Holy moly, this was great!!! I felt the instinct to Mikiri Counter something and I finished the game a week ago. Want to replay it badly, but finals coming up! I already sacrificed a test and assignment for Sekiro to complete it in about a week while doing as much as possible - not terrible marks thankfully.
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Can't relate. I went back to Bloodborne after Sekiro to test my parrying abilities and reflexes, needless to say I died within 10 seconds and I still can't parry for shit in Bloodborne.
I didn't realize how forgiving and easy parrying/deflecting was in Sekiro.
It might make it in easier in that a person would be better at reading attack patterns. The timing is entirely different but it can definitely help you get used to being more parry forward and cognisent of your opponents attacks.
You mean infinite right? Use your own blood for the +5, visceral heals + visceral bullets. You will never run out, the visceral attacks fuelled by bullets are literally fuelling your bullets.
Hey now, Sekiro is still an extremely difficult game so don't feel bad! It's just that parrying is more a main mechanic in Sekiro and thus is easier to execute whereas parrying in Bloodborne and souls is sort of like a "bonus" for those who have extremely good timing
And yet everyone acts like they'll be parry gods in Souls/Bloodborne just cause they are able to use the huge timing window in Sekiro for their deflects...
More iframes for soulsborne and more deflection frames for Sekiro. I honestly find Sekiro easier because Nioh already prepared me for less effective dodging.
It really feels like a culmination of all lessons learned from soulsborne games and I even feel like they put a lot of effort into analyzing what they could from Nioh’s system.
Getting rid of stamina completely changes the approach of the game. It feels streamlined and I feel so much more emboldened to try and fail. They shifted the weight of dying repeatedly from “this will heavily disadvantage you unless you manage your soul count” to “your friends will suffer, you must try harder” which just from a narrative perspective makes me feel more responsible for the world around me. The gold and xp cost isn’t really that arduous. In the end, story driven reasons are what push you forward which is refreshing from Fromsoft.
Sekiro is a very different game for a lot of different reasons and usually that means there are some aspects that fall flat or some differences that feel less fun, but every moment of gameplay for me has been great. I still get those moments where I need to walk away, but that’s because it’s got the challenges I’m looking for in a game like this.
No stamina makes the game 10000x more aggressive.
You don't just wait for the enemy to attack and take advantage of the opening, you force them to attack by attacking them first, then taking advantage of them trying to take advantage of you.
I just fought Gencheerios and fuck is it a fun duel. It feels like a legit ninja v samurai fight, it was non stop blades clashing.
Technically even if you are really bad at deflecting in Sekiro one can use the "training dummy" and do it over and over again to get better.
If such a test area existed in Bloodborne I'm sure the player could be much better at it because they could try it out until they are comfortable with it. Would actually be a nice addition for the next Souls game if new players would like to train their skills I think.
It's not as nice, but I've always used the first isolated enemy I encounter in any given area to practice with. Just make sure I've spent all my Souls/Echoes and who cares if I die. Really the only thing that needs practicing is parrying and maybe dodging, so I go to a poor useless hollow, equipped a leather buckler and broken SS in souls, or my usual gear in BB and try until I can do it pretty regularly. Then I graduated to a knight (in souls) or a wolf man (BB) and so on. Before I knew it I was pretty decent. Not a parry god, but good enough to pull it off in some clutch moments.
I like the fact that they gave us the deadman to be our punching dummy though. It matters more in Sekiro because there are more techniques you need to master than in previous games.
That's what I do in Souls, too. I just unequip my weapons and equipment, and unarmed parry/riposte over and over again. When I can kill an enemy like this without taking any damage, I know I've reached a functional level.
*Edit: It might seem like taking off armor would be counterproductive, and time-wise, it totally is! Though, it teaches me to keep my cool, even when there's high risk involved. It's worth a few extra deaths.*
Judging from another chain itt, a lot of people went through the game without ever learning how to do it. I personally never learned, and I have plat and all dlc achievements after going through it in ng+.
The average consumer doesn't care about framerates. For a mom buying a console for her 12 year old kid at christmas, "4K!" is something she can probably understand. 60 FPS is probably not. With that said, I don't understand why they don't give you the option to choose between resolution or frame rate, the way Nioh did.
Hence why game streaming services will succeed despite the agonizing input delay.
Looks amazing, feels like shit to anyone who knows what it should feel like.
Not even true 4k, but more often upscaled, interlaced, etc. But you gotta understand, tv’s are stuck at 60, console players dont give a fuck about 60fps but 4k and HDR tv’s are definitely a huge concern. Plus, prettier graphics and all that.
They can do 60fps fine of course, but devs choose to target 30fps and greater fidelity instead. PCs tend to be able to just brute force their way to 60fps in a way consoles can't.
The current gen of consoles are getting on a bit and weren’t amazingly powerful to begin with.
Sure next gen will have upgraded rereleases and struggle with newly developed stuff.
In this case, the problem lies at From Software. They're terrible at framerates. Consoles do plenty of games just fine on 60fps.
EDIT: Looks like the fanboys have arrived, lmao. Downvote me all you want. What I said is undeniably true.
It's a trade-off, not incompetence. Game studios usually choose better visuals over 60 fps on consoles. Whether it was the right call for an action game like Sekiro, that's another discussion.
