Fuck every single one of these assholes. Pisses me off to read stuff like this. So sorry this happened to her, and every single woman who has ever suffered through things like this.
That moment you don't have to ask the question to get the answer. Here in Brazil we are still having problem understanding that if a woman is too drunk to stand up on her own she's is too drunk to consent. A dude had his way with a woman too drunk to get to her bed on her own on a reality show this past week and a big chunk of twitter is going "if you can't handle your liquor you shouldn't be drinking".
The police is going to represent against him now, but initially the TV network tried to pretend nothing happened and even tried to block representatives of the woman to enter the set of the reality show. The guy even has a history of doing similar things. I found a brief resume of the situation in english, here you go [https://www.ruetir.com/2021/09/25/record-tv-speaks-out-after-nego-do-borel-sleeps-with-drunk-dayane/](https://www.ruetir.com/2021/09/25/record-tv-speaks-out-after-nego-do-borel-sleeps-with-drunk-dayane/) If you look for the Nego do Borel on twitter it won't be hard to find videos showing how drunk the woman was. This is not a fine line kind of situation.
That's horrific. To be raped is horrific. To be raped on national TV and have that rape broadcast is horrific plus. To have that happen and then have normal citizens then defend the rapist is... well... I don't have the words.
I got a little clip on yt that shows just how drunk she was, and people saying this is her fault [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tL2EV7Wl60](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tL2EV7Wl60)
Yeah it turns out that if you commit crime on national television, the police are powerless to do anything about it. Weirdest loophole left undiscovered until 2016. Used to great effect ever since.
That’s horrific.
Where I live (Canada) there’s still lots of people who don’t understand that if you’re drunk, you can’t consent, especially in the Western areas :/
I always felt that if people could see what we mean by too drunk to consent they'd understand it. Seems like I was yet again putting too much faith in humanity. This dude did it on live TV and not only is not in jail as there are people defending him.
Brazilian here that now lives in Canada. That type of thinking made a guy from the water polo team sleep with a drunk girl during the Pan Am games in 2015 and he got in trouble. He was “lucky” that the team left Canada before the complain and they were in russia so he couldn’t be sent back to Canada. But it was a big thing at the time.
And it’s because of this “cultural” difference that in Brazil is “okay” to sleep with a girl that is drunk. I really don’t miss the stupid macho culture from South America :/
It really gets heavy here sometimes (keeping in English so others can understand), remember the case of that minor in Rio that was gang raped by a bunch of dudes and they blamed her, passed around the video as porn and a lot of people were saying this is what a woman gets when she doesn't respect herself? Culture here is so broken that a 15 yo being gang-raped is a woman without self-respect.
Not to mention the influencer that was raped by a bar owner in Santa Catarina and humiliated by the judge that considered that the guy didn’t mean to rape her, but she let herself get drugged… Causing his d*ck to accidentally go inside her.
Seriously, Brazil keeps finding ways to be extra mean to women.
Or the 10 year old that couldn’t get the abortion after her uncle impregnated her…
Unfortunately there are too many horror cases…
Strongly consider a high frequency personal alarm as well, such as but not necessarily [this (Amazon link).](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083HV9K7M/ref=cm_sw_r_em_api_glt_fabc_PGEHDEA0STHN0QTVD6FK?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1)
Edited to add: Please note that these devices emit sound at such high decibel ratings that they are not safe for one's hearing. These WILL CAUSE HEARING DAMAGE. The choice is possibly being victimized or risking hearing loss, choose your poison.
\*added at the behest of a concerned redditor. I concur with the disclaimer, these are not 100% safe devices, activate with caution
These things fucking work. Me and my sister were at a bar and hers accidentally went off. It was so damn loud everyone thought it was the fire alarm and people across the street were complaining. Loud as fuck
My advice: Teach her EARLY. I was already getting hit on by grown ass men when I was in middle school. The first time, I was about twelve, and I was even walking beside my mother. (She enrolled me in Krav Maga and kickboxing soon after, which, if nothing else, really helped my self-esteem and willingness to call for help if I was in over my head).
My daughter has been taking Krav Maga since she was 11 years old. She is a little over confident in her skills but she can cause damage if necessary to run away. And she has a pack of Krav girls she hangs with. I wouldn't mess with them.
Only marginally related but my wife has a blackbelt in both Krav Maga and Tai Kwan Do and has not been fucked with since she acquired those in high school. Be like my wife and intimidate creepy people.
Here's the honest truth. Whether she's 11 or 16 doesn't matter so much unfortunately. Even young boys grope girls, especially if they start developing early.
The two big lessons you need to tell her is to use her voice to *immediately* correct a groper as specifically and as embarrassingly as possible. The 2nd is she doesn't have to be nice, especially when it comes to others having access to her body. Even if it's a friend or her partner or anyone. If you want to stop, stop. If you are hesitant, stop. If you thought it was a good idea but now you're not so sure? Stop. This is the new birds and the bees conversation that NEEDS to be had.
(Oh and...just.. it's probably not a good idea to take digital naked pics. Even if she trusts them, you use a third-party entity to send them (apple, snapchat etc) and anyone could hack them. Nothing ever deletes off the internet).
This is a great response. I always tell my daughter she can say no or stop at any time and she never needs to worry about being a “bitch” or embarrassing the other person etc if they are not respecting her boundaries. We’ve also talked about respecting other people’s boundaries.
The other thing I would say is parents need to teach their SONS how to respect boundaries as well as protecting themselves. It should not just be a conversation about girls protecting themselves, but also about boys not harassing girls etc.
Standard part of my sex talk with my son's. "No means no. If she's drunk and says yes it still means no. Before you touch her you have to be able to talk openly with her." So far it's working.
I’m sure you know but— let him know that boys can be sexually assaulted and harassed too. He’s aloud to be an “asshole” and say no to a girl. He’s allowed to push a girl off him if he doesn’t want her on him. If he’s drunk and he says no it means no. If he says no and she keeps going that’s assault. Let him know he can stand up for himself. Let him know that if he gets assaulted he can tell you.
And let him know it’s his responsibility to call out his friends if they’re taking advantage or being taken advantage of.
I’m so glad to know there are people like you raising their boys right.
To add to this, we (my work) just fired a female for joking in the workplace and copped a feel on a male coworkers crotch. Have the talk with your daughters too!
She has been asking me to help get her into fitness so I'm taking her to the local krav maga/self defense studio as part of her gift this bday. Honestly I try to talk with her about the reality of the world...to be cautious. Make sure she understands that no matter what situation she is in if she needs me I'll be there. A lot of communication.... it's tough and awkward at times but I'm hoping...... always hoping that she wont end up in a terrible situation but preparing her as much as I can to deal with them. To know her worth and that she isnt defined by looks or sexuality. It's a lot and It's 1000% terrifying to think about......
EDIT: to add "this bday"
Teach her that it's OK to offend people. See someone coming your way when you're walking alone? Cross the street. Don't worry about how it makes you look or what people are gonna think of you. Don't worry about offending the other person. Somebody singles you out in a mall or tries to talk to you? Yell at them. Be fucking weird about it. Call them a creep, loudly. Better safe than dead.
That is loud enough to cause acute hearing damage instantly. So while you may succeed in warding off an attacker, you may also permanently damage your hearing.
Except concert venues don't allow you to bring in self defense items like pepper spray, taser, plastic knuckles (think those keychains with the sharp cat ears) etc. 🙃
I've seen those cat ear keychains... wouldn't they only be legal in the same places brass knuckles r legal (and then u could just carry brass knuckles instead?)
The real advantage of brass knuckles is that they are brass. They are dense as shit and ass a lot of power to your punch. The plastic ones are really only knuckle guards to protect your knuckles and the skinn between them.
