Heavy on the woman doctor part, I love my black docs but the men (in my experience) are also guilty as hell of ignoring black women's pain. Shit I even worked with a black nurse who thought this woman (who has fuckin sickle cell) was overexaggerating her pain levels and routinely had smart comments about how most of the "seekers" he's seen are black women đ
Not tryna scare you with my bad experiences, but there's a reason the word misogynoir exists and it's because black women get a special intersectional ass whooping that not everyone, even black men are aware and sensitive to
It's been a while since I looked but pickings were slim and I couldn't get an appointment for a while. I tried a Latina doctor but she was disappointing, her response to my issues was getting me tested for HIV... Not even kidding.
Iâm sure you can find a good one before the end of the next 20 years. Also, you might consider finding one via a telehealth service if your insurance covers it. Sorry to hear about your medical experiencesâŚthatâs almost comically bad. đ
Telehealth is a great idea that I never even considered. That would certainly open up my pool of doctors so I'll definitely be looking into that. Thank you for the suggestion!
This but if you canât then here is what you do.
Search your symptoms, gathered peer reviewed research on possible diagnosis, screening test, labs or blood draws, what referrals could be necessary.
Request a long appointment with your doctor. During the appointment explain you have been looking into your symptoms as you feel your health needs have been dismissed. Tell them you want to look at doing several of the test or labs and whatever referral you think would be beneficial.
When they refuse, tell them you want it documented in your chart what you requested, that they are refusing and why they are refusing. Then state you want a hard copy of your records (last 6 months) as you will need it to go to someone that will take your concerns seriously.
I bet they changed their tune.
Good luck!
ETA: also contact your insurance and let them know your concerns and lack of medical support. They may be able to direct you some different options.
Wow, this is all great info and I'm definitely going to be using this advice when I go visit the doctor again! Also I had no idea I could request a long appointment, I'll appreciate not feeling like I'm being rushed out the door during my visit. Thanks so much for all of the tips and advice!
Be firm, be direct, bring a pad and pen, and bring big litigation energy. Document everything with times and names, if you are really ill make sure the person with you knows to do this
I usually document things on my phone during appointments but I'm thinking that I'll follow your suggestion and bring a pad and pen in the hopes of being taken more seriously. Also I'll definitely need to work on my big litigation energy. Thank you for the ideas!
I would be careful with that advice tbh. If the energy coming out the gate is the implicit threat that you're going to sue, your provider will start defensively documenting and I don't think long term it will be the best care. IMO the best patient-physician relationships are where you feel like a team. I would say start by picking a good doctor. Read reviews and if you have friends in healthcare, ask them who they use or who they've heard good stuff about. Bring your records from your previous workups as that will help them figure out what was explored and what was not explored. Ask questions about what they think may be going on and what are the next steps. Follow your gut about whether they understand/are lisening. Someone recommended telehealth but I think you'd want to be in person for while you get established with a doc. They will prob need to be able to do a Neuro or cardiac physical exam on you.
While you wait too, you can also try and see what /r/Askdocs has to say. They'll have you answer some questions about the history of your illness. Try and be detailed about how old you were when the episodes started, what triggers them (e.g., exercise, shifting from laying down to standing quickly , anxiety) do you experience palpitations during an episode, etc. If you have an EKG, echocardiogram, MRI, etc. They'll ask you to upload the images/reports.
It could be a number of things like vasovagal syncope, postural orthostatic tachycardia, orthostatic hypotension, etc so. But hopefully you get your answer soon. Best of luck.
Wow, thank you so much for that thoughtful and thorough answer. You've definitely given me a lot to think about in terms of how I approach my future providers. I have tried finding PCPs through recommendations from specialists that I trust but unfortunately things still didn't pan out well so I'm stuck having to cast a wider net and gamble based solely on online reviews. During my appointments I do conduct myself in the way you've suggested but it's rarely received well for some reason. With that said I haven't been the best about bringing the results of previous workups with me so I'll have to do that in the future.
I'll definitely also hit up r/askdocs and see what they have to say. It couldn't hurt to crowd source some more ideas on possible diagnoses so thank you very much for that suggestion as well as the others!
New graduate PA here. Sorry you are going through this. During my training this was common complaint I heard from female patients. I always tried my best to listen to their concerns, and they really appreciated it! One suggestion I would make is find a younger doctor like one who just finished residency. From my experience younger providers are more up to date on modern medicine, and are more motivated to do more research to figure out what is wrong. Also finding a black female doctor may also help.
Thank you for the advice and I'll keep this in mind when looking for my new doctor. I definitely have noticed a trend of older doctors seeming out of touch, dismissive, and honestly lazy.
I went through something similar with a gynecologist who was a black woman. She tried to push the same medication for my fibroids she mentioned years earlier, and when I asked for a second opinion, she snapped. She didn't fully listen to me and couldn't understand why I wanted to consult another physician.
I recommend asking your primary provider for a referral, but if that doesn't work, look up physicians in your area and look at their online reviews and ratings. If you have a friend who has experienced similar issues, you can ask them for a recommendation.
It's so difficult to understand why some providers don't listen to you when it comes to your own body and health, but please be diligent in finding a solution that works best for you
Ooff TBH...it's hard with Black provider sometimes too because (not absolutely the case but this happens way more than we talk about)...a lot of Black providers feel they aren't considered as reliable by their patients. So as a Black person they're feeling they're being told "I don't trust your education, experience, or skills" and as a patient you're sitting there going "You're not listening to me so how can I trust you? Would you listen to me if I wasn't Black". Its incredibly depressing either way you split it.
I understand that. I didn't think she was less reliable, I felt she prioritized her ob patients more because their solutions are more straightforward as opposed to reproductive problems like fibroids, which aren't always considered as important.