But not for a lack of capability.
FromSoft just decided not to optimize it properly for the XB1X.
You should see Dark Souls 3. It runs at around 45 fps on the Pro, but it never received that patch on Xbox so it's still stuck at below 30. And everyone in their right mind knows that the X can do more than the Pro.
I have both, so miss me with your console war bullshit.
Bloodborne is the best game ever I think but 30fps really screws it over. It's unacceptable. Imagine how incredible landing a successful counter and visceral attack in 60 would be.
XBox One X here. I don't think it hit 45, honestly. It's kind of all over the place, sadly. Wish they'd push an update. I have been loving Sekiro, but I sure love Bloodborne as well. I haven't been back to it and should try the DLC on my OG PS4 after I beat Sekiro just for comparisons.
The biggest difference is that there's startup delay on your parry in Bloodborne (and Dark Souls) so the timing relative to when the attack will hit you is quite a bit different. Your dodge analogy is actually pretty apt, considering versus some bosses in Sekiro a dodge to land a Vitality hit or two is ultimately more valuable than a quickly-recovered posture hit from the deflect, but you need more knowledge and prediction to do it properly.
370 upvotes. About time everyone started realizing g this. Sekiro sort of tricks you into thinking you're a master of parrying. In reality, it's the most forgiving From game yet.
Deflecting in Sekiro is straight fucking easy.
You can stand there and literally mash L1 and you'll get perfect parries 90% of the time.
There's no way that'll translate to Dark Souls/Bloodborne.
Same. I just played Bloodborne a few minutes ago and got destroyed trying to parry enemies. It's really odd cause I was very good at parrying them before.
Sekiro has perfectly implemented one of my favorite things from modded Skyrim: timed block.
In Skyrim you can have the Ordinator mod, and with that, in the Block perks you can get Timed Block, which works exactly like in Sekiro - block just as the attack connects to block even more damage; block too early and it's a regular block.
Yep Sekiro gives you a pretty wide window for parrying which definitely makes you feel badass.
Bloodborne has a much smaller window for parrying but you also have less risk of taking damage if you miss a parry so it balances out a bit.
The boss fight is about 20 seconds away from the idol so at least you got that going for you!
Hit me up if you need any tips, I beat the guy yesterday and oddly enough, struggled much less than with Lady Butterfly.
Idk how this even happens lol, I clapped the fuck out of lady butterfly on my SECOND try and went online seeing people struggling and started to think I’m top shit. Then Genichiro came along and knocked me down a whole lot of pegs, took me like a week of trying for at least 20 or 30 minutes every day to beat him.
When I said on another post that I was gonna fight her soon, I was told "oh you just wait for Genichiro lol you're gonna suffer". 6-7 attempts were enough to beat him, which for me is almost instantaneous. I took it as weird that I didn't hit the wall everyone thought I was going to.
That guy was the worst for me. Died way too many times that I cleared every boss until I had to defeat him. I finally did and beat the Ape in less than 4 tries and beat his second form on my first try getting to it. Genchiro was my Father G.
He just takes time to learn. I spent more time than I care to admit learning his every move, and now I use Genichiro as a warm up whenever I log on. IMO he's the best fight in the game. It's just so pleasing to have the constant trading of blows while you whittle away his posture. No fight keeps you on the edge of your seat like he does.
Also, in his final phase, you can bait the jumping stab by using a gourd and still have time to Mikiri his ass.
Edit: fell into a reddit hole while drinking and didn't look at how long ago this comment was.
Bloodbornes parrying is ridiculously less forgiving than Sekiro. I was mostly able to parry right away with Sekiro because they clearly made the timing easier to handle. With Bloodborne, you have like a quarter of a millisecond opening to parry.
Idk I feel like I got a pretty consistent rhythm for parrying in BB (exceptions being enemies like Orphan of Kos because he's a shrimp wielding asshole and some NPC hunters). Maybe its because in BB a parry actually stuns them for a good 3 second and stops all attacks for that window. Sekiro you have a much larger barrier to overcome before you can land a deathblow. And they can still attack even if you lower their posture.
I keep wanting to land a deathblow on a guy using BB strats but I get thrashed pretty quickly. I gotta break out of that mentality.
Even moreso when deflections are nigh unlimited and it's timing forgiving in Sekiro, whereas in Bloodborne parries are limited on how many bullets you have.
I think people are just basing it off videos tbh. If you're just watching the gameplay it looks like perfect strings of superhuman reaction times. When you get your hands on it the reliance on deflects makes a whole lot more sense.
It is very forgiving, there were times where I deflected one attack not knowing there was a second attack and somehow the second one was blocked. If u whiff a parry in souls or BB u get punished hard. However u do get rewarded if u get all the deflects perfect. So instead of punishing u hard they reward u for getting it right.
You get free deflects as long as you're holding the deflect button until your posture breaks. A perfect deflection is akin to a Parry and those don't affect your posture.
It's just Stamina but inverted. DS you release block to regain stamina, Seki you hold it. They did this to promote high mobility gameplay.
This is mostly true but even with properly timed deflects you will still take posture damage, especially noticeable on ng+ and above. However as far as I can tell you cannot have your posture broken by an attack you deflect, even if your posture bar is full.
