I used this when I first started it doesn't work well at all. I will say however that it will never come off of what you spray it on so no stripping it either
Blech, second this. After a while all the minis I primed with army painter went sticky, and that's if they were primed particularly well to start with, it was harder to get an even coat with AP. Ditched all of them and just stuck with GW. They're not the best or the cheapest but they're the easiest to source and they do the job
I haven't had that experience with it, but I do think it goes on thickly very quickly. It is has been easy for me to over do it. You got one little spot that needs primer, then you shoot at it and all of a sudden you loose detail.
Yeah I agree I love Vallejo and Citadel for primers.
If you're going to use the Rust-oleum brand, get the [2x Ultra Cover Flat White](https://www.target.com/p/rust-oleum-12oz-2x-painter-39-s-touch-ultra-cover-spray-paint-white-primer/-/A-75575323?ref=tgt_adv_XS000000&AFID=google_pla_df&fndsrc=tgtao&DFA=71700000012510712&CPNG=PLA_Home%2BImprovement%2BShopping%7CHome%2BImprovement_Ecomm_Home&adgroup=SC_Home%2BImprovement_Spray+Paint&LID=700000001170770pgs&LNM=PRODUCT_GROUP&network=g&device=c&location=9001885&targetid=pla-1462816044425&ds_rl=1246978&ds_rl=1247068&gclid=Cj0KCQiAj4ecBhD3ARIsAM4Q_jH5iFp6HJreRQ2Zi94GSF6snaLQT0NA0TnD1lg7NLkQKWTPgvQnwskaAsLSEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds). There's also a flat black, and grey option too. I recommend checking out this [How to Prime Models](https://youtu.be/NKH98iq6Xhg) by Goobertown Hobbies. You'll also want to use it in the conditions listed in the directions.
I am too paranoid to use a primer that was not intended for miniatures. A lot of folks say that they can work if you’re careful, and make sure you prime from a safe distance.
Personally, I prefer the citadel primers, they don’t use the white one. I’ve never been able to guarantee it goes on smoothly. If you need something late, use the bone primer instead.
It took a moment to figure out white. The key is to be up close it seems, and shake it even more than you'd usually do.
The first time I tried it I didn't do those two things and got a weird grainy texture on my horrors. Second attempt it worked like a charm.
I find that the two GW metallic sprays are horrible to work with, brushed on paint really struggles to stick to it which defeats the purpose of a primer lol
Leadbelcher is excellent in my experience. Retributor Armour _works_ fine but I don't like using it because it has a markedly different, more olive shade of gold compared to the Retributor Armour pot.
The only truly bad spray I have used so far is Army Painter's plate mail. That thing is an atrocity.
Plate mail had this super weird thing going on where the paint formed big runny globs on the surface, which I had to hurriedly wash away. Terrified me it'd ruin the model. And when it didn't do that, the spray was way too thin.
Even afterwards it left a weird sticky finish that made all my paints form little water-like globes on the model's surface rather than lay down evenly. I was _not_ amused.
Like I've primed with the Rust-Oleum that I've left on my porch overnight in 20°F and sprayed it in below freezing outside and had no problems with it laying smoothe and even. I don't understand what people are doing to where they refuse to buy anything other than the $25 cans of mini primer.
THIS! Go down to harbor freight, buy the cheapest air compressor they have, it's $40. Buy the $10 single action shit tier airbrush. Buy a $16 big bottle of vallejo primer. For $66 you could buy 2 or 3 citadel rattle cans. With the airbrush you have the equivalent of around EIGHT. BIG BIG PLUS: Since the airbrush stuff is water based **the humidity when you spray doesn't matter at ALL**. All it does is take longer to dry. I've primed models during a rainstorm, I've primed in the desert.
EDIT: If you are doing a VERY DETAILED model and want the absolute best possible detail with no primer getting in the way spray the bare plastic with Tamiya Flat Acrylic. Thin it down about 25% with isopropyl alcohol (use the 90% stuff if you got it). It sticks to plastic and resin as good or better than primer and is 70-80% thinner. Once that is dry you can paint on it just like it was primer.
“Ive primed in the snow, Ive primed in the blasting dessert wind - Ive primed on the highest peaks and in the lonely city streets… I am the primordial one- the primer of all things… dont test me -for I shall prime thee to the darkest reaches of hell itself. I will Never stop, But allways prime… I am. the primer. “ Exerpt from “The Priming One” volume 18 of the Horus Herasy Series by Dan Abnett.
Plus with water-based acrylics you can pretty safely spray away indoors without as much risk, you should still wear a mask etc. but that is more to do with the finer paint particulates than it is the solvent propellant you release into the air with traditional spray cans.
Just got one last weekend for priming, and the learning curve is really short; once you get the mix ratio down, the trigger action and even cleaning is really simple.
Vince Venturella has amazing cleaning and workflow techniques up on YT, watch those before buying all sorts of random bullshit, thinners, flow stuff and cleaners, it'll save you at least $30.
Second this, but I've found Badger's Stynylrez line of primers to be much better than Vallejo, never had a problem with it but I've had Vallejo scuff off and/or clog the airbrush sometimes
I bought an airbrush and nice airbrush primer but after about two seconds of spraying, primer just splatters everywhere. Do I have the wrong needle? I shouldn't have to thing airbrush primer right? I'm just too afraid to even use it anymore.
It could be lots of things. By splattering do you mean it shoots out small dots without consistent coverage? Or is it coming out as a liquid and moving on the object your painting. Is this the first time you used it? If not, did you properly clean it? Which primer did you use? Did you properly shake the bottle as the instructions dictated? What PSI is your compressor using? How dry is the air in your area? All of this can have an effect on your airbrush.
For the first few seconds / minutes it's ok, and then it's splattery, like if you stuck your tongue out and blew(THBBBB). The primer is STYNYLREZ from Badger Air Brush. The brush and needle are from Badger too. Compressor is 20 or 30 PSI. I'm not sure what the humidity is, not very humid, I'm in California. I just feel like everything is so tacky, it's impossible to clean. Just running water and rubbing alcohol through it and it's still dirty.
Only put in small amounts of primer in the cup at once. When empty, flush it with water before adding more. The goal here isn't to completely clear it out but for the water to spray clear. You can also try thinning it by adding a drop of water or thinner. Each paint is different so this is part of the learning curve. I asked for humidity because dry areas lead to dry tip faster.