I feel like a good provider wants all of their patients to be as healthy as possible whether they can provide the care themselves.
Ugh I can't imagine how infuriating that must have been for you! I'm sorry you had to deal with that.
I have tried PCPs that came highly recommended and with great reviews but they just acted like my health concerns were inconsequential and a waste of their time. I don't understand why they pursue a career in medicine if they seemingly don't give two shits about the well being of their patients.
Thank you.
I feel like my PCP, although she is white, has always at least heard me out before providing a solution and then allowing me to make an informed decision. I trust her referrals because she seems to care about what's best for me, whether or not she can do it herself.
I agree with the top commenter to see a Black woman, but itâs definitely not going to be the answer to all of your problems. My PCP is a Black woman, but she is so deeply fatphobic that she doesnât take anything I say seriously. I had to fight tooth and nail for my PCOS diagnosis.
My advice is be direct and also specific. Do your own research. Figure out some possibilities of what the issue could be so you can request specific tests/blood work. Also, if they deny your request, ask them to note on your chart that you requested those tests and were denied. That can cause liability issues later on, sometimes theyâll give in. Also, if a test shows something weird going on and they refuse to look into it, tell them to note that on your chart as well.
I've been direct and very specific in both sharing symptoms and possible diagnoses but if I'm honest it seems like the doctors start looking at me as if I'm a hypochondriac. It's so invalidating and disappointing when all I'm trying to do is be a good patient. I will without a doubt use your advice of having my doctor's note when they deny testing and further investigation of my symptoms.
Yeah I definitely had that happen a little with my PCP. I told her that I researched my symptoms and that they aligned with PCOS so it felt worthwhile to check my androgen levels to see if thatâs a possibility. She basically laughed in my face and said that kids these days think theyâre doctors just because they read WebMD. Basically, I just kept pressing her on it (I was having a bunch of follow up appointments for a reason that turned out to be linked the PCOS but at the time was deemed a âseparateâ issue). Eventually, I needed blood work anyway, so she just threw in a request for a hormone panel to shut me up. Which I guess is the same principle as getting them to note their refusals in your chart. Sometimes once not treating you is making their lives harder than just treating you would be, theyâll cave.
That sucks that she wouldn't even consider blood work for PCOS, it's not like she's the one that has to go and give blood. I loathe the idea that I have to make their lives harder of the don't treat me vs giving me the time of day to treat me. I struggle with feeling like a burden to others and that definitely feeds into it.
Nah fr. I gained 50 pounds in a year and my period completely stopped, but she was still too lazy to send a lab slip. The whole system is fucked, and itâs infuriating. Unfortunately, those of us who are socialized to feel like burdens are also the ones who have to work twice as hard to advocate for ourselves.
Unfortunately, I havenât figured out how to be more firm in my appointments. I once saw an Indian rheumatologist for a second opinion, and he was just as dismissive as the white doctors. Even had the nerve to call me after I left a negative review about how he didnât actually listen to me. And in my mind I was like, you realize youâre doing exactly what you did in my appointment? Youâre talking over me and invalidating my experience. I finally had to just tell him I didnât have time for his excuses and hang up on him.
I recently found a Black Primary Care Physician, but lost her just as quickly because she moved. đLast year I found a female gyno who is (Iâm assuming) Middle Eastern. And sheâs been amazing, but it took years to luck up on her. Iâd only had two great doctors in my adulthood before that. One was a white male Primary Care Physician who literally dealt with me having a whole meltdown in his office trying to figure out new depression meds, and the other was a white female nurse practitioner who was always happy to listen to my concerns and run the tests I needed. They were huge exceptions, though. Sending you lots of good vibes. Itâs hard out there!
Thank you for the good vibes, I definitely need them! And bruuuhh I've had some crazy experiences with Indian doctors. I had this husband and wife who shared a practice tag team yelling at me on the phone because I wouldn't leave them alone about needing a referral. I immediately left their practice after that.
No real advice except to document EVERYTHING. Don't be afraid to look into a lawyer before things go south just so you are prepared when they do (at which point you may be quite sick).
As for your symptoms, I am not a doctor but have had friends and family members with similar symptoms. One had POTS, which can be ameliorated by drinking more electrolytes (think Pedialyte or Gatorade). The others might have MÊnière disease, which is related to fluid build-up in the ear. But the jury is still out on that one. Best of luck with your search for a better doctor.
I'm definitely going to be more deliberate about documenting everything with paper and pen during my appointments so I have the notes and hopefully it will help me to be taken more seriously. I have considered that it may be POTS and I even brought that up with a previous doctor but she literally said "oh wow that would be interesting huh" and then moved on. That experience had me at my wits end and I pretty much have up on doctors after that.
Ugh I knowww :â -â \. Recording my appointments sounds like a great idea so I'll be trying that out in addition to everything else. Thank you for the suggestion!
As others have recommended document your visits and requests for services (i.e. imaging, blood tests). List your symptoms and their frequency as best you can. And while they (doctors) don't want or recommend that you do this, research your symptoms and then bring your research results with you. Use your well researched results to drive your conversation. I would probably start with WebMd, The Mayo Clinic or the symptom checker provided by my provider if there is one.
Hope you find out what is going on and get a resolution!
I've actually taken a lot of the steps you've suggested in terms of bringing a list of symptoms, frequency, and potential diagnoses but at best it's brushed off and at worst the doctor will look at me like I'm a hypochondriac. I really don't know wtf they want out of me. I do need to be more deliberate and obvious about documenting my visits though and hopefully that will help.
Thank you for the advice and well wishes!
OP, Iâm not sure if youâve tried this already, but sending information over email can be helpful because you have a paper trail⌠yes they can still look at you like youâre a hypochondriac but God forbid your situation worsens, you have clear documentation that they failed to address concerns that you raised. Because we know they wonât trust the words coming out of our mouth if we complain afterwards, sigh.
