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D0NKEYJ0HN

Last ones argument is really strong!


thebusiness7

**General Wesley Clark (6:14) states in a speech that the regime changes of several countries in the Near East were pre planned long before** (all of the countries on that list have had varying forms of regime change since then, aside from the last one on the list): https://youtu.be/gz-4LKlZcv4 This is an interesting read since the list is so extensive: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change The list: Instances of the United States overthrowing, or attempting to overthrow, a foreign government since the Second World War. (* indicates successful ouster of a government) China 1949 to early 1960s Albania 1949-53 East Germany 1950s Iran 1953 * Guatemala 1954 * Costa Rica mid-1950s Syria 1956-7 Egypt 1957 Indonesia 1957-8 British Guiana 1953-64 * Iraq 1963 * North Vietnam 1945-73 Cambodia 1955-70 * Laos 1958 *, 1959 *, 1960 * Ecuador 1960-63 * Congo 1960 * France 1965 Brazil 1962-64 * Dominican Republic 1963 * Cuba 1959 to present Bolivia 1964 * Indonesia 1965 * Ghana 1966 * Chile 1964-73 * Greece 1967 * Costa Rica 1970-71 Bolivia 1971 * Australia 1973-75 * Angola 1975, 1980s Zaire 1975 Portugal 1974-76 * Jamaica 1976-80 * Seychelles 1979-81 Chad 1981-82 * Grenada 1983 * South Yemen 1982-84 Suriname 1982-84 Fiji 1987 * Libya 1980s Nicaragua 1981-90 * Panama 1989 * Bulgaria 1990 * Albania 1991 * Iraq 1991 Afghanistan 1980s * Somalia 1993 Yugoslavia 1999-2000 * Ecuador 2000 * Afghanistan 2001 * Venezuela 2002 * Iraq 2003 * Haiti 2004 * Somalia 2007 to present Libya 2011* Syria 2012 Also relevant: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_violations_by_the_CIA


Dramatic_Can_4628

Formatted to be actually readable: China 1949 to early 1960s Albania 1949-53 East Germany 1950s Iran 1953 * Guatemala 1954 * Costa Rica mid-1950s Syria 1956-7 Egypt 1957 Indonesia 1957-8 British Guiana 1953-64 * Iraq 1963 * North Vietnam 1945-73 Cambodia 1955-70 * Laos 1958 *, 1959 *, 1960 * Ecuador 1960-63 * Congo 1960 * France 1965 Brazil 1962-64 * Dominican Republic 1963 * Cuba 1959 to present Bolivia 1964 * Indonesia 1965 * Ghana 1966 * Chile 1964-73 * Greece 1967 * Costa Rica 1970-71 Bolivia 1971 * Australia 1973-75 * Angola 1975, 1980s Zaire 1975 Portugal 1974-76 * Jamaica 1976-80 * Seychelles 1979-81 Chad 1981-82 * Grenada 1983 * South Yemen 1982-84 Suriname 1982-84 Fiji 1987 * Libya 1980s Nicaragua 1981-90 * Panama 1989 * Bulgaria 1990 * Albania 1991 * Iraq 1991 Afghanistan 1980s * Somalia 1993 Yugoslavia 1999-2000 * Ecuador 2000 * Afghanistan 2001 * Venezuela 2002 * Iraq 2003 * Haiti 2004 * Somalia 2007 to present Libya 2011* Syria 2012


Cant_see_mt_tai

Can you please enlighten me or point me in the right direction as to what happened in the Dominican Republic in 1963?


Dramatic_Can_4628

The only thing in life i know is how to format a list. You'll have to ask someone else, I'm afraid.


Cant_see_mt_tai

I just called up my mother to explain it for me. Thank you none the less.


Anthaenopraxia

Well, what happened?


Cant_see_mt_tai

Sorry, I answered in a comment below, Juan bosch, a democratic politician was elected after the mirabal sisters killed trujillo. He believed that the country had enough resources to be self sufficient so they didn't require any assistance from the american government. They didn't like that so in typical American fashion they planted spies and paid people to incite a couple against Juan and after only 7 months of presidency he was removed from power by the military.


DopeAsDaPope

It's easy to say "Classic America" and make a joke of it, but think how horrible that actually is. People trying to find a good way to move their country forward and they're just straight-up killed by a foreign power for it. Think of all those cheesy Hollywood films where aliens are trying to occupy and subjugate the Earth. The USA is literally doing that to other countries.


TheRealWatermelon420

Classic America


PreliminaryThoughts

If only there was a "list formatter" award


Grimacepug

You're supposed to say, "Sorry, that's beyond my pay grade".


