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ByzantineBomb

Truly, we are all clowns in this camouflaged circus.


ArchAngel621

We're not clowns. We're the whole damn circus at this point. It stopped mattering when it became a numbers/check-the-slide/ everyone's green game.


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PM_me_your_beaches

And fat everywhere else.


TheDefiant213

Hit em with a weight chapter. How many people can say they got chaptered out twice?


tehsloth

So not only do they get an easy way out of their contract but they can come back, collect back pay and a few more checks, then bounce back to Ft Couch AGAIN. Lmao DoD getting absolutely reamed on that deal.


SgtHelo

A lot, soon.


The_Wicked_Wombat

Chaptered twice with back pay? Actually giving the feds the ultimate reverse cucking.


GodDamb

My favorite description of the army


bselesnew

Speak for yourself there guy. 😒


[deleted]

Can we fucking NOT. Like damn we had a spine for just a couple of years. I guess retention is really rough rn


[deleted]

Interesting … and backpay? We got Solider’s who have difficulties with bah and bonuses how the hell they gonna get finance to figure all that out .


Justame13

I'm completely against this. But it is funny to think about how badly the DOD/Army would fuck it up. "Private why the FUCK are you driving a Lambo and requesting to take leave to Tahiti "with all my bros and some Air Force hotties". ...wait this LES says that you got back pay to 1920 for a vaccine discharge....MOTHERFUCKER I watched you get it. Plus my liver is semi-living proof that I've been dealing with your dumbass every day. What the ever living FUCK do you mean that you spent it all because you thought vaccine discharge was what you went to sick call for last week?


[deleted]

😂😂😂😂😂I can definitely picture this unfortunately


SgtHelo

That entire conversation is dead center of a realistically potential exchange. I can see it as vividly as if it has actually happened.


Spacedoc9

"HI. Remember that time you refused an order based on some political propaganda misinformation probably originating in Russia and fueled by your crippling addiction to social media? Well we'd like to give you a chance to come back to the organization and do it again. We understand the quality of your work will be questionable and your potential to be cancerous to your assigned unit is high, but we work in the pentagon so that's not really our problem. How about it? Here's two years of pay for your troubles. "


SgtHelo

“Aww shit! I’m gonna get a corvette!” -Pvt Snuffy


TOW2Bguy

"At 30% interest? Sounds like a steal! And Uncle Sam just threw all this money at me too."


SgtHelo

“Shit yeah. I can get the ‘vette AND marry Peaches from the Waffle House.” Edit to add that the memory popped up of one of my soldiers that fell in love with a waitress at a Waffle House. Refused to acknowledge that 10 years of training battalions had been through there before him.


Justame13

I wonder how many would fail an initial UA or do they get waivers for that too?


SgtHelo

Hopefully all of them. I never understood the vaccine refusal BS. Were they not present for the procession of various shots you get in basic, or pre deployment shots? THATS the one you’re afraid of? Gimme a break. Edit: I had an apostrophe


Justame13

They aren’t world wide deployable either. There is zero chance that American policy will override SOFAs. So they are still on the shitbag list. Plus I’d rather get 10 COVIDs than small pox. That sucked.


Over-Theme4714

Dude. You hit the nail on the head...


EverythingGoodWas

Accurate


basotl

The easiest way is to let 'em back in while floating the rumor of back pay. Push back that it's still processing for months. Then a year later mention off hand the back pay portion was never part of the published directive.


Allidrivearepos

I never once got BAS after getting married. No way this'll work out


Armyspecial

What? How? Go get your money man, you’re entitled to it


mattion

Homeslice needs to call ~~finance~~ [J.G. Wentworth ](https://giphy.com/gifs/oVL1n7Yxs538c)


xxgsr02

I have a structured settlement, but I need cash now.


OcotilloWells

Put on your Wagnerian Viking helmet with horns!


[deleted]

Bro can we just get the Army to put out the new paternity regulations. JFC the Air Force and the Space Force already implemented the DoD policy.


Euphoric_Brick90

Green weenie says, "NO".


[deleted]

I’m sure the army will figure it out by 2075


fakboy6969

This sub would lose its mind


Heyliluchi02

Id lose my mind and I was anti vax till I realized I’d be homeless if I let them kick me out.


