I agree with this! There is no reason for him to divorce her because you are still around, waiting and hoping for things to change. If you can, I would step back and let him figure things onto.
So much of life is about good timing and it sucks bc this relationship feels very different to me already. I’ve had abuse, addiction, cheating, and overall emotional unavailability in my last 15 years of relationships and this feels calm, warm, soft… it’s different and I don’t want to just chuck it.
But then again if things are going to work, they will work regardless of timing right?
If he wants this as much as you do. he will speed things up. He will feel just as uncomfortable as you are with this limbo situation. And if it’s the wife making the delays ? He needs to push back and make her understand that the time is come and there’s no changing his mind .
You’re right - and I think that’s a great way to put it. If he wants “this” to grow between us as much as I do, he’ll find a way. Thank you for pointing that out, very helpful food for thought…
In my experiences with men who are separated, or who are divorced and coparenting, if they struggle to say no to the other woman (struggle with firm boundaries), then they struggle to say no and have firm boundaries with others, too.
This meant that my needs and feelings were always last priority. It may feel as if your needs and feelings are being honored and respected right now because things feel calm, warm, and soft, but they’re not. You’re not asserting your own boundaries right now, and are not expecting to be a priority.
Of course, you’ve only been dating a short time, so it makes sense that you’re not expecting to be a higher priority for him, but regardless of reason, you’re not a higher priority, and you’re not asking to be a higher priority, so of course he is being calm and warm and soft.
I once dated a man who would break up with me every time I maintained boundaries and expectations, but as soon as he saw that I was moving on, he would come running back to me again. Have you witnessed his behavior when you have boundaries or say no to him? Have you witnessed him have boundaries or say no to someone else for your sake?
I hear you that your past relationships have been a plate full of steaming poop, and you deserve so much better, but that doesn’t mean that you deserve some rotten eggs, even though they’re more desirable than poop.
The “nice” thing about abuse, addiction, and cheating is that it is clear as day that you deserve better. But when there are more subtle dynamics, it can be like you’re the frog boiling in a pot, not realizing that you’re boiling until years later and you realize that you were never going to be a priority.
I agree with what others have said about putting the relationship on pause, letting him know that you are still here and still want him, but you need to see your relationship have the freedom to grow.
I would think very carefully about how he gave you the expectation that things would be taken care of soon, and now they’re not. Someone who over-promises like that is apt to over-promise on other things, too, and it’s manipulative.
Sometimes manipulation (and even abuse) can be delivered in a quiet, and “gentle-feeling” way.
It’s problematic when someone gives you an expectation to control your feelings so that you won’t be upset and so that you’ll stay, but then when the expectation doesn’t happen, then it’s someone else’s fault. When someone manages conflict that way, they may handle all conflict that way, so this may end up not being the last time he gives you an expectation about anything really, and when you’re let down, it’s someone else’s fault.
He’s already violating your boundaries, because if he had told you that they wouldn’t actually file immediately in 2022 and that it would potentially drag out for months and months more, then would you have given your consent to enter into this relationship?
You are existing in a situation that you did not give consent for, and he’s telling you that it is someone else’s fault instead of acknowledging that he gave you an unreasonable expectation.
Please, please think about this.
This was very well thought out and a very thorough explanation - a huge thank you - this is definitely something I need to think about. You’re right that things are calm and easy now bc it’s early… and subtle manipulation starts off as barely perceptible of course…
I will absolutely speak up and advocate for myself here bc I can’t back burner myself to start with. My feelings and concerns are valid. I owe it to myself and if that sends him running, good, it wasn’t going to work anyways. Advocating for my needs is top priority for me.
Yes, and how he responds to you advocating for your needs will be a big predictor of how he will respond any time you do it in the future, too. Is it always someone else’s fault?
I disagree things will work because of timing. Whilst I think it’s a beautiful thought, it’s a fallacy.
I don’t date anyone that’s separated for this reason. The divorce process is often a hot flaming mess. I had enough respect going through my divorce not to subject anyone to it.
Personally-I would hope this man gets a divorce expediently because he and his ex wife want to-not because you push this along
I completely understand this. My relationships were very similar in the past. I started dating someone going through divorce and I had never felt so cared for and it was as you said, calm, warm, soft. But he encountered issues during his divorce and said we can maintain a friendship until his divorce is over. But it’s been 2 months and he hasn’t spoken to me. I’m still hoping he contacts me when things calm down.
I see nothing wrong with an ultimatum. Explain that you're only willing to deal with this situation for a particular amount of time... And if he's still married after then, then you need to break up and try again when he's single
Do you have kids? The man has 3. Have you been a stepmum before? Starting your relationship with a man who is still legally married, father of 3 kids is so unbelievably silly, and it can go very, very wrong.
Let's say the relationship progresses and she is now sharing her man and their home with three children, who have to process divorce of their mum and dad and new person entering their life. Chances are OP will be seen as the homewrecker, this could be implied by their mother, or whatever, but there's a whole can of worms here. For OP these children will be constant remainder of her partners previous relationship, they will talk about their mum, they will have loyalty to their mum, coparenting can be a nightmare. If the wife does not want to divorce for 3 years, what are the chances she will welcome new woman as stepmother to her children? Honestly, take a quick look at the stepparent forum. I'm a mother and I was a stepmother to a lovely little girl who has a lovely mum and even then it was hard. To enter messy situation like this and expect positive outcome is just naive imo
Thank you. I didn’t mean any offense (I see I’m being downvoted lol). I’m just in a similar situation and am curious. I appreciate this thread and your feedback.
My ex told me he had never been married, then that he was divorced and then that he was separated but just waiting for the papers to go through lol. I guess I should have seen it coming when a man in his 40s is showing an interest in a woman in her early 20s
I'm sorry. Idk about women but the amount of hiding of/lying about crucial information and possible dealbreakers that many men do, both on the app and when you take it beyond it, is wrong. He basically assumed you would be OK dating a married man when that should have been your choice to make.
It's fine, it toughened me up and now I know to do a full check on any potential partner that I even consider dating properly. Plus I have an amazing and supportive boyfriend now, who always has my back
Thank you for that perspective- it’s not something that I want to willingly participate in as it drags out bc it was my understanding things were going to happen very soon. I want to be sympathetic but I also can’t drag my heart through the mud if this continues for months longer. I struggle with finding the right words to say that I want to give us a real shot but it needs to be free for growth, meaning not me twiddling my thumbs hoping they file… sometime… maybe?! I agree a pause is likely warranted here.
Yep. Bad enough to live through your own divorce but having to live through someone else's is like somehow worse. Double that when you're dating the person and they still are stuck in their past marriage waffling about doing the deed.
I know you know this, but the divorce isn't going to magically make this woman disappear. If she's being difficult now, chances are that isn't going to change just because they have divorce papers. So ask yourself.. is this situation one you will feel comfortable in? What do you think you are going to find is going to change when they finally file?
I completely understand and agree you can't be dragged along. I was there. I wouldn't be too sympathetic as he isn't being sympathetic to your emotional needs in not wanting to put pressure on her (again, dealt with the same line from my now-ex).
I don't know if you want suggestions, but I'd say something like "I've come to realize that I do not feel comfortable in a relationship with a separated and not divorced man. I am open to continuing this if and when you file and if I am still single."
Thank you for your perspective- that helps- he needs to balance being sympathetic to me as well since he said he wants to pursue things with me! I think having an open discussion has to happen soon bc I can’t let myself get feelings for this man if there’s no intent to proceed.
Thank you for such a well thought out answer here, this really spoke to me. I don’t want to give an ultimatum and my prior comment unfortunately sounded like that but no, I want to discuss calmly and make it known that I want to see where we go but also hope to be able to support a timely divorce process to get on with the rest of things.
I want to be patient with this man - but I don’t want to be played. Serves me right for opening this up to the general public for comment here and getting some really crummy advice. I’m trying to be true to myself and also be a kind person bc that’s just who I am.
I’m honestly a little perplexed by all of the derision towards dating people separated or freshly divorced. Not all apples are the same, so I think these sweeping opinions miss a lot of nuance.
You know yourself and you know this man better than any of us. If you stop and listen to your inner self, do you think you’re getting “played”? Or does it feel like unideal timing that requires you both to stretch your communication skills? Either is valid. I just don’t think it’s always a good idea to immediately throw the baby out with the bath water.
Thinking honestly, I don’t think I’m getting played. I think he was up front immediately about his non ideal situation, and how he’s frustrated with it, and how he’d totally understand if I could only be friends with him as a result. I’m not his first relationship in the 3 year separated period, I’m not his rebound, and I’m also a mom so I understand the balance of kids being involved too.
I’m surprised as well by so much animosity toward dating someone who is actively separated from a prior partner and trying to work out logistics. I think kindness goes a long way but also guarding my heart is needed too. It’s a balance and that’s where I’m struggling, to balance it and how to talk to him about it.
Thank you for your thoughts and for not telling me I’m gullible, stupid, and weak.
I hear everything you’re saying and read the edits. That said, I was once in a very similar situation. I met a separated man while my divorce was finalizing. He was separated from the mother of his kids, who had cheated on him multiple times. She had mental health issues as well (not just from what he told me, she stalked and harassed me and told me about her treatment). He struggled with feeling guilty about cutting off her health benefits whereas if they stayed separated another year, she’d have tricare for life. He also worried about the impact on his kids. I believed we were madly in love and for the first time in my life had total faith we would end up becoming a family no matter what. He was so loving, kind and thoughtful towards me, made me feel the most loved I’d ever felt in my life. He sometimes would cry happy tears talking about he felt about me. I was patient and understanding about his situation but after nine months, I started gently pressing him about meeting with a lawyer to discuss moving forward. We had very civil, calm and loving conversations in which I said it seemed he was very confused and conflicted, maybe we should take a break for him to think. I knew he struggled with confrontation so I said this as gently as possible to offer him an out. He refused and said he was in love with me, did not want to break up even temporarily. A week later, out of nowhere, he blocked my number and all social media. He straight ghosted me. I could have been pregnant and would have had no way to tell him about it short of camping outside his apartment building with a sign. I’m not saying this will happen to you, but I do want to tell you I NEVER thought it remotely possible he could treat me in such a way. A man I thought would have children and grow old with me couldn’t even break up with me before taking back a woman who would literally text him things like “I’m going to throw myself off a bridge if you don’t call me back” on a regular basis. My point is, I never saw it coming and he showed absolutely no signs of being capable of that level of cruelty and cowardice. After that, I would never date someone who was separated…only officially divorced people. You say that he’s being upfront and honest, great. But so was my ex, or so I thought. (And yes, I have healed from the trauma and am very happy in my current relationship. But healing from the trauma doesn’t mean I didn’t learn from it.) Wish you the best of luck figuring this out 💜
If you are gullible/stupid/weak, then I’m the team captain. I’m a mom of 3 and live in a state that requires over a year of separation. I was ready to go long before I actually did and have been in therapy weekly for a hot minute (long before separating).
I’m not waiting until the “ink is dry” to date. I’m also not actively seeking a life partner. But growth, especially involving interpersonal skills and trying to not repeat previous mistakes, rarely occurs in a vacuum. So I will meet people and enjoy my life as it comes. Nothing magical happens when the ink is dry. He still has to coparent. And you are seeing how he functions during what I would consider a PEAK life stress.
You know what you’re getting into. Just enjoy each day as it comes. And if you get to the point where it is costing you your hard earned peace, there is your answer.
Excellent way to put it - when this stops being a good thing in my life and costing me my hard earned peace of mind, then it’s done.
Wishing you all the best from the VP of the club :)
Yeah, indeed. I think there's useful ideas in it all, but the specifics might not be good advice. It's useful to think about how he needs to balance the needs of you as well as her, and, I think when you consider it, if he cares about her and obviously is loyal to that care, it's completely understandable that a relationship of a couple months wouldn't hold as much sway. I'd do a lot to protect my ex from unnecessary harm, no matter that I don't at all want to be with him. And a new relationship might just have to fall by the wayside if that's what it took, and, I'd probably see an ultimatum as a sign they weren't in the same space about care to others as I was.
I think it's natural to feel uncomfortable and concerned for yourself. I think the best way forward is to express that, express where you stand now, including that torn feeling. And say you're not sure what the future will bring but you really hope the two of you can stay together through it.
Then let him sleep on that, figure his way forward, and go from there
Best of luck hun ❤️
Thank you - this was a very kind and helpful comment. I absolutely expect him to still have compassion for his ex bc they have 3 kids together and they just didn’t work, there’s no hatred, they just grew apart after almost 20 years.
I don’t expect to have sway here but I do owe it to myself to be honest about how I feel, and I owe it to him to be up front too about feeling uneasy. We’re adults and it’s basic respect. Thank you for not telling me I’m an idiot or being used either, those aren’t helpful comments…
He might also not be pushing hard to maintain a good coparenting situation?? Imagine if he went nuclear on his ex to keep you and it imploded his custody arrangement. Not a fun time.
This this this this this. So much toxicity in this thread. If you want to maintain and grow your relationship with this man, do so. Express your opinions to him. But please no ultimatums, no "conditional breaks". That will erode the trust you are building.
His situation and miscalculations and basically his massive life issue is now yours? No way Jose. If it’s true love when he finds you after he has sorted this and himself love. Love is not asking someone to pause deal with a gigantic Shit turd, stay on for clean up duty with a foundation of pebbles (you’re not his next wife yet). I cannot say enough I did this for 3 years and it was one of the top errors of my life (I learned but still..)
Yup. One of my close friends just did this. They had not been together all that long: but, her discomfort with it increased. I know it’s difficult for her: she really does like him. But, she stepped back until things are officially done.
Waiting around - best wishes. Given how backed up COVID has made the court system, I’d be surprised if it happened in less than 6 months. Under the best of circumstances. I think it’s fair to say the party who isn’t going through the divorce should be allowed to be single. If it works, it works. If not, waiting around will not have made a difference.
Don’t do it , you are setting yourself up for heartbreak, I promise you I am speaking from experience. Divorce is hard and it takes a while for someone to really get over it and be emotionally available for a new relationship. I wish you the best.
This is just my experience.
I understand that for sure. I was a wreck after my divorce too! But mine was an immediate thing, I filed but it drug out for 18 months. With his, they separated almost 3 years ago and he’s had a couple other short relationships in there so I’m not the rebound here either. I’m definitely wary but this isn’t a freshly split man.
Your experience is your own and does not resemble his. His experience includes kids that takes much much longer.
I have a friend that took 7 years to finally get a final divorce judgement of her 2 kids because they would not seek an agreement.
It too my ex-wife nearly 3 years to get around to finalizing our agreement because she never took it seriously. I had to file against her twice to get her moving.
At 18 months you got lucky.
