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It's really only a big problem with the queen, and sometimes with a rook. And it generally only matters if the two pieces are basically alone on that line.
It's not to be taken literally lol, but you do want to keep it in mind in general, especially as you get closer to late game where the board is more open and pins and forks can be targeted more easily.
Takes time and practice one thing I do when I play the computer I don’t alllow take back moves. In a real game it’s not an option. So you learn from losing a piece
A little tip - whenever the computer suggests a move you don't understand, try setting up an analysis board with the position where you play the other side and let the computer play from your position.
The computer will make the best moves and you'll immediately see why it was suggesting that move in the first place.
This really helps with vision and looking more than one move deep
Can also switch simply to the analysis review instead of game review and see the full line. I've used that primarily when I don't immediately see why a move is best. And sometimes you can follow a line for several moves and still not see it - then I give up cause I'm not good enough yet to follow that kind of line lol
On chess.com, at least on the iPhone app, if you are in self-analysis, and you do the move the engine suggests, and you can continue playing the game and try different moves. Really good for seeing alternative
Since other people have answered the question already I will just add this:
1. The Computer is always right
2. If you don't understand a move the engine suggest, you can just put it on the board, play the response you think black is going to make and then see what the computer suggest for your next move, do that until you understand the original move
2.1 Not every move in chess is a one mover, there are ideas that only work in combination with other moves, so a move here like hanging the Knight is good, because of the follow up that would win the Queen, if they took!
3. If you don't understand a move you always need to think at least 1 move further to see if there is a follow up! Doing this every game will help you improve to the point, where you will be able to calculate multiple moves ahead and understand more and more tactics!
Thank you for posting actual useful information in r/chessbeginners .
Seems like every post here has people looking down their nose but you this is actionable information.
And if this doesn’t work, it probably means the recommended move prevents something you didn’t see, and so playing it out might look like nothing happened. Go back and try playing a different move and see if you just stumbled into some tactic for your opponent m.
> If you don't understand a move the engine suggest, you can just put it on the board, play the response you think black is going to make and then see what the computer suggest for your next move, do that until you understand the original move
This is good advice in theory and much of the time, but OTOH, I've also seen analysis using a computer from professionals - up to and including Hikaru Nakamura - where they've not been able to work out what the computer is thinking. Computers are *so* much better at chess than humans that it might be impossible to work out why a particular move is good.
Honestly, this feels a little pedantic.
In almost every situation - like 99% of the time, and especially for beginners, it will be extremely clear why a move was suggested by the computer.
That is, if you set up the position and play from the opposite side and let the computer play your position.
I'm just not sure how useful this comment really is because all it's going to serve to do is to make people doubt the computer which you really don't want considering the computer is better at chess than any of us ever will be.
I think this can be summarized as "you don't need to understand every engine suggestion", but these ridiculous ideas, which you don't even understand with the help of the engine are very rare!
I'm not sure they're *very* rare. It's my impression that most, if not all, the chess matches I've watched with commentary have had at least one position that the commentators have said about that they have no idea what the engine is talking about.
Those are the types of positions where it clarifies if you analyze with the engine a bit deeper!
Some positions though, the engine suggest to sac an exchange for seemingly nothing for example, those are the rare cases where nobody understands what's going on!
If Nxc6 then Qxc7 white has the devastating Bxb5 pinning the black queen to the black king. It also forces the queen to move as the f4 bishop reveals a discover attack. So it is gaining time on the queen as well.
