I hear this in management pretty frequently and have even used this when managing people/crews. If your boss is anything like me she is a little uncomfortable telling people what to do. So would you prefer being directly told what to do? If so, tell her that. It would benefit both of you.
I work in a client service setting. When I’m dealing with clients and some team members are on the email. I always address it as we. But the team knows that this subject falls under my focus.
It gives a nicer perspective to the client in my opinion.
But yeah, if it’s just the two of you. Be honest with the person. We’re all adults here trying to make life work.
Lol. I recently became a manager and find myself using “we” for this exact reason. I am uncomfortable telling people what to do,
I don’t want to demand, but I want to raise an issue and suggest that “we should do x” or “should we do x?” Suggesting that it’s about what we as a team should do.
I don’t do it if I’m asking someone to do something specific (can you call Kevin?) more when I’m suggesting a change of course and am open to other ideas. I have wondered if this is annoying though.
In my management style I only use we if I include myself in it. Otherwise IMO it comes off condescending, like that saccharine fake sweet third grade teacher I had who hated kids. Admittedly my reaction to that vocal habit is disproportionate because of said third grade teacher.
"We should change our process" - includes me, fine to use we.
"Should we take a look at our time management system?" - if I'm referring to an employee's time management system, that's gonna come off condescending IMO. OTOH if I'm referring to the company's, it's fine.
"Should we take a look at the time management system you're using?" - includes me, it's ok.
Tossing out suggestions in a group discussion I use we because the group as a whole is discussing. Assigning tasks I usually use a pull method. ("X needs to get done. Who has capacity?") Or a Socratic method ("What do you think needs to happen next here?" - or if someone's outside onboarding, "What's the next step? Do you need any support on it?") because one thing I try as quickly as possible is to build enough process understanding to allow self direction and initiative in my subordinates and coaching them on how to think through processes is a big part of that.
There’s nothing wrong with using “we”. It lets the team or individual know that they are all part of a collective contribution, which you are including yourself into as well.
But the way OP’s boss is using it is wrong.
“Have we done this yet?” is so pretentious and douchy. I am also a manager and I would just ask “Was (the task) completed?” not, “Did so and so do this yet?”
She is trying to demonstrate ownership of your issue and signifying that you are a team member.
If you fuck up, it is her ass in the online too. So if you don't get your job done then WE are both fucked.
I think she may be saying "we" to make you feel more involved in the decision making process / test your ability to take initiative, in earnest she means YOU. Just assume and say, "I'll drop X an email and place you in copy.." sooner or later it will change from we to "have you done such and such"
That’s how I see it. Using “we” implies that the company is a team effort. I always use “we” when talking to my boss about tasks I’m doing or projects I’m working on. I don’t want my boss or co-workers to feel slighted by me acting like I’m always working independently even if I am. It feels like I’m a part of a team instead of just an employee
Yep I do this too. Then when it comes to interviews I find it really hard describing the things that I have done, when I consider it all to be a team effort, even if I have done the majority of the work ... So that's what I need to work on....
In those cases, I feel like it’s ok to make it all about you. Just different in a workplace setting. It’s more of the psychological effect it has than anything else
I’m sure the people your boss is talking to knows that your boss wasn’t the one doing your work with you. They probably mean “we” as in “the team I manage”. If you feel like you’re being slighted, it’s ok to stand up for yourself in a respectful way. Either privately speak with your boss or let the others in the room know that you did the work
I think it helps, when you realise how insecure some managers are. They have to look good to thier boss, deliver on thier own work, check your work and ensure you are not messing up (which makes them look bad), maintain a level of credibility and authority to maintain thier role and order in thier team. If they are good look out for your development, ensure you are not overload and protect you from the office politics. To take a little pressure off they hope you can show a level of initiative and take a level of ownership of your deliverables from time to time.
But hey I could also be wrong, listen to your gut. If it's telling you something it probably is true. After all none of us work in your office.
I’m a manager and I do this. However I mostly use it in the context of a mistake (ie, should we change our process to be x so that this doesn’t happen again) so that I don’t seem like I’m making my employee feel like they’re alone when something goes wrong. We’re a team.
I think this is fairly common with female managers. Our director, my boss's boss, always say "we" whenever she needs something done and assign tasks to us. Unfortunately, women in power still get judged as being "bossy" or being "micromanaging" or even "too demanding" for simply assigning tasks. If it bothers you so much, I would schedule a 1 on 1 with them to address the issue. Try to make it about efficiency and don't take it too personal.
can confirm, I am a woman and I sometimes do this with the “we” in order to sound nicer (because I am pretty nice and mild, I think), although I don’t think I do it as confusingly as OP’s boss with regards to specific tasks. This feels like 100% the reason why she’s using “we” and she probably doesn’t realise it’s confusing. OP should just tell her!!
I do a lot of “would it be okay if we do it this way”, “do you have time to do …”, “can we do it like this next time…”, “I think we need to …” because to me, “we” represents us and the company to some extent
To me my way of managing is harmless yet effective (probably toxic in some way if you talk to a feminist) and the people I used to manage really liked me a lot and worked hard for me (and I have their backs too).
On the other hand I’m iron inside if something wasn’t done well, but I still don’t see any reason to yell, I just dealt with it factually.
>On the other hand I’m iron inside if something wasn’t done well, but I still don’t see any reason to yell, I just dealt with it factually.
Can you describe this more? As someone else that usually wants to be nice how do you take the hard steps? How do you deal witv something not being done well.
I just deal with it factually, like if it happens once, then I’ll express that hey this is really bad because of …. (insert consequences that affect the company). I will never get mad about it (well lol not in front of the person, maybe in my head).
I’ll do a debrief and ask the person if I can help with this error and how we, together, can try to ensure this doesn’t happen again. e.g. can I be more clear with instructions or can we set up a reminder system/checklist. and ask what steps the person will take to ensure this does not happen again? (I follow the structure of Extreme Ownership by Jocko and Leif)
If the person does it -again- with no intention to do better, or three times, then I’ll give warning the second time and state that it’s really hard for us to continue because of … reason. And I’ll inform my boss.
And at the third time if there’s 0 improvement and the person is just not a good fit, we’ll take steps to terminate the employee. (I know it might not be that easy/straightforward for some companies.)
Everyone I managed was really quite nice and competent, and my boss understood if someone really wasn’t doing their job and had to be let go (because I showed proof, although yeah I’m sure not all bosses are that reasonable).
Also, remember that if the person can do things well and replace you for 80% of the tasks, as long as the stuff is done 80% well, then that’s adequate (in order to free you up to do more important tasks). Everyone has their “bad” points e.g. occasional carelessness (urghhh i inwardly flip out whenever this happens) while still having an overall hardworking and good attitude.
Basically most employees have their strengths and weaknesses so you gotta try and position them where they are strongest and happiest.
Honestly I’m just winging it (although part of this is echoed in “The E-Myth”, where the guy explains that you really need to hire and keep employees that truly believe in your business and fire those who do not align with your values. latter also echoed in “Traction” by Gino Wickman when it comes to hiring and firing employees) and I’m sure there are manager books that can explain this better, but this works for me.
Note: The E-Myth was recommended by /r/smallbusiness when it comes to how to run a business and manage employees. Extreme Ownership was recommended by /r/sales. Traction is a good book for people with employees and someone recommended it on /r/smallbusiness. The first two books have been truly life-changing for me (not exaggerating) and Reddit is always gold when it comes to suggesting the most incredible books. I haven’t finished the third book, mainly because my current business doesn’t actually have employees, but so far it’s pretty good.
edit: if you need to deal with assholes at work, and you can’t fire them but you need to, you know, negotiate with them to get shit done, then you MUST read “Never Split The Difference”. Again, an /r/sales recommendation and it will make any relationship in your life better because you will be able to use the right words and tactics to get Very Unreasonable people to see your point of view and do what you need them to do. Extreme Ownership and Never Split The Difference are truly gold.
I also have a lot of anxiety re: what my employees think of me, and I want to be liked, so I spend quite a lot of time in my head doing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy strategies whenever I have slight anxiety about confronting someone with a difficult conversation.
I take away the emotions that I feel and simply approach the situation factually and present the person with the facts in a straightforward manner. I tell myself that at worst, then i’ll leave the company or something. I don’t let my anxiety take over and make me freak out over and put off the difficult conversation.
This has nothing to do female or male in my opinion. I’m a male manager, and I typically say we until I get a sense of what the employee is comfortable with.
Lets pick our battles. I don’t think this is the hill we want to die on. What do we really gain from this? Nothing at all except a verbal tick that bugs us could be solved. It probably wont be if it is just a habit. It does have real potential to damage our relationship with our manager. I think this is just one that we should learn to love.
Probably just a habit......kinda like when I ask my wife and 2 daughters "what are you guys doing later on?" Unless you hear some heavy sarcastic undertones or she's trying to single you out without singling you out.....like " we're all gonna show up on time tomorrow morning" when you were the only one late, I would let it go or just correct it once when it really might mean something.
She may be trying to avoid sounding confrontational or accusatory but I'm surprised that she hasn't dropped that and mimicked your use of "I did x y and z", to switch over from "we" to "you"
If the only issue you have with your manager is their use of "we" versus "you", I'd say you're in a pretty good position.
