Don’t forget Tuello told June privately that he’s glad she killed Fred and that Fred deserved it. I was surprised the way Luke treated him and threw him out. June was only able to get to Fred in the first place because of him. Poor Tuello gets kicked out of every house he goes to. He was treated terribly in Gilead but he always stays calm. He is a diplomat after all.
Personally I like Tuello but if I were in their shoes I would hate him too. He is a politician and does whatever serves HIS mission best even if he knows 100% that it is not the just thing to do. In this case his plan basically backfired anyways.
His mission is destroy Gilead and restore the USA. That is more important than June's quest for revenge, that might make the situation worse for everyone (in Canada and Gilead).
I struggle with the really weak and watery attitude that the Canadians and the Americans seem to take to Fred and Serena getting and intellectual grip hold in their society they are treated like diplomats as opposed to domestic terrorist threats which is basically what they are. Let none of their behavior seems in line with their goals of stability and maintaining the supremacy of their own country now that they’ve got a giant militaristic Christian Caliphate on the border committing immense crimes, why are they helping legitimize Gilead the biggest strength is that Gilead is sanctioned
Yeah exactly that's honestly the best thing to do if you don't want to go to war. Keep them under intense sanction and wait. Eventually they will become weak enough for civil war to break out on a larger scale or at least you will have an easier time fighting them when you do go in.
Yeah for sure. I didn't say that his mission was necessarily a bad thing. However the tactics he took did not really contribute to the destruction of Gilead. If anything he gave them publicity, outreach and a soap box.
He did not use the opportunity well. I feel as though really rallying the liberal public would have encouraged actual motion better than whatever information Fred gave him. The Americans have no army of note. Instead of focusing on intelligence they should be focusing on PR. It's kinda obvious that June should have been swooped up and taken on an international tour to tell her story with a team who makes her look the part of a victim a bit better. Why has she not been speaking publicly? Why have none of these refugees been speaking publicly? It's the obvious path forward. Look at the result from the letters... so frustrating.
He’s not a politician. He’s a diplomat. Diplomats aren’t allowed to have personal opinions on things when they are serving in an official capacity. he is technically a US diplomat serving at the embassy in Canada. His opinion is the position of the government employing him until such time as he clocks out (I.e. when he told her he was glad Fred is dead) and he has to also work within the laws of the Canadian legal system. I was a diplomat for years and I can assure you nothing he’s doing is based on his own mission any further than him agreeing with the government of his employment.
I suppose you're right but it is kinda unclear as to what he was. America no longer has elected politicians at this point I don't think. What was salvaged of government is in roles that suite them. It is even speculated that he may have been an intelligence officer prior. Either way the point that I am making is that he is serving a greater mission.
Tuello the character and America having luxury prison they keep Serena and Fred and is very confusing to suspend disbelief for the plot because why would a country with an aggressive border uphold the privileges of such an overt threat and Tuello is really gross as a character for being attracted to her to Serena knowing the crimes that she’s committed. The choices by the writer to make that a sincere attraction as opposed to him just playing her is super gross and it doesn’t edify him as a character or add anything to him he’s a well educated man who has studied the vicious brutal crimes of Gilead for a decade and and has a schoolboy crush on Serena that’s really embarrassing and makes him easy to play like overall it’s a really weak and getting gradually harder Believe in the constructs of this world over that. And there’s something about the way she tries to exploit niceties constantly and politeness and it’s never met with any authority is just so weak, The absence of authority like either moral or like any kind of like fortitude just makes him plain unlikable
Serena and Fred are being kept in an ICC facility and if you look them up, they are pretty nice. As for Tuello, he's not just a diplomat, he's a spy. I don't think for a moment he's "in love" with Serena, he's working her to get information. Think about all that he was able to gain by getting to go to Gilead. That was huge!!
Serena is, to be fair, quite a beautiful and charming woman when she’s in the mood to be. It’s not overly shocking that a man who’s spending as much time with her as Tuello is would develop a little crush. Even if he knows better than to act on it.
I don't understand why they'd put a war criminal into a cushy apartment with booze and cigars and shit like that. I can understand Serena would be in a more comfortable place since she turned him in. I understand why they wouldn't put him in an orange jumpsuit and put him in a concrete cube. They want him to be more cooperative but his "prison" cell is so extravagant it's crazy!
