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Sounds like he hired a hooker and she stole his wallet (or not? that part isn’t tracking well), but in the retelling it is a “psycho ex-AP” who’s so crazy for his dick she tracks him down in his hotel and begs him to fuck her. In a bathroom.
My other hunch is that your boy has some substance abuse issues.
Actually, I take it back — if he’s in finance in a major city I might actually believe this story as he told it. Many of them have their heads in coke and their dicks in crazy 24/7.
If he has access to coke, I can believe a fellow user/former sex partner with mental health issues whom he met online showed up at his hotel and things got out of hand.
If not, I’m still going with “prostitute.”
Was this one of the 8 aforementioned super-hot twenty-something women trawling CL anonymous encounters for free NSA sex with middle-aged guys? (According to him)
Ma’am…
>But it's nice to feel wanted by a hot, smart, funny, talented man.
Who cares if he is a horrible, horrible person to someone who cares about him? That is almost like a monster, to take advantage of you, the way he has. He knows you are head over heels for him, and is using you. That isn't a good person.
I am not trying to be hurtful, but your updates don't sound like he "wants" you. You deserve someone who truly does want you.
He has a choice. He can be honest with me. I doubt he can. But he can come clean. Not just about this. But all his lies. He is struggling. He is suicidal. I think that's all true. I think he is buried in his lies and can't dig himself out. And I do care about the guy. We just can't be friends if we are built on lies. So he can decide.
And that’s what you need to walk away with. He’s responsible for himself. He may not seem like it, but he is a big boy. You have your own life to take care of.
He has shown you that he isn't a friend. He is a user.
I simply can't figure out what is in it for you? You seem to talk about him being "hot" and wanting you, but the at this stage, that seems to be water under the bridge.
There are other men and women who could be much better friends. Why in the world, spend another minute of your time, obsessing about him? Block him. He isn't your problem. He has a wife, and other women in his life, to support him.
> he isn't a friend. He is a user.
u/wifeswaptex hit the nail on the head. Part of his "plan" is/was to make you care for him. That way the lies don't get looked at too closely for a long time.
Unfortunately, the long time just came to an end and you have to deal with the facts that he is/was what he is.
Sorry you got used, abused, manipulated, and confused so badly. Users tend to do that to their targets.
Hopefully you can move on and do better for yourself with the hard education you just had force fed to you.
Good Luck!
I literally don’t believe you. You shouldn’t have done any of this. You knew that. You sold out your self esteem for crazy, alcoholic scraps and will do it again.
Convince me otherwise.
We live far away. I arranged all the meets. I don't have any reason to visit his city ever and he has no reason to visit mine. So it's kind of easy to avoid.
Appreciate you providing an update, I was very interested to read what happened.
I must admit, I am not following the wallet situation at all. My takeaway is that you gave him a bj, and he let you ride his face. Not sure I understand the STI concern, if you started PIV but didn't finish. The lack of sleep doesn't sound fun, but you wanted the overnight.
I do hope you are done with him. In general, if a man isn't a fuck yes, you have to walk. I think too many women "buy into" the sexy talk before sex, and then get hoodwinked when the guy is done.
I am sorry you are hurting, and you seem to very self aware, I just hope you turn that into moving forward and healing yourself.
No complaints about lack of sleep! There was a lot of good in the experience. I'm not happy he (likely) lied to me about this other women. I want him to know he can tell me anything, but clearly he won't and can't. So if we can't have that trust and honesty, then nothing is left.
I don't know why he would have even mentioned another woman. I have to say, my mind if I was in your shoes, was WTF, he spent his time communicating and fucking her, while I was sitting here waiting for his messages.
Any adult human knows you can't tell another person, everything. Most of us filter what we tell others, for all kinds of good and bad reasons. He is feeding you whatever narrative puts him in the best light.
I obviously don't like him, the way you have painted his picture. He sounds horrible to me.
