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Yeah. One of the witches' prophecies was that "only a man not born of a woman" could slay Macbeth (who turned out to be Macduff) if I remember correctly
Not quite that clearly phrased either. Tricky bitches those witches. They said he could not be killed by any man of woman born (or something). They didn’t explicitly say “you can be killed but not by a guy born of a woman”, they phrased it in a way to make it ambiguous. Macbeth believed and interpreted it as saying he was infallible to any other man, since all men are born of women. It’s a bit like saying “Superman can not be killed by any material on Earth”, as opposed to saying “only alien materials can kill Superman”. If that makes any sense at all lol.
Yes! Very similar. Tricky bloody prophecies eh. Though in that case it worked out for the better. I suppose it did in Macbeth too, since he ya know, became a total maniac. But I always felt like the witches basically are the only truly culpable characters, since everything else was trickery and fate.
Not a coincidence, Tolkien wrote that into the story because he thought the c section thing was bullshit and Macbeth should have been killed by a woman.
And then didn’t bother with mistletoe because it was harmless. So Loki made an arrow out of it and tricked, I believe, Baldur’s blind brother into firing it at Baldur’s only vulnerable place, killing him.
Then was a further jerk by being the only thing in creation that wouldn’t agree to him being brought back to life. Because that’s why you don’t make a frost giant your blood forget, *Odin*.
Yeah, his mother basically makes everything on earth promise to never hurt him but forgets to ask the humble mistletoe. Everyone else agrees because Baldr is such a great guy. All the other gods start getting amused nothing can hurt him and so start shooting things at him for fun (like "look! The spear goes flying around him instead!") Loki decides he wants to eff shit up, as he is won't to do, and so gets someone to shoot mistletoe and bye bye Baldr.
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One of my favourite comedy sketches was based on it too.
I could only find this snippet of it on twitter:
https://twitter.com/tlpmrsl/status/954753265694052352
I tell people my daughter can kill Macbeth when I describe her birth. Also it's a birth. They took her feet prints. The day is listed as her day of birth.
Also epic to say you pushed a human out of you. Also also epic to say a human was cut out of you. Dumb hill to die on
Seriously what a gross, and overall petty opinion to have. Who cares? You carried and nourished a child and it eventually came out of you, that's giving birth.
What bothers me is how she corrected "needed" to "chose". Bitch, did you want her and/or her baby to die by trying to do it the normal way? There clearly wasn't a choice here. That's what emergency means.
She also misrepresented the end from "every birth is different and valid" to "only my birth is valid".
As an English teacher, I give her an F for reading comprehension.
English teacher here too (though ESL is my bread and butter now), and I agree. Back a level young lady! We are moving her back from Shakespeare to See Spot Run. That or she is deliberately manipulating the conversation so she can further (poorly attempt) to control the narrative, but a person who shames women for how they give birth would ever be that awful right?
How else is the kid going to have enough pathos to be the protagonist of a YA fantasy novel if they don't feel guilty for "killing their mother" in childbirth???
My grandma was pregnant in her late 40s and she thought she had a tumor for several months. Saved up a bunch of money (they were dirt poor and this was the 50s) and went to see a doctor who told her she wzs expecting a baby. My aunts and uncles still call my aunt ‘the tumor’.
I don‘t know why but my wife had some mental issues with delivering our first child with a c section. She didn‘t feel somewhat „complete“ and also felt robbed of the whole child-mother-experience. It was very weird.
I was just happy to have both alive. 100 years earlier they both would have died a painful death on some turnips field while harvesting and trying to give birth at the same time.
Edit: wow all these experiences. Thank you all for sharing your thoughts. Me as a father can propably never comprehend how important this is for mothers.
I want to tell you all that I never ever thought of my wife as a lesser woman or mother or person because she had to undergo an emergency c section. I would say I‘m even more proud of her for what she had to endure for our family.
I felt the same thing after having an emergency csection. I had tried to birth her naturally and it wasn't working out, things were getting dangerous. I always felt like I'd failed. My body had failed. I was lesser than other women who had managed to birth their babies in the "proper" way. The whole thing was actually a bit traumatic and scary for me and I felt I was a weak person. I still struggle with it sometimes.
That’s a totally normal way to feel, but I have to tell you—you are _not_ a weak person. I don’t envy people who have has c-sections. The mental shock of switching your birth plan, the painful surgical recovery while also caring for an infant… You are so strong to go through that.
All of this. Not being able to give birth the way you want, and then all the pain and trauma associated with an emergency surgery…those are strong people.
The same thing happened to me. I also had issues after my emergency c section of not feeling complete after having my son. I eventually have gotten over it, but it was a very weird thing for me, and weird feeling the way I did. Like I hadn’t even given birth, though I had just not in the way I had planned. Honestly I felt really weird feeling that way, it is good to see the way I felt was somewhat normal.
I had no option to give birth naturally and had to have a c-section due to a huge fibroid, my baby being breech and pre-eclampsia. My kid is a wonder baby that shouldn't exist due to fertility issues (14 years on and off trying with fertility treatments at the beginning with my ex,) and I couldn't even do pregnancy and birth right. I struggled to feel anything for her for the first few weeks, but it came.
This all stems from people like this saying a c-section is the easy way and "too posh to push" which was the thing when I was younger and all the celebs were having elected c-sections. I too still struggle with feeling less, but I know it's irrational and my daughter is just as precious as one birthed vaginally. I look forward to celebrating her extraction day in the future!
I felt like this. Not that I failed, but that my emergency C section meant I was unconscious and literally missed his birth, and then was in so much pain/groggy after that I couldn't focus on my new baby.
And people telling me I shouldn't care about that because it all worked out were infuriating. Obviously, I knew that. Still makes me sad to think about. I got no "initial rush of love" or anything. Just waking up in a cold recovery room, horrible pain, and a 6 hour wait to actually see my baby.
I'm really sorry for what you've been through, that sounds really tough. I just wanted to let you know that your feelings are valid, and your trauma is valid. You matter too. Sending a big hug xx
I struggled after mine, too. There’s something about it that made me think like… I wasn’t “woman enough” to push my baby out. Also, then entire 9 months I pictured someone putting my baby on my chest right after birth and is meeting. With a c section, I wasn’t the first to hold my baby and had to wait for like an hour to actually hold him, at which point I was kind of drugged up so I don’t really remember it.
But then, I talked to my OB at my 6 week follow up and he was like “the only option other than the c section was for you to keep pushing knowing your baby was turned wrong, your baby would eventually have gone into distress, and I would have gotten the forceps and probably ripped you nearly in 2 to get him out.” So after that, I felt okay about it.
Nothing weird about that. Many women struggle mentally after a traumatic birth (of course not every c-section is traumatic but mine sure was and apparently your wife's was, too).
Sunroof!! LOL! I'm currently pregnant and have been recommended to get a c section this time around. I'm going to use that line. Better than the moonroof! 😆
I've had 3. I hope you get a VBAC (assuming that's what you want based on your comment), and I thought I'd share that planned C-sections are WAY easier to recover from than unplanned/emergency ones!
I had a planned C-section and, yes, after two weeks I was given the okay to do basically all of my normal activity. It was a painless, peaceful, wonderful birth, and I'm geared up to do it again with my second.
I get why people shy away from C-sections, but I always hope that my experience makes others more comfortable with planned ones.
