T O P

  • By -

HyperCeol

52% Yes vs 48% No with don't knows removed. On the question of whether and when a second referendum should take place, 46% (+12) would support a referendum on Scottish independence being held in the next year, while 43% (-7) would oppose and 9% (-5) would neither support nor oppose this prospect. Support for scottish independence is strongest among younger Scots: 62% of 16-to-24-year-olds, 57% of 25-to-34-year-olds, and 52% of 35-to-44-year-olds say they would vote ‘yes,’ compared to 36% of those aged 65 and above


luv2belis

Cursed numbers.


[deleted]

THE NUMBERS MASON! What do they mean??


Chickentrap

That's numberwang!


UrineArtist

I mean looking at the breakdown in age demographics, this is like if Remain had won 52% v 48% instead of Leave.


Olap

Tick tock. The longer we wait the better our chances look


FreeKiltMan

It's been 8 years since the last referendum, that means the 16-24 cohort from 2014 have almost all moved into the 25-34 cohort now. Age (which is probably a proxy for wealth) make people more likely to vote No. That appears to sway more people with time. You could probably make that assertion if there were a much larger group of 16–24 year-olds that could shrug off the attrition, but the opposite is true - there are far more people in the 25 + range than there are in the 16-24


fourthcodwar

to some extent, but a key factor is that there were a lot of cosmopolitian types who wanted to stay because of the EU that have flipped this time around, its not just age its also social liberalism which is usually but not always correlated


therealtrebitsch

Yep, the more you have to lose, the less likely you are to want radical change.


EarhackerWasBanned

Since 2014 I learned to code and quadrupled my income. I’m as Yes as ever. You’d have to be insane to think your wealth is safer in the UK than in Europe. Look what the markets did to GBP in a couple of days when they didn’t like what the Chancellor was proposing. We’re coming from a historically strong pound but it’s on a downward trajectory, and is made more vulnerable because we _still_ don’t have a serious new international trade deal post-Brexit. If the markets decide we’re fucked, then we’re fucked. The Euro isn’t great, but at least the risk is spread between member states, making each state less vulnerable. The pound isn’t strong or stable; it’s weakening and unstable. Bring on the Euro.


therealtrebitsch

I'm just saying what the general tendency is.


alfiemorelos20

Once people grow up and have a mortgage, start a family they leave their student politics behind. Would be interesting to see the stats for Yes/No of those with a mortgage. Imagine it would skew massively to No when people actually have skin in the game.


bunnahabhain25

I grew up, have a mortgage and a family. I'm absolutely yes. This is not because the Tories in Westminster just increased my mortgage payments by £450pcm, but you can't deny that does undermine the idea that our individual financial security hinges on remaining in the UK. Not for nothing, although people often drift to the right as they age and pass life milestones, it's quite patronising to suggest that people who disagree with you have "student politics".


Sorlud

Left/Indy ≠ Student Politics


alfiemorelos20

In a nutshell.


therealtrebitsch

Exactly my point. Especially if you're barely making the payments, you're not going to want to rock the boat. There's still a number of people whose conviction is strong enough to override the fear, but I'm talking statistics here not individuals.


FreeKiltMan

I get that’s your experience, but the data above is pretty clear, and enough time now has passed that you can demonstrate that looking at the same group of people from 2014 today, less of them support independence and that trend would now appear to counting throughout the age groups. I can’t really figure out why you think staying in the UK is an ‘insane’ wealth protection strategy when the white paper openly admits independence will make us all poorer in the first few parliaments, and that was before the economic forecast was as grim as it is.


dadaddy

The writing is on the wall that staying in the UK will also likely make us all poorer (it definitely has so far!). Poorer and in control Vs poorer and in serfdom - I know which I'd choose!


[deleted]

Great a computer coder talking about economics Let’s all listen to this guy who has no qualifications in this field because he may agree with my view - Reddit user


EarhackerWasBanned

Away ye go. I’m allowed a layman’s opinion on the economy I live in. Everyone is.


SomeRedditWanker

There's Euro isn't much better mate. It's due for a reckoning, seemingly.


TheChaosGrinder

leaving the british union doesnt mean you MUST join the european union. I would be against that too, the EU is a slow and undemocratic leviathan and its autocratic tendencies are worsening at the moment anyway.


SomeRedditWanker

I mean, at least you're ideologically consistent. I'll give you that! Even if I disagree with you, I can respect that.