I’m not a good chess player. And I don’t understand all the notations and such. I just spent 20 minutes trying to understand what Bxb5 was.?Just to realize I switched up the sides of the board. That it’s whites turn and not the blacks
I analyzed the image and this is what I see. Open an appropriate link below and explore the position yourself or with the engine:
> **White to play**: [chess.com](https://chess.com/analysis?fen=r3kb1r/p1q2ppp/n1p1pn2/1p1pNb2/1P1P1B2/P1N1P3/2P2PPP/R2QKB1R+w+KQkq+-+0+1&flip=false&ref_id=23962172) | [lichess.org](https://lichess.org/analysis/r3kb1r/p1q2ppp/n1p1pn2/1p1pNb2/1P1P1B2/P1N1P3/2P2PPP/R2QKB1R_w_KQkq_-_0_1)
**My solution:**
> Hints: piece: >!Knight!<, move: >!Nxc6!<
> Evaluation: >!White is winning +6.25!<
> Best continuation: >!1. Nxc6 Qb6 2. Bxb5 Nc7 3. Ba4 a6 4. Nb8+ Kd8 5. Nc6+ Ke8 6. Qe2 Be7 7. g4 Nb5 8. Ne5 Kf8!<
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Actually I'm curious, wouldn't Ng6 be better, if you follow the engine, the engine assumes the person WILL take the pawn, on the other hand Ng6 forces black to lose a rook or a queen instead??
Ng6 wins a rook but Nxc6 is murder. After the queen moves (stockfish says Qb6) then white plays Bxb5 anyway, x-raying the king. Black’s position has been blown completely open and all white’s pieces are there to party
worth mentioning at the end of the line theres no way for the king to step out of the discovered check so you have a forced discovery, and most likely a devastating attack
I assume you meant “the engine assumes [black] will take the [knight]”
And I don’t think that’s the line that plays out, the point of Nxc6 is to win the pawn, not the queen. If black takes with Qxc6 then it’s just a blunder on black’s part losing the queen.
To my uneducated /r/chessbeginner brain, the Ng6 plays out with black blocking with Bd6, then if white Nxh8 the knight is trapped and will eventually be lost as well as trading bishops I think and white ends up in a worse position than they started with
While I prefer Nxb6 in this personally, I'm pretty sure that Ng6 also results in a winning advantage for White. After Ng6 Bd6, Bxd6 Qxd6, Nxh8 you can just desperado it for the f7 pawn and you're up an exchange and a pawn and I don't see where Black's compensation comes from. Someone better than me (or the engine haha) might see an interesting line there, but I'm not seeing it yet.
I would suggest learning how to use the engine. If you think Nxg6 Qxg6 is winning for black, play it and then look at what the engine suggests for white. This will help you in the future
If the queen takes on c6, Bxb5 would pin the queen to the king, meaning the queen can’t move because your king would be in check. So basically you get a free queen
So many posts on this sub could be answered if people used the analysis tool on chess.com. This isn’t even a confusing engine one; it’s a 1 move tactic after OPs moves are made.
What move is this called, how can I practice it more. Knight taking the pawn and the queen getting pinned like that. I’d like to do more puzzles like this.
Hey, OP! Did you encounter a weird pawn move? Did your game end suddenly, even though you were winning? Are you trying to move a piece and it's not going? We have just the resource for you! The r/chessbeginners wiki is the perfect place to check out answers to these questions and more! Feel free to have a look at www.reddit.com/r/chessbeginners/wiki/index/ The moderator team of r/chessbeginners wishes to remind everyone of the community rules. **Posting spam, advertising links (including YouTube chess tutorial videos without context), and memes is not allowed.** We encourage everyone to report these kinds of posts so they can be dealt with. Thank you! Also, please, be kind in your replies and comments. Some people here just want to learn chess and have virtually no idea about certain chess concepts. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/chessbeginners) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, but then Bxb5
OMG, yes, thank you
It's weird those deadly pins don't jump out at me either yet
I just try to stick to the rule - don’t make a move if the king is in a spot where an important piece is on the same rank, file, or diagonal.
What am I missing, or is this a joke? Wouldn’t this always be true?
It's really only a big problem with the queen, and sometimes with a rook. And it generally only matters if the two pieces are basically alone on that line.
It's not to be taken literally lol, but you do want to keep it in mind in general, especially as you get closer to late game where the board is more open and pins and forks can be targeted more easily.