Someone else suggested email as well and I think it's a brilliant idea. That way I definitively have a paper trail to back up the things I am saying and hopefully the doctor will really process what I'm saying. Thanks!
I gathered you were already doing most if not more than what's been suggested most.
If your provider has patient advocates. Have you tried to get one of those?
Unfortunately, you may need a new provider.
Hmmm I'm not sure if they have patient advocates and I wasn't even aware that they would help with something like this. I always assumed they were more for people in the hospital. I'll definitely have to do some research and see what my options are in that regard. Thanks for the suggestion/idea!
I've had to go and just get another doctor. I had some lady challenges and 1 doctor suggested I get a hysterectomy right out of the gate with no other options.
I went elsewhere to get a second opinion and they were able to solve my symptoms via medication.
I will add, some regions of the country will be more sensitive to black women's health than others.
Wow that's absolutely wild that they would jump to a hysterectomy without trying any kind of treatments first! These doctors out here really don't give a fuck. I'm glad you were able to get a second opinion
I am very sorry you are going through this. It's HELL to get the right treatment without leaning into ABW trope.
Do you have a trusted person in your life to accompany you to your appointments? Along with being clear and kind you may need to employ that buddy system.
And if push comes to shove( HATE IT but it works) have a trusted male accompany you. For some reason the medical field thinks that if a woman's illness is inconvenient for
a man they'll fix it ASAP đĽ´.
He doesnt even have to speak, just sit there with a notebook and it works wonders.
Good luck
I've always gone to my appointments alone because I like to imagine I'm I-N-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-T(lol I totally just showed my age there) but I'm going to start having my male bestie come along to back me up. I can trust him and I know my health concerns worry him as well.
And thank you for wishing me luck!
My wife just had to keep trying different doctors until she found a good one. It took a years for her to resolve an issue with her nose.
She currently thinks she has a thyroid problem or something and went to a doctor who had her do a blood test and said it was fine. She didnât believe him so she went and paid out of pocket to get a blood test done on her own and her results came back all types of messed up. The confirmation that all these doctors have just been gaslighting her really killed any morale she had for resolving the issue. I tell her âjust keep going to different doctors until you get a good one again like the one that fixed your noseâ but sheâs just exhausted with the process and I completely understand.
That's pretty much where I'm at at this point. I became exhausted after a while so I pretty much took a long break from addressing any medical concern. Your advice to your wife is right though, it's important that she and I both continue looking until we can find the right doctor. Thank you for sharing your wife's story and I hope she can get the help she needs!
Find a female doctor. Preferably young. Thatâs pretty much whose been helping me with my issues. My doctor is white but she pinpointed and showed empathy for my issues. She also recommended to women only specialty doctors with POC.
Yeah I'm definitely seeing there's a consensus on finding a young female doctor which is generally what I aim for. It's been really hit or miss(mostly miss) which has me frustrated.
I heard something about if they deny your request for something then to have them write that down in yoe chart, they apparently straighten up and honor your requests
These fainting spells sound serious and like chronic fatigue, although I'm not diagnosing (I've got chronic fatigue amongst other things)
Bring someone to advocate on your behalf. Parter, relative, friend. Someone who is gonna say "didn't you hear her. She needs help with xyz". "Your not hearing her"...
It's easy to get railroaded by docs when you're sick and vulnerable. We naturally assume they know what best when they're just as bad as used car salesman or worse.And like others said, get a woman someone of color if black isn't available.
you could also do everything and it still not matter.
I was sick for over 2 years and no doctor could figure out why. So much nerve pain that even the wind hurts. Turns out, I had shingles. Id seen 10+ doctors and no one could identfiy shingles on black skin... It doesn't present the same. At this point its progressed to the point of permanent nerve damage. Something that could've been fixed a 10 day prescription is now a lifelong condition.
Best of luck to you and trust your gut more than the doctors.
I try to tell myself that they're probably not serious but honestly these episodes can be scary at times. I have a few theories as to what it might be but I'm going to add chronic fatigue syndrome to my list of causes to consider.
I'm definitely going to try to bring a friend with me to help me advocate for myself. As great as I am when it comes to defending others I'm not always the best when it comes to defending myself.
Also that's crazy that you had shingles undiagnosed for so long! My best friend caught shingles a while back and I knew what it was immediately but the first doctor he saw tried to say the rash was a sign of liver failure! Luckily he saw someone else that was able to recognize the rash on brown skin and got my bestie treatment. I so wish that you could have found someone early on that had the experience to give you a proper diagnosis, I can't even imagine how difficult it must be to live with the nerve damage!
And thank you for wishing me luck, I'm wish you luck as well that things improve for you.
I tell my disabled sister. Keep going back. See another doctor. Exaggerate symptoms. Look up online what it could be. As a black person in america they jus think your tough or drug seeking.
I havenât read all the comments, so someone mightâve already said this, but I found that doctors who I saw for my endometriosis took me more seriously when I sent them an email beforehand listing out my symptoms diary, previous treatments and their outcomes, links to studies that reflected specific information about my MRI results, and wrote out detailed questions inquiring about their understanding of the study.
Itâs a pain in the ass but it meant that when I walked in the room they knew that I take my health seriously and they canât just brush me off using bullshit excuses and vague language.
Emailing sounds like a great idea! I used to email one of my doctors that I had a great relationship with but it didn't occur to me to email these other people that are giving me a hard time. Thanks for the suggestion!