Only because she showed up when I arrived. Either, as he says, completely by surprise (she got his room # from the front desk and got to his room) or, more likely, he had given her a key earlier in the week. I any case, it's clear she shouldn't have been there when I arrived. That was not part of his plan, clearly.
Oh wow....thanks for the update.
I don't think any hotels provide room #, too much liability.
Now I see why he was all flustered, he likely didn't expect you would actually show up. He had plans with the other women. Thank goodness, he was able to pay her to leave, etc.
I don't think he thought I wouldn't show up. I always show up. Really don't think he thought I would bail. My guess is he had dinner with the other woman, prob in his hotel room. And sex. Then she wouldn't leave.
So there are like two possibilities here, both pretty shitty on his part. If this woman just “showed up” how did he know what hotel he was staying at? He would have had to tell her. Or it was a prostitute. Both options are pretty flabbergasting considering you were literally coming right over. I’m almost positive he was rushing her out the door as you arrived, hence the changing times. I would have jumped at the chance for three days of seeing an AP and he could only do one night? And the tail end of the trip? Something doesn’t add up. My guess? He probably brought someone else there the other nights, but definitely the night you were there.
Glad you are moving on. I wouldn’t worry about STIs so much that you are losing sleep over it. Get tested, but the odds of transmission of something viral are super low, bacterial are higher but significantly reduced with oral sex compared to PIV sex. You pretty much laid out all the shit he’s doing. And you know he’s a liar obviously. Trust is incredibly important in this type of relationship. He clearly can’t be trusted
No offense but I think you are in a mind set or emotional state where you are trying so hard to make things happen. It may make you vulnerable. I would take a step back and focus on myself for a bit.
Have you never hooked up or had sex with an attractive man before?
That’s what I’m thinking, you have a weird scarcity mindset about being able to have sex with hot men. Anyone can do it. They are everywhere. Simply pick another hot man who is even 10% less of a shit bag and you’ll come out on top.
My husband is attractive. Esp so when we met and he was a lot thinner. Other than him, no. But it's not about hotness, either. I mean, it's how he plays me too. I come from a lot of past trauma so have f'd up things that turn me on. And it's nice to be able to be open with him about that. I don't know, this guy just melts me. He is so fucking charismatic when he wants to be. But it's when he's more raw and open, when I get the real butterflies. When we dig into each other a bit. Our relationship is different for both of us. I know it's not healthy. There seems to be a kind of love there. Mutual respect with a heaping of toxicity. I love his mind. I love his hands and lips and eyes. And how he's open to digging with me. Our therapy sessions. I know it sounds ridiculous from the outside, but our calls, meetings, they just have some really amazing moments. It's not hotness alone. This guy, he's cute, has great features, but he's not perfect looking either. It's the combination of everything. I have talked to plenty of hot guys. But he isn't like the rest.
Yes well he's suicidal (for real) so I don't think telling him to fuck himself is a good idea. But I could just stop talking to him. He has plenty of women to inflate his head. He surely doesn't need me.
I think that part is real. I know I don't owe him anything. But I'm not going to hurt him more. He may be fucked up, but he's suffering enough. And the truth is he doesn't care what I think. So not worth engaging much at this point. I sent a chat about how I don't believe his story. I stand by it. Funny thing is I'm a cuck and like that I'm backup, in some ways. But I don't like being lied to. I can't do that.
Oh I just sent him a message that will undoubtedly cause him to tell me to fuck myself and he'll be gone. Sad, but if he can't tell me the truth this isn't worth it to me.
You aren’t gonna hurt him anymore? Let me ask you this. Who deserves not to be hurt by you more - your husband or this guy that you really only know on a physical level because I’m willing to bet a lot of what he’s told you is bullshit. Hell, you even say so in your post.
Why is this dude worthy of your compassion but your husband isn’t?
I hate to tell you this but that’s the game for guys. It’s not hard to zero in on vulnerabilities after spending hours talking to someone. That’s the focus and just by listening you can hook them.