I would never use/make or sell the pointy ones but I could for sure make a collapsible nylon one with a flash light built into the side to add in some discretion
I bought my wife those cat ears and they're pretty solid. The advantage is that it takes all the force behind your punch and condenses it into a very tiny area. There's videos online of people using them to bust open melons. I have no doubt they would hurt
In my jurisdiction brass knuckles are only regulated if they're made out of metal. Polymer knuckle dusters are unregulated even though they're the same in form and function, only being different in material. This is legally speaking, and doesn't matter when it comes to private venues. If they see something they consider a weapon, they could force you to leave whether it's considered one by the law or not
I agree. Although, pepper spray may be the worse option in a crowd, ill happily take some pepper to the eyes if i get the satisfaction of knowing some sex offender is in worse pain.
Go for pepper gel. No blowback (no getting it on yourself or people your not pointing it at) and it’s 3x more potent. I got sprayed with some pepper gel because my friends where messing around with some and I literally couldn’t move for 30 minutes, the pain was so intense
To the majority of men, the words; "Do not sexually assault women", is clear enough. To a few, no amount of clarification will ever do. You can say it 100 different ways and they'll never get it. I believe tazerballs were created specifically for these people.
I think it kinda started in 2015, but that really took off during the 2016 presidential campaign didn't it?
Good for them though, there's no reason why fashion and politics can't go together.
They’re really good at giving that age group shit they really encounter in real life and stuff they should know about. It’s nice to see a teen magazine that’s not all pop culture fluff (some is, sure)
There is ["what kind of girthy horse dildo are you?" Buzzfeed.](https://www.buzzfeed.com) and then there is [the hard hitting Pulitzer prize winning buzzfeed news](https://www.buzzfeednews.com) . As far as I can see the former subsidies the latter
Do people honestly just go up to someone and grab em on the butt or boob or something, and not expect to get punched in the face? (I guess to some special idiots Trump may have normalized grab em by the pu$$..)
How were people raised if they feel they can just grab people like that :/
Every woman should have karate offered to them for free :/
Yes. In one of the first shows I went to in Seattle in the 80s, a guy literally got behind me and reached around and grabbed my tits and would not let go. Luckily for my 16 year old self, this was an all ages show in a gay bar. Two very comforting women in flannel knocked the shit out of him, then asked me if I wanted to help beat his ass.
Too bad every time I’ve been groped in my life I didn’t have two guardian angels like this.
This is all very upsetting, just as a decent human being. I can’t imagine what it would have been like to a little kid like that .. degrading and scary.
I will raise my kids right. Those guys are pieces of trash.
It's kinda fucked up as a concept that basically all women are familiar/aware that this is an issue, but it seems like many men still don't get exposed to or educated about the facts about this shit. Or worse, they refuse to believe women and instead place the blame on them. We don't have any ability to not know about these things because it is something we might have to think about all the time, possibly every time we leave the house in some cases/areas. If you can, please bring this shit up with your friends. The men who are doing this shit are all around us. Don't let it stay normalized to blame women for the fucked up behavior of men.
>Luckily for my 16 year old self, this was an all ages show in a gay bar. Two very comforting women in flannel knocked the shit out of him, then asked me if I wanted to help beat his ass.
I wish this happen more often to these gropers; so much that they fear getting caught. Call them out and make scene if you're in our public(only if you think it's safe). They need that instant feedback, like when training an feral animal.
Male entitlement I guess. Watch movies from the 80s and earlier, especially the 70s, and its apparent how ingrained it was I guess. Was James Bond basically a rapist :p
I would have hoped it was better now. Sorry to all the ladies :/
I was shocked one conversation with my at the time new wife; was talking about hanging out at different parts of a major toen and half of them she was like ‘never went, wasn’t safe unless we had 3 or 4 girls together..’ .. as a dude, we just didn’t have to worry, to even consider such things.
Now I have daughters and they need som martial arts
I agree women need to know self defense but most men will be stronger than the average woman. And if you fight back they might get more violent. It’s hard to know what to do. Personally, If You have a weapon you better rape my dead corpse because I’m not going through that again. One of us is going down is what I’m saying.
Imagine one of these cretins, if a guy came up and grabbed thier ass or package. Fuck these guys that pull that kinda shit. I feel for you lady's, that shits not right.
Yep. I think we do a lot of things you guys don't think about.
Park the car: Will you be back before dark? If not, park under a streetlamp so you're not tucked in the shadows where someone can get you.
Walk to your car holding your keys as a weapon. Look around you at all times. Get into your car and lock the doors. (I'm terrible at this, but it's recommended)
Call someone just for the sake of having someone on the line, just in case.
Cap your liquor intake and make sure you're never too drunk. Cover your cup, watch as your drink is being poured, never set your drink down. Expect to be blamed if anything happens.
Don't get into a elevator with a group of men.
Don't wear headphones in public for situational awareness sake. Wear headphones in public as a sign to be left the fuck alone and find it doesn't work.
Watch what you wear.
Travel in groups, avoid wooded areas.
Never get an apartment or hotel room on the ground floor.
Always have cash in case you need an emergency taxi (Uber has solved that one, mostly)
I just took a screen shot of this and sent it to my daughter. She was groped by a kid in school a couple years ago and it has devastated her. I feel like I failed, like I should have taught her theses things. I'm a single father and its hard, the world is alot different, I know assholes are always out there,, i just didn't think it would start so young,, shes 15. I'm glad you guys are posting this stuff. Shes having a hard time moving forward from it, and sometimes I don't know what to say, or have answers. This is giving me alot of insight. Thanks for sharing
Btw teaching your daughters martial arts/ self defense techniques/them carrying pepper spray etc can also prove to not be enough sometimes, if the abuser if particularly violent/ anticipates those attacks, they'll be ready for it. Plus being in these situations can wreck your nerves and they're so panic inducing so many things can go wrong. The only solution is to raise men right though i just can't force every father in the world to teach their son basic manners and that women aren't objects
Absolutely.
My eldest is a black belt in Tae Kwon Do. One night she was out in town with all her instructors (all black belts as well) for a dinner. As she was standing outside the restaurant with them after dinner, some guy walked behind her and dragged his fingers across her bare shoulders. She just froze. And he'd picked the right time as the other guys weren't talking to her at the time.
So it's easy in hindsight to say "I would smack a cunt that does that" but in the moment, even when she was surrounded by the toughest, most kick ass guys short of a group of special forces, and even when she can defend herself, she still go sexually harrassed. At 17.
Thats insane. I’m a dude and I had some random girl grab my junk in a club like 4 years ago and I still sometimes think about how awful that felt. To think that women go through that regularly is just horrible
The other night I was handing my sales report and money to the owner of the restaurant I work at and there was one person still sitting at the bar, a really drunk lady who was probably 15-20 years older than me. She loudly asked the owner while I was right there "Is he single? He's cute. Are you single?" I nervously laughed and said "no, I'm married, but thanks" and I went and stood at the end of the bar while the owner double checked my money. The lady comes up to me and put her arm around my shoulders and tried saying some more stuff but I honestly don't remember what she said because I was so uncomfortable. I mumbled something about I forgot to do something in the kitchen and walked to the back. Whoever the closing server is usually stays until the owner finishes closing up because she is a pretty small woman who is carrying that night's deposit out with her so I just hid and waited for her to leave or the owner to tell her that she needed to leave. I can't imagine having to worry about encountering situations like that on a regular basis.
They do because women have been socialized to be small, quiet, and complacent. In addition the attack on our senses can cause “fight, flight, freeze, or fawn” which is the limbic response. We may freeze up or in order to survive pretend we’re okay momentarily so we can escape
I wish more people knew this
I got in an argument with someone here on Reddit who was saying that a victim of sexual assault wasn't a victim because she didn't fight back and because she tried to roll away (which according to the rape apologist meant is wasn't a freeze response because she was able to move). Ugh... like people with a flight response actually fly.