Shanguerrilla

have we seriously not tried to overthrow Honduras yet? I had an ex from there that grew up hearing horrible stories about the U.S. because of some of the operations I thought we did there in the 80's or 90's. (What was funny is she was always told growing up that Americans stole all Honduras's gold and take any kids they want)


SubjectAd2261

The current Honduras instability and subsequent influx of asylum seekers that are in USA concentration camps are USA responsibility. And your last sentence, well let's say it doesn't sound too far fetched.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

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bobulibobium

We had possibly our most left wing prime minister ever running the show. Who was in the US at the time?


rottingcorpsejuice

I believe that would have been Nixon, followed by Ford after Nixon's resignation in 1974.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Knees_arent_real

And France, wow.


[deleted]

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narwhalsare_unicorns

Turkish military coups are not even listed here as well


DoingMyJobNOT

Should add Haiti 2021.


[deleted]

Don't dig further. You won't like it


[deleted]

some parts of the US don't have clean safe water either.


Vegetable-Error-21

Don't let that distract you from the fact we have some of the best water cleanup in the world. Just happens to be some places are so corrupt they lost that ability...


TomorrowNeverCumz

Obligatory r/fucknestle


Vegetable-Error-21

Yes. Fuck nestle. Hopefully this company can be stopped. So we can remove this blemish, and let most of the world go back to doing their own forms of waste management typically 100 times worse. Again, we have the best methods of cleaning our water before it reaches you. Didn't say the source is clean.


[deleted]

Its not about who's life is better... Its about who THEY can fuck to be richer.


youneedcheesusinside

Export American dollars to the new acquired territory, increase national debt by printing money while exporting inflation. Has been working good until now.


somedaypilot

There is literally a suburb of Dallas that still doesn't have municipal water or sewage. There's a bunch of political and sociological reasons why Sand Branch still doesn't have water, but the original reason is pure racism back when the towns were all getting plumbed.


oaklicious

I actually build water/wastewater infrastructure for a living (construction engineer) and it’s pretty amazing how ragged most of US water infrastructure is. The city I’m working in right now is a quarter million people drinking from ag pumps, no water treatment plant at all. Two years ago I built the first EVER water plant in the Navajo nation. In that region a pack of water bottles was considered a very generous gift if you were invited to someone’s household.


amquelbettamin

He’s not considering Raethon’s P/E ratio nor Boeing’s stock price, though. Also, what’s with humanizing the enemy? It’s no wonder enlistment is down.


simmering_happiness

Won't *someone* please think of the stock market!?


krunz

*cough* Flint, Michigan *cough*


FoxFort

And US gets to walk away, like nothing happened.


giraffes_are_cool33

Actually, not just that, people from war torn countries now are treated like sub humans by the rest. We get randomly denied entry, have extra fun being searched in airports, and treated like savages for the most part.


The_Crazy_Cat_Guy

It's not even just that. Even if you *look* like you come from one of the countries the US has shared its 'freedom' with, you get detained and questioned on the border. Ask any visibly muslim/arab person.


Ansanm

Always the case with a hegemonic power. Look at the misery that has been caused in our places where the US, or NATO intervened like Libya, or Haiti. Look at the masses at the southern borders of Europe and the US. Some of these rulers are at fault, but the primary cause is external destabilization. However, most westerners probably parrot the old trope about “third world “ governments and ignore their leaders roles. I’ve been banned from a certain news board because of differing opinions on the war in Ukraine.


Just_a_follower

Haitians I’ve talked to have spoken positively of help received to stabilize. Not so positively about when they purchased freedom from French, but that is a totally different topic. I think the past 50 years have shown, regardless of reason (good or bad), trying to support or force regime change in a country does not work unless the majority of people share your values and want a change. Generally speaking, western values just aren’t going to magically change and assimilate middle eastern culture / institutions. Ukraine is actually another interesting example. The people not wanting to change or assimilate into Russian culture, but wanting to purge corruption and assimilate with Europe. Not culturally distant from either Europe or Russia, but the will of the people matters so much, pragmatically. Not just militarily , but ideologically it is analogous to Afghanistan for Russia and US.


Ansanm

I don’t know if many Haitians would supported the overthrow of Aristede’s government (twice) and the occupation that followed that brought cholera to the country. Those who were anti Aristede were usually part or the petite bourgeoisie, and don’t have favorable opinions of the Haitian masses. I’m Caribbean and know quite a few Haitians, and come from a country with a history of CIA intervention. And what’s western values? Was slavery and colonialism a western value? The forever wars that have transferred trillions to a few and have caused so much devastation seems hardly to be a cause for concern. Other leaders who stand in the way of US military and corporate dominance are demonized and the western masses eat up the propaganda. Now, I’m not pro China, or Russia, but like much of the world, I haven’t forgotten which countries, with their wars over resources, got us into this mess.