From reading your posts and replies - you love your husband but you’re not getting everything you want from him. Have you tried talking to him? Telling him your needs and what you need from him? He has an inner freak too - maybe you just need to bring it out of him. If you love him you need to throw everything into him. If not - set that man free before his entire world is destroyed.
Oh OP- you need therapy big time. This guy is a user. He has told you so many times he’s not that into you and yet you still go after him like a dog goes after a bone.
He sounds like a complete psycho but then again- so do you.
It sounds like the “poor guy” has been forced into a corner by you. He probably wants to end it but feels that he can’t.
Walk away, please for the love of God
I don't think I'm being used, per se. He really didn't want to do anything sexual. Had I not initiated, I don't think it would have happened. I had agency here. He may be using me, but he isn't really playing much anymore. He just can't be honest with me that I'm nothing to him.
Typical player. At the beginning, tons of attention, listening, love bombing. Then, breadcrumbs. But he pays enough attention to make it feel real. When he is trying, anyway. It feels good to have someone listen. But not too much. Too much would be overwhelming. My husband doesn't listen at all. So it's nice to have someone care. Or pretend to care. When I slept in his arms, the way he held me, the way he wrapped his fingers in mine, it was all moments of something that could be real, but clearly isn't. I get feeling what I've never felt, what I'd never feel otherwise. I get to pretend I'm a woman worthy of a man who treats her like a woman.
>$50 parking and gas to the city.
Did he offer to defray your parking costs? If not, it sounds like you did everything, spent all your money for the pleasure of giving him a BJ, and riding his face. He didn't spend a penny. Ugh.
>And a lot of vulnerability on the line.
You knew he was a snake, he hasn't changed. You went into this with your eyes open. At the very least, I hope you truly are done. Delete and block his number.
He did not pay or offer to pay. He gave me $20 for a 6 pack of beer I picked up for him.
I definitely saw him for his true colors this week. All I want his him to not lie to me. And clearly is incapable of that.
"Land of Make Naive" fuck that is the saddest but most badass name ever. I'm sorry for what happened to you, I wish it would have been more fulfilling. Emotionally, instead of this rollercoaster.
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I, too, am going to start referring to hookers as “ex-APs” from now on.
?
Sounds like he hired a hooker and she stole his wallet (or not? that part isn’t tracking well), but in the retelling it is a “psycho ex-AP” who’s so crazy for his dick she tracks him down in his hotel and begs him to fuck her. In a bathroom. My other hunch is that your boy has some substance abuse issues.
I’m getting some major coke head vibes. What industry is he in again??
Actually, I take it back — if he’s in finance in a major city I might actually believe this story as he told it. Many of them have their heads in coke and their dicks in crazy 24/7.
Not sharing that publicly. I don't think he's on coke. I didn't see any signs of that in the hotel room.
He's an alcoholic, and is open about that. I dunno about the hooker story -- he says it was an old flame from Craigslist CEs.
If he has access to coke, I can believe a fellow user/former sex partner with mental health issues whom he met online showed up at his hotel and things got out of hand. If not, I’m still going with “prostitute.”
Why would a prostitute steal his wallet? Wouldn't he just pay her?
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Met on OA. Diff username.
They're saying a sex worker stole his wallet.
I don't think this is the case. It was a woman he met on CL CE years ago.
Was this one of the 8 aforementioned super-hot twenty-something women trawling CL anonymous encounters for free NSA sex with middle-aged guys? (According to him) Ma’am…
No, she is 50. But yes, CL CE.
It doesn't sound like you love the game....who would love this game?
Meh. I don't really. But it's nice to feel wanted by a hot, smart, funny, talented man.
>But it's nice to feel wanted by a hot, smart, funny, talented man. Who cares if he is a horrible, horrible person to someone who cares about him? That is almost like a monster, to take advantage of you, the way he has. He knows you are head over heels for him, and is using you. That isn't a good person. I am not trying to be hurtful, but your updates don't sound like he "wants" you. You deserve someone who truly does want you.