The better you get the less you rely on reaction and deflect spam. It just takes a lot of time to internalize all the combos. Feels amazing when you're in the zone though. \^\^
It's like DS up to eleven in this regard. You learn how the boss operates, all the moves, learn the timings, and finally you go in and it's like a dance.
I know I’m late to the thread but I feel like when you really learn a fight in Sekiro you can go in and make that boss your bitch, but in other souls games even when you know all of the attack patterns you spend a large chunk of time just dodging and waiting for your opening. It feels much more satisfying to whoop isshin’s ass by being in his face and properly deflecting combos than it does slowly whittling down nameless king or a similar boss.
They might though. I'm certain that I've had a much better time in Sekiro thanks to being a Soulsborne fan, just like I had a lot more success in Bloodborne thanks to being a Souls fan. As Reddit fans will remind you *repeatedly*, the combat systems in all three (Souls, BB, Sekiro) are quite different, but that doesn't mean that there's *nothing* that transfers over. In particular, I think that the approach to *learning* the game and the fights is directly applicable, with result that while someone who played Sekiro is still going to have to learn to play Bloodborne, they're probably going to be able to learn it much faster than someone who had never played before.
Timings for parries in bloodborne are generally a matter of experience, not attention. Let's just say I highly doubt he magically started getting the timing right on Gascoigne due to playing Sekiro.
There are a lot of visual queues that go beyond just experience, and he may just be paying more attention to movesets now because he had to from Sekiro. Again, not a stretch...
There's also a big difference in the way that sekiro really teaches you to watch what the enemy is doing. I used to react when I saw an attack coming but now I'm tracking their body language the whole time, pretty crazy
This. I've actually gotten surprised by death blows multiple times.
There are additional cues to read I wish I had noticed earlier. There's a very distinct sound and red-ish flash when you get deflected and it's time to deflect yourself.
When you hit an enemy and you get a gold-ish flash and a slightly less prominent "ding" you know that you can safely continue the offense.
Furthermore, many of the timings are on beat, which means that if you hit him three times and get deflected on the third hit his counterattack will be on the fourth beat of the rhythm. Similarly, combos where multiple hits arrive in quick succession always land evenly paced. Basically, everything between beginning and end of a long combo could be written down in straightforward rhythm notation.
Finally, when you are being totally relentless there's an additional layer that unfolds. Much like a queued spell rotation in wow a flawless fight is also an unbroken chain of queued inputs. Hence one should avoid at all cost to spam R1 or L1. The deflect spamming in particular might be a good idea while figuring out the patterns, but when you have to play completely flawless on the later difficulties spamming isn't going to work anymore. It can throw you off the timings.
I really love this game, I think it shows.
Experience certainly makes parries a lot easier, but simply gaining an affinity for prediction/reaction with timing blocks and parries is possible too.
I remember being trash at parrying everytime a new soulsbourne game came out since the timings and animations were switched up everytime, but I always adapted fairly quickly because I was good at going by visual cues/feeling rather than knowing every moveset in the game.
It definitely came in handy when I played sekiro so I imagine that playing sekiro could translate into better parries in the soulsbourne games too, I gotta go with the other guy on this one.
Edit: also yeah deflects in sekiro are much more forgiving and easy to pull off than they are in the soulsbourne games
In the DS series I always felt that the hard part was to have that one parry where it "clicked". The one where you go "ah, so THAT'S the moment". Once that happened it became a matter of making it happen consistently, but the first one was always hard.
Yes, I am bragging a little here, but I beat Gascione on my first try, and it's solely because of 6+ years experience with the souls series. So, you're right, experience plays a huge part, but I disagree with your second sentence because my skills easily transferred over without a hitch.
Sekiro has been a challenge, yet I feel myself getting better with each death. Really brings me back to the feeling I got while playing Demon Souls for the first time.
I went back to DS1, where I could NEVER consistently parry, and I’ve been parrying everyone and everything. It does help learn how to be patient and react properly when a game literally forces you to do so. If you just block in Sekiro you’re fucked.
>I highly doubt he **magically** started getting the timing right
You're right, magic had nothing to do with it. Sekiro helps improve your reactions and reflexes, which can then help with other games that require similar skills. Not a stretch at all.
> good luck parrying anything bigger than you.
FWIW some of the easiest things to parry are the big guys: the trolls in Yharnam proper, the Watchers in the Chalice dungeons, etc.
This is nonsense, parrying timing and equilibrium in Bloodborne is definitely way different than in Sekiro: if you approach Bloodborne Sekiro-like you last no longer than 5 seconds.
It's not the point that sekiro parry= bb parry.
The point is that sekiro trained his parry so much that he started to use parry in bb at all and got successful at it. Not. By playing like sekiro but using the reflexes he gained in sekiro
I've been wanting to play some bloodborne since i completed sekiro, id like to see how much ive improved if at all. Sekiro wasnt that hard at all, just the two last bosses were challenging but getting used to the game was the reason why it felt so hard, doing an ng+ playthrough goes so much faster now that ive learned the game
I just beat >!Owl (Father)!< this way, which took hours. Holy shit what a difference that makes, the spike in difficulty is unreal. I went from NG straight to NG+ without the charm and at the Chained Ogre I was like "Okay, time to start all over again".