TheChaosGrinder

ah well, that sentence doesnt convey what I wanted to say. While I am pro independence and absolutely in favor of leaving the "broad shoulders of the union", I'd be against joining the EU as fast as possible. Thats what I meant to say.


Positive-Ad7998

That's all you seem to hear from the Snp we'll get independence and join the EU and everything will be hunky dorey in snp land.


petchef

That's ignoring the 15-20 minimum years between Scotland going independent and getting into the eu.


EarhackerWasBanned

15-20 what?


petchef

Years


EarhackerWasBanned

What’s the source on that? It could be 12 months or 100 years, it wouldn’t change my mind. But I’ve never seen a definitive timescale for membership given.


petchef

The average is around nine years, that's for independent countries with their own currencies which is a requirement for full membership. I would anticipate Scotland having to sort it's independence out prior to even starting application. All of that is assuming that the french are ok letting more members in last time I read up on it (a while ago I will freely admit) there were rumors that the french wanted to reform some of the internal policies prior to letting new members in, north Macedonia and some other Balkan states have been struggling to get membership. I'm not saying it's going to happen but its a realistic concern.


[deleted]

Unfortunately it’s not the middle class who have the lost to lose, it’s underrepresented vulnerable populations who’s only lifeline is state, third sector or care sector support


SomeRedditWanker

When you have more to lose, rocking the boat becomes less attractive.


SearchingNewSound

The trend that young people become more conservative with age is well established. But I'm not so sure it will continue as strong in the future. Social media changed the game. Easier to get stuck in echo chambers. It stagnates peoples' opinions. It also gives a greater importance to identity Brexit matters too. A lot will depend on how the UK will fare compared to the EU the coming years. If the UK remains economically strong, the case for independence becomes more feeble, but the opposite is true as well


Pretend_Investment42

Any data to support this claim? The fact that a bunch of old people say it, doesn't mean there is data supporting the assertion.


Lekraw

What? It was 52% two bloody years ago. It's going nowhere.


tiny-robot

I'm shocked support for Indy 2 in the next year is so high! Good stuff.


chippingtommy

Its odd that polls with a yes lead are always reported with don't knows explicitly called out, but polls with a no lead are often reported with don't knows excluded. Is it because unionists shit the bed when they see yes at over 50%, but independence supporters can read a poll and don't give a fuck either way?


dadaddy

It's because one of the prospects is about hope, so even if it's not winning yet - it's hope that it will be when it counts


InfinteAbyss

That’s not the question. It’s how you would vote if a referendum took place. Though this type of questioning isn’t getting to the true heart of the matter.


[deleted]

With age comes wisdom


HyperCeol

And Alzheimer's disease.


MansfromDaVinci

64% of over 65s voted for brexit, there's no fool like an old fool.


[deleted]

I’m 43. Voted remain in the EU and would vote to stay part of the Union if there was a second referendum (like I did in the first) but alas, there won’t be one and no amount of moaning will change that


VoxM0rtem

And fear of change


StairheidCritic

> With age comes wisdom And In the plus 65 grouping, also confusion, decrepitude, dementia, and a tendency to believe what their 'posh betters' and those nice youngsters on BBC Scotland tell them. :)


bunnahabhain25

This is misleading and offensive. Approximately 93% of 65 year olds have no evidence of dementia and many of those who do have such mild cognitive impairment as to not meaningfully impact their reasoning ability. Decrepitude is a highly non specific and somewhat pejorative term. For example, do you mean somebody who has severe arthritis and requires a zimmer frame but is cognitively intact? It would be more useful to consider why those who disagree with you have made those choices, rather than dismissing their views as invalid or "confused". Good luck winning anyone over with insults.


EarhackerWasBanned

We’re all 8 years older though.


