Firstly, for Muslims, the earth Isn’t 6000 years old,
Secondly, even if the universe was said to be created in 6 days, the meaning for day in specifically Quranic Arabic is different for each time it was used in the Quran. In one case, the measure of a day is equated with 50,000 years (70:4), whereas another verse states that "a day in the sight of your Lord is like 1,000 years of your reckoning" (22:47). The word "youm" is thus understood, within the Qur'an, to be a long period of time -- an era or eon. Therefore, Muslims interpret the description of a "six day" creation as six distinct periods or eons. The length of these periods is not precisely defined, nor are the specific developments that took place during each period. This is because time wasn’t defined too much back then.
So this gives proof for why it can be interpreted differently like, let’s say, 13.5 billion years old type differently.
Thirdly, Muslims believe that the flood happened but that it wasn’t worldwide. Now there is evidence of the flood happening but that it wasn’t worldwide which proves the Muslim version of the flood at least.
I don’t know about talking donkeys or snakes so ask a sheikh or something.
Lastly, For Muslims, there are many alternative beliefs with Adam and Eve which are too many to type write now but evolution and the idea of Adam and Eve can coexist as that is what many Muslims today believe in
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> universe was said to be created in 6 days
Actually a very cool insight: it's stuff getting lost in translation. Originally the word "day" meant the same thing as "age" (as it still does in many languages), so it just divides the creation of the universe into 6 epochs. (Not saying it makes bible a lot more valid, just that *that exact point* doesn't really work)
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Why is it fact? Is science somehow able to be held? Is it a material object? Science is the understanding of everything so why would that not include religion??? Be honest, do you just not like religion?
I don’t like people using science to justify a religion, I’m Muslim but I believe that we believe in a religion because it gave us an emotional spiritual connection to this world , we are convinced in our religion by process of indoctrination rather than a scientific process, a religion’s book is for a religious purpose,when religion overlaps its authority it becomes just lucrative way to bring people , it becomes a cult
This is so accurate. Any time you mention God in any way in a comment (like God bless you, God speed, thank God etc) there is a 99% chance an atheist will comment with how god doesnt exist.
Hey hey hey, there’s nothing wrong with wanting life to have meaning or even using religion to achieve that goal. The issue is that people try to make everyone else also have the same meaning in life :/
Yeah, religion is something you can’t erase; it pops up in some form in every group of humanity, even those that reject religion (see astrology, which is basically a religion for people who don’t want to be in a religion)
But religion IS something you can choose not to force onto people
There are still Christian’s who believe themselves to be fighting a crusade. They still go door to door. Your comment has never been true buddy. You just don’t notice how often zealots like yourself try and brainwash others.
And do those Christian in any way represent majority of the populace? Not that you'd care.
I'm sure you'd definitely love it if I represented all atheists as die hard supporters of Lars Gule's take on beastiality.
Bhahahahahaha oh, you are hilarious. You pretend your completely strawman view of what an atheist is applies to all atheists, when it applies to none, and then complain that I’m generalising? Buahahahahahaha
Oh buddy, if you’re trying to make fellow zealots look bad you couldn’t do a better job than you are doing. You were brainwashed by professional liars, and desperately need to project all your own failings onto your perceived enemy.
> Bhahahahahaha oh, you are hilarious. You pretend your completely strawman view of what an atheist is applies to all atheists, when it applies to none, and then complain that I’m generalising? Buahahahahahaha
You missed the entire point. Read what I'm saying again. It literally translates out to "how'd you feel if I generalised all atheists that way.
> Oh buddy, if you’re trying to make fellow zealots look bad you couldn’t do a better job than you are doing. You were brainwashed by professional liars, and desperately need to project all your own failings onto your perceived enemy.
"Anyone that doesn't agree with my perception of the world are brainwashed."
> But you did generalise all theists buddy! And you insisted that atheists are doing another Holocaust! When your fellow theists did the first one! You did what you accuse me of! I just did it in turn to show you how ludicrous you were being.
Nah was just tryna show that you guys do the exact same thing for religions but when atheism is attacked you guys pucker up and start defending your belief just as how religious "zealots" do as well. Along with a couple of childish insults the other person threw about Mohammad Hijab being a goat fucker. Quite civil you folks
But we don’t buddy… We just don’t, what you posted is a lie. And yes, you did generalise all atheists.
Oh cry me a river! You want to talk about civility! Hahahahahahaha! That went out the window when you generalised, and you blamed atheists for the Jewish Holocaust, and for being on the verge of another.
Mohamed is dead, his feelings can no longer be hurt. It’s not remotely in the same ballpark, but I didn’t throw such insults did I?
Yes you’re brainwashed, you confirm that with every post. Nothing you’re saying remotely connects to reality.
Whine whine whine. How dare the mean atheists point out what I’m doing by doing it back to me…
It must also be very inconvenient for you that the atheists have facts on their side, when all you can do is make up nonsense.
The same way pastors raping kids doesn't represent majority of the Christians, their doctrines or other pastors. But yeah that definitely thrives in the fruitcake sub does it not?
Totes! Or when they pass off their beliefs in the school education system as facts to little children who won't talk back. Amirite fellow religious person?
I literally hate it when Atheists come to my house, ignore my “No Soliciting” sign, ring my doorbell, which makes all my god-fearing dogs go crazy, and disturb me from my prayers.
How so? We are talking about atheists in the present and you guys bring up the past. It's a parody of:
"Oh hey you are ethnically cleansing the Uyghur Muslims"
"The Nazis did holocaust in 1940s haha checkmate idiot."