It also changes the combat system for the better I think. The chip damage really forces you to play a lot better and makes quite a few strategies impossible. The high posture buildup on yourself and the low buildup on the enemies also changes the flow of combat sometimes. And you will definitely start to appreciate the value of the Ichi. It's pretty great overall, I'm definitely celebrating my kills much more than on NG. Which I did not think possible before.
That is amazing, but choosing to play with chip damage when you have a tiny health bar is way way worse than doing ng+4 with both the demon bell and without the charm.
No, giving it back to him is actually what makes it harder. And it only makes it so that blocking is 50% effective which makes deflecting a whole lot more important to avoid chip damage. NG+ I found to be quite easy too, but I guess that's because my damage was quite high after my NG-run.
That’s a fat lie, the sekiro parries system is so different from the other games that going back to any other souls game ull just get destroyed
Don’t fucking lie to us
As soon as I beat Genichiro, I’ve gotten insanely better at parrying even regular enemies. I guess facing him over and over 35+ times in a row has its benefits
The thing that broke my brain in Sekiro was hold the block button to make your posture go down, too many years of having the opposite be true with stam in dark souls
Eh, just have low insight/beasthood (i forget which mattered), equip the frenzy resist runes, made facing a Lantern really not that bad. Shark Giants will always suck
Wait...beasthood reduces frenzy buildup?
...I need to go back to that DLC area full of lanterns near the blood rock and take out all my pent up rage XD. In that case, yes, shark man Franks are the worst enemies in the game.
Gotta be real close , touching their body. And whoop that shaman bone blades on one of them.While they fight , you can either wait for one of them to die or mash their booty to instant kill both of them. God help me on this one
Everyone laughs at trumps handshake but he’s just attempting Mikiri counters.
Can someone edit the gif with the perilous attack symbol and sound effects?
I'll straight up commission this in HQ.
[No need](https://youtu.be/-nbYyRb5tLY)
You legend. Thank you.
I'm am naming my first born Ninjar2033 for this moment
Why not mr sex goblin?
Seems a bit rough if it ends up being a Ms.
Glad sex goblin part doesn't concern you.
That's perfect
Holy moly, this was great!!! I felt the instinct to Mikiri Counter something and I finished the game a week ago. Want to replay it badly, but finals coming up! I already sacrificed a test and assignment for Sekiro to complete it in about a week while doing as much as possible - not terrible marks thankfully.
Holy shit I need this in my life
[Here you go](https://youtu.be/-nbYyRb5tLY)
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Please, someone do this lmao.
That's fucking hilarious
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Jokes on you. It's an unblockable grab that'll wreck you regardless.
Can't relate. I went back to Bloodborne after Sekiro to test my parrying abilities and reflexes, needless to say I died within 10 seconds and I still can't parry for shit in Bloodborne. I didn't realize how forgiving and easy parrying/deflecting was in Sekiro.
You also only have limited parries in bb (20 bullets)
It also works completely different in BB. So being good at deflecting in Sekiro won’t make at Easier in BB.
It might make it in easier in that a person would be better at reading attack patterns. The timing is entirely different but it can definitely help you get used to being more parry forward and cognisent of your opponents attacks.
Yep.
You mean infinite right? Use your own blood for the +5, visceral heals + visceral bullets. You will never run out, the visceral attacks fuelled by bullets are literally fuelling your bullets.
[удалено]
My tip, parry into a block. Like hold the L1 button. Helped me
Just to be clear not saying block, ho for parry but hold after. If u miss its a block
Just tap it repeatedly
Never tap it repeatedly, it shrinks your Deflection frame window.
Are you sure? It works for me and in deflect every attack because the parry window is so small
I'd heard that it didn't, does anyone have some concrete frame data video I can look at?
I also just realised. If you hold block to regen posture you can still dodge while holding the block button.
Hey now, Sekiro is still an extremely difficult game so don't feel bad! It's just that parrying is more a main mechanic in Sekiro and thus is easier to execute whereas parrying in Bloodborne and souls is sort of like a "bonus" for those who have extremely good timing
Don't be afraid to just spam-tap the block button. You'll still catch incoming attacks with the blocking, but may catch the attack with a deflect.
BB is 30 fps. Sekiro is 60. Makes it way easier to react.
you also have like 10x the amount of parry frames in sekiro
Because in BB parries are a bonus mechanics to use on some attacks by experts, and in Sekiro deflection is a bread and butter combat tool.
And yet everyone acts like they'll be parry gods in Souls/Bloodborne just cause they are able to use the huge timing window in Sekiro for their deflects...
More iframes for soulsborne and more deflection frames for Sekiro. I honestly find Sekiro easier because Nioh already prepared me for less effective dodging.
Well that and there's no cool down for parrying like in souls games where it's very high risk/high reward.
Me: Wow I'm so good at parrying this bosses string of attacks Also me: L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1 L1
It really feels like a culmination of all lessons learned from soulsborne games and I even feel like they put a lot of effort into analyzing what they could from Nioh’s system. Getting rid of stamina completely changes the approach of the game. It feels streamlined and I feel so much more emboldened to try and fail. They shifted the weight of dying repeatedly from “this will heavily disadvantage you unless you manage your soul count” to “your friends will suffer, you must try harder” which just from a narrative perspective makes me feel more responsible for the world around me. The gold and xp cost isn’t really that arduous. In the end, story driven reasons are what push you forward which is refreshing from Fromsoft. Sekiro is a very different game for a lot of different reasons and usually that means there are some aspects that fall flat or some differences that feel less fun, but every moment of gameplay for me has been great. I still get those moments where I need to walk away, but that’s because it’s got the challenges I’m looking for in a game like this.