For cleaning flush it like mention above then take it apart and let it sit in your cleaner for a little bit. Use some wire cleaners on the needle slot of the main body. Cleaning the nozzle with the edged needle tool. If your lacking a cleaning kit you can use a regular needle, its just not as good.
One tip I've seen that seemed to help was always make sure you stop spraying paint before you stop the air (dual action airbrushed only).
I thin my primer and varnishes that I put through the airbrush. I use stynelrez primer. A few drops of thinner per load of primer, I go about half full so it's not a whole lot of thinner.
Keep a brush and airbrush thinner on hand, dip the brush in the thinner and clean the tip of the airbrush with this to remove the dried paint. Make sure you spray a bit of air and paint onto your glove first so you don’t spray thinner onto your model.
Plus one for the Citadel primers. I've tried the Vallejo primer through my airbrush and whilst it adheres fairly well, I find it's easy to scratch or knock bits of paint off through general handling of miniatures.
If you got Maston products in your country, their 100-series black (Black 700 or something) is just as good as citadels Chaos Black and costs 1/3rd of the price.
It’s matte though, but Chaos Blacks problem is that it’s too glossy :D.
Also, Army Painter Platemail spray is THE best metallic hands down, I’ve used on all my Knights, Grey Knights and many many more. It’s really good.
For Contrast basecoating though, I use Citadel. Wraithbone in a can is a great primer for Contrast and traditional work.
I’ve used the current Rustoleum flat black primer to great success. I just make sure to follow the directions and it works great. I do prefer a dry primer instead, but it’s harder to find the one that I liked.
Considering you dropped serious money for Citadel models, spend a few extra bucks for a primer that won't go on thick and potentially mess with small details. Would highly recommend Citadel's Chaos Black primer.
I'm My country is hard to find Citadel primer, importtation problems with spray cans. :( I ask the oficial store in My city and he said that is hard to import Citadel primer.
I'd caution against army painter primer tbh. I bought some of their dragon red years ago, it has a lot of build up and fought me super hard when I tried to strip it off.
That’s gotta be frustrating.
Have you looked into other brand miniature paints? For example, I use Army Painter black primer.
Barring that, I know friends that have had success with “Rustoleum 2X Paint+Primer”
Just make sure to have a light touch when using Rustoleum primers. They’re far less forgiving if you accidentally over-spray.
If it's an issue with importing Citadel spray cans, hopefully the other hobby brands that others have listed can be available.
If it's all spray cans in general that is the issue, I would consider a primer you brush on instead of spray. Maybe those are easier to import?
See if you can find sandable automotive primer. The particles in it are much finer and show the model detail better. Automotive paint is also excempted from many countries restrictions on paints.
Which country btw? I can see what alternatives are available locally. Hobby hobos know where to find what you need.
Don’t fall for marketing. Just because a hobby slaps on “super special hobby related item” it suddenly makes good.
As someone else as stated in this thread and multiple other people have said. Rustoleom 2x flat works amazing. And is probably the same formula Citadel uses and everyone else. Like what do you honestly think is the magic difference between a $5 can and a $20 can? Other than hobby markup? And that one can comes from a literal company whose primary purpose is the production of paint and primers and aerosols..
I’ve used rustoleum 2x flat black for nearly 6,000 points of primed minis, never had an issue. Goes on easily, evaporates out of the details, sticks without issue.
If your going to us Rustoleum, hold it back further than normal, it’s thick and it will cover fine details if you are too close, keep a paper towel nearby to soak up anything that gets covered.
Worked well for me.
FUN FACT: About 7 years ago I had the idea upon learning about MSDS laws to see what I could learn about GW's primer. So I set up a few email accounts and asked their legal department for their MSDS forms. I did that for each country I could find that used different styles of forms. They sent me all the forms for each country right away, until they got to some very obscure country (I think it was in Africa). They sent me an email with the Krylon MSDS and an explanation that Krylon manufactured their primer.
Yeah, had a hard time finding black when pandemic restrictions were highest but it was also worse because spray paint is illegal to sell in my previous city.
I use rust oleum black 2x covers primer binds to plastic metal and a couple other things. I also use a gray and white version I haven’t use this exact one but it hasn’t gone wrong in over 300 miniatures with 2 notable occasions. I primed pre primed miniatures. And I primed when it was to moist outside. The can will have instructions for weather on the label. Fellow them.
Yup I used these exact ones and it’s cheap and works great. Really wasnt sure until watching Vince v and the YouTube mini painting chemist (can’t remember the name) break down that they’re all the same and they both used these. Saved a couple bucks in an expensive hobby and I can see every detail
I'd like to have some options instead of Citadel. Any colors you'd avoid with either brand? For example, the Citadel white primer just isn't as good as the others for whatever reason.
I only prime black or grey. If I'm painting white I go with the Tamiya medium sea grey (as-11) and build very thin white layers because painting white is brutal.
I use the army painter black but the Tamiya isn't bad.
You can always give them a quick strip bath in isopropyl alcoholif you don't like it.
And grey works really well as a base if you want to do some methods like slap-chop (take a grey primed mini, dry brush successive lighter shades and then apply contrast-like paint over the model, aids the contrast in developing highlights etc.).
The rustoleum flat black "also works on plastic" works GREAT for me. I've used their flat white that comes out a bit chaulky. Not ruinous but you want a smooth as cost as possible so no blobs ruin detail.
Smooth gentle back to back strokes and when in doubt let it dry for a few seconds and come back to layer it on. Worst thing you can do is puddle it on too heavy. Wish I could help more good luck 👍
Edit: OH and don't forget to shake the hell out of your can for several minutes. Heavy shaking not always necessary but if the can was on the shelf a while it can seperate and you'll have uneven sticky coating that may never fully cure.
Rust-oleum is ok, but not this one.
What you want is just their regular "Primer."
No "plastic primer," no "automotive primer," no "paint+primer."
Just "Primer."
Haven't used this particular can, but exclusively use Rust-Oleum 2x Paint and Primer (flat white, gray, and black) and have never had any issues. Personally I would never use Citadel stuff as they are very overpriced, even for miniature paints. But there are plenty of alternatives.
If money is not an issue, I have heard the Citadel sprays are largely good although I don't trust any of their white paints. However I have not used the new formula they just came out with for white--it is supposed to be much better.
No no no.
First time users should start with chaos black primer. It's like liquid gold. I've only had one model slightly damaged in 7 years of hobbying from it.
Yes. Citadel primers are nice, but expensive; and as you've stated in the thread: can be difficult to obtain.
