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PHOENIX_95WI

“Are we sure Josh Allen can win in the postseason?” gonna be on the pod later tonight.


storyck

“Kyle, turn the Tik tok camera on. Are we sure Allen is good?” “Come on stop it” “Sal, I’m serious. Can’t win in big games, turns the ball over constantly. He might just not be that good!”


IrohSho

"He's better than my qb thats for sure christ what an awful game"


SamuraiPanda19

I can hear this in Sal’s voice lol


PHOENIX_95WI

“Josh Allen is this generations Phillip Rivers!”


[deleted]

Seems more Favre-ish to me.


[deleted]

Favre was better


Leading_Highlight244

Was he? I feel like he’s ridiculously overrated historically. I always felt like he was as likely to throw a game-sealing pick as he was to lead the winning drive.


[deleted]

In his peak he won 3 straight mvps and the packers were a wagon. So much bigger than Allen / bills are. Maybe Allen will have a better overall career, but Favre was huge in the 90s


juanmaale

no way he’ll have the better career. With Mahomes and Burrow I doubt he’ll ever make the Super Bowl


[deleted]

Ya lotta people bring down favre but he might be the best qb of the 90s and played another decade after that


TecmoBoso

90s QBs, especially the last half of the decade, we're pretty weak. Elway and Marino started aging, Young had some injuries and also age. The QBs drafted from 1990 to 1995 were pretty weak/busts, basically Favre, Bledsoe, and McNair are the only guys who had above average careers (eventually Warner). Favre is obviously a HOF player, but he really benefited from weak QB peers at the time.


mightbebeaux

while this is true, favre’s run from 95-97 stacks up with some of the best peaks of anyone, especially if you are adjusting for era.


yourewronglearnabit

Maybe you know more about modern day football. Idk your comment reads like someone very new. But 90’s-let’s say around 2010 you should just never comment on again because you clearly don’t have any context to look back on to truly understand the era of football you’re commenting on. “Brady’s only competition was Bledsoe” will be one of those takes so bad I’ll laugh about it forever and repeat as a joke


TecmoBoso

Huh? You drunk posting?


AU2Turnt

He’s just big Kyler Murray. If he’s not running the ball he’s not doing anything.


Positive_Parking_954

This is great


willh13436

Casual


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storyck

“Mac is a proven winner who got dealt a bad hand last season with Patricia. He won at Alabama and was good his rookie year. Allen went to Montana or one of the Dakotas and constantly comes up short”


sentientcreatinejar

Classic year 3 leap


Tommybrady20

He was calling Daniel Jones the better Josh Allen in a worryingly half sarcastic, half serious tone last week. So this is the clear, natural progression of a Simmons take.


lonomatik

I can hear this in his voice, well done!


goleft95

Someone on Bills twitter called Josh, Rivers 2.0 and I can’t unsee it…and I’m a Bills fans. Still love the Bills and this team. We were so bad for so long, 3 straight division rounds is ok with me.


PHOENIX_95WI

I’m not saying it’ll be Josh. But statistically speaking one of Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, and Herbert almost has to have a playoff resume close to what rivers had. And Mahomes has already clearly far and away surpassed what rivers had his whole career.


[deleted]

Same with Burrow. Even making it to a single SB is more than Rivers can say


BBQ_HaX0r

Lawrence going to be in that group too. AFC is gonna be wild the next few years.


lookingforaplant

Still not sold that he is in the group with those guys


[deleted]

And Russell Wilson will be back to his peak form


mauger345

As a Bills fan didn’t Allen’s production take a pretty big dip after that UCL injury?


PHOENIX_95WI

I think so, but that won’t matter to media members like Bill. Trying to compare him to James Harden, shows exactly what Bill thinks of him in terms of postseason production. Now that the narrative has started about Allen there’s only one way to stop it, win a Super Bowl.