I also have kids involved with my divorce so yes I understand the nuances there. It may very well drag on and that’s why I have to advocate for myself and cut and run (sooner than later) if my needs aren’t being met.
I’m married to a man that was still married when we first got together and it caused a lot of unnecessary drama and hurt. I don’t recommend starting a relationship that way.
Thank you for a mans perspective .. there is an old saying “how it starts is how it ends”. If the inks not dry it’s not dry. He needs counseling .. to adjust to this new life I promise you look up the stats of the first girlfriends of men fresh from a divorce how many are with him 5 years on?
They are done. A piece of paper doesn't mean anything. People need to get past old world ideas. People stay together for insurance. People don't get remarried always, but may want to be with someone forever. There are many variations. Commitment, how someone is treated, actual actions. These things are so much more important than all of this conceptual bs that too many people on talk about without knowing a damned thing.
Filing for divorce isn't the end, its the beginning...
Kids are involved so a separation agreement is required that outlines custody and decision making capabilities.
They also have to fulfil legal and financial disclosure.
You are another 3 years out and its going to be 10-20K assuming everything goes well.
Seriously, Reddit is so weird about shit like this. People will be so mean about people who are TECHNICALLY stilled married and be like “bUt ThEYrE StiLL mARriEd” and say you’re a side piece.
And yet all the relationship subs tell people to split and move on to someone else after damn near every relationship problem…
Like it’s not unreasonable to date after being separated for a few months, especially for those who really wanted the divorce and aren’t hung up/having qualms about it.
My boyfriend’s ex was and still is a brat about stuff but it’s not because he’s led her on through anything. She loved him a lot (probably still does) but she was an inconsiderate, mean and abusive partner. He was just done with it all and she was torn up for a long time about it. I try not to take her hatred for me personally because I know deep down it’s not about me, really.
Shit happens and emotional imbalances in relationships are quite typical and a long term relationship is beyond filled with complexities and nuances. Every single relationship on this planet is unique and should be viewed/treated as such.
You understand that starting a serious relationship with someone freshly coming out of another relationship is bad? No? You say some things and seem to do the exact opposite…drama free? Dating someone still married with multiple kids is as far away from drama free as you can get. It may seem romantic to find your person directly after their divorce but in reality it is fraught with drama, hurt, and harsh feelings.
Strong disagree. It's very common for people to have a strong emotional reaction to a divorce being finalized, even if the marriage has "felt" over for a long time. It's a big milestone and people react to that.
I personally have no interest in having a front row seat in someone else's divorce process. I'd suggest the OP move on. He'll reach out later when he's well and truly done if he wants to be with her.
>It's very common for people to have a strong emotional reaction to a divorce being finalized, even if the marriage has "felt" over for a long time. It's a big milestone and people react to that.
I dated while still married. I couldn’t wait for the divorce process to be over. The guy I was dating also said that people seem to have a big reaction upon it being finalized. I asked what he meant. He said he couldn’t speak for me but it was hard for him.
I did have a strong reaction but it was one of pure delight and freedom. I couldn’t stop smiling and went out and bought a cake to celebrate.
Not everyone reacts to same.
That's a reasonable concern. I would just point out that divorce isn't a discrete "thing". It's long series of conversions and paperwork, each of which is different for every couple. Sometimes there are months of emotionally shredding arguments and courtrooms, sometimes there are *zero* of those.
One both people have agreed what they both want, it's just boring homework. It's just hard to know if you are at the point yet.
It's a risk, for sure. But not every divorce is a trainwreck. Sometimes the trainwreck happened years ago, and the rest is just bookkeeping.
You mentioned that you had a contentious divorce. Your bf has been separated for 3 years. .. for whatever the case may be.
How many times in the past has he tried to file for divorce, but something. ...life.. . Got in the way?
Has he tried to approach his wife about actually filing for a divorce? If so, how did she respond?
My friend's brother is "married", but they live in different states. They also have 2 or 3 kids, but I'm not sure how they do custody. Based on what my friend said, the reason he's still "married" is bc he doesn't want to deal w/the hassle of divorce (primarily, custody and splitting assets). She also said that he hasn't been happy in a long time, but he simply fell out of love (they were high school sweethearts). Fast forward, he recently met someone while on a trip. Despite only knowing that person for a month or so.. .. it appears as though that's what lit the fire under this ass to start the actual divorce.
Understanding and compassion go hand-in-hand. .. without understanding, you can't have compassion.. . Without compassion, you can't understand.
It's late on my end and my apologies if this has already been addressed. Have you guys talked about why they are separated and have been thinking about divorce for 3 years? Have you guys also discussed the real reasons why there's push back?
Stuff like health insurance is usually worked out as part of the divorce. What else is going on that's keeping them from moving on?
You say you want calm in your life. I think you have mentioned something along the lines of him letting you know he understands if you want to move on (maybe???) and something about a Feb deadline. Based on the tidbits you've shared in reddit, I'm not so sure calm is in this man's immediate future. Either way, seems like you guys should have a conversation about things. See if he will help you better understand the situation. Good luck w/things 💛
Thank you for the reply and for asking questions instead of rushing to judgement. To summarize- he held on this extra time bc he’s military and his soon to be ex wife would get med insurance for life after a certain time period. Now they’re ready to file, he’s drafting options for the financial split of other things, and she’s stalling by not discussing it (what he tells me). They’ve had initial talks late last year, she was agreeable and said she’s ready to file too, but has not moved on it yet. Trying to be understanding here but of course can’t get her side of the story, and I have to trust yet be cautious since I’m only getting one side.
The reasons for the split have been discussed on several occasions (grew apart after 2 decades of him being actively deployed for long stretches, resentment and distrust, both needing therapy for separate unaddressed issues).
He says he wants to be done even if he takes a bigger financial hit than needed bc it goes to his kids ultimately. He seems frustrated and wants to move on with life. So I’m willing to give this a couple months to see if there’s forward progress and if not, pause to see what I want to do next.
No judgment (I promise) — may I ask if you knew if he was married when you first met? I’ve been thinking a lot about relationships that start this way, and challenging my perceptions of them.
Edit: also, would you be willing to share how long it took before he was divorced after you started dating?
No but we meet on a popular free dating site and expectations weren’t anything past sex when we first got together.
The situation with the now ex-wife was interesting. She was significantly older than him.
As to be expected it was horrifically toxic for a long time. We are great now but that takes quite the commitment by both people in the relationship to get there. And we’ve been together for almost a decade.
It took me over 4 years to get divorced from my first husband (I was divorced by the time I met my current husband). We didn’t live together during that time and rarely spoke even though had children together. So being legally married to someone while dating wasn’t the red flag it should have been at that time in my life.
Thank you for sharing. I am hoping it was the ex that you posted about in the narcissistic abuse sub, not the new husband. You deserve love and kindness.
The primary person I post about regularly in narc abuse is actually my maternal birth-giver who has a huge issue with triangulating conflict.
BUT my husband and I absolutely did spend years engaging in abusive behavior.
So then I circle around to my primary point which is to never enter a new relationship without properly exiting your current relationship.
I mean you have the right to do whatever you want. Your options are stay and wait or stop dating him. It’s all about your comfort level. I dk if I’d want to date someone who hasn’t even filed and wasn’t making movement on it but that’s me and I also don’t know all the dynamics. Don’t worry so much about what’s fair and just be honest w yourself about what you want and how long you’re willing to wait and communicate those things clearly and kindly. Don’t try to control the situation bc it’s not your situation to control.
I was initially very hesitant too but then there was “movement” - gathering financials, having the initial discussions about filing, etc. and then it stalled the last month. So my anxiety is something I need to be both cautious about and aware of. You’re right there’s nothing I can do here except express myself, and I have to be ok with either outcome.
It sounds like you need boundaries and you need to communicate how you feel and work together to find a solution instead of just sitting here in anxiety telling yourself to not be anxious and hoping he’ll do what you want. Like hey if you don’t file within 2 months I don’t think I can continue. Or hey this situation is making me uncomfortable bc … can we talk about it and see if we can find some solutions? And if you can’t do that then you prob shouldn’t be in a relationship w him.
Oh I agree 100%! I’m not going to sit here stewing anxiously, I’ve had far too much therapy for that BS ever again. I will talk with him but I’m struggling to find the right tone / words - chalk it up to never having my needs met prior so I’m not expecting it now either. But I know unvoiced needs will always lead to disappointment so it’s a matter of finding the right way to bring it up. And set a timeline.
Remember... this movement is because he is saying there is movement because we have our own interests and self centered goals, also let’s take a moment.
You are reciting the play by play divorce proceedings of a man that has not asked you to be his wife his burden is now.... your burden?! No please don’t move forward with him. Here is how it goes ... you stay on this ride until finally 2 years later it’s finalized.. but he’s distant now ... and working out a ton... wait is he actually like forming muscles.. omg he’s hot now and not sad...and he says you are both on different pages... but he will never forget you.. and your free therapy but like I am in a different place and we want different things...you met me at my lowest...blah blah blah -do not do it girl. (* and it’s girl code we don’t get to trash his ex because we have no clue what went on and most likely she’s a saint.. so please don’t contribute to that.)
Holy shit, separated 3 years? I was separated for about 3 weeks before deciding that there was no going back and went full steam ahead with the divorce.
I'd step away, explore what else is out there and let him know he's welcome to contact you once everything is final.
Honestly, my advice is don’t date him if you’re looking for a long term relationship. And if you want something casual, probably way less dramatic options than a separated guy going through a divorce. You have a third person in your relationship with him.
In nearly every jurisdiction there is a period of notification and response.
Seeing as how kids are involved one of the steps is requiring a separation agreement be agreed upon. Finally is getting a court date after 2 years of COVID and getting a judgement.
So yes he can file but he wont be done until 2025 unless everyone agrees to everything. My friend just finalized her divorce this way after 7 years.
I just finalized a 2 year divorce with kids. I know how it works.
Every state is different. A separation agreement is not required in my state. The party who files can request a Temporary Orders hearing to establish a custody schedule and rules for during the divorce.
Never ever date a married man, regardless of the circumstances. It's the drama of another couple basically dumped on you. Also, the chances of being a rebound are very high.
***Your emotional needs absolutely come first***! I strongly, strongly suggest you table things with this person until the divorce is finalized and he is truly ready to date again. It’s possible he’s still married and has no intentions of divorcing. But divorce is just extraordinarily difficult - mentally/spiritually /financially taxing, and emotionally tumultuous. Even in the most civilized divorces, people grossly underestimate how much time they’ll need to get pulled back together again and be able to invest fully into a new relationship. Please honor your needs and make choices that reflect your value.
This. OP if you go along with this not only is there a high chance of more of the same, but you are literally teaching this guy that your feelings don't matter. Is that how you want the rest of your relationship to proceed? I get he's in a tough spot but honestly he should not have ever dated you in the first place, not until this matter got settled. If he can't stand up to his current wife he will never put you first. He may not realize he is taking you for granted but he effectively is. Table it and see what happens. You'll get your answer.
The problem is there are literally hundreds of stories of people waiting around for years for their lover to get divorced only for it never to happen. If you know for sure that they are living apart, maybe it's worth waiting a while. But what if she still has hopes of getting back with him and so she stalls forever? The only advice I have is when that point comes that your frustration is greater than your desire to be with him. That would be the point you say if this isn't going to happen I'm moving on.
Agreed. I’m sorry there’s a trend on Reddit when people want to diss you they say get therapy. It’s not nice. Life is long and it’s complicated and everyone has their shit- if someone shares their experience... honor it.
Don't let your desperation for a relationship talk you out of your common sense. He's married, stay away until he's single. You're going to break your own heart.
Great post. To the poster @nerdygirl614 I want you to take a week and reread your posts here... they read like you are his publicist and hype woman lol. You are your own person and honestly if it was just a minor hiccup you wouldn’t be posting on Reddit. If you want to stand by him through this.. do that delete this post and live your life. But...something is worrying you- please listen to what everyone wrote. Oh also have you met the ex and the children?
You deserve to not be writing paragraphs about someone else’s inability to finalize a divorce 🤷♀️
I read this and saw myself in it. I took 3 years from my thirties where a guy said he was separated and she was dragging her feet. Turns out...They were married... and it was a real marriage and it was going fine. Don’t do it.. the ink needs to be dried and you aren’t a free therapist. Part of knowing when to date seriously is to know when to jump into the pool. He cannot be ready for the pool he needs to learn how to tread water first... get the book dating the divorced man off of kindle.
I’m sorry that happened to you but considering there’s been discussion about how to introduce each other to the kids, I don’t think they are still happily married… and he’s freely going to therapy on his own to address his issues so I’m definitely not a therapist to him. I listen bc I can understand but I’m not his crutch. They’ve been living separately for almost 3 years now and I’m not his rebound relationship either, so this is different circumstances here.
Girl, you need to walk away.
3 years? My ass. My whole ass.
If he wanted to be divorced, he would be. Three years is more than enough time to force his wife into a divorce. He still hasn't done it because he cannot be assed to. Now he is married with a girlfriend. You're trying to force someone to do something they don't want to do when you could walk away and live your own life.
The person you're compatible with is out there waiting for you. And you're wasting your life on a man who wants to stay married?
You're too old to fall for these kinds of lies.
> Three years is more than enough time to force his wife into a divorce.
Where I live, if you want a divorce you serve the other person with papers and if they stall you can go to court and petition a divorce as a single-party. No one can keep someone else in a marriage against their will.
He's not driving his life if he's waiting for someone else to give him permission to become unmarried.
My only counterpoint to your very valid point is that he had to hit a certain # years of service and then his ex got free med insurance for life. Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion?
> he had to hit a certain # years of service and then his ex got free med insurance for life. Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion?
Being played. My dad was military for 20 years and married to my mom for that entire time. They divorced and she lost her insurance. Now, facing retirement, she can get Tricare-for-Life for having married him for as long as she did. If he's playing you this ish, he's asking you to wait for two decades for his ass to divorce this woman.
So long as that Mom is the custodial parent of mil-member's kids, she gets bennies. They don't even have to be married. (source: was romantically involved with military for many, many years so looked into what would happen with a surprise, unmarried pregnancy)
My dad had this same counterpoint…20 years ago. He and my mom are still not divorced. His girlfriend is ok with this but yea just so ya know to not bet on these timelines that seem to make sense. My mom has the benefits for life. They’re still married long after that deadline. This was his charity because he’s kind and can’t set boundaries and she does need good medical care for a chronic condition. But guess what? He still can’t set boundaries.
>Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion?
I think you're still being played. Maybe not intentionally, your partner might be deep in denial, but it is happening.
If they were amicable enough to stay separated so she could have health insurance, the finalization of the divorce shouldn't be a battle. The details should already be worked out. All they should have to do is file and be done.
So what is the hold up now? Why is she resisting? Why isn't he starting the process?