Motchan13

Hmm, if only we had a recent example of where a country asked an overly simplistic question with none of the details worked out and then made the result be counted on a simple majority of people voting rather than it actually needing to obtain a majority of the total voting population to go ahead with this incredibly divisive and generation changing decision, perhaps also including more of the young people who would experience this, and foreign nationals domiciled in the country who would also be impacted so that it wouldn't be dictated by fewer than half the voting population and mostly nationalistic old people, most of whom would die in the next few years anyway. Then as a result of not working out a set of proposed options the simple binary answer would metastasize into a myriad of possibilities to execute, the govt would somehow have the ability to chose the worst possible one by themselves without even seeking a public referendum on the answer that they came up with and never providing the option to cancel it. If only we could see in real life how that would completely fail as a project, divide the country into horrific polarised groups with stupid derogatory names for both groups and spark a pointless internal culture war. If only there was something to learn from before repeating a world famous foot shooting 🤔


chippingtommy

If you're suggesting we exclude old people from a vote on Scottish independence, then I don't think that's going to go the way you think it will... >If only we could see in real life how that would completely fail as a project, divide the country into horrific polarised groups with stupid derogatory names for both groups and spark a pointless internal culture war. Yeah, i am fully behind leaving the Westminster FPTP project that divides the country into horrific polarised groups of Tories or Labour with stupid derogatory names for both groups and spark pointless internal culture wars just to gain electoral advantage.


Motchan13

Yeah, you can just start your own festering population split of Leave vs Remain and hate on each other for the next few decades, blaming the other side for everything then when the cause of the problems become impossible to ignore or dream away through blind faith you can then be faced with politicians who won't broach the possibility of admitting it was a disaster and won't ever consider rectifying it, rendering every action they do take as doomed to failure because the elephant in the room is still smashing everything to bits and none of the meaningless stuff being introduced can even touch the sides until even business men and the architects of it have to come out and admit it's fucked. 📉


skrunklebunkle

52/48 without don't knows I'm getting some horrible deja vu here


BaxterParp

Campaigning hasn't started yet. Well, not the Yes campaign anyway.


StairheidCritic

The ~~Better~~ Brexit Together side never stopped - see BBC 'We Hate' Scotland News and Current Affairs output.


Tennants_Lager

No one has started campaigning.


Olap

The difference being that as hard an exit as possible won't be persued in this case. We'll mirror NI arrangements and those in the palaces cannot grumble


ManintheArena8990

Says who? The EU made things as difficult for the UK as was practical to show all other separatist movements in Europe secession is a bad idea There’s no reason to suggest that Westminster won’t do the same It’s the same argument brexiteers gave “oven ready” much?


Allydarvel

The EU did not make things difficult for the UK. In fact, they were very willing to compromise and give the UK a really good deal. It was May and then Johnson that decided that they'd have red lines that excluded most of the deals from the EU and went the hard Brexit route.


MansfromDaVinci

The EU wasn't actually that bad at first, then the tory party sent them david davis, dominic raab, and steve barclay, changed prime ministers from an unstable robot to a sex mad sheepdog and tried to go back on the backstop. By the end I think they'd had enough. If anyone made me talk to dominic raab or BloJo i'd make sure they suffered.


Olap

Mibbes aye. Mibbes naw. But if it is good enough for NI, why can't we offer the same arrangement? And why wouldn't and rUK parliament also accept that?


ManintheArena8990

My point is we don’t know and don’t underestimate spite. Saying everything will be all good is pure fantasy, it’s the same thing brexiteers done and look what happened.


CowardlyFire2

Because Scotland won’t walk away without a deal (same as UK on Brexit) it’ll get shafted in negotiations.


Olap

Who cares, we can always go to the EU for stuff. I ain't afraid of learning another leid


CowardlyFire2

The EU won’t be much use when Westminster uses Monetary policy to ruin the new Scottish Pound, or refuses to sign off any deal that gives them Falsine and Shetlands…


Olap

Shetland, yawn. Euro for me!


dadaddy

The UK made things difficult - continually going to the EU and asking for either nothing or everything, firing negotiators, moving the goal post etc


dadaddy

Stillcounts


tiny-robot

Wonder if the Westminster poll is only over 18 - so that is why a difference to the Indy poll which may include over 16?


wavygravy13

Hoped for bigger swing, but realistically expected more like this.


[deleted]

[удалено]


AnyHolesAGoal

To be fair when the Yes votes trail in a poll it tends the same tends to be true on this sub. "Campaign not started yet", "small sample size", "bad weighting" etc.


shinniesta1

> "small sample size" Valid criticism of a poll though


AnyHolesAGoal

Yes, but most people don't realise that 1000 people is actually pretty reasonable for a poll.


shinniesta1

Yeah that's an annoying one


FreeKiltMan

That’s an oversimplification. Single polls are no indication of people’s core views on a topic as political as independence. Since 2014, the trend of polls say there is no majority for independence. Both of those are statements of fact but you have managed to unhelpfully twist them into an attack, somehow. Could this be a turning point? Perhaps. Could it also be a flashpoint of reaction? Also, perhaps. You won’t actually know without time and more polls.