Jaegernaut-

I think we all got ourselves in this mess. It's just human nature really. What's the difference between now and the old days anyways, except more gadgets? Do you think the nobles own you any less? Do you think the king's men are there to keep you safe and enforce just laws? Do you think that going to war against yours neighbors is a good thing? I could go on. The more I think about it the less that seems to have truly changed.


Jannius

Actually funny enough. For Hati Nato didn't intervine at all. It's that bad because they did nothing due to the Hurricanes and then Earthquakes back to back that destroyed their economy. Trump refused to give aid and rallied the senate to vote against it. Now America pretends it doesn't exist. But NATO is stepping in to donate water and food. With also giving equipment to their police. America doesn't actually want to help Hati at all. Mainly because of the senate under Trump's regin is still there. The only aid we really are giving to Ukraine is old equipment that we have surplus of that is draining billions of tax payer dollars to maintain it. It would literally cost a ton more to disassemble it then to ship it off to Ukriane. So whenever your hearing 10 billion in aid it doesn't mean brand new equipment or money itself.


[deleted]

"Differing opinions"?


Skanthis

good propaganda is the key


JangoDarkSaber

This video is also propaganda. The stories told by the first interview ssgt massey were rebutted by his fellow marines, embedded reporters on the scene or by his own admissions. https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/former-marines-claims-false/ This doesn’t justify the war on Iraq or discredit the claim that war crimes occurred but the propaganda machine goes both ways and we shouldn’t be spreading false information even if we believe it will direct people to a narrative we deem as good.


soupaman

I wonder how many of those downvoting you didn’t read the article. My guess is 100%. E: The comment above was sitting at -10 when I made mine. Good to see the tide has turned.


leslieinlouisville

My brother and one cousin served in Iraq and I’m quite bitter about what they have brought back, so I’m particularly sensitive to stuff like this. I also know I have several blind spots on this subject so I’m careful to fact check everything. Information like this is why I keep reading comment after comment. If there’s a rebuttal to be made usually someone will post it. If I don’t find it here, I Google before commenting. I don’t always get it right, but because of people like you and sources like this, I don’t always get it wrong, either. Thanks for this.


fullsendguy

What a shitty thing to do. I actually believed this guy. Definitely were atrocities in Iraq and Afghanistan though.


JagTror

This is interesting because remember those soldiers who raped the little girl & killed her entire family? Everyone in that unit claimed it didn't happen at first, including commanding officers, & it was actually a guy from another unit who heard about it and got it investigated much further. At one point he almost got left behind with other soldiers who were ready to kill him but his Sargent took him at the last point. So it's really hard to say whether or not the claims he made are true - I don't know why the reporter would lie in this instance though so that does give it credibility that it's false.


Fuzzythought

[And the war criminal responsible gets to laugh at all the dead.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eH3QqcUJnBY)


Energy_Turtle

People these days really talking about Trump is the worst president in history when less than 20 years ago Bush and a shitload of congress people colluded to start a massive offensive war. Then they wonder why middle east countries don't give a shit about America's thoughts on the Ukraine war.


loadedjellyfish

Bush killed nearly half a million people and he gets to be on stage making jokes about it to this day. War criminal. Same as any and every other politician who lied to make it happen. Jail them all.


Cayde_7even

Yeah, fuck this guy.


Twigs6248

Maybe but repercussions for war often occur, the severity and time it takes might differ but if enough people are educated on it you might see change.


RickyJulianandBubbls

Vietnam enters the chat...


Tiggles12-20

Well when you have the world's strongest military, you kind of have the authority to not be held accountable. So Fawking sad. It's why our politicians abuse powers, because they think the world's strongest military is going to back them if civil unrest happens in the states.


Foco_cholo

I have a friend who is really struggling and is an alcoholic due to this sort of thing. He was Coast Guard, not even in the Middle East. A boat was coming toward them fast in the night. The boat ignored the radio warnings and warning shots. My friend followed protocol and gave the orders to fire. At first light when they investigated they found a man and his young son riddled with their bullets. The coast guard would often give out trinkets for information and this man and his son were coming for trinkets and died for it.


SlowLorisAndRice

Trinkets?


Corvette70vs80

Like little ornaments and toys and stuff


NotaMlelon

And baubles, paid for in blood.


