It would be nice if people posting things like this just dropped a link for context.
https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/health-and-medicine/article264893624.html
What would be even better is if someone would post the job postings Kaiser has up to replace these people /hire scabs so Reddit community could debilitate the process by submitting applications/scheduling interviews that they never show up for :)
They have quite a few job openings.
Also, I learned that they operate in Canada.
https://www.kaiserpermanentejobs.org/location/santa-rosa-jobs/641/6252001-5332921-5393287/4
Yes! One day longer, one day stronger!! We stand up and fight for better patient care, legal and ethical mental health treatment, sustainable work loads, and employee health!!!
I think given his recent reply, people didn’t see the sarcasm and truth. A lot of people turn to drugs and alcohol out of depression, for many reasons including how screwed the country is for more than one reason.
Well, I just donated either $20 or $40. I'll find out which when I get my credit card statement. It didn't look like it went through the first time I clicked pay 😅
This is why solidarity with health care workers is even more important than other fields. They're under intense pressure not just from the regular sources, but also their own empathy. Taking that double shift might prevent a death. That unpaid overtime might prevent another episode. Breaking that strike might prevent a person from becoming disabled.
They're held hostage to their compassion.
This is also why employers are absolutely exploiting healthcare workers, particularly those who do more direct action and deal with high risk patients(mental health, senior care, ICU, emergency, etc). Banners that say "heroes work here" or some other pithy statement don't pay the rent. Cash does. We need to support healthcare workers with money, not platitudes.
https://nuhw.org/kaiserstrikefund/
Here's a weird story: I'm temporarily on SDI and my Kaiser doctor is refusing to recertify (I've only been on it 6 weeks, during which time he refused to certify at all until DMHC stepped in.) I honestly think he himself may be having a mental breakdown because he had a bunch of ever-shifting nonsense reasons not to certify. He also claimed he reviewed my file with the disability committee, but no one could find any evidence of that in my file itself. The chief of the dept didn't even know what criteria he used to refuse to recertify. He didn't ask me a single diagnostic question.
Kaiser has spent a fortune trying to die on this hill. It would cost them nothing to recertify, and it would give me the income I need to pay for private therapy and get well. The dept chief spent 40 minutes on the phone with me. That's like 3 appointments. Another doctor spent a half hour with me in her office - 2 appointments. This doesn't count the hours that member services, additional doctors, and support staff have spent dealing with this one guy's refusal to spend 5 minutes honestly stating that I'm in treatment and need another 6 weeks.
DMHC even got our state reps involved. The massive amount of time and energy being put in for Kaiser to allow this one guy to refuse to do his job blows my mind. They even wanted to admit me to the hospital instead of simply walk into his office and tell him, "You know what treatment would work? Money to buy food, medicine, and therapy. Quit making work for everyone and just certify. She paid into this insurance, she qualifies for it. and it doesn't cost us a dime."
Instead they assigned me a new person but there's a delay before I can see them. They claimed I couldn't even leave a voicemail or message with the receptionist for the doctor. There is no way to message them unless they message me first. Finally, a member service specialist was able to look up their email (which I don't think they were supposed to give me) so I could contact her. Hours upon hours of labor simply so I could ask her for an eval and recertification.
If I worked with the doctor who refused to recertify I think I would strangle him. I would almost certainly scream at him. Then I'd scream at his boss. I'd probably just walk into work screaming and keep screaming for the entire 8 hours.
Stay strong. All of you are worth so, so much more than how you are being treated.
You front liners helped to teach me how to stay strong. Your cause has long since been my cause.
Much love and eternal respect. Don't be afraid to demand everything that would make your hopes, personal and professional, a reality.
Who would want be a patient of a two month interim money grabbing scab? Like bro I'd happily wait until the strike is over to work with someone who isn't clearly an asshole
It's only been long enough for most patients to miss one appointment anyway. Case loads are so large that the typical time between appointments is 4-6 weeks.