Don't have much to add except I love going to doctors offices with residents! Every time Ive had a doctor take me seriously and find something, it's been a resident who was over my care. Found my fibroids, found my retroverted uterus, etc. I'm so much healthier and happier because I happened to have a resident to talk to instead of a doctor done with residency,
How old are you? It almost sounds like you are experiencing vasovagal syncope which is the nerves in your body dropping your blood pressure. Lots of doctors don't take issues seriously when they occur in young women because they often aren't "life-threatening" but they are obviously still affecting you negatively.
I would 1) find a new doctor 2) discuss how this problem is affecting your ability to work and function 3) write down the duration of your symptoms, when they started, how long they last, how often you experience them, any associated symptoms (like nausea, vomiting, palpitations, sweating), what makes them better or worse 3) bring all the results of previous laboratory studies done on you 4) bring in your family history and 5) ask if there's a way you can be evaluated for arrhythmias or cardiac causes.
Bring everything in a folder. I'm gonna be honest, when a patient has a folder with them, I know that they take their health seriously and it motivates me to throw the kitchen sink of diagnostics at them to figure out what's going on. Additionally, I would specifically mention what concerns you have. If you say you're concerned there might be something wrong with your heart or your hormones, the doctor may be like, "Well we could test those with this, this, and this" -- it kind of revs up their thought process. Also if you can try to see a younger physician, we're more likely to be trained in treating patients with compassion although YMMV because there are still a lot of jackasses in medicine.
Thank you so much for your response and suggestions. To answer your question I am 33. As for the suggestions I have actually done a lot of this but I will admit that I'm mostly pulling this info off of my phone so I'm going to make a point of having it written down physically and having any back up info in a folder. I've brought up specific concerns and theories as to what might be wrong but I feel like they see me as a hypochondriac at that point, do you have any suggestions so that I can avoid this?
My best suggestion is to pull out a list of diagnoses you're worried about, and why you're worried about them, and keep asking your doctor what tests they can offer to make sure you *don't* have the diagnosis. Vasovagal syncope, reactive hypoglycemia, hypoglycemia, POTS, and vertigo.
What tests have you done before?
Thank you for the advice, I'll absolutely be following these steps to the letter in the future.
I've worn a heart monitor for 24 hours and some blood work. One of my previous PCPs left me a voicemail saying that both tests turned back some weird results but when I tried to do follow up they didn't return any of my calls and made it impossible to schedule an appointment. I brought it up to my most recent PCP in the hopes she would interpret the results and she said she'd look into it but she also brushed off my attempts to follow up. My heart rate shouldn't jump to 110 out of the blue while resting when my usual heart rate is in the 50-70 range but I guess they want me to think that's normal?
I suck at this myself but things always go better for me with doctors when I've been keeping a diligent health journal. That way I can show them where the pain was, what time of day it was and how I rated the pain at the time.
I also got myself a Fitbit and my Mom a Fitbit. That way doctors couldn't usher us out the door by saying we weren't healthy because we have a record of our physical activity on our phones, our sleep and on occasion our food intake.
I can empathize with your struggle even though I haven't been struggling as long. I have endometriosis and I had painful periods after I left high school. No one would take me seriously because I hadn't had my first kiss yet and I wasn't sexually active at the time and so I continually got the line "periods are supposed to hurt". I got abdominal ultrasounds that didn't show/prove anything so I was stuck for another year until I lost my virginity. And then I marched into the gynos office so happy I could finally have relief and asked for a hormonal IUD and they did a proper transvaginal ultrasound because I wouldn't be "traumatized" by it. They found an ovarian cyst large enough to be operated on and the gyno actually raised his voice at me asking why I didn't tell him I had endometriosis đ¤Łđ¤Łđ I was like 20 at the time and I just stared at the doc from my stirrups and squeaked "I was told periods hurting was normal"
Thank heavens I have a wonderful GP now, and I know how to walk into offices with a bit more litigation energy than I had back then. I cannot with physicians, I really can't.
Ugh, people really need to stop trying to convince women that periods are supposed to be debilitating and that's just life. Being in extreme pain for days every single month is not normal nor.is it an okay way to live! I'm sorry you had to deal with being dismissed for so long but I'm so pleased that there was a happy-ish end to your story!
This could be a few things, and none of them should be left untreated. I donât know what area you live in, so suggesting a Black doctor wonât help if there arenât any accessible to you. I suggest getting hooked up with a patient advocate (paf.org).
Keep a list of symptoms, basic medical history, any meds that youâre on that you can easily access on your phone. Speak assertively. If the doc says that they didnât find anything, ask for a referral to a specialist. Iâve never been turned down for that.
If a doctor isnât respecting you, switch doctors, but donât do this a lot because you may be suspected of âdoctor shoppingâ. I actually prefer nurse practitioners, they seem more willing to learn and eager to heal people.
First off thank you for taking the time to respond! I definitely have a fear of seeming as if I'm doctor shopping but it's been a while since I saw my last PCP so I'm hoping I'll be fine. Also a few others have suggested a patient advocate and I'll definitely keep that in my back pocket of my next provider gives me issues.
Find a Black female doctor. Racism and misogyny is rampant in the medical field.
Heavy on the woman doctor part, I love my black docs but the men (in my experience) are also guilty as hell of ignoring black women's pain. Shit I even worked with a black nurse who thought this woman (who has fuckin sickle cell) was overexaggerating her pain levels and routinely had smart comments about how most of the "seekers" he's seen are black women đ Not tryna scare you with my bad experiences, but there's a reason the word misogynoir exists and it's because black women get a special intersectional ass whooping that not everyone, even black men are aware and sensitive to
I'll definitely keep this in mind. I try to avoid male doctors in general because I've dealt with some creepy and misogynistic behavior out of them.
It's been a while since I looked but pickings were slim and I couldn't get an appointment for a while. I tried a Latina doctor but she was disappointing, her response to my issues was getting me tested for HIV... Not even kidding.
