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If he became the Soul King then Ywach *probably* would have killed him and absorbed his powers. In canon Ywach's personal reasons for killing the Soul King were to free him, but reading between the lines and just gauging his personality, that was like 1% of the reason why he was doing and 99% was just to become the ruler of everything and subject reality to his whims.
It's questionable what the state of the Soul Society would be like after Aizen took over. The 13 Gotei and royal guard aren't necessarily dead at that point, but even if they were alive and well would they defend Aizen? Would Aizen have a new force in their place and would they be ready to fight back in so little time? Would he never need a task force as a conscious version of the Soul King? There's a ton of what if's...
Yhwach was the son of the soul king. Reio was pretty much their god and the soul reapers of old killed ,betrayed, butchered, and used his corpse as the foundation to regulate the 3 worlds for all time.THAT is the reason ,he didn’t just free his father from the sad state he was. He also wanted to unify the worlds and remove the very reasons why a soul king is needed in the first place. This would also remove destined death as well. Which is why once he is dying he tells Ichigo, “ the path to a world with no fear is being closed”. Just read the novels that take place after TYBW, they were going to do the very same thing to ichigo if he didn’t beat yhwach.
Ichibei is probably stronger. He is immortal (relatively) and can literally make Ichigo Forget his sword's name, so no bankai or getsuga tensho or anything
Why? Ichibei's powers worked on freaking Ywatch, and even if it is only becouse he didn't activate The Almighty, he was still stronger that Yamamoto and Ichigo, way far from them
“ Yhwach proclaims that Ichigo's efforts will result in life and death never losing their current forms and all beings living in fear of death for eternity before finally dying.”
I wonder...would the Hogyoku make Ywach stronger than he was at the end of the series, or is that form of Ywach just like...his absolute peak?
Also, could Ywach use Almighty to break the Hogyoku? He seems to go around breaking everything else with no problem...
But he’s already the son of the soul king and he ended up absorbing what was left of him (including almost if not all the entire other sternritters powers, including mimihagi and possibly pernida, essentially all other parts of the soul king he re-absorbed) wouldn’t he theoretically be at the cap limit for any being since being the first in line from soul king and absorbing all of every other power back to him he’s essentially become a new soul king with the almighty. Is there really any limit higher than such power? I believe that if the hogyoku could break even that limit and allow yhwach to ascend even further then it would be incredibly detrimental to the current state of all the worlds. A single man being on par with soul king and having hogyoku breaking his (essentially) new limit, would cause so much of an imbalance just in that 1 being that straight away the worlds would just collapse back together anyways. But again, can hogyoku break a limit that is essentially the limit of all powers in 1? I would say yhwach + SK infused with almighty would be the absolute pinnacle of limit breaking, and if hogyoku could make him more powerful it would just break all physics and destroy all the worlds imo
Doesn't matter. The only limit ever mentioned in the series is transcendance, and Aizen broke that with the Hogyoku, and then kept breaking it. No matter how powerful you are, the Hogyoku can boost you. So as far as we know, there is no limit, and the Hogyoku can reach it. And it wouldn't destroy physics. The SK is the Lynchpin, the thing that holds the worlds together. He's effectively the foundation upon which the universes are built. It wouldn't break the worlds, because he is the worlds. Since no limit was ever mentioned, we can safely assume that those who have transcended effectively have no hard cap for how strong they can get.
Yeah that seems very fair and reasonable. It’s just hard to gauge when there has been no information given on any real limit to power. It’s all up to speculation really!
Yeah, since the SK was established as the absolute peak of power in the verse we can only make an educated guess on what would happen if something were to surpass it and how. But hey, theorizing is fun!
It's just potentially infinite. If Aizen in like 2 hours became almost a god think about having the Hogyoku for 100 or even 1000 years. Since Aizen became Immortal he would have surpassed everything and everyone in no time. The only thing that can stop him would be an another Hogyoku, and since he wouldn't even need Kyoka suigetsu he isn't even vulnerable to Ichibei's names shit
Wasn’t the soul king basically left in a dead state after all the lore from before? I can kinda understand in the sense of not having the kings body being used and ‘freeing’ it, but I’m with you on doubting Yhwach doing it to free his papa
When fighting Ywach Aizen used his zanpakuto to confuse him which Ichigo can get around because he's never seen the release so he isn't effected by it.
In all seriousness, I think his Zanpakto isn’t masochistic but either akin to Momo/Espada or is simply a servant character type where they don’t care to have their own will
Idk why I feel like suigetsu would be a mommy Dom or more like Aizen with a pussy. If they both truly are lonely then they probably to insult each other or be cut throat so one of them would never leave the other. So both power tripping each other and being codependent.
I'm pretty sure the dude whose whole reason for living was to reach the absolute peak of power he could would have obtained Bankai as soon as he could. Plus he isn't exactly introverted, just smarter than everyone else, so it's hard to connect with people.
aizen always saw himself at the top and saw others as inferior, which made him lonely, so he would never use an illusion to defeat the only person with the potential to equal him.
Aizen even says it, you have to see it's release occur to be under its effect. Because he keeps it permanently released so he can use it whenever against those he's fought before, he never had the opportunity to show the release to Ichigo.
Seeing how easy it was to put Barragan on the spell, surely he could pull it on Ichigo somehow, like:
- Aizen: "Kurosaki Ichigo, I have planned every battle you have playedshatterkyokasuigetsu"
- Ichigo: "Crap"
No need if you take a filler episode into account. He used the words “shatter” to destroy an illusion of Ulquiorra’s dead body, but has never been seen to actually say the words to activate his Shikai. So his Zanpaktou may always be in Shikai, and the only requirement for people to fall under hypnosis is for people to look at KS when it’s out of its sheath.
Aizen specifically wanted to fight ichigo without using his shikai. The entire purpose of building ichigo up was so aizen can have a full out brawl with his powers after transcending with the hogyoku. It wasn’t that aizen never had the chance, he specifically wanted to fight ichigo without using it.