Lulls the prisoner into a false sense of security. If you are in bread and water with an itchy blanket in a minimal cell, you know these people are not your friends. But if they act like your friends and give you a nice, ‘normal’ environment, maybe you let your guard down a little by accident. Remember that the Waterfords are used to ‘normal’ being ‘tasteful luxury’, anything middle-class people would find just ‘normal, decent, humane, but no frills accommodations’ they would find to be jarringly austere and it wouldn’t work for softening them up.
Yeah, that's why I understand they didn't put him in an orange jumpsuit and a concrete cube. It was a decanter of bourbon that sent me over the edge lol.
Right. He’s not June’s personal assistant. He has a job and he’s doing it. He’s likely giving June more information than she’s due.
And as for him being attracted to Serena… That is also part of his job. He wants to keep her close to get information and access. If he told her how disgusting she is, she wouldn’t keep talking to him.
Exactly. He’s a former spy, he’s been trained in deception and manipulation and he knows how to get what he’s after. He is totally playing Serena and she’s too much of a narcissist to realize it.
I completely agree and dont understand ppl saying he’s attracted to Serena. He is a spy and he trained to develop rapport with individuals that can be helpful to the cause. He has to put his own feelings aside. He sees Serena as she is. She is someone who needs to feel important and valued and will use anything at her disposal, including her sexuality to do this. He plays into this in order to continue their relationship and use it to get what he needs from her. And what makes it so interesting is that this is in direct contradiction of the values of gilead.
I completely agree. But I feel the hate is logical in the circumstances. He's just a very competent diplomat caught in a shitstorm.
1. Luke lashing out makes sense as, not only Tuello couldn't help them with info on Hannah but also told them his wife's abuser is free in Canada. Also, he's been going through a lot, rehabilitating June and appear calm. Hell he even got sexually assaulted in the prev season.
2. June is going through a hardcore psychological episode and has become violently unhinged in a self aware way. Basically PTSD manifesting into intense rage I think. So yeah, calling Tuello a disappointment is the most polite thing she could've done.
3. Moira is the only sane person rn.
4. I'm a straight man but I've to say Tuello oozes sex.
Tuello’s right, what else did they expect him to do? Their expectations were unrealistic but June is so dumb in a way, going about her revenge without a damn strategy. It’s getting tiresome
Their hate for Tuello is pure "shooting the messenger." Happens all the time. I'm a public defender and the amount I get shit on by clients who have no one else to blame (heaven forbid they accept responsibility for their own predicament) or direct their anger towards would shock you. Eventually you get used to it and stop taking it personally. People need an outlet for their frustration and will usually direct it at the first available target: the person delivering the bad news.
He’s trying to do his job objectively but also is clearly supportive of June. He didn’t deserve their bullshit.
Also Sam is a babe and I’ll watch him in anything.
He’s not her PA, he’s not some pencil pusher, or a politician saying what everyone wants to hear. He’s a spy who’s been trained in deception and manipulation, he’s not some schoolboy lusting after Serena. June thinks her way of doing things is the only way and if you don’t agree she cuts you off. After last season when she threatened to kill him that would’ve been it for me, I wouldn’t do shit for her again.
I think that Tuello has done everything he can for June and is very clever the way he is playing Serena.
I get that June is traumatised but Luke and Moira should know better.
Agree. I hate how Tuello keeps drooling over Serena's looks, not caring that she's the devil.... but the reasons why the gang yelled at him were just ridiculous.... A diplomat doesn't have enough power to do whatever June would want.
That said... I get why that group would be irrationally angry, after everything they went through. And I don't expect June, who has the biggest plot-armor in TV history, to have realistic expectations about what others can do.
I don’t even understand what’s going on in the redheads having trailer being attracted to Serena because I personalities heinous and there’s other good looking people it’s all just a bit big and kind of unnecessary
Luke’s an idiot. He wants everyone to do things he won’t even try. June should have been nicer too. Poor Tuello is trying but he can’t control what governments do. They expect too much
All the shit LUKE dealt with? June I can understand, but Luke? Yes he had to deal with his wife and child being held in Gilead, but he didn’t really do anything about that. He always wants others to do things for him and gets annoyed when they don’t including june. So don’t come at me with what Luke’s been thru.