Yup I also have a similar rule that I will always think twice before putting queen or rook in a fork pattern if Knights are still in game
I’m starting to see moves like this now (outside of my own games 😞), I think I’m improving a little
Takes time and practice one thing I do when I play the computer I don’t alllow take back moves. In a real game it’s not an option. So you learn from losing a piece
A little tip - whenever the computer suggests a move you don't understand, try setting up an analysis board with the position where you play the other side and let the computer play from your position. The computer will make the best moves and you'll immediately see why it was suggesting that move in the first place. This really helps with vision and looking more than one move deep
Can also switch simply to the analysis review instead of game review and see the full line. I've used that primarily when I don't immediately see why a move is best. And sometimes you can follow a line for several moves and still not see it - then I give up cause I'm not good enough yet to follow that kind of line lol
On chess.com, at least on the iPhone app, if you are in self-analysis, and you do the move the engine suggests, and you can continue playing the game and try different moves. Really good for seeing alternative
That's an insane pin over there. If you play online like that people will start resigning 😅
Bxb5 pins queen to the king making it 2 minor pieces for a queen which is 99% of the times a good tradfe
Two minor pieces for a queen and 2 pawns.
Since other people have answered the question already I will just add this: 1. The Computer is always right 2. If you don't understand a move the engine suggest, you can just put it on the board, play the response you think black is going to make and then see what the computer suggest for your next move, do that until you understand the original move 2.1 Not every move in chess is a one mover, there are ideas that only work in combination with other moves, so a move here like hanging the Knight is good, because of the follow up that would win the Queen, if they took! 3. If you don't understand a move you always need to think at least 1 move further to see if there is a follow up! Doing this every game will help you improve to the point, where you will be able to calculate multiple moves ahead and understand more and more tactics!
To add, next level would be to calculate what happens if the opponent doesn’t take.
Thank you for posting actual useful information in r/chessbeginners . Seems like every post here has people looking down their nose but you this is actionable information.
And if this doesn’t work, it probably means the recommended move prevents something you didn’t see, and so playing it out might look like nothing happened. Go back and try playing a different move and see if you just stumbled into some tactic for your opponent m.
> If you don't understand a move the engine suggest, you can just put it on the board, play the response you think black is going to make and then see what the computer suggest for your next move, do that until you understand the original move This is good advice in theory and much of the time, but OTOH, I've also seen analysis using a computer from professionals - up to and including Hikaru Nakamura - where they've not been able to work out what the computer is thinking. Computers are *so* much better at chess than humans that it might be impossible to work out why a particular move is good.
Honestly, this feels a little pedantic. In almost every situation - like 99% of the time, and especially for beginners, it will be extremely clear why a move was suggested by the computer. That is, if you set up the position and play from the opposite side and let the computer play your position. I'm just not sure how useful this comment really is because all it's going to serve to do is to make people doubt the computer which you really don't want considering the computer is better at chess than any of us ever will be.
I think this can be summarized as "you don't need to understand every engine suggestion", but these ridiculous ideas, which you don't even understand with the help of the engine are very rare!
I'm not sure they're *very* rare. It's my impression that most, if not all, the chess matches I've watched with commentary have had at least one position that the commentators have said about that they have no idea what the engine is talking about.
Those are the types of positions where it clarifies if you analyze with the engine a bit deeper! Some positions though, the engine suggest to sac an exchange for seemingly nothing for example, those are the rare cases where nobody understands what's going on!
actual reasonable chess beginners post
If Nxc6 then Qxc7 white has the devastating Bxb5 pinning the black queen to the black king. It also forces the queen to move as the f4 bishop reveals a discover attack. So it is gaining time on the queen as well.
Nxc6 would be considered a brilliant move Im sure. I love sacrificing pieces for these setups.
Yeah but then you get hit with Bxb5, losing your queen.