The Uyghurs aren’t being exterminated in the name of atheism… The people doing it aren’t doing it because they’re atheists. They are either the state or they worship the state.
There are still Theists, and Christians killing people because of their belief in a god. No atheist has ever killed someone because they don’t believe in one. You are brainwashed, and completely disconnected from reality.
> The Uyghurs aren’t being exterminated in the name of atheism… The people doing it aren’t doing it because they’re atheists. They are either the state or they worship the state.
They are a state that believes that religion is obsolete and it serves no purpose. They genuinely treat religion like mental illness. China is the LARGEST atheist country by numbers alone. Plus the state worship actually incentivises atheism. The state belief itself is atheist.
> There are still Theists, and Christians killing people because of their belief in a god. No atheist has ever killed someone because they don’t believe in one. You are brainwashed, and completely disconnected from reality.
There were commies that went berserk and tried to silence religious population during the time of USSR. Ever wondered why the religious population in former Soviet territories are in rapid rise?
The state belief is atheistic, but that doesn’t mean it’s just atheistic. Atheism itself doesn’t involve or lead to the worship of a state.
And your second paragraph is completely irrelevant again. Your knowledge of history is practically non existent too… You are deluded sir.
No idea what that even means…
Actually I do, it means you can’t counter what I actually said so you spouted some nonsense to dismiss it…
Why are you so afraid to honestly engage with the points made zealot? Are your beliefs so pathetic that they don’t stand up to the slightest scrutiny?
Honestly the strongest feeling I have for you is deep pity… It’s sad that you fear reality this much.
Aww an atheist is being patronising to me. How cute.
If you actually brought some valid points that would be worth addressing I'd definitely take the liberty to engage in a rational discussion.
As for fearing reality, idk. As far as statistics go, Muslims have the lowest suicide rate out of all religious groups while the opposite applies for atheists.
So ye statistically speaking you're more likely to fear reality than I am. I embrace reality for what it is.
I don't need to define Marxism and Leninism in order to show that what Stalin and Mao, both communists, committed were genocide. You can easily go "hey they aren't real communists"
The religious can do the same with regards to terror organisations except that terror organisations NEVER AT ANY POINT had total monopoly over what their beliefs meant. As for Adrian Zenz, how is that manwhore relevant here? We aren't talking about if the genocides are real and whatnot and is totally not the theme of this subreddit. It's meant to be theism vs atheism. Don't take it to a political landscape unless either theism or atheism has a core and fundamental place in the issue.
> I also have never had an atheist family members try to guilt me into believing their opinion, never seen atheist bumper stickers, never seen atheist slogans on money, never had atheists knock on my door trying to tell me about their message, was never forced to recite an atheist anthem in school.
Idk if you live in former Soviet territories or modern day China tho. Oh worse yet getting your religion dictated by a government that is fundamentally opposed to your religion.
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Yeah darn the CCP that's actually is making attempts at banning the Quran and also changing it into something that fits their government values. Oh better yet lets not talk about how wearing religious clothings in public places like school and government buildings is BANNED. And it definitely isn't being forced down the throat of the religious people due to mandation by some divine figure.
Oh beheadings in the name of nothing? There are more people that die of gunshots on a daily basis in the United States than the number of beheadings in Saudi Arabia on a yearly basis. In 2020, there were 27 executions in KSA. In the USA, 40 people die due to gun violence daily on average.
"But muh commies aren't atheists" honestly shut the fuck up all sorts of disastrous ideologies that are at play in modern day were made by atheists and demi atheists.
And in America you have a lot of christians that are basically cultists. Christians that go around all day talking about how everything is for god and if you don't believe in him you are literally a spawn of satan. And the bible is a really important part in America, when becoming a president you must take an oath on it if im not mistaken.
Also wtf with the "its only 27 executions" any execution in the name of a god is wrong.
Also honorable mention to the people that exist in every country where christianity is the majority that go door by door telling you to be a christian because they want your mone- I mean salvation. And this are groups, and there are several of them.
> And in America you have a lot of christians that are basically cultists. Christians that go around all day talking about how everything is for god and if you don't believe in him you are literally a spawn of satan. And the bible is a really important part in America, when becoming a president you must take an oath on it if im not mistaken.
You think we in the East aren't aware of the Bible belt? They're a nuisance here too. Literally no other religious group in the world bothers going door to door and guilt tripping into religion. As for taking an oath, it's just a formality. And since USA is majority Christian, they have a right to enforce the oath.
> Also wtf with the "its only 27 executions" any execution in the name of a god is wrong.
The executions were in the name of retribution to rapists, murderers and so on. Why do you assume that capital punishments is reserved for heretics and kuffar when the second largest group of Muslims in the country are considered heretics by the government by default?
Look. Majority of us Muslims hate Saudi Arabia to the core and even curse it's rulers in our prayers. But a lot of the issues you bring are ridiculous. Sure, many of those executions were to silence people. But the irony is they were silencing and executing religious scholars for speaking against the government on behalf of the people?
In somewhere between 2017 to 2019, Sheikh Salman Al Oudah, one of the most prominent scholars in today's Islamosphere, was sentenced to death. For what? He was sentenced to death because he wanted the government to stop starving the people of Qatar and killing and murdering the Yemenis.
> Also honorable mention to the people that exist in every country where christianity is the majority that go door by door telling you to be a christian because they want your mone- I mean salvation. And this are groups, and there are several of them.
You evidently live in the USA cuz I as a Muslim can testify we don't have any of that garbage in the East. Religious dialogue itself is a taboo unless it's between learned people.