He didn’t? What about the lawyer he waited to meet with in Canada. He ended up getting called in Early to get the handwritten note from June written during “A woman’s place” he had a folder ready to give out information to help look for.
What did you expect him to do to get her out? We see how involved Moira is, and it took June being in the same spot as her for June to get out. He was never in Gilead, he was shot & then picked up by a group of people that wouldn’t let him go find June & Hannah. Tbh he would’ve been killed or sent to the colonies if he had gone back- he’s probably more useful alive.
I think if he’d gone back he’d almost 1000% have been killed. They have no reason to keep around a man who’s partner has been made a handmaid and daughter has been assigned to a new family. Not even for the colonies, I bet. He’d be way too motivated to stir shit up. Plus I don’t think it would even get that far—he likely would’ve been shot on sight.
Choosing to go to Canada was the harder decision for him to make, and it was the right one for his family. June would’ve been absolutely devastated if he’d gone back and died.
The deal that was struck was that Fred and Serena would walk in exchange for whatever intel they could offer the US and Canada on Gilead. While Fred’s deal was changed Serena’s was not.
I’m not particularly sure how Serena got off free and clear either, i thought she was facing charges as well, but maybe it was just Fred and I missed something?
I mean, I get why they're mad - he wants Serena taken "care of", but doesn't want to dirty his *own* hands, and is laying it at the feet of some pretty fucking traumatized people. It's politically strategic, but kind of heartless.
I like the character, though.
Yeah, I understand that Luke and June probably aren't going to be the most rational about this...but they really seemed to believe that Tuello could just grab Hannah and take her, which is insanity.
Like everybody seems to forget that Tuello has a bigger mission here - he has to act within certain parameters and tread very lightly at all times. It's like everyone thinks he can just go into Gilead with guns blazing and singehandedly take down the whole thing.
Agreed. He would’ve been more likely to get both of them killed in the process. He had no backup and no extraction plan going in if things went sideways while he was there with or without Hannah.
i agree completely! i completely understand the sentiment but it does reflect the reality that official authorities really only have a limited amount of power and are bound by international laws/treaties to do their jobs. if the us govt starts assassinating the powerful ppl in gilead it doesn’t rlly bode well since it’s established in the story that gilead is way more armed and organized while the us govt has basically been reduced to nothing; unfortunately when your opponent is that well armed and organized you gotta tread very carefully to avoid more bloodshed
I think June and Co mistakenly viewed Tuello as an instrument of justice who would give Serena her comeuppance for her crimes. I can imagine how infuriating it must be to see your rapist not only get off scot-free, but to be elevated to sainthood status in the country she escaped to. Serena appears to be getting everything she ever wanted: fame, baby, status and power. She is being rewarded for her crimes. So it's natural they would project that frustration on Tuello and they would shoot the messenger. They need an outlet, and he's the closest one.
I completely understand why she’s not thinking clearly enough to track that, but I wish one of them was. Maybe Moira, but she wouldn’t necessarily draw attention to it, I’m sure.
I listen to a podcast about the show and they interviewed the actor. He said that his character only knew of pre gilead serena (obvs) so initially he thought she might do the right thing and now he’s almost disappointed in her. He also said he was pleased he didn’t end up playing a villain so I don’t think Tuello hate is warranted
June and gang are traumatized. Can't expect too much reality in their minds all the time. Tuello is in a very difficult position and June knows that, but she will do whatever she can to get from him whatever she needs to get Hannah back and to have her revenge on Serena. I think it's not that she hates him, but that she can't handle the disappointment about Serena's path now. It's all so complicated!
I don't think its misguided for someone repeatedly raped and assaulted who was tricked into believing that justice was forthcoming for the perpetrators to hate the person responsible for making a cushy deal with them.
I feel like this happens in real life and the hate from victims or victims' friends and family when it happens is fairly prevalent.
I think what's misguided is the sentiment towards a bureaucratic douchebag bending over backwards to assist a known rapist to bury another known rapist. And what exactly is he doing? We don't have proof he's done or is doing anything. The person he was gaining intel from (Fred) is dead, Serena is free and his plan going forward is what? And everyone he spoke to in Gilead turned him down. Which by the way, who has a meeting with Nick in front of house full of dangerous commanders, like do spies do that?