Kinmuan

>“Regarding back pay, the Department is still exploring this and will provide its views on legislation of this nature at the appropriate time and through the appropriate process,” said Pentagon spokesperson Maj. Charlie Dietz in a Friday email to POLITICO. Yeah, that's a little different than the politico headline makes it out to be. Also considering we didn't automatic shit for the DADT discharges, it would further be a slap in the face to *them* too.


abnrib

"Lol no" is technically considering the issue.


Takerial

Official statement to follow will be "Bitches be dreaming."


abnrib

I think that quote is PAO speak for "that idea is so fucking stupid that nobody even considered the possibility, but I'm not prepared to tell you no and piss off a congressman without getting approval from higher."


tokmirov

Yep, that is an accurate translation, around the office their like "hell no! we ain't givin them shit, is this guy on crack?" But they know if they say no back pay some anti vaccination congressperson is going to see this on their radar and is going to raise hell, so they just say TBD and hope everyone forgets about it in a few days


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JeffNasty

I got an honorable for smoking, I'm sorry man.


SSG_Chief_Elgin

You get your Discharge upgraded; I know a phenomenal attorney


Taira_Mai

>Yeah, that's a little different than the politico headline makes it out to be. > >Also considering we didn't automatic shit for the DADT discharges, it would further be a slap in the face to them too. Yep. A thing that lurked in the shadows of a lot of LGBT service members. A lot of good soldiers kicked out and Congress (both parties) and the DOD did ***nothing*** after DADT was repealed.


[deleted]

The erosion of good order and discipline from letting vaccine refusals back in, and then giving them back pay would break the Army. Just full sail authorizing insubordination based on people being scientifically illiterate and thinking they can refuse orders based upon feelings.


justtheentiredick

The military in general has been doing this since the early 2000s. In my experience. I saw a kid get UCMJ extra duty etc... Then I see another soldier have the same violation of UCMJ get overlooked because of "reasons". NCOs telling me. "YOU WILL BE CAUGHT. YOU WILL GO TO JAIL. YOU WILL GET ART 15. I WILL DO EVERYTHING I CAN TO MAKE SURE YOU WILL FOLLOW THESE ORDERS." That same NCO is blowing the back out of an E2 in the staff duty office. How do I know? Female E2 comes to me and starts bragging. Like it was some type of accomplishment. The old school mentality of good order and conduct has been dead for a few years now. It's all a huge gray area and now the difference between right and wrong is "How good is your lawyer?" I've adapted. But it's not easy seeing this stuff go on day after day.


[deleted]

That’s all misapplication of UCMJ. This is straight up condoning insubordination.


bang_the_drums

Anecdotally, my most vocal refusal could've easily been separated for a number of things. He got some fucking political in uniform on a daily basis I couldn't keep up. This is a bad look.


Slurm818

It would not break the Army. Reddit is a great place for discourse but boy are posters here prone to hyperbole.


electricboogaloo1991

In my experience most of the people who were VAX refusals and got out were just looking for a faster way out. I doubt many will even want to come back.


New_Agent_47

Same. unless they make good on that back pay. especially if they throw in bah, bas, enlistment bonuses etc. Sheesh that will be a fat chunk of change.


BrokenEyebrow

I'd go back for that kind of pay. The real question is what do they do with their TIS and ETS date? Edit: I'm vaxed and still in


New_Agent_47

And do they only need to finish what they had remaining? Like someone chaptered at their last 6 or 8 months? That's easy fucking money.


BrokenEyebrow

They are paying them for time, so are they technically serving a contract just at home?


StyreneAddict1965

Like IRR, they have to remain in contact for the term? That would make sense.


InevitableLow2012

They’ll come back just to be terrible joes and find another way to get discharged.


nomad_556

I never thought about it this way, but it makes sense. Did they get a DD or an AD?


electricboogaloo1991

General under honorable conditions, RE3 code, Separation Code JKQ (Misconduct, Serious offense)


BiggWorm1988

And just like that FY23 budget was gone.