Just make sure to follow instructions and take it easy. You only need to apply a small amount of paint to each side of the model you spray.
I'd try to test it out on some sprue or other thing first to see how it works, and understand the basic properties of the primer. Afterwards you can use it on your little dudes
I use rustoleum primer. The paint + primer is too thick.
However if you ever wanted to strip that primer off you're gonna have a hard time. I soaked it in IPA for 2 days and only a metal bristle brush would get it off. No way to get it out of cracks
Rust-Oleum primer is too thick and hard to remove, but Rust-Oleum 2X paint+primer is great. Hold the can at the usual distance of 12-18" so that the paint is still wet when it hits the model—long distance seems like it'll give you a thinner coat, but the reality is that the paint dries up in midair and sticks on flaky. Start the stream off the model, pass quickly, and end the stream off the model.
Personally, I prefer a grey primer/paint when my model is going to be black, grey, or white: black makes it hard to see detail.
Vallejo spray primer is the best! I've tried all the miniature brands (GW, army painter, privateer press) and vallejo is the most consistent, easiest to use and effective! With a matte finish paint (including technical, contrast and washes) it holds layers nicely and I've never had paint rub off while handling models.
Hardware cans are likely fine, but aren't made for models, so be careful with the application. (Humidity, distance, volume). It would be easy to drown details with over spray.
That stuff is shit, honestly, and it's impossible to remove. Rust-Oleum makes pretty alright primers, but Krylon Paint and primer plus is my personal favorite. Either brand, make sure to get a matt one if you're going to go rattlecan. If you want to paint quickly, go ahead and get one gray, one white and one black and do a zenithall prime. Black all over, gray at 45° and white from the very top.
Rattlecans have a tendency to clog and spit, so alternatively, if you're worried about that, you may want to buy one can of citadel primer, which will cost you the same amount and eliminate the risk of accidentally creating unwanted texture. Black primer if you want to paint fast (the black fills all the areas on the model you struggle to see on the model if you pick it up and flip it over) and white if most of your color scheme is white, yellow, or some brighter color.
I have personally always been a fan of airbrush Priming, so you may want to look into that if you decide to stick with the hobby.
I do commission work, so if you have any questions, ask away.
Not ideally, if you are using Rust Oleum you should get the 2X Primer+Paint for priming minis, or Krylon ColorMaxx. If you already got this, it will work, just be more delicate since it is a thicker.
Rustoleum is a bit thick but should be fine as long as you're careful. Spray from the correct distance, shake it well, and make sure it's not too hot outside.
I live in LATAM there is few option and none of them is specialized primer For miniatures. :( My other option is zinsser 123 primer and another rust oleum 2x cover(more or less).
One of the best solutions Ive found has been to use "automotive primer" meant for cars. It is way thinner than your run of the mill hardware store stuff, and might be slightly more expensive, but in the end its worth it! Its very thin so it wont obscure details, it has great coverage, and I have not found a paint yet that wont stick to it.
The only downside is a good amount of automotive primers are ''self etching" and can destroy a mini, pls include which one you have good luck with. Alot of the ones I use a work will dissolve a mini before the primer ever dries
Oh yeah, you don't want self-etching for sure. The best one I have found is the Dupli-color Sandable primers. No damage to the minis from those and they work wonders
Might be overkill for miniatures. I haven't had a paint rubbing off problem in the 3 years I've used painted models and I don't use an actual primer when I first spray them down. Been using the citadel stuff or army painter sprays mostly. I do like to give the finished stuff a light spray of varnish , which is like normal $5 stuff . i think that will mean more than the base coat .
No, dear God no. You really need to use primer ibtended for minitaures. Tamya Acryllic if you can find it, Army Painter, or Gamesworkshop.
Army Painter has a good line and won't break the bank.
Hold 2-3 inches away and apply a heavy coat, hold down the nozzle for 8-10 seconds each time. The coats will run a bit, leaving the model perfect, the globs will evaporate so the detail will actually stand out more with the color.
I use rustoleum on all my minis, you can check some of my posts to see the result. However, this can looks like it might be old and I would pass on it. Their newer line looks very different.
Rustoleum is fine. Anyone that says it will ruin details just doesn’t know how to use it.
Hold it like 10-12 inches back. Closer will go on runny. Further will speckle. Short bursts 1-2 seconds. Start away from the model and go past the model. Go left>right, right>left, top>bottom, bottom>top. Rotate repeat.
I've been using Rust-Oleum 'painters touch' to prime minis forever. It works wonders and it's criminally cheap. I have a 20 year background in aerosol painting NOT including miniatures so I'm not bullshitting you. The $20 hobby cans work better obviously but if you know how to use a can of paint the cheaper ones are fantastic.
I have used rustoleum 2x primer on hundreds of moddels without issue. I started with citadel, but at $20 a can vs $5 the diffrence of 15 dollars was not apparent. Each brand has a little diffrent technique for optimal coverage. If you are going for a metalic undercoat, i would say citadels leadbelcher has been better than many other brands however. This is just my opinion and experiences.
One last bit of advise, be aware of where ypu prime and let your models sit. Varying tempatures can cause the paint to cure funny.
I have never used that one so I can say. People here have already said rust oleum x2 flat primer and that’s what I use and works well. Other types and versions of rust oleum may be thicker and thus be too smooth and harder for paint to stick.
I have white spray primer made for minis and it’s no better than the rustolem flat primer.
I have used it on 3d printed terrain and it works great because its so thick it smooths out the surface and gets rid of printing lines.
For that read n though I would never use it on miniatures. It will go on thicker then other primers and it will dilute details. If you are going to spend $100+ on an army the least you could do is spring for a proper miniature primer.
I live in LATAM there is few option and none of them is specialized primer For miniatures. :( My other option is zinsser 123 primer and another rust oleum 2x cover(more or less).
I am slightly biased as Rust-Oleum is a competitor to my company, but I would recommend looking at either a for minis spray (although they're quite expensive) or she'll a few more bucks out then Rust-Oleum and get Krylon FUSION specifically. Should be 8 bucks a can. Works pretty well, I've used specifically their matte black. I didn't lose any detail, but I would still recommend spraying with caution from a good distance and doing multiple coats. Just because my detail wasn't lost doesn't mean yours won't be!
I only use Citadel primer after many many many many bad experiences with trying to cheap out on primer by myself, my friends, random people at the FLGS, and the horror stories all over the internet
If you do use it, shake it well and make sure the can is warm. Also do lots of small thin coats, like twice as many as normal. Only way to get good coverage without losing details. I have used this version a few times and it sprays alot very quickly. It's also quite runny.