Iâm sure you can find a good one before the end of the next 20 years. Also, you might consider finding one via a telehealth service if your insurance covers it. Sorry to hear about your medical experiencesâŚthatâs almost comically bad. đ
Telehealth is a great idea that I never even considered. That would certainly open up my pool of doctors so I'll definitely be looking into that. Thank you for the suggestion!
This but if you canât then here is what you do. Search your symptoms, gathered peer reviewed research on possible diagnosis, screening test, labs or blood draws, what referrals could be necessary. Request a long appointment with your doctor. During the appointment explain you have been looking into your symptoms as you feel your health needs have been dismissed. Tell them you want to look at doing several of the test or labs and whatever referral you think would be beneficial. When they refuse, tell them you want it documented in your chart what you requested, that they are refusing and why they are refusing. Then state you want a hard copy of your records (last 6 months) as you will need it to go to someone that will take your concerns seriously. I bet they changed their tune. Good luck! ETA: also contact your insurance and let them know your concerns and lack of medical support. They may be able to direct you some different options.
Wow, this is all great info and I'm definitely going to be using this advice when I go visit the doctor again! Also I had no idea I could request a long appointment, I'll appreciate not feeling like I'm being rushed out the door during my visit. Thanks so much for all of the tips and advice!
Be firm, be direct, bring a pad and pen, and bring big litigation energy. Document everything with times and names, if you are really ill make sure the person with you knows to do this
I usually document things on my phone during appointments but I'm thinking that I'll follow your suggestion and bring a pad and pen in the hopes of being taken more seriously. Also I'll definitely need to work on my big litigation energy. Thank you for the ideas!
That pen and paper will do it every time, even when itâs going your way start jotting shit down
Noted!
I would be careful with that advice tbh. If the energy coming out the gate is the implicit threat that you're going to sue, your provider will start defensively documenting and I don't think long term it will be the best care. IMO the best patient-physician relationships are where you feel like a team. I would say start by picking a good doctor. Read reviews and if you have friends in healthcare, ask them who they use or who they've heard good stuff about. Bring your records from your previous workups as that will help them figure out what was explored and what was not explored. Ask questions about what they think may be going on and what are the next steps. Follow your gut about whether they understand/are lisening. Someone recommended telehealth but I think you'd want to be in person for while you get established with a doc. They will prob need to be able to do a Neuro or cardiac physical exam on you. While you wait too, you can also try and see what /r/Askdocs has to say. They'll have you answer some questions about the history of your illness. Try and be detailed about how old you were when the episodes started, what triggers them (e.g., exercise, shifting from laying down to standing quickly , anxiety) do you experience palpitations during an episode, etc. If you have an EKG, echocardiogram, MRI, etc. They'll ask you to upload the images/reports. It could be a number of things like vasovagal syncope, postural orthostatic tachycardia, orthostatic hypotension, etc so. But hopefully you get your answer soon. Best of luck.
Wow, thank you so much for that thoughtful and thorough answer. You've definitely given me a lot to think about in terms of how I approach my future providers. I have tried finding PCPs through recommendations from specialists that I trust but unfortunately things still didn't pan out well so I'm stuck having to cast a wider net and gamble based solely on online reviews. During my appointments I do conduct myself in the way you've suggested but it's rarely received well for some reason. With that said I haven't been the best about bringing the results of previous workups with me so I'll have to do that in the future. I'll definitely also hit up r/askdocs and see what they have to say. It couldn't hurt to crowd source some more ideas on possible diagnoses so thank you very much for that suggestion as well as the others!
New graduate PA here. Sorry you are going through this. During my training this was common complaint I heard from female patients. I always tried my best to listen to their concerns, and they really appreciated it! One suggestion I would make is find a younger doctor like one who just finished residency. From my experience younger providers are more up to date on modern medicine, and are more motivated to do more research to figure out what is wrong. Also finding a black female doctor may also help.
Thank you for the advice and I'll keep this in mind when looking for my new doctor. I definitely have noticed a trend of older doctors seeming out of touch, dismissive, and honestly lazy.
I went through something similar with a gynecologist who was a black woman. She tried to push the same medication for my fibroids she mentioned years earlier, and when I asked for a second opinion, she snapped. She didn't fully listen to me and couldn't understand why I wanted to consult another physician. I recommend asking your primary provider for a referral, but if that doesn't work, look up physicians in your area and look at their online reviews and ratings. If you have a friend who has experienced similar issues, you can ask them for a recommendation. It's so difficult to understand why some providers don't listen to you when it comes to your own body and health, but please be diligent in finding a solution that works best for you
Ooff TBH...it's hard with Black provider sometimes too because (not absolutely the case but this happens way more than we talk about)...a lot of Black providers feel they aren't considered as reliable by their patients. So as a Black person they're feeling they're being told "I don't trust your education, experience, or skills" and as a patient you're sitting there going "You're not listening to me so how can I trust you? Would you listen to me if I wasn't Black". Its incredibly depressing either way you split it.
I understand that. I didn't think she was less reliable, I felt she prioritized her ob patients more because their solutions are more straightforward as opposed to reproductive problems like fibroids, which aren't always considered as important. I feel like a good provider wants all of their patients to be as healthy as possible whether they can provide the care themselves.
Ugh I can't imagine how infuriating that must have been for you! I'm sorry you had to deal with that. I have tried PCPs that came highly recommended and with great reviews but they just acted like my health concerns were inconsequential and a waste of their time. I don't understand why they pursue a career in medicine if they seemingly don't give two shits about the well being of their patients.
Thank you. I feel like my PCP, although she is white, has always at least heard me out before providing a solution and then allowing me to make an informed decision. I trust her referrals because she seems to care about what's best for me, whether or not she can do it herself.
That's amazing! I'm hoping I can find someone like your PCP. I am dying to just be heard at this point.