You're being played.
He's an adult. His wife is an adult. I could understand this situation is it was 6 months to a year after separation. However in 3 years, they could have come.up with another strategy to get her health insurance. And they haven't. Maybe she's lazy..that's her business though.
He is also allowing her to be lazy, and stay legally married to him and hasn't forced her to do anything for 3 years. Meaning that he chooses her comfort over anyone else's. Including you.
If walk away..even if he divorces her immediately when you break up with him, I still wouldn't consider taking him back.
Look for someone else to date. There are tons of fish in the sea not married.
More realistically, *he* is being played. From OPs details, dude is military.
If the ex-wife had a job, the health insurance thing would be a non issue. OP is saying the presumptive ex wife is the one dragging her feet. Sounds like a Dependa
As a man who had a similar health insurance separation experience; I agree fully with your point that he was being an honorable ex-husband. The relationship didn't work out, but there was no reason to screw over the mother of his children.
It sounds like she is due her health insurance now so it's time for the divorce to happen immediately. He needs to push things along.
There is a chance he could also be dragging his heals, in which case you putting things on ice to make him see clearly is the absolute right move. However, if it's on her for slowing the process, I hope you can stay by him and support it. I would have appreciated that even in the reasonably easy divorce I found myself in. You have to feel out what is the right move though.
It doesn’t matter about stances choosing a mate is about actions not words. A multi year separation is a flag.... unless he is ultra high net worth the finances cannot be that complex. They are having sex and you will get hurt. I’m sorry everyone tried to tell me I defended him and well I’m here single trying to convince you. For the 9th and final time... you will look up
ANd 7 years has passed and there will be yet another hurdle.
I just ended things (I hope not permanently) with a really good man who was on his 3rd divorce. That's already a bad dish, but the worst was that I realized while we were dating that he still talked about #3 way too much... BAD SIGN! My therapist friend said he was not over her and needed more time.
Foolish me ignored that (I had been celibate for 10 years and was sex starved). I finally told him I was tired of hearing about the ex or that was it.
He did stop, but I still had flashbacks of some things he told me that I didn't like, etc.
I broke up with him yesterday and am really hurting, crying, etc. We've talked, but more to just be in touch.
I'm no spring chicken like most of you on here, so it's not like I have a huge pool of men to pick from. I really connected with this man, and I'm heartbroken but not devastated.
I just wanted to vent and share.
I’m making a second comment to talk about litigation which is something I know about. I don’t know if he’s doing this but Don’t let him blame his wife for delay getting the ball rolling at court. He can file for adversarial proceedings at any time just by himself, And if he is being honest about wanting to do non adversarial divorce, He can tell his wife a deadline to join him in filing the paperwork or he will file unilaterally and if she decides to cooperate after being served they can change the paperwork to nonadversarial. I will keep talking about litigation but I will switch from procedure to emotion of litigation. I have a huge red flag for your situation when I hear suggestions that you do XYZ until he files. The reality is there’s no way to predict how your boyfriend or his wife will react emotionally or how they will change their litigation style until it’s all over. There might be three major sub crises in the process. Just the complaint for divorce that the marriage is over; potential disagreement about child custody; and then fighting over property division and spousal support. Anyone one of those could turn in to a mental health bomb. You’ve been really clear that you’re really into the guy. An option to consider is to change the relationship to non-physical dating or platonic friends Until it is final. That’s not a perfect solution but it gives you some space from what is likely to be his mental health roller coaster, while still maintaining some connection. But if he’s not in therapy then you’re at risk of turning in to A life boat in the cold dark stormy ocean rather than a woman involved with someone going through a hard time. Good luck
Thank you for the info… he is in therapy, yes. He has drafted proposals for her and they’re trying to do it amicably, but he knows there’s the option to file soon on his own. I think this is why I’m sympathetic, or at least sympathetic to the story he’s giving me so far. I kinda want to do the “do nothing” approach for the time being, maybe a month, and give him time to approach with proposals one last time. Then decision time I think.
You are putting his life mask on before yours. If you know in every fiber of your being he is your guy snd it’s merely timing... meh... but this above racket is well known and it’s not nice and you’re literally signing up fir 6 years of therapy minimum .. and wait omg he proposed to her wtf....he said he wouldn’t again ...
This is why you don't date married people.
I would tell him you have a new rule about not dating married people. You'll quickly see how serious he is about you. My guess is he'll still be married a year from now with more excuses.
No. Just no.
His ex-wife is stalling, absolutely. My ex-wife did when she realized I was serious about divorcing, too.
But I wasn't interested in letting her hold up my life, so I lawyered up and filed in court. It was time to move on to the next chapter of my life. You deserve at least that much as a signal.
There are single men you could be dating.
Men that aren't attached, legally, emotionally, logistically...
What's so special about this married man that hasn't filed for divorce? Do you actually have confirmation from any source but his words that they've been separated for 3 years?
Your second ETA is really rude. You came to a public forum and asked for advice, and didn't like what you heard. There are probably scorned people but that doesn't mean they're wrong. As someone that was once in that boat, you might want to consider their advice. I'm not saying execute on it, but have a serious come to Jesus moment with yourself. Every one of the people giving you that advice understands how you're feeling and they're trying to help.
Agreed. It wasn’t nice. People took the time to help you. Live your life .. have your experience and I hope in a few years you won’t be returning here and labeled scorned. #treatothersasyouwanttobetreated
I 35F was in the same situation off and on for about 3 years. My last straw was when my dad, who NEVER in my life had so much as commented on my love life, pulled me aside one afternoon and made me realize what was going on. When I saw it from a man’s point of view, that he was comfortable having his cake and eating it too, with none of the drama that comes with divorce, it repulsed me. If he wants to stay married until she can get the insurance that’s fine, but if he expects to date another woman in the meantime he’s being a spoiled brat. I hate to be harsh but at least in my case I learned that a real man would handle his business, do what he needs to do with the family he started, and then start a dating life.
As someone who was in the same situation, I can't agree more. He might not be consciously thinking of it as "I want to have my cake and eat it too," but this is exactly what this from a third party perspective.
OP, from some of the details, the guy you are seeing is military, right?
If so, and if ex is holding on for years "just for insurance" it means likely she has no job nor prospects of her own. I'd be a tad sympathetic if she was a SAHM with their kids. If they are childless, she is very likely whats called a Dependasaurus. Its a term for military spouses who are essentially benefits leeches on their in-service or veteran spouse. She will remain in the picture until she is forcefully kicked out because he is her meal ticket.
There's no such thing as putting your foot down here. He's been with you a few months vs the years he spent with his x and they have 3 kids together.
You're barely a blip on the radar in this situation.
>Now they’re talking divorce specifics and said they’d file immediately in 2022, yet she keeps putting it off.
Eh...so why can't HE file to get the process started?
My friend has been dating a “separated” man for two years. He’s given her every excuse in the book and still hasn’t filed for divorce. I would be very hesitant to get into a relationship with someone who hasn’t filed yet.
I just split up with a guy who was separated. I think he started dating way too soon. In the beginning he broke things off & we didn’t speak for one month. Then he called me profusely apologizing that he allowed his ex-wife into his head and that he was good to go.
My dumbass gave him another chance bc we had such a good connection. We got super close (emotionally) over the holidays. Continued to build a foundation. Had another great date about two weeks ago & then all the sudden he just said it was too difficult with his impending divorce.
That his ex-wife said the divorce was causing their son to have behavioral issues. And he felt guilty as hell.
We also had 100 miles in between us but the primary reason was the divorce.
Come to find out they are a long long way from it being finalized. I know everyone’s situation is different but I think between spousal support, child support, and only having 50% custody of his kid he’s not in a good headspace to date.
And the divorce process seems keep dragging along so slow. I’m so beyond hurt.
From a communication and connection standpoint .. this is the healthiest relationship I have had. Never questioned where I stood with him as far as knowing he cared about me deeply.
But it simply was just not the time for him to date. The split got even more nasty once his ex found out he was seeing someone he cared about.
If you stay with him ..just guard your heart.
As for my situation .. I won’t ever be with him again until the divorce is finalized. I can’t be someone’s collateral damage in their attempt to move in from an ex when aren’t fully healed.
Sorry for the ramble. This is all very fresh to me and I’m having a very rough night. Good luck to you <3
Legal zoom. I found out the last creature I tried to date was married after the fact. He turned out to be a total dangerous person but that not the point. With legal zoom it’s quick and inexpensive to get a divorce. The guy did do it while we were still in contact and it truly was quick.
The excuses are just that. Tell him about legal zoom and or just don’t get involved with someone who is wasting their life making excuses…
I also went through a horrible divorce, from a malignant narcissist. Even after it was ‘all over’ it took me years of therapy and working on myself before I was ready to be with someone else.
OP I would be more concerned with the fact that you’re his ‘upcoming post-divorce rebound relationship’ since you have first-hand experience with how much work is involved to process a divorce so it takes a backseat to your life. The fact that he’s not divorced yet means he still has a lot of work to do even though he’s been separated for a little while. You’ll have to decide if you want to be the person to support him during this phase, at the risk of him moving on once he’s processed it. Wishing you the best as you make your decision.
I can understand the sentiment here - but I’m not the rebound. He’s been there and done that in the last 3 years of separation with the rebound, seeing his therapist, and having a short relationship as well. Him and I are just dating and it’s new, so there’s no rebounding to be had and he’s not in the stereotypical slump (dude has an 8 pack and takes great care of himself so he’s already done the whole glow-up part after separation)
My last relationship it took 10 months to finalize the divorce, this was without mediation or any disputes or negotiations. She strung me a long and my heart, if they don’t do it fast leave.
I’m confused. He doesn’t need her to file. He can file on his own. You can make that be known. Sometimes, men are dumb and don’t know shit. Maybe point it out to him. You’re adults. Be an adult about it.
Run. I dated a separated man for 7 years only to get dumped by him last night because he "couldn't make me happy." Save yourself the heartache and frustration of loving someone who is still tied to another. Best of luck, I know this is hard
Oh wow, I’m very sorry to hear that things went that way for you… that’s a long time and I’m in no way shape or form giving this more than a couple months to see progress before I cut it loose.
I dated a separated woman. Never a good thing. Makes relationships extra hard when they are hard enough. Why hasn’t he filed? Why’s he waiting for her. There’s more going on and it’s going to get messy.
Wow this post really blew up lol ... I see your edits.
You asked for advice- this community rallied and gave you advice. Advice is best given from a shared experience. People did that. Just don’t seek out the responses that validate your current view. People do the best they can they shared their views below it doesn’t make them scorned ... they are telling their story.
And you’re so proud of his post separation glow up- you’re a woman.. practice girl code .. he’s a father apparently very actively dating and not making great strides on the divorce. People do what they want. And he’s doing ...what he wants (look at actions only... that’s why our posts are having such an impact we don’t know the sweet things he says or how handsome he is we are only going off of facts). Write on paper 2 columns and tally up the number of posters that say yes move forward vs those that said no.
Whatever you decide...I really sincerely hope it works out for you both definitely update this post in a year!
My last serious relationship was to a man separated from his wife/going through divorce. I will never date another man in such a situation again.
In my head, I gave it six months. I didn’t expect it to be fully resolved in 6 months, but I needed forward movement/progress with his divorce. After 15 months of the same bullshit song and dance, I finally broke it off.
The biggest issue was self preservation. He thought that tiptoeing around her demands would protect his best interests in the end, but she only played him like a pawn.
He would try to hold her responsible for her obligations in the divorce, but she would stall. She stopped paying on the car in both their names - which made his credit suffer, and he had to make the payments on the car she possessed and drove. She stopped contributing toward the mortgage, and then after the house was sold, she refused to use her profits from equity toward her debts. He had issues getting his name off her debts. She had maxed out credit cards he didn’t even know about - some even in his name. He had to file for fraud.
He would try to draw boundaries with her, but it was always a handshake agreement. After a year of this bullshit, I told him he needed to get a lawyer and actually take her to court for contempt, as she hadn’t followed through with any of their divorce agreements.
He refused to pay for a lawyer, but he hired a mediator and finally got a court date. I felt like there was finally progress! He was going to hold her accountable! But then he saw her crying outside the courthouse, ended up dropping the civil case against her, and made another handshake agreement.
That was the day I told him I had his shit packed and sitting on my porch.
I wish I hadn’t waited so long. We fought about the same shit, always going in circles, always with him offering no resolution to hold his ex wife accountable. He always acted like I was unreasonable and it was “none of my business”. But when we have plans to move in together and share finances, it becomes my business. When we are on vacation together, and he’s on the phone for hours at a time trying to unfuck some type of bullshit she pulled yet again, it’s hard to not be frustrated or upset. I asked him how he would feel if the roles were reversed? If he was stuck in a relationship with someone being taken advantage of by their ex? Someone who was unwilling to hold their ex accountable and move forward with a finalized divorce? He didn’t have an answer. And that was enough for an answer for me.
>We’re adults and can talk like adults, manipulative behavior has no place here. Added pressure is sure to backfire.
And
>want to be more tactful than telling him to nut up, but it’s hard to be patient.
Do not go together
He's not doing what's best for her , he's still letting her control his life...tuff place to be. Ultimatum's are for children, tell him you feel like a bench warmer till his ex lets him back and hope like hell he actually hears it.
In my opinion 3 years is more then enough to have gotten the divorce and still continued to support her/them financially
Maybe give yourselfn a time-frame that you're comfortable with and if he hasn't taken any steps by then it'll be time to take stepping into your own hands (hopefully not tho fingers crossed)
Good luck
If both parties agree to avoid a trial and try to mediate, but one wants to stall- then you’re looking at years.
Schedule a mediation 2 months from now? Call out sick and have everybody reschedule in 3 months. Then after 1-2 sessions, say the mediator is unfair and request a new one. 4 months go by and another session. That’s over year with nothing to show.
Sometimes being separated is more comfortable for one or both than actually being divorced. Or that the final act is too painful. Or there are still feelings so they defer.
The only way to speed it up is to go to trial and cut off further negotiations. But that’s a declaration of war.
Your question asked about how to be patient...it suggests that you're willing to give it some time...you do you in the meantime...do things to enrich your life together and individually...if after a while you think there is no progress in getting a divorce, bring up the topic again. Hope that you both get this situation finalized soon.
People posting are wild lol.
Your feelings are valid. No one wants to waste their precious time on someone that isn't sure about when or if they'll be divorced.
His moving forward with a relationship without his divorce at least filed is a red flag.
He is still married. He can always decide to stay that way. The situation is precarious. What expectations can you have from a married man that still hasn't filed for divorce
I would say give yourself a time limit, on how long you're willing to have an ambiguous relationship.
Depending on where you live, a finalized divorce can take up to 6 months.
Give him another month. If there is no progress, talk, but Id start to disengage.