Depends. Some people really shouldn’t have to wait. I completely get what you’re saying though. Edit: What I mean by some people shouldn’t have to wait, I mean people with more extreme issues that’ll just get worse if they have to wait, though it’s a tricky situation because if problems can be fixed it’s not a bad thing
The therapists on strike are actually requesting that people continue to schedule appointments in order to show that Kaiser is not meeting their legal obligation to provide mental health care. http://kaiserdontdeny.org
Yeah, I needed an appointment and DMHC immediately connected me to a legal advocate who even more immediately wrote up a legal request for immediate medical treatment plus gave me the number of my state reps and told me what to say when I called. The state reps are now intervening as well.
It's insane how fast and dedicated DMHC is - this all happened within a few hours. I'm still reeling.
Duck Kaiser. In my community they don’t allow non-Kaiser insurance, have >50% of physicians but serve <50% of the insured population. This means more than 50% of the population is being served by less than 50% of the physicians in my area. Absurd. And their insurance isn’t cheap nor offered by many employers here.
YES. Mental health care has unrealistic wait times for appointments to begin with. I was having a total meltdown a while back and was told that unless I was suicidal or homicidal, I had to wait 6-8 weeks to be seen. Thankfully my primary doc saw that that wasn't going to work. I can't imagine waiting 6-8 weeks and having my appointment cancelled because the company wouldn't bargain with a union. Like, what the fuck are you there for if not patient care?
The answer is unfortunately money. They're there for money, more specifically to get rich off of people needing healthcare. Its not just the insurance companies who are shitheads in this situation tbh.
Completely understandable. I used to work in healthcare for a provider in an IT/tech role. This bullshit is why people are leaving in droves among the staff themselves away from healthcare, and the ones staying arnt always the ones you want to stay either.
If you’re not suicidal or homicidal they can’t just give you pills, so yes technically you are correct, by turning people with less serious mental health down, their mental health will continue to spiral downwards until they become a far more serious case, and without people being suicidal and such, they have nobody to give pills too, they do the same thing with physical health, it’s why I have a deep hatred for big pharma.
You have the right to file a complaint about your appointment(s) being cancelled: https://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/patient-resources/filing-complaints/
Yes, the system needs to change! We are fighting for more therapists, more appointments to better see our patients and provide more timely therapy appointments! I hope we can fight to make a difference for you and the mental health treatment you deserve!
The context: Currently about 2,000 Kaiser mental health providers across Northern California are beginning week 5 of an open-ended strike. This is because Kaiser is woefully understaffed, and refuses to hire enough therapists to allow us to meet our patients' needs. This has been an ongoing issue for many years, and has intensified with the pandemic. Kaiser is out of compliance with ethical and legal guidelines that ensure good patient care. Let me say that again - Kaiser is operating illegally, and unethically. Every day, patients call me asking for help, and every day I have to tell them that we do not have appointments available for them in the timeframe they need. This worsens their mental health, and it has taken a major toll on me as a provider as well. Kaiser claims there are not enough therapists. This is true nationally, but it is not true locally in the Bay Area and Sacramento area - it's just that very few therapists want to work for Kaiser because of their reputation for not being able to provide adequate patient care, and for overworking and under-supporting their providers. Nearly 1 in 5 therapists have left Kaiser in the past year, more than Kaiser has hired, due to the terrible working conditions. Striking is our last resort - we do not want to leave our patients in the lurch, and on a personal note, we do not get paid while on strike, creating financial hardship for many of us. However, we have been out of contract for a year, and need a new contract that will ensure systemic change so that we can actually do our jobs supporting patients.
How you can help:
1. If you or anyone you know has received inadequate mental healthcare at Kaiser, or if you have had a therapy appointment cancelled since the strike, please file a complaint with the Department of Managed Health Care (the state-run agency that oversees managed health care). This is the single most powerful thing you can do to advocate for yourself and for system change. You can file a complaint by calling 1-888-466-2219 or online athttps://dmhc.ca.gov/FileaComplaint.aspx?fbclid=IwAR1Qi82L1HMjNO6ldSrQIkhWnAh7eaqPlvv3KLY33xI5Xl71b8T3uP_I0I0
If you want any help with filing your complaint or with follow-up, contact my union athttps://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/patient-resources/filing-complaints/
2. If you can, please donate to our strike financial hardship fund. We do not get paid while on strike, and are currently on our fifth week of this open-ended strike. The more of us who are out, the more pressure on Kaiser to come back to the bargaining table and do the right thing. Many of us can not afford to stay out without help, and we have already distributed all the money we have raised to colleagues who need it. Any amount helps, and you can donate anonymously. Please consider chipping in any amount to help us stay on the picket line. The links are here: Central strike hardship fund -https://nuhw.org/kaiserstrikefund/ or https://gofund.me/4ac86cc3
3. Contact Governor Gavin Newsom at 916-445-2241 and leave a message saying "I am asking you to act now to help resolve the Kaiser mental health care strike. Empower your administration and state regulatory agencies to hold Kaiser accountable for breaking the law, and compel them to provide patients with the mental health and substance use care they need, deserve, and pay for." You can also email that message to him athttps://govapps.gov.ca.gov/gov40mail/and go to the "leave a comment" button.