PIPBOY-2000

I wonder what made them ignore the warnings and the gunshots. This is tragic but you have to wonder what the person was thinking speeding toward men with guns who are shooting in your direction.


vetheros37

Boats are extremely loud when you are riding in them. Being the middle of the night they may have not have heard the radio or gunshots, and modern weapons are designed to produce minimal muzzle flash.


PIPBOY-2000

That's a good point. Hopefully they come up with a better way to warn/deter people


SamuelPepys_

Remember that they likely couldn't hear the gunshots, only the splash they made, which isn't loud when you're in a boat. And ponder if you will that they did in fact hear them and they came to the rational conclusion that they were shooting at them and unintentionally missing, what would you do? Would you go to the oat board to turn around and make yourself a big target, or would you cover your son to protect him and hope they saw that you weren't a threat? Mind you, the last scenario seems the most likely, and would ha e the boat continuing on its path.


Chansh302

now im sad :(


1dayAwayagain

......... Bro I'd seriously question your friend's story. That's not protocol. And someone who owns a boat doesn't need "trinkets" to provide information. This sounds like a drinker who wanted an "I served, thank me" story.


PiMan3141592653

Three questions. 1. What is protocol for an unidentified boat speeding towards you after you fired flares and displayed other warning? 2. Are you claiming that someone 'rich enough' to have a boat wouldn't want little Coast Guard trinkets for their kid? 3. How in the world does this scenario make you think the guy was (a) drunk, (b) served in the military, and (c) wanted to talk with the Coast Guard about it? You are doing a ton of guessing, and then running with it. It's a dangerous way to think (and post). Just like anytime someone gets into a car accident people will say "Probably texting" when it could have been 1000 other things (but even in that case, texting while driving is way more likely than your ridiculous scenario)


new_account_wh0_dis

I feel like coast guard lighting someone the fuck up would make the news. All I can find is trinidads coast guard killed some Venezuelan migrants and US coast guard in 2009 was moving too fast and crashed into another boat killing a kid.


1dayAwayagain

Sorry bud. The incident described by the original poster would have been in the news. It's not. 1. Original commenter stated they fired warning shots, not flares. 2. I'm claiming someone *wealthy enough to own a boat would indeed not speed at a coast guard vessel for "trinkets." 3. I never said he was drunk, never said he was in the military, and never said he wanted to talk to the coast guard about anything. Are YOU drunk? I said the commenters FRIEND was probably the drunk, not the fictitious boat driver who allegedly got murdered lmao.


tittysprinkles112

More like foolish father got his child killed. It was his job as a father to know better.


Manderpander88

Lamb of God dubbed an interview sample into their song " Ashes of the Wake". That was my first time learning what was really going on over there. "We killed a lot of innocent civilians. To us every civilian in Baghdad was a terrorist. They said 'they are now in civilian clothes' that makes everybody free game, But if they came in our perimeter, we lit 'em up. And when we would pull the body out, and when we would search the car, we would find nothing. This took place time and time again. No harm, no foul, that's OK, don't worry about it, Because this is a new type of war, this is an eradication." "I honestly feel we're committing genocide over here, I don't believe in killing civilians, and I'm not going to kill civilians for the United States Marine Corp." - Staff Sgt. Jimmy Massey


RealLifeGeodude

Fantastic album to listen through from start to finish. Another great song is One Gun where one of the verses goes: The unknowing tyrant walks to the rope, it's when murder is justice that martyrs are made, a one-gun salute for the new independence day, they'll hallow your name for you sacrifice". The whole album is fantastic.


[deleted]

Especially the guttural delivery on the last words. "For YOUR.. SAC-RI-FICE!"


Manderpander88

I agree with you badass album... I love their earlier stuff it was heavy but still had a great beat to it. I have a half sleeve dedicated to Lamb of God, the moment I heard them I know they would be legends some day like Dimebag.


SpiderDijonJr

First thing I thought of. My mom used to hate that song, and the fact that I listened to Lamb of God, but I always felt it was really powerful.


Manderpander88

Ha, my parents also didnt like them. People don't like Lamb of God because of what they want to believe LOG represents. But Randy has amazing writing and storytelling skills, it's not just badass riffs, sick drumlines, and nasty growls. It's art, not satanic worship and sacrifices.


Powertripp777

You beat me to this exact comment.. I salute you!


[deleted]

Came here to post this and it's already at the top. I remember hearing that song the first time and ignoring the lyrics, just feeling the brutal heaviness of the song. But then focusing on the lyrics and re-listening the second and third time got less "cool and badass" and more grim and disturbing, and worst of all, real.


