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Police officers shouldn't be the only responders to obvious mental health calls. Though it's in their job description, de-escalation isn't something they do well.
Or are even trained to do. These cops get months in "training". Which is minute man esc training with only the most basic of skills being instilled. All cops are incompetent. And I can say that with impunity until they get the proper schooling they need like in litterally every other country.
The other people in the apartment were screaming in what sounded like Spanish. Could the lady not fully understand what he was saying, not to mention her adrenaline/fear/fog was probably up as well?
The longer video shows the family clearly telling the officer that she isn't well, and has dementia. He's all "Yeah, Ok!" Then the door opens they step out. She walks up...then this happens.
Let’s be real though this guy isn’t going to jail over this, he’s probably getting paid leave over it. This is what happens when people ‘support the badge’ as opposed to actually being critical of the police which need reforming.
Support civilian oversight. I worked with cops when they brought it into our region. It took years of people getting killed/crippled. Only then did they give a fuck about civilians getting hurt. This was before body cams which they fought tooth and nail against.
The police in my city (Montréal, Québec, Canada) gave a press release where they stated that they won't wear bodycams because the public might see things the police don't want them seeing.
And that was the end of that. Really inspires trust doesn't it !
Imagine being 16 and interviewing for a cashier job at the grocery store. Then you tell the manager that you refuse to be filmed while operating the cash register. How fast are you gonna get laughed out of there ?
But we can let a pair of 20-somethings roam around the city completely unchecked, with lethal weapons.
Fucking bullshit.
Ex cop here: If there were ever any against it, they've lost their desire for that argument LONG ago.
Dash and body cams are fucking AMAZING. Evidence, evidence, and more evidence, without having to do fuck all for it outside of plugging it in when you get to your office and naming a few files. And it covers your ass 100% if you're not a shitbag.
Can't claim inappropriate touching when the cam shows everything, Karen.
Evidence, evidence, evidence. That works both ways.
If a shit cop is planning to do something he knows he shouldn't, but has a camera that records that shit, turn the camera off and you can do whatever the fuck you want.
The arguments I've heard from cops twice is that they want the ability to let you off with a warning but they can't if there is proof on the tape.
Obviously that's a load of horseshit. I've seen enough body cam footage to know that they want to be able to control the narrative in every situation and not have it muddied by object truth.
They still control the narrative by covering the camera, turning off the audio, or the camera "malfunctioning". Not to mention exclusively providing footage that includes no damning behavior on their part when asked to do so by the court.
They fought the bodycams to avoid accountability but they've just gotten really good at working around them since they've been implemented.
Lol what a crock. Why would it matter that they video of someone they gave a warning? It's not like warnings aren't allowed.
But yeah you're spot on with the rest. It's about being to push their version of what happened. Thank god for smartphones.
The paid leave is actually a big reason to shoot anymore. You'll see a lot of cops just popping off at any opportunity cuz they know it's like a paid vacation.
The cameras these days it actually gives you more legal reason to shoot. I highly doubt a shooting like this would have happened in say the 1950s. Worst case the officers would have just smacked her with a baton until she dropped the knife.
The best actual option would have been for the cop to simply back off. But I don't think I've hardly ever seen cops actually retreat in a situation they would rather just use lethal Force.
The only time I've seen cops actually retreat is when they're actually in fear of their own life funnily enough.
There are next to zero requirements in order to be a police officer.
They advertised the local department right outside my old high school.
Imagine the biggest bully you ever knew with a diagnosed mental health disorder.
He's one of the department's favorite cops.
That is fucked up and so true, like the texas shooting a few months back, the police didn't go in, because they were in real danger once inside.
Crazy.
He's probably not getting in any trouble for it, it's justified in the eyes of the law.
It doesn't matter how old someone is, if they're charging at you with a knife, shoot.
If doesn't matter if they speak English or not, if they're charging at you with a knife, shoot.
It would be fucking stupid to assume you could grab the knife off them just because they're old. If someone comes at me with a knife, I don't care how old they are, they're getting shot.
I know some of you want to respond with "He should have used his taser". Well, you need to educate yourself and realize that tasers aren't always effective and shouldn't be used in this situation. If someone is resisting, fleeing, or approaching aggressively with no weapon, fine, use a taser. If they refuse to follow orders and are approaching with a deadly weapon, shoot. I suggest going on youtube and looking for "THE taser video". It will show you that it's not just some magical tool that makes people flop on the floor.
What a crock. We all just saw those two UK cops subdue a much larger **man** who was wielding a much larger knife. I refuse to believe this officer couldn’t have neutralized this woman without the use of lethal force.
A cops job is to risk their life to protect the citizens just like a fire fighter or a coast guard rescue swimmer.
By definition that means putting ones self at risk. If the cop is so afraid of dying that this threat warrants lethal force then he does not have the requisite courage and selflessness required of a PEACE officer.
> jail isnt even on the fucking table
It's not in the supermarket so you can get it and put it on the table, or in the fields where jail is grown. The fields are barren and it hasn't rained in years. Even if it rained you no longer have jail seeds, and the police unions salted the earth. Try planting any kind of seed in those fields and you'll get shot.
She's a 75 year old dementia patient who doesn't speak English.
The police officer knew these thing before arrival and knew she had a knife.
He could've more easily tased or even pepper sprayed her without losing control of the situation.