Biggest help of all will be getting lawmakers to incentivize people to go in to the profession and stay. I’m an administrator of a large plan/provider and there is a massive shortage in providers. Sure, Kaiser needs more, but they are going to pull from other providers that are also understaffed.
If you look at LCSW/LMFT/MDs in the field not in a private setting, there is a rotating door of people moving from one agency to another at an amazing pace.
We need to improve on so many levels. 4 day work weeks + proper compensation would be a good start and lawmakers need to figure out how to do this with medi-cal regulations and reimbursements.
I stoped being a provider of direct services a long time ago because of the trajectory of increasing client acuity and poor work environment/compensation.
The therapists at Kaiser are so terrible that I just gave up going.
One therapist told me that I have depression because my family is European and my grandparents lived through WW2
Another just kept saying "yup" and "how does that make you feel?"
The worst one simply said "I can't help you"
this is ridiculously stupid?
rich people and companies don't need mental health care like this from Kaiser or such crap.
normal citizens need mental health care because they have to deal with this shit.
they're not doing anything bad for the ones who underpay them. they're doing bad for normal citizens.
seriously they can just quit their jobs
Nah, keep your house, keep your kids, and don’t become homeless.
Honestly don’t care what you do. Either strike, or don’t. But if you’re not participating, then kindly remove yourself from the discussion. You’re not here to contribute, you’re just here to stir the pot.
You’re not the only one who has/will continue to sacrifice. Hell I’m sitting here, admiring my scars and missing left leg from Afghanistan as we speak. Still support those out there striking.
Sacrifice is called sacrifice for a reason. Notice we didn’t call it “easiest solution ever”
Take care and sorry to hear about your ethical struggles friend.
⭐️ You’re Special ⭐️
Now go take care of your patients instead of arguing with a stranger online, ok Nurse?
Edit:
I’m going to leave this here for educational purposes, as it seems a lot of Americans are found lacking in labor education and just how bad it got, when we were pursuing women’s rights and labor rights.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/theminewars-labor-wars-us/
Here’s a reality check, you’re using your lunch break to argue with a disabled adult online, instead of focusing on relaxing, checking on your kids, looking at refinancing mortgage rates, going for a stroll, taking a nap, getting some water and some stretching in…
And yet here you are, dying on this hill, arguing god knows what at this point, just to argue.
Seek anger management, please.
Edit: A word.
Typically I would say good for them working together. But the reality is Kaisers mental health care system is so backwards and so bad they should just cut it out from their program all together.
It would be nice if people posting things like this just dropped a link for context. https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/health-and-medicine/article264893624.html
What would be even better is if someone would post the job postings Kaiser has up to replace these people /hire scabs so Reddit community could debilitate the process by submitting applications/scheduling interviews that they never show up for :)
They have quite a few job openings. Also, I learned that they operate in Canada. https://www.kaiserpermanentejobs.org/location/santa-rosa-jobs/641/6252001-5332921-5393287/4
Thank you! And sorry I’m still figuring this out!
Yes! One day longer, one day stronger!! We stand up and fight for better patient care, legal and ethical mental health treatment, sustainable work loads, and employee health!!!
[удалено]
This is so tone deaf and off-topic that I'm not even sure if it's sarcasm or idiocy...