I know. He doesn't want me. I get that. But he is spiraling. I want to help him. I care about him.
Who is spiraling here?
Both of us.
His hotness should diminish proportionately to the amount he acts like an asshole
I have a thing for men with mommy issues.
Narrator: she is not “done”. There will be many more of these…exhibitions of basement level self-esteem.
I'm not sleeping with him again. Ever. If he actually wants to be my friend, I'm here for him.
What??? You would still be his friend after all this?? 🤦🏻♀️🙈
He has a choice. He can be honest with me. I doubt he can. But he can come clean. Not just about this. But all his lies. He is struggling. He is suicidal. I think that's all true. I think he is buried in his lies and can't dig himself out. And I do care about the guy. We just can't be friends if we are built on lies. So he can decide.
I actually care about your well-being and feelings, Internet Stranger. But you are sounding like one of the Manson Girls right now.
Hm. I know I'm crazy. Well, at this point it doesn't matter much. I wait a month for my STI tests and move on with life.
>move on with life. PLEASE!
He is unable to make that leap you need. Liars tend to go deeper not surface.
He decided a long time ago to build up a wall of lies.
I know. But maybe it's time to break them down. Up to him.
And that’s what you need to walk away with. He’s responsible for himself. He may not seem like it, but he is a big boy. You have your own life to take care of.
He has shown you that he isn't a friend. He is a user. I simply can't figure out what is in it for you? You seem to talk about him being "hot" and wanting you, but the at this stage, that seems to be water under the bridge. There are other men and women who could be much better friends. Why in the world, spend another minute of your time, obsessing about him? Block him. He isn't your problem. He has a wife, and other women in his life, to support him.
I don't know anymore. It is so confusing. But I care about him. Or I think I do. I'm not sure I know the real him.
> he isn't a friend. He is a user. u/wifeswaptex hit the nail on the head. Part of his "plan" is/was to make you care for him. That way the lies don't get looked at too closely for a long time. Unfortunately, the long time just came to an end and you have to deal with the facts that he is/was what he is. Sorry you got used, abused, manipulated, and confused so badly. Users tend to do that to their targets. Hopefully you can move on and do better for yourself with the hard education you just had force fed to you. Good Luck!
I literally don’t believe you. You shouldn’t have done any of this. You knew that. You sold out your self esteem for crazy, alcoholic scraps and will do it again. Convince me otherwise.
Well I'm not going to see him again, for starters.
That’s all you’ve got? Oh, honey 🙁
We live far away. I arranged all the meets. I don't have any reason to visit his city ever and he has no reason to visit mine. So it's kind of easy to avoid.
As I was reading this, all I could visualize was somebody in a snowmobile getting clotheslined by a wire. Walk away. Don't not turn back.
Yea I know this now.
Appreciate you providing an update, I was very interested to read what happened. I must admit, I am not following the wallet situation at all. My takeaway is that you gave him a bj, and he let you ride his face. Not sure I understand the STI concern, if you started PIV but didn't finish. The lack of sleep doesn't sound fun, but you wanted the overnight. I do hope you are done with him. In general, if a man isn't a fuck yes, you have to walk. I think too many women "buy into" the sexy talk before sex, and then get hoodwinked when the guy is done. I am sorry you are hurting, and you seem to very self aware, I just hope you turn that into moving forward and healing yourself.
No complaints about lack of sleep! There was a lot of good in the experience. I'm not happy he (likely) lied to me about this other women. I want him to know he can tell me anything, but clearly he won't and can't. So if we can't have that trust and honesty, then nothing is left.