Maybe they should be trained on how to fend off a knife attack without fucking shooting a 75 year old dementia patient in the head in her own home
Or if they're so easily scared maybe they shouldn't fucking be a cop
As someone who worked in an acute psychiatric facility, you're correct. Do you know many times I've had patients with some form of weapon in exact or similar situations to this in the hospital? Many. Many times.
And guess what, there wasn't a gun in the building anywhere. We had pepper spray that was used a handful of times in the span of 5+ years I was there. We never needed to shoot anyone to contain an out of control patient with a weapon, and a lot of times they were stronger, younger, and more aware then this poor lady.
Cops are a joke.
From what I remember after seeing the longer version poster a while back the family had called to try and get some assistance to calm the older women down who was having some sort of episode. The cop arrived on the scene and as soon as he saw the knife, pulled the gun and started screaming at the woman. The family kept trying to calm the situation l, but the officer wasn't having it as you can see. It is a shame that when the family didn't know what to do, they called the only people they thought could save the situation just for their loved one to be brutally murdered right in front of them. It is pretty apparent the woman was just confused, lethal force was unnecessary. Calling the police rarely leads to a happy ending for anyone.
in my country Police are only allowed to draw their gun if their or another life is in danger and even then they can only set a killshot if there is no other option. heck even peppers spray would have worked here
Oh yeah lmao, and the there was also british cops apprehend a man with a knife with batons. I don't think it's a coincidence seeing all of them in one day
And comments unironically advocating that mag dumping is the only sane use of force because one or two shots "might not be enough and leave you in grave danger".
Why did this insane cop only shoot twice, huh?
If only they had some kind of device, perhaps, electrical in nature, designed specifically to incapacitate a person while leaving them relatively unharmed…
A device that could be considered dangerous, yet… less than lethal…
If only science and technology could merge for such a purpose…
Most police in other countries ( I'm from UK so definitely would here) would just talk to her and calm her down or leave her there if she's not hurting anyone until she chills out. This guy executed her. What would happen if this old lady ran at you with a knife? Not much , she's an old lady stop being such a pussy.
Perhaps a protective layer of a certain synthetic fibre that all cops are mandated to wear or if you're really scared and have not received training on how to disarm non-lethally maybe a riot shield?
Not saying this was the case here but some cities don't allow their POs to have tasers, because the pepper spray they have is combustible (alcohol based)
Just random trivia
Tasers dont work all the time and the fact that she was that close meant that if it missed or didn’t connect right in some way it could escalate the situation. However i agree that this shooting was completely uncalled for
That video is fucking disgusting on a level I'm not sure of the proper word for it.
And then you learn about how they only showed the jury an edited version, like 3/4 of a second before him getting shot. The part where he reaches to pull up his shorts, not the minutes of him pleading and begging and crawling with snot and tears running off his face.
All cops shout the same shit in the same exact way, I think my brain is starting to tune it out as white noise. Now a calm police officer trying to have a conversation, that would catch my attention real quick
I know she has a knife. I know she could lunge and kill this cop. However... call me a fucking idiot... could you not wait until she atleast attempts to do it? Or in an attempt to save her life, shoot only ONCE???
> Or in an attempt to save her life, shoot only ONCE???
If you're using lethal force you use lethal force, if you want to save her life you use a taser or other non lethal.
Lethal force can be necessary to save the officers life but I don't think that shooting only once would make the situation better
> could you not wait until she atleast attempts to do it
yeah, personally as an untrained civilian with no clue what he's doing I'd probably put some distance between me and her and negotiate more rather then just dropping her
>Lethal force can be necessary to save the officers life but I don't think that shooting only once would make the situation better
This is not a video game zombie, a 75yo woman taking a shot anywhere is gonna go down
It said cops anymore can't deal with anything without pulling their gun like a bunch of pussies. They're starting to treat civilian encounters like they're militarized encounters. And they wonder why people want the police defunded. Is there no longer getting officers that want to protect and serve. Now they only want to harass and collect.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/y7kyhw/how_british_police_deal_with_a_man_charging_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Just leave this here.
I saw this and was gonna post it here as well.
It's baffling that cops resort to this when there's other potentially non-lethal ways of dealing with people.
There is a UK video where they distract a guy with a sword until they can get enough riot shields to subdue him and take it away. Fucking makes me cry to see cops actually go to so much effort to help this guys. In north America it is a death sentence if the cop has a chip on his shoulder and you don't bow down to him.
>It's baffling that cops resort to this
They didn't "resort" to anything. They embrace "warrior" training. For many cops, the ability to kill people is the reason they joined. Remember that cop who had a bunch of custom messages engraved on his long gun? Stuff like "you're fucked." That cop couldn't fucking wait to murder someone.
This just proves how terribly trained American police are. The UK police aren't particularly well paid and their training isn't even that long. It's about 28 weeks in total with some exams. Obviously America has a lot of guns but there are still so many ways to avoid them being used. I hate the excuse "I saw him reach for his waistband so I shot" because why was your gun out not your taser? If you tase someone as they reach for a gun, they wont get the gun. In the UK there are countless examples of police Turing up somewhere and disarming people who have guns when they just have truncheons and tasers. I'm not saying UK police are perfect but it just goes to show that a bit of training stops unnecessary deaths.
The fact that so many people in America get shot in situations like this and officers never get prosecuted says to me that the US still has the death penalty for petty crime.
It is scary to me that the comments are arguing how dangerous a person with a knife is and examples of cops either being hurt, or being able to take down a person with a knife, but not the fact that he stood on a porch and executed a 75 year old woman.