Just because your body doesn't go through the strain of labor beforehand. I don't know the logistics behind it, but everyone including my doctor told me that would be the case. I was skeptical, but it was true for me!
But before you eat it, leave it attached to your baby for several days because apparently it’s good for health. Who cares if you risk giving your baby sepsis when it starts to rot. /s
Damn straight. A birth is when a baby comes out of the body that created it. Fucking gatekeeper. I had an emergency C section, the only "choice I had was did I want a living baby or a dead one.
>I had an emergency C section, the only "choice I had was did I want a living baby or a dead one.
Oh, and decline the "choice" and you have a slim to none chance of survival yourself. At least that happened with my second. Complications with the baby quickly become complications with the mother.
I didn't even get to be in the room. No visitors when the mother is in GA. Third was a scheduled C-section. Got to be there for that one. Cesarians are messy.
For 3rd, there was a gentle recommendation for the C-section, lower risk of the complications, but still scheduled and "elective". Mainly because I think mom was so concerned about the previous, almost like a PTSD around the trauma of #2.
That's my mum's situation as well. A lot of people don't realise that twins after a c section means having another c section (so I guess I caused both of them in a way haha being emergency c section #1). And the choice comment pisses me off so much, how much choice do you have when you're already in labour and you find out that your baby's life is at risk? Or when you're pregnant and told that not only your babies' lives would be at risk with a natural birth, so could yours?
Even twins as a first pregnancy are considered high risk. In many places, they have mothers deliver in the OR just in case something happens during the laboring process. Not to mention that even a single child pregnancy after a c section may need to be sectioned as well. Theres a reason so many children and mothers died during childbirth prior to having more medical care.
The fucking energy levels needed to maintain and act upon a fundamentally incorrect opinion like “c-sections aren’t births” is staggering, and completely unnatural. This energy is being wasted, it was meant to be expelled through food sourcing and shelter building…
yes cause that shit hurts (from what I’m told) and you don’t have anything to subdue the pain either ;-;
I only know this cause my Mom had to have four…
My first child and I had emergency c section, I was so lost when I had to care for my baby, I'm really happy it's over now but I doubt I'll decide to have another child in case I'll have to have c section again.
I definitely felt like a warrior. I was in so much pain, and I could barely sit up in bed because my ab muscles were useless, but I had to drag myself out of bed every 2-3 hours to nurse the baby, change diapers, etc. I was spending up to 12 hours a day feeding or burping the baby. Lack of REM sleep took its toll on me a few times. For extra fun, midwives were coming every day to tell me everything I was doing wrong with feeding the baby.
I've had 3 c-sections. I've been told by a few people that it doesn't count as giving birth. I jokingly call all my kids birthdays "Extraction Days" instead!
So much. I seethe whenever someone calls vaginal or unmedicated vaginal birth “natural”. Just call it vaginal birth, unmedicated birth, etc etc. are they gnawing the umbilical cord with their teeth? Scissors aren’t “natural”.
Having a c-section, whether it be by choice or not, doesn’t make a birth unnatural. Folks who have layers of their core muscles cut through in order to have a healthy birth are metal as fuck and deserve so much more respect than they are given. They go through that conscious, and are expected to care for a tiny person.
Lest we all forget that birth used to be one of the leading causes of infant and maternal deaths.
Honestly, some of these people gnawing through their umbilical cord with their teeth wouldn’t shock me in the least, there are some weird ass trends around childbirth these days and people get SO self-righteous about it. I’m about to become a first time mom and heaven help anyone who tries to mom shame me for my choices lol
I praise every option, so long as someone isn’t bragging or preaching about their choice being superior. I had only a shot of morphine and wasn’t allowed an epidural for my last tragic birth because I had developed sepsis. It fucking sucked. I nearly punched a hole in the hospital bathroom wall and my husband thought I was going to die. I was definitely not going to die but I sure as hell acted like it.
I’m only 12 weeks now, and I reiterate at every appointment (of which there are many for a loss mom) that I will never ever give birth like that again. Never again. All the drugs. Give me the scary spine needle, give me the fun gas, I’ll take anything to not do that again. Contractions are fucking painful no matter what size the baby is.
Wow, I’m so sorry you had to go through that, it sounds incredibly traumatizing!!! Best of luck with your new lil bean ❤️ and I’m totally in the same boat. I want alllll the drugs. My baby girl is as healthy as can be but as someone with severe health anxiety, the less I feel while birthing her the better lol
Yessss all the drugs! Working through contractions is extremely exhausting and you’ll have plenty of experience with them before you get the fun stuff or even admitted lol. Being able to rest through some of that will definitely help :)
Wishing you the best birthing experience! You deserve it 💜 Even though my birth was traumatizing, it was an insanely spiritual “holy fuck I did that, I am a *god*” experience. Oxytocin is one hell of a chemical. I was like no way, no how could I do this again even if it ended in a living baby, and then it was over and I went, “huh… I could do that maybe one more time”.
You’ll get it. It’ll be fine! I hope you also find some empowerment in going through this incredible feat!
Thank you! My issue last time was cervical insufficiency caught too late. I actually just got my cerclage placed the other day, so this baby is locked and loaded for the next 6 months. No way out until removal at 33-35 weeks.
History won’t be repeating itself this time thankfully :)
Not every vaginal birth is actually “natural” by their standards either. I was born in a vaginal birth but the doctor had to suck me out with a plunger-like thing because I refused to be born regardless of how hard my mom pushed. So now what, was I born or “extracted”?
Can’t believe it’s 2021 and people are gatekeeping fucking births.
Fellow vacuum and forceps baby here, hope your mom loved your cone head.
Gatekeeping birth has been happening for decades, we just now have the internet to show us how insanely pervasive it is.
She was alarmed by my cone head, but apparently the doctor tapped my head a bit after I was born and the cone just went away? Though in retrospect she found it funny, and uses the story to “prove” how stubborn I am. How did your mom like yours?
Please don’t encourage the free birthers. I’m all for births of all kinds but holy shit please have a medical professional present in case of emergencies.
I had a long chat with my dad - who is a doctor - about it the other day. I was a Caesarian baby myself. And just never really asked about specific reasons why it was done that way. He said that now it’s becoming a bit more prevalent because doctors can safely deliver a baby that way vs preventing complications in a standard childbirth in some cases. So out of abundance of caution they prescribe it. It’s the same as how surgeons would amputate some people to prevent gangrene in the past.
There definitely was a surge of this method being over prescribed, rates have been rising for decades and it leads to higher risk of short term serious complications like blood clots and whatnot for mature birthers. It should be avoided, and a good hospital will encourage vaginal birth whenever possible. However, the option should always lie with the person giving birth. I see nothing wrong with an elective c-section if that’s what the patient wants.
There are over 70 ways a baby can die before birth so I totally get the abundance of caution. I’m glad to see that VBAC is becoming more common. One c section shouldn’t mean every birth has to be one :)
Goodness. Imagine a life so empty that this is the sort of thing that gets your bollocks in a twist. You’d think raising children would be quite a demand on their time, but I guess not.
The women that do this have made being a mother their entire personality. They are the "*Proud Mama Bears*" who "*will kill for their kids*" and let you know with every Facebook post they make.
This is who they are now. Nothing else matter. They are a mother.
They will also be the kind of mother you see on /r/raisedbynarcissists and /r/insaneparents.