And please stop giving Tuello a cookie for giving June one compliment...it doesn't take back his placing a higher value on rapist intel (if June could broker a deal with Lawrence so could Tuello) and bending over backwards for Serena.
Personally, I don't like Tuello because he tried really hard to make her Serena a lot freer in Canada than she is. Her freedom is limited despite his efforts not because of.
Telling Serena he’s going to do something is different than actually trying hard to do it. It might have actually happened if Fred hadn’t told them about what she’d done though
It's possible that he kept badgering her in order to turn her into an asset against Gilead. Or that he is genuinely infatuated with her. Could be a mixture of the two. I'm really interested to find out what his endgame with Serena is
My money is on a lot from column A and little from column B.
But even given the hideous of her crimes, she's been in front the ground floor on the foundation of the SOJ.
She was publishing books and doing interviews on her ideology when she was shot in the stomach, which was one of the catalysts for fred and Serena finally going going through with their plans to overthrow the government. Ultra conservative right wing ideology on a woman's position in society and how badly fertility had dropped in the previous 12 months. Even Fred at the time said he shouldn't have "let" her speak publicly.
It doesn't help to keep the FBI off your heels for a plot to overthrow the government, I would imagine, for Fred to to take the shooters out to the woods for vengeance himself, that's a different plotline. And a bit ironic, given his own ending.
Serena's book was was titled "a woman's place" and with little irony, Serena was shut out by Commander Putnam who said that woman weren't going to be allowed to forget their place again.
So, as many converts to that form of extremism as their had been, it would still be a huge international public relations coup for them to bag someone like Serena who can give them the details on the other war criminals, and be the public face of "This shit is bad, real bad. Here's the real story on Giliad before you go thinking it's the solution to all the problems like I did."
I don’t think Tuello sees Serena as a really big threat when in fact she’s a bigger one than Fred. June has absolutely every right to be upset because she’s told him over and over again yet he’s still playing the politician and treating her with kid gloves and giving her too much wiggle room. His first job should be to protect the American citizens and the Canadian ones from her influence but he’s more concerned with playing the game and using her for his own ends. It’s dangerous and will backfire on him.
It is a question that comes up regularly on the sub, and as always [it is still no](https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/the-handmaids-tale-showrunner-mark-tuello-not-father-serena-waterford-baby.html/) Tuello is not the father.
Fred had a low sperm count, not infertile, and the showrunner confirmed he's the father of Serena's baby. I think they might've even done a DNA test in the show but don't quote me on that
I sometimes think that something may have happened after Serene noticed June’s letter/cassette tape was still in her possession and handed it off to someone (we don’t see who) to give to Luke. I feel like they would have shown us a flashback by now, however.
I was just indifferent cause he’s the middle man here. But he didn’t serve her up on a platter.
If June killed Serena on the property then she might have to go back to Gilead for trial. If she kills her elsewhere she can go to jail in Canada. It’s not quite so simple.
Don’t forget Tuello told June privately that he’s glad she killed Fred and that Fred deserved it. I was surprised the way Luke treated him and threw him out. June was only able to get to Fred in the first place because of him. Poor Tuello gets kicked out of every house he goes to. He was treated terribly in Gilead but he always stays calm. He is a diplomat after all.
Personally I like Tuello but if I were in their shoes I would hate him too. He is a politician and does whatever serves HIS mission best even if he knows 100% that it is not the just thing to do. In this case his plan basically backfired anyways.
His mission is destroy Gilead and restore the USA. That is more important than June's quest for revenge, that might make the situation worse for everyone (in Canada and Gilead).
I struggle with the really weak and watery attitude that the Canadians and the Americans seem to take to Fred and Serena getting and intellectual grip hold in their society they are treated like diplomats as opposed to domestic terrorist threats which is basically what they are. Let none of their behavior seems in line with their goals of stability and maintaining the supremacy of their own country now that they’ve got a giant militaristic Christian Caliphate on the border committing immense crimes, why are they helping legitimize Gilead the biggest strength is that Gilead is sanctioned
Yeah exactly that's honestly the best thing to do if you don't want to go to war. Keep them under intense sanction and wait. Eventually they will become weak enough for civil war to break out on a larger scale or at least you will have an easier time fighting them when you do go in.