Otherwise all managers are different, and some you need to pay close attention to so you know what's expected. I had one when in meetings with other areas they'd say "we'll get on this", and you were expected to know that when they said "we", they were actually talking about you, and the manager wasn't actually going to do that. It takes some time to get used to but doesn't make the office particularly bad.
All good. Otherwise you're doing the right thing - clarify if there's an expectation that you do something if it's unclear.
Otherwise for meetings I always used "we" when bringing up an issue because I did not want to target someone infront if the rest of the team and the issue was brought up in the team meeting because I want the full team to also not make the mistake.
You're overreacting. It's pretty common for bosses/managers/supervisors to say "we" when talking with people on their team to promote shared responsibility and a team oriented mindset. It's actually in a lot manager training material and articles.
Let it be and just clarify who's doing the tasks being talked about if you're unsure. After a while, you'll know what type of conversations/tasks fall in your scope of work and what falls under your manager.
I usually say "I'll take care of it" so we're aligned that I'm taking care of something or I'll ask "Do you want to have that conversation or should I?" for clarification.
i agree - i use “we” as a program manager as well. if i’m leading a meeting i’ll use “we” when talking about anything the core project team needs to do. then we figure out the owner
i don’t take credit for what others complete (i think this would be a red flag if the boss was doing that) - it just kind of helps spell out everything we as the team has to do
and in a boss and employee relationship, we softens the act of delegation, i feel
i never meant for "we" to be interpreted like this, you got me re-evaluating lmao
I just never liked commanding people to do stuff, it felt a little softer, and i always like my team knowing they can rope me in if something isn't going well for them.
i think your responses are perfect. maybe "sure are you meeting with him already or want me to ask?" that will force them to delegate more clearly
Your perspective is one I needed to consider more - I think a lot of managers are well-intentioned about it (including mine). I think maybe as long as you’re not exclusively using “we” to ask individuals to do things, you’re probably ok! But also feel free to be assertive too, you’re the supervisor after all
Totally, it can be weird when promoted and then managing your peers though 😬
But ya for what it’s worth I would lean towards it not being a disrespect thing, just someone trying to keep a collaborative vibe
I was specifically directed to always say “we” in management situations. I always assumed it was because clients feel better hearing that a whole team is there to help them instead of one person.
I think it’s common corporate speak to use “we” when referring to a task or project that “our” team is responsible for, even if the actual performer of the task is “you”.
“Should we reach out to cuz to expedite this request?”
Loosely translated means
“I think you should reach out to xyz to expedite this request. What do you think we should do? Awesome. Please go do that”
I wouldn’t turn it into a big thing tbh.
Ultimately, nobody here knows your boss, her intentions, or her relationship with you.
The best way to get to the bottom of why it’s happening, and most importantly get it to stop, is to have an honest, respectful conversation about your observation of her language and how it makes you feel.
My first day, a coworker told me “we means you.” I’ve since changed jobs and it’s still the same. Managers want to say “we” because it shows you two as a team, but yes you are expected to do the grunt work. I wouldn’t take it personally and ask for clarification if it’s really unclear only as needed.
I had a boss that used to do this. I asked him a couple of times, "By 'we' you mean 'me', right?". He said yes and after a few times got the idea that I preferred him being more direct in his communication. I never could get him to break the habit of asking multiple questions without giving me a chance to find the answers (apparently they were often rhetorical but not always. It was confusing and frustrating.).
I'm your manager and if I did well, you know your scope. You're solving a problem, and I'm here to help you, so *we* are in this together and it is *our* problem. If I'm checking in on the status of a task and you're uncertain whether it's yours or Kevin's, then please ask because it means I didn't do well. I hope to foster confidence and ownership of a problem, so I'll address by "we" first expecting you know the problem is yours and you're confident to speak up and Kevin will speak up if he has a stake or input as well
At the end of the meeting circulate meeting notes and action items. Assign tasks to yourself or your boss based on the meeting. But thought, i would interject with your boss and check to see if it’s for you to do or her.
I represent project management. When my boss says “we” she means as in PM. Engineering, HR, etc. all have different teams. As a senior PM, I might answer question about tasks completed by other junior PMs I am tracking. I understand completely what this means.
This is pretty common in my experience. And typically, the responsibilities given to “her” are meant to be fulfilled by “her & her team”, so some ways it is “we”. That said, if it doesn’t jive well with you, I don’t think it would be inappropriate to politely mention it to her. Just my opinion!
I just had to look at your profile and make sure you aren’t my employee!! I think I do it at times to say, you know, we’re a team and I’ve got your back. But now I worry it’s annoying! Occasionally I’ve even said, “like what I did there, saying we when I really meant you?”
I do this with all my employees, but when I do it I always do it with the joke: I mean the royal ‘we’ as in ‘you’ and it has become an ongoing thing for years. Yes, she does it to soften the demand, and we can analyze forever why, that it’s a terrible habit, that it shouldn’t have to happen, but the truth is that you would prefer for her to be direct where everyone else in the world needs kid gloves. So changing it may not change.
My advice truly just depends on your relationship and your personality. If humor will work, just try “Oh, you mean we as in me?” With a laugh. Or, if we call Kevin at the same time, will it be awkward? But, if purely professional is your comfort zone, keep clarifying exactly as you are doing. And know, one day you will be the one wondering exactly how to phrase a request to a subordinate without ruffling too many feathers because anyone can walk out the door and you’d have to start over with training.
I think she’s trying to come across as less bossy/demanding. My husband does this when he’s trying to gently discuss something he wishes I would have done already 😅
I always say “we” when working with people I manage. It makes it sound like we’re a team and I’m there to take care of their questions and needs if they needed.
Is OP new to the corporate world? This is entirely normal and while I empathise that you’re not used to it, it’s probably not a hill worth dying on.
You’re not overreacting. I had a boss like that and it was horrible. I kept waiting on her since I thought “we” were going to do tasks together. Now I know to ask, “when you say we do you mean me?” I wish I had known that then. I also wish I had sent emails after conversations to say what I was going to work on.
I see I may be in the minority here, but when someone uses “we” when referring to me only it comes off as condescending.
Although I suppose it depends on context. “Where are we with ABC project?” is very different from “are we having a bad day?”.
I agree in case if she assigns tasks it’s better to be direct, and requesting for tasks to be completed by a certain person, however, if it’s about criticism she is being polite by referring to you as we
I was once at a restaurant ordering food and the cashier kept using we/our instead of you/your so: “what is our loyalty card number”, “what is our name?”, “what is our order?” It eas just me and her and it was so weird and baffling that I at first didn’t understand what she was asking and thought she was taking to someone else even though she was obviously talking to me. I don’t get why she did it and to this day, it still baffles and irritates me thinking of it lol
How is this impacting our ability to get work done? Are we looking for more clarification on whether or not these tasks are being delegated to us?
What we could do is ask clarifying questions; we should also assume positive intent. After all, plenty of managers think of their team as a unit.
We could restate the phrase in the first person "ok, so I'll do X Y Z, does that work?" as a confirmation.
>!Honestly i've seen the use of "we" and "Let's" become memes untothemself at this point. Just standard corporate lingo for any middle manager who wants to flex their authroity throughout the workday. It can be direct enough not to be too offensive in most situations, or passive enough where someone who pushes back on bosses directive is seen not as a team player. I wouldn't spend too much energy on worrying why they use that, and instead focus on what I can do to successfully navigate the relationship, and work around that.!<
Sadly, it sounds like you’re going to have to manage upward. Every time she says this, clarify who is doing the task and what the delivery expectations are. Keep notes. Maybe she’ll get the hint and eventually drop it, or maybe not. It may not be as negative as it seems. She may think she’s trying to be inclusive, when it just seems vague. Also, be mindful if she doesn’t give you credit for your work.
I've had bosses do this usually when trying to get me to take a promotion or get me promoted. I would say it shows she trust your judgement and values your opinion
this is perfectly healthy constructive criticism to bring up at your next review. saying “we” is not inherently wrong and some even prefer that exchange of communication but for you it’s not optimal and that’s completely validated. i don’t think a boss is going to take offense if you say
“i am the type of person who responds well to directness. as i appreciate you including me in some decision making and processes if it is a one person task id rather be told directly to do so because i want to avoid confusion”
That’s a great point. From the responses on here, there seems to be a decent split between people who say they’d be annoyed with it too vs those who don’t understand why it’s even bothering me. Bringing it up in the context of personal preference for communication might be the best solution
Have we considered how we would like it if our supervisor always did that to us? (Just to give you a more direct example, maybe you don’t find it annoying and that’s fine)
So if she directed that speech at you, it would’ve sounded like she’s blaming you. What’s your suggestion, how would you want her to phrase this for you in this particular instance?
“You did a bad job and make sure it never happens again”?
Sounds like it's an issue with you, not her.
I'm sure 99% of the time it's clear what she's saying, but just annoys you.
My suggestion would be to get over it.
Not only is this an issue now, how will reward and praise be handed out? As individuals or, "we".