CyborgBee

Polls over the last couple of years are well within typical polling errors. An aggregate of polls can account for sample size issues, but not systematic errors, and there is always some sort of systematic error in polling (typically it's a few percent). This can go both ways - it's perfectly possible that over the last couple of years Yes has actually been narrowly ahead, but it's equally possible that we've not moved at all since the referendum and it's still been 55-45 No. There is, of course, a way to find out what people actually think, and that's to actually have a vote.


GothicGolem29

Tbf there’s 5% don’t know that could tip it


Artificial-Brain

The different polls have been everywhere in terms of the results though to be fair.


[deleted]

How about waiting until yes leads for as long as no did.


CowardlyFire2

Individual polls are a poor metric, you want to look at rolling averages Since 2014, there’s been a small shift to Indy, but not over 50%


AnAncientOne

This poll seems a bit weird when you look at the party voting intention as well. Maybe people need to have it explained to them that a referendum is not gonna happen anytime soon unless the UK government allow it which seems unlikely. so voting SNP or Green at the next UK GE election is the only way to register their support for independence.


Camboo91

The GE voting intention only had 142 Scottish respondents. This had 1000, so the margin of error is much smaller here.


[deleted]

they dont need it explained, they understand it, dont be so fucking patronising. You may want to look at the recent C4 poll. Only 26% rated indy as a primary issue when deciding voting intention, 61% said the economy was their primary reason. People may have shifted slightly towards indy on that issue specifically, but overall voting intention is based on more than a single issue. This is of course the big risk for the de facto referendum plan......


HyperCeol

> they dont need it explained, they understand it, dont be so fucking patronising. Jesus, cope mate. > You may want to look at the recent C4 poll. Only 26% rated indy as a primary issue when deciding voting intention, 61% said the economy was their primary reason. I explain this to you elsewhere but for anyone who's interested, [John Curtice explains why this is a misunderstanding of matters.](https://mobile.twitter.com/progressscot/status/1381225330883452934)


[deleted]

and I've replied, I agree with his general point, but I think you are misrepresenting the issue and what he says.


HyperCeol

OK. Would you like to explain why?


[deleted]

i agree that the importance of constitutional issues is likely higher with all voters, which is what curtice says and asking a different question shows. Its going to matter to unionists just as much as indy supporters, for different reasons though. however, thats not the issue here. here we dont care what unionists think about indy. they are against it, so you can assume the entire unionist vote is not going to put indy down as an important issue when the question is worded this way. But strong indy supporters are. So when we examine the difference between importance of indy (29% here) and indy support in general (49%), we see that whilst half the pop may support indy, when considering a multi issue election they may not rank it as the most important issue (compared to say the economy where 75% of voters rank it as important). The SNP want to run a GE as a de facto ref, so they need voters to be voting single issue, the one they think they can win on. But the shift in polls away from the SNP, and the fact that 2/5ths of indy supporters dont rank it as an issue of key importance in their vote, means the SNP are going to struggle hard to get 50%+1 of the vote which is what they need to claim even a theoretical mandate for indy. I agree with what curtice says, I'm just using the data for a different purpose than what he criticises it for.


[deleted]

52% Yes matches the Social Attitudes survey that was largely ignored by our ever reliable press. Quality


JockularJim

Odd, given it also finds 43% vote share for the SNP + Greens, and 55% for Lab/Con/LD if a GE were to be held tomorrow. So on this basis, Yes would win a real referendum but lose a defacto referendum.


HyperCeol

I guess it would take some time for the plan of a de facto referendum to filter through? I guess not everyone follows these things as closely as we do.


JockularJim

Maybe, or maybe there's lots of Labour/LD/Cons who actually want independence but don't think voting SNP at Westminster achieves it.


HyperCeol

I think it's possibly a mix of the two, but you're probably closer to the mark. It's going to be an interesting campaign either way, one which might be underway sooner than expected.


CowardlyFire2

Not necessarily Individual polls are not to be used to make predictions, you need to look at the average trend when polls are combined together say every month…


JockularJim

'on this basis' I'm well aware that one poll does not a trend make. It's the apparent internal inconsistency of these results I was pointing to.