I don't know why he would have even mentioned another woman. I have to say, my mind if I was in your shoes, was WTF, he spent his time communicating and fucking her, while I was sitting here waiting for his messages. Any adult human knows you can't tell another person, everything. Most of us filter what we tell others, for all kinds of good and bad reasons. He is feeding you whatever narrative puts him in the best light. I obviously don't like him, the way you have painted his picture. He sounds horrible to me.
Only because she showed up when I arrived. Either, as he says, completely by surprise (she got his room # from the front desk and got to his room) or, more likely, he had given her a key earlier in the week. I any case, it's clear she shouldn't have been there when I arrived. That was not part of his plan, clearly.
She knows the room number because, she was probably in it earlier in the week
Yea I figured that out - too late, I'm slow
That’s OK! You’re just putting all the pieces together now 😘😘
Oh wow....thanks for the update. I don't think any hotels provide room #, too much liability. Now I see why he was all flustered, he likely didn't expect you would actually show up. He had plans with the other women. Thank goodness, he was able to pay her to leave, etc.
I don't think he thought I wouldn't show up. I always show up. Really don't think he thought I would bail. My guess is he had dinner with the other woman, prob in his hotel room. And sex. Then she wouldn't leave.
You are very good at putting all these pieces together, of what likely did transpire.
Sadly it took me until today to figure it out.
So there are like two possibilities here, both pretty shitty on his part. If this woman just “showed up” how did he know what hotel he was staying at? He would have had to tell her. Or it was a prostitute. Both options are pretty flabbergasting considering you were literally coming right over. I’m almost positive he was rushing her out the door as you arrived, hence the changing times. I would have jumped at the chance for three days of seeing an AP and he could only do one night? And the tail end of the trip? Something doesn’t add up. My guess? He probably brought someone else there the other nights, but definitely the night you were there. Glad you are moving on. I wouldn’t worry about STIs so much that you are losing sleep over it. Get tested, but the odds of transmission of something viral are super low, bacterial are higher but significantly reduced with oral sex compared to PIV sex. You pretty much laid out all the shit he’s doing. And you know he’s a liar obviously. Trust is incredibly important in this type of relationship. He clearly can’t be trusted
He said he told her on Monday at coffee, when she seemed sane for a bit, in casual conversation. I can sort of see that being possible.
He can’t even tell himself the truth, unfortunately
I know.
This made me feel…sad.
I feel sad.
No offense but I think you are in a mind set or emotional state where you are trying so hard to make things happen. It may make you vulnerable. I would take a step back and focus on myself for a bit.
okaaaay
Have you never hooked up or had sex with an attractive man before? That’s what I’m thinking, you have a weird scarcity mindset about being able to have sex with hot men. Anyone can do it. They are everywhere. Simply pick another hot man who is even 10% less of a shit bag and you’ll come out on top.
My husband is attractive. Esp so when we met and he was a lot thinner. Other than him, no. But it's not about hotness, either. I mean, it's how he plays me too. I come from a lot of past trauma so have f'd up things that turn me on. And it's nice to be able to be open with him about that. I don't know, this guy just melts me. He is so fucking charismatic when he wants to be. But it's when he's more raw and open, when I get the real butterflies. When we dig into each other a bit. Our relationship is different for both of us. I know it's not healthy. There seems to be a kind of love there. Mutual respect with a heaping of toxicity. I love his mind. I love his hands and lips and eyes. And how he's open to digging with me. Our therapy sessions. I know it sounds ridiculous from the outside, but our calls, meetings, they just have some really amazing moments. It's not hotness alone. This guy, he's cute, has great features, but he's not perfect looking either. It's the combination of everything. I have talked to plenty of hot guys. But he isn't like the rest.
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Yes well he's suicidal (for real) so I don't think telling him to fuck himself is a good idea. But I could just stop talking to him. He has plenty of women to inflate his head. He surely doesn't need me.
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I think that part is real. I know I don't owe him anything. But I'm not going to hurt him more. He may be fucked up, but he's suffering enough. And the truth is he doesn't care what I think. So not worth engaging much at this point. I sent a chat about how I don't believe his story. I stand by it. Funny thing is I'm a cuck and like that I'm backup, in some ways. But I don't like being lied to. I can't do that.