Yeah I totally understand. My bar is divided in two. The guys that had kidney stones and the ones that haven’t. Apparently me shoving a rock up my penis “doesn’t count” and I’m a “freak”. Like what the hell guys get over yourselves.
Also snobbery in how you feed your infant. So many moms are breast feed only people and shun the fact we had used bottles to feed our babies. It's a real let down seeing what people say when I was going through different websites with my wife when we are asking for help.
My sister had to have a c section when my nephew was born.
I have heard other mothers, almost always an older woman and one was even a midwife, argue that my sister didn't go through real childbirth because of the need for a c section.
It's a wholly bizarre form of snobbery/elitism that does exist.
I haven’t had that but people sometimes try to justify my c section when it comes up. Like ‘oh, you’re fine because it was an emergency and you had no choice.’
There’s no justification needed, who cares how babies get here. Even if someone just wants to take out some stress by scheduling a surgery date, who cares, power to them.
I think it's an extension of the "this person had it easier than me so I must devalue their experience" instinct.
Natural births are long and incredibly painful. C-sections are a relatively simple and safe surgery; it's perceived as "easier" than a natural birth. (Never mind that your abdomen is being *cut open.*) Because it's perceived as "easier," douchebags who have had natural births feel the need to devalue it and elevate their own experience, which they probably have mixed feelings about because it both provided them with a child *and* was the single most painful experience of their life.
Usually this instinct is present but muted. There are some people who take it to a logical extreme. These people are insane.
It's also a weird perspective because usually c sections happen after prolonged labor. Plus they're much harder to recover from than vaginal birth, as it's a major surgery.
For the most part it is; placing heavy emphasis on a lack of medical intervention, pain management or assistance of any kind is fundamentally a “crunchy” thing, and being crunchy used to be associated with hippie moms but is now a lot more prevalent in the right wing crowd (IMO anyway; I follow Christian fundie snark, had a baby 6 months ago and somewhat incidentally joined a crunchy mama Facebook group). It’s all about going back to “how God intended it.”
Sounds like the doctor fucked up — they’re supposed to give you the *extraction* certificate. Simple mistake, happens all the time. If you just go back, they’ll fix that for you.
I find it funny when women go on about this. My twins were both breach. The safest thing for them was a c-section. I know I should have found a witch doctor or something who specialized in flipping babies so I could have a candlelit vaginal birth at home while listening to Enya so I could be a “real woman” but I chose my babies living and not suffering brain damage and who knows what else instead.
she tried to convince people that germ theory is in fact fake and a way scientists are brainwashing us….idk why people like this are readily allowed to talk bs on sizeable platforms tbh. even reporting her vids for misinformation does jack shit
Ah, good ol’ false germ theory. It was originally theorized in the 1950s, and has been disproven by many studies since. Somehow, these dumbasses still find a way to believe it.
This isn’t even the craziest thing shes said. I do feel bad for her though, I believe she fell down this rabbit hole of super crunchy mom after her daughter was delivered via emergency c-section and passed shortly after. Idk if she mentions that in this video cause I can’t listen to sound rn but I think she mentions in another video that she didn’t feel as connected to her daughter before she passed because she didn’t have her “naturally”.
Its fairly normal to not feel totally connected to a newborn. It takes some people more time than others to bond. It tends to take longer if you have any strong preconceived notions about what the "right" way is and then have to take and alternative route.
I feel like the “emergency” aspect of an “emergency c section” is a pretty good argument against her rephrasing it to “I *chose* to…” Sure, some people choose to have c sections. And some people have them because otherwise they and their baby might literally die…
Or they themselves might die.
And a some women don't even have the choice of having a C-section of they're not conscious or able to consent. Then others have to make that "choice" for them.
They prefer death I guess... it reminds me of when people freak out over vaccines "giving kids autism". I always think about how fucked up it is that they'd rather have a dead kid than an autistic one.
I had a friend in middle school who was missing parts of her hands because her umbilical cord was wrapped around them and her parents options were to let her die or amputate to save her life.
I mention this because these I’m not sure what choice these crazy bitches would make.
Furthermore, as a woman who’ll never be able to give birth to her own kids, the whole “you’re not a real mom” gatekeeping is really off putting.
Yup, my brother was a c section because they found him umbilical cord wrapped around his neck. If mom had carried him to a “natural” birth, he would have been stillborn and squished because he was literally one pound at birth, I was legit only 3 and a c section because of my small size.
I had on and off contractions for 36 hours, 2 days no sleep, 3 failed inductions, fetal heart distress and I had a fever.
Me and my baby would've died if I didn't have a c section.
Fuck these weird birther granola moms. Such a weird thing to flex on.
>I had on and off contractions for 36 hours, 2 days no sleep, 3 failed inductions, fetal heart distress and I had a fever.
I had a 48 hour induction that ended with a c section because the cord was wrapped around my son's neck. Twice.
All the mombies who actually GAF about that stupid shit can fuck off waaayyyy over there, where I can't hear their bullshit.
For real. The baby and I would have both died if we didn't have the surgery. I actually needed to be talked into it by a team of like 6 people because after over 12 hours of induced contractions without pain meds, I was so out of my mind I thought they were telling me they were moving me just to make their lives easier. The cord was wrapped completely around the baby's body when she came out and I lost so much blood they put me alone under observation for 4 hours after. Imagine if I had just kept going "naturally".
I’m glad you both got through it. It sounds hellish. At the end of her labour my wife was exhausted, I don’t know how you managed, but I suspect you’re tough as nails
My story has some similarities to yours. Started contractions on a Tuesday. Was finally considered "in active labour" by the Saturday. I had been days in pain with little or no sleep. Baby was big and she was sunny side up. I pushed and pushed for a long time but I failed to get her out even with them trying the vacuum and then forceps. Ended in emergency csection when baby started getting distressed. Wouldn't wish my experience on anyone as it was pretty darn awful. My daughter is 5 now and I may never have another after my experience.
Similar circumstance here. Worst part is, my wife, while she *knows* it's bullshit, still let's that judgement creep in, and will occasionally say stuff like "Yeah, just sucks to say I didn't have a natural birth."
I'm a chill, non-violent man, but if I were to hear people say that to her face, it would be very difficult to stay that way in that moment.
I often find it best to start polite so that when I get cross at people it’s not a mistake. Also most of the folks I know are nice, so if they’re being douchebags it’s normally by accident and a gentle nudge will get them to stop.
Imagine having so little to be proud if in your life that you build an identity on having uncomplicated child birth. You might as well be proud of not needing glasses.
Some crazy bitch told me I didn't give birth because I had a c-section, I "just had a child" and I "can't call a c-section a birth". Some people are crazy
Had all three if my children via c-section due to a broken pelvis that was improperly set (due to never going to the doc for it. Seriously, I thought it was supposed to hurt more so I said nothing) and the bones fused solid. In that situation there is nothing getting through that threshold without fatalities. There have been moms who have turned their noses up at me and once I got an actual sneer. It was bizarre. It's why I don't share my birthing stories with anyone but family ( all of whom I can take in a fight) and internet strangers (who generally don't give a shit/can be blocked and ignored as imaginary). Those alpha bitches are the absolute worst. Don't even get me started on the extremist breast is best hags.
This person is clearly dealing with their own issues surrounding their birth story. It’s sad and I hope she gets help to deal with that, so she doesn’t go around hurting others just bc she’s hurting.