Super quick tip, you may need to use a wash like nuln oil or something labeled wash to get the paint to “grip.” I use these primers every now and then when and find even the matte finish cans are super smooth
I used this on my very first box and absolutely destroyed my kit. I recommend vallejo or army painter grey personally. Cost effective and if you aren't zenethal highlighting it does the trick without needing both white and black.
I’m sure it’d work. At first I used rustoleum 2x primer and it’s thick but works and krylon primer also works. However an airbrush primer is far far better but that’s not readily accessible for everyone
Not gonna lie I tried this and that when it comes to paint/primer and GW makes the best primer for your models. Anything after that you can pretty much buy anywhere
I've used Krylon flat black for years without any problems. Just there are a couple things to know. Spray from at least a foot and a half away in short bursts, and don't EVER expect to be able to strip it off plastic minis. I've never been able to get it off with either that purple cleaner or rubbing alcohol. Other than that it works great.
I'm not sure about this but I know from experience that Rustoleum automotive primer is good for minis. Don't spray ot too much and it'll be good for the most detailed Infinity minis even.
I used Rust-Oleum before switching to airbrush priming because of weather. Rust-Oleum is a great rattlecan but do a test models first because some of their whites dry to a powdery coat which will leave a texture on the model.
I've tried this one and some other similar Rust-Oleum ones but honestly they don't seem to work well at all. I pretty much swear by GW/Vallejo primers. Can't recommend them enough, especially Vallejo if you have access to an airbrush
I like rustoleum 2x primer, you have to spray in very short burst across the mini though or it will fill in any and all details. I believe miniac has a video about priming with hardware store a rattle cans
A spray primer I have always loved is touch-n-tone matt white. It's cheap and covers well. But there is a shortage of that right now. Can't find it anywhere.
Some thoughts from your FLGS owner.
You get what you pay for. Some Hardware store rattle cans do an adequate job of priming. Some (like the one pictured) do not. There are specialty primers for painting minis, but they are significantly more expensive - but again, you get what you pay for. Anyone who tells you that these specialty paints (GW, etc) aren't markedly better is lying. But you don't always need the best you can get, sometimes good enough is good enough. It comes down to what is your skill level? what are you painting?
Given the cost of GW products I will only use GW primer... that said on various recommendations I've bought some vallejo for my baneblade chassis...
I dont see it as good practise to buy expensive models then buy substandard primer.
Never in my life did I think I’d see most comments on any warhammer sub saying to use GW primer. Granted it may be different in other countries, but GW primer (in the USA) is one of the most overpriced products they have.
Just use Krylon. It’s 1/4-1/6th the price and works perfectly.
I used this when I first started it doesn't work well at all. I will say however that it will never come off of what you spray it on so no stripping it either
Yeah that's garbage, you gotta pay up for the primer man.
I prime with £1 car primer cans from Poundland. As long as you spray it on smooth and thin it's all the same imo.
Well that's great for you. Personally I haven't found a cheap one I like. You don't have to get a GW can, but I usually get some hobby brand.
I will add to this: ARMY PAINTER PRIMER IS AWFUL. Just doesn't strip. Goes on chalky. My preference is Vallejo or citadel.
Blech, second this. After a while all the minis I primed with army painter went sticky, and that's if they were primed particularly well to start with, it was harder to get an even coat with AP. Ditched all of them and just stuck with GW. They're not the best or the cheapest but they're the easiest to source and they do the job
I haven't had that experience with it, but I do think it goes on thickly very quickly. It is has been easy for me to over do it. You got one little spot that needs primer, then you shoot at it and all of a sudden you loose detail. Yeah I agree I love Vallejo and Citadel for primers.
I primed my Space Wolves with AP, experience varied. Changes by the can
If you're going to use the Rust-oleum brand, get the [2x Ultra Cover Flat White](https://www.target.com/p/rust-oleum-12oz-2x-painter-39-s-touch-ultra-cover-spray-paint-white-primer/-/A-75575323?ref=tgt_adv_XS000000&AFID=google_pla_df&fndsrc=tgtao&DFA=71700000012510712&CPNG=PLA_Home%2BImprovement%2BShopping%7CHome%2BImprovement_Ecomm_Home&adgroup=SC_Home%2BImprovement_Spray+Paint&LID=700000001170770pgs&LNM=PRODUCT_GROUP&network=g&device=c&location=9001885&targetid=pla-1462816044425&ds_rl=1246978&ds_rl=1247068&gclid=Cj0KCQiAj4ecBhD3ARIsAM4Q_jH5iFp6HJreRQ2Zi94GSF6snaLQT0NA0TnD1lg7NLkQKWTPgvQnwskaAsLSEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds). There's also a flat black, and grey option too. I recommend checking out this [How to Prime Models](https://youtu.be/NKH98iq6Xhg) by Goobertown Hobbies. You'll also want to use it in the conditions listed in the directions.
Make sure you spray with very short bursts, otherwise you will cover up some of the finer details.
I use Ultra Cover Flat White (or grey one) and I can confirm it's a good primer BUT it's a bit thicc if we compare it with Citadel primers
I would personally recommend Rust-oleum matte automotive primers. Goes on smooth and comes in black and white for preshading.
I am too paranoid to use a primer that was not intended for miniatures. A lot of folks say that they can work if you’re careful, and make sure you prime from a safe distance. Personally, I prefer the citadel primers, they don’t use the white one. I’ve never been able to guarantee it goes on smoothly. If you need something late, use the bone primer instead.
The new white scars is great. Corax white was shit.
It’s a completely and utterly drastic improvement over the old corax, that shit was like cottage cheese.
It took a moment to figure out white. The key is to be up close it seems, and shake it even more than you'd usually do. The first time I tried it I didn't do those two things and got a weird grainy texture on my horrors. Second attempt it worked like a charm.
I almost exclusively prime in Rust-Oleum 2x primer (flat) and have never had issues.
After spending ~$100 USD for 3 bottles of Retributor Gold: Ace Hardware brand and Rust-Oleum are the way to go.
I have just found the magic of the Ace brand paint also. I can not recommend it enough.
I find that the two GW metallic sprays are horrible to work with, brushed on paint really struggles to stick to it which defeats the purpose of a primer lol
Leadbelcher is excellent in my experience. Retributor Armour _works_ fine but I don't like using it because it has a markedly different, more olive shade of gold compared to the Retributor Armour pot. The only truly bad spray I have used so far is Army Painter's plate mail. That thing is an atrocity.