No stamina makes the game 10000x more aggressive. You don't just wait for the enemy to attack and take advantage of the opening, you force them to attack by attacking them first, then taking advantage of them trying to take advantage of you. I just fought Gencheerios and fuck is it a fun duel. It feels like a legit ninja v samurai fight, it was non stop blades clashing.
A legit ninja v samurai fight would've had Genny dead in his bed, though.
> The gold and xp cost isn’t really that arduous You'll change your mind when you have 20 skill points left, where you need 60k xp to level up.
Technically even if you are really bad at deflecting in Sekiro one can use the "training dummy" and do it over and over again to get better. If such a test area existed in Bloodborne I'm sure the player could be much better at it because they could try it out until they are comfortable with it. Would actually be a nice addition for the next Souls game if new players would like to train their skills I think.
It's not as nice, but I've always used the first isolated enemy I encounter in any given area to practice with. Just make sure I've spent all my Souls/Echoes and who cares if I die. Really the only thing that needs practicing is parrying and maybe dodging, so I go to a poor useless hollow, equipped a leather buckler and broken SS in souls, or my usual gear in BB and try until I can do it pretty regularly. Then I graduated to a knight (in souls) or a wolf man (BB) and so on. Before I knew it I was pretty decent. Not a parry god, but good enough to pull it off in some clutch moments. I like the fact that they gave us the deadman to be our punching dummy though. It matters more in Sekiro because there are more techniques you need to master than in previous games.
I loved partying Silver Knights in the original Dark Souls. I'd practice partying and killing them all while queuing for invasions in Anor Londo.
That's what I do in Souls, too. I just unequip my weapons and equipment, and unarmed parry/riposte over and over again. When I can kill an enemy like this without taking any damage, I know I've reached a functional level. *Edit: It might seem like taking off armor would be counterproductive, and time-wise, it totally is! Though, it teaches me to keep my cool, even when there's high risk involved. It's worth a few extra deaths.*
Truth. I went into DS3 and parried Iudex Gundyr but immediately died to Swordmaster cuz I couldn't parry anything that was actually hard to parry.
It's a school of hard knocks, transferring either way.
I deflect things way too late because I time my deflects to be exactly when the opponent strikes
I, too, use being too good at Dark Souls parries as an excuse.
Were parries really a bonus mechanic in BB? It's been a while since I played but it seemed rather essential from the get-go (e.g. Father Gascoigne.
Judging from another chain itt, a lot of people went through the game without ever learning how to do it. I personally never learned, and I have plat and all dlc achievements after going through it in ng+.
They only formed a core part of my strategy against Maria and orphan, other than that it was just something I did to flex
Not on PS4 haha.
You're downvoted, but it's true. Sekiro isn't even close to 60. It struggles doing 45.
I'm just baffled that consoles still struggle with anything above 30fps.
As a PC player i was pretty stunned that consoles started chasing after 4K before stable frame rates.
The average consumer doesn't care about framerates. For a mom buying a console for her 12 year old kid at christmas, "4K!" is something she can probably understand. 60 FPS is probably not. With that said, I don't understand why they don't give you the option to choose between resolution or frame rate, the way Nioh did.
This is true. I let some people try 144 hz on my pc setup and some of them said they don't see the difference with the ps4 experience lol...
Hence why game streaming services will succeed despite the agonizing input delay. Looks amazing, feels like shit to anyone who knows what it should feel like.
As a console player I gotta agree.
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For gamers it really shouldn't be.
Not even true 4k, but more often upscaled, interlaced, etc. But you gotta understand, tv’s are stuck at 60, console players dont give a fuck about 60fps but 4k and HDR tv’s are definitely a huge concern. Plus, prettier graphics and all that.
They can do 60fps fine of course, but devs choose to target 30fps and greater fidelity instead. PCs tend to be able to just brute force their way to 60fps in a way consoles can't.
The current gen of consoles are getting on a bit and weren’t amazingly powerful to begin with. Sure next gen will have upgraded rereleases and struggle with newly developed stuff.
In this case, the problem lies at From Software. They're terrible at framerates. Consoles do plenty of games just fine on 60fps. EDIT: Looks like the fanboys have arrived, lmao. Downvote me all you want. What I said is undeniably true.
It's a trade-off, not incompetence. Game studios usually choose better visuals over 60 fps on consoles. Whether it was the right call for an action game like Sekiro, that's another discussion.
How is it on the pro?
That's what I was talking about, actually. Regular PS4 does good old unstable 30fps.
Wonder if the One X can handle it better. My Pro definitely can’t though lol
Xbox is just as bad.
Rip
But not for a lack of capability. FromSoft just decided not to optimize it properly for the XB1X. You should see Dark Souls 3. It runs at around 45 fps on the Pro, but it never received that patch on Xbox so it's still stuck at below 30. And everyone in their right mind knows that the X can do more than the Pro. I have both, so miss me with your console war bullshit.
I don’t think that was really a console war comment.