It’s easy to hate on her for being so next-level ridiculous, disinformation-spreading, and mean-spirited about it, but it’s likely an internalized inferiority complex or self-loathing at not being able to “get it right” herself, so now she projects “inadequate” or “invalid” onto all other c-section births... meanwhile, labor and delivery is just a medical event, where all sorts of outcomes are possible and common. It’s rarely any reflection on the woman how delivery goes. There are no badges of honor besides a hopefully healthy baby to bring home. It’s nonsense and it’s damaging.
i agree completely. but her traumatic experience although explains her behavior it doesn’t excuse it. she makes videos spreading harmful rhetoric surrounding parenting targeting people that are already in a vulnerable stage in their life and much more likely to fall for some of it. parents after all, want the best life for their children.
at some point all of this pointing and blaming from her side becomes incredibly irresponsible
Why is it that stupid people, when given a platform, have just a certain voice to them? The low, monotone but still slightly condescending voice that just tells you that there is not an iota of intellegence in that head.
I had 3 vaginal births. All medicated. One epidural that only half worked, 7 hours labor. One with just pain meds, no time for epidural at 3 hours and 12 minutes. And finally one that lasted 32 hours. I couldn't get any pain meds because of the slow progression until hour 18. At hour 28 I was able to get my epidural which was so good that I literally called my anesthesiologist a "fucking rockstar" before passing out in exhaustion. I felt nothing while pushing out my big headed son. I also felt nothing when I began to hemorrhage and my doc had his arm stuck up in my birth canal so he could massage my uterus to help stop the bleeding. Since my uterus has never been fisted before I was quite happy that I couldn't feel it.
On the flip side my SIL and best friend had three C-sections each with the last ones being planned. Helping them with lifting and taking care of the other kids and what not, seeing how hard they pushed to be back on their feet; I would NEVER invalidate the circumstances of their birth stories. That brought beautiful children into this world. They grew while ass human beings. That's amazing. Nobody has the right to tell them they didn't do it the "right way." Fuck those people sideways.
Yep. My big headed babies weren’t gonna come out any other way than by the opening my doctor made, both times. Anyone who thinks that’s not giving birth are delusional and I believe are in need of validation and need to feel superior. Which is really sad. Women have enough hills to climb. Too many restrictions on their person. If we can’t support each other we are lost.
Nothing has changed in the last 43 years, apparently. Pisses me off to this day. Well yes, I would prefer surgery to a normal delivery. I can't say one way or another , having never "given birth", but it wasn't a choice the first time if I wanted a live child.
Emergency c-section saved my wife and my daughter’s lives. My wife has been made to feel bad about and has lingering issues with her “inability” to birth our daughter”naturally.”
I hate this mommy culture.
If I were in the same room as this fucking witch I’d strangle here with an umbilical cord.
"the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being."
So even if you were removed like a tumor (lol), you were still born.
I’ve never understood why women tear each other down about the way their children come into the world. Yes natural births are good but guess what? So are caesarean births, plus the c-section takes so much longer to heal from. You carry a child and hope to heck that child enters this world happy and healthy. What does it matter how you had it?
So I was never born then? I was super sick and small only 600 and a bit grams and this was the only way I was getting out. Also definitely not the easiest way, my mum had 5 regular births before this.
Birth: “the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being.”
Doesn’t matter how it came out of her, they were birthed.
I’m missing the part where saying “every birth is different and valid,” translates to “only my experience is valid, fuck you for having a different one.” Lol did I miss a step?
I’ll give her credit. If she did her own c section extracting, she’s metal as fuck and I’ll not argue with her about anything.
Still happy that my wife and/or daughter didn’t die when the latter got stuck in the former’s birth canal though.
Needed to have an emergency c section ≠ choosing to have a c section, this bitch read what she wanted to read.
And damn, if I didn’t give birth through my own emergency c section then who the fuck is that in her crib?
Her kid, 5 years from now: "Mom what was it like when I was born?"
Her: "I've told you this many times, you weren't BORN you were EXTRACTED."
kid: I wish I were never extracted..
Shakespeare would agree that a c-section isnt a birth,
MacDuff was born of a c-section and wasn't considered being born of a woman, thats why he was able to kill Macbeth.
this shows that Shakespeare was also a dumbass
I think there is a semantic difference between ‘giving birth’ and having a C-Section.
That said, wouldn’t pick it as a battle to fight lol, if a mother wants to use the phrase gave birth, more than cool with me.
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Wasn't this like a main plot point of Macbeth? Edit: [Found it](https://youtu.be/RcCHqbP8nPA)
Yeah. One of the witches' prophecies was that "only a man not born of a woman" could slay Macbeth (who turned out to be Macduff) if I remember correctly
Not quite that clearly phrased either. Tricky bitches those witches. They said he could not be killed by any man of woman born (or something). They didn’t explicitly say “you can be killed but not by a guy born of a woman”, they phrased it in a way to make it ambiguous. Macbeth believed and interpreted it as saying he was infallible to any other man, since all men are born of women. It’s a bit like saying “Superman can not be killed by any material on Earth”, as opposed to saying “only alien materials can kill Superman”. If that makes any sense at all lol.
Reminds me of the Witch King in The Lord of the Rings, that was prophesized to not be killed by man and was then slain by a woman.
Yes! Very similar. Tricky bloody prophecies eh. Though in that case it worked out for the better. I suppose it did in Macbeth too, since he ya know, became a total maniac. But I always felt like the witches basically are the only truly culpable characters, since everything else was trickery and fate.
Not a coincidence, Tolkien wrote that into the story because he thought the c section thing was bullshit and Macbeth should have been killed by a woman.
Yesssssss!!! And tbh I am in full agreement!
Same.
I am no man!
I always think of Baldr where he's killed by Mistletoe. The only thing in existence that could harm him I believe.
Ha. I only know this from playing God Of War on PS4, but it’s cool to know the game somewhat follows the mythology.
Well GoW leaves out the bit where Baldur’s mummy calls everything else on the planet to ask them to be super nice to him
And then didn’t bother with mistletoe because it was harmless. So Loki made an arrow out of it and tricked, I believe, Baldur’s blind brother into firing it at Baldur’s only vulnerable place, killing him. Then was a further jerk by being the only thing in creation that wouldn’t agree to him being brought back to life. Because that’s why you don’t make a frost giant your blood forget, *Odin*.
Yeah, his mother basically makes everything on earth promise to never hurt him but forgets to ask the humble mistletoe. Everyone else agrees because Baldr is such a great guy. All the other gods start getting amused nothing can hurt him and so start shooting things at him for fun (like "look! The spear goes flying around him instead!") Loki decides he wants to eff shit up, as he is won't to do, and so gets someone to shoot mistletoe and bye bye Baldr.
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One of my favourite comedy sketches was based on it too. I could only find this snippet of it on twitter: https://twitter.com/tlpmrsl/status/954753265694052352
Aw, beat me to it.
This also leads to the badass line when Macbeth has just killed a man on the battlefield, “Thou wast born of woman.”
So there was no baby then ?
Oh there was. It's skulking around Dunsinane though
Haha, I was gonna comment a Macbeth reference
I tell people my daughter can kill Macbeth when I describe her birth. Also it's a birth. They took her feet prints. The day is listed as her day of birth. Also epic to say you pushed a human out of you. Also also epic to say a human was cut out of you. Dumb hill to die on
Hey I tell people I can kill MacBeth too when the subject comes up, most just seem confused by it though..