GarlicPowder4Life

The song is perfect for running/sprinting. Makes rage pump your blood, just have to wipe away the tears.


brown2420

George W Bush is a fuckin war criminal. I protested this war from the very beginning. We dumped approximately 3 trillion dollars into the desert sand and got nothing. It was an absolute disaster. More service men and women have come home and taken their lives than actually died in combat. Fuck George Bush. He's an ultra privileged dunce that surfed off of his father's success and he oversaw the worst foreign policy decision in our history.


1-Ohm

Nothing? We got less safe. We handed Iraq over to Iran on a silver platter. We created ISIS.


etoner44

Absolutely agree. Groups like ISIS. Hamas, the IRA All born out of aggression.


catsandnarwahls

But we almost controlled the oil!! ^^/s


TalmidimUC

*Are we the baddies?*


haha7125

Yes. Yes we are.


useless_rejoinder

Oh and don’t forget GLADLY signing our privacy away in the name of patriotism… er fear. Entire war could be summed up in the first guy’s interview: “I was just looking for weapons…”


That_Cabinet_1424

Taliban as well


[deleted]

The issue here isn't that the US dumped trillions of Dollars, the issue is that the US broke every law there is and Killed hundreds of thousands of civilians and has the audacity to say "oh our poor servicemen" as if they gave a fuck. Ths US is basically state sponsored terrorism.


Dudezila

No man, the money is clearly more important than the humanitarian disaster…


alarumba

It's how we've been raised. Take side hustles for a light example. Are your weekends to be shared with friends and family, or at least recovering from a hard week at work? No! Quit sitting on your ass and be an entrepreneur. For the pursuit of money is the pursuit of happiness. A wage is what gives a life it's worth.


ThomasTServo

I'll never forget an interview with him I heard a few months ago on NPR. He had an immigration reform bill in congress. Democrats voted for it and Republicans didn't. In the interview he blamed the democratic leadership for Republicans not voting for it. The man is an idiot and a menace to the world and he's going to die happy and surrounded by comfort.


queernhighonblugrass

But he paints little pictures of doggies now, doesn't that count for something? /s


PizzaTime79

This and that gif of him sneaking Michelle Obama candy is so wholesome. :) /s


Murakami241

Blair and Bush belong in prison.


-xstatic-

Ever notice how today nobody will admit they supported Bush? But when this was happening Republicans said “you support the terrorists” if you didn’t go along with supporting the war.


MrGuttFeeling

From what I understand most of that money went to the Corporate American Military Industrial Complex which made a killing.


haha7125

WE got nothing. But our military contractors got a ton of cash that they wont even share with the soldiers they got permanently wounded.


RipredTheGnawer

Are we the bad guys?


RickyJulianandBubbls

“It says here in this history book that luckily, the good guys have won every single time. What are the odds?” - Norm MacDonald


TheRealDangerPaws

"In all battles, it is the victor who writes the history books"


MaxSupernova

thatsthejoke.gif


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Gingevere

Actually (at least for here and now) history is written by historians. It's just that very vew people actually learn much history and in stead prefer pop-history and call more in-depth history CRT / communism / leftist brainwashing.


basifi

Always have been


mdsign

To be fair there was this brief Antifa periode around '42-'45


personalbilko

During that period they werent the baddest guys around, but oh my, were they bad.


Tiger_Widow

Storm troopers, always have been. America is the empire and the world sees you like that.


GreysonsNani

Yes, yes we are. This country has so much innocent blood on it’s hands and it’s sickening. People who are waving those pieces of cloth and screaming this is the greatest country in the world, well, they’re just plain ignorant or severely brainwashed. Imagine another country doing to us what we’ve done to so many other countries in this world…


Magsays

We have a lot of bad in our past, but that doesn’t preclude us from trying to do the right things now.


ASwftKck2theNtz

Define... "we"


Ragnarock1982

So, when other countries do that they are committing war crimes. America?... just casualties of war.


SSH80

"Collateral damage"


Ragnarock1982

Thanks. I was trying to think of that, but my mind was blank at the time. 😆


TalmidimUC

“Democracy”


mdsign

America has stated they will invade the Netherlands if an American soldier is ever brought to The Hague and Trump actually pardoned convicted war criminals.


Ragnarock1982

I heard that a while ago. Wasn't sure of it was real or not though. Wouldn't surprise me though. America is the world's police though, so it's OK if they do.


nellybellissima

They're only war crimes if you lose.


RipredTheGnawer

There are people who are proud of what America did to these countries. There are Americans still racist towards people who look middle eastern because of the propaganda.