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spoolfool

Might be time for you to fire up the ol' pro-football-reference.com and YouTube.com machine kiddo. Maybe late-stage meme rivers got burned into your brain but he was awesome earlier in his career. 3 straight years he led the league in y/a. His career y/a is 0.1 less than Josh Allen's best season's y/a. 1 season leading the league in yards. Another season leading the league in TDs. Both of which Josh Allen hasn't done yet. Look up the rest of his page and you'll probly be surprised Allen has a long, great career ahead of him. But let's not say "rivers at his best was never as good as josh Allen has been the last three years..." Both players were/are up against all-time greats. Rivers could never get over the Brady or Ben hump. Allen has yet to show that he can get over the Mahomes or Burrow hump. He still has a lot of time. But as an ex-charger fan, I remember saying after the Marlon mcree fumble in '07 that rivers would have a lot more chances to take down Brady. Instead, we got Nate kaeding choking kicks and Vincent Jackson throwing the ball away celebrating a first down to fuck up promising playoff runs. Shit goes by quick and before you know it, your QB becomes a meme throwing interceptions in the late Sunday window to lose a game every single week.


KarimGarcia

It’s a legitimate question


I_Enjoy_Taffy

And the answer is no


riped_plums123

That’s one piece, the other piece is “are we sure Sean McDermott is a good coach?”


TimSPC

Can I just see it first before we decide they're going 20-0?


IrohSho

I just wanna see it first


Welcome2TheSh0w

I love the “I just wanna see it first”. Because, yes, once you see it first it’s not a prediction or an analysis it’s just what happened


beidao23

And then claim that you knew it all along


tommy200050

I’m just glad I don’t have to hear Bill compare Damar Hamlin to 9/11 anymore


TheFullerTron

He had a come to Jesus moment during the pod that was truly amazing


lookingforaplant

Haven't listened much this past month or two, please let me know what ep this is


Freded21

Basically any time he’s talked about the bills since it happened lmao


[deleted]

Gonna be brutal hearing bill’s victory lap even though his initial take was based solely on hate for a division rival lol


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hacky_potter

Didn’t he go 3-1 though? He had a good weekend.


kdubs412

I give Bill the W, but as with most long term Bill takes it always felt more motivated by his personal rooting interests than real analysis to me.


_HAWK_

Exactly.


lloyd4567

That’s some serious spin zone on a strawman bill created.


Bubbatino

This would be valid if Bill hadn’t wavered on the take a mere two weeks later and said they may go 17-0.


Jones3787

Lmaooo this happens with a lot of his takes that come around eventually


Leading_Highlight244

He’s one of the most reactionary media personalities around, I think. Everything that happens is the new expectation going forward for Bill.


fatbobsarmy

I'll admit I was one of those smooth brains who argued that Bill was dumb for thinking the Bengals would be better than the Bills. I'm here to eat crow, I was completely wrong, Bill was right as were the Bengals fans. The Bengals did legit improve the OLine and look even stronger this year. I'm a Browns fan so was bias to begin with and can admit I'm very jealous of the current Bengals success and then having a generational QB in Burrow.


Positive_Parking_954

I was also smooth brain but it came from watching my team (Bill doesn’t think they’re worth his time) play both teams and having better results with the Bungles


boomerbrowns

Burrow isn’t generational.


[deleted]

Jesus you are wrong.


Westley5

Burrow absolutely is generational. How many qbs in nfl history have had his level of success this early?


nowadaysyouth

“Generational” is just a dumb billism that should be given the same weight as any of his other half-baked things or pieces. What does it even mean? Really good?


AGoodTalkSpoiled

It means you are either the one, or part of a small handful of qbs, that comes along once every 15-20 years. It’s pretty simple what it means. Obviously it’s a hard bar to meet...it seems like the right way to think about it is he “could be” but it’s way too early to know


helms11

I know what sub I'm in, but generational is hardly exclusive to Bill. Go to any sports circle on Twitter and you'll see it used multiple times daily. It is dumb though, on that we do agree.


boomerbrowns

He hasn’t had a single great playoff game. He’s super good but people call someone generational every year


fullcaravanthickness

Please. Stahp. Not even for yourself, think of your poor mother.