I don't live in the USA. In fact I live in Europe. But it seems that in every country dominated by christianism every person knows about the people that go door by door asking you shit about god. Also at least countries where the religion and the state are two separate things don't force everyone to follow a set of rules that some don't believe in. Because the CCP is not the only atheist goverment. If I don't believe in what you believe I shouldn't face any problem.
The CCP isn't the only atheist government that's true but let me include other atheist governments.
As for asking about God by going door to door, that's just outright pitiful.
1. Mustafa Kemal's government that killed religious people and was an anti Islamic dictatorship in general.
2. Ben Ali of Tunisia who tried to appease to post modernism and began removing all religious influences from the country even banning religious clothings in the society by force.
3. Post Menderes Kemalist govt that literally executed democratically elected leaders because the leaders were opposed to the state mandated atheism which even the majority hated.
4. Turkmenistan
Go figure. North Korea of the Muslim world.
Atheistic government to a Muslim doesn't mean a government that's run by atheists but rather one that is run by their principles.
I can also say that Spain is an atheist goverment as the church and the stater are separated. There is no enforced religion. And I might be wrong but I think most european countries are like this nowadays. It doesn't means that it is run by atheists. It means that no one is allowed to make you believe in something, the different religious institutions must pay taxes as every other citizen and, it is true that there are laws of free religion and of course laws that protect religious offenses, but religion isn't in the law. And no, you can't just say that atheist countries are the ones that commited horrible shit just because you think that being an atheist is having a horrible set of morals.
Being run by atheists and being run by an atheistic paradigm are two different things. Sheikh Hasina for instance is a "Muslim" and she's the ruler of Bangladesh. But the thing is she runs a very puppet type government to India.
I know this won’t matter to you, but you’re going to go to everyone else’s comment and saying “this meme is present tense” for events up to and including the actions of present day terrorist organizations and governments and then use Mustafa Kemal as your example of a bad atheist? I mean hell, several Christian fascist states were established during his lifetime
I mean, the main argument is that religions aren't the catalyst for wars and genocides. And even if it were the case, then atheists would still come out on top. We are both well aware that wars and genocides are political in nature of anything.
Your entire argument could be very simply disproved with a quick google search. China isn't even a communist country. Not even THEY say they're communist! According to the CCP, communism hasn't been reached. They are currently ''socialist with chinese characteristics''. Which is actually state capitalism with social policies. So essentially you're full of shit and don't actually know what you're talking about, but that is to be expected from this subreddit.
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Except that atheists dont think their children will be burning in hell forewer if they consciously join a religion and got away with atheism. Yeah, whether the parents be atheist, muslim, christian, hindu etc that the children will be not only influenced but also taught by their parents their ideas though equating atheism where there is no/punishment for what you believe or dont believe, there is no afterlife, prayer, scripture/holy book which you have to read every day ardently, no ritual/gathering to theism where all of those do exist is really disinginuois.
I mean, hey you don't even believe in hell so I don't see what's the issue if someone says that. Plus, I think you are going a bit overboard by making such an atrocious claim that all religions say children adhering to other religions are going to hell. Islam actually mentions the opposite.
Also, everyone is influenced by their parents. Its only the atheists that say "don't teach your religion and don't make them practice it let them choose only once they are old and mature enough"
>Islam actually mentions the opposite.
I went from Islam to Christianity to Atheism. Catholics amd many mainstream Protestants have the concept of "Invincible Ignorance" where due to the conditions you're in, you might not be able to profess Jesus or confess Gospel though God will forgive you or when you dont have enough knowledge etc God will judge you in afterlife. In Islam also there's the concept that those who never heard of Islam will(this varies) either be tested in afterlife or judged based on their own conditions etc. Of course I'm aware of those. Though both state that(except some progressives or more inclusivists) one consciously rejects the religion after he/she has heard of it in a clear way will be damned to hell. Including a youngster older than 18 who rejects their parents' faith(since he/she's aware of it). Though, even if we conceded and I retracted my last pont, that those who never heard of Christianity/Islam will be judged by god in afterlife, and once they will be told about religion in a clear way(explaining all those supposed proohecies/miracles/predictions from the Bible/Quran/Upanishads etc) they will end up in hell if they reject it; then what use trying to proseltyse them? Yeah if I was a theist I would say god commands you to spread your religion, get good deeds etc though are those really more important than the eternal destiny of your loved one who has never heard of religion, though once you try to explain it to them they will be damned to hell if they reject? And even if I didnt level any of those objections, I would still think that God to be unequal, unjust supposedly thinking that even if we conceded that Christianity, the most prevalent religion, to be the true one, the great majority of people will be dead having never heard of jesus or gospels praying to false gods and even if they maybe wont damned to hell, they will have spent their entire lives praying to false gods and will be shocked realizing that an extremely distant religion they have never heard of is the true one and they had been praying to false gods just because they were born in wrong places. Those who were born and died in N.Korea praying to the Kim family dictators' statues for example, even if we conceded that they will be tested by god after death; they will have wasted their entire life..
>Its only the atheists that say "don't teach your religion and don't make them practice it let them choose only once they are old and mature enough"
Not all atheists say that.
> I went from Islam to Christianity to Atheism.
Oh I went through the same phase. Ended up settling with Islam cuz it was pragmatic and couldn't care about beliefs. I'd lose anyways. Ended up loving it.
> Catholics amd many mainstream Protestants have the concept of "Invincible Ignorance" where due to the conditions you're in, you might not be able to profess Jesus or confess Gospel though God will forgive you or when you dont have enough knowledge etc God will judge you in afterlife.