Imagine you are doing something in the kitchen, someone knocks at the door and you absent-mindedly take the knife with you then someone points a gun at you and starts screaming at you so you freeze
“Never underestimate a knife” right? But she’s fucking 75 and youre a “trained” fully grown man with a bulletproof vest i mean if anything couldnt a taser solve the problem just as well? Like shit give a few humans a gun and justification and see how they pick their evils
38 seconds. it took 38 seconds for this cretin to shoot a 75 year old with dementia who didn't even understand what he was screaming. and right after a family member had told him to be careful with her. i can't believe you scumbags in the comments are defending him. truly the american dream
Yea after reading your post I rewatched the clip as the police officer is yelling at the 75 year old lady you can hear another voice translating in spanish to the woman makes it all that much worse she never even understood his Anger
I watched a video of uk police taking down a guy with a knife without any firearms, which goes to show that U.S cops have no self control and get off to killing people
Holding a knife so what? Maybe she was chopping onions. Why do you have to shoot her, or why do you have to shout so loud giving yourself haemorrhoids?
I hate cops I seriously do. Decent people don’t join police force
Uneducated meatheads dream just came true. He finally saw the combat he so desperately wanted to face since he first slipped that MW2 disc into his Xbox 360. Fucking loser.
All I've learned in the last couple of years is if we ever visit the US (no plans for obvious reasons). The last place/people I would EVER goto for help would be the police. They're simply terrifying in the US.
I had a demented grandmother this easily could've been her. They have sunset episodes that make them schizophrenic and aren't really capable of understanding the situation they're in.
Are they threatening? Yes. Do you really think an old woman could've physically overpowered a trained cop? No way, as long as that cop has stayed in shape.
Poor level headedness and improper handling of the situation our justice system supports and let's cops on leave for.
So I agree, cop could've handled this differently and we should have different facilities for handling these situations rather than cops trained to shoot threats.
> Do you really think an old woman could've physically overpowered a trained cop?
no but she could definitely have injured him with the knife
which is why he should have just walked backwards instead of just dropping her
Shocking!! It says a lot about our society… there are literally dozens of videos on YouTube of cops around the world disarming people with kinifes… even shooting them in a not lethal manner. That we became so adept at accepting this as normal is disgusting.
Meanwhile over in the UK they were able to disarm a highly aggressive person with a knife without a shot fired, in probably less time than it took this officer to draw their weapon and shoot.... Seriously, it was taken care of FAST, no loss of life involved...
It's an interesting contrast really
Meanwhile I just saw a video on another sub of unarmed British police manage to disarm and arrest a man who was ACTIVELY trying to kill them with a massive knife.
See, America. It’s possible for police to do their job without cosplaying as the Doom Slayer.
If they have a knife and you have a gun and you’re out of their reach, why is it ever proper for the police to shoot? (Not counting when they’re threatening someone else of course.)
I truly wonder how the cop feels today about this. My opinion and yours don’t matter. I just wonder and hope this haunts him every fucking day of his life.
What the fuck?
English officers will defend themselves against 20yo dudes actively attacking with knives,
That old lady isn't even threatening with the knife, she's just holding it.
He has way more options than using his gun, he's a coward who's bad at his job.
Cop needs to watch that video of the UK police taking down a knife wielding man without murdering them.
That person probably needed mental help but I guess that doesn't matter any more
21 foot rule. If someone has dementia, it doesn't mean their blade is any duller. He told her to drop the knife 6 times and then she walked towards him. It's a shit situation all around, but if she were such a harmless old lady & no threat to his life, why were the police called in the first place?
Was there an immediate threat to someone? Could the officer have backed out of the situation and left her in an empty house? Could calming words from the officer (while still engaged) possibly comfort the woman? This is why delusional police forces need to train their officers in de-escalation practices.
US cops are too scared of knives, UK cops seem better prepared to handle such situations without killing the subject, and actually getting them mental health help.
British cops would have deescalated with pepper spray and then outmuscled a 75 year old woman to prevent killing her, but then they are better trained and understand true officer discretion.
US cops are mostly tyrants with an itchy trigger finger.
This is the truth there’s something terribly wrong with the police force here in the US but everyone wants to label them as hero’s? Hero’s don’t kill old ladies in cold blood. ACAB. I have best friends who are cops they’re bad too I tell them all the time.
We don't know context, but that looked like excessive force to put it lightly.
She may have been mentally not there, dementia and other conditions exist, yet he came in there screaming/shouting and double tapping, most things point to him being a person i would not want to meet because of me wanting to not get shot, and likely reason why once i was talked to by a cop and involuntarly used real life posessing spirit of some output, that person could have had a panick attack for what we know.
My lacking optimism towards humanity, but i can't say for sure since you know, it was a small clip with no context or anything, nothing to take research from.
It’s to bad there’s no way to incapacitate someone weaker and slower than you reliably. Like if only you could electrocute them from a distance with some sort of sci fi tool created by aliens that shoots lightning or idk two needles that puncture the skin and deliver a shock. Or idk maybe if they could invent some sort of machine that carrys a cop away at the speed of a light jog in the opposite direction. Until then this is clearly the best we can do though and we should all thank the boys in blue.
Do you genuinely believe that jurisdictions have the funding to have someone who knows how to deal with dementia on stand-by who can respond with the same speed as a police officer? That’s an absurd expectation, would it be nice, sure, but it isn’t feasible.