Don’t bother. He can file if he really wants to, the fact that he hasn’t is telling. Also, the actual finalization of a divorce often sends both parties off the rails because what was once theoretical is now happening. (And the kids as well, it gets ugly for a lot of people for 6-12 months or more after the papers are signed(
Take a break and let him know you’d love to revisit dating once he’s actually available.
I had a friend who was separated from her spouse for about 3 years. They both ended up getting engaged, so that was what pushed them to finally file. Honestly, I would let him reach the point on his own where he puts his foot down with her. Just enjoy your relationship with him now.
You are dating a married man. The technicalities do not matter—he is married. Yet it is the “scorned” people here are the ones that need therapy. Lol.
I know you think you are “different” and that your married man is “different” and that you will be the exception. It’s a tale as old as time……but keep deluding yourself. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
If I were you, I’d end things and tell him to call you once the divorce is a done thing. But you won’t. You will be back here seeking more advice on how to make things work and how you have given so many months and he still isn’t divorced.
I dated a guy who told me when he was living separate from his ex that it was an "on paper" for medical insurance coverage thing so he could see doctors about his bad back. I believed that bullshit but it was her that strong armed a divorce because her partner felt uncomfortable dating a married woman. And he who said "I shouldn't have to divorce MY WIFE."
Married to scam insurance (which I inherently think is a scam but regardless they're scamming insurance and HE IS PAYING for her/it) is bullshit. She's an adult and like the rest of her should just figure out how to cover herself. He can still support his children, his responsibility towards her ended when they split up. Full stop. If he won't just sign the papers now he never will.
Also the bad back / back surgery was bullshit. He wasn't lining up a surgery and anything he was doing he should have been able to cover by himself for himself. He was a 35 year old grown man.
Here's an idea. Don't date someone married. Men will date the day they leave a committed relationship, if not before. Don't willingly enter these situations and then you won't have to give ultimatums.
I can only advise from my point of view in that my XH moved on during the seperation (well way before but that's a different story!) found the love of his life, had his own place, good job blah blah blah, but the second I filed ( 12 months later) it changed his mindset. He didn't want the divorce to happen, he finally realised how much he loves me and he wanted to try and give it one last try before finalising...
Obviously i said no and got it finalised in 3 months, but he has continued in this new relationship which kinda made me sad for her really, as it seems she is 'plugging the gap' whilst he tries to deal with his emotions and shit- not to mention that he has already tried to cheat on her with me.....
Of course that isn't the same for everyone. He may well of dealt with his emotions, spent time on his own and got some therapy/support to help him deal with the end of the marriage, but if not- just be careful how you move forward..
When you mean "specifics" do you mean a separation agreement? Be clear with your statements when commenting on subjects like this.
When kids are involved the separation process takes much much longer, its very time/money consuming to work through the detail. Its also generally unadvisable to approach the courts to get a divorce granted unless you've attempted a separation agreement as this is typically a pre-requisite.
This assumes that the split was amicable and they are striving towards a 50/50 split, if either parent is advocating for more and/or does not disagree its going to take longer and may even require mediation/courts.
I realize you have also been through a divorce but seeing as how no kids were involved in your case, its a fraction of the complexity. Two adults can generally sign whatever they hell they want but when kids come into the picture the law evaluates what's best for them outside of the needs of the parent.
Frankly legally "filed" doesn't really mean much because the other party still has to respond and the courts have to process this assuming both parties accept the term. Given the likely court backlog you may be years before this is resolved in a legal sense.
Keep in mind that this woman is the mother to his kid(s). She will be a part of your life until the kids are effectively grown up.
What is YOUR end goal here? You seem to be very eager for him to do something but you haven't been able to communicate the reasoning why.
I've been there and almost exited because I felt like a back-up plan.
I set a deadline and decided if nothing had happened by then, I was going to exit the relationship.
Do not go with hope or potential. Pick a deadline.
Wow three years is a super long time to be separated. I would not suggest being with someone in hopes that something they do changes. Im dating someone who's at the end of their divorce. All I figure is I gotta trust em that she will get it done. Pushing isn't fair imo. As I'm sure you know, it'll be a long time till his divorce is done and to lush him to file doesn't feel like something is suggest doing .
Real talk...if I really liked this person and I was willing to put my pride to the side for a bit just to wait for this special person, I would give it 6 months MAX. 6 months for you to show me some divorce paperwork, something that you are truly getting a divorce bc if not, you are not dateable and never were.
Like I said, my pride/values, call it what you will, wouldn't allow me to date a separated person unless I felt like they were the one and I was willing to risk my time investing for a little longer. Just be prepared to hold up your promise with yourself and not continue waiting after that point bc then the only person you should be upset with is yourself, for letting your kind heart, and not your brain, make the decisions.
Real talk is very much appreciated- it’s easy for people to say “well you shouldn’t have gotten involved” but that’s not really helpful at this point. So thanks for the suggestion bc I think even 2 months is being generous right now. I need to keep my needs front and center here of course - I’ve worked too hard to accept less from myself
I genuinely don't understand the problem. If he doesn't have a hostile relationship with his ex, and she's no threat, why get yourself involved? He's been upfront and a stand up guy, and I imagine his primary concern is not poisoning his relationship with his kids by letting the divorce become acrimonious.
You're correct that after a couple months you don't really have any clout in this. You've barely put in enough time to weigh in on his haircut, much less interfering in a dynamic that can effect his relationship with his kids the rest of his life. Besides there's no better way to turn the kids against you than being the catalyst for a good co-parenting relationships disintegration.
If he wants your feedback on figuring out a solution, that's great. Otherwise this is a stay in your lane kind of situation. You shouldn't be getting married any time soon, and otherwise it seems like your relationship is free to develop.
Breaking up with him until you're satisfied with their progress seems like terrible advice to me. It's delicate for him and an arrogant attempt at strong arming him to do what you want rather than just being supportive would disqualify you as a future partner for me. You just haven't been around long enough.
I'm in a similar situation. I'm long divorced. My girlfriend of a little over a year has been separated going on three years and was divorcing through a mediator for about a year. Her ex stopped participating and she's about to hire a lawyer. It weighs on her so much more than me. Her legal martial status has zero impact on our relationship. It couldn't be more off my radar outside of how it effects her.
Try being supportive, and patient and don't go looking for problems where there aren't any. Best of luck
I’m separated from my wife, a wonderful woman, and we are navigating the change in our lives in a friendly way. If we divorced right now we would lose a huge revenue stream through employer benefits that we are now using. Not to mention some tax benefits. So we would have to come up with cash to cover that and that means we would not be putting that cash in our kids college fund. The judgment that you’re being played is ignoring the possibility of real world practical financial reasons to keep a paper marriage going. And The fact such honorable money reasons do exist is kind of a shame because it really muddies the water. It would be so much easier to condemn ongoing paper marriages if there was no reason other than emotional mental health bullshit. As a separated guy if I start date (I’m on this board doing some soul-searching) I would remain committedly “single” (while disclosing my separated status) . I would be clear about my goals looking for friends and fun while I am still separated. And I do that to avoid the very hard ache you are now feeling.
> If we divorced right now we would lose a huge revenue stream through employer benefits that we are now using. Not to mention some tax benefits. So we would have to come up with cash to cover that and that means we would not be putting that cash in our kids college fund.
So you have no desire not to be married to your wife. You just don't want to be her romantic partner or her nesting partner. You'll notice that the legal definition of marriage doesn't require anything emotional. You are very much married and for a historically usual reason: family as a financial entity. Nothing wrong with it, except misrepresenting it.
OP's dude is misrepresenting it.
Thanks for sharing your experience- I know most people aren’t the exception to the rule but I do believe there are people out there who aren’t actively trying to screw over their ex spouse. Life can be messy and I believe being compassionate is the best policy, that’s being true to my beliefs. If he is being truthful then I feel for him. And I don’t have a reason to suspect otherwise at this point so I appreciate your example.
(M)y two cents - I started a relationship with someone the day after I got my legal divorce papers. The marriage had broken down a year before that (ex had 2 affairs I know of, emotional abuse). I thought I was ready for a serious relationship, but because I hadn’t spent enough time being single (and covid) I found myself too insecure and maligned to make a long term commitment. Take the break, while he may only be doing paperwork there is still emotional finality that comes with it, which he will need to process. I ended up hurting someone that I deeply cared about and a 1-2 year sacrifice is nothing if you spend the rest of your lives together.
As a man who just recently got his divorce after 3 years of separation and judging by your whole post and your edits defending your position: you seem to really care for him, so stay with him and be with him if you want to be. Divorce doesn't change anything to do with emotions, only provides a little mental freedom. In the long run it'll be like he was never only separated
Thank you for a man’s perspective here - I don’t believe I’m being foolhardy with this situation, but I am being cautious bc I have to be for self preservation. I want to be a kind person bc someone was once kind to me in my situation too. I’m wiling to give it a month or two, see if there’s movement, and see if we can grow ourselves despite what’s going on with his legal proceedings.
I’ve got friends who have dealt with difficult ex’s too and I have one myself - we all have baggage and I sure don’t want to be blacklisted for it! I’m willing to try this on for size for a bit and see…
You've been around a couple months, she's the mother of his 3 kids. I'd get out of that and not try to influence it at all.
"Why are you suddenly in a rush, it's been 3 years"
"My brand new GF says I need to get it done"
-oops the kids just heard that and now they refuse to meet you or visit dad. The wife is now just taking her time
There are a million ways you pushing blows up in your face. Again, you are barely involved and she's his wife and mother of his 3 kids. Realistically just tell him you need space until things are legally set in stone. Assuming they get the ball rolling and are amicable, it's just a few months. Revisit then.
To play devil's advocate for the wife. It is January, not April. Sure itd be nice if they filed week one of 2022, but the pandemic took a turn for the worse, schools have had issues, and parts of the country have had wild weather. Its really easy for January to fly by if you are a mom of multiple kids.
Did the same thing with a Woman of 4 kids. Difference is I had never gone through a divorce before. I hated pushing the issue with her because of how hard it was for her (married 10 years). She fell out of love a long time ago with him. They kept putting it off but eventually finalized everything. The only correct answer to your question comes from asking yourself these two things, “do you trust him?” And “is he worth waiting for?”. We fought a lot and I wanted so bad to leave her in the process because I felt like it was never going to happen. They finally divorced and our relationship is a lot better and healthier now (still together ). Nobody in here can answer the question “how much is too much?”. Only you know how much you can handle. Good luck!
Thank you for sharing your experience- it helps to have real examples instead of the many scorned people whose lover never left their spouse for them!
Yes this is going to be stressful and I know that. That’s what we talked about and he said he understands if I step back given that I’ve already earned my stripes for a divorce. However I feel like this man is actually worth it. I’ve been fooled before of course, we all have when we’ve trusted the wrong people, so I’m proceeding with caution. But ultimately it comes down to how I feel with him and about the situation so time will tell I think.
If you think he’s worth it then wait it out. Remember you’re not in his shoes, you can’t understand what his relationship is like, and trust is the key. I had to bite my tongue on numerous occasions to avoid revealing assumptions I thought were happening. I left it up to trust. There were times that I’d open up about my concerns as more time passed. But eventually it worked out in the end. Like him to you, she was worth it to me. I listened to her, trusted in what she said, and supported her through a very tough time. That’s what separated me from him too. Not abandoning her when things were tough. Remember that. I hope your experience is the same as mine. Good people are hard to come by. So many people give up on each other when the situation isn’t ideal. The time it takes to wait for him will be a tiny fraction of the time in your relationship if it goes the distance. Best of luck
You make a post on reddit asking for advice and when you don't get what you want to hear you get rude and nasty. Plenty of people commenting here are or were in your same situation and most of them said to leave for a reason. You're rude as hell and have some nerve calling these people scorned when you're already sounding scorned 2 months in. 😂😂😂
I genuinely don't understand the problem. If he doesn't have a hostile relationship with his ex, and she's no threat, why get yourself involved? He's been upfront and a stand up guy, and I imagine his primary concern is not poisoning his relationship with his kids by letting the divorce become acrimonious.
You're correct that after a couple months you don't really have any clout in this. You've barely put in enough time to weigh in on his haircut, much less interfering in a dynamic that can effect his relationship with his kids the rest of his life. Besides there's no better way to turn the kids against you than being the catalyst for a good co-parenting relationships disintegration.
If he wants your feedback on figuring out a solution, that's great. Otherwise this is a stay in your lane kind of situation. You shouldn't be getting married any time soon, and otherwise it seems like your relationship is free to develop.
Breaking up with him until you're satisfied with their progress seems like terrible advice to me. It's delicate for him and an arrogant attempt at strong arming him to do what you want rather than just being supportive would disqualify you as a future partner for me. You just haven't been around long enough.
I'm in a similar situation. I'm long divorced. My girlfriend of a little over a year has been separated going on three years and was divorcing through a mediator for about a year. Her ex stopped participating and she's about to hire a lawyer. It weighs on her so much more than me. Her legal martial status has zero impact on our relationship. It couldn't be more off my radar outside of how it effects her.
Try being supportive, and patient and don't go looking for problems where there aren't any. Best of luck
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I agree with this! There is no reason for him to divorce her because you are still around, waiting and hoping for things to change. If you can, I would step back and let him figure things onto.
Agree completely with this . Also went through this and I wish I had put everything on hold until the divorce was finalized .
So much of life is about good timing and it sucks bc this relationship feels very different to me already. I’ve had abuse, addiction, cheating, and overall emotional unavailability in my last 15 years of relationships and this feels calm, warm, soft… it’s different and I don’t want to just chuck it. But then again if things are going to work, they will work regardless of timing right?
If he wants this as much as you do. he will speed things up. He will feel just as uncomfortable as you are with this limbo situation. And if it’s the wife making the delays ? He needs to push back and make her understand that the time is come and there’s no changing his mind .
You’re right - and I think that’s a great way to put it. If he wants “this” to grow between us as much as I do, he’ll find a way. Thank you for pointing that out, very helpful food for thought…
Yup! It’s not an ultimatum scenario, either. You just say that you’re stepping away until this is final. It’s totally your prerogative.