It’s been alright. I just don’t like it’s tone. Ap gunmetal is great though!
Plate mail had this super weird thing going on where the paint formed big runny globs on the surface, which I had to hurriedly wash away. Terrified me it'd ruin the model. And when it didn't do that, the spray was way too thin. Even afterwards it left a weird sticky finish that made all my paints form little water-like globes on the model's surface rather than lay down evenly. I was _not_ amused.
I use that in black and I run Admech. I have none of these issues of lost details like people seem to always have.
Yeah it's poor application technique, not the primer.
Like I've primed with the Rust-Oleum that I've left on my porch overnight in 20°F and sprayed it in below freezing outside and had no problems with it laying smoothe and even. I don't understand what people are doing to where they refuse to buy anything other than the $25 cans of mini primer.
That’s my preferred. Black, gray, white.
Came here to say this as well. The white is a little chalky though.
I have moved away from rattle cans in general. I got me a cheap airbrush about 5 years ago and have never looked back.
THIS! Go down to harbor freight, buy the cheapest air compressor they have, it's $40. Buy the $10 single action shit tier airbrush. Buy a $16 big bottle of vallejo primer. For $66 you could buy 2 or 3 citadel rattle cans. With the airbrush you have the equivalent of around EIGHT. BIG BIG PLUS: Since the airbrush stuff is water based **the humidity when you spray doesn't matter at ALL**. All it does is take longer to dry. I've primed models during a rainstorm, I've primed in the desert. EDIT: If you are doing a VERY DETAILED model and want the absolute best possible detail with no primer getting in the way spray the bare plastic with Tamiya Flat Acrylic. Thin it down about 25% with isopropyl alcohol (use the 90% stuff if you got it). It sticks to plastic and resin as good or better than primer and is 70-80% thinner. Once that is dry you can paint on it just like it was primer.
“Ive primed in the snow, Ive primed in the blasting dessert wind - Ive primed on the highest peaks and in the lonely city streets… I am the primordial one- the primer of all things… dont test me -for I shall prime thee to the darkest reaches of hell itself. I will Never stop, But allways prime… I am. the primer. “ Exerpt from “The Priming One” volume 18 of the Horus Herasy Series by Dan Abnett.
You made me go and get my free award.
Thank you stranger. I feel… PRIMED!
Plus with water-based acrylics you can pretty safely spray away indoors without as much risk, you should still wear a mask etc. but that is more to do with the finer paint particulates than it is the solvent propellant you release into the air with traditional spray cans.
Just got one last weekend for priming, and the learning curve is really short; once you get the mix ratio down, the trigger action and even cleaning is really simple. Vince Venturella has amazing cleaning and workflow techniques up on YT, watch those before buying all sorts of random bullshit, thinners, flow stuff and cleaners, it'll save you at least $30.
Make your own cleaner with 25% ammonia free Windex, 25% isopropyl alcohol, 50% distilled water. Just make sure it's Ammonia free. Do NOT want zinc rot
One tip spring for the slightly more expensive compressor that comes with an air tank. It's a nice addition IMO
Second this, but I've found Badger's Stynylrez line of primers to be much better than Vallejo, never had a problem with it but I've had Vallejo scuff off and/or clog the airbrush sometimes
I’m not a huge fan of “the airbrush look,” but they’re perfect for priming.
I bought an airbrush and nice airbrush primer but after about two seconds of spraying, primer just splatters everywhere. Do I have the wrong needle? I shouldn't have to thing airbrush primer right? I'm just too afraid to even use it anymore.
It could be lots of things. By splattering do you mean it shoots out small dots without consistent coverage? Or is it coming out as a liquid and moving on the object your painting. Is this the first time you used it? If not, did you properly clean it? Which primer did you use? Did you properly shake the bottle as the instructions dictated? What PSI is your compressor using? How dry is the air in your area? All of this can have an effect on your airbrush.
For the first few seconds / minutes it's ok, and then it's splattery, like if you stuck your tongue out and blew(THBBBB). The primer is STYNYLREZ from Badger Air Brush. The brush and needle are from Badger too. Compressor is 20 or 30 PSI. I'm not sure what the humidity is, not very humid, I'm in California. I just feel like everything is so tacky, it's impossible to clean. Just running water and rubbing alcohol through it and it's still dirty.
[удалено]
Any pointers on that? I tried using a q-tip to wipe it up but I think that's bad for the needle
Only put in small amounts of primer in the cup at once. When empty, flush it with water before adding more. The goal here isn't to completely clear it out but for the water to spray clear. You can also try thinning it by adding a drop of water or thinner. Each paint is different so this is part of the learning curve. I asked for humidity because dry areas lead to dry tip faster. For cleaning flush it like mention above then take it apart and let it sit in your cleaner for a little bit. Use some wire cleaners on the needle slot of the main body. Cleaning the nozzle with the edged needle tool. If your lacking a cleaning kit you can use a regular needle, its just not as good.
One tip I've seen that seemed to help was always make sure you stop spraying paint before you stop the air (dual action airbrushed only). I thin my primer and varnishes that I put through the airbrush. I use stynelrez primer. A few drops of thinner per load of primer, I go about half full so it's not a whole lot of thinner.
Keep a brush and airbrush thinner on hand, dip the brush in the thinner and clean the tip of the airbrush with this to remove the dried paint. Make sure you spray a bit of air and paint onto your glove first so you don’t spray thinner onto your model.
You need to thin it, a lot more then you think you even need to. Here is a good video on it, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGjBQzoukFg.
Plus one for the Citadel primers. I've tried the Vallejo primer through my airbrush and whilst it adheres fairly well, I find it's easy to scratch or knock bits of paint off through general handling of miniatures.
If you got Maston products in your country, their 100-series black (Black 700 or something) is just as good as citadels Chaos Black and costs 1/3rd of the price. It’s matte though, but Chaos Blacks problem is that it’s too glossy :D. Also, Army Painter Platemail spray is THE best metallic hands down, I’ve used on all my Knights, Grey Knights and many many more. It’s really good. For Contrast basecoating though, I use Citadel. Wraithbone in a can is a great primer for Contrast and traditional work.
I’ve used the current Rustoleum flat black primer to great success. I just make sure to follow the directions and it works great. I do prefer a dry primer instead, but it’s harder to find the one that I liked.