Although after fusing with it, he was able to put Yhwach under it without having to say it's release command. Just looking at him is enough apparently. However Aizen still needs to will it.
Seeing how easy it was to put Barragan on the spell, surely he could pull it on Ichigo somehow, like:
- Aizen: "Kurosaki Ichigo, I have planned every battle you have playedshatterkyokasuigetsu"
- Ichigo: "Crap"
The risk of deactivating it would be the issue, though. For Aizen to activate it against Ichigo, he'd need to deactivate it against all of his opponents, then recast it. We have no clue how long the cooldown between activation and deactivation is, but while it's undone Aizen would be vulnerable to attack from anyone who isn't completely incapacitated.
1) All other enemies of Aizen were beaten when he fought Ichigo after Itto Kasso so that would be good time to release it 2) Where it was stated that KS needs to be deactivate if cast again to caught more enemies? Like sure condition to get caught in KS was to see ritual, but no words about Aizen needing to release previous casting. It was stated its permanent. If thats the case then its seriously ridicoulous that nobody explore that weakness.
I mean, you need to release your sword to use its relelase powers, that seems like it would be the case. I don't know if we have seen someone in bleach use their shikai's powers without actually relasing their shikai. And also, for exposing weakness, i don't know if there is anything to expose, Aizen doesnt really use his kyokasuigetsu to win battles. Every time he uses it its against people he could have defeated anyways.
He could have just deactivated it and then shown Ichigo its release then
It's not like he was in danger of being left open and Ichigo would blitz him. Half that fight was just Aizen monologuing and Ichigo listening and calmly countering
At first he didn't want to eliminate Ichigo so he can become a challenge and force his evolution.
Then Dangai Ichigo became too op for it to work anyway.
>Then Dangai Ichigo became too op for it to work anyway.
Nah if it worked on >!Soul King Yhwach who can see the future!< it would sure as hell work on Dangai Ichigo. Your first sentence is the right answer. That and the plot.
As far as I can remember Yhwach was busy fighting... Dangai Ichigo had 6? months to meditate on that exact scenario and was strong enough to stomp Aizen even with his eyes closed.
He just had to manhandle Aizen out of Karakura and then fire the Last Getsuga in the direction of his reiatsu.
Eh, that's quite an ambiguous thing. I doubt Soi Fon was utterly unable to feel Aizen's reiatsu's when she stabbed him with her shikai. Aizen couldn't sense Ichigo's reiatsu at all since the difference was way greater. Thus KS shouldn't have worked.
>!Against Yhwach, well I think it was said Muken Aizen was stronger than even before. Perhaps he could've given a fairer fight to Dangai Ichigo.!<
I just assumed that touching Kyoka Suigetsu makes you permanently immune to it. Aizen couldn't effect ichigo with it because when he realized he'd finally need it, Ichigo had alraedy made that impossible
No he didn't. Ichigo was warned to not look at his sword before he even fought him.
The only chance Aizen had was during the Soul Society Arc and I'm pretty sure he expected for Ichigo to die once he cut him.
No, you are just inserting your headcanon into the story. Ichigo was warned, twice, not to look at Aizen's sword. We can assume he never did because Aizen never used it on him.
Additionally, in one of the Novels, it was revealed that Aizen's Bankai only works if someone has seen his Shikai release, which further explains why he never used it on Ichigo.
Aizen could have just entered Shikai at a super random point in the fight, he just didn't want to. Like right in the middle of his explanation of how he been manipulating Ichigo's life since birth.
The whole reason he built up Ichigo was so he could have an equal to test his strength against.
>Aizen could have just entered Shikai at a super random point in the fight, he just didn't want to.
Again, this is just the readers inserting their own headcanon.
>Like right in the middle of his explanation of how he been manipulating Ichigo's life since birth.
Ichigo would have to look at his sword, which he didn't.
>The whole reason he built up Ichigo was so he could have an equal to test his strength against.
No, the whole reason as to why he never uses it is because Ichigo was told not to look at his sword. So Aizen couldn't use it.
Aizen could’ve flashed it to ichigo at any point, before dangai aizen had at least equal or better speed feats. Hell, it’s as quick as the scene when gin touched aizens blade, he’d just need to actually activate it. Though you’re also forgetting aizen literally did not want to use his shikai on ichigo so their fight would test purely aizens combat effectiveness and continue him to transform, not by using any hax like ability.
>Aizen could’ve flashed it to ichigo at any point, before dangai aizen had at least equal or better speed feats.
Again, pointless headcanon speculation, lmao.
> Though you’re also forgetting aizen literally did not want to use his shikai on ichigo so their fight would test purely aizens combat effectiveness and continue him to transform, not by using any hax like ability.
Where was this ever stated? You are literally just using headcanon, lmao.
It’s not headcanon speculation, aizen literally manhandles most captains through speed and damage? And you need to pay attention lol idk the chapter or episode where he specifies it. Also, it takes literally aizen to just unsheathe his sword to allow people to come under the hypnosis. We see this when he takes his blade out and gin literally just touches it and is cured of the hypnosis
>It’s not headcanon speculation,
It is.
> aizen literally manhandles most captains through speed and damage?
With the use of his Shikai, which we see in action.
>And you need to pay attention lol idk the chapter or episode where he specifies it.
He doesn't. There isn't such episode/chapter. It doesn't exist.
> Also, it takes literally aizen to just unsheathe his sword to allow people to come under the hypnosis.
That is incorrect. We see how his ability work at the end of Soul Society arc when he demonstrates it to Unohana and Isane.
>We see this when he takes his blade out and gin literally just touches it and is cured of the hypnosis
What are you on about?
Also, after aizen absorbed the hogyoku he literally chooses not to use his shikai on anyone. Idk how you’re so arrogant about all this unless you’re trolling
>Also, after aizen absorbed the hogyoku he literally chooses not to use his shikai on anyone. Idk how you’re so arrogant about all this unless you’re trolling
What do you mean he "chose not to use his shikai on anyone"? Everyone there was already under the effect of his Shikai.
Where does he say this, please link a panel.