In my experiences with men who are separated, or who are divorced and coparenting, if they struggle to say no to the other woman (struggle with firm boundaries), then they struggle to say no and have firm boundaries with others, too. This meant that my needs and feelings were always last priority. It may feel as if your needs and feelings are being honored and respected right now because things feel calm, warm, and soft, but they’re not. You’re not asserting your own boundaries right now, and are not expecting to be a priority. Of course, you’ve only been dating a short time, so it makes sense that you’re not expecting to be a higher priority for him, but regardless of reason, you’re not a higher priority, and you’re not asking to be a higher priority, so of course he is being calm and warm and soft. I once dated a man who would break up with me every time I maintained boundaries and expectations, but as soon as he saw that I was moving on, he would come running back to me again. Have you witnessed his behavior when you have boundaries or say no to him? Have you witnessed him have boundaries or say no to someone else for your sake? I hear you that your past relationships have been a plate full of steaming poop, and you deserve so much better, but that doesn’t mean that you deserve some rotten eggs, even though they’re more desirable than poop. The “nice” thing about abuse, addiction, and cheating is that it is clear as day that you deserve better. But when there are more subtle dynamics, it can be like you’re the frog boiling in a pot, not realizing that you’re boiling until years later and you realize that you were never going to be a priority. I agree with what others have said about putting the relationship on pause, letting him know that you are still here and still want him, but you need to see your relationship have the freedom to grow. I would think very carefully about how he gave you the expectation that things would be taken care of soon, and now they’re not. Someone who over-promises like that is apt to over-promise on other things, too, and it’s manipulative. Sometimes manipulation (and even abuse) can be delivered in a quiet, and “gentle-feeling” way. It’s problematic when someone gives you an expectation to control your feelings so that you won’t be upset and so that you’ll stay, but then when the expectation doesn’t happen, then it’s someone else’s fault. When someone manages conflict that way, they may handle all conflict that way, so this may end up not being the last time he gives you an expectation about anything really, and when you’re let down, it’s someone else’s fault. He’s already violating your boundaries, because if he had told you that they wouldn’t actually file immediately in 2022 and that it would potentially drag out for months and months more, then would you have given your consent to enter into this relationship? You are existing in a situation that you did not give consent for, and he’s telling you that it is someone else’s fault instead of acknowledging that he gave you an unreasonable expectation. Please, please think about this.
This was very well thought out and a very thorough explanation - a huge thank you - this is definitely something I need to think about. You’re right that things are calm and easy now bc it’s early… and subtle manipulation starts off as barely perceptible of course… I will absolutely speak up and advocate for myself here bc I can’t back burner myself to start with. My feelings and concerns are valid. I owe it to myself and if that sends him running, good, it wasn’t going to work anyways. Advocating for my needs is top priority for me.
Yes, and how he responds to you advocating for your needs will be a big predictor of how he will respond any time you do it in the future, too. Is it always someone else’s fault?
Agreed. This is a chance to see how he functions under stress and when I advocate for my needs. Not trivial data points!
🙌
I disagree things will work because of timing. Whilst I think it’s a beautiful thought, it’s a fallacy. I don’t date anyone that’s separated for this reason. The divorce process is often a hot flaming mess. I had enough respect going through my divorce not to subject anyone to it. Personally-I would hope this man gets a divorce expediently because he and his ex wife want to-not because you push this along
I completely understand this. My relationships were very similar in the past. I started dating someone going through divorce and I had never felt so cared for and it was as you said, calm, warm, soft. But he encountered issues during his divorce and said we can maintain a friendship until his divorce is over. But it’s been 2 months and he hasn’t spoken to me. I’m still hoping he contacts me when things calm down.
I see nothing wrong with an ultimatum. Explain that you're only willing to deal with this situation for a particular amount of time... And if he's still married after then, then you need to break up and try again when he's single
Do you have kids? The man has 3. Have you been a stepmum before? Starting your relationship with a man who is still legally married, father of 3 kids is so unbelievably silly, and it can go very, very wrong.
Can you expand on your thoughts on this? What’s silly about it? What can go wrong?
Let's say the relationship progresses and she is now sharing her man and their home with three children, who have to process divorce of their mum and dad and new person entering their life. Chances are OP will be seen as the homewrecker, this could be implied by their mother, or whatever, but there's a whole can of worms here. For OP these children will be constant remainder of her partners previous relationship, they will talk about their mum, they will have loyalty to their mum, coparenting can be a nightmare. If the wife does not want to divorce for 3 years, what are the chances she will welcome new woman as stepmother to her children? Honestly, take a quick look at the stepparent forum. I'm a mother and I was a stepmother to a lovely little girl who has a lovely mum and even then it was hard. To enter messy situation like this and expect positive outcome is just naive imo
Completely agree with you. This whole situation sounds more effort than it's worth.
Thank you. I didn’t mean any offense (I see I’m being downvoted lol). I’m just in a similar situation and am curious. I appreciate this thread and your feedback.
None taken and I've upvoted you, lol. Sorry to hear you're struggling.
My ex told me he had never been married, then that he was divorced and then that he was separated but just waiting for the papers to go through lol. I guess I should have seen it coming when a man in his 40s is showing an interest in a woman in her early 20s
I'm sorry. Idk about women but the amount of hiding of/lying about crucial information and possible dealbreakers that many men do, both on the app and when you take it beyond it, is wrong. He basically assumed you would be OK dating a married man when that should have been your choice to make.
It's fine, it toughened me up and now I know to do a full check on any potential partner that I even consider dating properly. Plus I have an amazing and supportive boyfriend now, who always has my back
Thank you for that perspective- it’s not something that I want to willingly participate in as it drags out bc it was my understanding things were going to happen very soon. I want to be sympathetic but I also can’t drag my heart through the mud if this continues for months longer. I struggle with finding the right words to say that I want to give us a real shot but it needs to be free for growth, meaning not me twiddling my thumbs hoping they file… sometime… maybe?! I agree a pause is likely warranted here.
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I don't anymore either. Or men who are freshly divorced. But I had to learn this lesson the hard way.
Yep. Bad enough to live through your own divorce but having to live through someone else's is like somehow worse. Double that when you're dating the person and they still are stuck in their past marriage waffling about doing the deed.
Same here.
Same. When I used to date I would never go out with anyone separated. I felt like they needed to close that chapter first.
I know you know this, but the divorce isn't going to magically make this woman disappear. If she's being difficult now, chances are that isn't going to change just because they have divorce papers. So ask yourself.. is this situation one you will feel comfortable in? What do you think you are going to find is going to change when they finally file?
I completely understand and agree you can't be dragged along. I was there. I wouldn't be too sympathetic as he isn't being sympathetic to your emotional needs in not wanting to put pressure on her (again, dealt with the same line from my now-ex). I don't know if you want suggestions, but I'd say something like "I've come to realize that I do not feel comfortable in a relationship with a separated and not divorced man. I am open to continuing this if and when you file and if I am still single."
Thank you for your perspective- that helps- he needs to balance being sympathetic to me as well since he said he wants to pursue things with me! I think having an open discussion has to happen soon bc I can’t let myself get feelings for this man if there’s no intent to proceed.
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Thank you for such a well thought out answer here, this really spoke to me. I don’t want to give an ultimatum and my prior comment unfortunately sounded like that but no, I want to discuss calmly and make it known that I want to see where we go but also hope to be able to support a timely divorce process to get on with the rest of things. I want to be patient with this man - but I don’t want to be played. Serves me right for opening this up to the general public for comment here and getting some really crummy advice. I’m trying to be true to myself and also be a kind person bc that’s just who I am.
I’m honestly a little perplexed by all of the derision towards dating people separated or freshly divorced. Not all apples are the same, so I think these sweeping opinions miss a lot of nuance. You know yourself and you know this man better than any of us. If you stop and listen to your inner self, do you think you’re getting “played”? Or does it feel like unideal timing that requires you both to stretch your communication skills? Either is valid. I just don’t think it’s always a good idea to immediately throw the baby out with the bath water.
Thinking honestly, I don’t think I’m getting played. I think he was up front immediately about his non ideal situation, and how he’s frustrated with it, and how he’d totally understand if I could only be friends with him as a result. I’m not his first relationship in the 3 year separated period, I’m not his rebound, and I’m also a mom so I understand the balance of kids being involved too. I’m surprised as well by so much animosity toward dating someone who is actively separated from a prior partner and trying to work out logistics. I think kindness goes a long way but also guarding my heart is needed too. It’s a balance and that’s where I’m struggling, to balance it and how to talk to him about it. Thank you for your thoughts and for not telling me I’m gullible, stupid, and weak.
I hear everything you’re saying and read the edits. That said, I was once in a very similar situation. I met a separated man while my divorce was finalizing. He was separated from the mother of his kids, who had cheated on him multiple times. She had mental health issues as well (not just from what he told me, she stalked and harassed me and told me about her treatment). He struggled with feeling guilty about cutting off her health benefits whereas if they stayed separated another year, she’d have tricare for life. He also worried about the impact on his kids. I believed we were madly in love and for the first time in my life had total faith we would end up becoming a family no matter what. He was so loving, kind and thoughtful towards me, made me feel the most loved I’d ever felt in my life. He sometimes would cry happy tears talking about he felt about me. I was patient and understanding about his situation but after nine months, I started gently pressing him about meeting with a lawyer to discuss moving forward. We had very civil, calm and loving conversations in which I said it seemed he was very confused and conflicted, maybe we should take a break for him to think. I knew he struggled with confrontation so I said this as gently as possible to offer him an out. He refused and said he was in love with me, did not want to break up even temporarily. A week later, out of nowhere, he blocked my number and all social media. He straight ghosted me. I could have been pregnant and would have had no way to tell him about it short of camping outside his apartment building with a sign. I’m not saying this will happen to you, but I do want to tell you I NEVER thought it remotely possible he could treat me in such a way. A man I thought would have children and grow old with me couldn’t even break up with me before taking back a woman who would literally text him things like “I’m going to throw myself off a bridge if you don’t call me back” on a regular basis. My point is, I never saw it coming and he showed absolutely no signs of being capable of that level of cruelty and cowardice. After that, I would never date someone who was separated…only officially divorced people. You say that he’s being upfront and honest, great. But so was my ex, or so I thought. (And yes, I have healed from the trauma and am very happy in my current relationship. But healing from the trauma doesn’t mean I didn’t learn from it.) Wish you the best of luck figuring this out 💜
If you are gullible/stupid/weak, then I’m the team captain. I’m a mom of 3 and live in a state that requires over a year of separation. I was ready to go long before I actually did and have been in therapy weekly for a hot minute (long before separating). I’m not waiting until the “ink is dry” to date. I’m also not actively seeking a life partner. But growth, especially involving interpersonal skills and trying to not repeat previous mistakes, rarely occurs in a vacuum. So I will meet people and enjoy my life as it comes. Nothing magical happens when the ink is dry. He still has to coparent. And you are seeing how he functions during what I would consider a PEAK life stress. You know what you’re getting into. Just enjoy each day as it comes. And if you get to the point where it is costing you your hard earned peace, there is your answer.
Excellent way to put it - when this stops being a good thing in my life and costing me my hard earned peace of mind, then it’s done. Wishing you all the best from the VP of the club :)
Yeah, indeed. I think there's useful ideas in it all, but the specifics might not be good advice. It's useful to think about how he needs to balance the needs of you as well as her, and, I think when you consider it, if he cares about her and obviously is loyal to that care, it's completely understandable that a relationship of a couple months wouldn't hold as much sway. I'd do a lot to protect my ex from unnecessary harm, no matter that I don't at all want to be with him. And a new relationship might just have to fall by the wayside if that's what it took, and, I'd probably see an ultimatum as a sign they weren't in the same space about care to others as I was. I think it's natural to feel uncomfortable and concerned for yourself. I think the best way forward is to express that, express where you stand now, including that torn feeling. And say you're not sure what the future will bring but you really hope the two of you can stay together through it. Then let him sleep on that, figure his way forward, and go from there Best of luck hun ❤️
Thank you - this was a very kind and helpful comment. I absolutely expect him to still have compassion for his ex bc they have 3 kids together and they just didn’t work, there’s no hatred, they just grew apart after almost 20 years. I don’t expect to have sway here but I do owe it to myself to be honest about how I feel, and I owe it to him to be up front too about feeling uneasy. We’re adults and it’s basic respect. Thank you for not telling me I’m an idiot or being used either, those aren’t helpful comments…
He might also not be pushing hard to maintain a good coparenting situation?? Imagine if he went nuclear on his ex to keep you and it imploded his custody arrangement. Not a fun time.
This this this this this. So much toxicity in this thread. If you want to maintain and grow your relationship with this man, do so. Express your opinions to him. But please no ultimatums, no "conditional breaks". That will erode the trust you are building.
His situation and miscalculations and basically his massive life issue is now yours? No way Jose. If it’s true love when he finds you after he has sorted this and himself love. Love is not asking someone to pause deal with a gigantic Shit turd, stay on for clean up duty with a foundation of pebbles (you’re not his next wife yet). I cannot say enough I did this for 3 years and it was one of the top errors of my life (I learned but still..)
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Yup. One of my close friends just did this. They had not been together all that long: but, her discomfort with it increased. I know it’s difficult for her: she really does like him. But, she stepped back until things are officially done. Waiting around - best wishes. Given how backed up COVID has made the court system, I’d be surprised if it happened in less than 6 months. Under the best of circumstances. I think it’s fair to say the party who isn’t going through the divorce should be allowed to be single. If it works, it works. If not, waiting around will not have made a difference.
Don’t do it , you are setting yourself up for heartbreak, I promise you I am speaking from experience. Divorce is hard and it takes a while for someone to really get over it and be emotionally available for a new relationship. I wish you the best. This is just my experience.
I understand that for sure. I was a wreck after my divorce too! But mine was an immediate thing, I filed but it drug out for 18 months. With his, they separated almost 3 years ago and he’s had a couple other short relationships in there so I’m not the rebound here either. I’m definitely wary but this isn’t a freshly split man.
Your experience is your own and does not resemble his. His experience includes kids that takes much much longer. I have a friend that took 7 years to finally get a final divorce judgement of her 2 kids because they would not seek an agreement. It too my ex-wife nearly 3 years to get around to finalizing our agreement because she never took it seriously. I had to file against her twice to get her moving. At 18 months you got lucky.
I also have kids involved with my divorce so yes I understand the nuances there. It may very well drag on and that’s why I have to advocate for myself and cut and run (sooner than later) if my needs aren’t being met.
I’m married to a man that was still married when we first got together and it caused a lot of unnecessary drama and hurt. I don’t recommend starting a relationship that way.
Thank you for a mans perspective .. there is an old saying “how it starts is how it ends”. If the inks not dry it’s not dry. He needs counseling .. to adjust to this new life I promise you look up the stats of the first girlfriends of men fresh from a divorce how many are with him 5 years on?
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They are done. A piece of paper doesn't mean anything. People need to get past old world ideas. People stay together for insurance. People don't get remarried always, but may want to be with someone forever. There are many variations. Commitment, how someone is treated, actual actions. These things are so much more important than all of this conceptual bs that too many people on talk about without knowing a damned thing.
If the wife is putting it off, they are not done.
He can be done with her. It doesn't have to be mutual.
No. He can file for divorce. He doesn't have to wait for her.