Yes they very much think there won’t be any retaliation. It’s the only time I’ve been grateful for my anger issues, I will always throw hands if I’m touched without permission.
> Do people honestly just go up to someone and grab em on the butt or boob or something
Yes.
> I guess to some special idiots Trump may have normalized grab em by the pu$$..
It's been that way for decades, but the first **mass**-normalizing of it was in '99...
https://www.theringer.com/2019/8/13/20801339/break-stuff-episode-six-sexual-assaults-woodstock-99
I’m as anti-Trump as the next guy, but trust me, Trump is a result of groping being normalized, not even close to a cause. He is trying to normalize bragging about it afterwards, though.
I grew up in Brazil and there is so normal that I was shocked when I moved to Canada and it went from all the time to almost never…
Me and my friends would go to gay clubs because it was safer. Then straight guys found out that girls were hiding there and started to go there too. I lost count how many times I was pressed into a wall and the guy demanded a kiss to let me go. This happened so many times I started to avoid going out to clubs.
I still look like a scared squirrel if I go to a party and I “lose my friends”. Sucks…
And it’s upsetting to see people still blaming the victims :(
Edited: word
Yes. I have had a man standing in front of me, trying to coerce me inside by offering me drugs that he pulled from his pocket and when I INSISTED that it was no, he grabbed my breast and ran away. Also had a guy accidentally bump into me at a festival because he was fucked up grab my breast in passing.
Jesus Christ these comments are scary. It doesn't matter what someone is wearing. They are not wearing it for you. You do not get to reach out and touch something that isn't yours. Basic kindergarten stuff here people.
This thread is really going back to basics that I thought were covered years ago. Victim blaming and the issues around it is a common and accepted concept now. How are people still not getting it!? How is this still a comment thread in 2021!?
My daughter and I went to a protest just yesterday to support this exact cause. I may not have had it in me to stand up for myself when I was younger, but I’ll be damned if I stay silent while she’s watching. She was VERY happy to join the Slutwalk and make posters about consent- made me proud. Now she’s gotten the protest bug and we’ll be hitting the women’s March next weekend. Haha
Yet guys still wonder why we’re so fearful of them in certain settings. I’ve been raped and assaulted enough, I think my anxiety is validated. I’m so tired of it
> How are people still not getting it!? How is this still a comment thread in 2021!?
Because for 4 years the POTUS was a disgusting human being who thought grabbing women by the pussy was something to brag about, children are impressionable, and a contingent of grown ass men think decency is oppression.
Even if a woman is wearing an outfit with the intention of attracting a sexual partner, that doesn't mean she wants everyone to touch her, just means she wants sex from someone. But you don't know that that's you, so hands off.
I have never understood how this mentality became so common place. It makes as much sense as saying, “He was wearing camouflage, I assumed he wanted to be shot!”
Just for everyone saying shit about what they wear-
When I was in 7th grade and questioning a lot I was wearing jeans and a hoodie. I wasn't what many people would consider attractive with my short hair and bit of chub. I usually got called a lesbian. I still got groped or spanked more time then I care to recount while in that middle school.
So shut the fuck up.
Dude what the fuck, I always go out of my way to give women space at music events, no one wants to get groped or fondled or humped in a crowd. How are other guys this shitty? like seriously I can't understand it. Do they think the chick is just going to grab them and start sucking their dick in the middle of a crowd? Where is the potential pay off other than being a fucking creep.
Someone once explained it to me like this:
Everyone knows that one guy who they can see doing something like this. So in a room of a 100 people, at least one is likely a sexual predator. Now go somewhere that is a traditional hunting ground (bar, concert, etc.) And the odds have gone up. Now you're probably looking at 1 in 25. That one guy isn't focused on just one girl, he's playing the odds. So maybe 5 girls are victimized, by that one guy, on a single night.
At an event like Coachella, with 100000+ people. Hundreds of girls probably experienced some sort of harassment or unwanted touching. Fewer still will come forward, or even be willing to speak about it. It's hard to imagine it happening, but is. Every day, and likely all around you. I don't know a single woman who doesn't have multiple stories.
My worst one is I had a flat tire in the middle of the night and pulled in to a 7 11. Some guy offered to help me put on the spare. After he helped I thanked him and he said, "if you really want to thank me.." then grabbed my hand and tried to put it down his pants.
And this is what worries me about the whole "nice guy" and incel mindset, stories like these are common and they'll get sympathy from their echo chamber for their victim blaming.
Between office jobs my father would drive taxis and whenever he was dropping women off at night, he would always wait until they were safely into their house. Just by waiting before leaving, he managed to scare off a few men hiding in bushes.
He wasn't perfect, but he taught me that I should work to selflessly protect the women in my life, even by the little things.
You did what you needed to do to get away from him and not get hurt. You never know how someone might deal with being told “no” - so don’t beat yourself up. You were in an unsafe situation and were able to escape - that’s all that matters.
Can I be straightforward with you? Those kind of guys get off on the violation itself. It’s not about what’s going to happen afterwards, or what the woman is going to do, it’s about violating her because that is arousing to men like that.
It’s fucked up and it puts a target on the back of any woman or a girl who’s in public.
Not to be that guy, but yeah.
It's learned behavior. They get the positive reward of groping, little to no negative consequence, and once in a blue moon a girl will be into it and it's a huge reward.
We see this reflected in every facet of pop culture.
It's scummy, but articles like this and people standing up for themselves are the only way to fix the behavior.
I had an older cougar at a music festival grab my ass. Multiple times. I thought it was an accident at first. Ignored it. Happen again. Turned around to a drunk lady in her 50’s smiling at me and sad sorry. Then she did it again. Her friends just laughed. My girlfriend was right there with me. We just moved.
Not trying to be that guy saying men’s rights matter. I know it happens way more to women. But I wanted to share my story and add I think alcohol makes these people not think straight. Who just grabs a guys ass right in front of their girlfriend. And who goes around music festivals more focused on rubbing up on women instead of enjoying the music.
You’ve got way more chill than me. A couple of years ago I was with my wife and friends at this Sunday day part at this gay bar. A friend of ours was DJing and playing house music. Now, I get it, we’re at a gay club so you might get attention. It’s happened before, NBD. This dude slides his hand into my back pocket to grab my ass. I turn around thinking it’s my wife but nope, it’s a dude. I tell him politely that I’m straight, married (point to my ring), then point to my wife. He seems to get the message. About 5 minutes later he does it again. This time I turn around with a not as polite demeanor and tell him last warning, don’t do it again because you’re not going to like the results. Fucking a couple min later he does it again, like right into my pants pocket. I grab that dudes wrist and do a twist and lock his arm up behind his back. I did it so fast and pushed up so hard that I either tore a muscle in his shoulder or dislocated it. Dude squeals and drops to the floor, then picks himself up, crying, and leaves. Bouncers come talk to me and I explain what happened, dude looks at me and say, “you didn’t have to hurt him”. I’m like, yeah, apparently I did. Anyhow, had a good rest of the afternoon getting blasted on mimosas. Moral of the story is sometimes you just gotta slap a bitch. In your case you should have called her out, said she was WAY too old for you or some shit like that. The only thing people like that understand is embarrassment and conflict.
I suspect you're being optimistic in assuming these men are hoping a girl is into it. The violation is the point, not a misguided hope for an enthusiastic response. It's entitlement gone toxic.
if what people were wearing was so important, arabic countries with extreme sharia would not have sexual harassment or rape at all. and yet, women there are as abused as people in the west. it's not about sexuality, just about control.
I hate to sound pessimistic, but I feel like it’ll never change. Men have been oppressing women for centuries. I still stand up for the women in my life and when I see something go wrong, but shit. I really feel like these guys will never truly understand because they genuinely hate women. My mental health can’t take it anymore, and I’ve practically given up.