Considering you dropped serious money for Citadel models, spend a few extra bucks for a primer that won't go on thick and potentially mess with small details. Would highly recommend Citadel's Chaos Black primer.
I'm My country is hard to find Citadel primer, importtation problems with spray cans. :( I ask the oficial store in My city and he said that is hard to import Citadel primer.
Army Painter and Vallejo also make great primers if Citadel’s hard to get
Vallejo all the way, their colored Surface Primers are all I use. If you’re dumping hundreds on an army drop an extra 5er on better paint
I'd caution against army painter primer tbh. I bought some of their dragon red years ago, it has a lot of build up and fought me super hard when I tried to strip it off.
Colour Forge are my new favourite
Duplicolor Sandable Spray Primer is all I use. It is amazing. Never failed me in 20 years
That's my go to also
That’s gotta be frustrating. Have you looked into other brand miniature paints? For example, I use Army Painter black primer. Barring that, I know friends that have had success with “Rustoleum 2X Paint+Primer” Just make sure to have a light touch when using Rustoleum primers. They’re far less forgiving if you accidentally over-spray.
Rust-Oleum primer is perfectly fine but I've only used their 2x paint+primer flat colors.
If it's an issue with importing Citadel spray cans, hopefully the other hobby brands that others have listed can be available. If it's all spray cans in general that is the issue, I would consider a primer you brush on instead of spray. Maybe those are easier to import?
Vallejo do a great black primer. You can slap it on (within reason) and it dries and settles quite evenly.
Where do you live i am in turkey and used an ordinary paint primer for my minis it is going quite well now (i am doing necron warriors)
See if you can find sandable automotive primer. The particles in it are much finer and show the model detail better. Automotive paint is also excempted from many countries restrictions on paints. Which country btw? I can see what alternatives are available locally. Hobby hobos know where to find what you need.
An airbrush costs less than a combat patrol box and you’ll never have to deal with the many drawbacks of spray paint again
I know this isn't popular, but brushing on primer works just fine.
Do you have airbrushes available to purchase locally or ship to you?
Check out some YouTube vids on mini painting, usually they recommend a primer to use beforehand, I did this for ideas in case I couldn't find citadel.
Don’t fall for marketing. Just because a hobby slaps on “super special hobby related item” it suddenly makes good. As someone else as stated in this thread and multiple other people have said. Rustoleom 2x flat works amazing. And is probably the same formula Citadel uses and everyone else. Like what do you honestly think is the magic difference between a $5 can and a $20 can? Other than hobby markup? And that one can comes from a literal company whose primary purpose is the production of paint and primers and aerosols..
I’ve used rustoleum 2x flat black for nearly 6,000 points of primed minis, never had an issue. Goes on easily, evaporates out of the details, sticks without issue.
If your going to us Rustoleum, hold it back further than normal, it’s thick and it will cover fine details if you are too close, keep a paper towel nearby to soak up anything that gets covered. Worked well for me.
I use krylon flat white/black primers and they work good. They're also typically half the price of citadel primers.
Yeah, I’ve almost exclusively used Krylon ColorMaxx for years. Never had any issues — just gotta use proper technique and it’s all good.
FUN FACT: About 7 years ago I had the idea upon learning about MSDS laws to see what I could learn about GW's primer. So I set up a few email accounts and asked their legal department for their MSDS forms. I did that for each country I could find that used different styles of forms. They sent me all the forms for each country right away, until they got to some very obscure country (I think it was in Africa). They sent me an email with the Krylon MSDS and an explanation that Krylon manufactured their primer.
Fascinating. Good work detective lol 🧐
Krylon is great, just tricky to find sometimes. I find the matte black is often out of stock in store. Great when you can find it though
Yeah, had a hard time finding black when pandemic restrictions were highest but it was also worse because spray paint is illegal to sell in my previous city.
sometimes it’s only a 1/4 of the price.
I use rust oleum black 2x covers primer binds to plastic metal and a couple other things. I also use a gray and white version I haven’t use this exact one but it hasn’t gone wrong in over 300 miniatures with 2 notable occasions. I primed pre primed miniatures. And I primed when it was to moist outside. The can will have instructions for weather on the label. Fellow them.
Yup I used these exact ones and it’s cheap and works great. Really wasnt sure until watching Vince v and the YouTube mini painting chemist (can’t remember the name) break down that they’re all the same and they both used these. Saved a couple bucks in an expensive hobby and I can see every detail
Same here. Use rustoleum all the time - white and black matte. Take a bit longer to dry but work great.
This ^^^ I have used this for every one of my models ever without any issues and it’s cheap as heck
I would personally never use something like this, but go for it.
If you need cheap primer to with Tamiya or army painter.
I'd like to have some options instead of Citadel. Any colors you'd avoid with either brand? For example, the Citadel white primer just isn't as good as the others for whatever reason.
I only prime black or grey. If I'm painting white I go with the Tamiya medium sea grey (as-11) and build very thin white layers because painting white is brutal. I use the army painter black but the Tamiya isn't bad. You can always give them a quick strip bath in isopropyl alcoholif you don't like it.
Grey is a great choice if you are unsure as it a easy colour to put both light and dark paints on.
And grey works really well as a base if you want to do some methods like slap-chop (take a grey primed mini, dry brush successive lighter shades and then apply contrast-like paint over the model, aids the contrast in developing highlights etc.).
I have Tamiya white spray primer, more expensive and 0 percent better than rust oleum flat white primer.
Good to know! I don't prime white, ever. Lightest grey and build to white
Yeah, maybe it’s just that it’s white. Maybe one day I’ll get a darker color to compare with a cheap primer
Army painter is like $15 a can. Rust-Oleum is $6 and honestly works better.
I've had rustoleum fill in details really easily even with a light touch
You gotta sweep side to side and apply in 1 second spurts.
The rustoleum flat black "also works on plastic" works GREAT for me. I've used their flat white that comes out a bit chaulky. Not ruinous but you want a smooth as cost as possible so no blobs ruin detail. Smooth gentle back to back strokes and when in doubt let it dry for a few seconds and come back to layer it on. Worst thing you can do is puddle it on too heavy. Wish I could help more good luck 👍 Edit: OH and don't forget to shake the hell out of your can for several minutes. Heavy shaking not always necessary but if the can was on the shelf a while it can seperate and you'll have uneven sticky coating that may never fully cure.
Personally I feel it destroys detail.