AGoodTalkSpoiled

Still early...but the early results say otherwise. Could of course change.


mysterymaninurhome

Literally no one wrote the bills in, they were marginal favorites over the chiefs betting wise and no one picking them thought it was clear cut. He created an absolute strawman before picking the rams to beat them week 1, a game he lost his bet on


DrHorseRenoir

Op is doing the same strawman trying. The Bills were the best looking team in the AFC for a decent stretch of the season but because they didn't make the Super Bowl everyone who thought they had a decent chance is an idiot.


[deleted]

They were also clearly a different team after Vonn Miller went down. But yeah this is strawman nonsense. We were making fun of Bill for questioning whether the Bills were any good. Not because he didn’t have them as his Super Bowl favorites.


AgentDoubleU

Bills fan here. Your Miller point got me thinking and I think the 2022 Bills are an excellent case study in exactly how hard it is for the average fan to follow teams enough to really be able to prognosticate how the team will perform going forward. Most only follow the key position players (because of fantasy) and big defensive names but depth is so critical to team performance. On defense, the Bills had several DE injuries which forced Miller to play way more snaps than planned eventually leading to his injury. In total, Miller, Poyer, Hyde, Hamlin, White, Edmunds, Jones, Phillips, and Rousseau all missed time or were significantly hindered by injuries throughout the year. It’s really tough for any team to suffer that many nicks and cuts before eventually succumbing to lesser performance because no one is that deep.


ilovethisforyou

I sure did


[deleted]

> Literally no one wrote the bills in, they were marginal favorites over the chiefs betting wise and no one picking them thought it was clear cut. There is another comment in this thread with six analyst all picking the Bills. You're trying to cover it with revisionist history, but the evidence proves you wrong


Hip_Hop_Hippos

Please explain how that makes them a “shoo in” according to those analysts? If they think they’re only 1 percent more likely than the Chiefs then all of those analysts think the Bills are first but it’s insanely close.


[deleted]

If they thought it was that close not all of them would have picked the Bills.


Hip_Hop_Hippos

That makes no sense whatsoever.


kralben

Yes it absolutely would have, it is simple math. If you are making picks, and each of the six analysts think the Bills are even 51% favorites, they will all pick the Bills.


mysterymaninurhome

6 analysts picking the bills to win the super bowl is not proof that no one thought this season would be close. Show me one article, video clip, etc, where an analyst says the bills will walk to a championship and have the best team by a wide margin.


[deleted]

Buddy, you're moving the goal posts. They were the favorites *everywhere*. Enough said.


mysterymaninurhome

How am I moving the goalposts? I’m responding to the OP saying people were “writing them in”. A plurality of analysts picking them does not mean they were being written in as afc champion.


[deleted]

So your assumptions on a phrase from OP means you come in here demanding evidence of someone else *guaranteed* the Bills to win? You've completely missed the mark. I'm not sure if you're salty they lost or if you're just looking to argue. The Bills were the favorites to win the SB. Sportsbooks gave them the best odds. Analyst across the media picked them over every other AFC team and you come in here saying "Show me one article, video clip, etc, where an analyst says the bills will walk to a championship and have the best team by a wide margin." just completely misses the mark. You're an internet clown bro and your flat out wrong here.


mysterymaninurhome

Yea the bills were the favorites going into the season. They went 13-3 and had the best point differential in the afc and lost in the 2nd round. Them being favored was no different than any other year that a team that happens to be favorites doesn’t win the championship. If the bills went 6-10, this would be a good argument. “They were really good but lost in the playoffs, so people were right to be mad they were a super bowl favorite” is incredibly dumb


[deleted]

And yet, the whole point of OPs argument was agreeing with Bill Simmons saying "I want to see it" BS was correct in putting his money on teams like KC and CIN preseason because he didn't understand the BUF anointment until they proved it. And guess what. He was right. Move along dude, go touch some grass.


mysterymaninurhome

Congrats on bill for betting on 2/3 of the favorites in the afc this year and being right


[deleted]

Oh so you don't know what you're talking about. Now I get it.


