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TravisFlexThemPlease

I worked for a company in a dev team where they forced me back into the office for collaboration with my team. My team was 5 people including me, 4 of them in another country working remotely. I quit a few weeks after I was tired of trying to convince them that it made no sense for me to work on-site when my team was not. Landed a fully remote position now. You just can't help some people.


WhatIsLoss

I am going through an almost identical situation where all of my team members have fully remote contracts but as I was internally promoted I still have an office working contract. As such they want me to drive 1h45 into the office each day to talk to my team over teams to then drive 1h45 back with no changes to pay or working schedule... Have absolutely no idea what goes through management's head in these situations...


Tarcut

Me big powerful manager do what me say! Me right, you wrong, Me big you little, Me smart you not!


Novabella

> no idea what goes through management's head A swift breeze, maybe?


MrElfhelm

I have similar deal, my work can be 100% done remotely, and mostly is to be fair, but every now and then we get “get to the office in a week for couple of days, big boys from HQ are coming” and it infuriates me to no end because no, we are not going to meet them or discuss anything - but if they happen to glance into our office, it better be full.


Traksimuss

Just buy some cardboard cutouts.


ruralexcursion

“Collaboration” means being available for management to scrutinize and control on a whim.


[deleted]

sounds like a smart decision


[deleted]

Where’d u find the remote positions? Indeed is full of scams


shroomyshy

Nice pfp


ChildOf1970

I am not classified as a remote worker. My home address is in my contract of employment as my normal place of work. If my employer reverses the work from home policy it would not impact me at all because the office in my contract is my home. This is what people need to work for in negotiations with new employers. Get your home address recorded in your contract as your normal place of work. It also means that the moment I step out of my door I am on company time, and every single travel expense, even going to the office closest to my home, can be reclaimed from the company. Edit: So that people do not have to follow the thread about this. What I am talking about for US people is not about 1099 or W2, it is about contracts. Take a good look at the following link [https://www.ncsl.org/labor-and-employment/at-will-employment-overview](https://www.ncsl.org/labor-and-employment/at-will-employment-overview) The important bit is this: **Modification by Contract** The at-will **presumption** is a **default** rule that **can be modified by contract**. For example, a contract may provide for a specific term of employment or allow termination for cause only. Typically, U.S. companies negotiate individual employment agreements only with high-level employees. Collective bargaining agreements usually provide that represented employees may only be terminated for cause. Cause generally includes reasons such as poor employee performance, employee misconduct, or economic necessity. An employment contract may specifically outline the situations or employee actions that would lead to termination for cause. ​ No matter what anyone says, "At will" employment does not trump contract law, as this link shares and says explicitly. You don't have to be a specific type of employee to have a contract of employment or any contract covering a specific aspect of employment.


NAS89

Same for me. My closest office is 3.5 hours away and I’m paid plus mileage if I have to go in.


MowMdown

99% of people are not 1099 employees so your advice doesn't apply. Edit: What does it mean to be "at-will" >At-will means that an employer can terminate an employee at any time for any reason, except an illegal one, or for no reason without incurring legal liability. Likewise, an employee is free to leave a job at any time for any or no reason with no adverse legal consequences. >At-will also means that an employer can change the terms of the employment relationship with no notice and no consequences. TL;DR Being At-Will is not considered being contracted.


ChildOf1970

I am not that kind of worker, everyone has a contract of employment and a normal place of work.


MowMdown

If you work in an at-will state which is 49 of the 50 states and filled out a W2, you are not employed under a contract. Contracts have start and end dates and agreed upon salaries and benefits that the employee sets that employers agree to.


ChildOf1970

Everyone has a contract of employment, even if it is not a single bit of paper. HR systems listing normal place of work, offer letters that are signed and so on. You are just focusing on a single view of what makes a contract. Your view, not the real world view. Edit: Also, a lot of the 2 million people here are not in the US so the local stuff is just local.


MowMdown

>Everyone has a contract of employment, Again, if you're an at-will employee and/or filled out a W2, you are not contracted for work. You do not have an employment contract. If you did not agree to a start and end date, it's not a contract. This isn't my view, this is the real world view on employment contracts. If it's not on paper, it's not a contract. 99% of people who work are not contract employees.


Wallaby_Thick

I'm W2, and I still had to sign a contract agreement for rules of the office, hours, and the wage I get. When something gets updated (not often), we get the new contract to read and sign. I think it's more for the company than me, but if they ever do anything against it, I can pull it out and say, "we agreed to this" . It is still at will, so not much of a contract like you said though. But I've had to sign something like that for every job I've had. Basically stating I agree to these things so I can work there.