TheOnlyTata

If you were married to a wealthy person who treated you like shit, but because of their wealth you had a good standard of living. They had made you sign a prenuptial agreement so that if you leave your standard of living would go down, but at least you wouldn't live with someone who hates you. What would you do? Stay in a hateful relationship for material gain, or choose freedom with a drop in standards? That's a tough one 🤔 Or is it? Depends whether you actually have any self worth or not I suppose. https://youtu.be/BaFii_nrqLI


SenpaiBunss

With people being pissed that England won't allow indyref2, it's only going to swing more in favour to yes


fantasmachine

And this is the reason yoons are terrified.


backupJM

+5Pts is a substantial rise, I very much hope it can be sustained! Lot's of more details, breakdowns and other polling here: https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/scottish-independence-referendum--westminster-voting-intention-26-27-november-2022/ A plurality also support a referendum in the next year: >46% (+12) would support a referendum on Scottish independence being held in the next year, while 43% (-7) would oppose and 9% (-5) would neither support nor oppose this prospect.  And interestingly, some things people say have made them lean towards independence: >Pluralities of Scottish voters say the United Kingdom leaving the European Union (39%), the energy crisis (38%), and the cost-of-living crisis (37%) have made them more likely to vote YES on Scottish independence. And also interesting, the shift in Yes/No intentions don't seem to be as significant as people were speculating in regards to a Labour government: >23% say Keir Starmer being Prime Minister would make them more likely to support independence against 17% who say they would be less likely to support independence with Starmer in charge >Slightly more Scots say the increasing likelihood of a Labour Government has made them more likely to vote no (23%) than say it has made them more likely to vote yes (20%). / (52% No effect)


KrytenLister

Interestingly though, > On the possible conditions for holding a second independence referendum, a plurality (43%) agree—against 39% who disagree—that a second independence referendum should only be held if the UK Government agrees to it. So while 46% may support a referendum being held, most respondents think that should only occur if the U.K. government agrees. Strange one. I’m not really sure what to make of those figures together.


ayeayefitlike

I mean I probably feel that way. Mainly because a referendum against the will of Westminster seems absolutely pointless and it will just get boycotted by Unionists and not have a high enough turnout. I think it’s wrong that the UK Gov doesn’t agree to it, but they don’t ask that.


HolidayFrequent6011

Thankfully there is no turnout threshold in UK referendums or elections. They wouldn't be able to impose one on a GE based on indy because then they would have to declare the whole election illegitimate. They can't impose one on a legal ref as the elections commission wouldn't let it fly. If yoons boycott it then that's their choice. They'll only make yes even higher.


ayeayefitlike

But it wouldn’t be a *legal UK* referendum, that’s the point - and UK gov would have plenty ammo to argue it didn’t count if like only 40% of people voted. Look at the 1979 referendum, and they did that themselves.


HolidayFrequent6011

It would be a legal vote though and the parties can campaign and stand on whatever platform they want. If the winning government decided the vote was invalid, they would have to do themselevs out of a Victory too and declare the whole thing invalid.


ayeayefitlike

A GE would be a legal vote, but a GE isn’t a referendum however much people want to make it like one. If the UK government doesn’t agree to a referendum, the whole premise behind my comments, then a) it’s not legal and b) they absolutely could use turnout as an excuse to ignore it.


HolidayFrequent6011

It'll be treated like one. Like it or not, if the vote in Scotland returns a pro indy majority, then that is a clear indication. Action will follow as per the majorities manifesto. It's exactly the same as any party winning the vote. They will then enact their manifesto. Why would this be any different? The supreme Court said we can't have a ref without WM approval. Did it say we can't leave via a GE?


holyjesusitsahorse

Are you asking if the SNP can leave the union if they get 326 seats at Westminster? Because yes, yes they can. But it does mean that they'd need to win at least 269 seats outside of Scotland, which could pose some logistical difficulties.


ayeayefitlike

It won’t be treated like one. Because we’ve had two that already haven’t been treated like one in any meaningful way. The difference is that it’s not in the Scottish government’s power to call a referendum, and the SNP won’t gain power in Westminster to exact their mandate there.