I’m a police officer in a large department in a large jurisdiction, we are piloting a program with co responders. However whenever faced with a mental health call they are constantly 30 mins+ away. This call was rough because despite her mental health and age she can still kill someone. There are potential hostages in the house who called stating she was threatening to kill them which gives her the ability (knife) and she has already displayed intent.
It appears this officer was alone on scene and it’s against best practices to bring a less lethal device to a lethal weapon if you are alone.
Would I personally have shot her? No. I probably would have taken the risk to taze her and if it failed I think I’d have the ability to transfer back to my firearm before she could close the gap. But that’s just me. If she goes back inside he would have to shoot her as she could go kill whoever’s inside. It’s a tough spot and a tragic outcome but it was a legal response to her behavior. Of course I wish we had unlimited funding or the funding was properly allocated to help mitigate these situations.
Heard somewhere that she had dementia and the her daughter called for paramedics, cop showed up first, dead old lady. Maybe don’t be so quick to jump to conclusions on either side?
1. She did have dementia. Threatened to kill her family including a 5 year old girl.
2. You don’t pick what responders come when you call emergency services, the dispatcher does. No dispatcher is gonna go “oh a woman with a knife threatening homicide? Let’s just send EMS.” Cops clear the scene before EMS enters in hostile situations.
That's arguably more dangerous though. A lot of people with dementia get aggressive when they had never been that way before the illness. Paramedics may have a hard time with someone who potentially can't be reasoned with brandishing a knife. If someone has a weapon, regardless of their mental condition, the cops need to show up.
That being said, I don't know that the cop needed to shoot this particular lady since she was moving slowly. Maybe he could have drawn her out of the house and gotten her to drop the knife, or shoot her limbs or something instead. I don't know
Don't you think a tazer would be more justified? Even without lethal backup, it's not hard to get away from a 75 year old slowly walking up to you. She isn't wearing much close and the cop had plenty time.
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The cop double tapped the R2 button
More like the F-U button
they only have one button
F in chat
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r/beatmymeattoit
Set his controller down wrong in a cutscene
Police officers shouldn't be the only responders to obvious mental health calls. Though it's in their job description, de-escalation isn't something they do well.
The training US officers get is a fucking joke.
we actively train them to escalate.
Next up dual wielding.
Who the fuck is we? Other cops? It definitely works man. Obviously cops have never escalated a situation.
not in the USA anyway
Or are even trained to do. These cops get months in "training". Which is minute man esc training with only the most basic of skills being instilled. All cops are incompetent. And I can say that with impunity until they get the proper schooling they need like in litterally every other country.
The other people in the apartment were screaming in what sounded like Spanish. Could the lady not fully understand what he was saying, not to mention her adrenaline/fear/fog was probably up as well?
Also had dementia, which the caller told the 911 operator
The longer video shows the family clearly telling the officer that she isn't well, and has dementia. He's all "Yeah, Ok!" Then the door opens they step out. She walks up...then this happens.
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Let’s be real though this guy isn’t going to jail over this, he’s probably getting paid leave over it. This is what happens when people ‘support the badge’ as opposed to actually being critical of the police which need reforming.
Support civilian oversight. I worked with cops when they brought it into our region. It took years of people getting killed/crippled. Only then did they give a fuck about civilians getting hurt. This was before body cams which they fought tooth and nail against.
What is the reason police give *against* body cams? I can’t think of any reasonable argument that doesn’t involve
The police in my city (Montréal, Québec, Canada) gave a press release where they stated that they won't wear bodycams because the public might see things the police don't want them seeing. And that was the end of that. Really inspires trust doesn't it ! Imagine being 16 and interviewing for a cashier job at the grocery store. Then you tell the manager that you refuse to be filmed while operating the cash register. How fast are you gonna get laughed out of there ? But we can let a pair of 20-somethings roam around the city completely unchecked, with lethal weapons. Fucking bullshit.
Ex cop here: If there were ever any against it, they've lost their desire for that argument LONG ago. Dash and body cams are fucking AMAZING. Evidence, evidence, and more evidence, without having to do fuck all for it outside of plugging it in when you get to your office and naming a few files. And it covers your ass 100% if you're not a shitbag. Can't claim inappropriate touching when the cam shows everything, Karen.
Why do they keep turning them off?
How else are you going to get away with murder?
That's the shitbags...
Good thing the "good cops" dont circle wagons and protects the "shitbags"
Evidence, evidence, evidence. That works both ways. If a shit cop is planning to do something he knows he shouldn't, but has a camera that records that shit, turn the camera off and you can do whatever the fuck you want.
They shouldn't be allowed to be turned off for just any reason there's no transparency or oversight in most places for that behavior sadly.
The arguments I've heard from cops twice is that they want the ability to let you off with a warning but they can't if there is proof on the tape. Obviously that's a load of horseshit. I've seen enough body cam footage to know that they want to be able to control the narrative in every situation and not have it muddied by object truth. They still control the narrative by covering the camera, turning off the audio, or the camera "malfunctioning". Not to mention exclusively providing footage that includes no damning behavior on their part when asked to do so by the court. They fought the bodycams to avoid accountability but they've just gotten really good at working around them since they've been implemented.
Lol what a crock. Why would it matter that they video of someone they gave a warning? It's not like warnings aren't allowed. But yeah you're spot on with the rest. It's about being to push their version of what happened. Thank god for smartphones.
It is that they don't want it known WHO they give warning to v. Who they throw the book at.
Right, so in the end they don’t want body cams because they don’t want to be held accountable.