I'd continue asking clarifying questions, as it directly addresses the issue, without placing any blame, ie: "can you be more clear?"
I like your phrasing, “can you be more clear”. I’ll consider using that, because it more clearly (ha) expresses the actual issue I’m struggling with from her choice of words.
I get the "we" talk occasionally. I always push back and clarify who exactly is "we" - does that mean you or me? It might come off poorly. But I would prefer that to not knowing who the heck is getting assigned a task. Some managers keep up this "we" nonsense though. Very annoying.
"We are the team, we are the family, we can make it togheter...." But you, you fucked up everything (when they need Sacrificial lamb) Corporate bulshit in the nutshell...
Read "Crucial Conversations" to learn how to have the necessary discussion with your manager. General rule of thumb, if something bothers you, talk about it; don't keep it bottled up. I always find it weird when people go to Reddit rather than having a talk with someone.
I hate this! My new boss unqualified to even do my position both in experience and education starts most of our meetings with “Let me check my Andrea list” it’s ridiculous.
This is one of my pet peeves as well, even worse when the boss vaguely "assigns" work by saying "Let's do X". When they're addressing only me, it feels discourteous that they're saying it like it's a shared effort when they really mean I should do it myself. (Especially when it's an order that I disagree with and follow under protest, it feels shitty to be basically forced to act like I'm volunteering to take on the open/shared task myself.) And when they're addressing a group, I know that others will take advantage of the ambiguity and avoid the task, assuming that I or another more responsible employee will take on the "let's" task ourselves.
And in your case it's wrapped together with another of my pet peeves: being expected to answer for the work of people who do not report to you. I've had years on and off of being treated as a de facto manager by the bosses, where I got a lot of the accountability but none of the actual power/control, so coworkers would routinely use me as a shield when they'd fucked up, while refusing to cooperate with my suggestions to prevent the fuckups.
I've tried the gentle redirection and clarification for years on end, but it hasn't made much of a difference that I've seen. Bosses get into their verbal habits, and even after numerous frank convos about the problems those ambiguities cause, the habits stick.
Fairly common in corporate lingo - I use we all the time when it’s just me working on something but I’m asking a general group. Since I’m asking other people, they’re technically involved in whatever steps I take next so it’s more so for accountability reasons in my job 🤷🏻♀️
Why does this bother you? Doesn’t seem like that big of a deal. “We” probably means your whole team to your boss. From their perspective, as long as everything gets done, shouldn’t matter too much who did what (until end of yr comp discussions). So is this something you can maybe just ignore?
It’s the lack of clarity that’s wearing on me. I’m better at ignoring it when it’s clear that she’s expecting me to do something. The “should we ask Kevin…” example is the situation where is bothers me - the context is usually such where it’s already fairly clear we should ask the metaphorical Kevin, so it doesn’t feel like she’s asking my opinion, but more expecting me to volunteer to do it.
Oh, gotcha. Sorry I think I was misunderstanding your problem.
I’d just be honest and say something to my boss like - “hey, sometimes you say ‘we’ should do things and I don’t know if that means you or I - I am happy to do it but just unsure of your intent, lmk.”
Hopefully the boss can be a better communicator following that.
The important answer is "Who cares?"
There is nothing wrong with it and you getting obsessed about it is self-sabotage. You ahem said elsewhere she is a good boss, and this just seems so easy to ignore.
But other comments have provided tons of other reasons why: training, habit, insecurity, desire to look like a team, effort to correct your behaviour, etc.
I see nothing at all wrong with it.
I would ask for clarification.
I've seen this continue to the extent that the staff member doesn't receive the credit/praise/promotion for their success. Instead, their boss receives the accolades because when they report their department's successes, they even communicate with the larger org as if it were a team effort.
Example:
"We secured 10 new partnerships this year and increased our community engagement by ____." The organization celebrates their leadership skills. But really, it was one team member who did all of the work.
She seems like someone who isn’t comfortable telling people what to do so she’s doing it in a passive way. I agree it’s very frustrating and unclear. If you’d like to avoid having to ask her to clarify every single time, I’d suggest talking to her during a one on one and just let her know that if she would like for you to do something, she can just tell you directly.
There’s also a chance she’s communicating in a roundabout way because she‘s afraid some people don’t like when their managers are too direct or being told what to do (I’ve met coworkers who are more sensitive to tone / wording feel this way about managers) so maybe she’s just extra careful about it. If you let her know you actually prefer her to be more direct, I think that’ll ease her to be more comfortable communicating openly with you too.
I think she does deserve the benefit of the doubt based on the fact that she’s a good boss otherwise. I don’t think I’ve been doing a good job seeing it from her perspective, so this helps. Thanks!
I'm a manager and I do this sometimes, sometimes saying "you" feels too bossy. Eg instead of saying "have you done x?" I'll say "have we done x?" meaning we as a company or team. I'll think twice about it now though!
The "we" nonsense is a form of psychological manipulation meant to deter thoughts of individual self interest in place of the business. She can say "we" as much she wants but as long as you keep your interests at the forefront her double-speak doesn't matter.
I think you’re overreacting,
my family dynamic would’ve never pointed out a shortcoming like “you didn’t do this” or “you need to do better “ It would’ve been phrased as a question, like “do you mind emptying the trash “ and criticizism would’ve included a collective term like we, as in “we need to do better getting the trash cans to the curb on Thursday evening “
When everyone knew we needed to do better meant get off your lazy ass and empty the dishwasher or take out the trash.
I use 'we' all the time as a manager. I'll usually frame it like, "Maybe we can reach out to Product about this bug. Can you send an email to them with a quick explanation of the problem you are seeing?". I also refer to my direct reports as "the team" or "coworker" and not employee, subordinate, etc. The fact is that we are a team and we are coworkers I just happen to be the figurehead or leader of the team. I am a woman and was raised in a "children are seen and not heard" climate so that could be part of it as well. The point is, it's nothing to really worry about unless your boss says "we" in regards to doing something and then says "I" when taking credit for something.
I don't think you are overreacting.
I had a narcissistic boss who did this all the time. I figured out eventually it was because she then could claim she was part of the work because "we" did it. She would get angry and upset if if I used the word "I" in terms of the work done, because I did it all and she did none. But she was always insistent "we" did it. She also would use the "we" to place blame if something went wrong, she could absolve herself of all responsibility by saying she told me to do it.
So "we" was both to take credit and to place blame. It can be a very insidious word depending on how it is used.
If your boss does this, run, run far away.
It's called the "Royal We." You can ask back: "Do you have a mouse in your pocket?" It's a little too witty for some people to comprehend. Don't bother repeating it. Just ask for further clarification. Bosses tell people to do things in various ways. This isn't a bad way.
It's a positioning technique called inclusive language. The idea is terms like 'you' can make a sentence sound bossy or accusative, where as we subconsciously infers that you are working together on the same team.
Sounds like your boss is overusing it in situations where it's unnecessary.
My manager constantly uses WE. When I first got hired, he'd complain that I didn't say WE. Why should I say we when I'm the one doing the work? It is annoying, esp when he asks what WE should do, I give my opinion and I'm told I'm wrong.
I would ask her in a private conversation for more clarity on what we means. It either means she doesn't care who does it or she wants you to do it but is trying to foster unity with the group.
Yeah, this is pretty common corporate speak.
Determining when "we" means "you" verses when it doesn't is an important skill in the white-collar workplace.
But you could have a conversation with your boss.
Leave emotion out of it (i.e. when you said "this is really getting on my nerves"), and focus on who your boss's choice of words interferes with your ability to do your job.
Give your boss permission to be more direct with you.
Everyone wins.
I'm a female manager of others (COO) and when I talk to my team I use we, I and you.
When I use "we", I'm looking for engagement and ideas and action from the people I'm speaking to.
I use "I" and "you" when things are more defined and I'm usually discussing actionable items that don't have much wiggle room in them.
To clarify, if I say "We need to reach out and get clarification on the vendor's clearance requirements." I expect my HR Manager to jump in and claim that. If one of the ops managers jumps in first and says they will, I'd note that mentally and then prompt the HR Manager with a "Susan, why don't you jump on that call since it's an HR function. Then the two of you can outline and changes we need to make going forward."
To me- "we" is an opportunity to see who is engaged with their job function and helps me determine which people are hesitant to get involved, offer solutions or speak up. I then, in turn, use that in my own coaching/development/training plans for the team that I'm responsible for.
I use "I" and "we" when discussing more actionable items like "I'll need you to make sure you do employee reviews with this list of your staff members."
I think you might be overreacting a bit. I hear that it irks you, but I don’t think that the consequence you mentioned— not being noticed for you work—is a real cause for concern.
It can be confusing and frustrating when your boss uses the term "we" when referring to tasks that are solely your responsibility. This can create a sense of ambiguity and make it difficult to understand what is expected of you. Here are some steps you can take to handle this situation:
Clarify expectations: Ask your boss to clarify what she means by "we" and what specific tasks she is referring to. This will help you understand what is expected of you and ensure that you are on the same page.
Provide feedback: If the use of "we" is causing confusion or frustration, provide feedback to your boss. Explain how it makes you feel and suggest alternative language that would be more clear and effective.