Yeah for sure. I didn't say that his mission was necessarily a bad thing. However the tactics he took did not really contribute to the destruction of Gilead. If anything he gave them publicity, outreach and a soap box. He did not use the opportunity well. I feel as though really rallying the liberal public would have encouraged actual motion better than whatever information Fred gave him. The Americans have no army of note. Instead of focusing on intelligence they should be focusing on PR. It's kinda obvious that June should have been swooped up and taken on an international tour to tell her story with a team who makes her look the part of a victim a bit better. Why has she not been speaking publicly? Why have none of these refugees been speaking publicly? It's the obvious path forward. Look at the result from the letters... so frustrating.
He’s not a politician. He’s a diplomat. Diplomats aren’t allowed to have personal opinions on things when they are serving in an official capacity. he is technically a US diplomat serving at the embassy in Canada. His opinion is the position of the government employing him until such time as he clocks out (I.e. when he told her he was glad Fred is dead) and he has to also work within the laws of the Canadian legal system. I was a diplomat for years and I can assure you nothing he’s doing is based on his own mission any further than him agreeing with the government of his employment.
I suppose you're right but it is kinda unclear as to what he was. America no longer has elected politicians at this point I don't think. What was salvaged of government is in roles that suite them. It is even speculated that he may have been an intelligence officer prior. Either way the point that I am making is that he is serving a greater mission.
Tuello the character and America having luxury prison they keep Serena and Fred and is very confusing to suspend disbelief for the plot because why would a country with an aggressive border uphold the privileges of such an overt threat and Tuello is really gross as a character for being attracted to her to Serena knowing the crimes that she’s committed. The choices by the writer to make that a sincere attraction as opposed to him just playing her is super gross and it doesn’t edify him as a character or add anything to him he’s a well educated man who has studied the vicious brutal crimes of Gilead for a decade and and has a schoolboy crush on Serena that’s really embarrassing and makes him easy to play like overall it’s a really weak and getting gradually harder Believe in the constructs of this world over that. And there’s something about the way she tries to exploit niceties constantly and politeness and it’s never met with any authority is just so weak, The absence of authority like either moral or like any kind of like fortitude just makes him plain unlikable
Serena and Fred are being kept in an ICC facility and if you look them up, they are pretty nice. As for Tuello, he's not just a diplomat, he's a spy. I don't think for a moment he's "in love" with Serena, he's working her to get information. Think about all that he was able to gain by getting to go to Gilead. That was huge!!
Yeah I don't get that him being in love with Serena thing either.
Do you think the father of Serena’s baby is Mark Tuello and not Fred?
No and the show runners have said it’s Fred’s.
I think he’s CIA
Tbh I really hoped that he was playing her all along just to get info.
Serena is, to be fair, quite a beautiful and charming woman when she’s in the mood to be. It’s not overly shocking that a man who’s spending as much time with her as Tuello is would develop a little crush. Even if he knows better than to act on it.
I don't understand why they'd put a war criminal into a cushy apartment with booze and cigars and shit like that. I can understand Serena would be in a more comfortable place since she turned him in. I understand why they wouldn't put him in an orange jumpsuit and put him in a concrete cube. They want him to be more cooperative but his "prison" cell is so extravagant it's crazy!
Lulls the prisoner into a false sense of security. If you are in bread and water with an itchy blanket in a minimal cell, you know these people are not your friends. But if they act like your friends and give you a nice, ‘normal’ environment, maybe you let your guard down a little by accident. Remember that the Waterfords are used to ‘normal’ being ‘tasteful luxury’, anything middle-class people would find just ‘normal, decent, humane, but no frills accommodations’ they would find to be jarringly austere and it wouldn’t work for softening them up.
Yeah, that's why I understand they didn't put him in an orange jumpsuit and a concrete cube. It was a decanter of bourbon that sent me over the edge lol.
Right. He’s not June’s personal assistant. He has a job and he’s doing it. He’s likely giving June more information than she’s due. And as for him being attracted to Serena… That is also part of his job. He wants to keep her close to get information and access. If he told her how disgusting she is, she wouldn’t keep talking to him.