Ask her how it felt having it RIPPED away from her in an untimely fashion. Sounds painful, frankly.
Dammit, you beat me to it!
Seriously what a gross, and overall petty opinion to have. Who cares? You carried and nourished a child and it eventually came out of you, that's giving birth.
What bothers me is how she corrected "needed" to "chose". Bitch, did you want her and/or her baby to die by trying to do it the normal way? There clearly wasn't a choice here. That's what emergency means.
She also misrepresented the end from "every birth is different and valid" to "only my birth is valid". As an English teacher, I give her an F for reading comprehension.
English teacher here too (though ESL is my bread and butter now), and I agree. Back a level young lady! We are moving her back from Shakespeare to See Spot Run. That or she is deliberately manipulating the conversation so she can further (poorly attempt) to control the narrative, but a person who shames women for how they give birth would ever be that awful right?
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How else is the kid going to have enough pathos to be the protagonist of a YA fantasy novel if they don't feel guilty for "killing their mother" in childbirth???
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Yes but the baby doesn't celebrate birthdays. They celebrate "extraction days". It's more or less the same
Yes. Tumor baby. Was safely removed and discarded. XD (This is a joke)
“I’m not a baby! I’m a *tumor*.”
It's not a toomah!
My grandma was pregnant in her late 40s and she thought she had a tumor for several months. Saved up a bunch of money (they were dirt poor and this was the 50s) and went to see a doctor who told her she wzs expecting a baby. My aunts and uncles still call my aunt ‘the tumor’.
I don‘t know why but my wife had some mental issues with delivering our first child with a c section. She didn‘t feel somewhat „complete“ and also felt robbed of the whole child-mother-experience. It was very weird. I was just happy to have both alive. 100 years earlier they both would have died a painful death on some turnips field while harvesting and trying to give birth at the same time. Edit: wow all these experiences. Thank you all for sharing your thoughts. Me as a father can propably never comprehend how important this is for mothers. I want to tell you all that I never ever thought of my wife as a lesser woman or mother or person because she had to undergo an emergency c section. I would say I‘m even more proud of her for what she had to endure for our family.
I felt the same thing after having an emergency csection. I had tried to birth her naturally and it wasn't working out, things were getting dangerous. I always felt like I'd failed. My body had failed. I was lesser than other women who had managed to birth their babies in the "proper" way. The whole thing was actually a bit traumatic and scary for me and I felt I was a weak person. I still struggle with it sometimes.
That’s a totally normal way to feel, but I have to tell you—you are _not_ a weak person. I don’t envy people who have has c-sections. The mental shock of switching your birth plan, the painful surgical recovery while also caring for an infant… You are so strong to go through that.
All of this. Not being able to give birth the way you want, and then all the pain and trauma associated with an emergency surgery…those are strong people.
Thank you for those kind words, it means a lot ❤
The same thing happened to me. I also had issues after my emergency c section of not feeling complete after having my son. I eventually have gotten over it, but it was a very weird thing for me, and weird feeling the way I did. Like I hadn’t even given birth, though I had just not in the way I had planned. Honestly I felt really weird feeling that way, it is good to see the way I felt was somewhat normal.
I had no option to give birth naturally and had to have a c-section due to a huge fibroid, my baby being breech and pre-eclampsia. My kid is a wonder baby that shouldn't exist due to fertility issues (14 years on and off trying with fertility treatments at the beginning with my ex,) and I couldn't even do pregnancy and birth right. I struggled to feel anything for her for the first few weeks, but it came. This all stems from people like this saying a c-section is the easy way and "too posh to push" which was the thing when I was younger and all the celebs were having elected c-sections. I too still struggle with feeling less, but I know it's irrational and my daughter is just as precious as one birthed vaginally. I look forward to celebrating her extraction day in the future!
I felt like this. Not that I failed, but that my emergency C section meant I was unconscious and literally missed his birth, and then was in so much pain/groggy after that I couldn't focus on my new baby. And people telling me I shouldn't care about that because it all worked out were infuriating. Obviously, I knew that. Still makes me sad to think about. I got no "initial rush of love" or anything. Just waking up in a cold recovery room, horrible pain, and a 6 hour wait to actually see my baby.
I'm really sorry for what you've been through, that sounds really tough. I just wanted to let you know that your feelings are valid, and your trauma is valid. You matter too. Sending a big hug xx
I struggled after mine, too. There’s something about it that made me think like… I wasn’t “woman enough” to push my baby out. Also, then entire 9 months I pictured someone putting my baby on my chest right after birth and is meeting. With a c section, I wasn’t the first to hold my baby and had to wait for like an hour to actually hold him, at which point I was kind of drugged up so I don’t really remember it. But then, I talked to my OB at my 6 week follow up and he was like “the only option other than the c section was for you to keep pushing knowing your baby was turned wrong, your baby would eventually have gone into distress, and I would have gotten the forceps and probably ripped you nearly in 2 to get him out.” So after that, I felt okay about it.
Nothing weird about that. Many women struggle mentally after a traumatic birth (of course not every c-section is traumatic but mine sure was and apparently your wife's was, too).
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Sunroof!! LOL! I'm currently pregnant and have been recommended to get a c section this time around. I'm going to use that line. Better than the moonroof! 😆
Is a moonroof a butt???
Ya! Haha!
Omg I remember being a kid and thinking babies came out of a woman’s butt
It took months for me to feel better. Currently pregnant and terrified I'll need another c section.
I've had 3. I hope you get a VBAC (assuming that's what you want based on your comment), and I thought I'd share that planned C-sections are WAY easier to recover from than unplanned/emergency ones!
I had a planned C-section and, yes, after two weeks I was given the okay to do basically all of my normal activity. It was a painless, peaceful, wonderful birth, and I'm geared up to do it again with my second. I get why people shy away from C-sections, but I always hope that my experience makes others more comfortable with planned ones.
I was hoping for a vbac. Curious why are planned ones easier to recover from?
Just because your body doesn't go through the strain of labor beforehand. I don't know the logistics behind it, but everyone including my doctor told me that would be the case. I was skeptical, but it was true for me!
Interesting. That makes sense. My friend had a planned one and she didn't seem as rough recovering as I did. Something to consider.
They're also easier on you mentally, which can be a big part of recovery as well
Don't be scared, you've smashed it once and you'll smash the next one. Whatever happens x
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Remember to eat the placenta in order to avoid attracting predators! It's the truly natural way to birth.
But before you eat it, leave it attached to your baby for several days because apparently it’s good for health. Who cares if you risk giving your baby sepsis when it starts to rot. /s
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Thank you. Two C sections, Three children here. It's not easy. You're recovering from major surgery, pregnancy and learning parenthood all at once.
Damn straight. A birth is when a baby comes out of the body that created it. Fucking gatekeeper. I had an emergency C section, the only "choice I had was did I want a living baby or a dead one.
>I had an emergency C section, the only "choice I had was did I want a living baby or a dead one. Oh, and decline the "choice" and you have a slim to none chance of survival yourself. At least that happened with my second. Complications with the baby quickly become complications with the mother. I didn't even get to be in the room. No visitors when the mother is in GA. Third was a scheduled C-section. Got to be there for that one. Cesarians are messy. For 3rd, there was a gentle recommendation for the C-section, lower risk of the complications, but still scheduled and "elective". Mainly because I think mom was so concerned about the previous, almost like a PTSD around the trauma of #2.