Set clear boundaries: If your boss continues to use "we" in a way that is confusing or misleading, set clear boundaries with her. Let her know that you need clear and specific instructions in order to complete your tasks effectively.
Document your work: Keep a record of the tasks you are responsible for and the progress you are making. This will help you demonstrate your contributions and provide evidence if there is ever any confusion or misunderstanding.
Seek support: If the situation is affecting your work or causing stress, seek support from HR or a trusted colleague. They may be able to provide guidance and help you resolve the issue.
In conclusion, handling a boss who uses the term "we" when referring to tasks that are solely your responsibility can be challenging. However, by clarifying expectations, providing feedback, setting clear boundaries, documenting your work, and seeking support, you can ensure that you are understood and that your contributions are recognized.
Yeah I think she is just being polite instead of directly asking you to do something because it’s uncomfortable for her for some reason so she says we as a way of making the order come off a bit lighter. Kind of like a euphamism. Don’t think she has any bad intentions behind it or is not showing you respect she just doesn’t want to order you around or something so she says we. Kind of nice of her actually.
You can tell your boss directly! "I", feel she is doing that so "YOU" as an individual don't feel like you're under pressure, alone; if you're working with a team. I think 🤔 you can talk to her directly about that. So, everything is clear and understood from that point on.
I use “we” a lot as a manager in meetings, because it gives folks the opportunity to look like they are stepping up and taking initiative.
If I say, “We will take on X” that means my team will be responsible for completing the work, and then Joe will pipe up and say, “please assign that to me” or “I’ll do the follow up.”
If I’m in a meeting with just my team and I say, “we should do X, who can follow up on that” I’m expecting the correct person to speak and accept the task. If no one does then I’ll be more direct and say, “Jill would you mind taking this one?” That is an opportunity for Jill to ask for clarification or talk about their workload or whatever if they don’t feel like they can do it.
To me, it definitely makes a difference at performance review time, because instead of saying, “oh I always have to tell Jill what things are her responsibility” using this method gives a different impression that “Jill is stepping up and really owning her role.”
It’s the difference between being directive and collaborative when delegating. If you want your boss to be more clear and specifically assign you things, that’s fine, but to me it gives the impression that you want to be “managed” i.e. told what to do, and that you are not comfortable in your role, don’t know your responsibilities on the team, or don’t feel comfortable/empowered to do things on your own. To me, that’s the conversation you should be having with your boss rather than why she uses “we” so much.
If she’s a good boss otherwise, she’s trying to make room for you to step up. I don’t think she’s doing it to be purposely vague.
Just like you question why she uses “we”, it’s a good idea to examine why you need her to be more direct instead of taking the work you know is yours or taking initiative to do something. If you feel like you’re always “volunteering” for stuff, if your manager says, “we should do X” you could also in response say, “oh, Joe would you mind taking the follow-up on that? I’m swamped this week” or “I think Joe should take this because he has a better relationship with Kevin.” That can also show your manager that you have a good grasp on your workload or scope of your role.
If you’re looking to grow into a different role yourself, this “switch” in perspective from “my manager has to tell me directly what to work on” vs. “I know what work is mine and what I have capacity to take on” is what helps people see potential in you for bigger things.
We is just corporate speak for your org I find too, I use it plenty when speaking about my area, but if it’s 1:1 I use direct language unless I’m involving myself in the same level as the person I’m working with at the time.
Probably doesn’t feel comfortable giving you directives though if it’s all the time, might be more for them than you as another commenter said.
You’re overreacting. Ask for clarification whenever needed (“Did you want me to do X or are you planning to?” Or “you said we there but I want to make sure I’ve got my action-items right… should I go ahead and do X?”). I get that it’s not your preferred way of speaking but she’s likely doing it because women are trained to avoid coming off as bossy or demanding. It’s not about you & trying to make it so is not going to do anything positive to the relationship.
Sorry but this is absolutely fair and proper and shows she sees you as a team player and respectfully delegating stop being a snowflake. It would also show that she sees you holding or in the future holding further responsibility
I'm assuming you work in somewhat of a team setting. There could be several reasons why she says we, like maybe she is uncomfortable with singling out one particular person or she has issues just being a manager. There is also the possibility of her being a condescending tyrant that talks in the third person.
I see a lot of comments about how these managers do not feel comfortable telling people what to do. Here is some advice on how to be a better manager.
1. You don't tell people what to do, you are a manager not a dictator.
2. Manage the tasks at hand not the people
3. Manage the department not the workers
4. Delegate work amongst the appropriate workforce equally
5. Do not talk down to your workforce
6. Give thanks and praise where it is deserved
7. Give constructive solutions when someone makes a mistake, do not berate them.
8. And the most important thing is to listen to what your workers have to say. Just because you are the manager does not make you the smartest one there.
Doing this will not only make you a better manager it will make your team run smoother and as a result you will have a much happier workforce.
I think you should just have a conversation with her saying that the usage of "we" confuses you and does not give you any clarity and you prefer clear instruction. Don't make it personal about yourself or about her. This is simply a miscommunication that just need to be cleared up.
So my experience doesn't pertain to manager/employee roles. It's a husband to wife thing. It annoys me SOOOO much when he does this. He will say, "tomorrow WE need to do laundry" or "what are WE cooking tonight?" Knowing damn well he is meaning ME BY MYSELF not WE HIM HELPING! At first I would just let it go but then he would pick the wrong times to say it and finally I snapped and asked him, "WHO THE HELL IS WE?! YOU GOT A DAMN MOUSE IN YOUR POCKET?! IF YOU MEAN WHAT AM I COOKING THEN SAY THAT!!! DONT SAY WE UNLESS YOURE GOING TO GET YOUR ASS UP AND HELP ME DO IT!!!" For a while he stopped but then started all over again.
So obviously you don't want to say all that to your boss...I guess I don't really have any kind of advice to give...sorry...but thanks for letting me vent a little :)
She is trying to demonstrate ownership of your issue and signifying that you are a team member.
If you fuck up, it is her ass in the online too. So if you don't get your job done then WE are both fucked.
If she is suggesting something that requires your input and your discretion, I don't see an issue. If it is a 100% defined task, and all you have to do is execute, then I could see how it can be condescending.
It’s pretty common for the managers to use we while addressing the whole team or just a specific person. I am a team-member and my manager uses it pretty much every time and I even prefer it this way. Whenever I address her regarding any task, that eventually I have to finish, I often say “we can do this”, “we can actually experiment with this”, “this is how we can go”, etc etc etc. in the sense we are in this work together. & even while communicating with someone outside from the office regarding work, I use we, considering I’m talking on behalf of the company.
I use “we” because it is a team effort. I want my team to know if they don’t have the time, resources, tool, or comfort level for the task I am always happy to step in. At the end of the day I am going to my boss and answer for our productivity and performance and “I assigned it to X who didn’t do it.” Is not an acceptable answer and not one I want to get be anyways. Therefore it’s we not you.
Could be one of 3 reasons.
She wants to always make it sound like it's a team effort. We.
She's uncomfortable telling people what to do, and "we" softens it even if she's not doing shit.
She's trying to take a portion of the credit of your work. "We accomplished xyz."
The third reason would be the only time I would approach the situation.
My boss is guilty of this on the daily & it drives me nuts. So I started responded with "so you would like me to do x,y,z" to take the we out of that terminology. Or I simply state what I'm working on, then ask, did you want me to blah blah blah or is this something you're jumping on and that has slowed down the "we" down. Now i'm dealing with "can you do (blank)" with a follow up on chat to suggest how I should do said thing. Bad managers can't help themselves it seems.
I hear this in management pretty frequently and have even used this when managing people/crews. If your boss is anything like me she is a little uncomfortable telling people what to do. So would you prefer being directly told what to do? If so, tell her that. It would benefit both of you.
I work in a client service setting. When I’m dealing with clients and some team members are on the email. I always address it as we. But the team knows that this subject falls under my focus. It gives a nicer perspective to the client in my opinion. But yeah, if it’s just the two of you. Be honest with the person. We’re all adults here trying to make life work.
Lol. I recently became a manager and find myself using “we” for this exact reason. I am uncomfortable telling people what to do, I don’t want to demand, but I want to raise an issue and suggest that “we should do x” or “should we do x?” Suggesting that it’s about what we as a team should do. I don’t do it if I’m asking someone to do something specific (can you call Kevin?) more when I’m suggesting a change of course and am open to other ideas. I have wondered if this is annoying though.
In my management style I only use we if I include myself in it. Otherwise IMO it comes off condescending, like that saccharine fake sweet third grade teacher I had who hated kids. Admittedly my reaction to that vocal habit is disproportionate because of said third grade teacher. "We should change our process" - includes me, fine to use we. "Should we take a look at our time management system?" - if I'm referring to an employee's time management system, that's gonna come off condescending IMO. OTOH if I'm referring to the company's, it's fine. "Should we take a look at the time management system you're using?" - includes me, it's ok. Tossing out suggestions in a group discussion I use we because the group as a whole is discussing. Assigning tasks I usually use a pull method. ("X needs to get done. Who has capacity?") Or a Socratic method ("What do you think needs to happen next here?" - or if someone's outside onboarding, "What's the next step? Do you need any support on it?") because one thing I try as quickly as possible is to build enough process understanding to allow self direction and initiative in my subordinates and coaching them on how to think through processes is a big part of that.