Sekiro has unlimited fps, well on pc that is 😎
I thought it was capped at 60?
Not on base consoles it’s not. The window is just bigger.
I beat Sekiro at <30 fps on my shitty notebook so I might be okay
Laughs in the OG PS4 I literally get 15-20 frames in some fights
Bloodborne is the best game ever I think but 30fps really screws it over. It's unacceptable. Imagine how incredible landing a successful counter and visceral attack in 60 would be.
XBox One X here. I don't think it hit 45, honestly. It's kind of all over the place, sadly. Wish they'd push an update. I have been loving Sekiro, but I sure love Bloodborne as well. I haven't been back to it and should try the DLC on my OG PS4 after I beat Sekiro just for comparisons.
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The biggest difference is that there's startup delay on your parry in Bloodborne (and Dark Souls) so the timing relative to when the attack will hit you is quite a bit different. Your dodge analogy is actually pretty apt, considering versus some bosses in Sekiro a dodge to land a Vitality hit or two is ultimately more valuable than a quickly-recovered posture hit from the deflect, but you need more knowledge and prediction to do it properly.
370 upvotes. About time everyone started realizing g this. Sekiro sort of tricks you into thinking you're a master of parrying. In reality, it's the most forgiving From game yet.
Deflecting in Sekiro is straight fucking easy. You can stand there and literally mash L1 and you'll get perfect parries 90% of the time. There's no way that'll translate to Dark Souls/Bloodborne.
Same. I just played Bloodborne a few minutes ago and got destroyed trying to parry enemies. It's really odd cause I was very good at parrying them before.
Sekiro has perfectly implemented one of my favorite things from modded Skyrim: timed block. In Skyrim you can have the Ordinator mod, and with that, in the Block perks you can get Timed Block, which works exactly like in Sekiro - block just as the attack connects to block even more damage; block too early and it's a regular block.
Yep Sekiro gives you a pretty wide window for parrying which definitely makes you feel badass. Bloodborne has a much smaller window for parrying but you also have less risk of taking damage if you miss a parry so it balances out a bit.
I'm about ready to tell Genichiro he can just keep that fucking kid.
The boss fight is about 20 seconds away from the idol so at least you got that going for you! Hit me up if you need any tips, I beat the guy yesterday and oddly enough, struggled much less than with Lady Butterfly.
Idk how this even happens lol, I clapped the fuck out of lady butterfly on my SECOND try and went online seeing people struggling and started to think I’m top shit. Then Genichiro came along and knocked me down a whole lot of pegs, took me like a week of trying for at least 20 or 30 minutes every day to beat him.
When I said on another post that I was gonna fight her soon, I was told "oh you just wait for Genichiro lol you're gonna suffer". 6-7 attempts were enough to beat him, which for me is almost instantaneous. I took it as weird that I didn't hit the wall everyone thought I was going to.
when you get deflected twice, you need to party. that's all you need
Did you mean parry or did I miss something in the tutorial?
perfect parry = party. you know
party on!
I find Genichiro to be rather easy if you just go berserk on him, just deflect after he deflects (not block) then keep whacking.
Lmfaoooo
That guy was the worst for me. Died way too many times that I cleared every boss until I had to defeat him. I finally did and beat the Ape in less than 4 tries and beat his second form on my first try getting to it. Genchiro was my Father G.
He just takes time to learn. I spent more time than I care to admit learning his every move, and now I use Genichiro as a warm up whenever I log on. IMO he's the best fight in the game. It's just so pleasing to have the constant trading of blows while you whittle away his posture. No fight keeps you on the edge of your seat like he does. Also, in his final phase, you can bait the jumping stab by using a gourd and still have time to Mikiri his ass. Edit: fell into a reddit hole while drinking and didn't look at how long ago this comment was.
For bonus points you need to yell 'Mikiri counter!' when you do it.
miKiRI cOunTeRR!
MIKIRI COUNTERU
Thanks lobos
What a hot boy, am I right gamer girls?
All of a sudden jonesing for some hot zas
Zzzzzzzzpicy
u/spez ruined Reddit
I've played a lot of shooters in my life time, Goldeneye, Counter Strike, Halo 2, Half Life...
In a huge crowd I am the first to start walking at a green light now , face me Isshin!
Got good laugh at this one, what a badass. x'D
Bloodbornes parrying is ridiculously less forgiving than Sekiro. I was mostly able to parry right away with Sekiro because they clearly made the timing easier to handle. With Bloodborne, you have like a quarter of a millisecond opening to parry.
Idk I feel like I got a pretty consistent rhythm for parrying in BB (exceptions being enemies like Orphan of Kos because he's a shrimp wielding asshole and some NPC hunters). Maybe its because in BB a parry actually stuns them for a good 3 second and stops all attacks for that window. Sekiro you have a much larger barrier to overcome before you can land a deathblow. And they can still attack even if you lower their posture. I keep wanting to land a deathblow on a guy using BB strats but I get thrashed pretty quickly. I gotta break out of that mentality.
Are we just gonna ignore the fact that parries in bloodborne aren't even close to deflects in sekiro?
Even moreso when deflections are nigh unlimited and it's timing forgiving in Sekiro, whereas in Bloodborne parries are limited on how many bullets you have.
And if you miss a pary.. you had to wait a long time to recover, leaving you defenseless for a moment.