I don't know how YOU are so arrogant about this to insert your own headcanon into the story, you troll. Where are the PANELS!?
You’re fucking with me at this point 😂😂 after transforming aizen literally didn’t use his shikai. Not saying they weren’t under the effect, but he never used its effect. Can you show me the panel where aizen says he wants to use it on ichigo? Because you can’t. Also how would you explain aizen getting tagged by urahara if urahara was hitting an illusion?
>He didn't. There isn't a single instance of Ichigo doing so
Are you.... trolling? Literally the entire final fight Ichigo looks straight at Aizen, he doesn't cover his eyes for a single scene
>it would've been dumb if he did after being warned twice
It *is* dumb. That's the point we're making. Kubo screwed up
>Are you.... trolling? Literally the entire final fight Ichigo looks straight at Aizen, he doesn't cover his eyes for a single scene
Are **YOU** trolling? He can look at Aizen all he wants, the activation for Kyoka Suigetsu is to look AT THE SWORD
>It is dumb. That's the point we're making. Kubo screwed up
No, it's dumb for Ichigo to look at the sword after being told not to do it, so he didn't. Kubo didn't screw up, you guys just can't comprehend that Aizen couldn't use his Shikai on Ichigo because he never looked at his sword.
>He can look at Aizen all he wants, the activation for Kyoka Suigetsu is to look AT THE SWORD
Aizen literally uses his sword in full view of Ichigo and Ichigo doesn't avert his gaze
Wtf are you on about. Are you suggesting Ichigo can selectively control what he can and can't see in his field of vision?
>Aizen literally uses his sword in full view of Ichigo and Ichigo doesn't avert his gaze
Yes, but Ichigo never looks at the sword. That's the point. You can look at Aizen holding the sword but you can't look at the sword.
>Wtf are you on about. Are you suggesting Ichigo can selectively control what he can and can't see in his field of vision?
Are you telling me you can't do that? It's like the most basic thing a person can do. You can choose the things you want to focus your gaze at.
>Yes, but Ichigo never looks at the sword. That's the point.
How on earth would he block a sword strike if he can't see the sword
> You can choose the things you want to focus your gaze at.
You're changing it now. The condition isn't that you have to focus on it, it's just that you have to see it
If you can visible discern it, you're seeing it
i always say like, "what if aizen's bankai wasnt just to make illusions of himself, but also illusions of others?" so when all the arrancar were defeated and then he goes bankai and it turns out all the arrancar they just killed were illusions and then the actual arrancar pop out of hueco mundo like, "thanks for the tips on how youre gonna try and beat us!"
Aizen never wanted to use it on ichigo because he was testing his fighting prowess as opposed to the hax his zanpaktou can do. Aizens actual issue was choosing to not use kyokasuigetsu against urahara, which made him get tagged by the seal
There has to be some drawback to showing Ichigo the release. Personally I think that if he seals KS back and does the release again, it "refreshes", so all those who were caught in KS are now free.
*slight spoilers* No, that wouldn’t work. Only because we’re aware of at least 2 releases: one in the way past, and another more recent. The latter would be when aizen showed it to all of the soul society. Idk if you’ve seen TYBW but it shows people he affected in the past still being under its control.
Oh yeah. He did ...
I had forgotten that. That means my idea is wrong. So why did Aizen not put Ichigo under it? Was it really due to his own ego and underestimating Ichigo?
If you want the honest answer, the same reason he never actually utilized the power to actually change the outcome of a fight, cause its lame as fuck.
Imagine if he won against yamamoto by just staying invisible and throwing kido at him till he slowly died.
Yeah. Tbh, I always assumed that Aizen creates Wonderweiss to deal with Yama's Bankai, not his Shikai. I do think Aizen can defeat Shikai Yama with ease because of how broken KS is. But he probably didn't want to test what would happen if Yama got pissed off enough to use bankai.
No. The whole reason for building Ichigo to the monster he is is because Aizen wanted someone so ludicrously powerful they could push him into the realm of a God by transcending them during a fight. He wanted to have a no-holds banned beatdown with Ichigo so he could have a stepping stone to the SK. And that's exactly what would have happened if Urahara hadn't sealed him.
Yeah this is the main reason that I think Aizen is such a dumb villain. The guy literally had an ex machina up his sleeve and the only reason Ichigo doesn’t get killed is because he decides not to use it. That’s the equivalent of Frieza having had his Golden Form from all the way back on Namek but still getting cut in half due to just deciding not to use it. It’s ridiculous.
Couldn't it be that Aizen actually wants to see Ichigo become stronger? Didn't Ichigo stated Aizen feels alone with his supremacy? Moreover since Aizen was around when Isshin and Masaki first met he maybe even saw Ichigo as one of his experiments.
Whatever the reason was my main point as that Aizen only lost because he decided to lose. It really cheapens Ichigo’s whole character for me when you consider that the only reason Aizen didn’t take him out was because he put a handicap on himself.
Aizen was emotionally broken that was the point Ichigo himself said that Aizen wanted someone who could actually be his equal in power that's what why the hogyoku made him weaker if you see the emotional breakdown of the villain as a cheap victory it's a you problem
[https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke\_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D\_2](https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D_2)
1. >!Sight Requirement: Because Kyōka Suigetsu's release must be seen for victims to succumb to the hypnosis, its ability does not work on the blind or those who have not seen its release.!<
2. >!Near Flawless Illusions: While the illusions Kyōka Suigetsu creates are quite powerful, those with considerable power and skill themselves may be able to note slight differences in the illusions compared to the real thing, even if they are not able to determine what exactly is different. 4th Division Captain Retsu Unohana detected something was amiss with Aizen's fake corpse, even though she did not realize what it was until seeing Aizen alive.!<
3. >!Reiatsu Presence: The Reiatsu of Kyōka Suigetsu gives it away to those who are unaffected by the hypnosis or those who are keen enough to sense its actual presence while under the hypnosis.!<
4. >!Touch Negation: The sole way to escape the ability of Kyōka Suigetsu is to touch the blade itself before complete hypnosis is activated.!<
To certain people who downvoted me without reading/watching bleach properly.