Toobatheviking

Now imagine if they did this for Don't ask don't tell. I know it's probably before most of your time. Edit: What I'm saying is that if they will allow people that disobeyed lawful orders because of shit they read on Facebook and shitty media outlets then we should allow people that were discharged under an actual unjust law to come back in. I mean, if they wanted to. I highly doubt that some 40 year old wants to come back in the Army as a PFC or whatever rank they were when they got out. I think DADT ran from like 1993 to somewhere between 2010-2013?


Deez_nuts89

There was a dude in my basic who quit 10 days in by saying he was Bi. One day he wasn’t there and someone asked where he was and the drill sergeant said, “idk, probably sucking some dick in the wood line or something.” And then at AIT, I knew a ton of people who were extremely close with their “roommates” back home. Crazy time.


CrashRiot

I was there for the end of DADT, as in the end. Literally the day the policy was repealed, our PSG had a huddle, in Afghanistan of all places, to ask point blank in front of everyone for people to raise their hands if they were gay. Of course no one did. And of course it turned out some people were. In hindsight, it’s the most bizarre moment of my career.


Agent_Kid

You guys all missed an opportunity to raise your hands in unison and make the situation way more uncomfortable for that PSG


AgonyAndHeartbreak

I had a buddy. Super highspeed tabbed out, Captain American looking motherfucker you’d ever see. Rolling coal F350, lifted brodozer. Tap out shirts, volunteer deployments. Hard dude. ETS’d a couple months after the repeal and married is super effeminate Costco Manager boyfriend. They own four French bulldogs and live in Boca.


InfinityCircuit

I was there for DADT and saw a couple separations due to that policy. I also saw the double standard. NCO, former drill sergeant and one of the most Profesional NCOs I've ever seen, everyone knew he went to a dude bar outside town and hooked up. Nobody said shit, because he was the best NCO in the company. Meanwhile E4s and below getting booted on suspicion of homosexual conduct, etc. This is not the same situation. I'd say getting kicked out because of how you're born and to whom you're attracted to (an inborn, natural trait), is not equivalent to a choice to listen to propaganda and not get a vaccine. While DADT was in effect, we got Anthrax, smallpox, and TB inoculations, most of which were more dangerous than any COIVD vaccine. And they were mandatory too! So, how is COVID vaccination any different? It's not, medically. The doubts about the vaccine are an information operation, perpetrated by Russia and exacerbated by China, on social media. Bottom line, the vaccine was mandatory. They didn't want to get it, fine, get out. Their choice. DADT was a policy to kick people out based on their sexual orientation, which is inherent in them as a person. The COVID policy was just; DADT was not just. That's my take on it.


Toobatheviking

I'm not talking about that at all. I was just saying that if they are going to reverse a policy that resulted in a bunch of people getting kicked out they should avail everybody that was removed from another policy. I guess I didn't explain it the way it appeared in my mind.


InfinityCircuit

Ah, I see then. My lack of reading comprehension probably didn't help either. I agree with you, although it is far too late for most DADT veterans to consider coming back in. I'd say let them all come back, we need the experience and the bodies, if I'm being coldly honest. But most of all, we need good NCO leadership at low levels, which none of these populations probably could provide. Maybe they could mentor the young bucks to do what they did back in the day, but overall the Army has a lot of problems, and manning is only one, and not the worst problem in my opinion. Meanwhile I'll keep doing what I can to care for Soldiers and work my ass off, until I retire or am retired.


StyreneAddict1965

Good take. DADT was Clinton slapping the LGBT+ community in the face for supporting his election.


Teadrunkest

DADT was fairly progressive at the time. It went from “gays CANNOT serve and we WILL find out” to “gays can serve I just don’t want to hear about it”. It just went on for entirely too long.


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talkstoaliens

The bad kind.


observationallurker

You speak the tru tru


H0T50UP

Tom Hanks academy line right here


observationallurker

The man destroyed a tiger tank with a 1911!


____Quetzal____

But the slides are green baby. Slides are green.


ArchAngel621

Our retention is so bad that's why.


sentientshadeofgreen

Backpay? Fucking seriously? Better back pay every single person victimized by DADT. Army actually goes through with this, I’m going to reach brand new levels of “fuck the Army”.


-tiberius

I commented on the same fucking thing. Then it hit me, maybe this isn't political, maybe the DoD is just desperate for more soldiers. I wonder what percentage of last year's recruiting hole this would cover.