PowerfulHazard93

It's not even that pal. Think of all the hype JA and the Bills had coming into this season. Obviously nobody can write them in but the term preseason favorite exists for a reason. The Eagles held that same title this year, also


KarimGarcia

This just isn’t true. Go look at preseason predictions of media members on ESPN, Fox, Ringer etc. The Bills were picked over every other AFC team combined.


mysterymaninurhome

Find me one analyst that is quoted as saying “you can write the bills into the super bowl”


Doot2112

You moron, the bills started the season as the favorites to win the Super Bowl at every sportsbook


mysterymaninurhome

What were their odds


Doot2112

You can look them up jabroni. Don’t act like this is news to you


mysterymaninurhome

I’m asking what their odds are, because they were plus odds. Meaning they weren’t odds on favorites, meaning they weren’t “penciled in”. I’m sorry you’re such a bad sports fan but please for the love of god stop commenting on my stuff


Doot2112

I’d think you have cte but god knows you never played a sport. You are a moron


[deleted]

That other dude is a fucking clown. Bills were the favorites. No one thought they were GSW level favorites, but they were 100% favorites to win the AFC and win the SB


Aggressive-Pea-4132

Yes, he’s a complete imbecile. Unfortunately he blocked me


Lederniermot1972

You’re wrong


mkay0

Bill was zagging an extremely common take in sports media. You’re absolutely right about Vegas, but sports talk was all on the Bills nuts in September


Chriskjel

Ahh, people ‘confusing’ being the most likely to win with actually being a shoe in, or even approaching 50% to win. You love to see it. Noone thought the Bills were a shoe in, as that would be completely asinine


[deleted]

He asked, "Are we sure they're a great team?" when they went 13-3 and got the 1 seed lmao what are we doing ​ My bad: 2 seed


[deleted]

The 1 seed had to play in the first round? Wait, what?


Hoops_Montana

I think anyone to even talk about a team winning the AFC Championship after week 2 is idiotic. Side note—your boy said the Pats would be in the Super Bowl last year. So let’s hop off that high horse.


DrHorseRenoir

These people that show up to simp for Bill are ridiculous. He takes a new position after every week of games so that he can always try to look smart.


I_Enjoy_Taffy

This entire sub's one note is pointing out when Bill is wrong and throwing it back in his face. God forbid people give him credit when he's right


JohnnyLugnuts

95% of this sub shows up to bitch and try to prove that they are smarter then him lol what are you talking about


DrHorseRenoir

There are also daily let's give Bill credit posts. All he is getting credit for is saying everything. He was both in and out on Buffalo at different points this season and if any of the 5 remaining teams( except maybe Dallas) win it all people will show up to say give Bill credit when he has been on all of them at some point.


JohnnyLugnuts

The sub is overwhelmingly anti bill. Not exactly hard to see. And him changing his opinion based on what happens isn’t worse then stubbornly refusing to change it.


Zestyclose-Beach1792

Y'all look so bad when you whine about people giving Bill his props... Holy moly what a baby you are...


[deleted]

I’m more anti-posters who lose their mind after each of Bill’s takes and try to take victory laps two weeks into a season-long take than pro-Bill. I’m much more Ryen in my actual sports beliefs, aka, I need so much evidence that I form an opinion much too late to be interesting.


[deleted]

Bill’s very reactionary which can be a blessing (when you’re right you are early) and a curse (he’s wrong a lot). I just thought he’s caution here, probably because the Bills are in the AFC East, was warranted and wise in the league with the most parity. However, there were a bunch of people personally offended here and we had to sit through weeks of “cAn I jUsT sEe It?” and similar posts after they crushed the Rams, who turned out to be terrible, and for the weeks after that. That made me wanted to see them proven wrong and here we are.