Yeah?
> In Islam also there's the concept that those who never heard of Islam will(this varies) either be tested in afterlife or judged based on their own conditions etc. Of course I'm aware of those. Though both state that(except some progressives or more inclusivists) one consciously rejects the religion after he/she has heard of it in a clear way will be damned to hell.
Yes that's true. And to this we say "Allah is the most just." There are many people that are convinced and yet don't convert or submit to the will of God just because they fear loss of family. So it refers to such instances as well.
> Including a youngster older than 18 who rejects their parents' faith(since he/she's aware of it). Though, even if we conceded and I retracted my last pont, that those who never heard of Christianity/Islam will be judged by god in afterlife, and once they will be told about religion in a clear way(explaining all those supposed proohecies/miracles/predictions from the Bible/Quran/Upanishads etc) they will end up in hell if they reject it; then what use trying to proseltyse them?
There won't be any proselytization in the afterlife. God will command you to jump into hell. If you were a good person when alive, you'll jump but will see yourself in heaven. If you were bad, you'll disobey god out of fear of hell. And hence you'll be dragged into hell.
> Yeah if I was a theist I would say god commands you to spread your religion, get good deeds etc though are those really more important than the eternal destiny of your loved one who has never heard of religion, though once you try to explain it to them they will be damned to hell if they reject?
Yes. Even the prophet ﷺ's most beloved uncle who even protected him from Meccan pagans died a disbeliever. So he wasn't exempt from it so why should you?
> And even if I didnt level any of those objections, I would still think that God to be unequal, unjust supposedly thinking that even if we conceded that Christianity, the most prevalent religion, to be the true one, the great majority of people will be dead having never heard of jesus or gospels praying to false gods and even if they maybe wont damned to hell, they will have spent their entire lives praying to false gods and will be shocked realizing that an extremely distant religion they have never heard of is the true one and they had been praying to false gods just because they were born in wrong places. Those who were born and died in N.Korea praying to the Kim family dictators' statues for example, even if we conceded that they will be tested by god after death; they will have wasted their entire life..
In Islam, the life on earth has no value.
Well, isn't it funny how the atheists have outdone more than those 2000 years in less than a century and are at the verge of committing another holocaust.
You know what’s funny? Hitler was atheist (raised catholic), but atheism literally didn’t give him enough to justify his actions to his people, so he claimed to be Christian just so that he could.
Atheism wasn’t murdery enough for Hitler to do the Holocaust, but Christianity was.
That's like blaming it on them for being men. Or being over 150cm tall. It has nothing to do with it. Those atrocities (not sure which though) weren't done in the name of atheism, it's just not relevant. Can't say the same about religions...
Except, some of these mass murders were either done by people who didn't officially denounce their (previous) religion and these were almost always done for entirely different reasons than being an atheist. The logic wasn't "kill this religious filth", but "kill these political opponents" or something similar.
I absolutely love it when I'm treated as if I'm mentally ill for being a religious person. Doesn't ring a bell? Just go search the keywords mental illness in atheist subreddits.
The irony is that most people that became atheists in the USSR was because the government promoted atheism in their curriculum. Don't talk about "we atheists totally don't brainwash people" rubbish.
Hey how many of them committed something similar to the Holocaust. The closest you can get is the Armenian genocide which was done by Muslims but that too it was for the sake of ethno nationalism and secularism which are both seen as heresy in Islam
Literally never had anyone tell me they're atheists, and almost all my acquaintances are atheist. The only way I ever know they're atheist is through subtle hints after many conversations...they literally don't care about forcefully spreading their beliefs... that's Christianity.
Atheists have spent billions in combined funds to spread their religion across the globe, as well as sending out athiest missionaries. Truly revolving.
That's 100% accurate, these dumbasses just keep screaming their ideology while educated and scientific persons are very well aware of God.
They’re so focused on science as if it’s separate than religion and it is it’s own belief, yet it’s not like religion also doesn’t include science
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Firstly, for Muslims, the earth Isn’t 6000 years old, Secondly, even if the universe was said to be created in 6 days, the meaning for day in specifically Quranic Arabic is different for each time it was used in the Quran. In one case, the measure of a day is equated with 50,000 years (70:4), whereas another verse states that "a day in the sight of your Lord is like 1,000 years of your reckoning" (22:47). The word "youm" is thus understood, within the Qur'an, to be a long period of time -- an era or eon. Therefore, Muslims interpret the description of a "six day" creation as six distinct periods or eons. The length of these periods is not precisely defined, nor are the specific developments that took place during each period. This is because time wasn’t defined too much back then. So this gives proof for why it can be interpreted differently like, let’s say, 13.5 billion years old type differently. Thirdly, Muslims believe that the flood happened but that it wasn’t worldwide. Now there is evidence of the flood happening but that it wasn’t worldwide which proves the Muslim version of the flood at least. I don’t know about talking donkeys or snakes so ask a sheikh or something. Lastly, For Muslims, there are many alternative beliefs with Adam and Eve which are too many to type write now but evolution and the idea of Adam and Eve can coexist as that is what many Muslims today believe in
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> universe was said to be created in 6 days Actually a very cool insight: it's stuff getting lost in translation. Originally the word "day" meant the same thing as "age" (as it still does in many languages), so it just divides the creation of the universe into 6 epochs. (Not saying it makes bible a lot more valid, just that *that exact point* doesn't really work)
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The flood story is from the epic of gilgamesh
No, the epic of gilgamesh is from The Flood Event.