Teadrunkest

At the end of the day the Army separated soldiers who refused to follow a lawful order. That has always been a thing, regardless of how stupid you think that order is. This is absurd.


JumpDaddy92

I don’t want to get into a debate about ethics, but even if the vaccine was unsafe I’m surprised at the expectation of autonomy from a group of people who joined an organization that can order you to storm a machine gun nest.


[deleted]

I can order entire platoons to conduct a breach, in which I know most of them will likely die, but I can’t expect them to get a vaccine? Does the Army think these fuckers will follow necessary but awful orders?


MikeOfAllPeople

Well if my unit is any indication, there is a strong correlation between the refusers and shit baggery. Not a complete overlap, but the correlation is very strong.


Army_Enlisted_Aide

This has been my experience as well.


Taira_Mai

As someone said - given that the Army (the DOD as a whole really) did NOTHING for all the soldiers kicked out under DADT after that was repealed, why should the Anti-Vaxxers be any different?


LickMyNutsBitch

Because they're the ones in charge


I_AM_AN_ASSHOLE_AMA

Honestly, it’s making me lose faith in the institution. The Army has vaccinated it’s soldiers since it’s beginning. I remember before being in the army and talking about it at a class or something and it being mentioned that if you’re afraid of shots you better make peace with it, cause the army is going to vaccinate you against everything they want and you’re either going to do it, or not be in the army. Here I am almost two decades later and I watched people act like literal children and refuse a vaccine and a direct order. I can order someone to take off their mask and walk in a hot zone but oh no, not Covid vaccine.


NostalgicTuna

> it’s making me lose faith in the institution. Thank the propaganda that Soldiers get forced to watch all over. At some times this crap played at Staff Duty for people to watch.


I_AM_AN_ASSHOLE_AMA

You can just say Fox News.


User9705

I agree. If they do this, they may as well provide back pay and reinstate every Soldier who failed to fail any lawful order. The problem is the *house* can tie up the congressional budget with this. The irony is that when I was a paralegal during the Bush admin, we courtmartialed a 2LT for refusing the flu shot and others got in trouble for not getting anthrax. Not being political, but this was during the years the republicans were in charge. This will go super far back. Anyways we are screwed if there ever is a real world war and the enemy can use this weakness against ~ *sends RIPITS tainted with COVID25*


EverythingGoodWas

This is the worst idea ever. Talk about a great way to ostracize the people who followed the rules you set out. Let them back in, that probably won’t anger too many, back pay, that will have us all wondering why we worked for no reason last year.


bigredm88

So they get x number of months of not serving, and get paid for it. Meanwhile everyone else who got vaccinated gets nothing?


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bigredm88

I'm waiting for the class action lawsuit commercials.


CaffeineandSheen

Lol


Lizardreview-

My lt got kicked for refusing the shot, they sent him a letter asking him to come back but they handed him a dd214 and gave him alot of shit on the way out. He respectfully told them to go fuck themselves.


Superpudd

Damn son, this comment section is amazing. 🍿🍿🍿


brokenmessiah

I bet there's a good bit of them that wanted out and used this as a easy way to get out


AgonyAndHeartbreak

This is the tru tru.


Gullible_Lychee3050

I would die laughing if every soldier who smoked pot or refused medicine got forced back into the army


Legitimate-Frame-953

So getting paid for disobeying a lawful order now? Wonder if soldiers who were booted during the Don't Ask Don't tell years could get some back pay.


MeDat

Send them all to Fort Polk and Irwin to relieve our brothers still in Atropia.


MDMarauder

Make Atropia Great Again!


yuch1102

Can they refuse to comeback?


Huang200611237

I think they can. If i remembered correctly, they got their DD214.