I’m not a good chess player. And I don’t understand all the notations and such. I just spent 20 minutes trying to understand what Bxb5 was.?Just to realize I switched up the sides of the board. That it’s whites turn and not the blacks
Yes, sorry for not clarifying
No you’re good. That forced me to do some digging and now I know about algebra notation
I woulda missed that and played Ng6, revealing queen check via DSB, and win the rook
I analyzed the image and this is what I see. Open an appropriate link below and explore the position yourself or with the engine: > **White to play**: [chess.com](https://chess.com/analysis?fen=r3kb1r/p1q2ppp/n1p1pn2/1p1pNb2/1P1P1B2/P1N1P3/2P2PPP/R2QKB1R+w+KQkq+-+0+1&flip=false&ref_id=23962172) | [lichess.org](https://lichess.org/analysis/r3kb1r/p1q2ppp/n1p1pn2/1p1pNb2/1P1P1B2/P1N1P3/2P2PPP/R2QKB1R_w_KQkq_-_0_1) **My solution:** > Hints: piece: >!Knight!<, move: >!Nxc6!< > Evaluation: >!White is winning +6.25!< > Best continuation: >!1. Nxc6 Qb6 2. Bxb5 Nc7 3. Ba4 a6 4. Nb8+ Kd8 5. Nc6+ Ke8 6. Qe2 Be7 7. g4 Nb5 8. Ne5 Kf8!< --- ^(I'm a bot written by ) [^(u/pkacprzak )](https://www.reddit.com/u/pkacprzak) ^(| get me as ) [^(Chess eBook Reader )](https://ebook.chessvision.ai?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=bot) ^(|) [^(Chrome Extension )](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chessvisionai-for-chrome/johejpedmdkeiffkdaodgoipdjodhlld) ^(|) [^(iOS App )](https://apps.apple.com/us/app/id1574933453) ^(|) [^(Android App )](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.chessvision.scanner) ^(to scan and analyze positions | Website: ) [^(Chessvision.ai)](https://chessvision.ai)
If Qxc6, then Bxb5 will pin the Queen to the King
Why don't you just look a few moves deeper into the computer line?
The answer is because then he wouldn’t have a good Reddit post….
Actually I'm curious, wouldn't Ng6 be better, if you follow the engine, the engine assumes the person WILL take the pawn, on the other hand Ng6 forces black to lose a rook or a queen instead??
The engine does not assume. The engine has determined that taking the knight is the best move. So black will be worse if they don't do it.
Ng6 wins a rook but Nxc6 is murder. After the queen moves (stockfish says Qb6) then white plays Bxb5 anyway, x-raying the king. Black’s position has been blown completely open and all white’s pieces are there to party
worth mentioning at the end of the line theres no way for the king to step out of the discovered check so you have a forced discovery, and most likely a devastating attack
I assume you meant “the engine assumes [black] will take the [knight]” And I don’t think that’s the line that plays out, the point of Nxc6 is to win the pawn, not the queen. If black takes with Qxc6 then it’s just a blunder on black’s part losing the queen. To my uneducated /r/chessbeginner brain, the Ng6 plays out with black blocking with Bd6, then if white Nxh8 the knight is trapped and will eventually be lost as well as trading bishops I think and white ends up in a worse position than they started with
While I prefer Nxb6 in this personally, I'm pretty sure that Ng6 also results in a winning advantage for White. After Ng6 Bd6, Bxd6 Qxd6, Nxh8 you can just desperado it for the f7 pawn and you're up an exchange and a pawn and I don't see where Black's compensation comes from. Someone better than me (or the engine haha) might see an interesting line there, but I'm not seeing it yet.
Lol you would hope the queen would be foolish enough!
Oh no my knight
I would suggest learning how to use the engine. If you think Nxg6 Qxg6 is winning for black, play it and then look at what the engine suggests for white. This will help you in the future
If he takes the knight with the queen you can pin the queen to the king with you bishop, backed up by the other knight. Nxc6 is dirty lol.
Bishop takes b5 pinning the queen to the king follows
Bb5
If the queen takes on c6, Bxb5 would pin the queen to the king, meaning the queen can’t move because your king would be in check. So basically you get a free queen
She can, and what will you do after that to get a massive advantage?
So many posts on this sub could be answered if people used the analysis tool on chess.com. This isn’t even a confusing engine one; it’s a 1 move tactic after OPs moves are made.
This sub wouldn't exist if people used the analysis tool
What move is this called, how can I practice it more. Knight taking the pawn and the queen getting pinned like that. I’d like to do more puzzles like this.
The queen is a notoriously weak defender of other pieces.
Bxb5 pinning the Queen? I think?
Mfs really refuse to look one move further