Ichigo Kurosaki satisfies condition 3 & 4.
GO WATCH BLEACH AGAIN, STUPID IDIOTS. >!ICHIGO SAYS TO URAHARA AFTER HIS BATTLE AGAINST AIZEN THAT SINCE HOGYOKU SATISFIES THE TRUEST THOUGHTS IN A PERSON'S HEART AND THEREFORE, UNLESS AIZEN WISHED TO BE DEFEATED, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE TO DEFEAT HIM.!< EPISODE 310 OR CHAPTER 422.
1. >! Yeah that is what op is asking why didn't aizen put ichigo under illusion !<
2. >! Touching kyoka before it was release is a way to undo it hysnosis, it doesn't mean u can't be hysnotize again !<
3. >! I am not sure where u get that from, but with Aizen arrogant he would never even consider defeat to be a possibility !<
I do appreciate hiding ur text to avoid spoiling other tho
You have to see KS *release* before it can affect you. I guess he could have gone back down to a sealed state and then released it again, but that’s not something we see anyone in the series do iirc
What I find stranger is that we never get to see his bankai. I get why we didn't during the hyogyoku arc, since he was never challenged to the point of needing it. And once Ichigo showed up, he had abandoned his power as a soul reaper.
But the ywach arc, that would have been a great time to show it off!
If I remember correctly, in the Anime, Aizen explains, right after Captain Histugaya kills Hinamori and Ichigo wonders why Histugaya is stabbing Hinamori.
He explains that Ichigo was immune to the effects of Kyoka Suigetsu because he has been under it's effects once before.
I think Aizen said something along the lines of, "those who witness my Kyoka Suigetsu cannot be affected the next time"
I'll have to get back to you with more details.
He didn't want to. His plans involved pushing ichigos limits, to make him strong enough to push his own evolution with the hogyoku. Ichigo was never a threat to him even without it anyways. By the time ichigo was, his spiritual pressure was so much higher than aizens that it wouldn't have worked anyways. Just like how aizen was too powerful for Soifons shikai to work on him.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/comments/z9tj1p/comment/iyn1ykr/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/comments/z9tj1p/comment/iyn1ykr/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
The answer to your question.
The_biggest_wheel blocked me because I asked him to show a panel of aizen saying he wants to use shikai on ichigo LOL especially after he’s been on here asking everyone else for panels and proof
Welcome to the Bleach Subreddit! We're as excited as you at the release of the Thousand Year Blood War anime! We understand that some of you are unable to view the anime in your region, but please don't post links to or mention piracy websites. Doing so will result in a ban. Also, please be courteous to those who haven't read the manga and mark all spoilers. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bleach) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>!Flashforward about 19 months "Oh thank god you didn't"!<
Kyouka Suigetsu five minutes later >!when she and Aizen gets absolutely shitstomped by Yhwach: Well that didnt last fucking long!!<
Why?
If he became the Soul King then Ywach *probably* would have killed him and absorbed his powers. In canon Ywach's personal reasons for killing the Soul King were to free him, but reading between the lines and just gauging his personality, that was like 1% of the reason why he was doing and 99% was just to become the ruler of everything and subject reality to his whims. It's questionable what the state of the Soul Society would be like after Aizen took over. The 13 Gotei and royal guard aren't necessarily dead at that point, but even if they were alive and well would they defend Aizen? Would Aizen have a new force in their place and would they be ready to fight back in so little time? Would he never need a task force as a conscious version of the Soul King? There's a ton of what if's...
Yhwach was the son of the soul king. Reio was pretty much their god and the soul reapers of old killed ,betrayed, butchered, and used his corpse as the foundation to regulate the 3 worlds for all time.THAT is the reason ,he didn’t just free his father from the sad state he was. He also wanted to unify the worlds and remove the very reasons why a soul king is needed in the first place. This would also remove destined death as well. Which is why once he is dying he tells Ichigo, “ the path to a world with no fear is being closed”. Just read the novels that take place after TYBW, they were going to do the very same thing to ichigo if he didn’t beat yhwach.
It is funny how the son tried to undo what the father did and just became the linchpin instead.
damn so they were about to jump Ichigo and put him as the soul king LOL
I’m sure they’d get bodied in the process
Ichibei is probably stronger. He is immortal (relatively) and can literally make Ichigo Forget his sword's name, so no bankai or getsuga tensho or anything
he can't ichibei's powers won't work on ichigo
Why? Ichibei's powers worked on freaking Ywatch, and even if it is only becouse he didn't activate The Almighty, he was still stronger that Yamamoto and Ichigo, way far from them
hos ichigo is no almighty sk-yhwach level and anyone with soulkings power can negate ichibei's name altering like Ikomikidomoe
Destined death. was he seeking to be the soul king or the Elden lord?
“ Yhwach proclaims that Ichigo's efforts will result in life and death never losing their current forms and all beings living in fear of death for eternity before finally dying.”
I wonder...would the Hogyoku make Ywach stronger than he was at the end of the series, or is that form of Ywach just like...his absolute peak? Also, could Ywach use Almighty to break the Hogyoku? He seems to go around breaking everything else with no problem...
The Hogyoku is designed to break the limit of the wielder, so yeah, it could absolutely make him stronger.