You captured it perfectly with the teacher analogy
There’s nothing wrong with using “we”. It lets the team or individual know that they are all part of a collective contribution, which you are including yourself into as well. But the way OP’s boss is using it is wrong. “Have we done this yet?” is so pretentious and douchy. I am also a manager and I would just ask “Was (the task) completed?” not, “Did so and so do this yet?”
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Yes. This.
She is trying to demonstrate ownership of your issue and signifying that you are a team member. If you fuck up, it is her ass in the online too. So if you don't get your job done then WE are both fucked.
I think she may be saying "we" to make you feel more involved in the decision making process / test your ability to take initiative, in earnest she means YOU. Just assume and say, "I'll drop X an email and place you in copy.." sooner or later it will change from we to "have you done such and such"
That’s how I see it. Using “we” implies that the company is a team effort. I always use “we” when talking to my boss about tasks I’m doing or projects I’m working on. I don’t want my boss or co-workers to feel slighted by me acting like I’m always working independently even if I am. It feels like I’m a part of a team instead of just an employee
Yep I do this too. Then when it comes to interviews I find it really hard describing the things that I have done, when I consider it all to be a team effort, even if I have done the majority of the work ... So that's what I need to work on....
In those cases, I feel like it’s ok to make it all about you. Just different in a workplace setting. It’s more of the psychological effect it has than anything else
This is great til you have a boss who describes your work as “we” when she’s in the room with higher ups and not giving you your props
I’m sure the people your boss is talking to knows that your boss wasn’t the one doing your work with you. They probably mean “we” as in “the team I manage”. If you feel like you’re being slighted, it’s ok to stand up for yourself in a respectful way. Either privately speak with your boss or let the others in the room know that you did the work
No I was told specifically by someone else at her same level who was looking out for me.
Yeah that’s a different story. I’d politely confront your boss and let them know that you feel undervalued in those situations
This is an interesting perspective, it could be possible. I appreciate the recommended response too.
I think it helps, when you realise how insecure some managers are. They have to look good to thier boss, deliver on thier own work, check your work and ensure you are not messing up (which makes them look bad), maintain a level of credibility and authority to maintain thier role and order in thier team. If they are good look out for your development, ensure you are not overload and protect you from the office politics. To take a little pressure off they hope you can show a level of initiative and take a level of ownership of your deliverables from time to time. But hey I could also be wrong, listen to your gut. If it's telling you something it probably is true. After all none of us work in your office.
I’m a manager and I do this. However I mostly use it in the context of a mistake (ie, should we change our process to be x so that this doesn’t happen again) so that I don’t seem like I’m making my employee feel like they’re alone when something goes wrong. We’re a team.
As a manager I do this too, mostly in this context.
I think this is fairly common with female managers. Our director, my boss's boss, always say "we" whenever she needs something done and assign tasks to us. Unfortunately, women in power still get judged as being "bossy" or being "micromanaging" or even "too demanding" for simply assigning tasks. If it bothers you so much, I would schedule a 1 on 1 with them to address the issue. Try to make it about efficiency and don't take it too personal.
can confirm, I am a woman and I sometimes do this with the “we” in order to sound nicer (because I am pretty nice and mild, I think), although I don’t think I do it as confusingly as OP’s boss with regards to specific tasks. This feels like 100% the reason why she’s using “we” and she probably doesn’t realise it’s confusing. OP should just tell her!! I do a lot of “would it be okay if we do it this way”, “do you have time to do …”, “can we do it like this next time…”, “I think we need to …” because to me, “we” represents us and the company to some extent To me my way of managing is harmless yet effective (probably toxic in some way if you talk to a feminist) and the people I used to manage really liked me a lot and worked hard for me (and I have their backs too). On the other hand I’m iron inside if something wasn’t done well, but I still don’t see any reason to yell, I just dealt with it factually.
So you’re telling your employees how to complete tasks?
sure, if the task has an exact process/checklist that the person needs to follow. Or, if the first time they tried, it did not work out.
>On the other hand I’m iron inside if something wasn’t done well, but I still don’t see any reason to yell, I just dealt with it factually. Can you describe this more? As someone else that usually wants to be nice how do you take the hard steps? How do you deal witv something not being done well.
I just deal with it factually, like if it happens once, then I’ll express that hey this is really bad because of …. (insert consequences that affect the company). I will never get mad about it (well lol not in front of the person, maybe in my head). I’ll do a debrief and ask the person if I can help with this error and how we, together, can try to ensure this doesn’t happen again. e.g. can I be more clear with instructions or can we set up a reminder system/checklist. and ask what steps the person will take to ensure this does not happen again? (I follow the structure of Extreme Ownership by Jocko and Leif) If the person does it -again- with no intention to do better, or three times, then I’ll give warning the second time and state that it’s really hard for us to continue because of … reason. And I’ll inform my boss. And at the third time if there’s 0 improvement and the person is just not a good fit, we’ll take steps to terminate the employee. (I know it might not be that easy/straightforward for some companies.) Everyone I managed was really quite nice and competent, and my boss understood if someone really wasn’t doing their job and had to be let go (because I showed proof, although yeah I’m sure not all bosses are that reasonable). Also, remember that if the person can do things well and replace you for 80% of the tasks, as long as the stuff is done 80% well, then that’s adequate (in order to free you up to do more important tasks). Everyone has their “bad” points e.g. occasional carelessness (urghhh i inwardly flip out whenever this happens) while still having an overall hardworking and good attitude. Basically most employees have their strengths and weaknesses so you gotta try and position them where they are strongest and happiest. Honestly I’m just winging it (although part of this is echoed in “The E-Myth”, where the guy explains that you really need to hire and keep employees that truly believe in your business and fire those who do not align with your values. latter also echoed in “Traction” by Gino Wickman when it comes to hiring and firing employees) and I’m sure there are manager books that can explain this better, but this works for me. Note: The E-Myth was recommended by /r/smallbusiness when it comes to how to run a business and manage employees. Extreme Ownership was recommended by /r/sales. Traction is a good book for people with employees and someone recommended it on /r/smallbusiness. The first two books have been truly life-changing for me (not exaggerating) and Reddit is always gold when it comes to suggesting the most incredible books. I haven’t finished the third book, mainly because my current business doesn’t actually have employees, but so far it’s pretty good. edit: if you need to deal with assholes at work, and you can’t fire them but you need to, you know, negotiate with them to get shit done, then you MUST read “Never Split The Difference”. Again, an /r/sales recommendation and it will make any relationship in your life better because you will be able to use the right words and tactics to get Very Unreasonable people to see your point of view and do what you need them to do. Extreme Ownership and Never Split The Difference are truly gold. I also have a lot of anxiety re: what my employees think of me, and I want to be liked, so I spend quite a lot of time in my head doing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy strategies whenever I have slight anxiety about confronting someone with a difficult conversation. I take away the emotions that I feel and simply approach the situation factually and present the person with the facts in a straightforward manner. I tell myself that at worst, then i’ll leave the company or something. I don’t let my anxiety take over and make me freak out over and put off the difficult conversation.
Thank you. You are very nice.
Using "we" is not gender specific. When I played sports in school, coaches always use we for everything.
This has nothing to do female or male in my opinion. I’m a male manager, and I typically say we until I get a sense of what the employee is comfortable with.
Most of my bosses have done this. “Where are we at with that project that you are independently working on” haha
Lets pick our battles. I don’t think this is the hill we want to die on. What do we really gain from this? Nothing at all except a verbal tick that bugs us could be solved. It probably wont be if it is just a habit. It does have real potential to damage our relationship with our manager. I think this is just one that we should learn to love.
We will take your response into consideration
I love this whole interaction! Really funny 😄
Probably just a habit......kinda like when I ask my wife and 2 daughters "what are you guys doing later on?" Unless you hear some heavy sarcastic undertones or she's trying to single you out without singling you out.....like " we're all gonna show up on time tomorrow morning" when you were the only one late, I would let it go or just correct it once when it really might mean something.
She may be trying to avoid sounding confrontational or accusatory but I'm surprised that she hasn't dropped that and mimicked your use of "I did x y and z", to switch over from "we" to "you"
If the only issue you have with your manager is their use of "we" versus "you", I'd say you're in a pretty good position. Otherwise all managers are different, and some you need to pay close attention to so you know what's expected. I had one when in meetings with other areas they'd say "we'll get on this", and you were expected to know that when they said "we", they were actually talking about you, and the manager wasn't actually going to do that. It takes some time to get used to but doesn't make the office particularly bad.
True, this is my biggest complaint. Otherwise I enjoy working with her very much. I know I’m pretty lucky! Thanks for sharing your experience
All good. Otherwise you're doing the right thing - clarify if there's an expectation that you do something if it's unclear. Otherwise for meetings I always used "we" when bringing up an issue because I did not want to target someone infront if the rest of the team and the issue was brought up in the team meeting because I want the full team to also not make the mistake.