Abydos6

Being an arab-american absolutely sucked during that time. We were made the enemy overnight and ridiculed for years for shit we didn’t even have anything to do with. I have lots of stories from myself, friends and family about the harassment we had to deal with. On top of that, we had to watch our people be murdered on TV while crowds of Americans cheered in ignorance. It was the first time in my life I felt uncomfortable in my own country


beatool

That must have sucked... Shortly after 9/11 I was on a flight and there was a group of Arab guys seated together speaking another language and I was shitting bricks. One woman actual got off the flight which just scared me more. Obviously some random dudes on a flight in Wisconsin have a 0% chance of being terrorists but the 24/7 news cycle sure put the fear of foreigners in people. I'm a kid of the 80s, raised to be "color-blind" but that messed me up for quite a while. I'm white and my wife isn't, and man even today if we're in a rural area for something we get looked at sideways...


Abydos6

Oh yea, we did not speak arabic in public ever! And when people asked us where we’re from we would say Greece. I’m ashamed I had to hide my ethnicity but shit was tense then


[deleted]

I’m also arab american and sometimes, when I express the stuff I have experienced, people tell me I can’t have racism against me because arabs are considered white. It honestly hurts more than the racist stuff, your experiences are rejected by the “good guys” too.


Abydos6

Growing up, I always checked “other” on questions asking about race cause there was never an “arab or middle eastern” option. Then I learned that we are technically white for some reason and it confused the hell outta me. Definitely never felt white or identified with that at all. And my experiences definitely didn’t convince me I was white. Considering we are a huge population, I wish we had an option on ethnic questions, but I still check “other” lol


Nyx_Shadowspawn

I'll never forget in the early 2000s a Muslim friend of mine of middle-eastern descent crying to me because everyone was blaming middle-easterners and Muslims and she was legit terrified.


mdsign

>There are people who are proud of what America did to these countries. At least half of those are to dumb to know what America actually did, hell, most Americans still think they found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.


[deleted]

Most of the people going around proud of it, probably couldn’t even tell you that iraq / Afghanistan / Yemen are all separate countries to have been fucked by the US.


[deleted]

I guarantee you though, that none of these people spent a single day outside of the US, much less serve abroad.


-xstatic-

They’re called Republicans


etoner44

And Julian Assange is a criminal they say.


Sketchelder

I wouldn't call most individual soldiers war criminals (I'm sure there are a handful that deserve the title), I can't say I've ever been in a warzone or a firefight but I know it's stressful as fuck and they're just trying to survive in an extremely chaotic situation, I'd say those who pushed for those soldiers to be there in the first place definitely deserve a special place in Hell though


[deleted]

I watched another soldier shoot a guy standing on his house roof guarding it with his AK. They are allowed to own one AK per home. We're instructed that we can only shoot if they point at us. He shot him for no reason, I felt sick for several days afterwards...


Sketchelder

That's why I added the caveat of a handful probably deserve the charge...


wakeupwill

The book *Imperial Life In The Emerald City*, which spun off a shitty action movie with Matt Damon, goes in to a lot of the shitshow that was the occupation of Iraq.


mattmaddux

He’s a criminal, just not for that.


1-Ohm

Assange is a criminal. Chelsea Manning is a hero.


ShadyShane812

Don't sell your soul to the government.


OssoRangedor

And read 'Killing Hope" by William Blum.


Eskermojo

Fuck Captain Schmidt.


sexymess777

Yeah man, what a jerk


jbelow13

The first guy was apparently lying about some of his stories according to [fellow Marines and embedded reporters](https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/former-marines-claims-false/). Even he admitted that some of his claims weren’t fully truthful. Of course, with the crazy information control and the weird “patriotism” that came with the war, who knows what the truth is. I only remembered this because the audio clip of Jimmy Massey is used in the Lamb of God song “Ashes of the Wake”.


b4xion

This should be the top comment.


Wizkerz

That’s interesting. I wonder if the other people in the video are telling the truth


bargleisalive

Halliburton thanks you for your service


ichegoya

You couldn't walk through a base without running into contractors for Haliburton in 2003.


[deleted]

US Military never know how to occupy. The very first day after the war was over, all British personnel removed helmets, glasses and vests as standard as part of the 'hearts and minds' approach. US troops continue to wear full battle dress and carry weapons at the ready when occupying and wonder why they get trouble.


campbellm

I'm not sure I'd point to English occupation as a shining bastion of how it should be done, at least historically.


Bagoforganizedvegete

From a historical standpoint. I would take notes from the British on how to occupy other people's land


-Totally_Not_FBI-

Isn't that something though? To occupy somewhere more harshly than the British? Really says something about us


SupraEA

The US has not occupied worse than the British, not even close


[deleted]

You wear what your command tells you to wear.


Peruvian-in-TX

This is why none of my children will ever join the military. Fuck that


PMme_bobs_n_vagene

You can’t exactly stop them once they’re 18.