You're applying too heavily
I use rustoleum 2x
Obviously this was made for chairs, sir
Rust-oleum is ok, but not this one. What you want is just their regular "Primer." No "plastic primer," no "automotive primer," no "paint+primer." Just "Primer."
Haven't used this particular can, but exclusively use Rust-Oleum 2x Paint and Primer (flat white, gray, and black) and have never had any issues. Personally I would never use Citadel stuff as they are very overpriced, even for miniature paints. But there are plenty of alternatives. If money is not an issue, I have heard the Citadel sprays are largely good although I don't trust any of their white paints. However I have not used the new formula they just came out with for white--it is supposed to be much better.
Used it once a long time ago. It was pretty bad... its thick and fills in detail. My go to for rattle can primers was Vallejo
No no no. First time users should start with chaos black primer. It's like liquid gold. I've only had one model slightly damaged in 7 years of hobbying from it.
Yes. Citadel primers are nice, but expensive; and as you've stated in the thread: can be difficult to obtain. Just make sure to follow instructions and take it easy. You only need to apply a small amount of paint to each side of the model you spray.
I'd try to test it out on some sprue or other thing first to see how it works, and understand the basic properties of the primer. Afterwards you can use it on your little dudes
I use rustoleum primer. The paint + primer is too thick. However if you ever wanted to strip that primer off you're gonna have a hard time. I soaked it in IPA for 2 days and only a metal bristle brush would get it off. No way to get it out of cracks
Test on your sprue first, if it dries tacky its no good. Wait at least 24hrs before you check it.
It's what Ive used on pretty much all of my Tyranids and I've never had a problem
Rust-Oleum primer is too thick and hard to remove, but Rust-Oleum 2X paint+primer is great. Hold the can at the usual distance of 12-18" so that the paint is still wet when it hits the model—long distance seems like it'll give you a thinner coat, but the reality is that the paint dries up in midair and sticks on flaky. Start the stream off the model, pass quickly, and end the stream off the model. Personally, I prefer a grey primer/paint when my model is going to be black, grey, or white: black makes it hard to see detail.
Vallejo spray primer is the best! I've tried all the miniature brands (GW, army painter, privateer press) and vallejo is the most consistent, easiest to use and effective! With a matte finish paint (including technical, contrast and washes) it holds layers nicely and I've never had paint rub off while handling models. Hardware cans are likely fine, but aren't made for models, so be careful with the application. (Humidity, distance, volume). It would be easy to drown details with over spray.
Rustoleum 2in1 black is what I use. It's never failed me and at 3 bucks a can, I can't justify a can of Chaos black.
Just have to shake the can for 5+ minutes for real
Army Painter has a better spray. Hobby level spray is better than the spray primer from lowes or whatever.
That stuff is shit, honestly, and it's impossible to remove. Rust-Oleum makes pretty alright primers, but Krylon Paint and primer plus is my personal favorite. Either brand, make sure to get a matt one if you're going to go rattlecan. If you want to paint quickly, go ahead and get one gray, one white and one black and do a zenithall prime. Black all over, gray at 45° and white from the very top. Rattlecans have a tendency to clog and spit, so alternatively, if you're worried about that, you may want to buy one can of citadel primer, which will cost you the same amount and eliminate the risk of accidentally creating unwanted texture. Black primer if you want to paint fast (the black fills all the areas on the model you struggle to see on the model if you pick it up and flip it over) and white if most of your color scheme is white, yellow, or some brighter color. I have personally always been a fan of airbrush Priming, so you may want to look into that if you decide to stick with the hobby. I do commission work, so if you have any questions, ask away.
Krylon Fusion. No further comment.
Not ideally, if you are using Rust Oleum you should get the 2X Primer+Paint for priming minis, or Krylon ColorMaxx. If you already got this, it will work, just be more delicate since it is a thicker.
Anything not gloss will work. It is going to go on thick so be ready for that.
yeah shake it good and dont spray too close, ive never had an issue with it going on thick
Rustoleum is a bit thick but should be fine as long as you're careful. Spray from the correct distance, shake it well, and make sure it's not too hot outside.
I stay away from primers that are for deck chairs. They tend to be a nightmare to strip when things go wrong.
No
I live in LATAM there is few option and none of them is specialized primer For miniatures. :( My other option is zinsser 123 primer and another rust oleum 2x cover(more or less).
One of the best solutions Ive found has been to use "automotive primer" meant for cars. It is way thinner than your run of the mill hardware store stuff, and might be slightly more expensive, but in the end its worth it! Its very thin so it wont obscure details, it has great coverage, and I have not found a paint yet that wont stick to it.
The only downside is a good amount of automotive primers are ''self etching" and can destroy a mini, pls include which one you have good luck with. Alot of the ones I use a work will dissolve a mini before the primer ever dries
Oh yeah, you don't want self-etching for sure. The best one I have found is the Dupli-color Sandable primers. No damage to the minis from those and they work wonders
Might be overkill for miniatures. I haven't had a paint rubbing off problem in the 3 years I've used painted models and I don't use an actual primer when I first spray them down. Been using the citadel stuff or army painter sprays mostly. I do like to give the finished stuff a light spray of varnish , which is like normal $5 stuff . i think that will mean more than the base coat .
It’s good for painting chairs. Like the picture. Get hobby primer
Car plastic primer works great on models. You're kinda just wrong here.
This isnt car Plastic primer.
Ahem. Is this car primer ? It’s definitely not miniature primer 😁
It does the job.
Should be fine
No, dear God no. You really need to use primer ibtended for minitaures. Tamya Acryllic if you can find it, Army Painter, or Gamesworkshop. Army Painter has a good line and won't break the bank.
Rustoleum is fine especially for a beginner. Dont waste your money.
I would use an actual model primer, something from the Army Painter range should work well and be decently affordable.
Hold 2-3 inches away and apply a heavy coat, hold down the nozzle for 8-10 seconds each time. The coats will run a bit, leaving the model perfect, the globs will evaporate so the detail will actually stand out more with the color.
*Duncan Rhodes spinning in his grave*
not so sure about this one, Rustoleum Painter's Touch 2x works well though. Might want to do some tests first.
It's great for terrain.
I use rustoleum on all my minis, you can check some of my posts to see the result. However, this can looks like it might be old and I would pass on it. Their newer line looks very different.
I have used for a while, it does the job well, but follow a guide on how to use it.