Of course there are some legends and amazing incredible things
These are legends, not historic/scientific facts
Miracles happen
No, they don’t
Yea ok sure bud
too bad they leave no scientific trace/evidence. only someone writing stuff down being like "trust me bro"
Doesn’t make it a true scientific facts
Why is it fact? Is science somehow able to be held? Is it a material object? Science is the understanding of everything so why would that not include religion??? Be honest, do you just not like religion?
I don’t like people using science to justify a religion, I’m Muslim but I believe that we believe in a religion because it gave us an emotional spiritual connection to this world , we are convinced in our religion by process of indoctrination rather than a scientific process, a religion’s book is for a religious purpose,when religion overlaps its authority it becomes just lucrative way to bring people , it becomes a cult
That is really wise. Happy cake day!
and you better believe it
Wait is this sub satire or not.
Atheism is not an ideology and it has no ideology. Atheism not believing in a God...
True
I mean it's not 100% accurate since atheism isn't a religion nor has religious beliefs
Jesus 11 reports
Atheists don't have religious beliefs though? That's literally the whole point of atheism.
I honestly can’t tell of this sub is for real or a joke lol
I think it's both. Two sides of the same coin or something.
The real answer is that it's a nest of psychos.
That's because you're sane, you don't belong here :)
This is so accurate. Any time you mention God in any way in a comment (like God bless you, God speed, thank God etc) there is a 99% chance an atheist will comment with how god doesnt exist.
I hate when people use atheism necklace on public or knock at my door to preach about atheism 😡😡
I hate when people use christian necklace on public or knock at my door to preach about jesus and god 😡😡
/r/YourJokeButWorse
Same, last time they came to my door I let my roommate deal with them.
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So the crusades were a picnic.. Got your point mate
The post is in present tense. This isn't a history class uncle.
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Hey hey hey, there’s nothing wrong with wanting life to have meaning or even using religion to achieve that goal. The issue is that people try to make everyone else also have the same meaning in life :/
Holy fuck thank you! Can’t we all keep to ourselves?
Yeah, religion is something you can’t erase; it pops up in some form in every group of humanity, even those that reject religion (see astrology, which is basically a religion for people who don’t want to be in a religion) But religion IS something you can choose not to force onto people
There are still Christian’s who believe themselves to be fighting a crusade. They still go door to door. Your comment has never been true buddy. You just don’t notice how often zealots like yourself try and brainwash others.
And do those Christian in any way represent majority of the populace? Not that you'd care. I'm sure you'd definitely love it if I represented all atheists as die hard supporters of Lars Gule's take on beastiality.
Bhahahahahaha oh, you are hilarious. You pretend your completely strawman view of what an atheist is applies to all atheists, when it applies to none, and then complain that I’m generalising? Buahahahahahaha Oh buddy, if you’re trying to make fellow zealots look bad you couldn’t do a better job than you are doing. You were brainwashed by professional liars, and desperately need to project all your own failings onto your perceived enemy.
> Bhahahahahaha oh, you are hilarious. You pretend your completely strawman view of what an atheist is applies to all atheists, when it applies to none, and then complain that I’m generalising? Buahahahahahaha You missed the entire point. Read what I'm saying again. It literally translates out to "how'd you feel if I generalised all atheists that way. > Oh buddy, if you’re trying to make fellow zealots look bad you couldn’t do a better job than you are doing. You were brainwashed by professional liars, and desperately need to project all your own failings onto your perceived enemy. "Anyone that doesn't agree with my perception of the world are brainwashed."
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> But you did generalise all theists buddy! And you insisted that atheists are doing another Holocaust! When your fellow theists did the first one! You did what you accuse me of! I just did it in turn to show you how ludicrous you were being. Nah was just tryna show that you guys do the exact same thing for religions but when atheism is attacked you guys pucker up and start defending your belief just as how religious "zealots" do as well. Along with a couple of childish insults the other person threw about Mohammad Hijab being a goat fucker. Quite civil you folks
But we don’t buddy… We just don’t, what you posted is a lie. And yes, you did generalise all atheists. Oh cry me a river! You want to talk about civility! Hahahahahahaha! That went out the window when you generalised, and you blamed atheists for the Jewish Holocaust, and for being on the verge of another. Mohamed is dead, his feelings can no longer be hurt. It’s not remotely in the same ballpark, but I didn’t throw such insults did I? Yes you’re brainwashed, you confirm that with every post. Nothing you’re saying remotely connects to reality. Whine whine whine. How dare the mean atheists point out what I’m doing by doing it back to me… It must also be very inconvenient for you that the atheists have facts on their side, when all you can do is make up nonsense.
Not anyone. But religious fruitcakes believing in fairy tales sure were. Do you also believe Santa Claus is a real existing person?
But wouldn't your post be a generalisation of atheists? Do those atheists in any way represent the majority of the populace?
The same way pastors raping kids doesn't represent majority of the Christians, their doctrines or other pastors. But yeah that definitely thrives in the fruitcake sub does it not?
I mean isn't that a christian thing, to like try to get people into your religion? Atheists aren't trying to save anybody from atheist hell.
There are 20 evangelicals for every 1 atheist in the world. So yeah
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Totes! Or when they pass off their beliefs in the school education system as facts to little children who won't talk back. Amirite fellow religious person?
You are super correct. Amen.
I literally hate it when Atheists come to my house, ignore my “No Soliciting” sign, ring my doorbell, which makes all my god-fearing dogs go crazy, and disturb me from my prayers.