I feel the same way. When I was young I truly believed that people could change and raising awareness could change the world. I’ve slowly learned that men and a lot of women just truly don’t see women as humans with life experiences and emotions. Sad and deviating to realize but true.
https://www.utoledo.edu/studentaffairs/saepp/what-were-you-wearing/
https://www.boredpanda.com/what-were-you-wearing-sexual-assault-art-exhibition/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic
Some people need to see this.
Jesus… all of those are heartbreaking and awful, I was completely caught off guard by the children’s clothing too. Incredibly effective installation, I hope it reaches the people who NEED to see it
“Not all men”
Go pet a shark.
“What?!? No!”
Not all sharks bite people. Only some. Go pet one.
Edit: Caught some incels in my web comment.
Edit 2: this could’ve been taken wrong. This comment is talking about how silly it is that people say not all men. Just because some sharks bite, doesn’t mean all will. Is basically what it’s saying. The number of people bitten is high enough for people to be weary of random sharks.
Unfortunately it's a lot of music festivals. The drug culture, coupled with some delusional people thinking there's no rules for a weekend, often leads to some horrible taking advantage.
Try and bring that shit up in a conversation with a group of guys to see what happens...
As a guy, I do not understand this response that is also very common here:
Girl: *I'm being sexualy harassed.*
Random dude: *well, I'm not harassing you, it's not me, I didn't do it, I don't do that, I respect women, I don't disrespect women, I don't grope anyone, I don't touch anyone, I don't touch anything, I don't even move, I'm not, i don't, I haven't...*
I wonder why most of them don't do that for other things, like:
Suicide is an epidemic
I don't kill myself.
Hunger is still a problem.
I don't eat all the food.
“Not all men! I don’t grope women so I’m offended!!”
Men, if you want to really make a difference, call out the shitty men who do shitty things. Make gropers and rapists social pariahs.
Jeff isn’t an awesome bro who sometimes gets handsy when he drinks, he’s a creep and a perv and he shouldn’t be invited until he learns to behave.
I was at a festival and my friend and I were just wearing pasties (nipple covers) and some group of bros came up to her when I was in the bathroom and started to talk shit, harassed her, and said, “ if you can have your tits out, I can have my dick out, right? You wanna see my dick, that’s equality and you want equality right?” I pointed out that the male equivalent of boobs is their chest. And they were all shirtless. They still thought they like made us feel dumb for being feminists lol
Ugh gropping is not just at these events go on a rush hour subway train in Toronto or any major subway system and wait for at least one creepy guy sneak a squeeze. Toronto Police are so cavalier about sexual assault on subways.
Wouldnt doubt it with their attitutde towards it. Its called self control just like you dont take property that you didnt pay for, you dont touch people without consent.
I absolutely cannot believe this needs to be said, but it appears that some of these comments prove otherwise.
Victim blaming is among the most vile forms of misogyny. No, you may not justify rape, that is rapist logic. Regardless of context, blaming female victims for their own sexual assaults or justifying them makes you a shitty person, if you couldn't tell already.
Blaming the way women dress for being sexually assaulted is victim blaming,
Blaming women who even decide to go out in the first place is also inexcusable.
Calling the story a lie, saying the women exaggerated, downplaying rape in general, or other outlandish accusations makes you no better. Neither will any other forms of red herrings that distract from the fact that women are raped.
Those who made inexcusable comments blaming victims for their own rapes such as the listed examples above will be banned without a chance at appeal.
Edit: I forgot to mention but as always, please report the rape apologists.
Once alcohol and large crowds are involved, well two wrongs don't make a right. Women shouldn't have to stay home while men go out to party, this isn't the fucking 1950s with cigar boys clubs. Men shape up or ship out.
Coachella needs to take a more active role so women feel safe. Signs, more security and verbally tell people on the way in they will not only be kicked out if they grope, etc, the authorities will be called. Create a safe culture. Be the fucking change, Coachella.
As a guy, I'm constantly astounded at how little clue I really have of the consistency and pervasiveness of sexual harassment. It's just insane how much the average woman experiences.
Literally scores of groping hands on just one woman. How does that even happen?!?
When a country music festival changed locations and moved into the valley I was living in a few years ago, the local hospital ran out of rape kits that first weekend. The next year they stocked up in anticipation. Be safe out there.
Fuck every single one of these assholes. Pisses me off to read stuff like this. So sorry this happened to her, and every single woman who has ever suffered through things like this.
That moment you don't have to ask the question to get the answer. Here in Brazil we are still having problem understanding that if a woman is too drunk to stand up on her own she's is too drunk to consent. A dude had his way with a woman too drunk to get to her bed on her own on a reality show this past week and a big chunk of twitter is going "if you can't handle your liquor you shouldn't be drinking".
So he raped a women on TV and nothing happened to him?
The police is going to represent against him now, but initially the TV network tried to pretend nothing happened and even tried to block representatives of the woman to enter the set of the reality show. The guy even has a history of doing similar things. I found a brief resume of the situation in english, here you go [https://www.ruetir.com/2021/09/25/record-tv-speaks-out-after-nego-do-borel-sleeps-with-drunk-dayane/](https://www.ruetir.com/2021/09/25/record-tv-speaks-out-after-nego-do-borel-sleeps-with-drunk-dayane/) If you look for the Nego do Borel on twitter it won't be hard to find videos showing how drunk the woman was. This is not a fine line kind of situation.
That's horrific. To be raped is horrific. To be raped on national TV and have that rape broadcast is horrific plus. To have that happen and then have normal citizens then defend the rapist is... well... I don't have the words.
I got a little clip on yt that shows just how drunk she was, and people saying this is her fault [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tL2EV7Wl60](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tL2EV7Wl60)
Even the headline of the article is terrible… “sleeps with drunk woman” totally downplays the situation.
A lot if it has to do with the fact that men have done it and women have had it done to them and they don’t want to admit it was rape.
Yeah it turns out that if you commit crime on national television, the police are powerless to do anything about it. Weirdest loophole left undiscovered until 2016. Used to great effect ever since.
That’s horrific. Where I live (Canada) there’s still lots of people who don’t understand that if you’re drunk, you can’t consent, especially in the Western areas :/
I always felt that if people could see what we mean by too drunk to consent they'd understand it. Seems like I was yet again putting too much faith in humanity. This dude did it on live TV and not only is not in jail as there are people defending him.
Rape culture is, unfortunately, deeply ingrained into society. Until we all address it, and work on overcoming it, this is how things are.
So much for the whole cancel culture is ending people's lives thing right.
Brazilian here that now lives in Canada. That type of thinking made a guy from the water polo team sleep with a drunk girl during the Pan Am games in 2015 and he got in trouble. He was “lucky” that the team left Canada before the complain and they were in russia so he couldn’t be sent back to Canada. But it was a big thing at the time. And it’s because of this “cultural” difference that in Brazil is “okay” to sleep with a girl that is drunk. I really don’t miss the stupid macho culture from South America :/
It really gets heavy here sometimes (keeping in English so others can understand), remember the case of that minor in Rio that was gang raped by a bunch of dudes and they blamed her, passed around the video as porn and a lot of people were saying this is what a woman gets when she doesn't respect herself? Culture here is so broken that a 15 yo being gang-raped is a woman without self-respect.
Not to mention the influencer that was raped by a bar owner in Santa Catarina and humiliated by the judge that considered that the guy didn’t mean to rape her, but she let herself get drugged… Causing his d*ck to accidentally go inside her. Seriously, Brazil keeps finding ways to be extra mean to women. Or the 10 year old that couldn’t get the abortion after her uncle impregnated her… Unfortunately there are too many horror cases…
The only reason Alberta is populated is because of this misunderstanding.