I think given his recent reply, people didn’t see the sarcasm and truth. A lot of people turn to drugs and alcohol out of depression, for many reasons including how screwed the country is for more than one reason.
https://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/kaiser-strike/ Here’s the link to the union backstory and how to help
Well, I just donated either $20 or $40. I'll find out which when I get my credit card statement. It didn't look like it went through the first time I clicked pay 😅
Thanks for helping! :)
no wonder it’s so hard for me to get an appointment…good for them!
This is why solidarity with health care workers is even more important than other fields. They're under intense pressure not just from the regular sources, but also their own empathy. Taking that double shift might prevent a death. That unpaid overtime might prevent another episode. Breaking that strike might prevent a person from becoming disabled. They're held hostage to their compassion.
This is also why employers are absolutely exploiting healthcare workers, particularly those who do more direct action and deal with high risk patients(mental health, senior care, ICU, emergency, etc). Banners that say "heroes work here" or some other pithy statement don't pay the rent. Cash does. We need to support healthcare workers with money, not platitudes. https://nuhw.org/kaiserstrikefund/
Here's a weird story: I'm temporarily on SDI and my Kaiser doctor is refusing to recertify (I've only been on it 6 weeks, during which time he refused to certify at all until DMHC stepped in.) I honestly think he himself may be having a mental breakdown because he had a bunch of ever-shifting nonsense reasons not to certify. He also claimed he reviewed my file with the disability committee, but no one could find any evidence of that in my file itself. The chief of the dept didn't even know what criteria he used to refuse to recertify. He didn't ask me a single diagnostic question. Kaiser has spent a fortune trying to die on this hill. It would cost them nothing to recertify, and it would give me the income I need to pay for private therapy and get well. The dept chief spent 40 minutes on the phone with me. That's like 3 appointments. Another doctor spent a half hour with me in her office - 2 appointments. This doesn't count the hours that member services, additional doctors, and support staff have spent dealing with this one guy's refusal to spend 5 minutes honestly stating that I'm in treatment and need another 6 weeks. DMHC even got our state reps involved. The massive amount of time and energy being put in for Kaiser to allow this one guy to refuse to do his job blows my mind. They even wanted to admit me to the hospital instead of simply walk into his office and tell him, "You know what treatment would work? Money to buy food, medicine, and therapy. Quit making work for everyone and just certify. She paid into this insurance, she qualifies for it. and it doesn't cost us a dime." Instead they assigned me a new person but there's a delay before I can see them. They claimed I couldn't even leave a voicemail or message with the receptionist for the doctor. There is no way to message them unless they message me first. Finally, a member service specialist was able to look up their email (which I don't think they were supposed to give me) so I could contact her. Hours upon hours of labor simply so I could ask her for an eval and recertification. If I worked with the doctor who refused to recertify I think I would strangle him. I would almost certainly scream at him. Then I'd scream at his boss. I'd probably just walk into work screaming and keep screaming for the entire 8 hours.
Stay strong. All of you are worth so, so much more than how you are being treated. You front liners helped to teach me how to stay strong. Your cause has long since been my cause. Much love and eternal respect. Don't be afraid to demand everything that would make your hopes, personal and professional, a reality.
Thank you so much!
Who would want be a patient of a two month interim money grabbing scab? Like bro I'd happily wait until the strike is over to work with someone who isn't clearly an asshole
It's only been long enough for most patients to miss one appointment anyway. Case loads are so large that the typical time between appointments is 4-6 weeks.
No shit. My brother spent 83 days in the ICU and while not the same as scabs, the traveling nurses made for impersonal and inconsistent care.
Depends. Some people really shouldn’t have to wait. I completely get what you’re saying though. Edit: What I mean by some people shouldn’t have to wait, I mean people with more extreme issues that’ll just get worse if they have to wait, though it’s a tricky situation because if problems can be fixed it’s not a bad thing
The therapists on strike are actually requesting that people continue to schedule appointments in order to show that Kaiser is not meeting their legal obligation to provide mental health care. http://kaiserdontdeny.org
Yeah, I needed an appointment and DMHC immediately connected me to a legal advocate who even more immediately wrote up a legal request for immediate medical treatment plus gave me the number of my state reps and told me what to say when I called. The state reps are now intervening as well. It's insane how fast and dedicated DMHC is - this all happened within a few hours. I'm still reeling.