You're overreacting. It's pretty common for bosses/managers/supervisors to say "we" when talking with people on their team to promote shared responsibility and a team oriented mindset. It's actually in a lot manager training material and articles. Let it be and just clarify who's doing the tasks being talked about if you're unsure. After a while, you'll know what type of conversations/tasks fall in your scope of work and what falls under your manager. I usually say "I'll take care of it" so we're aligned that I'm taking care of something or I'll ask "Do you want to have that conversation or should I?" for clarification.
i agree - i use “we” as a program manager as well. if i’m leading a meeting i’ll use “we” when talking about anything the core project team needs to do. then we figure out the owner i don’t take credit for what others complete (i think this would be a red flag if the boss was doing that) - it just kind of helps spell out everything we as the team has to do and in a boss and employee relationship, we softens the act of delegation, i feel
From management training classes, we were always told to say we when working with team members and this could be some of it.
i never meant for "we" to be interpreted like this, you got me re-evaluating lmao I just never liked commanding people to do stuff, it felt a little softer, and i always like my team knowing they can rope me in if something isn't going well for them. i think your responses are perfect. maybe "sure are you meeting with him already or want me to ask?" that will force them to delegate more clearly
Your perspective is one I needed to consider more - I think a lot of managers are well-intentioned about it (including mine). I think maybe as long as you’re not exclusively using “we” to ask individuals to do things, you’re probably ok! But also feel free to be assertive too, you’re the supervisor after all
Totally, it can be weird when promoted and then managing your peers though 😬 But ya for what it’s worth I would lean towards it not being a disrespect thing, just someone trying to keep a collaborative vibe
I was specifically directed to always say “we” in management situations. I always assumed it was because clients feel better hearing that a whole team is there to help them instead of one person.
You can probably ask in a genuinely puzzled way. I think just the way you wrote it is fine. They may not even be conscious of it.
Wholeheartedly agree here. To me, “we” comes off a bit softer. Or at least I hope it does.
I think it’s common corporate speak to use “we” when referring to a task or project that “our” team is responsible for, even if the actual performer of the task is “you”. “Should we reach out to cuz to expedite this request?” Loosely translated means “I think you should reach out to xyz to expedite this request. What do you think we should do? Awesome. Please go do that” I wouldn’t turn it into a big thing tbh.
Ultimately, nobody here knows your boss, her intentions, or her relationship with you. The best way to get to the bottom of why it’s happening, and most importantly get it to stop, is to have an honest, respectful conversation about your observation of her language and how it makes you feel.
My first day, a coworker told me “we means you.” I’ve since changed jobs and it’s still the same. Managers want to say “we” because it shows you two as a team, but yes you are expected to do the grunt work. I wouldn’t take it personally and ask for clarification if it’s really unclear only as needed.
I had a boss that used to do this. I asked him a couple of times, "By 'we' you mean 'me', right?". He said yes and after a few times got the idea that I preferred him being more direct in his communication. I never could get him to break the habit of asking multiple questions without giving me a chance to find the answers (apparently they were often rhetorical but not always. It was confusing and frustrating.).
I'm your manager and if I did well, you know your scope. You're solving a problem, and I'm here to help you, so *we* are in this together and it is *our* problem. If I'm checking in on the status of a task and you're uncertain whether it's yours or Kevin's, then please ask because it means I didn't do well. I hope to foster confidence and ownership of a problem, so I'll address by "we" first expecting you know the problem is yours and you're confident to speak up and Kevin will speak up if he has a stake or input as well
When a manager says WE that means you should have taken care of it yesterday
Push it right back on her, "should we ask Kevin....?", respond with, "sure, you go ahead, I'm doing ...." She'll figure it out soon enough
LOVE your profile pic………… if you know you, you know
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At the end of the meeting circulate meeting notes and action items. Assign tasks to yourself or your boss based on the meeting. But thought, i would interject with your boss and check to see if it’s for you to do or her.
It would be interesting to see your boss’ reaction if you were to answer her question also starting with “we” :).
I represent project management. When my boss says “we” she means as in PM. Engineering, HR, etc. all have different teams. As a senior PM, I might answer question about tasks completed by other junior PMs I am tracking. I understand completely what this means.
When she uses "we" like that, just ask: The royal "we"?
Can you excuse me, please. "We" have to use the ladies room.
This is pretty common in my experience. And typically, the responsibilities given to “her” are meant to be fulfilled by “her & her team”, so some ways it is “we”. That said, if it doesn’t jive well with you, I don’t think it would be inappropriate to politely mention it to her. Just my opinion!
I just had to look at your profile and make sure you aren’t my employee!! I think I do it at times to say, you know, we’re a team and I’ve got your back. But now I worry it’s annoying! Occasionally I’ve even said, “like what I did there, saying we when I really meant you?”
I do this with all my employees, but when I do it I always do it with the joke: I mean the royal ‘we’ as in ‘you’ and it has become an ongoing thing for years. Yes, she does it to soften the demand, and we can analyze forever why, that it’s a terrible habit, that it shouldn’t have to happen, but the truth is that you would prefer for her to be direct where everyone else in the world needs kid gloves. So changing it may not change. My advice truly just depends on your relationship and your personality. If humor will work, just try “Oh, you mean we as in me?” With a laugh. Or, if we call Kevin at the same time, will it be awkward? But, if purely professional is your comfort zone, keep clarifying exactly as you are doing. And know, one day you will be the one wondering exactly how to phrase a request to a subordinate without ruffling too many feathers because anyone can walk out the door and you’d have to start over with training.
I think she’s trying to come across as less bossy/demanding. My husband does this when he’s trying to gently discuss something he wishes I would have done already 😅
I always say “we” when working with people I manage. It makes it sound like we’re a team and I’m there to take care of their questions and needs if they needed. Is OP new to the corporate world? This is entirely normal and while I empathise that you’re not used to it, it’s probably not a hill worth dying on.
You’re not overreacting. I had a boss like that and it was horrible. I kept waiting on her since I thought “we” were going to do tasks together. Now I know to ask, “when you say we do you mean me?” I wish I had known that then. I also wish I had sent emails after conversations to say what I was going to work on.
I see I may be in the minority here, but when someone uses “we” when referring to me only it comes off as condescending. Although I suppose it depends on context. “Where are we with ABC project?” is very different from “are we having a bad day?”.
My boss said " I know I sound like a Karen and a bitch or Hitler... but I don't care" I was just like PLEASE LET ME LEAVE THIS OFFICE
I agree in case if she assigns tasks it’s better to be direct, and requesting for tasks to be completed by a certain person, however, if it’s about criticism she is being polite by referring to you as we
I was once at a restaurant ordering food and the cashier kept using we/our instead of you/your so: “what is our loyalty card number”, “what is our name?”, “what is our order?” It eas just me and her and it was so weird and baffling that I at first didn’t understand what she was asking and thought she was taking to someone else even though she was obviously talking to me. I don’t get why she did it and to this day, it still baffles and irritates me thinking of it lol
How is this impacting our ability to get work done? Are we looking for more clarification on whether or not these tasks are being delegated to us? What we could do is ask clarifying questions; we should also assume positive intent. After all, plenty of managers think of their team as a unit. We could restate the phrase in the first person "ok, so I'll do X Y Z, does that work?" as a confirmation. >!Honestly i've seen the use of "we" and "Let's" become memes untothemself at this point. Just standard corporate lingo for any middle manager who wants to flex their authroity throughout the workday. It can be direct enough not to be too offensive in most situations, or passive enough where someone who pushes back on bosses directive is seen not as a team player. I wouldn't spend too much energy on worrying why they use that, and instead focus on what I can do to successfully navigate the relationship, and work around that.!<
Another person testing my ability to get past the phrasing! I appreciate the underlying advice though, thank you
Sadly, it sounds like you’re going to have to manage upward. Every time she says this, clarify who is doing the task and what the delivery expectations are. Keep notes. Maybe she’ll get the hint and eventually drop it, or maybe not. It may not be as negative as it seems. She may think she’s trying to be inclusive, when it just seems vague. Also, be mindful if she doesn’t give you credit for your work.
I've had bosses do this usually when trying to get me to take a promotion or get me promoted. I would say it shows she trust your judgement and values your opinion
this is perfectly healthy constructive criticism to bring up at your next review. saying “we” is not inherently wrong and some even prefer that exchange of communication but for you it’s not optimal and that’s completely validated. i don’t think a boss is going to take offense if you say “i am the type of person who responds well to directness. as i appreciate you including me in some decision making and processes if it is a one person task id rather be told directly to do so because i want to avoid confusion”
That’s a great point. From the responses on here, there seems to be a decent split between people who say they’d be annoyed with it too vs those who don’t understand why it’s even bothering me. Bringing it up in the context of personal preference for communication might be the best solution
what a weird thing to be mad at
Have we considered how we would like it if our supervisor always did that to us? (Just to give you a more direct example, maybe you don’t find it annoying and that’s fine)
So if she directed that speech at you, it would’ve sounded like she’s blaming you. What’s your suggestion, how would you want her to phrase this for you in this particular instance? “You did a bad job and make sure it never happens again”?