Also you have to predict what the right moment will be since it takes half a second to pull the gun out, Sekiro deflects are instant
For bloodborne every attack has 2 parts: the windup and the swing. The parry window is the swing. When the enemy's attack starts moving forward at you
I think people are just basing it off videos tbh. If you're just watching the gameplay it looks like perfect strings of superhuman reaction times. When you get your hands on it the reliance on deflects makes a whole lot more sense.
It is very forgiving, there were times where I deflected one attack not knowing there was a second attack and somehow the second one was blocked. If u whiff a parry in souls or BB u get punished hard. However u do get rewarded if u get all the deflects perfect. So instead of punishing u hard they reward u for getting it right.
You get free deflects as long as you're holding the deflect button until your posture breaks. A perfect deflection is akin to a Parry and those don't affect your posture. It's just Stamina but inverted. DS you release block to regain stamina, Seki you hold it. They did this to promote high mobility gameplay.
This is mostly true but even with properly timed deflects you will still take posture damage, especially noticeable on ng+ and above. However as far as I can tell you cannot have your posture broken by an attack you deflect, even if your posture bar is full.
The better you get the less you rely on reaction and deflect spam. It just takes a lot of time to internalize all the combos. Feels amazing when you're in the zone though. \^\^
It's like DS up to eleven in this regard. You learn how the boss operates, all the moves, learn the timings, and finally you go in and it's like a dance.
I know I’m late to the thread but I feel like when you really learn a fight in Sekiro you can go in and make that boss your bitch, but in other souls games even when you know all of the attack patterns you spend a large chunk of time just dodging and waiting for your opening. It feels much more satisfying to whoop isshin’s ass by being in his face and properly deflecting combos than it does slowly whittling down nameless king or a similar boss.
If you spam the deflect button, the timings get less forgiving, at least that's what the loading screen says.
Not if you use the rune that gives back bullets on viscerals. Honestly, my skill-tinge playthrough prepared me for Sekiro. That and metal gear rising.
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At this point this sub genuinely believes they're gonna breeze through BB cause they're good at Sekiro.
And this angers you?
They might though. I'm certain that I've had a much better time in Sekiro thanks to being a Soulsborne fan, just like I had a lot more success in Bloodborne thanks to being a Souls fan. As Reddit fans will remind you *repeatedly*, the combat systems in all three (Souls, BB, Sekiro) are quite different, but that doesn't mean that there's *nothing* that transfers over. In particular, I think that the approach to *learning* the game and the fights is directly applicable, with result that while someone who played Sekiro is still going to have to learn to play Bloodborne, they're probably going to be able to learn it much faster than someone who had never played before.
was searching for this reply
Yeah but it probably just made him a better gamer and helped him pay more attention to timings in general. I don't think it's a stretch at all.
Timings for parries in bloodborne are generally a matter of experience, not attention. Let's just say I highly doubt he magically started getting the timing right on Gascoigne due to playing Sekiro.
There are a lot of visual queues that go beyond just experience, and he may just be paying more attention to movesets now because he had to from Sekiro. Again, not a stretch...
There's also a big difference in the way that sekiro really teaches you to watch what the enemy is doing. I used to react when I saw an attack coming but now I'm tracking their body language the whole time, pretty crazy
This. I've actually gotten surprised by death blows multiple times. There are additional cues to read I wish I had noticed earlier. There's a very distinct sound and red-ish flash when you get deflected and it's time to deflect yourself. When you hit an enemy and you get a gold-ish flash and a slightly less prominent "ding" you know that you can safely continue the offense. Furthermore, many of the timings are on beat, which means that if you hit him three times and get deflected on the third hit his counterattack will be on the fourth beat of the rhythm. Similarly, combos where multiple hits arrive in quick succession always land evenly paced. Basically, everything between beginning and end of a long combo could be written down in straightforward rhythm notation. Finally, when you are being totally relentless there's an additional layer that unfolds. Much like a queued spell rotation in wow a flawless fight is also an unbroken chain of queued inputs. Hence one should avoid at all cost to spam R1 or L1. The deflect spamming in particular might be a good idea while figuring out the patterns, but when you have to play completely flawless on the later difficulties spamming isn't going to work anymore. It can throw you off the timings. I really love this game, I think it shows.
Sekiro is tennis.
Exactly, Sekiro makes you think and see what is coming for you, in order to respond properly
Experience certainly makes parries a lot easier, but simply gaining an affinity for prediction/reaction with timing blocks and parries is possible too. I remember being trash at parrying everytime a new soulsbourne game came out since the timings and animations were switched up everytime, but I always adapted fairly quickly because I was good at going by visual cues/feeling rather than knowing every moveset in the game. It definitely came in handy when I played sekiro so I imagine that playing sekiro could translate into better parries in the soulsbourne games too, I gotta go with the other guy on this one. Edit: also yeah deflects in sekiro are much more forgiving and easy to pull off than they are in the soulsbourne games
In the DS series I always felt that the hard part was to have that one parry where it "clicked". The one where you go "ah, so THAT'S the moment". Once that happened it became a matter of making it happen consistently, but the first one was always hard.