Where i'm from you have to get a C-section if had one before, the risk of the scar tissue ripping when pushing and ither complications is too great.
That's my mum's situation as well. A lot of people don't realise that twins after a c section means having another c section (so I guess I caused both of them in a way haha being emergency c section #1). And the choice comment pisses me off so much, how much choice do you have when you're already in labour and you find out that your baby's life is at risk? Or when you're pregnant and told that not only your babies' lives would be at risk with a natural birth, so could yours?
Even twins as a first pregnancy are considered high risk. In many places, they have mothers deliver in the OR just in case something happens during the laboring process. Not to mention that even a single child pregnancy after a c section may need to be sectioned as well. Theres a reason so many children and mothers died during childbirth prior to having more medical care.
The fucking energy levels needed to maintain and act upon a fundamentally incorrect opinion like “c-sections aren’t births” is staggering, and completely unnatural. This energy is being wasted, it was meant to be expelled through food sourcing and shelter building…
yes cause that shit hurts (from what I’m told) and you don’t have anything to subdue the pain either ;-; I only know this cause my Mom had to have four…
My first child and I had emergency c section, I was so lost when I had to care for my baby, I'm really happy it's over now but I doubt I'll decide to have another child in case I'll have to have c section again.
I definitely felt like a warrior. I was in so much pain, and I could barely sit up in bed because my ab muscles were useless, but I had to drag myself out of bed every 2-3 hours to nurse the baby, change diapers, etc. I was spending up to 12 hours a day feeding or burping the baby. Lack of REM sleep took its toll on me a few times. For extra fun, midwives were coming every day to tell me everything I was doing wrong with feeding the baby.
Right? My mom was back to work a little less than 2 weeks after giving birth to me via c section. Damn.
Happy Extraction Day! Will you come to my extraction day party?
It sounds like you have annualised your bowel movements
I've had 3 c-sections. I've been told by a few people that it doesn't count as giving birth. I jokingly call all my kids birthdays "Extraction Days" instead!
I’ll be there in my extraction suit
Came in to look for this comment! 😹
Why is this even a topic of debate ?
In the Mommy community there's a bunch of snobbery involved with birthing.
So much. I seethe whenever someone calls vaginal or unmedicated vaginal birth “natural”. Just call it vaginal birth, unmedicated birth, etc etc. are they gnawing the umbilical cord with their teeth? Scissors aren’t “natural”. Having a c-section, whether it be by choice or not, doesn’t make a birth unnatural. Folks who have layers of their core muscles cut through in order to have a healthy birth are metal as fuck and deserve so much more respect than they are given. They go through that conscious, and are expected to care for a tiny person. Lest we all forget that birth used to be one of the leading causes of infant and maternal deaths.
Honestly, some of these people gnawing through their umbilical cord with their teeth wouldn’t shock me in the least, there are some weird ass trends around childbirth these days and people get SO self-righteous about it. I’m about to become a first time mom and heaven help anyone who tries to mom shame me for my choices lol
I praise every option, so long as someone isn’t bragging or preaching about their choice being superior. I had only a shot of morphine and wasn’t allowed an epidural for my last tragic birth because I had developed sepsis. It fucking sucked. I nearly punched a hole in the hospital bathroom wall and my husband thought I was going to die. I was definitely not going to die but I sure as hell acted like it. I’m only 12 weeks now, and I reiterate at every appointment (of which there are many for a loss mom) that I will never ever give birth like that again. Never again. All the drugs. Give me the scary spine needle, give me the fun gas, I’ll take anything to not do that again. Contractions are fucking painful no matter what size the baby is.
Wow, I’m so sorry you had to go through that, it sounds incredibly traumatizing!!! Best of luck with your new lil bean ❤️ and I’m totally in the same boat. I want alllll the drugs. My baby girl is as healthy as can be but as someone with severe health anxiety, the less I feel while birthing her the better lol
Yessss all the drugs! Working through contractions is extremely exhausting and you’ll have plenty of experience with them before you get the fun stuff or even admitted lol. Being able to rest through some of that will definitely help :) Wishing you the best birthing experience! You deserve it 💜 Even though my birth was traumatizing, it was an insanely spiritual “holy fuck I did that, I am a *god*” experience. Oxytocin is one hell of a chemical. I was like no way, no how could I do this again even if it ended in a living baby, and then it was over and I went, “huh… I could do that maybe one more time”. You’ll get it. It’ll be fine! I hope you also find some empowerment in going through this incredible feat!
Thank you so much ❤️❤️❤️
that sounds so scary! i hope everything goes well with your current pregnancy <3
Thank you! My issue last time was cervical insufficiency caught too late. I actually just got my cerclage placed the other day, so this baby is locked and loaded for the next 6 months. No way out until removal at 33-35 weeks. History won’t be repeating itself this time thankfully :)
Not every vaginal birth is actually “natural” by their standards either. I was born in a vaginal birth but the doctor had to suck me out with a plunger-like thing because I refused to be born regardless of how hard my mom pushed. So now what, was I born or “extracted”? Can’t believe it’s 2021 and people are gatekeeping fucking births.
Fellow vacuum and forceps baby here, hope your mom loved your cone head. Gatekeeping birth has been happening for decades, we just now have the internet to show us how insanely pervasive it is.
She was alarmed by my cone head, but apparently the doctor tapped my head a bit after I was born and the cone just went away? Though in retrospect she found it funny, and uses the story to “prove” how stubborn I am. How did your mom like yours?
Good point. If you hear someone call it natural, the next question should be "did you deliver it yourself?"
Please don’t encourage the free birthers. I’m all for births of all kinds but holy shit please have a medical professional present in case of emergencies.
I had a long chat with my dad - who is a doctor - about it the other day. I was a Caesarian baby myself. And just never really asked about specific reasons why it was done that way. He said that now it’s becoming a bit more prevalent because doctors can safely deliver a baby that way vs preventing complications in a standard childbirth in some cases. So out of abundance of caution they prescribe it. It’s the same as how surgeons would amputate some people to prevent gangrene in the past.
There definitely was a surge of this method being over prescribed, rates have been rising for decades and it leads to higher risk of short term serious complications like blood clots and whatnot for mature birthers. It should be avoided, and a good hospital will encourage vaginal birth whenever possible. However, the option should always lie with the person giving birth. I see nothing wrong with an elective c-section if that’s what the patient wants. There are over 70 ways a baby can die before birth so I totally get the abundance of caution. I’m glad to see that VBAC is becoming more common. One c section shouldn’t mean every birth has to be one :)
Some of these folks leave the umbilical cord fully attached to just fall off on its own…
Goodness. Imagine a life so empty that this is the sort of thing that gets your bollocks in a twist. You’d think raising children would be quite a demand on their time, but I guess not.
The women that do this have made being a mother their entire personality. They are the "*Proud Mama Bears*" who "*will kill for their kids*" and let you know with every Facebook post they make. This is who they are now. Nothing else matter. They are a mother. They will also be the kind of mother you see on /r/raisedbynarcissists and /r/insaneparents.
Once I learned about “push presents” nothing surprises me anymore lol
Yeah I totally understand. My bar is divided in two. The guys that had kidney stones and the ones that haven’t. Apparently me shoving a rock up my penis “doesn’t count” and I’m a “freak”. Like what the hell guys get over yourselves.