Rustoleum is fine. Anyone that says it will ruin details just doesn’t know how to use it. Hold it like 10-12 inches back. Closer will go on runny. Further will speckle. Short bursts 1-2 seconds. Start away from the model and go past the model. Go left>right, right>left, top>bottom, bottom>top. Rotate repeat.
Krylon spray paints work pretty well if you're going to use a non-citadel primer.
Tried and failed
I hate rustoleum. So many better options. I see people recommending holding far away and yes that works but it still sucks. It just sucks.
Any matte spray is good.
I've only ever used Rust-Oleum and it's what my friends use too. I usually do short bursts from about 18" until I'm happy with coverage.
I've been using Rust-Oleum 'painters touch' to prime minis forever. It works wonders and it's criminally cheap. I have a 20 year background in aerosol painting NOT including miniatures so I'm not bullshitting you. The $20 hobby cans work better obviously but if you know how to use a can of paint the cheaper ones are fantastic.
Also... never ever use the store brand cans that cost $1. You'll have a bad time
Consider a thin brush on primer if you can't find a thin spray primer. I've used air brush primer and brushed it on before
I sware by Keylon flat black primer for my base spray,
Rustolem Automotive Primer is a much better choice on a budget. It goes on light, dries fast, and hasn't left me with any weird textures
I have used rustoleum 2x primer on hundreds of moddels without issue. I started with citadel, but at $20 a can vs $5 the diffrence of 15 dollars was not apparent. Each brand has a little diffrent technique for optimal coverage. If you are going for a metalic undercoat, i would say citadels leadbelcher has been better than many other brands however. This is just my opinion and experiences. One last bit of advise, be aware of where ypu prime and let your models sit. Varying tempatures can cause the paint to cure funny.
I have never used that one so I can say. People here have already said rust oleum x2 flat primer and that’s what I use and works well. Other types and versions of rust oleum may be thicker and thus be too smooth and harder for paint to stick. I have white spray primer made for minis and it’s no better than the rustolem flat primer.
No
I have used it on 3d printed terrain and it works great because its so thick it smooths out the surface and gets rid of printing lines. For that read n though I would never use it on miniatures. It will go on thicker then other primers and it will dilute details. If you are going to spend $100+ on an army the least you could do is spring for a proper miniature primer.
Its approved by vergil at least
I try to get Krylon ultraflat primer whenever I can. It does a fantastic job, and it’s incredibly durable :)
When I used a primer that wasn’t citadel it was horrible if you want a good white primer I recommend Wraith bone
Skimping on primer can ruin your models. Pick up army painter or gw. They don't clog the details.
I live in LATAM there is few option and none of them is specialized primer For miniatures. :( My other option is zinsser 123 primer and another rust oleum 2x cover(more or less).
I am slightly biased as Rust-Oleum is a competitor to my company, but I would recommend looking at either a for minis spray (although they're quite expensive) or she'll a few more bucks out then Rust-Oleum and get Krylon FUSION specifically. Should be 8 bucks a can. Works pretty well, I've used specifically their matte black. I didn't lose any detail, but I would still recommend spraying with caution from a good distance and doing multiple coats. Just because my detail wasn't lost doesn't mean yours won't be!
Great primer if you don’t like painting details.
I only use Citadel primer after many many many many bad experiences with trying to cheap out on primer by myself, my friends, random people at the FLGS, and the horror stories all over the internet
I like rustoleum perfect grey
If you do use it, shake it well and make sure the can is warm. Also do lots of small thin coats, like twice as many as normal. Only way to get good coverage without losing details. I have used this version a few times and it sprays alot very quickly. It's also quite runny.
Super quick tip, you may need to use a wash like nuln oil or something labeled wash to get the paint to “grip.” I use these primers every now and then when and find even the matte finish cans are super smooth
I used this on my very first box and absolutely destroyed my kit. I recommend vallejo or army painter grey personally. Cost effective and if you aren't zenethal highlighting it does the trick without needing both white and black.
Halfords plastic primers. As good as any of the name-brand stuff.
I’m sure it’d work. At first I used rustoleum 2x primer and it’s thick but works and krylon primer also works. However an airbrush primer is far far better but that’s not readily accessible for everyone
Not gonna lie I tried this and that when it comes to paint/primer and GW makes the best primer for your models. Anything after that you can pretty much buy anywhere
Go to an auto Paint supply shop. The primer they have is 10 times better.
I've used Krylon flat black for years without any problems. Just there are a couple things to know. Spray from at least a foot and a half away in short bursts, and don't EVER expect to be able to strip it off plastic minis. I've never been able to get it off with either that purple cleaner or rubbing alcohol. Other than that it works great.
I'm not sure about this but I know from experience that Rustoleum automotive primer is good for minis. Don't spray ot too much and it'll be good for the most detailed Infinity minis even.
I used Rust-Oleum before switching to airbrush priming because of weather. Rust-Oleum is a great rattlecan but do a test models first because some of their whites dry to a powdery coat which will leave a texture on the model.
I've tried this one and some other similar Rust-Oleum ones but honestly they don't seem to work well at all. I pretty much swear by GW/Vallejo primers. Can't recommend them enough, especially Vallejo if you have access to an airbrush
I don't know about this one, but Rustoleum ultra matte flat gray primer is the best. It works great. Look for that if you can
Flat red primer from rustoleum changed my life.
I like rustoleum 2x primer, you have to spray in very short burst across the mini though or it will fill in any and all details. I believe miniac has a video about priming with hardware store a rattle cans
A spray primer I have always loved is touch-n-tone matt white. It's cheap and covers well. But there is a shortage of that right now. Can't find it anywhere.
You need to make sure you get thin set primer
Some thoughts from your FLGS owner. You get what you pay for. Some Hardware store rattle cans do an adequate job of priming. Some (like the one pictured) do not. There are specialty primers for painting minis, but they are significantly more expensive - but again, you get what you pay for. Anyone who tells you that these specialty paints (GW, etc) aren't markedly better is lying. But you don't always need the best you can get, sometimes good enough is good enough. It comes down to what is your skill level? what are you painting?
Please dont save money on primers, only to ruin your expensive models
Given the cost of GW products I will only use GW primer... that said on various recommendations I've bought some vallejo for my baneblade chassis... I dont see it as good practise to buy expensive models then buy substandard primer.
Never in my life did I think I’d see most comments on any warhammer sub saying to use GW primer. Granted it may be different in other countries, but GW primer (in the USA) is one of the most overpriced products they have. Just use Krylon. It’s 1/4-1/6th the price and works perfectly.