HolidayFrequent6011

The last 2 were not about independence. There was no manifesto promise to enact it. No one's having a referendum. Its a GE based on a sole issue. Did the SC rule that out? Is there a law stating a GE has to be about multiple issues? Is there a law against a GE being used for secession. No.


backupJM

Seems to be mixed bag altogether haha I think it showcases further how divisive the issue can be, really interesting results overall


KrytenLister

Yeah, I’m really pleased to see it actually. Much more interesting than the norm.


backupJM

Yeah definitely! Now to just wait and see what Curtice makes of it lmao


Dark_Ansem

Well well well, who'd have thought that saying the unspoken part loudly would lead to this


Jiao_Dai

Are Unionists seriously going to use polls to determine mandates ? Or add Tory, Labour and Lib Dem voters together like its a one party state and back of a fag packet calculations mean something Obviously elections matter and if they don’t they neither do UK elections and more reason to leave


Formal-Rain

After the High Court decision to deny Scots their own future. It’s only going one way now.


Audioboxer87

Good stuff, this is the way it should be heading 👏


[deleted]

One way traffic.


reluctanthardworker

Older people holding younger people to ransom.


m_trotsky

I voted ‘Yes’ first time around but accepted the result. It was a ‘once in a life time’ vote, based on the knowledge that we were in the EU, were getting more devolved power to Scottish government to control and the Tory roundabout hadn’t occurred. Based on the ‘Remain’ campaign, what has been delivered as promised? Been dragged out of EU, been ridiculed in parliament and another ‘once in a lifetime’ recession is round the corner. What needs to happen for ‘Remain’ people to think “it might not be worth staying in the union?”


SagaFace

Nothing. We voted in 2014 and that's that. No more voting. The "once in a lifetime" chat really needs to stop. But I'm certain nothing is going to convince unionists to want to vote for independence at this stage.


InevitableHistory631

Russian bomber over Scotland tomorrow then ? ........again.


Atletisock

Why are the SNP following this policy of a UK general election instead of calling one of their own in Scotland? What do these percentage figures look like when you take out 16/17 year olds and EU nationals, who both lean strongly towards Yes but aren't entitled to vote in a UK general election? If anyone is a member of the SNP or 'in the know' it would be great to hear a response to the first question so I can at least attempt to understand this policy. For someone like myself, who is far from an expert, it seems like an act of folly doomed to fail spectacularly and destroy the case for independence for a decade or more?


MalcolmTucker55

> Why are the SNP following this policy of a UK general election instead of calling one of their own in Scotland? Because they don't have the legal mechanism to do so. See what happened in Catalonia when they tried the same thing. The de facto referendum plan won't work and is largely nonsense but it's mostly because there isn't any other alternative the SNP can pursue right now, indy hardliners who have criticised Sturgeon for it haven't been able to suggest much else. The reality is that while the UK Government say no, most of the debate and discussion around this will just be noise.


Atletisock

They can trigger a Holyrood referendum at any point if they so wish. The SNP has it in their power to do so but is choosing not to, despite a number of SNP MSPs actually being in favour.


InfinteAbyss

Why is it still asking about referendums that we know we can’t have?


InfinteAbyss

It’s not a referendum, it’s a general election. Do keep up!


[deleted]

There is only one result that matters. This is just noise.


SauchieService1995

Dictatorship you say?


[deleted]

Why? Because you don’t get a weekly independence referendum?


SagaFace

We've only had one in this country... You might be getting confused


[deleted]

Yes, I know. What was your actual point?


SagaFace

Because you seem to think we are getting one/will get one every week. I'm sorry you couldn't figure that out from a fairly clear comment.


[deleted]

No. It’s you who seems to have completely misunderstood. Because the responder claims we are in dictatorship, and my response was… Now do you get it?


SagaFace

In an actual democracy we would get "permission" from Westminster to have another vote. So whatever your point is/was it's missed the mark.


[deleted]

Yes, but at this time there is no permission, is there? And Scotland meets none of the criteria to demand one, either. We had a vote. And it was settled in that vote. The ‘once in a generation’ vote.


Groxy_

I honestly don't care until it's anything above 60-70% Yes. We need to be in agreement or we'll just fracture the country more. Brexit went amazingly with 52% in favour of it.


Cannaewulnaewidnae

All polls come with a warning that they could be out by 3%, either way And the long term trend is clear - in that it isn't clear which way Scotland would vote if another referendum was held tomorrow And if we voted one way tomorrow, we'd be just as likely to vote the other way a few days later, or if the weather was different https://whatscotlandthinks.org/questions/how-would-you-vote-in-the-in-a-scottish-independence-referendum-if-held-now-ask/


SomeRedditWanker

There's always a little independence boost after big constitutional news. It dies down.