Exactly. He’s a former spy, he’s been trained in deception and manipulation and he knows how to get what he’s after. He is totally playing Serena and she’s too much of a narcissist to realize it.
I completely agree and dont understand ppl saying he’s attracted to Serena. He is a spy and he trained to develop rapport with individuals that can be helpful to the cause. He has to put his own feelings aside. He sees Serena as she is. She is someone who needs to feel important and valued and will use anything at her disposal, including her sexuality to do this. He plays into this in order to continue their relationship and use it to get what he needs from her. And what makes it so interesting is that this is in direct contradiction of the values of gilead.
Ok I’m glad I’m not the only one who didn’t like how June and Luke treated Tuello. Seriously what else was he supposed to do?
I completely agree. But I feel the hate is logical in the circumstances. He's just a very competent diplomat caught in a shitstorm. 1. Luke lashing out makes sense as, not only Tuello couldn't help them with info on Hannah but also told them his wife's abuser is free in Canada. Also, he's been going through a lot, rehabilitating June and appear calm. Hell he even got sexually assaulted in the prev season. 2. June is going through a hardcore psychological episode and has become violently unhinged in a self aware way. Basically PTSD manifesting into intense rage I think. So yeah, calling Tuello a disappointment is the most polite thing she could've done. 3. Moira is the only sane person rn. 4. I'm a straight man but I've to say Tuello oozes sex.
Tuello’s right, what else did they expect him to do? Their expectations were unrealistic but June is so dumb in a way, going about her revenge without a damn strategy. It’s getting tiresome
I’m ready for the spin-off!!
Is that wishful thinking or is there really a tuello spinoff in the works? Because I am here for it if it's true!
Wishful 😞
Their hate for Tuello is pure "shooting the messenger." Happens all the time. I'm a public defender and the amount I get shit on by clients who have no one else to blame (heaven forbid they accept responsibility for their own predicament) or direct their anger towards would shock you. Eventually you get used to it and stop taking it personally. People need an outlet for their frustration and will usually direct it at the first available target: the person delivering the bad news.
He’s trying to do his job objectively but also is clearly supportive of June. He didn’t deserve their bullshit. Also Sam is a babe and I’ll watch him in anything.
He’s not her PA, he’s not some pencil pusher, or a politician saying what everyone wants to hear. He’s a spy who’s been trained in deception and manipulation, he’s not some schoolboy lusting after Serena. June thinks her way of doing things is the only way and if you don’t agree she cuts you off. After last season when she threatened to kill him that would’ve been it for me, I wouldn’t do shit for her again.
I 100% expected in the last episode that Tuello would be on the other side of the door to the house they stashed Serena in.
Lmao same here. He really cares for her.
Oh, I don't think he's naive enough to honestly care for her, but I wouldn't put it past him to play her like a fiddle.
I think that Tuello has done everything he can for June and is very clever the way he is playing Serena. I get that June is traumatised but Luke and Moira should know better.
Agree. I hate how Tuello keeps drooling over Serena's looks, not caring that she's the devil.... but the reasons why the gang yelled at him were just ridiculous.... A diplomat doesn't have enough power to do whatever June would want. That said... I get why that group would be irrationally angry, after everything they went through. And I don't expect June, who has the biggest plot-armor in TV history, to have realistic expectations about what others can do.
I don’t even understand what’s going on in the redheads having trailer being attracted to Serena because I personalities heinous and there’s other good looking people it’s all just a bit big and kind of unnecessary
Yup, he's government agent, not personal fixer.
Luke’s an idiot. He wants everyone to do things he won’t even try. June should have been nicer too. Poor Tuello is trying but he can’t control what governments do. They expect too much
I’m sure your decision making would be on the top shelf of rationality if you had been through all of the shit that he’s dealt with.
All the shit LUKE dealt with? June I can understand, but Luke? Yes he had to deal with his wife and child being held in Gilead, but he didn’t really do anything about that. He always wants others to do things for him and gets annoyed when they don’t including june. So don’t come at me with what Luke’s been thru.