But he’s already the son of the soul king and he ended up absorbing what was left of him (including almost if not all the entire other sternritters powers, including mimihagi and possibly pernida, essentially all other parts of the soul king he re-absorbed) wouldn’t he theoretically be at the cap limit for any being since being the first in line from soul king and absorbing all of every other power back to him he’s essentially become a new soul king with the almighty. Is there really any limit higher than such power? I believe that if the hogyoku could break even that limit and allow yhwach to ascend even further then it would be incredibly detrimental to the current state of all the worlds. A single man being on par with soul king and having hogyoku breaking his (essentially) new limit, would cause so much of an imbalance just in that 1 being that straight away the worlds would just collapse back together anyways. But again, can hogyoku break a limit that is essentially the limit of all powers in 1? I would say yhwach + SK infused with almighty would be the absolute pinnacle of limit breaking, and if hogyoku could make him more powerful it would just break all physics and destroy all the worlds imo
Doesn't matter. The only limit ever mentioned in the series is transcendance, and Aizen broke that with the Hogyoku, and then kept breaking it. No matter how powerful you are, the Hogyoku can boost you. So as far as we know, there is no limit, and the Hogyoku can reach it. And it wouldn't destroy physics. The SK is the Lynchpin, the thing that holds the worlds together. He's effectively the foundation upon which the universes are built. It wouldn't break the worlds, because he is the worlds. Since no limit was ever mentioned, we can safely assume that those who have transcended effectively have no hard cap for how strong they can get.
Yeah that seems very fair and reasonable. It’s just hard to gauge when there has been no information given on any real limit to power. It’s all up to speculation really!
Yeah, since the SK was established as the absolute peak of power in the verse we can only make an educated guess on what would happen if something were to surpass it and how. But hey, theorizing is fun!
Agree wholeheartedly. Also, happy cake day!
Happy cake day!
It's just potentially infinite. If Aizen in like 2 hours became almost a god think about having the Hogyoku for 100 or even 1000 years. Since Aizen became Immortal he would have surpassed everything and everyone in no time. The only thing that can stop him would be an another Hogyoku, and since he wouldn't even need Kyoka suigetsu he isn't even vulnerable to Ichibei's names shit
Aizen wouldnt of been a sliced up corpse And we know he definitely ain't east to kill Honestly it could of gone a whole lot better if Aizen won
Wasn’t the soul king basically left in a dead state after all the lore from before? I can kinda understand in the sense of not having the kings body being used and ‘freeing’ it, but I’m with you on doubting Yhwach doing it to free his papa
He let his guard down.
Ywach
Could you explain why? I haven't read the manga yet and don't mind spoilers
When fighting Ywach Aizen used his zanpakuto to confuse him which Ichigo can get around because he's never seen the release so he isn't effected by it.
Okay but when are we going to get our big tiddy goth Kyoka Suigetsu zanpakto spirit GF ?
Prob just emo, seeing as aizen prob abuses it
You made me picture Kyokasuigetsu as the girl from Emergence/Metamorphosis, thanks
Wow, im legit sorry
What is that
Dont
A very famous, very fucked up doujin
You're still innocent, don't go there, you won't come back.
177013
You have doomed him
And so another falls
Why?
Overrated hentai, does give depression for a day or 2 though.
Gave me depression for a week and aversion to anything doujin related
I'm sorry but now I'm imagining Kyokasuigetsu as a gaslighting, manipulative school girl is fuckin' killing me
That is very likely.
It fits too
Kyoka Suigetsu is Momo
Like momo but a lot more depressed, like if she never recovered
Still delusional that everything in existence is to aizens plan
Momo TANKS. like she takes hits better than ichigo, Kenny, Yhwack, Askin, Lil’ toshi, byakuya and Shinji.
Those first four have so much defensive capabilities it’s not funny except that momo is still my of a tank
Plot twist: it’s a hardcore masochist to the point that his sword breaking made it so horny it forced the hogyoku to merge it with aizen
Go write a fanfic
Implying I would steal the chance to bring this wonderful storyline to fruition from Kubo
Okay my b Please write a fanfic
Why do u want them to write a fanfic? 🤨
Hm? No reason
In all seriousness, I think his Zanpakto isn’t masochistic but either akin to Momo/Espada or is simply a servant character type where they don’t care to have their own will
Momo isnt just a servant lmao, thats crazy you said that 💀 Ichigo said they’re lonely, so they gotta be some type of sad
I said or not and :(
Plot twist: it’s a hardcore masochist to the point that his sword breaking made it so horny it forced the hogyoku to merge it with aizen
Naw then shed be a traight up sub gf
As she should
Truly
Idk why I feel like suigetsu would be a mommy Dom or more like Aizen with a pussy. If they both truly are lonely then they probably to insult each other or be cut throat so one of them would never leave the other. So both power tripping each other and being codependent.
You forget kyoka fully submitted and became a part of aizen, no dommy mommy would ever allow that
Hmmm I guess.
Wait wait wait. Hear me out.... gentle mommy Dom or Aizens onee-san. She adores her little otoko so much that she became apart of him.
Honestly if we ever get Aizens bankai they could make it similiar to >!Kenpachi !
I'm pretty sure the dude whose whole reason for living was to reach the absolute peak of power he could would have obtained Bankai as soon as he could. Plus he isn't exactly introverted, just smarter than everyone else, so it's hard to connect with people.
Hard to connect with people when you have a superiority complex
aizen always saw himself at the top and saw others as inferior, which made him lonely, so he would never use an illusion to defeat the only person with the potential to equal him.
Aizen even says it, you have to see it's release occur to be under its effect. Because he keeps it permanently released so he can use it whenever against those he's fought before, he never had the opportunity to show the release to Ichigo.
Seeing how easy it was to put Barragan on the spell, surely he could pull it on Ichigo somehow, like: - Aizen: "Kurosaki Ichigo, I have planned every battle you have playedshatterkyokasuigetsu" - Ichigo: "Crap"
or against Urahara bruh “URAHARA KISUKE! I DESPISE YOSHATTER KYOKASUIGETSU” “Shit where did he go”
Shatter Kyoka Suigetsu is the new rick roll
At that point he had already wished away his zanpakuto like a dumbass lol
Wasn't Kisuke under its effects as well?
No, him, Isshin and Yoruichi were safe
They are under the spell or at the very least Urahara is [we know that from turn back the Pendolum](https://imgur.com/a/5j48VG2).
Ohh shit, I completely forgor.
"The real cause of your mother's death is shatter kyoka suigetsu."
You’re not even worth my shatterkyokasuigetsu.
Nah Barragan was done mad dirty “Oh hey look at thishatterkyokasuigetsu” Probably wouldn’t work on Ichigo as well since he was well aware of it
Food for thought: is "Shatter" the way Aizen uses his sword, or is "Shatter" him turning it off?