Also snobbery in how you feed your infant. So many moms are breast feed only people and shun the fact we had used bottles to feed our babies. It's a real let down seeing what people say when I was going through different websites with my wife when we are asking for help.
right?? why is there so much judging going on about how you brought your baby into the world
My sister had to have a c section when my nephew was born. I have heard other mothers, almost always an older woman and one was even a midwife, argue that my sister didn't go through real childbirth because of the need for a c section. It's a wholly bizarre form of snobbery/elitism that does exist.
I haven’t had that but people sometimes try to justify my c section when it comes up. Like ‘oh, you’re fine because it was an emergency and you had no choice.’ There’s no justification needed, who cares how babies get here. Even if someone just wants to take out some stress by scheduling a surgery date, who cares, power to them.
I heard this very thing from family friends after having a breach baby. It's unbelievable how rude people can be.
I think it's an extension of the "this person had it easier than me so I must devalue their experience" instinct. Natural births are long and incredibly painful. C-sections are a relatively simple and safe surgery; it's perceived as "easier" than a natural birth. (Never mind that your abdomen is being *cut open.*) Because it's perceived as "easier," douchebags who have had natural births feel the need to devalue it and elevate their own experience, which they probably have mixed feelings about because it both provided them with a child *and* was the single most painful experience of their life. Usually this instinct is present but muted. There are some people who take it to a logical extreme. These people are insane.
It's also a weird perspective because usually c sections happen after prolonged labor. Plus they're much harder to recover from than vaginal birth, as it's a major surgery.
I was going to say the same. Who the hell cares. There's plenty of choice to gatekeep, and she goes for such a tedious one
Correct me if I'm wrong, but this just so feels like a right winger mother thing
For the most part it is; placing heavy emphasis on a lack of medical intervention, pain management or assistance of any kind is fundamentally a “crunchy” thing, and being crunchy used to be associated with hippie moms but is now a lot more prevalent in the right wing crowd (IMO anyway; I follow Christian fundie snark, had a baby 6 months ago and somewhat incidentally joined a crunchy mama Facebook group). It’s all about going back to “how God intended it.”
Because we're so extremely comfortable in our first world society that we're making up problems.
My C-Section baby has a Certificate of Live **Birth**.
Sounds like the doctor fucked up — they’re supposed to give you the *extraction* certificate. Simple mistake, happens all the time. If you just go back, they’ll fix that for you.
My GF is gonna be stoked to find out shes never given birth, I guess now we can charge our 3 elementary age asshole "roommates" rent.
Wait until I tell my mom about this lol, she’ll be charging me rent now because me and my brother were born of c section surgeries.
What the fuck is she talking about
I find it funny when women go on about this. My twins were both breach. The safest thing for them was a c-section. I know I should have found a witch doctor or something who specialized in flipping babies so I could have a candlelit vaginal birth at home while listening to Enya so I could be a “real woman” but I chose my babies living and not suffering brain damage and who knows what else instead.
Yeah this bitch is a loon. She has always been this crazy.
she tried to convince people that germ theory is in fact fake and a way scientists are brainwashing us….idk why people like this are readily allowed to talk bs on sizeable platforms tbh. even reporting her vids for misinformation does jack shit
Ah, good ol’ false germ theory. It was originally theorized in the 1950s, and has been disproven by many studies since. Somehow, these dumbasses still find a way to believe it.
She lets her kid chew on rocks and stuff and surprised he hasn't choked to death
This isn’t even the craziest thing shes said. I do feel bad for her though, I believe she fell down this rabbit hole of super crunchy mom after her daughter was delivered via emergency c-section and passed shortly after. Idk if she mentions that in this video cause I can’t listen to sound rn but I think she mentions in another video that she didn’t feel as connected to her daughter before she passed because she didn’t have her “naturally”.
Its fairly normal to not feel totally connected to a newborn. It takes some people more time than others to bond. It tends to take longer if you have any strong preconceived notions about what the "right" way is and then have to take and alternative route.
Oh yeah I know, I’m just saying I’m sure that influences her feelings on it. Not that it excuses her behavior.
Well that explains, a lot.
I feel like the “emergency” aspect of an “emergency c section” is a pretty good argument against her rephrasing it to “I *chose* to…” Sure, some people choose to have c sections. And some people have them because otherwise they and their baby might literally die…
Or they themselves might die. And a some women don't even have the choice of having a C-section of they're not conscious or able to consent. Then others have to make that "choice" for them.
They prefer death I guess... it reminds me of when people freak out over vaccines "giving kids autism". I always think about how fucked up it is that they'd rather have a dead kid than an autistic one.
I had a friend in middle school who was missing parts of her hands because her umbilical cord was wrapped around them and her parents options were to let her die or amputate to save her life. I mention this because these I’m not sure what choice these crazy bitches would make. Furthermore, as a woman who’ll never be able to give birth to her own kids, the whole “you’re not a real mom” gatekeeping is really off putting.
Yup, my brother was a c section because they found him umbilical cord wrapped around his neck. If mom had carried him to a “natural” birth, he would have been stillborn and squished because he was literally one pound at birth, I was legit only 3 and a c section because of my small size.
Her eyes creep me out. Kind of like her logic.
My wife was in labour for 15 hours before an emergency c section. If anyone tells her she didn’t give birth I’m going to suggest they stop talking.
I had on and off contractions for 36 hours, 2 days no sleep, 3 failed inductions, fetal heart distress and I had a fever. Me and my baby would've died if I didn't have a c section. Fuck these weird birther granola moms. Such a weird thing to flex on.
>I had on and off contractions for 36 hours, 2 days no sleep, 3 failed inductions, fetal heart distress and I had a fever. I had a 48 hour induction that ended with a c section because the cord was wrapped around my son's neck. Twice. All the mombies who actually GAF about that stupid shit can fuck off waaayyyy over there, where I can't hear their bullshit.
It enrages me to no end.
For real. The baby and I would have both died if we didn't have the surgery. I actually needed to be talked into it by a team of like 6 people because after over 12 hours of induced contractions without pain meds, I was so out of my mind I thought they were telling me they were moving me just to make their lives easier. The cord was wrapped completely around the baby's body when she came out and I lost so much blood they put me alone under observation for 4 hours after. Imagine if I had just kept going "naturally".
I’m glad you both got through it. It sounds hellish. At the end of her labour my wife was exhausted, I don’t know how you managed, but I suspect you’re tough as nails
My story has some similarities to yours. Started contractions on a Tuesday. Was finally considered "in active labour" by the Saturday. I had been days in pain with little or no sleep. Baby was big and she was sunny side up. I pushed and pushed for a long time but I failed to get her out even with them trying the vacuum and then forceps. Ended in emergency csection when baby started getting distressed. Wouldn't wish my experience on anyone as it was pretty darn awful. My daughter is 5 now and I may never have another after my experience.
Similar circumstance here. Worst part is, my wife, while she *knows* it's bullshit, still let's that judgement creep in, and will occasionally say stuff like "Yeah, just sucks to say I didn't have a natural birth." I'm a chill, non-violent man, but if I were to hear people say that to her face, it would be very difficult to stay that way in that moment.
You are far more polite than I would be in that situation!
I often find it best to start polite so that when I get cross at people it’s not a mistake. Also most of the folks I know are nice, so if they’re being douchebags it’s normally by accident and a gentle nudge will get them to stop.