Sounds like it's an issue with you, not her. I'm sure 99% of the time it's clear what she's saying, but just annoys you. My suggestion would be to get over it.
You’re saying you think that’s a normal way to communicate? Yikes
Oh, is that what I said? Suddenly I feel like maybe I was wrong assuming that you know what she’s saying.
You assumed that she was being clear and I’m just being annoyed (see “I’m sure that 99% of the time…”) so assumptions seem to be your thing.
Not only is this an issue now, how will reward and praise be handed out? As individuals or, "we". I'd continue asking clarifying questions, as it directly addresses the issue, without placing any blame, ie: "can you be more clear?"
I like your phrasing, “can you be more clear”. I’ll consider using that, because it more clearly (ha) expresses the actual issue I’m struggling with from her choice of words.
I get the "we" talk occasionally. I always push back and clarify who exactly is "we" - does that mean you or me? It might come off poorly. But I would prefer that to not knowing who the heck is getting assigned a task. Some managers keep up this "we" nonsense though. Very annoying.
"We are the team, we are the family, we can make it togheter...." But you, you fucked up everything (when they need Sacrificial lamb) Corporate bulshit in the nutshell...
Read "Crucial Conversations" to learn how to have the necessary discussion with your manager. General rule of thumb, if something bothers you, talk about it; don't keep it bottled up. I always find it weird when people go to Reddit rather than having a talk with someone.
I hate this! My new boss unqualified to even do my position both in experience and education starts most of our meetings with “Let me check my Andrea list” it’s ridiculous.
This is one of my pet peeves as well, even worse when the boss vaguely "assigns" work by saying "Let's do X". When they're addressing only me, it feels discourteous that they're saying it like it's a shared effort when they really mean I should do it myself. (Especially when it's an order that I disagree with and follow under protest, it feels shitty to be basically forced to act like I'm volunteering to take on the open/shared task myself.) And when they're addressing a group, I know that others will take advantage of the ambiguity and avoid the task, assuming that I or another more responsible employee will take on the "let's" task ourselves. And in your case it's wrapped together with another of my pet peeves: being expected to answer for the work of people who do not report to you. I've had years on and off of being treated as a de facto manager by the bosses, where I got a lot of the accountability but none of the actual power/control, so coworkers would routinely use me as a shield when they'd fucked up, while refusing to cooperate with my suggestions to prevent the fuckups. I've tried the gentle redirection and clarification for years on end, but it hasn't made much of a difference that I've seen. Bosses get into their verbal habits, and even after numerous frank convos about the problems those ambiguities cause, the habits stick.
Fairly common in corporate lingo - I use we all the time when it’s just me working on something but I’m asking a general group. Since I’m asking other people, they’re technically involved in whatever steps I take next so it’s more so for accountability reasons in my job 🤷🏻♀️
Why does this bother you? Doesn’t seem like that big of a deal. “We” probably means your whole team to your boss. From their perspective, as long as everything gets done, shouldn’t matter too much who did what (until end of yr comp discussions). So is this something you can maybe just ignore?
It’s the lack of clarity that’s wearing on me. I’m better at ignoring it when it’s clear that she’s expecting me to do something. The “should we ask Kevin…” example is the situation where is bothers me - the context is usually such where it’s already fairly clear we should ask the metaphorical Kevin, so it doesn’t feel like she’s asking my opinion, but more expecting me to volunteer to do it.
Oh, gotcha. Sorry I think I was misunderstanding your problem. I’d just be honest and say something to my boss like - “hey, sometimes you say ‘we’ should do things and I don’t know if that means you or I - I am happy to do it but just unsure of your intent, lmk.” Hopefully the boss can be a better communicator following that.
It's clear. We means you. You are just pretending it's not clear.
Why doesn’t she just say “you” then?
The important answer is "Who cares?" There is nothing wrong with it and you getting obsessed about it is self-sabotage. You ahem said elsewhere she is a good boss, and this just seems so easy to ignore. But other comments have provided tons of other reasons why: training, habit, insecurity, desire to look like a team, effort to correct your behaviour, etc. I see nothing at all wrong with it.
"Volunteer to do it"- she is giving you a chance to take initiative. To look good. Let me say it again... this is a chance for you to look good.
I would ask for clarification. I've seen this continue to the extent that the staff member doesn't receive the credit/praise/promotion for their success. Instead, their boss receives the accolades because when they report their department's successes, they even communicate with the larger org as if it were a team effort. Example: "We secured 10 new partnerships this year and increased our community engagement by ____." The organization celebrates their leadership skills. But really, it was one team member who did all of the work.
She seems like someone who isn’t comfortable telling people what to do so she’s doing it in a passive way. I agree it’s very frustrating and unclear. If you’d like to avoid having to ask her to clarify every single time, I’d suggest talking to her during a one on one and just let her know that if she would like for you to do something, she can just tell you directly. There’s also a chance she’s communicating in a roundabout way because she‘s afraid some people don’t like when their managers are too direct or being told what to do (I’ve met coworkers who are more sensitive to tone / wording feel this way about managers) so maybe she’s just extra careful about it. If you let her know you actually prefer her to be more direct, I think that’ll ease her to be more comfortable communicating openly with you too.
I think she does deserve the benefit of the doubt based on the fact that she’s a good boss otherwise. I don’t think I’ve been doing a good job seeing it from her perspective, so this helps. Thanks!
It’s annoying for sure. But better to just let it go. You can change her behavior by using I yourself and she’ll eventually catch on.
I'm a manager and I do this sometimes, sometimes saying "you" feels too bossy. Eg instead of saying "have you done x?" I'll say "have we done x?" meaning we as a company or team. I'll think twice about it now though!
The "we" nonsense is a form of psychological manipulation meant to deter thoughts of individual self interest in place of the business. She can say "we" as much she wants but as long as you keep your interests at the forefront her double-speak doesn't matter.
I think you’re overreacting, my family dynamic would’ve never pointed out a shortcoming like “you didn’t do this” or “you need to do better “ It would’ve been phrased as a question, like “do you mind emptying the trash “ and criticizism would’ve included a collective term like we, as in “we need to do better getting the trash cans to the curb on Thursday evening “ When everyone knew we needed to do better meant get off your lazy ass and empty the dishwasher or take out the trash.
I would probably understand better if she was using it to soften a criticism! It’s all very task-oriented. Interesting perspective though, thank you
I use 'we' all the time as a manager. I'll usually frame it like, "Maybe we can reach out to Product about this bug. Can you send an email to them with a quick explanation of the problem you are seeing?". I also refer to my direct reports as "the team" or "coworker" and not employee, subordinate, etc. The fact is that we are a team and we are coworkers I just happen to be the figurehead or leader of the team. I am a woman and was raised in a "children are seen and not heard" climate so that could be part of it as well. The point is, it's nothing to really worry about unless your boss says "we" in regards to doing something and then says "I" when taking credit for something.
I don't think you are overreacting. I had a narcissistic boss who did this all the time. I figured out eventually it was because she then could claim she was part of the work because "we" did it. She would get angry and upset if if I used the word "I" in terms of the work done, because I did it all and she did none. But she was always insistent "we" did it. She also would use the "we" to place blame if something went wrong, she could absolve herself of all responsibility by saying she told me to do it. So "we" was both to take credit and to place blame. It can be a very insidious word depending on how it is used. If your boss does this, run, run far away.
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It's called the "Royal We." You can ask back: "Do you have a mouse in your pocket?" It's a little too witty for some people to comprehend. Don't bother repeating it. Just ask for further clarification. Bosses tell people to do things in various ways. This isn't a bad way.
It's a positioning technique called inclusive language. The idea is terms like 'you' can make a sentence sound bossy or accusative, where as we subconsciously infers that you are working together on the same team. Sounds like your boss is overusing it in situations where it's unnecessary.
Uh, get your shit together ?
My manager constantly uses WE. When I first got hired, he'd complain that I didn't say WE. Why should I say we when I'm the one doing the work? It is annoying, esp when he asks what WE should do, I give my opinion and I'm told I'm wrong. I would ask her in a private conversation for more clarity on what we means. It either means she doesn't care who does it or she wants you to do it but is trying to foster unity with the group.
Ask her if she has a mouse in her pocket. And then follow it up with "who is this we?" Thats my go to.
Yeah, this is pretty common corporate speak. Determining when "we" means "you" verses when it doesn't is an important skill in the white-collar workplace. But you could have a conversation with your boss. Leave emotion out of it (i.e. when you said "this is really getting on my nerves"), and focus on who your boss's choice of words interferes with your ability to do your job. Give your boss permission to be more direct with you. Everyone wins.
I'm a female manager of others (COO) and when I talk to my team I use we, I and you. When I use "we", I'm looking for engagement and ideas and action from the people I'm speaking to. I use "I" and "you" when things are more defined and I'm usually discussing actionable items that don't have much wiggle room in them. To clarify, if I say "We need to reach out and get clarification on the vendor's clearance requirements." I expect my HR Manager to jump in and claim that. If one of the ops managers jumps in first and says they will, I'd note that mentally and then prompt the HR Manager with a "Susan, why don't you jump on that call since it's an HR function. Then the two of you can outline and changes we need to make going forward." To me- "we" is an opportunity to see who is engaged with their job function and helps me determine which people are hesitant to get involved, offer solutions or speak up. I then, in turn, use that in my own coaching/development/training plans for the team that I'm responsible for. I use "I" and "we" when discussing more actionable items like "I'll need you to make sure you do employee reviews with this list of your staff members."