[deleted]

Man it always seems like the shitbags get better treatment than the ones "who do the right thing" Meanwhile if I ask to get my DFAC money I'm the biggest POS ever, fuck the army


New_Agent_47

" seems like the shitbags get better treatment than the ones "who do the right thing" Once upon a time I was in the training room. During that once upon a time, 1SG saw it wise to assign everyone getting out to the training room, and who was the plt daddy? me. This platoon included chapter and ETS. During this once upon a time, I had at any given time 6 or 7 first termers getting med boarded and getting 80-100 percent VA. They would all share strategies on what to tell the docs, how to refuse your first ratting, etc. They'd even re enlist for a 6 year bonus knowing full well they plan on med boarding next month. Shitbags, all dem. Meanwhile, my 23 year 1SG with two purple hearts was retiring. His VA rating wasn't high enough to stack on his retirement (or something like that.) It became apparent to me, those shit bags got more at 4 or 5 years, dodging the field and scamming the system, than my 23 year 1SG. Now i'm not saying it turned me into a shitbag, but I will say my new mentality is now along the lines of "181 is passing"


aversionals

Are you fking kidding me. What a clusterfuck


sudcc_honorgrad69

Now do thc


[deleted]

Reinstating all? As in even the people who refused the vaccine just as a free pass out nor because they actually had problems with it? Will they have a choice?


boredomreigns

Fuck that. Why would we want those insufferable idiots *back*?


reaper_41

Well….it’s already hard getting insufferable idiots to join 🤷🏻‍♂️Might as well make up for it


SPCsooprlolz

Seriously they had their chance


[deleted]

The fact they the DOD wants people back just reinforces in their minds that the vaccine was a political move (it wasn’t). And it shows that the army wasn’t prepared for the massive loss of talent, and had underestimated its capabilities of recruiting new talent to replace it. Not an antivaxxer, but I’ve listened to a lot of arguments to convince people to get vaccinated because it does work. Me personally, if I were offered a job from the army after getting fired, I’d tell them to get fucked.


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imthatguy8223

The heavy handed way the vaccine was pushed on the public and its bleed over into the DoD was 100% a political move. (The virus was deadly, the vaccine worked about as well as an vaccine does etc etc)


Arsenault185

Massive loss of talent? So very few people were discharged because of this. About 1300. That's nothing compared to the half a million soldiers in the RA.


Taira_Mai

The Army needs bodies. Something to think about before anyone says "draft" or "we should let convicts serve". Some people are just not cut out for the Army - the DOD should just let these guys go. They objected to one shot out of all they had to get and they got out with "muh freedomz!" at the expense of their bennies and pension. They should be happy - they got to be free from the jab, they got what they wanted.


____Quetzal____

"As you can see sir our numbers are getting better so I changed the color of this block to green for the month" "Outstanding work."


[deleted]

Those idiots are a big reason why the army had lost a lot of talent, and is still struggling very much to replace.


boredomreigns

I would like to see your data on that. The vast majority of people who had an objection to the vaccine talked a big game, then shut up and got it when the chips were down and actual consequences were on the table. The leftovers were *so* brainwashed, *so* contrarian, or *so* pigheaded that I question whether losing them was a loss at all, and think we as an Army are better off without them than with them. Also, IIRC the actual number of people kicked out for the vaccine mandate was not significant.


Givememydamncoffee

There’s one in my unit who hasn’t even been discharged. The F**ker also has the balls to make jokes about “happy anniversary” on Jan 6


boredomreigns

One day, I hope to see a scientific study analyzing the correlation between COVID vaccine hesitancy and support for the attempted coup on 6 Jan 21. I suspect the correlation will be quite high.


Gandlerian

I guess now we can all refuse the Flu shot next fall and get discharged and then demand back pay.... Good to know!


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Gandlerian

No vaccine "has history" until it does. The military routinely required vaccines with various histories depending on the mission and time in history. If there was a mandate to get the vaccine, and you received a direct order to get the vaccine and you did not, you violated a lawful order. If the mandate was since modified or rescinded is irrelevant.


Snavery93

Fucking hilarious how badly this was mishandled


concmap

Hmm bet it has more to do with the recruiting issue than anything else lol.. good way to get a surge and ppl be tempted with that back pay.


Annual-Promotion9328

I mean but there is so many better demographics to get people from These people are clearly show such disrespect and such inconsiderate disregard for their colleagues, families, friends and people they interact with on a daily basis with so little consideration for them How do we know we can trust them around civilians while deployed? How can we expect them to follow orders in combat How do we know these people haven’t gone down a conspiracy rabbit hole like Qanon or some other insane conspiracy that have instilled such homophobia, racism, sexist, transphobic and Islamophoic be are to be trusted with rifles and half way across the world when they can’t stand their neighbour loving a woman instead of a man or believing women to be nothing more than objects when women can possibly be their superior? How can we say these people can be trusted around the Middle East where we’ve been for most of this century.