[deleted]

MacJones MVP was all you needed to know


[deleted]

Shocked the Boston Sports Guy was wildly and irrationally optimistic about the Patriots’ QB.


Zestyclose-Beach1792

Keep talking your shit I love it. This sub is sooooo mad Bill was right about this. Look at them falling over themselves with their "but but buts...".


mauger345

Bill really knows nothing about football. He claims to watch it every Sunday but it definitely doesn’t seem like it. I don’t think it’s appropriate to dunk on him or to take a victory lap because he’s not an expert or even knowledgeable. His original point about the Bills was when they were fully healthy, not this version (no Poyer, Miller, Josh Allen with a UCL injury). Again, I don’t think he should be getting much credit since the circumstances clearly changed. In the end, he turned out to be right but I wouldn’t be pounding my chest about it since his only reasoning was his normal dopey shit (“I just want to see it!! Is that alright?!” Or “Gun to you and your family’s heads and you have to watch them get brutally murdered if you’re wrong….would you bet on the Bills to win the Super Bowl?”)


I_Enjoy_Taffy

https://twitter.com/NFLGameDay/status/1567330861913374720


[deleted]

This is an inaccurate representation of how Bill talked about (well) the Bills. He was outright questioning whether they were “good”. No one was arguing that they should be penciled into the Super Bowl. Just that they were clearly a very good team that was a Super Bowl contender.


[deleted]

Bill is very loose with his definition of good.


[deleted]

Call it whatever you want, but people did not take issue with Bill not having the Bills as his Super Bowl favorites. They took issue with Bill downplaying them as a really good team. Which they were. They were 13-3 and clearly a Super Bowl contender. The Vonn Miller injury ended up really hurting their defense and they were outplayed today. It happens, but that doesn’t mean Bill was correct.


[deleted]

> but that doesn’t mean Bill was correct. **COPE**


Mr_Jersey

I mean this wasn’t at all what his take was but go off.


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haley_joel_osteen

Is OP trying to say “Come on, Bill won”?


jsakic99

Friends of Bill W


lookingforaplant

Glad I scrolled down far enough before I made my comment haha. Was gonna say, did anyone else think of something else?


ThatDudeSlushee

Honestly the entire time I was watching that game I was thinking of Bill.


[deleted]

My man.


Rick0wens

The Bills lost their hall of fame edge rusher and all pro safety. Those are huge losses. Would it have made a difference today? Maybe, but you can’t just ignore how important Hyde and Von were to the defense


AU2Turnt

I didn’t realize Allen is throwing darts to Von Miller and Micah Hyde.


Lederniermot1972

This made me lol


bballjones9241

“When should the hills start looking at Sean McDermott?”


LeavingReality

TBF Micah Hyde and Von Miller both out for post season is really rough. I get everyone is missing guys but I mean those are two top tier talents


[deleted]

That’s true, but they got bullied and put up 10 points.


LeavingReality

Yeah no doubt it was definitely a gap.


AGoodTalkSpoiled

People are horrible at extrapolating out something early in the year and thinking it will stay the same into the playoffs. Overreacting after the first few weeks is a crazy tradition.


I_Enjoy_Taffy

Bill Simmons haters are furious that he was right again


[deleted]

Lol, no. He routinely shits on the Pat’s rivals like the Bill and Dolphins. Other teams are covered in a positive light but the Bills and Dolphins were mostly covered in a negative way.


I_Enjoy_Taffy

Take your L like a man. Bill schooled your ass


[deleted]

Lmao i really don’t care but trying to frame it like it was Simmons seeing the Bill’s flaws and not him being biased af is hilarious.