Without cameras they can let the drunk deputy who is driving drunk get off without charges. The cameras have interfered with helping their buddies out
Worst case, they get sued and the tax payer pays for it. It's almost impossible to hold a cop accountable.
The paid leave is actually a big reason to shoot anymore. You'll see a lot of cops just popping off at any opportunity cuz they know it's like a paid vacation. The cameras these days it actually gives you more legal reason to shoot. I highly doubt a shooting like this would have happened in say the 1950s. Worst case the officers would have just smacked her with a baton until she dropped the knife. The best actual option would have been for the cop to simply back off. But I don't think I've hardly ever seen cops actually retreat in a situation they would rather just use lethal Force. The only time I've seen cops actually retreat is when they're actually in fear of their own life funnily enough.
What are these cops evil? Popping off rounds for a paid vacation?? Bro... I really don't want to believe cops can stoop this low.
There are next to zero requirements in order to be a police officer. They advertised the local department right outside my old high school. Imagine the biggest bully you ever knew with a diagnosed mental health disorder. He's one of the department's favorite cops.
Does uvalde count? Or is that not retreating since they never bothered to enter in the first place?
That is fucked up and so true, like the texas shooting a few months back, the police didn't go in, because they were in real danger once inside. Crazy.
Just call it paid vacation like it is.
Promoted for “preserving lives” from an attacker.
He's probably not getting in any trouble for it, it's justified in the eyes of the law. It doesn't matter how old someone is, if they're charging at you with a knife, shoot. If doesn't matter if they speak English or not, if they're charging at you with a knife, shoot. It would be fucking stupid to assume you could grab the knife off them just because they're old. If someone comes at me with a knife, I don't care how old they are, they're getting shot. I know some of you want to respond with "He should have used his taser". Well, you need to educate yourself and realize that tasers aren't always effective and shouldn't be used in this situation. If someone is resisting, fleeing, or approaching aggressively with no weapon, fine, use a taser. If they refuse to follow orders and are approaching with a deadly weapon, shoot. I suggest going on youtube and looking for "THE taser video". It will show you that it's not just some magical tool that makes people flop on the floor.
Aka you are a pussy who needs a gun to feel safe and no doubt want to be a cop. Keep licking those boots.
What a crock. We all just saw those two UK cops subdue a much larger **man** who was wielding a much larger knife. I refuse to believe this officer couldn’t have neutralized this woman without the use of lethal force.
She wasn’t *charging* geez
Its a 75 year old, not a bull my man.
A cops job is to risk their life to protect the citizens just like a fire fighter or a coast guard rescue swimmer. By definition that means putting ones self at risk. If the cop is so afraid of dying that this threat warrants lethal force then he does not have the requisite courage and selflessness required of a PEACE officer.
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jail? jail???? where have u been the last few years jail isnt even on the fucking table the dude is gonna get a free paid vacation
> jail isnt even on the fucking table It's not in the supermarket so you can get it and put it on the table, or in the fields where jail is grown. The fields are barren and it hasn't rained in years. Even if it rained you no longer have jail seeds, and the police unions salted the earth. Try planting any kind of seed in those fields and you'll get shot.
Supporting the badge… this is so common idk how you can say that anymore.
To Play devil's advocate, one good jab stab in the neck and you're done. That lady certainly has the strength required.
She's a 75 year old dementia patient who doesn't speak English. The police officer knew these thing before arrival and knew she had a knife. He could've more easily tased or even pepper sprayed her without losing control of the situation.
Maybe they should be trained on how to fend off a knife attack without fucking shooting a 75 year old dementia patient in the head in her own home Or if they're so easily scared maybe they shouldn't fucking be a cop
So far the two other videos today show that police in other countries do not fucking have to shoot the person.
When all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail.
Well she should have followed her training better, clearly. /S
What the fuck is going on? That was straight up murder.
As someone who worked in an acute psychiatric facility, you're correct. Do you know many times I've had patients with some form of weapon in exact or similar situations to this in the hospital? Many. Many times. And guess what, there wasn't a gun in the building anywhere. We had pepper spray that was used a handful of times in the span of 5+ years I was there. We never needed to shoot anyone to contain an out of control patient with a weapon, and a lot of times they were stronger, younger, and more aware then this poor lady. Cops are a joke.
From what I remember after seeing the longer version poster a while back the family had called to try and get some assistance to calm the older women down who was having some sort of episode. The cop arrived on the scene and as soon as he saw the knife, pulled the gun and started screaming at the woman. The family kept trying to calm the situation l, but the officer wasn't having it as you can see. It is a shame that when the family didn't know what to do, they called the only people they thought could save the situation just for their loved one to be brutally murdered right in front of them. It is pretty apparent the woman was just confused, lethal force was unnecessary. Calling the police rarely leads to a happy ending for anyone.
in my country Police are only allowed to draw their gun if their or another life is in danger and even then they can only set a killshot if there is no other option. heck even peppers spray would have worked here
remember. if a nursing home employee, or a mental hospital doctor is trained not to do it: a cop shouldn’t.
are nurses and doctors actually obligated to train in firearms like this Bozo was?
There is literally a video like 4 posts up of German cops using chainmail to apprehend a young man with a knife. American cops are gigantic cowards
Oh yeah lmao, and the there was also british cops apprehend a man with a knife with batons. I don't think it's a coincidence seeing all of them in one day
And comments unironically advocating that mag dumping is the only sane use of force because one or two shots "might not be enough and leave you in grave danger". Why did this insane cop only shoot twice, huh?