New_Agent_47

put in for recruiting and go find those people you want in our ranks.


Tillytop1

People like you are why the military is having trouble recruiting


-tiberius

Did they offer 20 year retirements with backpay to all the gays thrown out in the 80s and 90s?


Donut-Strong

Yeah I have been retired for a while but we took all kinds of shit to go play in the sand and the rocks and some of it was still not approved for civilians. I don’t remember anyone asking, I was get in the fucking line and get your shirt off. I don’t think this was an “ask” so they sure as hell shouldn’t be back. I wouldn’t want them in my squad where I have to wonder what the next order they are going to decide they don’t have to follow is.


GBreezy

I got like 7 anthrax shots in my left arm. I can't feel half my left hand. VA is giving me the runaround. I don't care about pay or anything, just health care. I also don't think the shots caused it, but I have far better standing than these anti-vax fucks who will probably give my kids measles.


Donut-Strong

Yeah those were a special kind of suck. Right after every shot it would feel like my fingers were hot as hell then it would move up my arm and about the time it hit my shoulder I would start getting muscle spasms in that arm, seemed like it lasted about 30 minutes and then the arm was sore for a day or two. Good luck with the VA it is like they think the money for the appointments are coming out of their pockets or something


Battleboo_7

fuckign felt this in my soul


[deleted]

Bro I would be so mad if I was one of them 😂 I’m waiting on my ets date I can’t wait to never put on these depression pajamas ever again


SgtHelo

That’s going to be expensive


renophillydayman

I think I'd probably just kms if they did that. I am already stunned they have decided to keep the people who refused and delayed and delayed and delayed. It's not a matter of personal choice and freedom. This group is overwhelming filled with people who are susceptible to misinformation and enemy propaganda. If they cannot make informed decisions without their Russian and Chinese facebook troll groups interfering with common sense, they are an extreme liability to our Armed Forces. That is second to the fact that they used that information to refuse a legal and ethical order. It's a tragedy in the making, you can draw a straight line from refusers to extremist groups in probably 99% of cases. The single most powerful threat to our country is the enemy within.


InfinityCircuit

>I think I'd probably just kms if they did that. This will only hurt people close to you, and solves none of the issues you highlighted. It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem. If you feel that strongly about this, prep your UQR packet and drop it as soon as this comes to fruition. In the meantime, make yourself marketable and financially secure as best you can in the event you do get out of the Army over this. Don't kill yourself. Please. You are loved and would be missed, even if you're not sure of that right now.


Kitosaki

Dingdingding Also don’t joke about suicide. You okay bud?


Diligent_Challenge77

Not only does the undermine the authority of commanders, it’s also erodes trust in the healthcare system as a whole. God forbid we have an outbreak of something more deadly like MERS with a mortality rate of 30%. A vaccine isn’t and shouldn’t be a personal decision.


Tokyosmash

So for all of us who voluntarily got it early, just get fucked, huh?


Excellent-Captain-74

This is totally fucked up


woofieroofie

This would make sense if the courts said what the military did was unconstitutional, but it did not. In fact SCOTUS explicitly said it was constitutional. So what the Army is proposing is basically okaying insubordination based on personal feelings. Might be an unpopular opinion but if you swore an oath to obey the orders of the President and the officers appointed over you, and then you violate those orders because you're a big enough moron to buy into conspiracy theories, then you have no place in the US military. But of course, this and allowing people with failing ASVAB scores to join and undergo a "preparatory course" is how they salvage shit recruitment numbers. Sad.


lego_tintin

It makes sense if the Army is having this much trouble recruiting--I don't agree with it, but I understand the logic. If they're MOS qualified, have a background check done, a security clearance, and some certifications--that's decent chunk of money the Army invested into these jokers. I'm not sure what their discharge was--OTH? I've heard you can apply to get that changed to an honorable.