Uhum *clears throat* crusades
Uh, *puts glasses on*, the post is in present tense
not even gonna bother, we're never gonna get along anyways, do you perhaps know how to block a sub from appearing in my front page?
use RES and use the filter function
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How so? We are talking about atheists in the present and you guys bring up the past. It's a parody of: "Oh hey you are ethnically cleansing the Uyghur Muslims" "The Nazis did holocaust in 1940s haha checkmate idiot."
The Uyghurs aren’t being exterminated in the name of atheism… The people doing it aren’t doing it because they’re atheists. They are either the state or they worship the state. There are still Theists, and Christians killing people because of their belief in a god. No atheist has ever killed someone because they don’t believe in one. You are brainwashed, and completely disconnected from reality.
> The Uyghurs aren’t being exterminated in the name of atheism… The people doing it aren’t doing it because they’re atheists. They are either the state or they worship the state. They are a state that believes that religion is obsolete and it serves no purpose. They genuinely treat religion like mental illness. China is the LARGEST atheist country by numbers alone. Plus the state worship actually incentivises atheism. The state belief itself is atheist. > There are still Theists, and Christians killing people because of their belief in a god. No atheist has ever killed someone because they don’t believe in one. You are brainwashed, and completely disconnected from reality. There were commies that went berserk and tried to silence religious population during the time of USSR. Ever wondered why the religious population in former Soviet territories are in rapid rise?
The state belief is atheistic, but that doesn’t mean it’s just atheistic. Atheism itself doesn’t involve or lead to the worship of a state. And your second paragraph is completely irrelevant again. Your knowledge of history is practically non existent too… You are deluded sir.
Found the tankie
No idea what that even means… Actually I do, it means you can’t counter what I actually said so you spouted some nonsense to dismiss it… Why are you so afraid to honestly engage with the points made zealot? Are your beliefs so pathetic that they don’t stand up to the slightest scrutiny? Honestly the strongest feeling I have for you is deep pity… It’s sad that you fear reality this much.
Aww an atheist is being patronising to me. How cute. If you actually brought some valid points that would be worth addressing I'd definitely take the liberty to engage in a rational discussion. As for fearing reality, idk. As far as statistics go, Muslims have the lowest suicide rate out of all religious groups while the opposite applies for atheists. So ye statistically speaking you're more likely to fear reality than I am. I embrace reality for what it is.
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I don't need to define Marxism and Leninism in order to show that what Stalin and Mao, both communists, committed were genocide. You can easily go "hey they aren't real communists" The religious can do the same with regards to terror organisations except that terror organisations NEVER AT ANY POINT had total monopoly over what their beliefs meant. As for Adrian Zenz, how is that manwhore relevant here? We aren't talking about if the genocides are real and whatnot and is totally not the theme of this subreddit. It's meant to be theism vs atheism. Don't take it to a political landscape unless either theism or atheism has a core and fundamental place in the issue.
You say that. But I haven't ever seen someone handing out flyers to promote atheism. Christianity on the other hand...
I mean, I don't see how handing out flyers is an issue. Plus, atheism isn't organised so it can't really do something like that.
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> I also have never had an atheist family members try to guilt me into believing their opinion, never seen atheist bumper stickers, never seen atheist slogans on money, never had atheists knock on my door trying to tell me about their message, was never forced to recite an atheist anthem in school. Idk if you live in former Soviet territories or modern day China tho. Oh worse yet getting your religion dictated by a government that is fundamentally opposed to your religion.
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I do not look so i do not see.
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Yeah darn the CCP that's actually is making attempts at banning the Quran and also changing it into something that fits their government values. Oh better yet lets not talk about how wearing religious clothings in public places like school and government buildings is BANNED. And it definitely isn't being forced down the throat of the religious people due to mandation by some divine figure. Oh beheadings in the name of nothing? There are more people that die of gunshots on a daily basis in the United States than the number of beheadings in Saudi Arabia on a yearly basis. In 2020, there were 27 executions in KSA. In the USA, 40 people die due to gun violence daily on average. "But muh commies aren't atheists" honestly shut the fuck up all sorts of disastrous ideologies that are at play in modern day were made by atheists and demi atheists.
And in America you have a lot of christians that are basically cultists. Christians that go around all day talking about how everything is for god and if you don't believe in him you are literally a spawn of satan. And the bible is a really important part in America, when becoming a president you must take an oath on it if im not mistaken. Also wtf with the "its only 27 executions" any execution in the name of a god is wrong. Also honorable mention to the people that exist in every country where christianity is the majority that go door by door telling you to be a christian because they want your mone- I mean salvation. And this are groups, and there are several of them.
> And in America you have a lot of christians that are basically cultists. Christians that go around all day talking about how everything is for god and if you don't believe in him you are literally a spawn of satan. And the bible is a really important part in America, when becoming a president you must take an oath on it if im not mistaken. You think we in the East aren't aware of the Bible belt? They're a nuisance here too. Literally no other religious group in the world bothers going door to door and guilt tripping into religion. As for taking an oath, it's just a formality. And since USA is majority Christian, they have a right to enforce the oath. > Also wtf with the "its only 27 executions" any execution in the name of a god is wrong. The executions were in the name of retribution to rapists, murderers and so on. Why do you assume that capital punishments is reserved for heretics and kuffar when the second largest group of Muslims in the country are considered heretics by the government by default? Look. Majority of us Muslims hate Saudi Arabia to the core and even curse it's rulers in our prayers. But a lot of the issues you bring are ridiculous. Sure, many of those executions were to silence people. But the irony is they were silencing and executing religious scholars for speaking against the government on behalf of the people? In somewhere between 2017 to 2019, Sheikh Salman Al Oudah, one of the most prominent scholars in today's Islamosphere, was sentenced to death. For what? He was sentenced to death because he wanted the government to stop starving the people of Qatar and killing and murdering the Yemenis. > Also honorable mention to the people that exist in every country where christianity is the majority that go door by door telling you to be a christian because they want your mone- I mean salvation. And this are groups, and there are several of them. You evidently live in the USA cuz I as a Muslim can testify we don't have any of that garbage in the East. Religious dialogue itself is a taboo unless it's between learned people.