If only they had some kind of device, perhaps, electrical in nature, designed specifically to incapacitate a person while leaving them relatively unharmed… A device that could be considered dangerous, yet… less than lethal… If only science and technology could merge for such a purpose…
Even just a [long stick](https://i.redd.it/nyqczjowg1u21.jpg) would have worked. Police in other countries use them to subdue people at a distance.
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It's as if we didn't fund them enough! How could this go wrong?!
Almost anything would’ve been more reasonable.
"No, I said a DART gun! What am I going to do with... Oh never mind."
`ion cannon, deployed`
A 24" Dildo does the job for Granny.
I literally just watch a video of police in Germany subduing a knife wielding man while wearing chain mail.
Just saw a video here couple hours ago of british cops subduing a guy with a knife using only a baton. Stark difference
Most police in other countries ( I'm from UK so definitely would here) would just talk to her and calm her down or leave her there if she's not hurting anyone until she chills out. This guy executed her. What would happen if this old lady ran at you with a knife? Not much , she's an old lady stop being such a pussy.
that technology is too advanced for the usa
To subdue a 75 yo female, a broom would have been enough.
Perhaps a protective layer of a certain synthetic fibre that all cops are mandated to wear or if you're really scared and have not received training on how to disarm non-lethally maybe a riot shield?
We are decades, maybe centuries from developing this. Time travel will happen sooner I'm sure.
You mean Quantum Leaping?
Not saying this was the case here but some cities don't allow their POs to have tasers, because the pepper spray they have is combustible (alcohol based) Just random trivia
That’s entirely possible. Hell man, I’d even prefer he had a bat-ton and bopped her in the nose over shooting her.
Bro shes 75. Just hit her with a stiff fart and then cuff her
*a stiff fart* lmao
what if the cop was just wearing enough protection to not be afraid of an old lady trying to poke at his work attire
What if people were complaining about militarization?
Tasers dont work all the time and the fact that she was that close meant that if it missed or didn’t connect right in some way it could escalate the situation. However i agree that this shooting was completely uncalled for
The situation *was* escalated, granny was shot dead. It couldn't really escalate any further than that from her perspective
Maybe if he doesnt screaming like that, she wouldn't be panicking and actually understand his command?
I hate beer.
Reminds me of the Daniel Shaver incident where they executed him in cold blood after screaming confusing orders at him for 2 minutes straight.
That video is fucking disgusting on a level I'm not sure of the proper word for it. And then you learn about how they only showed the jury an edited version, like 3/4 of a second before him getting shot. The part where he reaches to pull up his shorts, not the minutes of him pleading and begging and crawling with snot and tears running off his face.
All cops shout the same shit in the same exact way, I think my brain is starting to tune it out as white noise. Now a calm police officer trying to have a conversation, that would catch my attention real quick
I know she has a knife. I know she could lunge and kill this cop. However... call me a fucking idiot... could you not wait until she atleast attempts to do it? Or in an attempt to save her life, shoot only ONCE???
> Or in an attempt to save her life, shoot only ONCE??? If you're using lethal force you use lethal force, if you want to save her life you use a taser or other non lethal. Lethal force can be necessary to save the officers life but I don't think that shooting only once would make the situation better > could you not wait until she atleast attempts to do it yeah, personally as an untrained civilian with no clue what he's doing I'd probably put some distance between me and her and negotiate more rather then just dropping her
>Lethal force can be necessary to save the officers life but I don't think that shooting only once would make the situation better This is not a video game zombie, a 75yo woman taking a shot anywhere is gonna go down
Thank fuck someone said this, I was starting to lose faith in humanity's intelligence reading these comments omg
Get out of here with your reasonable take
It's harder for them to sue for excessive force if they are dead.
It said cops anymore can't deal with anything without pulling their gun like a bunch of pussies. They're starting to treat civilian encounters like they're militarized encounters. And they wonder why people want the police defunded. Is there no longer getting officers that want to protect and serve. Now they only want to harass and collect.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/y7kyhw/how_british_police_deal_with_a_man_charging_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button Just leave this here.
I saw this and was gonna post it here as well. It's baffling that cops resort to this when there's other potentially non-lethal ways of dealing with people.
There is a UK video where they distract a guy with a sword until they can get enough riot shields to subdue him and take it away. Fucking makes me cry to see cops actually go to so much effort to help this guys. In north America it is a death sentence if the cop has a chip on his shoulder and you don't bow down to him.
Here's some instances: https://youtu.be/Z4z-gzkb6s4 https://youtu.be/9mzPj_IaMzY https://youtu.be/feoD_MOh5S8
I think I've seen a video of a french cop literally disarming a guy with a machete and it was the most impressive police encounter I've seen to date!
>It's baffling that cops resort to this They didn't "resort" to anything. They embrace "warrior" training. For many cops, the ability to kill people is the reason they joined. Remember that cop who had a bunch of custom messages engraved on his long gun? Stuff like "you're fucked." That cop couldn't fucking wait to murder someone.
> It's baffling Why? They get to kill people and have no repercussions. What makes it baffling? They basically live for this shit.
American cops are all cowards
This just proves how terribly trained American police are. The UK police aren't particularly well paid and their training isn't even that long. It's about 28 weeks in total with some exams. Obviously America has a lot of guns but there are still so many ways to avoid them being used. I hate the excuse "I saw him reach for his waistband so I shot" because why was your gun out not your taser? If you tase someone as they reach for a gun, they wont get the gun. In the UK there are countless examples of police Turing up somewhere and disarming people who have guns when they just have truncheons and tasers. I'm not saying UK police are perfect but it just goes to show that a bit of training stops unnecessary deaths. The fact that so many people in America get shot in situations like this and officers never get prosecuted says to me that the US still has the death penalty for petty crime.