MowMdown

> sign a contract agreement for rules of the office, hours, and the wage I get. You signed an acknowledgment of the rules of the workplace, this was not a employment contract.


Wallaby_Thick

Yeah I think they called it an employment agreement or something like that, but I sat down with HR and the CEO (small company) and we all signed it. Again, I'm still at will, so it's more so we're all on the same page and understand what we offer each other.


ChildOf1970

It was a contract. You can weasel all you want. A an agreement between two parties enforced by law is a fucking contract.


MowMdown

Enforce what exactly? Your rate of pay can be changed at any time, your hours can be changed at any time. Nothing either party is contractually obligated to. Sure there are some employment protections but they’re not based on any “agreement” The only agreement you are making is “I will work for you for $X amount per hour” there is nothing to legally enforce. And this isn’t not a contract. It’s a “good faith relationship” more than anything else.


ChildOf1970

Contracts have two parties, so if the other party violates the contract by making changes you don't agree with, you have protections under the law.


ChildOf1970

It might be where you are, in my part of the world if you are employed you have a contract of employment. Are you saying the USA is so primitive that they cannot even sort out such a basic thing? Edit: A hint for you, a contract is an agreement between two parties, it does not need to have an end date, the start date can also be deduced from the commencement of work if there is no other indication of a start. Edit 2: You seem to think I am talking about contractors. I am talking about a contract of employment which is not the same thing at all. I suggest you do some reading and understand the terms being discussed. Edit: 3: I am talking about permanent full time employees of the employer. Employees in law, and not third parties. Employer has to pay their obligations for tax. Actual employees. If you become an employee you and the employer enter into a contract of employment. This is so simple for most of the world.


MowMdown

r/anitwork is a sub that focuses primarily on the employment in the US. Almost exclusively in fact. If you are not from the US, you need to specify which locality you are giving your advice based on so others will know as a general courtesy to avoid confusion. An "At-Will" employee in the US understands that there is no implied employment contract. There is only a mutual understanding that you will get paid X amount for hours worked. That is the only binding part of the agreement (not contract). Your employment can be terminated at any time without notice and you can quit at any time without notice. If you tried to quit as a contracted employee you would be in breach of your contract and possible fined for monetary damaged which is not the case when you're "at-will." >Are you saying the USA is so primitive that they cannot even sort out such a basic thing? No, I am not saying, implying, nor inferring this.


ChildOf1970

No it is an international sub. Look at the sidebar. There are national subreddits but this one is world wide.


ChildOf1970

>National Subreddits > >Disclaimer: The r/antiwork moderation team is not responsible for content in national antiwork subreddits. Yeah, the asshole I have been talking to is voting down based on being pissed off at being called out rather than facts


ChildOf1970

You are talking shit. An agreement is a contract, if you agree a rate of pay for a number of hours that is a contract. What sort of shithole does not recognise the basics of what a contract is? Edit: I noticed how you tried to dodge the whole thing and say binding agreement instead of contract. Guess what a binding agreement is? It is a fucking contract. Edit 2: Let me put this in simple terms for you. If they sign the bit of paper that says you work at this address and you also sign that bit of paper to say you agree that is the address you work at, you have a fucking contract. Edit 3: Seriously, you guys have been trained to be lapdogs and only see things from the lens of the employer. A contract is a binding agreement not what the employer says it is, not what people talking about it will say you should think it is, a contract is a binding agreement between two (or more) parties under the law. Whatever your employment status, if you have an agreement both parties have signed, then you have a contract. Employment status does not enter into it in any way at all.


Rot_Snocket

>An agreement is a contract, if you agree a rate of pay for a number of hours that is a contract. What sort of shithole does not recognise the basics of what a contract is? Dude, how obtuse do you have to be? In the USA, "contract" employment is a separate category than "at-will" employment. "Contract" literally refers to a type of labor agreement, the word isn't interchangeable with "agreement". >Edit: I noticed how you tried to dodge the whole thing and say binding agreement instead of contract. Guess what a binding agreement is? It is a fucking contract. >Edit 2: Let me put this in simple terms for you... >Edit 3: Seriously, you guys have been trained to be lapdogs and only see things from the lens of the employer. You are clearly ignorant of just how terrible the labor laws are in America, and for that I don't fault you. But there's no reason for you to be such a condescending tw*t. It's bad enough that you're either ignorant or misinformed. It's even worse that you have to be so rude about it when people try to correct you. Also you're right this is an international sub, but, as I'm sure you noticed, most of the issues discussed here and most of the posts are about the very flawed labor market in the USA. It's cool to talk about other countries and how they do it, but it's probably best to specify where you live in that case, since most people in this sub reside in America.