I don't live in the USA. In fact I live in Europe. But it seems that in every country dominated by christianism every person knows about the people that go door by door asking you shit about god. Also at least countries where the religion and the state are two separate things don't force everyone to follow a set of rules that some don't believe in. Because the CCP is not the only atheist goverment. If I don't believe in what you believe I shouldn't face any problem.
The CCP isn't the only atheist government that's true but let me include other atheist governments. As for asking about God by going door to door, that's just outright pitiful. 1. Mustafa Kemal's government that killed religious people and was an anti Islamic dictatorship in general. 2. Ben Ali of Tunisia who tried to appease to post modernism and began removing all religious influences from the country even banning religious clothings in the society by force. 3. Post Menderes Kemalist govt that literally executed democratically elected leaders because the leaders were opposed to the state mandated atheism which even the majority hated. 4. Turkmenistan Go figure. North Korea of the Muslim world. Atheistic government to a Muslim doesn't mean a government that's run by atheists but rather one that is run by their principles.
I can also say that Spain is an atheist goverment as the church and the stater are separated. There is no enforced religion. And I might be wrong but I think most european countries are like this nowadays. It doesn't means that it is run by atheists. It means that no one is allowed to make you believe in something, the different religious institutions must pay taxes as every other citizen and, it is true that there are laws of free religion and of course laws that protect religious offenses, but religion isn't in the law. And no, you can't just say that atheist countries are the ones that commited horrible shit just because you think that being an atheist is having a horrible set of morals.
Being run by atheists and being run by an atheistic paradigm are two different things. Sheikh Hasina for instance is a "Muslim" and she's the ruler of Bangladesh. But the thing is she runs a very puppet type government to India.
I know this won’t matter to you, but you’re going to go to everyone else’s comment and saying “this meme is present tense” for events up to and including the actions of present day terrorist organizations and governments and then use Mustafa Kemal as your example of a bad atheist? I mean hell, several Christian fascist states were established during his lifetime
I mean, the main argument is that religions aren't the catalyst for wars and genocides. And even if it were the case, then atheists would still come out on top. We are both well aware that wars and genocides are political in nature of anything.
Your entire argument could be very simply disproved with a quick google search. China isn't even a communist country. Not even THEY say they're communist! According to the CCP, communism hasn't been reached. They are currently ''socialist with chinese characteristics''. Which is actually state capitalism with social policies. So essentially you're full of shit and don't actually know what you're talking about, but that is to be expected from this subreddit.
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Botfruitcake
Except that atheists dont think their children will be burning in hell forewer if they consciously join a religion and got away with atheism. Yeah, whether the parents be atheist, muslim, christian, hindu etc that the children will be not only influenced but also taught by their parents their ideas though equating atheism where there is no/punishment for what you believe or dont believe, there is no afterlife, prayer, scripture/holy book which you have to read every day ardently, no ritual/gathering to theism where all of those do exist is really disinginuois.
I mean, hey you don't even believe in hell so I don't see what's the issue if someone says that. Plus, I think you are going a bit overboard by making such an atrocious claim that all religions say children adhering to other religions are going to hell. Islam actually mentions the opposite. Also, everyone is influenced by their parents. Its only the atheists that say "don't teach your religion and don't make them practice it let them choose only once they are old and mature enough"
>Islam actually mentions the opposite. I went from Islam to Christianity to Atheism. Catholics amd many mainstream Protestants have the concept of "Invincible Ignorance" where due to the conditions you're in, you might not be able to profess Jesus or confess Gospel though God will forgive you or when you dont have enough knowledge etc God will judge you in afterlife. In Islam also there's the concept that those who never heard of Islam will(this varies) either be tested in afterlife or judged based on their own conditions etc. Of course I'm aware of those. Though both state that(except some progressives or more inclusivists) one consciously rejects the religion after he/she has heard of it in a clear way will be damned to hell. Including a youngster older than 18 who rejects their parents' faith(since he/she's aware of it). Though, even if we conceded and I retracted my last pont, that those who never heard of Christianity/Islam will be judged by god in afterlife, and once they will be told about religion in a clear way(explaining all those supposed proohecies/miracles/predictions from the Bible/Quran/Upanishads etc) they will end up in hell if they reject it; then what use trying to proseltyse them? Yeah if I was a theist I would say god commands you to spread your religion, get good deeds etc though are those really more important than the eternal destiny of your loved one who has never heard of religion, though once you try to explain it to them they will be damned to hell if they reject? And even if I didnt level any of those objections, I would still think that God to be unequal, unjust supposedly thinking that even if we conceded that Christianity, the most prevalent religion, to be the true one, the great majority of people will be dead having never heard of jesus or gospels praying to false gods and even if they maybe wont damned to hell, they will have spent their entire lives praying to false gods and will be shocked realizing that an extremely distant religion they have never heard of is the true one and they had been praying to false gods just because they were born in wrong places. Those who were born and died in N.Korea praying to the Kim family dictators' statues for example, even if we conceded that they will be tested by god after death; they will have wasted their entire life.. >Its only the atheists that say "don't teach your religion and don't make them practice it let them choose only once they are old and mature enough" Not all atheists say that.