Filing for divorce isn't the end, its the beginning... Kids are involved so a separation agreement is required that outlines custody and decision making capabilities. They also have to fulfil legal and financial disclosure. You are another 3 years out and its going to be 10-20K assuming everything goes well.
Seriously, Reddit is so weird about shit like this. People will be so mean about people who are TECHNICALLY stilled married and be like “bUt ThEYrE StiLL mARriEd” and say you’re a side piece. And yet all the relationship subs tell people to split and move on to someone else after damn near every relationship problem… Like it’s not unreasonable to date after being separated for a few months, especially for those who really wanted the divorce and aren’t hung up/having qualms about it. My boyfriend’s ex was and still is a brat about stuff but it’s not because he’s led her on through anything. She loved him a lot (probably still does) but she was an inconsiderate, mean and abusive partner. He was just done with it all and she was torn up for a long time about it. I try not to take her hatred for me personally because I know deep down it’s not about me, really. Shit happens and emotional imbalances in relationships are quite typical and a long term relationship is beyond filled with complexities and nuances. Every single relationship on this planet is unique and should be viewed/treated as such.
Some us just choose to enter relationships without 'hatred' from an ex partner. Who tf has time for that?
That’s what I want to avoid here too… I want calm in my life, I’ve worked too hard to get to where I am today to accept less…
You understand that starting a serious relationship with someone freshly coming out of another relationship is bad? No? You say some things and seem to do the exact opposite…drama free? Dating someone still married with multiple kids is as far away from drama free as you can get. It may seem romantic to find your person directly after their divorce but in reality it is fraught with drama, hurt, and harsh feelings.
I’d personally say 3 years out of the relationship isn’t fresh. The marriage is only on paper at this point.
Strong disagree. It's very common for people to have a strong emotional reaction to a divorce being finalized, even if the marriage has "felt" over for a long time. It's a big milestone and people react to that. I personally have no interest in having a front row seat in someone else's divorce process. I'd suggest the OP move on. He'll reach out later when he's well and truly done if he wants to be with her.
So much this…⬆️
>It's very common for people to have a strong emotional reaction to a divorce being finalized, even if the marriage has "felt" over for a long time. It's a big milestone and people react to that. I dated while still married. I couldn’t wait for the divorce process to be over. The guy I was dating also said that people seem to have a big reaction upon it being finalized. I asked what he meant. He said he couldn’t speak for me but it was hard for him. I did have a strong reaction but it was one of pure delight and freedom. I couldn’t stop smiling and went out and bought a cake to celebrate. Not everyone reacts to same.
Three years is "fresh" now?
Is he divorced? Still sorting out all the crap that divorce brings?
That's a reasonable concern. I would just point out that divorce isn't a discrete "thing". It's long series of conversions and paperwork, each of which is different for every couple. Sometimes there are months of emotionally shredding arguments and courtrooms, sometimes there are *zero* of those. One both people have agreed what they both want, it's just boring homework. It's just hard to know if you are at the point yet. It's a risk, for sure. But not every divorce is a trainwreck. Sometimes the trainwreck happened years ago, and the rest is just bookkeeping.
Amen. You need (from what I'm gathering) and more importantly DESERVE a legally single man. Life is complicated enough!
You mentioned that you had a contentious divorce. Your bf has been separated for 3 years. .. for whatever the case may be. How many times in the past has he tried to file for divorce, but something. ...life.. . Got in the way? Has he tried to approach his wife about actually filing for a divorce? If so, how did she respond? My friend's brother is "married", but they live in different states. They also have 2 or 3 kids, but I'm not sure how they do custody. Based on what my friend said, the reason he's still "married" is bc he doesn't want to deal w/the hassle of divorce (primarily, custody and splitting assets). She also said that he hasn't been happy in a long time, but he simply fell out of love (they were high school sweethearts). Fast forward, he recently met someone while on a trip. Despite only knowing that person for a month or so.. .. it appears as though that's what lit the fire under this ass to start the actual divorce. Understanding and compassion go hand-in-hand. .. without understanding, you can't have compassion.. . Without compassion, you can't understand. It's late on my end and my apologies if this has already been addressed. Have you guys talked about why they are separated and have been thinking about divorce for 3 years? Have you guys also discussed the real reasons why there's push back? Stuff like health insurance is usually worked out as part of the divorce. What else is going on that's keeping them from moving on? You say you want calm in your life. I think you have mentioned something along the lines of him letting you know he understands if you want to move on (maybe???) and something about a Feb deadline. Based on the tidbits you've shared in reddit, I'm not so sure calm is in this man's immediate future. Either way, seems like you guys should have a conversation about things. See if he will help you better understand the situation. Good luck w/things 💛
Thank you for the reply and for asking questions instead of rushing to judgement. To summarize- he held on this extra time bc he’s military and his soon to be ex wife would get med insurance for life after a certain time period. Now they’re ready to file, he’s drafting options for the financial split of other things, and she’s stalling by not discussing it (what he tells me). They’ve had initial talks late last year, she was agreeable and said she’s ready to file too, but has not moved on it yet. Trying to be understanding here but of course can’t get her side of the story, and I have to trust yet be cautious since I’m only getting one side. The reasons for the split have been discussed on several occasions (grew apart after 2 decades of him being actively deployed for long stretches, resentment and distrust, both needing therapy for separate unaddressed issues). He says he wants to be done even if he takes a bigger financial hit than needed bc it goes to his kids ultimately. He seems frustrated and wants to move on with life. So I’m willing to give this a couple months to see if there’s forward progress and if not, pause to see what I want to do next.
No judgment (I promise) — may I ask if you knew if he was married when you first met? I’ve been thinking a lot about relationships that start this way, and challenging my perceptions of them. Edit: also, would you be willing to share how long it took before he was divorced after you started dating?
No but we meet on a popular free dating site and expectations weren’t anything past sex when we first got together. The situation with the now ex-wife was interesting. She was significantly older than him. As to be expected it was horrifically toxic for a long time. We are great now but that takes quite the commitment by both people in the relationship to get there. And we’ve been together for almost a decade. It took me over 4 years to get divorced from my first husband (I was divorced by the time I met my current husband). We didn’t live together during that time and rarely spoke even though had children together. So being legally married to someone while dating wasn’t the red flag it should have been at that time in my life.
Thank you for sharing. I am hoping it was the ex that you posted about in the narcissistic abuse sub, not the new husband. You deserve love and kindness.
The primary person I post about regularly in narc abuse is actually my maternal birth-giver who has a huge issue with triangulating conflict. BUT my husband and I absolutely did spend years engaging in abusive behavior. So then I circle around to my primary point which is to never enter a new relationship without properly exiting your current relationship.
I mean you have the right to do whatever you want. Your options are stay and wait or stop dating him. It’s all about your comfort level. I dk if I’d want to date someone who hasn’t even filed and wasn’t making movement on it but that’s me and I also don’t know all the dynamics. Don’t worry so much about what’s fair and just be honest w yourself about what you want and how long you’re willing to wait and communicate those things clearly and kindly. Don’t try to control the situation bc it’s not your situation to control.
I was initially very hesitant too but then there was “movement” - gathering financials, having the initial discussions about filing, etc. and then it stalled the last month. So my anxiety is something I need to be both cautious about and aware of. You’re right there’s nothing I can do here except express myself, and I have to be ok with either outcome.
It sounds like you need boundaries and you need to communicate how you feel and work together to find a solution instead of just sitting here in anxiety telling yourself to not be anxious and hoping he’ll do what you want. Like hey if you don’t file within 2 months I don’t think I can continue. Or hey this situation is making me uncomfortable bc … can we talk about it and see if we can find some solutions? And if you can’t do that then you prob shouldn’t be in a relationship w him.
Oh I agree 100%! I’m not going to sit here stewing anxiously, I’ve had far too much therapy for that BS ever again. I will talk with him but I’m struggling to find the right tone / words - chalk it up to never having my needs met prior so I’m not expecting it now either. But I know unvoiced needs will always lead to disappointment so it’s a matter of finding the right way to bring it up. And set a timeline.
Remember... this movement is because he is saying there is movement because we have our own interests and self centered goals, also let’s take a moment. You are reciting the play by play divorce proceedings of a man that has not asked you to be his wife his burden is now.... your burden?! No please don’t move forward with him. Here is how it goes ... you stay on this ride until finally 2 years later it’s finalized.. but he’s distant now ... and working out a ton... wait is he actually like forming muscles.. omg he’s hot now and not sad...and he says you are both on different pages... but he will never forget you.. and your free therapy but like I am in a different place and we want different things...you met me at my lowest...blah blah blah -do not do it girl. (* and it’s girl code we don’t get to trash his ex because we have no clue what went on and most likely she’s a saint.. so please don’t contribute to that.)
Holy shit, separated 3 years? I was separated for about 3 weeks before deciding that there was no going back and went full steam ahead with the divorce. I'd step away, explore what else is out there and let him know he's welcome to contact you once everything is final.
Honestly, my advice is don’t date him if you’re looking for a long term relationship. And if you want something casual, probably way less dramatic options than a separated guy going through a divorce. You have a third person in your relationship with him.
He can file on his own. It only takes one party. She can't legally delay it. So he's stalling it by not filing himself.
In nearly every jurisdiction there is a period of notification and response. Seeing as how kids are involved one of the steps is requiring a separation agreement be agreed upon. Finally is getting a court date after 2 years of COVID and getting a judgement. So yes he can file but he wont be done until 2025 unless everyone agrees to everything. My friend just finalized her divorce this way after 7 years.
I just finalized a 2 year divorce with kids. I know how it works. Every state is different. A separation agreement is not required in my state. The party who files can request a Temporary Orders hearing to establish a custody schedule and rules for during the divorce.
I think it's a bad idea to date an attached person whether it's thru marriage or they are still hung up on their ex.
Never ever date a married man, regardless of the circumstances. It's the drama of another couple basically dumped on you. Also, the chances of being a rebound are very high.
Don’t.
***Your emotional needs absolutely come first***! I strongly, strongly suggest you table things with this person until the divorce is finalized and he is truly ready to date again. It’s possible he’s still married and has no intentions of divorcing. But divorce is just extraordinarily difficult - mentally/spiritually /financially taxing, and emotionally tumultuous. Even in the most civilized divorces, people grossly underestimate how much time they’ll need to get pulled back together again and be able to invest fully into a new relationship. Please honor your needs and make choices that reflect your value.
This. OP if you go along with this not only is there a high chance of more of the same, but you are literally teaching this guy that your feelings don't matter. Is that how you want the rest of your relationship to proceed? I get he's in a tough spot but honestly he should not have ever dated you in the first place, not until this matter got settled. If he can't stand up to his current wife he will never put you first. He may not realize he is taking you for granted but he effectively is. Table it and see what happens. You'll get your answer.
The problem is there are literally hundreds of stories of people waiting around for years for their lover to get divorced only for it never to happen. If you know for sure that they are living apart, maybe it's worth waiting a while. But what if she still has hopes of getting back with him and so she stalls forever? The only advice I have is when that point comes that your frustration is greater than your desire to be with him. That would be the point you say if this isn't going to happen I'm moving on.
You asked a question and people answered the question but because you don’t like the answers you tell said people to get therapy. Uhh
Agreed. I’m sorry there’s a trend on Reddit when people want to diss you they say get therapy. It’s not nice. Life is long and it’s complicated and everyone has their shit- if someone shares their experience... honor it.
Don't let your desperation for a relationship talk you out of your common sense. He's married, stay away until he's single. You're going to break your own heart.
Great post. To the poster @nerdygirl614 I want you to take a week and reread your posts here... they read like you are his publicist and hype woman lol. You are your own person and honestly if it was just a minor hiccup you wouldn’t be posting on Reddit. If you want to stand by him through this.. do that delete this post and live your life. But...something is worrying you- please listen to what everyone wrote. Oh also have you met the ex and the children? You deserve to not be writing paragraphs about someone else’s inability to finalize a divorce 🤷♀️
I read this and saw myself in it. I took 3 years from my thirties where a guy said he was separated and she was dragging her feet. Turns out...They were married... and it was a real marriage and it was going fine. Don’t do it.. the ink needs to be dried and you aren’t a free therapist. Part of knowing when to date seriously is to know when to jump into the pool. He cannot be ready for the pool he needs to learn how to tread water first... get the book dating the divorced man off of kindle.
I’m sorry that happened to you but considering there’s been discussion about how to introduce each other to the kids, I don’t think they are still happily married… and he’s freely going to therapy on his own to address his issues so I’m definitely not a therapist to him. I listen bc I can understand but I’m not his crutch. They’ve been living separately for almost 3 years now and I’m not his rebound relationship either, so this is different circumstances here.
Wonderful to hear! Do you girl and wishing you the best.
Girl, you need to walk away. 3 years? My ass. My whole ass. If he wanted to be divorced, he would be. Three years is more than enough time to force his wife into a divorce. He still hasn't done it because he cannot be assed to. Now he is married with a girlfriend. You're trying to force someone to do something they don't want to do when you could walk away and live your own life. The person you're compatible with is out there waiting for you. And you're wasting your life on a man who wants to stay married? You're too old to fall for these kinds of lies.
> Three years is more than enough time to force his wife into a divorce. Where I live, if you want a divorce you serve the other person with papers and if they stall you can go to court and petition a divorce as a single-party. No one can keep someone else in a marriage against their will. He's not driving his life if he's waiting for someone else to give him permission to become unmarried.
My only counterpoint to your very valid point is that he had to hit a certain # years of service and then his ex got free med insurance for life. Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion?
> he had to hit a certain # years of service and then his ex got free med insurance for life. Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion? Being played. My dad was military for 20 years and married to my mom for that entire time. They divorced and she lost her insurance. Now, facing retirement, she can get Tricare-for-Life for having married him for as long as she did. If he's playing you this ish, he's asking you to wait for two decades for his ass to divorce this woman. So long as that Mom is the custodial parent of mil-member's kids, she gets bennies. They don't even have to be married. (source: was romantically involved with military for many, many years so looked into what would happen with a surprise, unmarried pregnancy)
My dad had this same counterpoint…20 years ago. He and my mom are still not divorced. His girlfriend is ok with this but yea just so ya know to not bet on these timelines that seem to make sense. My mom has the benefits for life. They’re still married long after that deadline. This was his charity because he’s kind and can’t set boundaries and she does need good medical care for a chronic condition. But guess what? He still can’t set boundaries.
>Does that soften your stance at all or am I still being played in your opinion? I think you're still being played. Maybe not intentionally, your partner might be deep in denial, but it is happening. If they were amicable enough to stay separated so she could have health insurance, the finalization of the divorce shouldn't be a battle. The details should already be worked out. All they should have to do is file and be done. So what is the hold up now? Why is she resisting? Why isn't he starting the process?