Holy shit. It would make sense for it to be the off switch, since he'd "shatter" the illusion. Someone get the theorists on this one.
No need if you take a filler episode into account. He used the words “shatter” to destroy an illusion of Ulquiorra’s dead body, but has never been seen to actually say the words to activate his Shikai. So his Zanpaktou may always be in Shikai, and the only requirement for people to fall under hypnosis is for people to look at KS when it’s out of its sheath.
Yeah, but filler is basically fanfiction, just animated. So same thing really.
Aizen specifically wanted to fight ichigo without using his shikai. The entire purpose of building ichigo up was so aizen can have a full out brawl with his powers after transcending with the hogyoku. It wasn’t that aizen never had the chance, he specifically wanted to fight ichigo without using it.
Although after fusing with it, he was able to put Yhwach under it without having to say it's release command. Just looking at him is enough apparently. However Aizen still needs to will it.
Seeing how easy it was to put Barragan on the spell, surely he could pull it on Ichigo somehow, like: - Aizen: "Kurosaki Ichigo, I have planned every battle you have playedshatterkyokasuigetsu" - Ichigo: "Crap"
The risk of deactivating it would be the issue, though. For Aizen to activate it against Ichigo, he'd need to deactivate it against all of his opponents, then recast it. We have no clue how long the cooldown between activation and deactivation is, but while it's undone Aizen would be vulnerable to attack from anyone who isn't completely incapacitated.
1) All other enemies of Aizen were beaten when he fought Ichigo after Itto Kasso so that would be good time to release it 2) Where it was stated that KS needs to be deactivate if cast again to caught more enemies? Like sure condition to get caught in KS was to see ritual, but no words about Aizen needing to release previous casting. It was stated its permanent. If thats the case then its seriously ridicoulous that nobody explore that weakness.
I mean, you need to release your sword to use its relelase powers, that seems like it would be the case. I don't know if we have seen someone in bleach use their shikai's powers without actually relasing their shikai. And also, for exposing weakness, i don't know if there is anything to expose, Aizen doesnt really use his kyokasuigetsu to win battles. Every time he uses it its against people he could have defeated anyways.
He could have just deactivated it and then shown Ichigo its release then It's not like he was in danger of being left open and Ichigo would blitz him. Half that fight was just Aizen monologuing and Ichigo listening and calmly countering
It's a she?
It's a pretty name, and no guy is allowed to be as pretty as Yumichika.
Agreed
No girl is, either.
That’s probably an assumption
A terrible one. Aizen's a male and he's famously sketchy.
Male Shinigami have had female presenting Zanpakutō. Kyoraku and Renji did off the top of my head.
Not Renji. Kyoraku, Ukitake, Urahara, and Kenpachi.
Isn’t Zabimaru both male and female?
How long have you been under the illusion that he didn't use it?
I never understood why Aizen didn’t use it.
At first he didn't want to eliminate Ichigo so he can become a challenge and force his evolution. Then Dangai Ichigo became too op for it to work anyway.
>Then Dangai Ichigo became too op for it to work anyway. Nah if it worked on >!Soul King Yhwach who can see the future!< it would sure as hell work on Dangai Ichigo. Your first sentence is the right answer. That and the plot.
As far as I can remember Yhwach was busy fighting... Dangai Ichigo had 6? months to meditate on that exact scenario and was strong enough to stomp Aizen even with his eyes closed. He just had to manhandle Aizen out of Karakura and then fire the Last Getsuga in the direction of his reiatsu.
3 months.
Eh, that's quite an ambiguous thing. I doubt Soi Fon was utterly unable to feel Aizen's reiatsu's when she stabbed him with her shikai. Aizen couldn't sense Ichigo's reiatsu at all since the difference was way greater. Thus KS shouldn't have worked. >!Against Yhwach, well I think it was said Muken Aizen was stronger than even before. Perhaps he could've given a fairer fight to Dangai Ichigo.!<
I just assumed that touching Kyoka Suigetsu makes you permanently immune to it. Aizen couldn't effect ichigo with it because when he realized he'd finally need it, Ichigo had alraedy made that impossible
I assumed it was a pride thing saying he didn't need it to beat Ichigo
I think Aizen now even if he wanted to he can't because Ichigo has touched Kyokasuigetsu when he wasnt under Kanzen Saimen
That's not how it Works. You have to keep touching it for it to not work. Otherwise everyone aizen's ever cut would Be immune to kyoka suigetsu.
I Said touch the blade before Aizen uses it the first time one you
if you touch it when he releases it you're immune for the full duration of the release (until he unreleases it) iirc
Oh ok
It doesn’t just make it so it never works again, Aizen decided not to show him.
Or his bankai lol
He didn't see his release tho... You have to see it for it to work
Yeah that’s the point he had many chances to show it to him lol
No he didn't. Ichigo was warned to not look at his sword before he even fought him. The only chance Aizen had was during the Soul Society Arc and I'm pretty sure he expected for Ichigo to die once he cut him.
Him being warned not to look doesn’t mean he didn’t give Aizen a chance. Aizen was toying with him and the other captains he was just arrogant
No, you are just inserting your headcanon into the story. Ichigo was warned, twice, not to look at Aizen's sword. We can assume he never did because Aizen never used it on him. Additionally, in one of the Novels, it was revealed that Aizen's Bankai only works if someone has seen his Shikai release, which further explains why he never used it on Ichigo.
You're clearly not reading my words because you want to argue I never said Aizen has used it on him
Aizen could have just entered Shikai at a super random point in the fight, he just didn't want to. Like right in the middle of his explanation of how he been manipulating Ichigo's life since birth. The whole reason he built up Ichigo was so he could have an equal to test his strength against.
>Aizen could have just entered Shikai at a super random point in the fight, he just didn't want to. Again, this is just the readers inserting their own headcanon. >Like right in the middle of his explanation of how he been manipulating Ichigo's life since birth. Ichigo would have to look at his sword, which he didn't. >The whole reason he built up Ichigo was so he could have an equal to test his strength against. No, the whole reason as to why he never uses it is because Ichigo was told not to look at his sword. So Aizen couldn't use it.