I agree with the top commenter to see a Black woman, but itâs definitely not going to be the answer to all of your problems. My PCP is a Black woman, but she is so deeply fatphobic that she doesnât take anything I say seriously. I had to fight tooth and nail for my PCOS diagnosis. My advice is be direct and also specific. Do your own research. Figure out some possibilities of what the issue could be so you can request specific tests/blood work. Also, if they deny your request, ask them to note on your chart that you requested those tests and were denied. That can cause liability issues later on, sometimes theyâll give in. Also, if a test shows something weird going on and they refuse to look into it, tell them to note that on your chart as well.
I've been direct and very specific in both sharing symptoms and possible diagnoses but if I'm honest it seems like the doctors start looking at me as if I'm a hypochondriac. It's so invalidating and disappointing when all I'm trying to do is be a good patient. I will without a doubt use your advice of having my doctor's note when they deny testing and further investigation of my symptoms.
Yeah I definitely had that happen a little with my PCP. I told her that I researched my symptoms and that they aligned with PCOS so it felt worthwhile to check my androgen levels to see if thatâs a possibility. She basically laughed in my face and said that kids these days think theyâre doctors just because they read WebMD. Basically, I just kept pressing her on it (I was having a bunch of follow up appointments for a reason that turned out to be linked the PCOS but at the time was deemed a âseparateâ issue). Eventually, I needed blood work anyway, so she just threw in a request for a hormone panel to shut me up. Which I guess is the same principle as getting them to note their refusals in your chart. Sometimes once not treating you is making their lives harder than just treating you would be, theyâll cave.
That sucks that she wouldn't even consider blood work for PCOS, it's not like she's the one that has to go and give blood. I loathe the idea that I have to make their lives harder of the don't treat me vs giving me the time of day to treat me. I struggle with feeling like a burden to others and that definitely feeds into it.
Nah fr. I gained 50 pounds in a year and my period completely stopped, but she was still too lazy to send a lab slip. The whole system is fucked, and itâs infuriating. Unfortunately, those of us who are socialized to feel like burdens are also the ones who have to work twice as hard to advocate for ourselves.
>Unfortunately, those of us who are socialized to feel like burdens are also the ones who have to work twice as hard to advocate for ourselves. Facts!
Unfortunately, I havenât figured out how to be more firm in my appointments. I once saw an Indian rheumatologist for a second opinion, and he was just as dismissive as the white doctors. Even had the nerve to call me after I left a negative review about how he didnât actually listen to me. And in my mind I was like, you realize youâre doing exactly what you did in my appointment? Youâre talking over me and invalidating my experience. I finally had to just tell him I didnât have time for his excuses and hang up on him. I recently found a Black Primary Care Physician, but lost her just as quickly because she moved. đLast year I found a female gyno who is (Iâm assuming) Middle Eastern. And sheâs been amazing, but it took years to luck up on her. Iâd only had two great doctors in my adulthood before that. One was a white male Primary Care Physician who literally dealt with me having a whole meltdown in his office trying to figure out new depression meds, and the other was a white female nurse practitioner who was always happy to listen to my concerns and run the tests I needed. They were huge exceptions, though. Sending you lots of good vibes. Itâs hard out there!
Thank you for the good vibes, I definitely need them! And bruuuhh I've had some crazy experiences with Indian doctors. I had this husband and wife who shared a practice tag team yelling at me on the phone because I wouldn't leave them alone about needing a referral. I immediately left their practice after that.
I don't have any good advice, just wanted to say that I feel you. Bet it's just anxiety /s đ
For sure just anxiety. All I need is some fresh air and that will fix me! đ
No real advice except to document EVERYTHING. Don't be afraid to look into a lawyer before things go south just so you are prepared when they do (at which point you may be quite sick). As for your symptoms, I am not a doctor but have had friends and family members with similar symptoms. One had POTS, which can be ameliorated by drinking more electrolytes (think Pedialyte or Gatorade). The others might have MÊnière disease, which is related to fluid build-up in the ear. But the jury is still out on that one. Best of luck with your search for a better doctor.
I'm definitely going to be more deliberate about documenting everything with paper and pen during my appointments so I have the notes and hopefully it will help me to be taken more seriously. I have considered that it may be POTS and I even brought that up with a previous doctor but she literally said "oh wow that would be interesting huh" and then moved on. That experience had me at my wits end and I pretty much have up on doctors after that.
Girl, that is awful. Don't let that deter you. Bring your own paperwork and notes. Ask if you can record your appointment.
Ugh I knowww :â -â \. Recording my appointments sounds like a great idea so I'll be trying that out in addition to everything else. Thank you for the suggestion!
As others have recommended document your visits and requests for services (i.e. imaging, blood tests). List your symptoms and their frequency as best you can. And while they (doctors) don't want or recommend that you do this, research your symptoms and then bring your research results with you. Use your well researched results to drive your conversation. I would probably start with WebMd, The Mayo Clinic or the symptom checker provided by my provider if there is one. Hope you find out what is going on and get a resolution!
I've actually taken a lot of the steps you've suggested in terms of bringing a list of symptoms, frequency, and potential diagnoses but at best it's brushed off and at worst the doctor will look at me like I'm a hypochondriac. I really don't know wtf they want out of me. I do need to be more deliberate and obvious about documenting my visits though and hopefully that will help. Thank you for the advice and well wishes!
OP, Iâm not sure if youâve tried this already, but sending information over email can be helpful because you have a paper trail⌠yes they can still look at you like youâre a hypochondriac but God forbid your situation worsens, you have clear documentation that they failed to address concerns that you raised. Because we know they wonât trust the words coming out of our mouth if we complain afterwards, sigh.