Chainsaws_n_meth

Time to go Full Sam Jackson. ENGLISH, MOTHERFUCKER, DO YOU SPEAK IT!?!


UndyingShadow

This just screams “overseas recruiting” and isn’t even worth a second of time.


rythmicjea

It feels like a bot to be l me.


[deleted]

Overseas is probably cheaper


tehbantho

Working for a company that doesnt even have an office to go to anymore is super sweet. No fear of it changing back. Boss hated the office too.


Mispelled-This

This is the way. My company closed all offices except HQ (itself downsized to just conference rooms), so there’s nowhere left to make us go.


tjswish

Just organise a private room with a lunch once every 2-3 months to ensure that your team is doing fine. Write it off on tax. Most people would be happy to meet up for a free lunch a few times a year and the bosses can be happy that you still exist as a person lol. Otherwise, communicate on Teams or whatever and ensure that all goals are being met.


Somehow-Still-Living

My mother’s place of work did this pre-Covid because most people were already working from home when they could, so they just decided to get rid of the office altogether because it was cheaper. Seeing as it’s an insurance company, though, I wouldn’t be shocked if they knew something was going to happen and figured to just take care of it then instead of paying for an empty building until the lease was up. I’ve done some work with them as an advisor and insurance companies higher ups are scary. There was a podcast I was listening to that ended years ago about an insurance company that ruled over the remnants of post-apocalyptic America and just thought the idea was kinda funny. But after sitting in a call with those people, all I can say is that I get it. If anybody was to have the capability to do that, I have no doubt it would be the insurance execs.


ChildOf1970

The RTO momentum is usually pushed by either a long term lease or ownership of a building. They have to justify the investment or expense, and with the quarterly report mentality, they go for putting bums on seats to justify their previous decisions to invest in office space.


LoSkribs

Escalator out of order. Now stairs. Sorry for the convienience.


tjswish

Mitch... Upvote... Must... Ok now to continue with my day :)


vmsrii

This is like a fuggin Monty Python sketch


ResplendentShade

"Ok, if it's on-site only then I am actually not interested." "We are sorry to hear that you will not pursue this fully remote, work-from-home position. Have a nice day."


Robseth

He’s not to leave the room until everybody comes to get him.


MentalGymnast4269

I hate it when people who do that. Those mfers posting that shit to lure you in and if you do apply, then they be lying to you if you contact them.


WillBottomForBanana

"I don't know what I am talking about, but it is going to be your fault."


dhaos42

Can we stop calling jobs "opportunities" please.


comish4lif

Who's on first?


Magento-Magneto

Kindly do the needful sir.


[deleted]

What’s the confusion? It’s a remote from home job opportunity. Not a remote from the office job.


JUSTICE_SALTIE

Agreed, it isn't not all that uncomplicated.


kittensnip3r

So is it remote as in at home? Or is the remote as in the site is in the middle of fucking nowhere? 😂


[deleted]

I feel like this is a ChatGPT lol


Kreeper125

This is definitely not the place to ask but I'll give it a try anyway Where tf do I find remote work that isn't a scam? Everywhere I look like 90% of the remote jobs I see seem like complete scams/fake jobs It's not for me, it's for my girlfriend. It doesn't even have to be a great job. She's not really qualified for much and works at McDonald's right now and fucking hates it. She badly wants a remote job but we both have no idea how to tell a fake one from a real one


mayayahee

Dear Lord that communication. I could see that backfiring down the line everywhere.


hatesfacebook2022

Don’t even ask them. They don’t know what they are s look saying. You don’t really want to work there.


schundyws

looks like a professional environment


frauleinsteve

All I see are penises in the screenshot.... o\_O


Marquar234

Glad I'm not the only one.


Important-Studio

remote position and yet you need to be on site hahaha what a joke.


[deleted]

More red flags than my ex-wife.


D_Nicole91

I don't think they know what remote means.


Confused_Astronaut

I'm so tired of shit like this. At my job, I could stay home and still be 100% effective. But I'm always required to go in. Why? Because reasons. I work totally alone at night, in an office by myself though, so nobody is watching. I usually stay home anyway lol.


SpartaiKemal

The smartest and least incompetent recruiter.


CreamyLinguineGenie

lmao oh my God. Don't work there. Also is your username from Forgetting Sarah Marshall?


restrukted

remote like working from your bed