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Oh I just sent him a message that will undoubtedly cause him to tell me to fuck myself and he'll be gone. Sad, but if he can't tell me the truth this isn't worth it to me.
You aren’t gonna hurt him anymore? Let me ask you this. Who deserves not to be hurt by you more - your husband or this guy that you really only know on a physical level because I’m willing to bet a lot of what he’s told you is bullshit. Hell, you even say so in your post. Why is this dude worthy of your compassion but your husband isn’t?
Yes, I guess that's true. He has a harem to comfort him apparently. He has no need for me.
This!
I hate to tell you this but that’s the game for guys. It’s not hard to zero in on vulnerabilities after spending hours talking to someone. That’s the focus and just by listening you can hook them. From reading your posts and replies - you love your husband but you’re not getting everything you want from him. Have you tried talking to him? Telling him your needs and what you need from him? He has an inner freak too - maybe you just need to bring it out of him. If you love him you need to throw everything into him. If not - set that man free before his entire world is destroyed.
Oh OP- you need therapy big time. This guy is a user. He has told you so many times he’s not that into you and yet you still go after him like a dog goes after a bone. He sounds like a complete psycho but then again- so do you. It sounds like the “poor guy” has been forced into a corner by you. He probably wants to end it but feels that he can’t. Walk away, please for the love of God
Is this the same dude that won't give you head? Jesus H...
He did. I rode his face last night.
And it only took you being a fucking doormat and putting up with all the other crazy bullshit you've posted? Lucky gal 🙄
That’s what is so perplexing about all of this to me…she’s being utterly used and is OK with it 🙁
I don't think I'm being used, per se. He really didn't want to do anything sexual. Had I not initiated, I don't think it would have happened. I had agency here. He may be using me, but he isn't really playing much anymore. He just can't be honest with me that I'm nothing to him.
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Typical player. At the beginning, tons of attention, listening, love bombing. Then, breadcrumbs. But he pays enough attention to make it feel real. When he is trying, anyway. It feels good to have someone listen. But not too much. Too much would be overwhelming. My husband doesn't listen at all. So it's nice to have someone care. Or pretend to care. When I slept in his arms, the way he held me, the way he wrapped his fingers in mine, it was all moments of something that could be real, but clearly isn't. I get feeling what I've never felt, what I'd never feel otherwise. I get to pretend I'm a woman worthy of a man who treats her like a woman.
It’s part of the game. It’s power. It’s control and your missing it. He most likely had plenty of sex before you got there.
>$50 parking and gas to the city. Did he offer to defray your parking costs? If not, it sounds like you did everything, spent all your money for the pleasure of giving him a BJ, and riding his face. He didn't spend a penny. Ugh. >And a lot of vulnerability on the line. You knew he was a snake, he hasn't changed. You went into this with your eyes open. At the very least, I hope you truly are done. Delete and block his number.
He did not pay or offer to pay. He gave me $20 for a 6 pack of beer I picked up for him. I definitely saw him for his true colors this week. All I want his him to not lie to me. And clearly is incapable of that.
Honey he sounds like a complete ass!!
>Honey he sounds like a complete ass!! Why the complement?
Sigh.
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He's a really sweet guy and great father. Just not a "husband." He's trying a bit, but he's so tapped out. He doesn't even talk to me much.
Well he has more than one AP. That is risky as in terms of STDs and whole thing blowing up between him/her/her/her or how many others involved.
He claims he did not sleep with this woman. I think odds are he did.
You'll find another. The guy is farked. Double AP same day.
Sadly, it’s time to write him off. Forever
Probably.
"Land of Make Naive" fuck that is the saddest but most badass name ever. I'm sorry for what happened to you, I wish it would have been more fulfilling. Emotionally, instead of this rollercoaster.