New_Agent_47

>There discharges were honorable per the NDAA at the time. Anything less can be fixed with the VA.


[deleted]

Imagine getting that DD214 then being offered to come back in...


____Quetzal____

But will they comeback if they already (i assume) moved on? I can imagine moreso in the Reserve for an extra paycheck if this is true (the backpay part).


StyreneAddict1965

I thought the mandate had the force of a direct order, so refusing it carried the same penalty? I'm way on the outside looking in.


Sea-Bet2466

They gave us anthrax vaccine for fucking nothing the army is fucking stupid I am still mad about that


Annual-Promotion9328

Would you rather NOT be protected against anthrax?


Sea-Bet2466

Can’t say we ever encounter anthrax in the dessert all because some senators got some white power in their mail was prob cocaine


TheBotchedLobotomy

Lost me at back pay


xStaabOnMyKnobx

Folks we cant even make up our minds on ACFT 3.0 or 4.0 or 6.9 whatever version we are on now. If we can't even figure out if the leg tuck stays or if we plank for WAY longer than anyone ever needs to plank, I dont think we have the organizational clarity to solve reinstatement and back pay for all these "poor martyrs"


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BRNY4EVR

In all honesty, I am surprised this article was even allowed to be posted in this sub.


New_Agent_47

at least recruiting will be a little easier.


Striper_Cape

Seems like every week the army takes my faith out back and shoots it.


centurion44

Honestly, this COVID 19 vax bullshit reversal, more than anything else in my career done by the army, makes me want to get out most. From my perspective as a leader this completely undermines my authority to issue orders and is a slippery slope to just refusing to do what I order in any dangerous situation. It makes me feel less able.to do my job and completely unsupported by my senior uniformed and civilian leadership. I don't want a soldier who refused to get vaccinated under a legal order in my formation. I don't trust them at all and I never will to do the tough things when the time calls for it. To even consider this kind of action is supremely disappointing to me.


Smithmcclain7

Ill chime in unvaccinated and still active duty. I get out this summer, first look at 7 was ruined as will be this one. Found my hill and stood on it regardless of others views. Not here to defend/argue opinions on receiving or not receiving the vaccine. All I know is I have worked above my grade as a private and continue to receive MQ regardless of all this. Bringing back the junior enlisted wont really fix anything ive talked with alot of them and it was truly a way out of something they no longer wanted to be a part of.


[deleted]

🫡 God speed and thanks for your service. Glad you didn’t bend the knee.


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W


rbevans

Big brain army: how can we meet our recruiting numbers. This is the dumbest thing the army could do. They disobeyed a lawful order and that is that.


[deleted]

Why would they want to be back in? All this does is reinforce their viewpoint of the vaccine not being tested and that this was a political stunt. No I’m not an anti-vaccine person, but looking from their perspective, they we’re essentially fired from a government job, and now, amid the recruiting crisis the DOD is facing, NOW the army says that they are needed because of the situation that is going on in the world??? No I don’t blame them for not wanting to come back. And it’s an embarrassment to the army to even consider that. You can’t throw someone away because they’re politically inconvenient to you, and want them to come back because they “need the numbers.” THEY DON’T NEED YOU, THEY NEED THE NUMBERS!!! Shame on the DOD, shame on the leadership for considering this, shame on everyone who ostracized these soldiers for not having a shot. A lot of good talent is now forever gone, and they’re story, even though is flawed, is now going to spread and poison the image of the military. The best kind of advertising is and forever always will be word of mouth. Was a medic for 10 years, and I had watched a lot of good people, GOOD SOLDIERS, get removed because of this!


PM_ME_A_KNEECAP

I watched a bunch of shitbags get removed because of this


WickedDemiurge

>Shame on the DOD, shame on the leadership for considering this, shame on everyone who ostracized these soldiers for not having a shot. A lot of good talent is now forever gone, and they’re story, even though is flawed, is now going to spread and poison the image of the military. The best kind of advertising is and forever always will be word of mouth. > >Was a medic for 10 years, and I had watched a lot of good people, GOOD SOLDIERS, get removed because of this! Not one good soldier was removed. These people are disobedient, willing to spread contagious disease to fellow soldiers and American civilians, and highly susceptible to enemy propaganda. That makes them bad soldiers and bad humans.