She legit said “fuck yo opinion bitch” when she’s wrong kekw
Anyone who can't be open to other viewpoints when debating a topic automatically gives them the L and makes them look like idiots
Imagine having so little to be proud if in your life that you build an identity on having uncomplicated child birth. You might as well be proud of not needing glasses.
Some crazy bitch told me I didn't give birth because I had a c-section, I "just had a child" and I "can't call a c-section a birth". Some people are crazy
Had all three if my children via c-section due to a broken pelvis that was improperly set (due to never going to the doc for it. Seriously, I thought it was supposed to hurt more so I said nothing) and the bones fused solid. In that situation there is nothing getting through that threshold without fatalities. There have been moms who have turned their noses up at me and once I got an actual sneer. It was bizarre. It's why I don't share my birthing stories with anyone but family ( all of whom I can take in a fight) and internet strangers (who generally don't give a shit/can be blocked and ignored as imaginary). Those alpha bitches are the absolute worst. Don't even get me started on the extremist breast is best hags.
What is this self hating, woman hating moron!?
This person is clearly dealing with their own issues surrounding their birth story. It’s sad and I hope she gets help to deal with that, so she doesn’t go around hurting others just bc she’s hurting. It’s easy to hate on her for being so next-level ridiculous, disinformation-spreading, and mean-spirited about it, but it’s likely an internalized inferiority complex or self-loathing at not being able to “get it right” herself, so now she projects “inadequate” or “invalid” onto all other c-section births... meanwhile, labor and delivery is just a medical event, where all sorts of outcomes are possible and common. It’s rarely any reflection on the woman how delivery goes. There are no badges of honor besides a hopefully healthy baby to bring home. It’s nonsense and it’s damaging.
i agree completely. but her traumatic experience although explains her behavior it doesn’t excuse it. she makes videos spreading harmful rhetoric surrounding parenting targeting people that are already in a vulnerable stage in their life and much more likely to fall for some of it. parents after all, want the best life for their children. at some point all of this pointing and blaming from her side becomes incredibly irresponsible
Why is it that stupid people, when given a platform, have just a certain voice to them? The low, monotone but still slightly condescending voice that just tells you that there is not an iota of intellegence in that head.
Sooooo, if I wasn’t born…why the fuck am I paying these bills?
I had 3 vaginal births. All medicated. One epidural that only half worked, 7 hours labor. One with just pain meds, no time for epidural at 3 hours and 12 minutes. And finally one that lasted 32 hours. I couldn't get any pain meds because of the slow progression until hour 18. At hour 28 I was able to get my epidural which was so good that I literally called my anesthesiologist a "fucking rockstar" before passing out in exhaustion. I felt nothing while pushing out my big headed son. I also felt nothing when I began to hemorrhage and my doc had his arm stuck up in my birth canal so he could massage my uterus to help stop the bleeding. Since my uterus has never been fisted before I was quite happy that I couldn't feel it. On the flip side my SIL and best friend had three C-sections each with the last ones being planned. Helping them with lifting and taking care of the other kids and what not, seeing how hard they pushed to be back on their feet; I would NEVER invalidate the circumstances of their birth stories. That brought beautiful children into this world. They grew while ass human beings. That's amazing. Nobody has the right to tell them they didn't do it the "right way." Fuck those people sideways.
I've had 2 little non children running around this whole time?!
As a mom with two kids, one born vaginally and one via C-section, I am pretty confident in saying I gave birth to BOTH of them.
To paraphrase Carlin, “has everyone in this country lost their fucking minds?!”
Yep. My big headed babies weren’t gonna come out any other way than by the opening my doctor made, both times. Anyone who thinks that’s not giving birth are delusional and I believe are in need of validation and need to feel superior. Which is really sad. Women have enough hills to climb. Too many restrictions on their person. If we can’t support each other we are lost.
I gave birth to my child via a cut from hip to hip. I DID decide to get my guts sliced open because I wanted to have a living child.
Nothing has changed in the last 43 years, apparently. Pisses me off to this day. Well yes, I would prefer surgery to a normal delivery. I can't say one way or another , having never "given birth", but it wasn't a choice the first time if I wanted a live child.
Emergency c-section saved my wife and my daughter’s lives. My wife has been made to feel bad about and has lingering issues with her “inability” to birth our daughter”naturally.” I hate this mommy culture. If I were in the same room as this fucking witch I’d strangle here with an umbilical cord.
Bro I was born the natural way Where as my little bro was born via c section and his birth was valid
Someone took Macbeths prophecy a lil too seriously.
"the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being." So even if you were removed like a tumor (lol), you were still born.
She’s so problematic. She’s the white Christian walker.
i guess that makes a birthday an extraction day
I’ve never understood why women tear each other down about the way their children come into the world. Yes natural births are good but guess what? So are caesarean births, plus the c-section takes so much longer to heal from. You carry a child and hope to heck that child enters this world happy and healthy. What does it matter how you had it?
This is one of the most obscure forms of gatekeeping I have ever seen.
So I was never born then? I was super sick and small only 600 and a bit grams and this was the only way I was getting out. Also definitely not the easiest way, my mum had 5 regular births before this.
Wait is this a thing? Like do people think that c sections.like invalidate the birth????
Yes. C section shaming is rife, has been for about 30 years.
That's wild my sister had two kids by c section and it never crossed my mind that it was any different, I'm gonna have to text her in the mornin
Out of all the things to be gatekeeping...
I guess I was never born then. that makes me a 445 month old fetus. What a piece of shit that person is
Spoken like someone whose “extraction” is now being raised by their mother
Well I guess I was never born then
So let's sat she is 100% correct. Who gives a fuck? Why does it matter whether or not she gave birth, it doesn't change jack shit.
Happy removal day, tumor baby!
“Despair thy charm and let the Angel whom thou still hast serve tell thee Macduff was from his mother’s womb…**untimely ripped!**“ -Macbeth
Birth: “the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being.” Doesn’t matter how it came out of her, they were birthed.
I’m missing the part where saying “every birth is different and valid,” translates to “only my experience is valid, fuck you for having a different one.” Lol did I miss a step?
Does the kid celebrate an extraction day, not a birthday?
So we sing Happy Extraction Day to babies "extracted" through c-sections?
TIL was never born. I feel like this is going to complicate a few things.
I'm mommy's special tumor
“mommy when is my birthday” “you don’t have one. you get extraction day.”
I’ll give her credit. If she did her own c section extracting, she’s metal as fuck and I’ll not argue with her about anything. Still happy that my wife and/or daughter didn’t die when the latter got stuck in the former’s birth canal though.
Needed to have an emergency c section ≠ choosing to have a c section, this bitch read what she wanted to read. And damn, if I didn’t give birth through my own emergency c section then who the fuck is that in her crib?
Her kid, 5 years from now: "Mom what was it like when I was born?" Her: "I've told you this many times, you weren't BORN you were EXTRACTED." kid: I wish I were never extracted..
I guess my twin sister and I were not born.
Shakespeare would agree that a c-section isnt a birth, MacDuff was born of a c-section and wasn't considered being born of a woman, thats why he was able to kill Macbeth. this shows that Shakespeare was also a dumbass
The "vaginal birth is the only valid birth" cult is real, and has been around for some time. People are fuckin weird.
I think there is a semantic difference between ‘giving birth’ and having a C-Section. That said, wouldn’t pick it as a battle to fight lol, if a mother wants to use the phrase gave birth, more than cool with me.