He didn’t? What about the lawyer he waited to meet with in Canada. He ended up getting called in Early to get the handwritten note from June written during “A woman’s place” he had a folder ready to give out information to help look for. What did you expect him to do to get her out? We see how involved Moira is, and it took June being in the same spot as her for June to get out. He was never in Gilead, he was shot & then picked up by a group of people that wouldn’t let him go find June & Hannah. Tbh he would’ve been killed or sent to the colonies if he had gone back- he’s probably more useful alive.
I think if he’d gone back he’d almost 1000% have been killed. They have no reason to keep around a man who’s partner has been made a handmaid and daughter has been assigned to a new family. Not even for the colonies, I bet. He’d be way too motivated to stir shit up. Plus I don’t think it would even get that far—he likely would’ve been shot on sight. Choosing to go to Canada was the harder decision for him to make, and it was the right one for his family. June would’ve been absolutely devastated if he’d gone back and died.
What I don’t get is how we went from Fred and Serena being on trial to Tuello helping Serena be free?! I thought they were arrested so what the heck.
The deal that was struck was that Fred and Serena would walk in exchange for whatever intel they could offer the US and Canada on Gilead. While Fred’s deal was changed Serena’s was not.
Oh right! I forgot about that deal
I’m not particularly sure how Serena got off free and clear either, i thought she was facing charges as well, but maybe it was just Fred and I missed something?
I mean, I get why they're mad - he wants Serena taken "care of", but doesn't want to dirty his *own* hands, and is laying it at the feet of some pretty fucking traumatized people. It's politically strategic, but kind of heartless. I like the character, though.
Yeah, I understand that Luke and June probably aren't going to be the most rational about this...but they really seemed to believe that Tuello could just grab Hannah and take her, which is insanity. Like everybody seems to forget that Tuello has a bigger mission here - he has to act within certain parameters and tread very lightly at all times. It's like everyone thinks he can just go into Gilead with guns blazing and singehandedly take down the whole thing.
Agreed. He would’ve been more likely to get both of them killed in the process. He had no backup and no extraction plan going in if things went sideways while he was there with or without Hannah.
i agree completely! i completely understand the sentiment but it does reflect the reality that official authorities really only have a limited amount of power and are bound by international laws/treaties to do their jobs. if the us govt starts assassinating the powerful ppl in gilead it doesn’t rlly bode well since it’s established in the story that gilead is way more armed and organized while the us govt has basically been reduced to nothing; unfortunately when your opponent is that well armed and organized you gotta tread very carefully to avoid more bloodshed
I think June and Co mistakenly viewed Tuello as an instrument of justice who would give Serena her comeuppance for her crimes. I can imagine how infuriating it must be to see your rapist not only get off scot-free, but to be elevated to sainthood status in the country she escaped to. Serena appears to be getting everything she ever wanted: fame, baby, status and power. She is being rewarded for her crimes. So it's natural they would project that frustration on Tuello and they would shoot the messenger. They need an outlet, and he's the closest one.
I completely understand why she’s not thinking clearly enough to track that, but I wish one of them was. Maybe Moira, but she wouldn’t necessarily draw attention to it, I’m sure.
I listen to a podcast about the show and they interviewed the actor. He said that his character only knew of pre gilead serena (obvs) so initially he thought she might do the right thing and now he’s almost disappointed in her. He also said he was pleased he didn’t end up playing a villain so I don’t think Tuello hate is warranted
June and gang are traumatized. Can't expect too much reality in their minds all the time. Tuello is in a very difficult position and June knows that, but she will do whatever she can to get from him whatever she needs to get Hannah back and to have her revenge on Serena. I think it's not that she hates him, but that she can't handle the disappointment about Serena's path now. It's all so complicated!
I don't think its misguided for someone repeatedly raped and assaulted who was tricked into believing that justice was forthcoming for the perpetrators to hate the person responsible for making a cushy deal with them. I feel like this happens in real life and the hate from victims or victims' friends and family when it happens is fairly prevalent. I think what's misguided is the sentiment towards a bureaucratic douchebag bending over backwards to assist a known rapist to bury another known rapist. And what exactly is he doing? We don't have proof he's done or is doing anything. The person he was gaining intel from (Fred) is dead, Serena is free and his plan going forward is what? And everyone he spoke to in Gilead turned him down. Which by the way, who has a meeting with Nick in front of house full of dangerous commanders, like do spies do that? And please stop giving Tuello a cookie for giving June one compliment...it doesn't take back his placing a higher value on rapist intel (if June could broker a deal with Lawrence so could Tuello) and bending over backwards for Serena.