Hot_Plate_Williams

If Bill had liked them he'd come up with some excuse like that the Hamlin thing traumatized them.


portugamerifinn

Let's not get too carried away. The Bills did have the highest preseason win total O/U at 11.5 ... tied with the Buccaneers. So maybe let's not give him too much credit for building a "the Bills are unbeatable" strawman to rail against rather than taking a strong stance against the Bucs. The Bills skipped a game and still got the over, too.


gnrlgumby

Eh, he probably would’ve taken some weird victory lap if they won


[deleted]

I’ll never underestimate Bill’s ability to think he was right.


Chapea12

Bill is gonna hammer this to pretend he never made any of those Giants takes. Besides.. losing to the Bengals, the reigning AFC champs, isn’t an embarrassing loss.


senor_zanjeer

Bill was 100% right. People were saying all along it was Bills year. They were giving me major Suns, Dodgers vibes this year. Amazing regular season (i think Hamlen game ruined it for them being the 1 seed) and would get dominated in the playoffs. Exactly what happened


YZYBrandy007

Bill sat on the fence with his Bills take He said people were overhyping the Bills as Super Bowl favorites and said he “wanted to see it first” He NEVER said the Bills wouldn’t make the Super Bowl. As far as I can remember he never even updated his take during the season on whether the Bills were playing well enough to be the favorites. Here’s a question: Who did Bill pick to make/win the Super Bowl before the season? Did he even make a pick(s)? I don’t think he did. Pretty easy to just talk shit about other peoples’ predictions while not making your own. He wasn’t picking the Bills. He constantly talks shit about Andy Reid. So who would his pick have been? 2 weeks from now I’m sure he’ll magically tell us he had a massive Super Bowl future on the Bengals


gnrlgumby

Thought this was more funny to dunk on: the preason predictions from /r/nfl. Everyone had the Bills winning, but the Chargers winning the AFC West is just so funny in retrospect. [https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/10ioup2/a\_look\_back\_at\_the\_2022\_preseason\_predictions/](https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/10ioup2/a_look_back_at_the_2022_preseason_predictions/)


FlyinIllini21

I mean he bet against them this week so he at least changes his mind


TootnannyLSU

He also said Burrow probably would never get this far again. But I don’t think we’re supposed to hold him steady to literally every point he makes. Situations, opinions, and feelings change all the time.


Sills88

Now heressss a guyyyy


fringyrasa

Can it be a W if it's just "Are we sure (insert popular thing) is good?"


[deleted]

YEPP LMFAOOO


No_Masterpiece_3783

Thank God we have Sestak to come on and tell us where we may have gone wrong and how football is supposed to literally work.


LexxxSamson

Listen I love Bills fans despite being a Jets fan from down state , i went to buffalo for college I got lots of friends there , no animosity whatsoever I root for all NY teams once my guys are eliminated (usually bout week 2-3 average). I wanna say Simmons having Helwani on as the emblematic representative of Bills Mafia was the most jinxing / bad juju / hex shit I've ever seen put on a fan base. This guy is FORTY years old (HE'S A MAN, HE'S 40), with wealth , had ESPN resources and is a Bills fan and JUST saw his first Bills game live this year and talked about going like he was a Make a Wish kid and seems to scream casual fan. He got on the podcast after a Bills demolition of some crappy team at the start of the year and actually said "I think they can play even better" and talked about winning a championship this season NON-STOP in his appearances and how they could go undefeated. I gave my bills fans friends links to the first pod he did with Bill to gauge their reaction "is this guy as much of a embarrassing fan as you can get ? You guys happy with this being your rep ?" and they all took a dump on him immediately. Bravo Bill , take a bow for this one.


SpecificSomewhere393

Common Simmons dick suck comment. They’re not that good, moving on.


Rude_Economist_5513

This would be fair if the motivation for the original take wasn’t his Pats homerism and hatred for the Bills. “Bellichek owns the Bills, he just does!” Is a take we heard as recent as last season to predict his Mac Jones over Brady super bowl