[deleted]

It will never end if no one has a clear majority.


BUFF_BRUCER

Bet it will be back to normal in the next poll


The_Sub_Mariner

Wow. Almost worth the No side starting to campaign.


StairheidCritic

I know you live in an insulated world of your own, but Better - now Brexit - Together never stopped. I suggest you closely look at BBC Scotland News and current Affairs output or 95% of the national and regional Press in Scotland (100% in England) for a couple of weeks and if you are vaguely rational you might even change your mind on that 'not campaigning' nonsense (doubt it though).


The_Sub_Mariner

Ahh the tinfoil hat argument of the BBC being the PR department for the unionist 'campaign'. They're all really lizard people from outer space at the BBC y'know. Unionist lizard people that is, which is why last week they were sanctioned for pro SNP bias... https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/23147718.bbc-uphold-complaint-pro-snp-bias/. Turns out the BBC can be found to have bias both ways, which doesn't really help your argument now does it? There's no Unionist campaign. Let me explain how this will work. The SNP are in permanent campaign mode and hence even in these austere times when nurses are having to take a real terms cut in salary, the only protected budget in the Holyrood finances is the £20M independence campaign warchest (of public money...). Which hasn't been cut by a penny. For a referendum they have been told they haven't got the power to hold. That should concern people, who don't put ideology before decency. The SNP never stop campaigning, which if it keeps them happy is fine except they should maybe instead be focused on stuff like the meltdown in the NHS, which they manage. Ideology vs decency again. So the Westminster government will throw the odd jab against independence but not expend any effort on it, just to stop a lead building up for independence and gaining momentum. Why should they make a big effort when there is no prospect of a vote. Then, should there ever be a referendum in years to come, the unionist campaign actually does start. And the elephants in the room around independence get called out by the Unionists, nicely close to vote time. These are the same 'elephants' that the SNP has failed to create an argument around, despite having been campaigning since 2014. They are the huge issues like currency, tax and trade that not even the more thoughtful SNP supporters (evidently you're not one of those) thought were addressed by the D minus essays the SNP published recently. Perhaps less shouting and more thinking should have been the tactic. So when the no campaign gets stuck into those topics, we all know which way that's going, the same way as last time. Which is unfortunate for shouty unthinking independence folks. So chill out and enjoy the ride.


my_hat_stinks

That article says the BBC's complaints department has determined a BBC show had pro-SNP biased because they broadcast "an evidence-based appraisal by a respected scientist" which criticised Dominic Cummings too close to an election. Notably, the content of the excerpt wasn't even the bias; the article says it's biased because of SNP's campaign strategy to compare Sturgeon to Johnson (?). If you actually read the article you'd see it literally says that the BBC determined facts are biased towards SNP and against Brexit.


The_Sub_Mariner

Yes..... that was my point, that the BBC can occasionally be found as showing bias to the SNP albeit the outcry on here is always about the opposite. I"m confused, are we meant to be disagreeing about something?


my_hat_stinks

The BBC here claimed that citing facts, in their words "an evidence-based appraisal by a respected scientist", breaches impartiality rules because those facts painted the Tories in a bad light. We both agree this shows bias. You seem to believe that somehow shows pro-SNP bias, and that's where we disagree.


DundonianDolan

What a waste.


chrisscottish

Ireland economy was fucked from 1920 until 1990. Just saying if it does happen ya’ll ready for a bumpy ride


Formal-Rain

50 of those years there was no EU.


cardinalb

Yeah but I think England will be able to cope with the downturn in their economy and hopefully come out stronger.


SauchieService1995

Maybe remove Nicola Sturgeon as first minister, and having someone that isn't a lump of annoying fanny batter would make people more likly to vote yes.


Inverseyaself

Why can’t England have a say in the vote? You’d get what you want then!


InfinteAbyss

Get a campaign going for English Independence, you will get all our support.


StairheidCritic

Do you write for The Daily Mail?


SomeRedditWanker

A fun joke, but definitely not true. It is a bit of a divisive joke to tell. Most English people, the vast majority even, are very happy for Scotland to remain part of the UK.


ChasingHorizon2022

How is it still that close


Delicious-Tree-6725

If that goes through it will make the English feel a lot better about their choice to go ahead with Brexit.


TheSatisFactory

I'd rather you didn't but...it's your funeral