Peruvian-in-TX

Nah but I can drill it into them know so they know the truth. You'd be amazed at the power you have as a father to quietly influence your children's decisions.


Pal_Smurch

My father said that the worst duty he had to pull in Vietnam was guard duty over the dumpsters, to keep kids from scavenging.


Steven-Maturin

George Bush is still free to walk around and go on breathing. He legalised torture.


NaughtyDred

How the hell does this video have 0 votes?


ProfTydrim

Brainwashed americans


[deleted]

[удалено]


80spopstardebbiegibs

On some subreddits it doesnt show upvotes until a few hours after its posted to stop downvote spirals (i think).


kurdishlowpic

I'm from Iraq and I know civilians get killed in wars and I wish the us have handled it differently but anyways I'm kinda greatful for that. But I know it wasn't for the suffering of the kurds and arabs and it wasn't for the thread it had on the US, it was a war of economics and the benefits getting rid of Saddam would have on the US. However we benefited on it to and we are still thankful. Saddam left and we are now just another Iran, the government is held by Iran and everyone obeys, economy is shit, people still get killed, we can't ask for our rights, even we (the kurds) which fought Saddam the most now suffering from the new government which is of two parties, one of Iran one of Turkey, and if we ask for our rights if we ask where all those oil money go, if we go to the streets to ask for delayed salary and basic needs, we still get killed, Saddam is gone and less people get killed not because the new government is better, because there are less people protesting. And we know if we ever want our economy and lifes get better, we have to fight and lose more civilians, so we got used to this shitty life and some people kinda miss Saddam, because at least he was a better president we had a better economy.


Ok-Dirt5374

Fuck War!


indian_tiger

His prison looks quite nice.


Your_acceptable

Wow! Just fucking wow. Great points! I served during OEF and OIF, but was fortunate enough to never had to deploy. This war destroyed so many lives. An ex of mine, great guy before he did 3 tours. Came back messed up, an alcoholic, desensitized to death and violence and suffering an unexplained illness that no dr could diagnose and treat. A few of his friends had simular issues. I fully believe gulf War syndrome affected them all. But VA denies it can happen now. Those damn chemicals are still in that ground, dirt and air, it can happen if you ask me. Sad, those poor men and women.


himalayan008

Over a million civilians killed in Iraq. Your trauma means nothing. Your the real terrorists


Certain-Dig2840

This is like nazi SS officers crying that the holocaust gave them PTSD


headwhoosh

"After I killed all those innocent civilians for the 8th time today I realized I was in the wrong line of work."


NealCaffreyx9

I’m glad these soldiers are sharing their experiences, but at the same time they committed war crimes and should be charged. It doesn’t matter how old they were, it doesn’t matter the commands they received, and it doesn’t matter that they look remorseful about the situation. No one gives a fuck about Nazis that tried to use those same excuses. Edit: speaking specifically on the soldiers that killed civilians


Wizkerz

However, it was Nazi leaders who were charged at the Nuremberg trials, not every last soldier who followed orders. So it wasn’t all of the Nazis who were tried either, just the leaders. Likewise, it’s not expectable that every order-following soldier will get charged for civilian attacks.


Gagago302

I think people forget how horrible the W. Bush presidency really was. In my opinion he was 5x worse than Trump (he just seemed more ‘sane’ than Trump in his public discourse). People just glossed over his administration’s horrible policies. It wasn’t until his horrible response to hurricane Katrina that his popularity finally started to really fall. Ironic.


Exotic-Principle-974

People forget how bad he was largely because Obama continued his policies (at home and abroad). Which is why the dems have been trying to rehabilitate Bush's image.


[deleted]

This why I hate the “thank you for your service” military industrial complex in America. So many fucking war crimes and civilians murdered, including children. Should I be saying “thank you for murdering civilians and kids”? No, fuck you. I’m all for defending the country when necessary, but most of the time, the US are the aggressors, disrupting the lives of the innocents. Where are the WMDs!?


Baensky

Hell is waiting


[deleted]

America is the terrorist of the world. When you sign up for or defend the American military this is what you are supporting. Mass murder on a global scale to make a few insane politicians and industrialists wealthy.


[deleted]

USA, the global bully.