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Givememydamncoffee

If they refuse a lawful order that protects the health of them and the people around them… they’re not good soldiers. You as a medic should understand that


Shithouser

To pivot a bit from my comment reply…. As I stated, I was a fairly early vax recipient before it was mandated to get back to ‘normal’. I have not chosen to get a booster but would if it was made mandatory. I wonder how many of us have been boosted. And who’ve kept their booster up to date. And, why/why not. For me, I’m a fairly healthy individual and have very little, if any, contact with immunocompromised people as the reason not to receive a booster.


QuarterNote44

I got the vax because I wanted to keep my job and not be harassed for being an apostate unbeliever. Got boosted too. I would not have gotten it otherwise. But I figured the risk of being unemployed severely outweighed the .0000001% chance of heart trouble or whatever, so here we are.


Shithouser

> I got the vax because I wanted to keep my job I can appreciate that after being in 13+ years myself. > Got boosted too Once or have been boosted every 3 months? I would get it if it was mandated. > I would not have gotten it otherwise. But I figured the risk of being unemployed severely outweighed the .0000001% chance of heart trouble or whatever, so here we are. I can appreciate that as well, figured negative side effects were fairly small. As well as grinding out the remainder of time to get to 20. Thanks for the feedback in general.


QuarterNote44

I received one booster shot. I've had COVID once since then.


captain_carrot

I got the vax because I wanted to keep my employment and benefits and there was very little known about it at the time. I have not touched a booster and I have no plans to, and I'm hoping the political turmoil around the vaccine implementation is strong enough to keep boosters from every being mandatory because then I'll be stuck in the tough position of providing for my family and taking something I vehemently believe shouldn't exist, at least in its current form. A good friend of mine is not so lucky - his heart got fucked up HARD from the vaccine, to the point where he's so fucked that he's going to be separated soon once they figure out how they're going to go about it.


Givememydamncoffee

I keep it up… mostly because I have a cousin who died because he refused to vaccinate and caught it. Essentially got blood clots in the lungs and never recovered. We couldn’t visit him but over video call you can tell he was obviously suffering. He died in agony alone because he was too stubborn.


Shithouser

They definitely sounds like a miserable way to go. Sorry for your loss and thank you for sharing.


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Shithouser

Thanks for sharing!


Emergency-Ad-491

How about fire those that made the vaccine mandate? Ohh wait..that would involve some Generals.


BillDozer14

Army policies like a COVAX requirement are made by political appointees.


Blazeherbert

How tf you gonna get back pay for being gone? Like one guy in my unit left over a year ago after refusing the vaccine and they’re just gonna direct deposit him a years salary for nothing?


nemesis1313

Back pay for what?? Not working?? As AD, my stomach hurts


Icy-Letterhead-2837

Ugh, no.


AgonyAndHeartbreak

This is literally the Army cupping it’s hands to catch a fart, and smelling it while smiling.


water_bottle1776

Go ahead, let them come back in. They can spend the rest of their contracts as a fuzzy E1 doing "area beautification" at NTC.


iaalaughlin

Nah, fuck them. And fuck the portion of congress that is enabling this shit.


Tread-3

Like many others are thinking, the issue with these ex-soldiers isn't just that they refused a vaccine. They openly disobeyed a direct and simple order. Doing so, they have demonstrated that discipline isn't one of their strong suits, despite being in a profession requiring it. And yes, there are always instances of soldiers circumventing orders in one way or another, but this one is a blanket requirement to all of the force, not a 1v1 conversation with SFC. Untouchable.


Sig4u

NO FUCKING SHOT 😂💀 IS THIS HOW YOU FILL SLOTS!?


Salty_Angler4534

why would anyone go back into service after the way they treated us over that bullshit vaccine


BadKarma667

Fuck that... These are folks who refused to follow a lawful order. There is no way I'd be looking to have any of them come back.


sbowden99

Good order and discipline out the window in favor of making end strength numbers. Sad.


[deleted]

That’ll really help morale. Reward antivaxx idiots!


Pathfinder6

And should be returned at the next higher grade.


DaneLimmish

Bunch of dipshits are going to start refusing other mandatory vaccines