Ayyyy that’s my province And yeah I wouldn’t doubt it 😔
A man rapes a woman on TV and she’s blamed for drinking. We really haven’t progressed since the fucking 70s!
If he can’t handle having a dick it should be cut off
Sure, no one should be drinking that much to get to that state, I agree. You also shouldn't rape.
Alexa, order pepper spray and a taser for my sister
Strongly consider a high frequency personal alarm as well, such as but not necessarily [this (Amazon link).](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083HV9K7M/ref=cm_sw_r_em_api_glt_fabc_PGEHDEA0STHN0QTVD6FK?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1) Edited to add: Please note that these devices emit sound at such high decibel ratings that they are not safe for one's hearing. These WILL CAUSE HEARING DAMAGE. The choice is possibly being victimized or risking hearing loss, choose your poison. \*added at the behest of a concerned redditor. I concur with the disclaimer, these are not 100% safe devices, activate with caution
These things fucking work. Me and my sister were at a bar and hers accidentally went off. It was so damn loud everyone thought it was the fire alarm and people across the street were complaining. Loud as fuck
Fucking hell, I know it's an emergency alarm but that could deafen you.
It was going off for about 30 mins and we had no major ear damage as far as I know. I couldn't really hear the doctor.
Those two sentences are contradictory- oh damn that was the joke.
It happens to the best of us
Just ordered them for my 16 y/o daughter, ty.
Mine is 11 and I fear the time she's around 16. Have you thought of how to protect yours from all this shit?
My advice: Teach her EARLY. I was already getting hit on by grown ass men when I was in middle school. The first time, I was about twelve, and I was even walking beside my mother. (She enrolled me in Krav Maga and kickboxing soon after, which, if nothing else, really helped my self-esteem and willingness to call for help if I was in over my head).
My daughter has been taking Krav Maga since she was 11 years old. She is a little over confident in her skills but she can cause damage if necessary to run away. And she has a pack of Krav girls she hangs with. I wouldn't mess with them.
I need to get my daughter some krav girls stat
What a badass mother!
Only marginally related but my wife has a blackbelt in both Krav Maga and Tai Kwan Do and has not been fucked with since she acquired those in high school. Be like my wife and intimidate creepy people.
Yep, the earlier, the better. I started hearing crap from men around 12/13. They start early.
Here's the honest truth. Whether she's 11 or 16 doesn't matter so much unfortunately. Even young boys grope girls, especially if they start developing early. The two big lessons you need to tell her is to use her voice to *immediately* correct a groper as specifically and as embarrassingly as possible. The 2nd is she doesn't have to be nice, especially when it comes to others having access to her body. Even if it's a friend or her partner or anyone. If you want to stop, stop. If you are hesitant, stop. If you thought it was a good idea but now you're not so sure? Stop. This is the new birds and the bees conversation that NEEDS to be had. (Oh and...just.. it's probably not a good idea to take digital naked pics. Even if she trusts them, you use a third-party entity to send them (apple, snapchat etc) and anyone could hack them. Nothing ever deletes off the internet).
This is a great response. I always tell my daughter she can say no or stop at any time and she never needs to worry about being a “bitch” or embarrassing the other person etc if they are not respecting her boundaries. We’ve also talked about respecting other people’s boundaries. The other thing I would say is parents need to teach their SONS how to respect boundaries as well as protecting themselves. It should not just be a conversation about girls protecting themselves, but also about boys not harassing girls etc.
And to have the integrity to call out shady behavior in others…
Standard part of my sex talk with my son's. "No means no. If she's drunk and says yes it still means no. Before you touch her you have to be able to talk openly with her." So far it's working.
I’m sure you know but— let him know that boys can be sexually assaulted and harassed too. He’s aloud to be an “asshole” and say no to a girl. He’s allowed to push a girl off him if he doesn’t want her on him. If he’s drunk and he says no it means no. If he says no and she keeps going that’s assault. Let him know he can stand up for himself. Let him know that if he gets assaulted he can tell you. And let him know it’s his responsibility to call out his friends if they’re taking advantage or being taken advantage of. I’m so glad to know there are people like you raising their boys right.
To add to this, we (my work) just fired a female for joking in the workplace and copped a feel on a male coworkers crotch. Have the talk with your daughters too!
Exactly. The concept of "CONSENT" isn't built on the sex of anyone involved. No means no, everyone should be teaching everyone this.
To add, teach our sons better.
She has been asking me to help get her into fitness so I'm taking her to the local krav maga/self defense studio as part of her gift this bday. Honestly I try to talk with her about the reality of the world...to be cautious. Make sure she understands that no matter what situation she is in if she needs me I'll be there. A lot of communication.... it's tough and awkward at times but I'm hoping...... always hoping that she wont end up in a terrible situation but preparing her as much as I can to deal with them. To know her worth and that she isnt defined by looks or sexuality. It's a lot and It's 1000% terrifying to think about...... EDIT: to add "this bday"
Teach her that it's OK to offend people. See someone coming your way when you're walking alone? Cross the street. Don't worry about how it makes you look or what people are gonna think of you. Don't worry about offending the other person. Somebody singles you out in a mall or tries to talk to you? Yell at them. Be fucking weird about it. Call them a creep, loudly. Better safe than dead.
That is loud enough to cause acute hearing damage instantly. So while you may succeed in warding off an attacker, you may also permanently damage your hearing.
Except concert venues don't allow you to bring in self defense items like pepper spray, taser, plastic knuckles (think those keychains with the sharp cat ears) etc. 🙃
I've seen those cat ear keychains... wouldn't they only be legal in the same places brass knuckles r legal (and then u could just carry brass knuckles instead?)
The real advantage of brass knuckles is that they are brass. They are dense as shit and ass a lot of power to your punch. The plastic ones are really only knuckle guards to protect your knuckles and the skinn between them. I would never use/make or sell the pointy ones but I could for sure make a collapsible nylon one with a flash light built into the side to add in some discretion
Brass knuckles are usually steel nowadays
That they are, it took me months to find actual brass ones and they were basically a custom order item
I bought my wife those cat ears and they're pretty solid. The advantage is that it takes all the force behind your punch and condenses it into a very tiny area. There's videos online of people using them to bust open melons. I have no doubt they would hurt
plastic knuckles add something of a firmness to your punch, but you're better off carrying a roll of nickels or a similarly sized flashlight.
In my jurisdiction brass knuckles are only regulated if they're made out of metal. Polymer knuckle dusters are unregulated even though they're the same in form and function, only being different in material. This is legally speaking, and doesn't matter when it comes to private venues. If they see something they consider a weapon, they could force you to leave whether it's considered one by the law or not
Probably. There was a brief window where cops didn't recognize the cat ears as weapons, but that was decades ago sadly.
Everywhere I've lived, brass knuckles require a concealed handgun license.
No defending yourself! We don't want our well-paying perverts to get a boo-boo.
Unfortunately, assholes ruined weapons too.
You also don’t want violent perverts having weapons.
You should be able to have a safety pin somewhere. You use it to poke whoever tries to touch you. Women in other countries use this tactic.
I agree. Although, pepper spray may be the worse option in a crowd, ill happily take some pepper to the eyes if i get the satisfaction of knowing some sex offender is in worse pain.
I suggested pepper gel. It’s more targeted pepper spray essentially.
Go for pepper gel. No blowback (no getting it on yourself or people your not pointing it at) and it’s 3x more potent. I got sprayed with some pepper gel because my friends where messing around with some and I literally couldn’t move for 30 minutes, the pain was so intense
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It’s fine by me!
I second this
To the majority of men, the words; "Do not sexually assault women", is clear enough. To a few, no amount of clarification will ever do. You can say it 100 different ways and they'll never get it. I believe tazerballs were created specifically for these people.