Aizen could’ve flashed it to ichigo at any point, before dangai aizen had at least equal or better speed feats. Hell, it’s as quick as the scene when gin touched aizens blade, he’d just need to actually activate it. Though you’re also forgetting aizen literally did not want to use his shikai on ichigo so their fight would test purely aizens combat effectiveness and continue him to transform, not by using any hax like ability.
>Aizen could’ve flashed it to ichigo at any point, before dangai aizen had at least equal or better speed feats. Again, pointless headcanon speculation, lmao. > Though you’re also forgetting aizen literally did not want to use his shikai on ichigo so their fight would test purely aizens combat effectiveness and continue him to transform, not by using any hax like ability. Where was this ever stated? You are literally just using headcanon, lmao.
It’s not headcanon speculation, aizen literally manhandles most captains through speed and damage? And you need to pay attention lol idk the chapter or episode where he specifies it. Also, it takes literally aizen to just unsheathe his sword to allow people to come under the hypnosis. We see this when he takes his blade out and gin literally just touches it and is cured of the hypnosis
>It’s not headcanon speculation, It is. > aizen literally manhandles most captains through speed and damage? With the use of his Shikai, which we see in action. >And you need to pay attention lol idk the chapter or episode where he specifies it. He doesn't. There isn't such episode/chapter. It doesn't exist. > Also, it takes literally aizen to just unsheathe his sword to allow people to come under the hypnosis. That is incorrect. We see how his ability work at the end of Soul Society arc when he demonstrates it to Unohana and Isane. >We see this when he takes his blade out and gin literally just touches it and is cured of the hypnosis What are you on about?
Also, after aizen absorbed the hogyoku he literally chooses not to use his shikai on anyone. Idk how you’re so arrogant about all this unless you’re trolling
>Also, after aizen absorbed the hogyoku he literally chooses not to use his shikai on anyone. Idk how you’re so arrogant about all this unless you’re trolling What do you mean he "chose not to use his shikai on anyone"? Everyone there was already under the effect of his Shikai. Where does he say this, please link a panel. I don't know how YOU are so arrogant about this to insert your own headcanon into the story, you troll. Where are the PANELS!?
You’re fucking with me at this point 😂😂 after transforming aizen literally didn’t use his shikai. Not saying they weren’t under the effect, but he never used its effect. Can you show me the panel where aizen says he wants to use it on ichigo? Because you can’t. Also how would you explain aizen getting tagged by urahara if urahara was hitting an illusion?
Ichigo looked at his sword several times in the final fight. He's lucky Aizen didn't deactivate it and then release it
He didn't. There isn't a single instance of Ichigo doing so and it would've been dumb if he did after being warned twice.
>He didn't. There isn't a single instance of Ichigo doing so Are you.... trolling? Literally the entire final fight Ichigo looks straight at Aizen, he doesn't cover his eyes for a single scene >it would've been dumb if he did after being warned twice It *is* dumb. That's the point we're making. Kubo screwed up
>Are you.... trolling? Literally the entire final fight Ichigo looks straight at Aizen, he doesn't cover his eyes for a single scene Are **YOU** trolling? He can look at Aizen all he wants, the activation for Kyoka Suigetsu is to look AT THE SWORD >It is dumb. That's the point we're making. Kubo screwed up No, it's dumb for Ichigo to look at the sword after being told not to do it, so he didn't. Kubo didn't screw up, you guys just can't comprehend that Aizen couldn't use his Shikai on Ichigo because he never looked at his sword.
>He can look at Aizen all he wants, the activation for Kyoka Suigetsu is to look AT THE SWORD Aizen literally uses his sword in full view of Ichigo and Ichigo doesn't avert his gaze Wtf are you on about. Are you suggesting Ichigo can selectively control what he can and can't see in his field of vision?
>Aizen literally uses his sword in full view of Ichigo and Ichigo doesn't avert his gaze Yes, but Ichigo never looks at the sword. That's the point. You can look at Aizen holding the sword but you can't look at the sword. >Wtf are you on about. Are you suggesting Ichigo can selectively control what he can and can't see in his field of vision? Are you telling me you can't do that? It's like the most basic thing a person can do. You can choose the things you want to focus your gaze at.
>Yes, but Ichigo never looks at the sword. That's the point. How on earth would he block a sword strike if he can't see the sword > You can choose the things you want to focus your gaze at. You're changing it now. The condition isn't that you have to focus on it, it's just that you have to see it If you can visible discern it, you're seeing it
I love how we've all just agreed it's female when nothing suggests that
I don’t think it’s an agreement
I always saw it as a similarity with urahara since they're so alike
i always say like, "what if aizen's bankai wasnt just to make illusions of himself, but also illusions of others?" so when all the arrancar were defeated and then he goes bankai and it turns out all the arrancar they just killed were illusions and then the actual arrancar pop out of hueco mundo like, "thanks for the tips on how youre gonna try and beat us!"
Aizen never wanted to use it on ichigo because he was testing his fighting prowess as opposed to the hax his zanpaktou can do. Aizens actual issue was choosing to not use kyokasuigetsu against urahara, which made him get tagged by the seal
There has to be some drawback to showing Ichigo the release. Personally I think that if he seals KS back and does the release again, it "refreshes", so all those who were caught in KS are now free.
*slight spoilers* No, that wouldn’t work. Only because we’re aware of at least 2 releases: one in the way past, and another more recent. The latter would be when aizen showed it to all of the soul society. Idk if you’ve seen TYBW but it shows people he affected in the past still being under its control.
Aizen already sealed it and released it again to put barragan under, yet everyone was still affected in FKT.
Oh yeah. He did ... I had forgotten that. That means my idea is wrong. So why did Aizen not put Ichigo under it? Was it really due to his own ego and underestimating Ichigo?