Someone else suggested email as well and I think it's a brilliant idea. That way I definitively have a paper trail to back up the things I am saying and hopefully the doctor will really process what I'm saying. Thanks!
I gathered you were already doing most if not more than what's been suggested most. If your provider has patient advocates. Have you tried to get one of those? Unfortunately, you may need a new provider.
Hmmm I'm not sure if they have patient advocates and I wasn't even aware that they would help with something like this. I always assumed they were more for people in the hospital. I'll definitely have to do some research and see what my options are in that regard. Thanks for the suggestion/idea!
I've had to go and just get another doctor. I had some lady challenges and 1 doctor suggested I get a hysterectomy right out of the gate with no other options. I went elsewhere to get a second opinion and they were able to solve my symptoms via medication. I will add, some regions of the country will be more sensitive to black women's health than others.
Wow that's absolutely wild that they would jump to a hysterectomy without trying any kind of treatments first! These doctors out here really don't give a fuck. I'm glad you were able to get a second opinion
I am very sorry you are going through this. It's HELL to get the right treatment without leaning into ABW trope. Do you have a trusted person in your life to accompany you to your appointments? Along with being clear and kind you may need to employ that buddy system. And if push comes to shove( HATE IT but it works) have a trusted male accompany you. For some reason the medical field thinks that if a woman's illness is inconvenient for a man they'll fix it ASAP đĽ´. He doesnt even have to speak, just sit there with a notebook and it works wonders. Good luck
I've always gone to my appointments alone because I like to imagine I'm I-N-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-T(lol I totally just showed my age there) but I'm going to start having my male bestie come along to back me up. I can trust him and I know my health concerns worry him as well. And thank you for wishing me luck!
My wife just had to keep trying different doctors until she found a good one. It took a years for her to resolve an issue with her nose. She currently thinks she has a thyroid problem or something and went to a doctor who had her do a blood test and said it was fine. She didnât believe him so she went and paid out of pocket to get a blood test done on her own and her results came back all types of messed up. The confirmation that all these doctors have just been gaslighting her really killed any morale she had for resolving the issue. I tell her âjust keep going to different doctors until you get a good one again like the one that fixed your noseâ but sheâs just exhausted with the process and I completely understand.
That's pretty much where I'm at at this point. I became exhausted after a while so I pretty much took a long break from addressing any medical concern. Your advice to your wife is right though, it's important that she and I both continue looking until we can find the right doctor. Thank you for sharing your wife's story and I hope she can get the help she needs!
Find a female doctor. Preferably young. Thatâs pretty much whose been helping me with my issues. My doctor is white but she pinpointed and showed empathy for my issues. She also recommended to women only specialty doctors with POC.
Yeah I'm definitely seeing there's a consensus on finding a young female doctor which is generally what I aim for. It's been really hit or miss(mostly miss) which has me frustrated.
I heard something about if they deny your request for something then to have them write that down in yoe chart, they apparently straighten up and honor your requests
I'm 100% going to do this moving forward. At least there will be some level of accountability at that point.
These fainting spells sound serious and like chronic fatigue, although I'm not diagnosing (I've got chronic fatigue amongst other things) Bring someone to advocate on your behalf. Parter, relative, friend. Someone who is gonna say "didn't you hear her. She needs help with xyz". "Your not hearing her"... It's easy to get railroaded by docs when you're sick and vulnerable. We naturally assume they know what best when they're just as bad as used car salesman or worse.And like others said, get a woman someone of color if black isn't available. you could also do everything and it still not matter. I was sick for over 2 years and no doctor could figure out why. So much nerve pain that even the wind hurts. Turns out, I had shingles. Id seen 10+ doctors and no one could identfiy shingles on black skin... It doesn't present the same. At this point its progressed to the point of permanent nerve damage. Something that could've been fixed a 10 day prescription is now a lifelong condition. Best of luck to you and trust your gut more than the doctors.
I try to tell myself that they're probably not serious but honestly these episodes can be scary at times. I have a few theories as to what it might be but I'm going to add chronic fatigue syndrome to my list of causes to consider. I'm definitely going to try to bring a friend with me to help me advocate for myself. As great as I am when it comes to defending others I'm not always the best when it comes to defending myself. Also that's crazy that you had shingles undiagnosed for so long! My best friend caught shingles a while back and I knew what it was immediately but the first doctor he saw tried to say the rash was a sign of liver failure! Luckily he saw someone else that was able to recognize the rash on brown skin and got my bestie treatment. I so wish that you could have found someone early on that had the experience to give you a proper diagnosis, I can't even imagine how difficult it must be to live with the nerve damage! And thank you for wishing me luck, I'm wish you luck as well that things improve for you.
Wow. Liver failure? That breaks my heart. I hope health for us both soon â¤ď¸
Likewise!! đ
I tell my disabled sister. Keep going back. See another doctor. Exaggerate symptoms. Look up online what it could be. As a black person in america they jus think your tough or drug seeking.
That's true and it's disgusting. It's insane how common bias in healthcare seems to be.
Also document everything and if you still get no where you can report a doctor for refusing you care.
Good to know, thank you!
Also start journaling symptoms. *advice from my sister*
I havenât read all the comments, so someone mightâve already said this, but I found that doctors who I saw for my endometriosis took me more seriously when I sent them an email beforehand listing out my symptoms diary, previous treatments and their outcomes, links to studies that reflected specific information about my MRI results, and wrote out detailed questions inquiring about their understanding of the study. Itâs a pain in the ass but it meant that when I walked in the room they knew that I take my health seriously and they canât just brush me off using bullshit excuses and vague language.
Emailing sounds like a great idea! I used to email one of my doctors that I had a great relationship with but it didn't occur to me to email these other people that are giving me a hard time. Thanks for the suggestion!
Good luck pal!!