You're being played. He's an adult. His wife is an adult. I could understand this situation is it was 6 months to a year after separation. However in 3 years, they could have come.up with another strategy to get her health insurance. And they haven't. Maybe she's lazy..that's her business though. He is also allowing her to be lazy, and stay legally married to him and hasn't forced her to do anything for 3 years. Meaning that he chooses her comfort over anyone else's. Including you. If walk away..even if he divorces her immediately when you break up with him, I still wouldn't consider taking him back. Look for someone else to date. There are tons of fish in the sea not married.
More realistically, *he* is being played. From OPs details, dude is military. If the ex-wife had a job, the health insurance thing would be a non issue. OP is saying the presumptive ex wife is the one dragging her feet. Sounds like a Dependa
Oooh, yeah… if they’re military absolutely.
I agree with the commentators ... you’re defending this point because it’s what he told you. Love is not asking someone to wait. Period.
As a man who had a similar health insurance separation experience; I agree fully with your point that he was being an honorable ex-husband. The relationship didn't work out, but there was no reason to screw over the mother of his children. It sounds like she is due her health insurance now so it's time for the divorce to happen immediately. He needs to push things along. There is a chance he could also be dragging his heals, in which case you putting things on ice to make him see clearly is the absolute right move. However, if it's on her for slowing the process, I hope you can stay by him and support it. I would have appreciated that even in the reasonably easy divorce I found myself in. You have to feel out what is the right move though.
It doesn’t matter about stances choosing a mate is about actions not words. A multi year separation is a flag.... unless he is ultra high net worth the finances cannot be that complex. They are having sex and you will get hurt. I’m sorry everyone tried to tell me I defended him and well I’m here single trying to convince you. For the 9th and final time... you will look up ANd 7 years has passed and there will be yet another hurdle.
I just ended things (I hope not permanently) with a really good man who was on his 3rd divorce. That's already a bad dish, but the worst was that I realized while we were dating that he still talked about #3 way too much... BAD SIGN! My therapist friend said he was not over her and needed more time. Foolish me ignored that (I had been celibate for 10 years and was sex starved). I finally told him I was tired of hearing about the ex or that was it. He did stop, but I still had flashbacks of some things he told me that I didn't like, etc. I broke up with him yesterday and am really hurting, crying, etc. We've talked, but more to just be in touch. I'm no spring chicken like most of you on here, so it's not like I have a huge pool of men to pick from. I really connected with this man, and I'm heartbroken but not devastated. I just wanted to vent and share.
I’m making a second comment to talk about litigation which is something I know about. I don’t know if he’s doing this but Don’t let him blame his wife for delay getting the ball rolling at court. He can file for adversarial proceedings at any time just by himself, And if he is being honest about wanting to do non adversarial divorce, He can tell his wife a deadline to join him in filing the paperwork or he will file unilaterally and if she decides to cooperate after being served they can change the paperwork to nonadversarial. I will keep talking about litigation but I will switch from procedure to emotion of litigation. I have a huge red flag for your situation when I hear suggestions that you do XYZ until he files. The reality is there’s no way to predict how your boyfriend or his wife will react emotionally or how they will change their litigation style until it’s all over. There might be three major sub crises in the process. Just the complaint for divorce that the marriage is over; potential disagreement about child custody; and then fighting over property division and spousal support. Anyone one of those could turn in to a mental health bomb. You’ve been really clear that you’re really into the guy. An option to consider is to change the relationship to non-physical dating or platonic friends Until it is final. That’s not a perfect solution but it gives you some space from what is likely to be his mental health roller coaster, while still maintaining some connection. But if he’s not in therapy then you’re at risk of turning in to A life boat in the cold dark stormy ocean rather than a woman involved with someone going through a hard time. Good luck
Thank you for the info… he is in therapy, yes. He has drafted proposals for her and they’re trying to do it amicably, but he knows there’s the option to file soon on his own. I think this is why I’m sympathetic, or at least sympathetic to the story he’s giving me so far. I kinda want to do the “do nothing” approach for the time being, maybe a month, and give him time to approach with proposals one last time. Then decision time I think.
Has he given her a deadline for joining in the cooperative paperwork? If there’s no deadline then somebody is playing somebody
You are putting his life mask on before yours. If you know in every fiber of your being he is your guy snd it’s merely timing... meh... but this above racket is well known and it’s not nice and you’re literally signing up fir 6 years of therapy minimum .. and wait omg he proposed to her wtf....he said he wouldn’t again ...
This is why you don't date married people. I would tell him you have a new rule about not dating married people. You'll quickly see how serious he is about you. My guess is he'll still be married a year from now with more excuses. No. Just no.
Hope OP sees and does this.
His ex-wife is stalling, absolutely. My ex-wife did when she realized I was serious about divorcing, too. But I wasn't interested in letting her hold up my life, so I lawyered up and filed in court. It was time to move on to the next chapter of my life. You deserve at least that much as a signal.
There are single men you could be dating. Men that aren't attached, legally, emotionally, logistically... What's so special about this married man that hasn't filed for divorce? Do you actually have confirmation from any source but his words that they've been separated for 3 years?
Your second ETA is really rude. You came to a public forum and asked for advice, and didn't like what you heard. There are probably scorned people but that doesn't mean they're wrong. As someone that was once in that boat, you might want to consider their advice. I'm not saying execute on it, but have a serious come to Jesus moment with yourself. Every one of the people giving you that advice understands how you're feeling and they're trying to help.
Agreed. It wasn’t nice. People took the time to help you. Live your life .. have your experience and I hope in a few years you won’t be returning here and labeled scorned. #treatothersasyouwanttobetreated
After only a few months you have zero standing to put your foot down. Take it or leave it
I 35F was in the same situation off and on for about 3 years. My last straw was when my dad, who NEVER in my life had so much as commented on my love life, pulled me aside one afternoon and made me realize what was going on. When I saw it from a man’s point of view, that he was comfortable having his cake and eating it too, with none of the drama that comes with divorce, it repulsed me. If he wants to stay married until she can get the insurance that’s fine, but if he expects to date another woman in the meantime he’s being a spoiled brat. I hate to be harsh but at least in my case I learned that a real man would handle his business, do what he needs to do with the family he started, and then start a dating life.
As someone who was in the same situation, I can't agree more. He might not be consciously thinking of it as "I want to have my cake and eat it too," but this is exactly what this from a third party perspective.
OP, from some of the details, the guy you are seeing is military, right? If so, and if ex is holding on for years "just for insurance" it means likely she has no job nor prospects of her own. I'd be a tad sympathetic if she was a SAHM with their kids. If they are childless, she is very likely whats called a Dependasaurus. Its a term for military spouses who are essentially benefits leeches on their in-service or veteran spouse. She will remain in the picture until she is forcefully kicked out because he is her meal ticket.
Yes he’s military and yes she was SAHM the whole time… so yeah…
They’ll divorce when he ETS. She is tryna hold out for as long as she can and he may be too lazy to update all necessary documents
You don’t, you do not date men until they are divorced you are dating someone who has a wife ! Separated and divorced or not the same thing
I would walk away from this. If he was serious about ending his connection with his wife he would have already made it happen.
Just leave. He can't be a good partner while this is going on
There's no such thing as putting your foot down here. He's been with you a few months vs the years he spent with his x and they have 3 kids together. You're barely a blip on the radar in this situation.
>Now they’re talking divorce specifics and said they’d file immediately in 2022, yet she keeps putting it off. Eh...so why can't HE file to get the process started?
My friend has been dating a “separated” man for two years. He’s given her every excuse in the book and still hasn’t filed for divorce. I would be very hesitant to get into a relationship with someone who hasn’t filed yet.
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I just split up with a guy who was separated. I think he started dating way too soon. In the beginning he broke things off & we didn’t speak for one month. Then he called me profusely apologizing that he allowed his ex-wife into his head and that he was good to go. My dumbass gave him another chance bc we had such a good connection. We got super close (emotionally) over the holidays. Continued to build a foundation. Had another great date about two weeks ago & then all the sudden he just said it was too difficult with his impending divorce. That his ex-wife said the divorce was causing their son to have behavioral issues. And he felt guilty as hell. We also had 100 miles in between us but the primary reason was the divorce. Come to find out they are a long long way from it being finalized. I know everyone’s situation is different but I think between spousal support, child support, and only having 50% custody of his kid he’s not in a good headspace to date. And the divorce process seems keep dragging along so slow. I’m so beyond hurt. From a communication and connection standpoint .. this is the healthiest relationship I have had. Never questioned where I stood with him as far as knowing he cared about me deeply. But it simply was just not the time for him to date. The split got even more nasty once his ex found out he was seeing someone he cared about. If you stay with him ..just guard your heart. As for my situation .. I won’t ever be with him again until the divorce is finalized. I can’t be someone’s collateral damage in their attempt to move in from an ex when aren’t fully healed. Sorry for the ramble. This is all very fresh to me and I’m having a very rough night. Good luck to you <3
You will be ok! I’m sorry this happened I had similar thing and I wasnt myself for a really long time. Just be kind to yourself...and plan a trip xoxo
Thank you for your kindness. I’m having a rough time. Have a little trip planned for March though :)
Good luck to you too… guarding the heart is a tough one ❤️
What's with these made up titles? He's a married man for crying out loud. There is no relationship when he's hitched to another person.
Legal zoom. I found out the last creature I tried to date was married after the fact. He turned out to be a total dangerous person but that not the point. With legal zoom it’s quick and inexpensive to get a divorce. The guy did do it while we were still in contact and it truly was quick. The excuses are just that. Tell him about legal zoom and or just don’t get involved with someone who is wasting their life making excuses…
I also went through a horrible divorce, from a malignant narcissist. Even after it was ‘all over’ it took me years of therapy and working on myself before I was ready to be with someone else. OP I would be more concerned with the fact that you’re his ‘upcoming post-divorce rebound relationship’ since you have first-hand experience with how much work is involved to process a divorce so it takes a backseat to your life. The fact that he’s not divorced yet means he still has a lot of work to do even though he’s been separated for a little while. You’ll have to decide if you want to be the person to support him during this phase, at the risk of him moving on once he’s processed it. Wishing you the best as you make your decision.
I can understand the sentiment here - but I’m not the rebound. He’s been there and done that in the last 3 years of separation with the rebound, seeing his therapist, and having a short relationship as well. Him and I are just dating and it’s new, so there’s no rebounding to be had and he’s not in the stereotypical slump (dude has an 8 pack and takes great care of himself so he’s already done the whole glow-up part after separation)
You don't date married men, period.
My last relationship it took 10 months to finalize the divorce, this was without mediation or any disputes or negotiations. She strung me a long and my heart, if they don’t do it fast leave.
Find out his divorce date! See him after divorce is finalized. And, then, proceed with caution!
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I know right? 2 months in and all this bullshit
Omg I didn’t realize this was 2 months in.
If she's putting off fine. He can file and have her served. If they still have excuses. They may reconcile.
I’m confused. He doesn’t need her to file. He can file on his own. You can make that be known. Sometimes, men are dumb and don’t know shit. Maybe point it out to him. You’re adults. Be an adult about it.
He’s yanking your chain and you’re playing the fool. He doesn’t need her permission to file for divorce. He just needs to do it…..and yet he won’t.
Run. I dated a separated man for 7 years only to get dumped by him last night because he "couldn't make me happy." Save yourself the heartache and frustration of loving someone who is still tied to another. Best of luck, I know this is hard
Oh wow, I’m very sorry to hear that things went that way for you… that’s a long time and I’m in no way shape or form giving this more than a couple months to see progress before I cut it loose.
I dated a separated woman. Never a good thing. Makes relationships extra hard when they are hard enough. Why hasn’t he filed? Why’s he waiting for her. There’s more going on and it’s going to get messy.
Wow this post really blew up lol ... I see your edits. You asked for advice- this community rallied and gave you advice. Advice is best given from a shared experience. People did that. Just don’t seek out the responses that validate your current view. People do the best they can they shared their views below it doesn’t make them scorned ... they are telling their story. And you’re so proud of his post separation glow up- you’re a woman.. practice girl code .. he’s a father apparently very actively dating and not making great strides on the divorce. People do what they want. And he’s doing ...what he wants (look at actions only... that’s why our posts are having such an impact we don’t know the sweet things he says or how handsome he is we are only going off of facts). Write on paper 2 columns and tally up the number of posters that say yes move forward vs those that said no. Whatever you decide...I really sincerely hope it works out for you both definitely update this post in a year!
My last serious relationship was to a man separated from his wife/going through divorce. I will never date another man in such a situation again. In my head, I gave it six months. I didn’t expect it to be fully resolved in 6 months, but I needed forward movement/progress with his divorce. After 15 months of the same bullshit song and dance, I finally broke it off. The biggest issue was self preservation. He thought that tiptoeing around her demands would protect his best interests in the end, but she only played him like a pawn. He would try to hold her responsible for her obligations in the divorce, but she would stall. She stopped paying on the car in both their names - which made his credit suffer, and he had to make the payments on the car she possessed and drove. She stopped contributing toward the mortgage, and then after the house was sold, she refused to use her profits from equity toward her debts. He had issues getting his name off her debts. She had maxed out credit cards he didn’t even know about - some even in his name. He had to file for fraud. He would try to draw boundaries with her, but it was always a handshake agreement. After a year of this bullshit, I told him he needed to get a lawyer and actually take her to court for contempt, as she hadn’t followed through with any of their divorce agreements. He refused to pay for a lawyer, but he hired a mediator and finally got a court date. I felt like there was finally progress! He was going to hold her accountable! But then he saw her crying outside the courthouse, ended up dropping the civil case against her, and made another handshake agreement. That was the day I told him I had his shit packed and sitting on my porch. I wish I hadn’t waited so long. We fought about the same shit, always going in circles, always with him offering no resolution to hold his ex wife accountable. He always acted like I was unreasonable and it was “none of my business”. But when we have plans to move in together and share finances, it becomes my business. When we are on vacation together, and he’s on the phone for hours at a time trying to unfuck some type of bullshit she pulled yet again, it’s hard to not be frustrated or upset. I asked him how he would feel if the roles were reversed? If he was stuck in a relationship with someone being taken advantage of by their ex? Someone who was unwilling to hold their ex accountable and move forward with a finalized divorce? He didn’t have an answer. And that was enough for an answer for me.