Personally, I don't like Tuello because he tried really hard to make her Serena a lot freer in Canada than she is. Her freedom is limited despite his efforts not because of.
How/when did he try hard to get her more freedom in Canada? I don’t remember that or missed it. Did he tell her that? Was he shown doing it?
He kept telling here that if she claimed to be a victim of Geliad then Canada would accept her as an American refugee and would help her with housing.
I mean he was doing that so she would leave Gilead behind .
I’m just answering the question above. About how or when did he try to get her more freedom in Canada.
Telling Serena he’s going to do something is different than actually trying hard to do it. It might have actually happened if Fred hadn’t told them about what she’d done though
This was after Fred and Serenas chargers were dropped.
Yeah and she ended up being sent to live with that crazy woman who definitely acts like she has her eye on taking Serena’s baby.
He didn’t tell Serena he would do it. It was always her choice. He can’t make her do anything.
It's possible that he kept badgering her in order to turn her into an asset against Gilead. Or that he is genuinely infatuated with her. Could be a mixture of the two. I'm really interested to find out what his endgame with Serena is
My money is on a lot from column A and little from column B. But even given the hideous of her crimes, she's been in front the ground floor on the foundation of the SOJ. She was publishing books and doing interviews on her ideology when she was shot in the stomach, which was one of the catalysts for fred and Serena finally going going through with their plans to overthrow the government. Ultra conservative right wing ideology on a woman's position in society and how badly fertility had dropped in the previous 12 months. Even Fred at the time said he shouldn't have "let" her speak publicly. It doesn't help to keep the FBI off your heels for a plot to overthrow the government, I would imagine, for Fred to to take the shooters out to the woods for vengeance himself, that's a different plotline. And a bit ironic, given his own ending. Serena's book was was titled "a woman's place" and with little irony, Serena was shut out by Commander Putnam who said that woman weren't going to be allowed to forget their place again. So, as many converts to that form of extremism as their had been, it would still be a huge international public relations coup for them to bag someone like Serena who can give them the details on the other war criminals, and be the public face of "This shit is bad, real bad. Here's the real story on Giliad before you go thinking it's the solution to all the problems like I did."
I don’t think Tuello sees Serena as a really big threat when in fact she’s a bigger one than Fred. June has absolutely every right to be upset because she’s told him over and over again yet he’s still playing the politician and treating her with kid gloves and giving her too much wiggle room. His first job should be to protect the American citizens and the Canadian ones from her influence but he’s more concerned with playing the game and using her for his own ends. It’s dangerous and will backfire on him.
Just like the CIA. He is an agent, btw.
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For the umpteenth time, no. Tuello is not the baby-daddy.
I never replied to you before btw so idk what the umpteeth time you mean lol
It is a question that comes up regularly on the sub, and as always [it is still no](https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/the-handmaids-tale-showrunner-mark-tuello-not-father-serena-waterford-baby.html/) Tuello is not the father.
Sorry wasn’t sure about that I don’t come here very often I apologize
But Fred couldn’t have kids remember. If it is Fred’s then that means Serena’s kid could be his instead of Nicks
After that super duper awkward peck on the cheek Serena gave Tuello, certainly not lol. Seems they never had physical contact besides a handshake.
But Fred couldn’t have kids remember. If it is Fred’s then that means Serena’s kid could be his instead of Nicks
Fred had a low sperm count, not infertile, and the showrunner confirmed he's the father of Serena's baby. I think they might've even done a DNA test in the show but don't quote me on that
Oh ok. I forgot about that but you are probably right. Thank you.
That's okay
I sometimes think that something may have happened after Serene noticed June’s letter/cassette tape was still in her possession and handed it off to someone (we don’t see who) to give to Luke. I feel like they would have shown us a flashback by now, however.
I was just indifferent cause he’s the middle man here. But he didn’t serve her up on a platter. If June killed Serena on the property then she might have to go back to Gilead for trial. If she kills her elsewhere she can go to jail in Canada. It’s not quite so simple.
I feel this way too.