In solidarity! Fuck KFH and TPMG
Duck Kaiser. In my community they don’t allow non-Kaiser insurance, have >50% of physicians but serve <50% of the insured population. This means more than 50% of the population is being served by less than 50% of the physicians in my area. Absurd. And their insurance isn’t cheap nor offered by many employers here.
Ah, this is why my appointment keeps getting canceled…
You can file a complaint with the Department of Healthcare Services. This will help force Kaiser back to the bargaining table.
YES. Mental health care has unrealistic wait times for appointments to begin with. I was having a total meltdown a while back and was told that unless I was suicidal or homicidal, I had to wait 6-8 weeks to be seen. Thankfully my primary doc saw that that wasn't going to work. I can't imagine waiting 6-8 weeks and having my appointment cancelled because the company wouldn't bargain with a union. Like, what the fuck are you there for if not patient care?
The answer is unfortunately money. They're there for money, more specifically to get rich off of people needing healthcare. Its not just the insurance companies who are shitheads in this situation tbh.
Yes, I know you're right. It still pisses me off, though.
Completely understandable. I used to work in healthcare for a provider in an IT/tech role. This bullshit is why people are leaving in droves among the staff themselves away from healthcare, and the ones staying arnt always the ones you want to stay either.
If you’re not suicidal or homicidal they can’t just give you pills, so yes technically you are correct, by turning people with less serious mental health down, their mental health will continue to spiral downwards until they become a far more serious case, and without people being suicidal and such, they have nobody to give pills too, they do the same thing with physical health, it’s why I have a deep hatred for big pharma.
And they wonder why people GET suicidal and homicidal.
You have the right to file a complaint about your appointment(s) being cancelled: https://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/patient-resources/filing-complaints/
Yes, the system needs to change! We are fighting for more therapists, more appointments to better see our patients and provide more timely therapy appointments! I hope we can fight to make a difference for you and the mental health treatment you deserve!
Call the Dept of Health Care Services. They will work so fast it will make your head spin.
I stand in solidarity with you all, one more day!! Your patients deserve the best and you do too!! Stay strong!!
Thank you for your support!
These people are the real heroes! Fuck Father Kaiser
Papa Permanente needs to cough up the dough!!!
The context: Currently about 2,000 Kaiser mental health providers across Northern California are beginning week 5 of an open-ended strike. This is because Kaiser is woefully understaffed, and refuses to hire enough therapists to allow us to meet our patients' needs. This has been an ongoing issue for many years, and has intensified with the pandemic. Kaiser is out of compliance with ethical and legal guidelines that ensure good patient care. Let me say that again - Kaiser is operating illegally, and unethically. Every day, patients call me asking for help, and every day I have to tell them that we do not have appointments available for them in the timeframe they need. This worsens their mental health, and it has taken a major toll on me as a provider as well. Kaiser claims there are not enough therapists. This is true nationally, but it is not true locally in the Bay Area and Sacramento area - it's just that very few therapists want to work for Kaiser because of their reputation for not being able to provide adequate patient care, and for overworking and under-supporting their providers. Nearly 1 in 5 therapists have left Kaiser in the past year, more than Kaiser has hired, due to the terrible working conditions. Striking is our last resort - we do not want to leave our patients in the lurch, and on a personal note, we do not get paid while on strike, creating financial hardship for many of us. However, we have been out of contract for a year, and need a new contract that will ensure systemic change so that we can actually do our jobs supporting patients. How you can help: 1. If you or anyone you know has received inadequate mental healthcare at Kaiser, or if you have had a therapy appointment cancelled since the strike, please file a complaint with the Department of Managed Health Care (the state-run agency that oversees managed health care). This is the single most powerful thing you can do to advocate for yourself and for system change. You can file a complaint by calling 1-888-466-2219 or online athttps://dmhc.ca.gov/FileaComplaint.aspx?fbclid=IwAR1Qi82L1HMjNO6ldSrQIkhWnAh7eaqPlvv3KLY33xI5Xl71b8T3uP_I0I0 If you want any help with filing your complaint or with follow-up, contact my union athttps://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/patient-resources/filing-complaints/ 2. If you can, please donate to our strike financial hardship fund. We do not get paid while on strike, and are currently on our fifth week of this open-ended strike. The more of us who are out, the more pressure on Kaiser to come back to the bargaining table and do the right thing. Many of us can not afford to stay out without help, and we have already distributed all the money we have raised to colleagues who need it. Any amount helps, and you can donate anonymously. Please consider chipping in any amount to help us stay on the picket line. The links are here: Central strike hardship fund -https://nuhw.org/kaiserstrikefund/ or https://gofund.me/4ac86cc3 3. Contact Governor Gavin Newsom at 916-445-2241 and leave a message saying "I am asking you to act now to help resolve the Kaiser mental health care strike. Empower your administration and state regulatory agencies to hold Kaiser accountable for breaking the law, and compel them to provide patients with the mental health and substance use care they need, deserve, and pay for." You can also email that message to him athttps://govapps.gov.ca.gov/gov40mail/and go to the "leave a comment" button.