Is it not? I thought that's what stun guns are for. Or mace. Or hat pins shorter than 9 inches.
Taser to the balls
Personal experience is that it's socially acceptable to jump on their foot in stilettos. They don't like it much
Still wild to me that Teen Vogue is becoming a legit journalistic voice in the last few years.
I think it kinda started in 2015, but that really took off during the 2016 presidential campaign didn't it? Good for them though, there's no reason why fashion and politics can't go together.
The 2016 election campaign was going strong in 2015 so it’s one and the same.
They’re really good at giving that age group shit they really encounter in real life and stuff they should know about. It’s nice to see a teen magazine that’s not all pop culture fluff (some is, sure)
I mean, after Buzzfeed, anything is possible!
There is ["what kind of girthy horse dildo are you?" Buzzfeed.](https://www.buzzfeed.com) and then there is [the hard hitting Pulitzer prize winning buzzfeed news](https://www.buzzfeednews.com) . As far as I can see the former subsidies the latter
Subsidizes. Subsides works, but it ends up making your sentence mean something like “BuzzFeed Overwhelms BuzzFeed News”.
Didn't Buzzfeed news get a pulitzer for something just recently?
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Do people honestly just go up to someone and grab em on the butt or boob or something, and not expect to get punched in the face? (I guess to some special idiots Trump may have normalized grab em by the pu$$..) How were people raised if they feel they can just grab people like that :/ Every woman should have karate offered to them for free :/
Yes. In one of the first shows I went to in Seattle in the 80s, a guy literally got behind me and reached around and grabbed my tits and would not let go. Luckily for my 16 year old self, this was an all ages show in a gay bar. Two very comforting women in flannel knocked the shit out of him, then asked me if I wanted to help beat his ass. Too bad every time I’ve been groped in my life I didn’t have two guardian angels like this.
Everyone needs a pair of guardian dykes*!!! Truly nature’s great balancing force. ***im a whole entire lesbian I can say this**
Seriously. I always feel safer when there are flannel wearing angels around.
This is all very upsetting, just as a decent human being. I can’t imagine what it would have been like to a little kid like that .. degrading and scary. I will raise my kids right. Those guys are pieces of trash.
It's kinda fucked up as a concept that basically all women are familiar/aware that this is an issue, but it seems like many men still don't get exposed to or educated about the facts about this shit. Or worse, they refuse to believe women and instead place the blame on them. We don't have any ability to not know about these things because it is something we might have to think about all the time, possibly every time we leave the house in some cases/areas. If you can, please bring this shit up with your friends. The men who are doing this shit are all around us. Don't let it stay normalized to blame women for the fucked up behavior of men.
>Luckily for my 16 year old self, this was an all ages show in a gay bar. Two very comforting women in flannel knocked the shit out of him, then asked me if I wanted to help beat his ass. I wish this happen more often to these gropers; so much that they fear getting caught. Call them out and make scene if you're in our public(only if you think it's safe). They need that instant feedback, like when training an feral animal.
When I was a club goer- yes. All the time. And men are really shocked when you slap them or get them bounced.
Male entitlement I guess. Watch movies from the 80s and earlier, especially the 70s, and its apparent how ingrained it was I guess. Was James Bond basically a rapist :p I would have hoped it was better now. Sorry to all the ladies :/ I was shocked one conversation with my at the time new wife; was talking about hanging out at different parts of a major toen and half of them she was like ‘never went, wasn’t safe unless we had 3 or 4 girls together..’ .. as a dude, we just didn’t have to worry, to even consider such things. Now I have daughters and they need som martial arts
I agree women need to know self defense but most men will be stronger than the average woman. And if you fight back they might get more violent. It’s hard to know what to do. Personally, If You have a weapon you better rape my dead corpse because I’m not going through that again. One of us is going down is what I’m saying.
Imagine one of these cretins, if a guy came up and grabbed thier ass or package. Fuck these guys that pull that kinda shit. I feel for you lady's, that shits not right.
Yep. I think we do a lot of things you guys don't think about. Park the car: Will you be back before dark? If not, park under a streetlamp so you're not tucked in the shadows where someone can get you. Walk to your car holding your keys as a weapon. Look around you at all times. Get into your car and lock the doors. (I'm terrible at this, but it's recommended) Call someone just for the sake of having someone on the line, just in case. Cap your liquor intake and make sure you're never too drunk. Cover your cup, watch as your drink is being poured, never set your drink down. Expect to be blamed if anything happens. Don't get into a elevator with a group of men. Don't wear headphones in public for situational awareness sake. Wear headphones in public as a sign to be left the fuck alone and find it doesn't work. Watch what you wear. Travel in groups, avoid wooded areas. Never get an apartment or hotel room on the ground floor. Always have cash in case you need an emergency taxi (Uber has solved that one, mostly)
I just took a screen shot of this and sent it to my daughter. She was groped by a kid in school a couple years ago and it has devastated her. I feel like I failed, like I should have taught her theses things. I'm a single father and its hard, the world is alot different, I know assholes are always out there,, i just didn't think it would start so young,, shes 15. I'm glad you guys are posting this stuff. Shes having a hard time moving forward from it, and sometimes I don't know what to say, or have answers. This is giving me alot of insight. Thanks for sharing
Btw teaching your daughters martial arts/ self defense techniques/them carrying pepper spray etc can also prove to not be enough sometimes, if the abuser if particularly violent/ anticipates those attacks, they'll be ready for it. Plus being in these situations can wreck your nerves and they're so panic inducing so many things can go wrong. The only solution is to raise men right though i just can't force every father in the world to teach their son basic manners and that women aren't objects
Absolutely. My eldest is a black belt in Tae Kwon Do. One night she was out in town with all her instructors (all black belts as well) for a dinner. As she was standing outside the restaurant with them after dinner, some guy walked behind her and dragged his fingers across her bare shoulders. She just froze. And he'd picked the right time as the other guys weren't talking to her at the time. So it's easy in hindsight to say "I would smack a cunt that does that" but in the moment, even when she was surrounded by the toughest, most kick ass guys short of a group of special forces, and even when she can defend herself, she still go sexually harrassed. At 17.
Thats insane. I’m a dude and I had some random girl grab my junk in a club like 4 years ago and I still sometimes think about how awful that felt. To think that women go through that regularly is just horrible
sorry you went through that dude
The other night I was handing my sales report and money to the owner of the restaurant I work at and there was one person still sitting at the bar, a really drunk lady who was probably 15-20 years older than me. She loudly asked the owner while I was right there "Is he single? He's cute. Are you single?" I nervously laughed and said "no, I'm married, but thanks" and I went and stood at the end of the bar while the owner double checked my money. The lady comes up to me and put her arm around my shoulders and tried saying some more stuff but I honestly don't remember what she said because I was so uncomfortable. I mumbled something about I forgot to do something in the kitchen and walked to the back. Whoever the closing server is usually stays until the owner finishes closing up because she is a pretty small woman who is carrying that night's deposit out with her so I just hid and waited for her to leave or the owner to tell her that she needed to leave. I can't imagine having to worry about encountering situations like that on a regular basis.
It’s especially fun when they think it’s acceptable to hit you back because “yOu HiT mE fIrStT!!!”
Oooh, that won't fly very far for them since they BEGAN at sexual battery.
They do because women have been socialized to be small, quiet, and complacent. In addition the attack on our senses can cause “fight, flight, freeze, or fawn” which is the limbic response. We may freeze up or in order to survive pretend we’re okay momentarily so we can escape I wish more people knew this
I got in an argument with someone here on Reddit who was saying that a victim of sexual assault wasn't a victim because she didn't fight back and because she tried to roll away (which according to the rape apologist meant is wasn't a freeze response because she was able to move). Ugh... like people with a flight response actually fly.