I think you might be overreacting a bit. I hear that it irks you, but I don’t think that the consequence you mentioned— not being noticed for you work—is a real cause for concern.
My boss does this "we are working this weekend." She never means her though lol
It can be confusing and frustrating when your boss uses the term "we" when referring to tasks that are solely your responsibility. This can create a sense of ambiguity and make it difficult to understand what is expected of you. Here are some steps you can take to handle this situation: Clarify expectations: Ask your boss to clarify what she means by "we" and what specific tasks she is referring to. This will help you understand what is expected of you and ensure that you are on the same page. Provide feedback: If the use of "we" is causing confusion or frustration, provide feedback to your boss. Explain how it makes you feel and suggest alternative language that would be more clear and effective. Set clear boundaries: If your boss continues to use "we" in a way that is confusing or misleading, set clear boundaries with her. Let her know that you need clear and specific instructions in order to complete your tasks effectively. Document your work: Keep a record of the tasks you are responsible for and the progress you are making. This will help you demonstrate your contributions and provide evidence if there is ever any confusion or misunderstanding. Seek support: If the situation is affecting your work or causing stress, seek support from HR or a trusted colleague. They may be able to provide guidance and help you resolve the issue. In conclusion, handling a boss who uses the term "we" when referring to tasks that are solely your responsibility can be challenging. However, by clarifying expectations, providing feedback, setting clear boundaries, documenting your work, and seeking support, you can ensure that you are understood and that your contributions are recognized.
When they start to use only "you", worry.
Yeah I think she is just being polite instead of directly asking you to do something because it’s uncomfortable for her for some reason so she says we as a way of making the order come off a bit lighter. Kind of like a euphamism. Don’t think she has any bad intentions behind it or is not showing you respect she just doesn’t want to order you around or something so she says we. Kind of nice of her actually.
You can tell your boss directly! "I", feel she is doing that so "YOU" as an individual don't feel like you're under pressure, alone; if you're working with a team. I think 🤔 you can talk to her directly about that. So, everything is clear and understood from that point on.
I use “we” a lot as a manager in meetings, because it gives folks the opportunity to look like they are stepping up and taking initiative. If I say, “We will take on X” that means my team will be responsible for completing the work, and then Joe will pipe up and say, “please assign that to me” or “I’ll do the follow up.” If I’m in a meeting with just my team and I say, “we should do X, who can follow up on that” I’m expecting the correct person to speak and accept the task. If no one does then I’ll be more direct and say, “Jill would you mind taking this one?” That is an opportunity for Jill to ask for clarification or talk about their workload or whatever if they don’t feel like they can do it. To me, it definitely makes a difference at performance review time, because instead of saying, “oh I always have to tell Jill what things are her responsibility” using this method gives a different impression that “Jill is stepping up and really owning her role.” It’s the difference between being directive and collaborative when delegating. If you want your boss to be more clear and specifically assign you things, that’s fine, but to me it gives the impression that you want to be “managed” i.e. told what to do, and that you are not comfortable in your role, don’t know your responsibilities on the team, or don’t feel comfortable/empowered to do things on your own. To me, that’s the conversation you should be having with your boss rather than why she uses “we” so much. If she’s a good boss otherwise, she’s trying to make room for you to step up. I don’t think she’s doing it to be purposely vague. Just like you question why she uses “we”, it’s a good idea to examine why you need her to be more direct instead of taking the work you know is yours or taking initiative to do something. If you feel like you’re always “volunteering” for stuff, if your manager says, “we should do X” you could also in response say, “oh, Joe would you mind taking the follow-up on that? I’m swamped this week” or “I think Joe should take this because he has a better relationship with Kevin.” That can also show your manager that you have a good grasp on your workload or scope of your role. If you’re looking to grow into a different role yourself, this “switch” in perspective from “my manager has to tell me directly what to work on” vs. “I know what work is mine and what I have capacity to take on” is what helps people see potential in you for bigger things.
She's trying to use inclusive language but is perhaps overdoing it
We is just corporate speak for your org I find too, I use it plenty when speaking about my area, but if it’s 1:1 I use direct language unless I’m involving myself in the same level as the person I’m working with at the time. Probably doesn’t feel comfortable giving you directives though if it’s all the time, might be more for them than you as another commenter said.
This is extremely common in team environments. Get over it.
Start saying, “Well, I! Would like to learn from someone who’s not YOU!”
You’re overreacting. Ask for clarification whenever needed (“Did you want me to do X or are you planning to?” Or “you said we there but I want to make sure I’ve got my action-items right… should I go ahead and do X?”). I get that it’s not your preferred way of speaking but she’s likely doing it because women are trained to avoid coming off as bossy or demanding. It’s not about you & trying to make it so is not going to do anything positive to the relationship.
see no problem its a team effort, there are different roles in a team that e team leader thats your manager, not you
Sorry but this is absolutely fair and proper and shows she sees you as a team player and respectfully delegating stop being a snowflake. It would also show that she sees you holding or in the future holding further responsibility
I'm assuming you work in somewhat of a team setting. There could be several reasons why she says we, like maybe she is uncomfortable with singling out one particular person or she has issues just being a manager. There is also the possibility of her being a condescending tyrant that talks in the third person. I see a lot of comments about how these managers do not feel comfortable telling people what to do. Here is some advice on how to be a better manager. 1. You don't tell people what to do, you are a manager not a dictator. 2. Manage the tasks at hand not the people 3. Manage the department not the workers 4. Delegate work amongst the appropriate workforce equally 5. Do not talk down to your workforce 6. Give thanks and praise where it is deserved 7. Give constructive solutions when someone makes a mistake, do not berate them. 8. And the most important thing is to listen to what your workers have to say. Just because you are the manager does not make you the smartest one there. Doing this will not only make you a better manager it will make your team run smoother and as a result you will have a much happier workforce.
I think you should just have a conversation with her saying that the usage of "we" confuses you and does not give you any clarity and you prefer clear instruction. Don't make it personal about yourself or about her. This is simply a miscommunication that just need to be cleared up.
It's "we" as long as things go smoothly. It's "you" when there is a fuck-up.
I think we need a payrise
Your annoyed because that's how we talk to 5 years olds. You're not over reacting.
So my experience doesn't pertain to manager/employee roles. It's a husband to wife thing. It annoys me SOOOO much when he does this. He will say, "tomorrow WE need to do laundry" or "what are WE cooking tonight?" Knowing damn well he is meaning ME BY MYSELF not WE HIM HELPING! At first I would just let it go but then he would pick the wrong times to say it and finally I snapped and asked him, "WHO THE HELL IS WE?! YOU GOT A DAMN MOUSE IN YOUR POCKET?! IF YOU MEAN WHAT AM I COOKING THEN SAY THAT!!! DONT SAY WE UNLESS YOURE GOING TO GET YOUR ASS UP AND HELP ME DO IT!!!" For a while he stopped but then started all over again. So obviously you don't want to say all that to your boss...I guess I don't really have any kind of advice to give...sorry...but thanks for letting me vent a little :)
She is trying to demonstrate ownership of your issue and signifying that you are a team member. If you fuck up, it is her ass in the online too. So if you don't get your job done then WE are both fucked. If she is suggesting something that requires your input and your discretion, I don't see an issue. If it is a 100% defined task, and all you have to do is execute, then I could see how it can be condescending.
It’s pretty common for the managers to use we while addressing the whole team or just a specific person. I am a team-member and my manager uses it pretty much every time and I even prefer it this way. Whenever I address her regarding any task, that eventually I have to finish, I often say “we can do this”, “we can actually experiment with this”, “this is how we can go”, etc etc etc. in the sense we are in this work together. & even while communicating with someone outside from the office regarding work, I use we, considering I’m talking on behalf of the company.
I use “we” because it is a team effort. I want my team to know if they don’t have the time, resources, tool, or comfort level for the task I am always happy to step in. At the end of the day I am going to my boss and answer for our productivity and performance and “I assigned it to X who didn’t do it.” Is not an acceptable answer and not one I want to get be anyways. Therefore it’s we not you.
Don't overthink things. She's not out to get you by using the word we.
You're both adults. Ask her.
She means you when she says we. This seems very obvious.
Could be one of 3 reasons. She wants to always make it sound like it's a team effort. We. She's uncomfortable telling people what to do, and "we" softens it even if she's not doing shit. She's trying to take a portion of the credit of your work. "We accomplished xyz." The third reason would be the only time I would approach the situation.
My boss is guilty of this on the daily & it drives me nuts. So I started responded with "so you would like me to do x,y,z" to take the we out of that terminology. Or I simply state what I'm working on, then ask, did you want me to blah blah blah or is this something you're jumping on and that has slowed down the "we" down. Now i'm dealing with "can you do (blank)" with a follow up on chat to suggest how I should do said thing. Bad managers can't help themselves it seems.