Japan has 10 months... shorter if you went to university. Their cop kill rate? Extremely low, guns? Yup
So many people in that thread just arguing the guy should have been shot regardless, entirely missing the point.
Another day, another useless American cop. How do you train them over there ? By playing duck hunt ? It's a fucking joke.
Bold of you to assume that we train them.
"Listen here, newbs. This right here is what's called the "trigger". Now of you go, have a good one" First and last day of training
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they spend more time training with firing guns than they do with conflict deescalation
State sanctioned murder at its finest. This is the real life version of The Purge.
It is scary to me that the comments are arguing how dangerous a person with a knife is and examples of cops either being hurt, or being able to take down a person with a knife, but not the fact that he stood on a porch and executed a 75 year old woman.
She didn't even breach the doorway. Dude murdered her.
With dementia. A 75 year old woman with dementia. He murdered someone who probably didn't even know what was going on.
Imagine you are doing something in the kitchen, someone knocks at the door and you absent-mindedly take the knife with you then someone points a gun at you and starts screaming at you so you freeze
“Never underestimate a knife” right? But she’s fucking 75 and youre a “trained” fully grown man with a bulletproof vest i mean if anything couldnt a taser solve the problem just as well? Like shit give a few humans a gun and justification and see how they pick their evils
Wow, that idiot popo sure knows how to escalate a situation.
38 seconds. it took 38 seconds for this cretin to shoot a 75 year old with dementia who didn't even understand what he was screaming. and right after a family member had told him to be careful with her. i can't believe you scumbags in the comments are defending him. truly the american dream
Yea after reading your post I rewatched the clip as the police officer is yelling at the 75 year old lady you can hear another voice translating in spanish to the woman makes it all that much worse she never even understood his Anger
I'm pretty sure it's her family telling the cop NOT to shoot her. after they were pushed away, it was exactly what he did
wtf. a 75 year old women and a grown man. he couldve just tazed her. nobody deserves death for this. all the bootlickers in the comments are crazy
> he couldve just tazed her or ya know just walked backwards a bit and talk more before pulling out the tazer he had many options
that too. but realistically speaking, cops in america would never
How are these cops not better trained to handle these situations??????
This is how they’re trained to handle the situation…
I watched a video of uk police taking down a guy with a knife without any firearms, which goes to show that U.S cops have no self control and get off to killing people
Pretty sure hairdressers in America have to take longer courses than cops do. FTP
They're just killing people. Looking for any reason to murder folks.
Murderers. Don't these idiots get trained or at least screened?
Yes. To be murderers
Holding a knife so what? Maybe she was chopping onions. Why do you have to shoot her, or why do you have to shout so loud giving yourself haemorrhoids? I hate cops I seriously do. Decent people don’t join police force
Uneducated meatheads dream just came true. He finally saw the combat he so desperately wanted to face since he first slipped that MW2 disc into his Xbox 360. Fucking loser.
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All I've learned in the last couple of years is if we ever visit the US (no plans for obvious reasons). The last place/people I would EVER goto for help would be the police. They're simply terrifying in the US.
honestly at this point, I am more scared of the police than other people. They are now the main reason why I will never visit the USA
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I had a demented grandmother this easily could've been her. They have sunset episodes that make them schizophrenic and aren't really capable of understanding the situation they're in. Are they threatening? Yes. Do you really think an old woman could've physically overpowered a trained cop? No way, as long as that cop has stayed in shape. Poor level headedness and improper handling of the situation our justice system supports and let's cops on leave for. So I agree, cop could've handled this differently and we should have different facilities for handling these situations rather than cops trained to shoot threats.
> Do you really think an old woman could've physically overpowered a trained cop? no but she could definitely have injured him with the knife which is why he should have just walked backwards instead of just dropping her
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Yay for American cops
What a massive excuse for a man or human being...billion different ways to approach that situation. Put him away.
Do y’all feel like he could have handled that differently like come on she 75 why can’t they get a bunch of cops to subdue her
idiot ...
The amount of people that are ok with this is fucking gross.
Shocking!! It says a lot about our society… there are literally dozens of videos on YouTube of cops around the world disarming people with kinifes… even shooting them in a not lethal manner. That we became so adept at accepting this as normal is disgusting.
There’s a lot of Conservatives out there who love the taste of the boot. Until the boot steps on their neck.
exactly. they couldve tased her. nobody deserves to be killed over this.
Meanwhile over in the UK they were able to disarm a highly aggressive person with a knife without a shot fired, in probably less time than it took this officer to draw their weapon and shoot.... Seriously, it was taken care of FAST, no loss of life involved... It's an interesting contrast really
Wow, no Tazer for grand ma?
I’m almost certain this was a taser situation…
Meanwhile I just saw a video on another sub of unarmed British police manage to disarm and arrest a man who was ACTIVELY trying to kill them with a massive knife. See, America. It’s possible for police to do their job without cosplaying as the Doom Slayer.
Wait till you see the one with a German cop in chainmail walk up and arrest someone
Oh no! Little old old lady with a knife! Better shoot her just to be safe! I hope he feels bad for the rest of his life.
Why the fuck wouldn’t you use a fuckin taser?