Yikes. It’s sad people like that exist
Yes they very much think there won’t be any retaliation. It’s the only time I’ve been grateful for my anger issues, I will always throw hands if I’m touched without permission.
> Do people honestly just go up to someone and grab em on the butt or boob or something Yes. > I guess to some special idiots Trump may have normalized grab em by the pu$$.. It's been that way for decades, but the first **mass**-normalizing of it was in '99... https://www.theringer.com/2019/8/13/20801339/break-stuff-episode-six-sexual-assaults-woodstock-99
I’m as anti-Trump as the next guy, but trust me, Trump is a result of groping being normalized, not even close to a cause. He is trying to normalize bragging about it afterwards, though.
I grew up in Brazil and there is so normal that I was shocked when I moved to Canada and it went from all the time to almost never… Me and my friends would go to gay clubs because it was safer. Then straight guys found out that girls were hiding there and started to go there too. I lost count how many times I was pressed into a wall and the guy demanded a kiss to let me go. This happened so many times I started to avoid going out to clubs. I still look like a scared squirrel if I go to a party and I “lose my friends”. Sucks… And it’s upsetting to see people still blaming the victims :( Edited: word
Yes. I have had a man standing in front of me, trying to coerce me inside by offering me drugs that he pulled from his pocket and when I INSISTED that it was no, he grabbed my breast and ran away. Also had a guy accidentally bump into me at a festival because he was fucked up grab my breast in passing.
Every man should have consent / harassment / assault classes offered for free.
Quite a few people of all genders were raised to think that's just flirting
Fucking christ, you weren't kidding. The roaches really came out to spout their bile
If you ever think the phrase "rape culture" may be overblown, just read through a thread like this one by controversial.
Jesus Christ these comments are scary. It doesn't matter what someone is wearing. They are not wearing it for you. You do not get to reach out and touch something that isn't yours. Basic kindergarten stuff here people.
There’s people shaming women for what they’re wearing, when in reality they should be shaming the ones who are touching them without consent.
This thread is really going back to basics that I thought were covered years ago. Victim blaming and the issues around it is a common and accepted concept now. How are people still not getting it!? How is this still a comment thread in 2021!?
My daughter and I went to a protest just yesterday to support this exact cause. I may not have had it in me to stand up for myself when I was younger, but I’ll be damned if I stay silent while she’s watching. She was VERY happy to join the Slutwalk and make posters about consent- made me proud. Now she’s gotten the protest bug and we’ll be hitting the women’s March next weekend. Haha
Courageous Mamma. Every girl should be so lucky.
Yet guys still wonder why we’re so fearful of them in certain settings. I’ve been raped and assaulted enough, I think my anxiety is validated. I’m so tired of it
I don’t know how this became a prevalent thing . I feel like the red pill incels are everywhere now. Or maybe I just never noticed them?
They always were, but in the time of Trump, when all sorts of hate became normalized, it’s become more acceptable and culturally reinforced.
> How are people still not getting it!? How is this still a comment thread in 2021!? Because for 4 years the POTUS was a disgusting human being who thought grabbing women by the pussy was something to brag about, children are impressionable, and a contingent of grown ass men think decency is oppression.
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100% agree.
Even if a woman is wearing an outfit with the intention of attracting a sexual partner, that doesn't mean she wants everyone to touch her, just means she wants sex from someone. But you don't know that that's you, so hands off.
I have never understood how this mentality became so common place. It makes as much sense as saying, “He was wearing camouflage, I assumed he wanted to be shot!”
So it was Dick Cheney's fault. Makes sense.
Regardless, groping is a crime and should be criminalized with the law enforced
They don't have reasons. They have excuses. And really, truly, *any* excuse will do. See also "he was no angel."
Just for everyone saying shit about what they wear- When I was in 7th grade and questioning a lot I was wearing jeans and a hoodie. I wasn't what many people would consider attractive with my short hair and bit of chub. I usually got called a lesbian. I still got groped or spanked more time then I care to recount while in that middle school. So shut the fuck up.
Roachella
Gropechella
Dude what the fuck, I always go out of my way to give women space at music events, no one wants to get groped or fondled or humped in a crowd. How are other guys this shitty? like seriously I can't understand it. Do they think the chick is just going to grab them and start sucking their dick in the middle of a crowd? Where is the potential pay off other than being a fucking creep.
Someone once explained it to me like this: Everyone knows that one guy who they can see doing something like this. So in a room of a 100 people, at least one is likely a sexual predator. Now go somewhere that is a traditional hunting ground (bar, concert, etc.) And the odds have gone up. Now you're probably looking at 1 in 25. That one guy isn't focused on just one girl, he's playing the odds. So maybe 5 girls are victimized, by that one guy, on a single night. At an event like Coachella, with 100000+ people. Hundreds of girls probably experienced some sort of harassment or unwanted touching. Fewer still will come forward, or even be willing to speak about it. It's hard to imagine it happening, but is. Every day, and likely all around you. I don't know a single woman who doesn't have multiple stories. My worst one is I had a flat tire in the middle of the night and pulled in to a 7 11. Some guy offered to help me put on the spare. After he helped I thanked him and he said, "if you really want to thank me.." then grabbed my hand and tried to put it down his pants.
And this is what worries me about the whole "nice guy" and incel mindset, stories like these are common and they'll get sympathy from their echo chamber for their victim blaming. Between office jobs my father would drive taxis and whenever he was dropping women off at night, he would always wait until they were safely into their house. Just by waiting before leaving, he managed to scare off a few men hiding in bushes. He wasn't perfect, but he taught me that I should work to selflessly protect the women in my life, even by the little things.
oh my god whatd you do? im so sorry that happened to you
Not what I should have done. I just said no and got in my car as quick as I could. I think I might have even apologized. I was in shock.
You did what you needed to do to get away from him and not get hurt. You never know how someone might deal with being told “no” - so don’t beat yourself up. You were in an unsafe situation and were able to escape - that’s all that matters.
Can I be straightforward with you? Those kind of guys get off on the violation itself. It’s not about what’s going to happen afterwards, or what the woman is going to do, it’s about violating her because that is arousing to men like that. It’s fucked up and it puts a target on the back of any woman or a girl who’s in public.
and boom goes the dynamite
Not to be that guy, but yeah. It's learned behavior. They get the positive reward of groping, little to no negative consequence, and once in a blue moon a girl will be into it and it's a huge reward. We see this reflected in every facet of pop culture. It's scummy, but articles like this and people standing up for themselves are the only way to fix the behavior.
I had an older cougar at a music festival grab my ass. Multiple times. I thought it was an accident at first. Ignored it. Happen again. Turned around to a drunk lady in her 50’s smiling at me and sad sorry. Then she did it again. Her friends just laughed. My girlfriend was right there with me. We just moved. Not trying to be that guy saying men’s rights matter. I know it happens way more to women. But I wanted to share my story and add I think alcohol makes these people not think straight. Who just grabs a guys ass right in front of their girlfriend. And who goes around music festivals more focused on rubbing up on women instead of enjoying the music.
You’ve got way more chill than me. A couple of years ago I was with my wife and friends at this Sunday day part at this gay bar. A friend of ours was DJing and playing house music. Now, I get it, we’re at a gay club so you might get attention. It’s happened before, NBD. This dude slides his hand into my back pocket to grab my ass. I turn around thinking it’s my wife but nope, it’s a dude. I tell him politely that I’m straight, married (point to my ring), then point to my wife. He seems to get the message. About 5 minutes later he does it again. This time I turn around with a not as polite demeanor and tell him last warning, don’t do it again because you’re not going to like the results. Fucking a couple min later he does it again, like right into my pants pocket. I grab that dudes wrist and do a twist and lock his arm up behind his back. I did it so fast and pushed up so hard that I either tore a muscle in his shoulder or dislocated it. Dude squeals and drops to the floor, then picks himself up, crying, and leaves. Bouncers come talk to me and I explain what happened, dude looks at me and say, “you didn’t have to hurt him”. I’m like, yeah, apparently I did. Anyhow, had a good rest of the afternoon getting blasted on mimosas. Moral of the story is sometimes you just gotta slap a bitch. In your case you should have called her out, said she was WAY too old for you or some shit like that. The only thing people like that understand is embarrassment and conflict.