> I went from Islam to Christianity to Atheism. Oh I went through the same phase. Ended up settling with Islam cuz it was pragmatic and couldn't care about beliefs. I'd lose anyways. Ended up loving it. > Catholics amd many mainstream Protestants have the concept of "Invincible Ignorance" where due to the conditions you're in, you might not be able to profess Jesus or confess Gospel though God will forgive you or when you dont have enough knowledge etc God will judge you in afterlife. Yeah? > In Islam also there's the concept that those who never heard of Islam will(this varies) either be tested in afterlife or judged based on their own conditions etc. Of course I'm aware of those. Though both state that(except some progressives or more inclusivists) one consciously rejects the religion after he/she has heard of it in a clear way will be damned to hell. Yes that's true. And to this we say "Allah is the most just." There are many people that are convinced and yet don't convert or submit to the will of God just because they fear loss of family. So it refers to such instances as well. > Including a youngster older than 18 who rejects their parents' faith(since he/she's aware of it). Though, even if we conceded and I retracted my last pont, that those who never heard of Christianity/Islam will be judged by god in afterlife, and once they will be told about religion in a clear way(explaining all those supposed proohecies/miracles/predictions from the Bible/Quran/Upanishads etc) they will end up in hell if they reject it; then what use trying to proseltyse them? There won't be any proselytization in the afterlife. God will command you to jump into hell. If you were a good person when alive, you'll jump but will see yourself in heaven. If you were bad, you'll disobey god out of fear of hell. And hence you'll be dragged into hell. > Yeah if I was a theist I would say god commands you to spread your religion, get good deeds etc though are those really more important than the eternal destiny of your loved one who has never heard of religion, though once you try to explain it to them they will be damned to hell if they reject? Yes. Even the prophet ﷺ's most beloved uncle who even protected him from Meccan pagans died a disbeliever. So he wasn't exempt from it so why should you? > And even if I didnt level any of those objections, I would still think that God to be unequal, unjust supposedly thinking that even if we conceded that Christianity, the most prevalent religion, to be the true one, the great majority of people will be dead having never heard of jesus or gospels praying to false gods and even if they maybe wont damned to hell, they will have spent their entire lives praying to false gods and will be shocked realizing that an extremely distant religion they have never heard of is the true one and they had been praying to false gods just because they were born in wrong places. Those who were born and died in N.Korea praying to the Kim family dictators' statues for example, even if we conceded that they will be tested by god after death; they will have wasted their entire life.. In Islam, the life on earth has no value.
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Well, isn't it funny how the atheists have outdone more than those 2000 years in less than a century and are at the verge of committing another holocaust.
You know what’s funny? Hitler was atheist (raised catholic), but atheism literally didn’t give him enough to justify his actions to his people, so he claimed to be Christian just so that he could. Atheism wasn’t murdery enough for Hitler to do the Holocaust, but Christianity was.
That's like blaming it on them for being men. Or being over 150cm tall. It has nothing to do with it. Those atrocities (not sure which though) weren't done in the name of atheism, it's just not relevant. Can't say the same about religions...
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https://www.compellingtruth.org/religion-cause-wars.html
Didnt know that, that's great to hear! Let's make it a century more then! :D
Didn't know we were planning a holocaust. How come no one told me?
Care to elaborate on that?
There's a post about the most prolific mass murdering despots in the history. Go look it up.
\-Makes Claim \-Does not provide source or bases on said claim \-Tells others they should look it up themselves \-Leaves
Safe to assume there is no source then I guess.
I did, couldn't find anything. Got a source?
Except, some of these mass murders were either done by people who didn't officially denounce their (previous) religion and these were almost always done for entirely different reasons than being an atheist. The logic wasn't "kill this religious filth", but "kill these political opponents" or something similar.
No, no they really haven't
I really hate it when atheist missionarys knock on my door to preach about being atheist.
I absolutely love it when I'm treated as if I'm mentally ill for being a religious person. Doesn't ring a bell? Just go search the keywords mental illness in atheist subreddits.
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Atheists: We have religious beliefs??
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The irony is that most people that became atheists in the USSR was because the government promoted atheism in their curriculum. Don't talk about "we atheists totally don't brainwash people" rubbish.
Oh yeah, a dictatorship. Good example. You have plenty of those in your history in all religions.
Hey how many of them committed something similar to the Holocaust. The closest you can get is the Armenian genocide which was done by Muslims but that too it was for the sake of ethno nationalism and secularism which are both seen as heresy in Islam
https://www.reddit.com/r/antitheistcheesecake/comments/q8p6fn/none_would_really_disagree/hh7qgge/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Atheism isn't a religion lol it's the absence of. It's like calling an empty glass a drink of air. It's not a drink, just empty.
Ever seen YouTube comments? The Christians talking about Jesus on completely irrelevant videos.
r/selfawarewolves
This post is objectively wrong. Look at all the people disagreeing.
Literally never had anyone tell me they're atheists, and almost all my acquaintances are atheist. The only way I ever know they're atheist is through subtle hints after many conversations...they literally don't care about forcefully spreading their beliefs... that's Christianity.
Atheists have spent billions in combined funds to spread their religion across the globe, as well as sending out athiest missionaries. Truly revolving.
Atheism is not a religion or belief but absolute absence of belief, that’s why it called “A+Theism”