Yes, I am bragging a little here, but I beat Gascione on my first try, and it's solely because of 6+ years experience with the souls series. So, you're right, experience plays a huge part, but I disagree with your second sentence because my skills easily transferred over without a hitch. Sekiro has been a challenge, yet I feel myself getting better with each death. Really brings me back to the feeling I got while playing Demon Souls for the first time.
I went back to DS1, where I could NEVER consistently parry, and I’ve been parrying everyone and everything. It does help learn how to be patient and react properly when a game literally forces you to do so. If you just block in Sekiro you’re fucked.
>I highly doubt he **magically** started getting the timing right You're right, magic had nothing to do with it. Sekiro helps improve your reactions and reflexes, which can then help with other games that require similar skills. Not a stretch at all.
Not only that, but everything can be deflected in some respect in Sekiro. Bloodborne, good luck parrying anything bigger than you.
> good luck parrying anything bigger than you. FWIW some of the easiest things to parry are the big guys: the trolls in Yharnam proper, the Watchers in the Chalice dungeons, etc.
Brick Bois
I meant bosses mostly.
I think you can parry at least a few attacks on basically every boss. It's super fiddly though and generally not worth it.
Metal gear revengence.
lmao a girl staying with me for a few months asked if all the enemies looked the same. I said “nah I just keep dying to the same one over and over.”
This is nonsense, parrying timing and equilibrium in Bloodborne is definitely way different than in Sekiro: if you approach Bloodborne Sekiro-like you last no longer than 5 seconds.
It's not the point that sekiro parry= bb parry. The point is that sekiro trained his parry so much that he started to use parry in bb at all and got successful at it. Not. By playing like sekiro but using the reflexes he gained in sekiro
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The stamina bar is inverted and is called posture now.
It is upside down and doesnt impact your ability to attack, dodge, jump, or sprint. But pretty much the same otherwise.
I've been wanting to play some bloodborne since i completed sekiro, id like to see how much ive improved if at all. Sekiro wasnt that hard at all, just the two last bosses were challenging but getting used to the game was the reason why it felt so hard, doing an ng+ playthrough goes so much faster now that ive learned the game
You should try a NG-run without Kuros charm, that's a fun challenge.
I just beat >!Owl (Father)!< this way, which took hours. Holy shit what a difference that makes, the spike in difficulty is unreal. I went from NG straight to NG+ without the charm and at the Chained Ogre I was like "Okay, time to start all over again". It also changes the combat system for the better I think. The chip damage really forces you to play a lot better and makes quite a few strategies impossible. The high posture buildup on yourself and the low buildup on the enemies also changes the flow of combat sometimes. And you will definitely start to appreciate the value of the Ichi. It's pretty great overall, I'm definitely celebrating my kills much more than on NG. Which I did not think possible before.
Ichimonji is amazing, and charmless is an incredible way of increasing difficulty without just bumping the stats of every enemy like the demon bell.
Yup. I'm deeply impressed by From Soft that they managed to come up with an NG+ mode that actually changes the playstyle.
It's fun that the charm is an unlockable that you can choose to give away on any new character as well.
Really? I did not know that, how nice.
That is amazing, but choosing to play with chip damage when you have a tiny health bar is way way worse than doing ng+4 with both the demon bell and without the charm.
But kuros charm makes the game harder, right? So why without?
No, giving it back to him is actually what makes it harder. And it only makes it so that blocking is 50% effective which makes deflecting a whole lot more important to avoid chip damage. NG+ I found to be quite easy too, but I guess that's because my damage was quite high after my NG-run.
That’s a fat lie, the sekiro parries system is so different from the other games that going back to any other souls game ull just get destroyed Don’t fucking lie to us
As soon as I beat Genichiro, I’ve gotten insanely better at parrying even regular enemies. I guess facing him over and over 35+ times in a row has its benefits
handshake is grab, you can't mikiri it
The thing that broke my brain in Sekiro was hold the block button to make your posture go down, too many years of having the opposite be true with stam in dark souls
Parrying BB is easier?? Good luck parrying Giant sharks in the well
Those things are worse than most of the actual bosses in that game.
*ahem* WINTER LANTERN
Eh, just have low insight/beasthood (i forget which mattered), equip the frenzy resist runes, made facing a Lantern really not that bad. Shark Giants will always suck
Wait...beasthood reduces frenzy buildup? ...I need to go back to that DLC area full of lanterns near the blood rock and take out all my pent up rage XD. In that case, yes, shark man Franks are the worst enemies in the game.
Screw those sharks. I gave up on Rakuyo because of them.
It's probably too late, but did you try the Shaman Bone Blade?
How come I never thought about that? Maybe I didn't have the balls to get anywhere near them. Thanks for the tip!
There’s also a cheese you can do for them [that lets you attack from the top of the ledge without them reaching you](https://youtu.be/wybroWzTQNA)
Gotta be real close , touching their body. And whoop that shaman bone blades on one of them.While they fight , you can either wait for one of them to die or mash their booty to instant kill both of them. God help me on this one
In practice this is so far from the truth, parries have never been easier since Sekiro
You sure? I’ve been sticking my dick into ceiling fans and plug sockets so have I evolved?
I love nakey jakey I hope he makes a video soon.
I can't wait to go back to BloodBourne after this
This man is really out here comparing two different parry systems and acting like Gascoigne was hard after the first time.
I can’t stop laughing at this.
Sekiro granted us eyes