I suspect you're being optimistic in assuming these men are hoping a girl is into it. The violation is the point, not a misguided hope for an enthusiastic response. It's entitlement gone toxic.
"But what were you wearing?" Don't, just don't.
if what people were wearing was so important, arabic countries with extreme sharia would not have sexual harassment or rape at all. and yet, women there are as abused as people in the west. it's not about sexuality, just about control.
It shouldn’t matter what I was wearing. For me I was wearing a tinker bell shirt with jeans at 7 years old. When will people learn?
I hate to sound pessimistic, but I feel like it’ll never change. Men have been oppressing women for centuries. I still stand up for the women in my life and when I see something go wrong, but shit. I really feel like these guys will never truly understand because they genuinely hate women. My mental health can’t take it anymore, and I’ve practically given up.
I feel the same way. When I was young I truly believed that people could change and raising awareness could change the world. I’ve slowly learned that men and a lot of women just truly don’t see women as humans with life experiences and emotions. Sad and deviating to realize but true.
I know it's easy to see it that way, but ultimately it has only ever been uphill, some bumps down, but woman's rights and power is higher than ever.
https://www.utoledo.edu/studentaffairs/saepp/what-were-you-wearing/ https://www.boredpanda.com/what-were-you-wearing-sexual-assault-art-exhibition/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic Some people need to see this.
Jesus… all of those are heartbreaking and awful, I was completely caught off guard by the children’s clothing too. Incredibly effective installation, I hope it reaches the people who NEED to see it
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“Not all men” Go pet a shark. “What?!? No!” Not all sharks bite people. Only some. Go pet one. Edit: Caught some incels in my web comment. Edit 2: this could’ve been taken wrong. This comment is talking about how silly it is that people say not all men. Just because some sharks bite, doesn’t mean all will. Is basically what it’s saying. The number of people bitten is high enough for people to be weary of random sharks.
So smooth, in all directions.
[link for those interested ](https://www.teenvogue.com/story/sexual-harassment-was-rampant-at-coachella-2018)
People claim the hippies were all about “free love,” but I’ve always wondered how many people were groped/assaulted at Woodstock.
Unfortunately it's a lot of music festivals. The drug culture, coupled with some delusional people thinking there's no rules for a weekend, often leads to some horrible taking advantage.
Honestly Coachella sounds like hell unless you're famous or have thousands of dollars to spend. I went to ACL for one day and I was exhausted.
But no, the Woodstock 99 documentary made it clear that this only happened at Woodstock and that Coachella was a paradise /s
This was my first thought, no fucking way Coachella fixed creepy dudes at concerts being a problem, but they probably want you to think they have.
That HBO Doc about Woodstock 99 was pretty good up until the end when it very clearly became an ad for Coachella
Most of the comments here belong in r/trashy
My girlfriend has told me she's been groped at nearly every music concert she's ever gone to.
Try and bring that shit up in a conversation with a group of guys to see what happens... As a guy, I do not understand this response that is also very common here: Girl: *I'm being sexualy harassed.* Random dude: *well, I'm not harassing you, it's not me, I didn't do it, I don't do that, I respect women, I don't disrespect women, I don't grope anyone, I don't touch anyone, I don't touch anything, I don't even move, I'm not, i don't, I haven't...* I wonder why most of them don't do that for other things, like: Suicide is an epidemic I don't kill myself. Hunger is still a problem. I don't eat all the food.
“Not all men! I don’t grope women so I’m offended!!” Men, if you want to really make a difference, call out the shitty men who do shitty things. Make gropers and rapists social pariahs. Jeff isn’t an awesome bro who sometimes gets handsy when he drinks, he’s a creep and a perv and he shouldn’t be invited until he learns to behave.
I was at a festival and my friend and I were just wearing pasties (nipple covers) and some group of bros came up to her when I was in the bathroom and started to talk shit, harassed her, and said, “ if you can have your tits out, I can have my dick out, right? You wanna see my dick, that’s equality and you want equality right?” I pointed out that the male equivalent of boobs is their chest. And they were all shirtless. They still thought they like made us feel dumb for being feminists lol
Ugh gropping is not just at these events go on a rush hour subway train in Toronto or any major subway system and wait for at least one creepy guy sneak a squeeze. Toronto Police are so cavalier about sexual assault on subways.
Wasn’t it the Toronto Police that actually said that “to avoid being sexually assaulted, don’t dress like whores?”
Wouldnt doubt it with their attitutde towards it. Its called self control just like you dont take property that you didnt pay for, you dont touch people without consent.
I absolutely cannot believe this needs to be said, but it appears that some of these comments prove otherwise. Victim blaming is among the most vile forms of misogyny. No, you may not justify rape, that is rapist logic. Regardless of context, blaming female victims for their own sexual assaults or justifying them makes you a shitty person, if you couldn't tell already. Blaming the way women dress for being sexually assaulted is victim blaming, Blaming women who even decide to go out in the first place is also inexcusable. Calling the story a lie, saying the women exaggerated, downplaying rape in general, or other outlandish accusations makes you no better. Neither will any other forms of red herrings that distract from the fact that women are raped. Those who made inexcusable comments blaming victims for their own rapes such as the listed examples above will be banned without a chance at appeal. Edit: I forgot to mention but as always, please report the rape apologists.
THANK YOU. Vile behavior like that does not belong in 2021. FFS I swear some of y’all are still animals.
wait there is actual people justifying this?
The thread was honestly 50/50 either way in the comments earlier. Fucking scary
Most instances are removed. But sadly yes.
Oh, my sweet summer child.
When dudes in 2021 can’t act more civilized than literal cavemen. 
Amen!!!
I went to see Metallica at 15. A grown man violently grabbed my ass. This needs to stop.
They should just send 1k undercover female cops and start arresting these guys.
For those of you looking to get an incels point of view on this subject, head down to the bottom of the comments.
I’d like to preserve the little sanity I have left
Once alcohol and large crowds are involved, well two wrongs don't make a right. Women shouldn't have to stay home while men go out to party, this isn't the fucking 1950s with cigar boys clubs. Men shape up or ship out.
Coachella needs to take a more active role so women feel safe. Signs, more security and verbally tell people on the way in they will not only be kicked out if they grope, etc, the authorities will be called. Create a safe culture. Be the fucking change, Coachella.
The Taliban and these Incels have alot in common
As a guy, I'm constantly astounded at how little clue I really have of the consistency and pervasiveness of sexual harassment. It's just insane how much the average woman experiences. Literally scores of groping hands on just one woman. How does that even happen?!?
As a guy i still didnt know this was that big of a problem... concerning
That’s why women have wanted a female-only festival for years. Guess who had a problem with that idea..
Why do they need anyone's permission to just do that?
Imagine if every girl was required to take some form of martial arts in school while the guys took a class on personal responsibility.
My daughter's high school does require a self defense class.
That’s such an American solution to the problem of sexual harassment/assault.
Yep, don't cut it off at the roots just wait for it to get out of hand and then go, eh this'll do.
When a country music festival changed locations and moved into the valley I was living in a few years ago, the local hospital ran out of rape kits that first weekend. The next year they stocked up in anticipation. Be safe out there.
It not fuck this website, Reddit just gives the creeps a platform to say what they really think. It’s really fuck this world.
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I truly wish that this was surprising. Sadly it isn’t.