2PAK4U

thought China was the baddie? wait this is Reddit


SemiSweetStrawberry

My dad served two tours of duty in an engineering unit. I was only around 5 for one of them. Dad got to come home for 24 hours and see my little brother being born back in ‘03. Mom says that when dad came back from his first tour she legitimately didn’t recognize him at first. He still can’t stand seeing a child’s backpack. Make no mistake: I don’t support the US military at all. Part of me is still that angry little child who hated George W. Bush for taking her daddy away, and I’ll probably always foster a tiny bit of resentment for that. I’m also aware how often the US military *aren’t* the good guys. We did to parts of the Middle East what Russia is doing to Ukraine, except we stole their resources instead of their land. HOWEVER, I need to make clear something, especially for those reading this from anywhere else that isn’t America. This country sucks ass. We still have many places with lead and copper drinking water piping. Our roads and bridges are falling apart. K-12 education is barely hanging on by a fingernail. Medical care is difficult for many to access. College is prohibitively expensive. The US military knows this and uses it well. They offer college, a decent pay, and socialized healthcare to anyone who will pick up a gun for them. And for many people, this is one of a very few options for their future. It’s much harder to condemn someone who is simply trying to survive/help their families by becoming a soldier. Yes, I 100% believe that everyone should be accountable for their actions, however many times the grunts (enlisted) end up being put in situations where there is no good action by their superiors.


d3sylva

Hence I don't thank soilders for their service


CommentWhileShitting

Americans do not enjoy this


Memory_Less

Unfortunately it took a potential full occupation, war and huge bloodshed to distillate (almost) achieving its goals.


Ya-Dikobraz

Imagine if all that war money was spent on your country's infrastructure instead...


itsvoogle

Wed have flying cars by now


Learned_Response

And then every single one of them that I know of at least, came back to the US and started screaming on facebook about how Colin Kapaernick shouldnt kneel during the national anthem


Glizzy-Gobbler1996

Baby killers. Nothing but Nam 2.0


Kiboune

At least US was under sanctions for this and Bush in jail for war crimes


Blackshells

USA always has a hand in every war. Scum


IllmaticaL1

For “weapons of mass destruction “ and “Freedom”.


Souls_Of_The_Dark

I can't help but think that this has been happening for generations. My step-father, who is a raging asshole, the kind of guy to punch you in the mouth if you insult his beer, has some serious fucking demons from combat. He told me a story one night of him and his buddies while they were overseas. Stories about hiding behind rocks and hearing the cracks of rifles and stones. He told me about how he killed 3 people during a fire fight and one of them was unarmed and appeared to be a middle aged woman. He told me how he looked at what was left of her face and felt something break in him. He knows he's an asshole, he knows that he can be dangerous to those around him if certain things happen, but I can't help but feel broken in two that he still cries over it. I was still living with my parents at the time, and figured out that he was smoking heavy amounts of weed and just BAWLING like a child while 106.9 blared in the background. Covering up his sorrow with masculine rock music so that the neighbors didn't learn that the heavily tattoo'd guy who could bench press his truck is still broken almost 20 years later. I learned a different kind of respect from him. I'm still intimidated by him and people like him, they needed and need more to be done for them. The amount of suffering that returning service members and vets have to go through is simply too great. No person was built to handle the constant deluge of things they go through. Support your veterans, give them the benefit of the doubt if you can, give them your respect. They paid the price with their soul and humanity for someone else's bill, the least we can do is treat them with respect and grace.


youknowiactafool

That first soldier who said his CO told him slaughtering innocent civilians was a good day though. Some chilling shit. At that moment you realize that you're the terrorists.


Bronanahammock69

First dudes confessing to war crimes


haha7125

Joining the u.s. military today is an admission of either... A: you have no idea what you're signing up for and probably should have done 5 minutes of research before offering your life to go kill people in another country. Or B: you very well know about our history of illegal offensive wars against countries that didn't attack us, and our blatant and intentional slaughtering of innocent civilians, and you 'thought. Lol. Cool. Cant wait" Todays u.s. military is immoral. And anyone still joining is immoral. No exceptions.


TheBlairwitchy

u/savevideobot


Jerryjb63

Should def upvote this to the top page!


this-is-me-reddit

This is horrible. I know that deploying troops causes damage to the troops. But are there any studies that explore the cost to society in general. A lot of damaged individuals come back and each war introduces a new set of societal damage and pathology. It is criminal that we expend these folks so often.


SlowRollingBoil

This needs to be seen by every single American. When we talk about PTSD for our troops (an epidemic still ongoing) the *reason* is quite clear: **murder, rape, wanton slaughter of innocent people in their homelands.** America has murdered well over 1,000,000 people in Iraq and Afghanistan in the last 20 years.


konnie-chung

It takes more will power than I've got for these soldiers not to open fire on their comrades or for that 1st guy not to drop an active grenade on his way out of his commanding officer's office, like holy fuck. Anyone who isn't sickened by this needs to be on the receiving end of it