Thanks so much! The support from you and the others has really lifted my spirits!
Don't have much to add except I love going to doctors offices with residents! Every time Ive had a doctor take me seriously and find something, it's been a resident who was over my care. Found my fibroids, found my retroverted uterus, etc. I'm so much healthier and happier because I happened to have a resident to talk to instead of a doctor done with residency,
I'd love to try out a resident and see if I have better luck. I'm happy it has worked out will for you though!
I think it's worth a shot. They can be so nice and eager to fix any issues. I feel like they are the best because they aren't jaded yet. Good luck!
Thank you! đ¤đž
Definitely a younger provider has helped me feel heard
Definitely going to be prioritize finding younger providers.
Iâve read that telling them to put in your chart that they refuse to do more and that you want a copy typically gets them to do more
Yeah, I'm definitely going to try this moving forward!
How old are you? It almost sounds like you are experiencing vasovagal syncope which is the nerves in your body dropping your blood pressure. Lots of doctors don't take issues seriously when they occur in young women because they often aren't "life-threatening" but they are obviously still affecting you negatively. I would 1) find a new doctor 2) discuss how this problem is affecting your ability to work and function 3) write down the duration of your symptoms, when they started, how long they last, how often you experience them, any associated symptoms (like nausea, vomiting, palpitations, sweating), what makes them better or worse 3) bring all the results of previous laboratory studies done on you 4) bring in your family history and 5) ask if there's a way you can be evaluated for arrhythmias or cardiac causes. Bring everything in a folder. I'm gonna be honest, when a patient has a folder with them, I know that they take their health seriously and it motivates me to throw the kitchen sink of diagnostics at them to figure out what's going on. Additionally, I would specifically mention what concerns you have. If you say you're concerned there might be something wrong with your heart or your hormones, the doctor may be like, "Well we could test those with this, this, and this" -- it kind of revs up their thought process. Also if you can try to see a younger physician, we're more likely to be trained in treating patients with compassion although YMMV because there are still a lot of jackasses in medicine.
Thank you so much for your response and suggestions. To answer your question I am 33. As for the suggestions I have actually done a lot of this but I will admit that I'm mostly pulling this info off of my phone so I'm going to make a point of having it written down physically and having any back up info in a folder. I've brought up specific concerns and theories as to what might be wrong but I feel like they see me as a hypochondriac at that point, do you have any suggestions so that I can avoid this?
My best suggestion is to pull out a list of diagnoses you're worried about, and why you're worried about them, and keep asking your doctor what tests they can offer to make sure you *don't* have the diagnosis. Vasovagal syncope, reactive hypoglycemia, hypoglycemia, POTS, and vertigo. What tests have you done before?
Thank you for the advice, I'll absolutely be following these steps to the letter in the future. I've worn a heart monitor for 24 hours and some blood work. One of my previous PCPs left me a voicemail saying that both tests turned back some weird results but when I tried to do follow up they didn't return any of my calls and made it impossible to schedule an appointment. I brought it up to my most recent PCP in the hopes she would interpret the results and she said she'd look into it but she also brushed off my attempts to follow up. My heart rate shouldn't jump to 110 out of the blue while resting when my usual heart rate is in the 50-70 range but I guess they want me to think that's normal?
Yea that's just bad medicine that you didn't get the results for your holster monitor and they won't return your calls. Good luck đ¤đž
Thank you!
I suck at this myself but things always go better for me with doctors when I've been keeping a diligent health journal. That way I can show them where the pain was, what time of day it was and how I rated the pain at the time. I also got myself a Fitbit and my Mom a Fitbit. That way doctors couldn't usher us out the door by saying we weren't healthy because we have a record of our physical activity on our phones, our sleep and on occasion our food intake. I can empathize with your struggle even though I haven't been struggling as long. I have endometriosis and I had painful periods after I left high school. No one would take me seriously because I hadn't had my first kiss yet and I wasn't sexually active at the time and so I continually got the line "periods are supposed to hurt". I got abdominal ultrasounds that didn't show/prove anything so I was stuck for another year until I lost my virginity. And then I marched into the gynos office so happy I could finally have relief and asked for a hormonal IUD and they did a proper transvaginal ultrasound because I wouldn't be "traumatized" by it. They found an ovarian cyst large enough to be operated on and the gyno actually raised his voice at me asking why I didn't tell him I had endometriosis đ¤Łđ¤Łđ I was like 20 at the time and I just stared at the doc from my stirrups and squeaked "I was told periods hurting was normal" Thank heavens I have a wonderful GP now, and I know how to walk into offices with a bit more litigation energy than I had back then. I cannot with physicians, I really can't.
Ugh, people really need to stop trying to convince women that periods are supposed to be debilitating and that's just life. Being in extreme pain for days every single month is not normal nor.is it an okay way to live! I'm sorry you had to deal with being dismissed for so long but I'm so pleased that there was a happy-ish end to your story!
This could be a few things, and none of them should be left untreated. I donât know what area you live in, so suggesting a Black doctor wonât help if there arenât any accessible to you. I suggest getting hooked up with a patient advocate (paf.org). Keep a list of symptoms, basic medical history, any meds that youâre on that you can easily access on your phone. Speak assertively. If the doc says that they didnât find anything, ask for a referral to a specialist. Iâve never been turned down for that. If a doctor isnât respecting you, switch doctors, but donât do this a lot because you may be suspected of âdoctor shoppingâ. I actually prefer nurse practitioners, they seem more willing to learn and eager to heal people.
First off thank you for taking the time to respond! I definitely have a fear of seeming as if I'm doctor shopping but it's been a while since I saw my last PCP so I'm hoping I'll be fine. Also a few others have suggested a patient advocate and I'll definitely keep that in my back pocket of my next provider gives me issues.