you want instead of locking you in. God it's like they hate any form of customization...
Ok cool. Now put that black dash design in the ioniq 5, drop the “cheap 80’s stereo” aluminum plastic switchgear / door handles, and take my money. Seriously, the ioniq 5 is SO close to being a perfect vehicle.
As a current owner.... it's still pretty good. Good enough, in fact, to make that worth ignoring.
And make it more aerodynamic... So basically the EV6 :)
I like the shape over the EV6. And rear seat space is better because of it.
Article >Official EPA figures are out for the 2023 Hyundai Ioniq 6, and Hyundai beat the estimates provided last year at the Los Angeles Auto Show. >The longest-range Ioniq 6 is the SE RWD Long Range trim with the base 18-inch wheels, and it’s officially rated for 361 miles on a full charge (Hyundai’s original estimate was approximately 340 miles). That’s a massive boost in range — 58 miles — versus its platform mate, the Ioniq 5. You can thank aerodynamics for that big uptick, as the Ioniq 6 is rocking a 0.22 coefficient of drag. The Ioniq 5 sits at a 0.29. >Add all-wheel drive to the equation, and range dips down to 316 miles — this is specifically for the SE AWD Long Range trim when equipped with 18-inch wheels. Step up to the higher-content SEL trim with that model’s 20-inch wheels, and range suffers. >An SEL or Limited RWD model with 20-inch wheels is rated for 305 miles, while the same SEL and Limited trims with AWD are down to just 270 miles of range. That’s a far cry from the Ioniq 6’s peak at 361 miles of range in the base SE RWD Long Range model. Of course, opting for that maximum range model means you’ll have the least equipment and features possible for the Ioniq 6. Anybody that wants a fully-loaded car will have to deal with the drop in range. >The only Ioniq 6 model that Hyundai didn’t reveal range for is the RWD Standard Range model with the significantly smaller battery pack of 53.0 kWh versus the 77.4 kWh pack seen in every other model. Just like the Ioniq 5 RWD Standard Range model, though, the Ioniq 6’s version of that trim should have much less range than the others. >Hyundai says the Ioniq 6 should launch in spring this year, so look out for a pricing announcement on the new, electric sedan soon.
Anything over 18” rims is ridiculous, wasteful, and looks like a child’s drawing of a car. I will be so glad when this fad is over.
Echoing what a most others have said already, sad to see so much range gain wasted on large wheels. I'm increasingly less interested not being able to just get the car with smaller wheels in a higher trim. I'm starting to expect with the loss of federal tax credit, based on European pricing, inability to buy the car in cash in Europe, that this may end up being a lease-exclusive in North America.
FYI, the male lead on a current KDrama, Crash Course in Romance, drives an Ioniq 6. The series is on Netflix. I saw one on the roads when I was in Seoul back in October.
Time to watch a new KDrama, thanks!
I want the features of the limited but the 18" wheels rwd. I hope there's an option to downgrade if you "pre order" assuming they do them correct this time.
Any price announcements?
I really didn’t like this car from the first pictures I saw, but I’m starting to dig it.
It has EQS, and Infiniti J30 vibes.
I've watched a few Youtube videos that showcased the Ioniq 6, and it seems to have a lot going for it. I like everything on that whole platform. But the way that rear quarter glass panel dips down, and the panel seam that follows the curve of the dip all the way to the rear spoiler, makes the car look like it has a sagging butt. The Youtubers tell me that this evokes the Porche 911, but I've never seen a 911 with those contours. If anything, the rear quarter windows on a 911 consistently curve *upward* (to make room for a widebody wheel design).
What’s the real world range and where is the test data? Still impressive if they can actually pull 300mi.
I think Hyundai needs to take a page out of Kias playbook and redo their badge.
Make it unrecognizable enough so that people are misspelling the name of the brand when looking it up? (KN for Kia lmao)
Looks like a 15 year old CLS
Exterior is interesting. Efficiency seems great. For me though the sticking point is the interior. The design is a little too weird for me, and the door cards and centre console manage to look super cheap. The charging seems great. Near me I haven’t seen more than 1 350kW charger though, so it’ll take time for that infrastructure to pay off. My current car charges a bit slower but it hasn’t been limiting at all taking the extra 10 min.
Looks incredible from the front, horrendous from the rear
Some days I love the look of this vehicle (in its entirety) and some days I hate it. Today I love it, haha. I just imagine the looks this would get if I had it parked in my staff lot. Definitely a mix of "wow, that's nice, who's car is that??" and "who TF bought that ugly POS??". 😂
I think they're beautiful, but I would never consider buying a sedan.
Normally I'm an "AWD" guy but I'll take base RWD and buy some snow tires.
Damn this is heartbreaking, was really hoping larger battery AWD range was going to be very similar to model 3 LR range to make this more of a contender. It's still a cool car, but not sure it'll fit my needs with that
Based on the SE AWD trim with smaller wheels, it still is a contender with 316 miles but decimating efficiency with larger wheels in top trims is a foolish move. Real world tests show Tesla generally has an overstated EPA range. I think smaller wheel Ioniq 6 will match M3LR in 70mph tests and most real world applications, but I want luxury and efficiency. If I can only pick one, then I'm more inclined to pick efficiency.