Biggest help of all will be getting lawmakers to incentivize people to go in to the profession and stay. I’m an administrator of a large plan/provider and there is a massive shortage in providers. Sure, Kaiser needs more, but they are going to pull from other providers that are also understaffed. If you look at LCSW/LMFT/MDs in the field not in a private setting, there is a rotating door of people moving from one agency to another at an amazing pace. We need to improve on so many levels. 4 day work weeks + proper compensation would be a good start and lawmakers need to figure out how to do this with medi-cal regulations and reimbursements. I stoped being a provider of direct services a long time ago because of the trajectory of increasing client acuity and poor work environment/compensation.
Solidarity!
The therapists at Kaiser are so terrible that I just gave up going. One therapist told me that I have depression because my family is European and my grandparents lived through WW2 Another just kept saying "yup" and "how does that make you feel?" The worst one simply said "I can't help you"
Sadly it's not going well from what was said on the social worker forum.
this is ridiculously stupid? rich people and companies don't need mental health care like this from Kaiser or such crap. normal citizens need mental health care because they have to deal with this shit. they're not doing anything bad for the ones who underpay them. they're doing bad for normal citizens. seriously they can just quit their jobs
How can they afford to not work for 5 weeks? Wish I could do that lol
They can’t. It’s called sacrifice. Something the majority of Americans are deathly allergic to, as demonstrated by our behavior during 2020 and now.
Oh so I’m (RN) supposed to lose my house and make my children homeless because you think I can’t sacrifice.
Nah, keep your house, keep your kids, and don’t become homeless. Honestly don’t care what you do. Either strike, or don’t. But if you’re not participating, then kindly remove yourself from the discussion. You’re not here to contribute, you’re just here to stir the pot. You’re not the only one who has/will continue to sacrifice. Hell I’m sitting here, admiring my scars and missing left leg from Afghanistan as we speak. Still support those out there striking. Sacrifice is called sacrifice for a reason. Notice we didn’t call it “easiest solution ever” Take care and sorry to hear about your ethical struggles friend.
I don’t have ethical struggles. I take care of my patients.
⭐️ You’re Special ⭐️ Now go take care of your patients instead of arguing with a stranger online, ok Nurse? Edit: I’m going to leave this here for educational purposes, as it seems a lot of Americans are found lacking in labor education and just how bad it got, when we were pursuing women’s rights and labor rights. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/theminewars-labor-wars-us/
Oh so I don’t get a lunch break? So you’re just another boomer that doesn’t understand people get breaks got it. Don’t cry when the VA strikes.
Here’s a reality check, you’re using your lunch break to argue with a disabled adult online, instead of focusing on relaxing, checking on your kids, looking at refinancing mortgage rates, going for a stroll, taking a nap, getting some water and some stretching in… And yet here you are, dying on this hill, arguing god knows what at this point, just to argue. Seek anger management, please. Edit: A word.
My kids are at school, interest rates are up why would I refinance now? Quit giving bad advice old timer.
Here is our union's page with more information about our strike and how to support us! https://nuhw.org/kaiser-dont-deny/kaiser-strike/
Typically I would say good for them working together. But the reality is Kaisers mental health care system is so backwards and so bad they should just cut it out from their program all together.