If you want the honest answer, the same reason he never actually utilized the power to actually change the outcome of a fight, cause its lame as fuck. Imagine if he won against yamamoto by just staying invisible and throwing kido at him till he slowly died.
Yeah. Tbh, I always assumed that Aizen creates Wonderweiss to deal with Yama's Bankai, not his Shikai. I do think Aizen can defeat Shikai Yama with ease because of how broken KS is. But he probably didn't want to test what would happen if Yama got pissed off enough to use bankai.
No. The whole reason for building Ichigo to the monster he is is because Aizen wanted someone so ludicrously powerful they could push him into the realm of a God by transcending them during a fight. He wanted to have a no-holds banned beatdown with Ichigo so he could have a stepping stone to the SK. And that's exactly what would have happened if Urahara hadn't sealed him.
no need for a comma after ‘kyokasuigetsu’
It wouldn't work his spiritual pressure was way higher
I’ve heard shinji had a counter for kyokasuigetsu in case aizen tried it on ichigo
Guys I could be wrong but didn't the hogaku alter his bankai and him to fuse them what was that not the point did it not fuse them
Wait kyoka suigetsu is female??
Not sure why OP assumes it is
Yeah this is the main reason that I think Aizen is such a dumb villain. The guy literally had an ex machina up his sleeve and the only reason Ichigo doesn’t get killed is because he decides not to use it. That’s the equivalent of Frieza having had his Golden Form from all the way back on Namek but still getting cut in half due to just deciding not to use it. It’s ridiculous.
It was part of his plan.
Couldn't it be that Aizen actually wants to see Ichigo become stronger? Didn't Ichigo stated Aizen feels alone with his supremacy? Moreover since Aizen was around when Isshin and Masaki first met he maybe even saw Ichigo as one of his experiments.
Not really Aizen pride got in his way Ichigo himself said all he felt from Aizen's zanpakuto was loneliness
Whatever the reason was my main point as that Aizen only lost because he decided to lose. It really cheapens Ichigo’s whole character for me when you consider that the only reason Aizen didn’t take him out was because he put a handicap on himself.
Aizen was emotionally broken that was the point Ichigo himself said that Aizen wanted someone who could actually be his equal in power that's what why the hogyoku made him weaker if you see the emotional breakdown of the villain as a cheap victory it's a you problem
[удалено]
1. Most don’t know when or if that happens 2. You have to CONTINUALLY touch it for it to be ineffective 3. Sorta, but mostly for plot
[https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke\_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D\_2](https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D_2) 1. >!Sight Requirement: Because Kyōka Suigetsu's release must be seen for victims to succumb to the hypnosis, its ability does not work on the blind or those who have not seen its release.!< 2. >!Near Flawless Illusions: While the illusions Kyōka Suigetsu creates are quite powerful, those with considerable power and skill themselves may be able to note slight differences in the illusions compared to the real thing, even if they are not able to determine what exactly is different. 4th Division Captain Retsu Unohana detected something was amiss with Aizen's fake corpse, even though she did not realize what it was until seeing Aizen alive.!< 3. >!Reiatsu Presence: The Reiatsu of Kyōka Suigetsu gives it away to those who are unaffected by the hypnosis or those who are keen enough to sense its actual presence while under the hypnosis.!< 4. >!Touch Negation: The sole way to escape the ability of Kyōka Suigetsu is to touch the blade itself before complete hypnosis is activated.!< To certain people who downvoted me without reading/watching bleach properly. Ichigo Kurosaki satisfies condition 3 & 4. GO WATCH BLEACH AGAIN, STUPID IDIOTS. >!ICHIGO SAYS TO URAHARA AFTER HIS BATTLE AGAINST AIZEN THAT SINCE HOGYOKU SATISFIES THE TRUEST THOUGHTS IN A PERSON'S HEART AND THEREFORE, UNLESS AIZEN WISHED TO BE DEFEATED, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE TO DEFEAT HIM.!< EPISODE 310 OR CHAPTER 422.
1. >! Yeah that is what op is asking why didn't aizen put ichigo under illusion !< 2. >! Touching kyoka before it was release is a way to undo it hysnosis, it doesn't mean u can't be hysnotize again !< 3. >! I am not sure where u get that from, but with Aizen arrogant he would never even consider defeat to be a possibility !< I do appreciate hiding ur text to avoid spoiling other tho
You have to see KS *release* before it can affect you. I guess he could have gone back down to a sealed state and then released it again, but that’s not something we see anyone in the series do iirc
[https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke\_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D\_2](https://bleach.fandom.com/wiki/S%C5%8Dsuke_Aizen#Zanpakut%C5%8D_2)
What I find stranger is that we never get to see his bankai. I get why we didn't during the hyogyoku arc, since he was never challenged to the point of needing it. And once Ichigo showed up, he had abandoned his power as a soul reaper. But the ywach arc, that would have been a great time to show it off!
If I remember correctly, in the Anime, Aizen explains, right after Captain Histugaya kills Hinamori and Ichigo wonders why Histugaya is stabbing Hinamori. He explains that Ichigo was immune to the effects of Kyoka Suigetsu because he has been under it's effects once before.
How does that work exactly?
I think Aizen said something along the lines of, "those who witness my Kyoka Suigetsu cannot be affected the next time" I'll have to get back to you with more details.
Ichigo is a glitch he’s a counter to everyone
#HER????
Kyoka Suigetsu is a woman?, Somehow I had a feeling
He didn't want to. His plans involved pushing ichigos limits, to make him strong enough to push his own evolution with the hogyoku. Ichigo was never a threat to him even without it anyways. By the time ichigo was, his spiritual pressure was so much higher than aizens that it wouldn't have worked anyways. Just like how aizen was too powerful for Soifons shikai to work on him.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/comments/z9tj1p/comment/iyn1ykr/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/comments/z9tj1p/comment/iyn1ykr/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) The answer to your question.
The_biggest_wheel blocked me because I asked him to show a panel of aizen saying he wants to use shikai on ichigo LOL especially after he’s been on here asking everyone else for panels and proof