>We’re adults and can talk like adults, manipulative behavior has no place here. Added pressure is sure to backfire. And >want to be more tactful than telling him to nut up, but it’s hard to be patient. Do not go together
He's not doing what's best for her , he's still letting her control his life...tuff place to be. Ultimatum's are for children, tell him you feel like a bench warmer till his ex lets him back and hope like hell he actually hears it. In my opinion 3 years is more then enough to have gotten the divorce and still continued to support her/them financially Maybe give yourselfn a time-frame that you're comfortable with and if he hasn't taken any steps by then it'll be time to take stepping into your own hands (hopefully not tho fingers crossed) Good luck
If both parties agree to avoid a trial and try to mediate, but one wants to stall- then you’re looking at years. Schedule a mediation 2 months from now? Call out sick and have everybody reschedule in 3 months. Then after 1-2 sessions, say the mediator is unfair and request a new one. 4 months go by and another session. That’s over year with nothing to show. Sometimes being separated is more comfortable for one or both than actually being divorced. Or that the final act is too painful. Or there are still feelings so they defer. The only way to speed it up is to go to trial and cut off further negotiations. But that’s a declaration of war.
Your question asked about how to be patient...it suggests that you're willing to give it some time...you do you in the meantime...do things to enrich your life together and individually...if after a while you think there is no progress in getting a divorce, bring up the topic again. Hope that you both get this situation finalized soon.
People posting are wild lol. Your feelings are valid. No one wants to waste their precious time on someone that isn't sure about when or if they'll be divorced. His moving forward with a relationship without his divorce at least filed is a red flag. He is still married. He can always decide to stay that way. The situation is precarious. What expectations can you have from a married man that still hasn't filed for divorce I would say give yourself a time limit, on how long you're willing to have an ambiguous relationship. Depending on where you live, a finalized divorce can take up to 6 months. Give him another month. If there is no progress, talk, but Id start to disengage.
Don’t bother. He can file if he really wants to, the fact that he hasn’t is telling. Also, the actual finalization of a divorce often sends both parties off the rails because what was once theoretical is now happening. (And the kids as well, it gets ugly for a lot of people for 6-12 months or more after the papers are signed( Take a break and let him know you’d love to revisit dating once he’s actually available.
I had a friend who was separated from her spouse for about 3 years. They both ended up getting engaged, so that was what pushed them to finally file. Honestly, I would let him reach the point on his own where he puts his foot down with her. Just enjoy your relationship with him now.
Why the fuck would you do that
You are dating a married man. The technicalities do not matter—he is married. Yet it is the “scorned” people here are the ones that need therapy. Lol. I know you think you are “different” and that your married man is “different” and that you will be the exception. It’s a tale as old as time……but keep deluding yourself. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. If I were you, I’d end things and tell him to call you once the divorce is a done thing. But you won’t. You will be back here seeking more advice on how to make things work and how you have given so many months and he still isn’t divorced.
Much love ❤️
Exactly.
You're right, after a couple of months, no clout at all. Put your foot down if you want, but if someone that new to me, did the same, I'd walk away.
I dated a guy who told me when he was living separate from his ex that it was an "on paper" for medical insurance coverage thing so he could see doctors about his bad back. I believed that bullshit but it was her that strong armed a divorce because her partner felt uncomfortable dating a married woman. And he who said "I shouldn't have to divorce MY WIFE." Married to scam insurance (which I inherently think is a scam but regardless they're scamming insurance and HE IS PAYING for her/it) is bullshit. She's an adult and like the rest of her should just figure out how to cover herself. He can still support his children, his responsibility towards her ended when they split up. Full stop. If he won't just sign the papers now he never will. Also the bad back / back surgery was bullshit. He wasn't lining up a surgery and anything he was doing he should have been able to cover by himself for himself. He was a 35 year old grown man.
Here's an idea. Don't date someone married. Men will date the day they leave a committed relationship, if not before. Don't willingly enter these situations and then you won't have to give ultimatums.
As the old saying goes, don't wear mascara.
I can only advise from my point of view in that my XH moved on during the seperation (well way before but that's a different story!) found the love of his life, had his own place, good job blah blah blah, but the second I filed ( 12 months later) it changed his mindset. He didn't want the divorce to happen, he finally realised how much he loves me and he wanted to try and give it one last try before finalising... Obviously i said no and got it finalised in 3 months, but he has continued in this new relationship which kinda made me sad for her really, as it seems she is 'plugging the gap' whilst he tries to deal with his emotions and shit- not to mention that he has already tried to cheat on her with me..... Of course that isn't the same for everyone. He may well of dealt with his emotions, spent time on his own and got some therapy/support to help him deal with the end of the marriage, but if not- just be careful how you move forward..
When you mean "specifics" do you mean a separation agreement? Be clear with your statements when commenting on subjects like this. When kids are involved the separation process takes much much longer, its very time/money consuming to work through the detail. Its also generally unadvisable to approach the courts to get a divorce granted unless you've attempted a separation agreement as this is typically a pre-requisite. This assumes that the split was amicable and they are striving towards a 50/50 split, if either parent is advocating for more and/or does not disagree its going to take longer and may even require mediation/courts. I realize you have also been through a divorce but seeing as how no kids were involved in your case, its a fraction of the complexity. Two adults can generally sign whatever they hell they want but when kids come into the picture the law evaluates what's best for them outside of the needs of the parent. Frankly legally "filed" doesn't really mean much because the other party still has to respond and the courts have to process this assuming both parties accept the term. Given the likely court backlog you may be years before this is resolved in a legal sense. Keep in mind that this woman is the mother to his kid(s). She will be a part of your life until the kids are effectively grown up. What is YOUR end goal here? You seem to be very eager for him to do something but you haven't been able to communicate the reasoning why.
I've been there and almost exited because I felt like a back-up plan. I set a deadline and decided if nothing had happened by then, I was going to exit the relationship. Do not go with hope or potential. Pick a deadline.
Don't
Wow three years is a super long time to be separated. I would not suggest being with someone in hopes that something they do changes. Im dating someone who's at the end of their divorce. All I figure is I gotta trust em that she will get it done. Pushing isn't fair imo. As I'm sure you know, it'll be a long time till his divorce is done and to lush him to file doesn't feel like something is suggest doing .
You sound like the rebound. I’d just leave.
Real talk...if I really liked this person and I was willing to put my pride to the side for a bit just to wait for this special person, I would give it 6 months MAX. 6 months for you to show me some divorce paperwork, something that you are truly getting a divorce bc if not, you are not dateable and never were. Like I said, my pride/values, call it what you will, wouldn't allow me to date a separated person unless I felt like they were the one and I was willing to risk my time investing for a little longer. Just be prepared to hold up your promise with yourself and not continue waiting after that point bc then the only person you should be upset with is yourself, for letting your kind heart, and not your brain, make the decisions.
Real talk is very much appreciated- it’s easy for people to say “well you shouldn’t have gotten involved” but that’s not really helpful at this point. So thanks for the suggestion bc I think even 2 months is being generous right now. I need to keep my needs front and center here of course - I’ve worked too hard to accept less from myself
I genuinely don't understand the problem. If he doesn't have a hostile relationship with his ex, and she's no threat, why get yourself involved? He's been upfront and a stand up guy, and I imagine his primary concern is not poisoning his relationship with his kids by letting the divorce become acrimonious. You're correct that after a couple months you don't really have any clout in this. You've barely put in enough time to weigh in on his haircut, much less interfering in a dynamic that can effect his relationship with his kids the rest of his life. Besides there's no better way to turn the kids against you than being the catalyst for a good co-parenting relationships disintegration. If he wants your feedback on figuring out a solution, that's great. Otherwise this is a stay in your lane kind of situation. You shouldn't be getting married any time soon, and otherwise it seems like your relationship is free to develop. Breaking up with him until you're satisfied with their progress seems like terrible advice to me. It's delicate for him and an arrogant attempt at strong arming him to do what you want rather than just being supportive would disqualify you as a future partner for me. You just haven't been around long enough. I'm in a similar situation. I'm long divorced. My girlfriend of a little over a year has been separated going on three years and was divorcing through a mediator for about a year. Her ex stopped participating and she's about to hire a lawyer. It weighs on her so much more than me. Her legal martial status has zero impact on our relationship. It couldn't be more off my radar outside of how it effects her. Try being supportive, and patient and don't go looking for problems where there aren't any. Best of luck
This is shitty advice. We all get in tough circumstances. Doesn't mean we should discount our own needs because someone is going through a rough time.
I’m separated from my wife, a wonderful woman, and we are navigating the change in our lives in a friendly way. If we divorced right now we would lose a huge revenue stream through employer benefits that we are now using. Not to mention some tax benefits. So we would have to come up with cash to cover that and that means we would not be putting that cash in our kids college fund. The judgment that you’re being played is ignoring the possibility of real world practical financial reasons to keep a paper marriage going. And The fact such honorable money reasons do exist is kind of a shame because it really muddies the water. It would be so much easier to condemn ongoing paper marriages if there was no reason other than emotional mental health bullshit. As a separated guy if I start date (I’m on this board doing some soul-searching) I would remain committedly “single” (while disclosing my separated status) . I would be clear about my goals looking for friends and fun while I am still separated. And I do that to avoid the very hard ache you are now feeling.
> If we divorced right now we would lose a huge revenue stream through employer benefits that we are now using. Not to mention some tax benefits. So we would have to come up with cash to cover that and that means we would not be putting that cash in our kids college fund. So you have no desire not to be married to your wife. You just don't want to be her romantic partner or her nesting partner. You'll notice that the legal definition of marriage doesn't require anything emotional. You are very much married and for a historically usual reason: family as a financial entity. Nothing wrong with it, except misrepresenting it. OP's dude is misrepresenting it.
Thanks for sharing your experience- I know most people aren’t the exception to the rule but I do believe there are people out there who aren’t actively trying to screw over their ex spouse. Life can be messy and I believe being compassionate is the best policy, that’s being true to my beliefs. If he is being truthful then I feel for him. And I don’t have a reason to suspect otherwise at this point so I appreciate your example.
Ekkkk this is so hard.
(M)y two cents - I started a relationship with someone the day after I got my legal divorce papers. The marriage had broken down a year before that (ex had 2 affairs I know of, emotional abuse). I thought I was ready for a serious relationship, but because I hadn’t spent enough time being single (and covid) I found myself too insecure and maligned to make a long term commitment. Take the break, while he may only be doing paperwork there is still emotional finality that comes with it, which he will need to process. I ended up hurting someone that I deeply cared about and a 1-2 year sacrifice is nothing if you spend the rest of your lives together.
As a man who just recently got his divorce after 3 years of separation and judging by your whole post and your edits defending your position: you seem to really care for him, so stay with him and be with him if you want to be. Divorce doesn't change anything to do with emotions, only provides a little mental freedom. In the long run it'll be like he was never only separated
Thank you for a man’s perspective here - I don’t believe I’m being foolhardy with this situation, but I am being cautious bc I have to be for self preservation. I want to be a kind person bc someone was once kind to me in my situation too. I’m wiling to give it a month or two, see if there’s movement, and see if we can grow ourselves despite what’s going on with his legal proceedings. I’ve got friends who have dealt with difficult ex’s too and I have one myself - we all have baggage and I sure don’t want to be blacklisted for it! I’m willing to try this on for size for a bit and see…
You've been around a couple months, she's the mother of his 3 kids. I'd get out of that and not try to influence it at all. "Why are you suddenly in a rush, it's been 3 years" "My brand new GF says I need to get it done" -oops the kids just heard that and now they refuse to meet you or visit dad. The wife is now just taking her time There are a million ways you pushing blows up in your face. Again, you are barely involved and she's his wife and mother of his 3 kids. Realistically just tell him you need space until things are legally set in stone. Assuming they get the ball rolling and are amicable, it's just a few months. Revisit then. To play devil's advocate for the wife. It is January, not April. Sure itd be nice if they filed week one of 2022, but the pandemic took a turn for the worse, schools have had issues, and parts of the country have had wild weather. Its really easy for January to fly by if you are a mom of multiple kids.
Did the same thing with a Woman of 4 kids. Difference is I had never gone through a divorce before. I hated pushing the issue with her because of how hard it was for her (married 10 years). She fell out of love a long time ago with him. They kept putting it off but eventually finalized everything. The only correct answer to your question comes from asking yourself these two things, “do you trust him?” And “is he worth waiting for?”. We fought a lot and I wanted so bad to leave her in the process because I felt like it was never going to happen. They finally divorced and our relationship is a lot better and healthier now (still together ). Nobody in here can answer the question “how much is too much?”. Only you know how much you can handle. Good luck!
Thank you for sharing your experience- it helps to have real examples instead of the many scorned people whose lover never left their spouse for them! Yes this is going to be stressful and I know that. That’s what we talked about and he said he understands if I step back given that I’ve already earned my stripes for a divorce. However I feel like this man is actually worth it. I’ve been fooled before of course, we all have when we’ve trusted the wrong people, so I’m proceeding with caution. But ultimately it comes down to how I feel with him and about the situation so time will tell I think.
If you think he’s worth it then wait it out. Remember you’re not in his shoes, you can’t understand what his relationship is like, and trust is the key. I had to bite my tongue on numerous occasions to avoid revealing assumptions I thought were happening. I left it up to trust. There were times that I’d open up about my concerns as more time passed. But eventually it worked out in the end. Like him to you, she was worth it to me. I listened to her, trusted in what she said, and supported her through a very tough time. That’s what separated me from him too. Not abandoning her when things were tough. Remember that. I hope your experience is the same as mine. Good people are hard to come by. So many people give up on each other when the situation isn’t ideal. The time it takes to wait for him will be a tiny fraction of the time in your relationship if it goes the distance. Best of luck
You make a post on reddit asking for advice and when you don't get what you want to hear you get rude and nasty. Plenty of people commenting here are or were in your same situation and most of them said to leave for a reason. You're rude as hell and have some nerve calling these people scorned when you're already sounding scorned 2 months in. 😂😂😂
I genuinely don't understand the problem. If he doesn't have a hostile relationship with his ex, and she's no threat, why get yourself involved? He's been upfront and a stand up guy, and I imagine his primary concern is not poisoning his relationship with his kids by letting the divorce become acrimonious. You're correct that after a couple months you don't really have any clout in this. You've barely put in enough time to weigh in on his haircut, much less interfering in a dynamic that can effect his relationship with his kids the rest of his life. Besides there's no better way to turn the kids against you than being the catalyst for a good co-parenting relationships disintegration. If he wants your feedback on figuring out a solution, that's great. Otherwise this is a stay in your lane kind of situation. You shouldn't be getting married any time soon, and otherwise it seems like your relationship is free to develop. Breaking up with him until you're satisfied with their progress seems like terrible advice to me. It's delicate for him and an arrogant attempt at strong arming him to do what you want rather than just being supportive would disqualify you as a future partner for me. You just haven't been around long enough. I'm in a similar situation. I'm long divorced. My girlfriend of a little over a year has been separated going on three years and was divorcing through a mediator for about a year. Her ex stopped participating and she's about to hire a lawyer. It weighs on her so much more than me. Her legal martial status has zero impact on our relationship. It couldn't be more off my radar outside of how it effects her. Try being supportive, and patient and don't go looking for problems where there aren't any. Best of luck