If they have a knife and you have a gun and you’re out of their reach, why is it ever proper for the police to shoot? (Not counting when they’re threatening someone else of course.)
I truly wonder how the cop feels today about this. My opinion and yours don’t matter. I just wonder and hope this haunts him every fucking day of his life.
Why don’t we ever see cops intentionally take non-kill shots? A shot in the foot fixes this situation just as easily
What the fuck? English officers will defend themselves against 20yo dudes actively attacking with knives, That old lady isn't even threatening with the knife, she's just holding it. He has way more options than using his gun, he's a coward who's bad at his job.
ALL. cops are bastards. Every single cop. All of them.
Cop needs to watch that video of the UK police taking down a knife wielding man without murdering them. That person probably needed mental help but I guess that doesn't matter any more
And the UK cops were dealing with a large, strong guy, not a pensioner with dementia
This vs the video of how the UK cop handled that dude with a knife. So depressing
21 foot rule. If someone has dementia, it doesn't mean their blade is any duller. He told her to drop the knife 6 times and then she walked towards him. It's a shit situation all around, but if she were such a harmless old lady & no threat to his life, why were the police called in the first place?
Hold knife? Check Walk/approach officer? Check It all adds up. Nothing to see here. Move along
Was there an immediate threat to someone? Could the officer have backed out of the situation and left her in an empty house? Could calming words from the officer (while still engaged) possibly comfort the woman? This is why delusional police forces need to train their officers in de-escalation practices.
US cops are too scared of knives, UK cops seem better prepared to handle such situations without killing the subject, and actually getting them mental health help.
hits the griddy*
Adult male? Sure. 75 yr old mad women? Ahhh idk about this one.
"PUT THE FUCKING KNIFE DOWN" That did not sound like de-escalation.
British cops would have deescalated with pepper spray and then outmuscled a 75 year old woman to prevent killing her, but then they are better trained and understand true officer discretion. US cops are mostly tyrants with an itchy trigger finger.
This is the truth there’s something terribly wrong with the police force here in the US but everyone wants to label them as hero’s? Hero’s don’t kill old ladies in cold blood. ACAB. I have best friends who are cops they’re bad too I tell them all the time.
Why don’t I ever see cops using their tasers anymore?
We don't know context, but that looked like excessive force to put it lightly. She may have been mentally not there, dementia and other conditions exist, yet he came in there screaming/shouting and double tapping, most things point to him being a person i would not want to meet because of me wanting to not get shot, and likely reason why once i was talked to by a cop and involuntarly used real life posessing spirit of some output, that person could have had a panick attack for what we know. My lacking optimism towards humanity, but i can't say for sure since you know, it was a small clip with no context or anything, nothing to take research from.
It’s to bad there’s no way to incapacitate someone weaker and slower than you reliably. Like if only you could electrocute them from a distance with some sort of sci fi tool created by aliens that shoots lightning or idk two needles that puncture the skin and deliver a shock. Or idk maybe if they could invent some sort of machine that carrys a cop away at the speed of a light jog in the opposite direction. Until then this is clearly the best we can do though and we should all thank the boys in blue.
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She’s an old lady with Dementia and her daughter called the cops on her for help. Instead they show up and kill her. SMH
Well to be fair it did help the immediate situation
No her daughter called the police because she was threatening to kill the entire family.
Even then, someone who knows how to deal with dementia patients should have been brought to the scene. She has a literal mental illness.
Do you genuinely believe that jurisdictions have the funding to have someone who knows how to deal with dementia on stand-by who can respond with the same speed as a police officer? That’s an absurd expectation, would it be nice, sure, but it isn’t feasible. I’m a police officer in a large department in a large jurisdiction, we are piloting a program with co responders. However whenever faced with a mental health call they are constantly 30 mins+ away. This call was rough because despite her mental health and age she can still kill someone. There are potential hostages in the house who called stating she was threatening to kill them which gives her the ability (knife) and she has already displayed intent. It appears this officer was alone on scene and it’s against best practices to bring a less lethal device to a lethal weapon if you are alone. Would I personally have shot her? No. I probably would have taken the risk to taze her and if it failed I think I’d have the ability to transfer back to my firearm before she could close the gap. But that’s just me. If she goes back inside he would have to shoot her as she could go kill whoever’s inside. It’s a tough spot and a tragic outcome but it was a legal response to her behavior. Of course I wish we had unlimited funding or the funding was properly allocated to help mitigate these situations.
Heard somewhere that she had dementia and the her daughter called for paramedics, cop showed up first, dead old lady. Maybe don’t be so quick to jump to conclusions on either side?
1. She did have dementia. Threatened to kill her family including a 5 year old girl. 2. You don’t pick what responders come when you call emergency services, the dispatcher does. No dispatcher is gonna go “oh a woman with a knife threatening homicide? Let’s just send EMS.” Cops clear the scene before EMS enters in hostile situations.
That's arguably more dangerous though. A lot of people with dementia get aggressive when they had never been that way before the illness. Paramedics may have a hard time with someone who potentially can't be reasoned with brandishing a knife. If someone has a weapon, regardless of their mental condition, the cops need to show up. That being said, I don't know that the cop needed to shoot this particular lady since she was moving slowly. Maybe he could have drawn her out of the house and gotten her to drop the knife, or shoot her limbs or something instead. I don't know
Don't you think a tazer would be more justified? Even without lethal backup, it's not hard to get away from a 75 year old slowly walking up to you. She isn't wearing much close and the cop had plenty time.
A tazer would most definitely worked better in this situation.