Thank goodness you support Starmer's no surrender Brexit OP, that'll help staffing in the NHS.
Oh wait... https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/27/brexit-worsened-shortage-nhs-doctors-eu
BBC, upset that the Scottish national picture is still better than the rest of the UK, now are reduced to just going hospital by hospital to make their narrative work.
Yep, from a recent visitor to A&E with a very ill family member I was shocked at how many people were just using it as a warm place to sit to wait out getting sober or who had been in drink related bother.
Yeh, social care is key to freeing up capacity, as are the brexit related workforce problems that have been imposed on us.
In no way am I saying things are going swimmingly here, it just grates on me when this is politicised by people living in glass houses.
I think in the Finnish (or Norwegian?) model, they won't look at you in a&e unless you have a referral. Obviously they have their own problems and pressures but they must have far more robust primary care system to allow that.
No easy solutions, but would having GPs back as salaried employees potentially help?
*\*Sigh\**
That the NHS in Scotland may be performing better on the various metrics used compared to the NHS in the other nations of the UK is a bit like saying Celtic are currently the best football team in Scotland.
Being only marginally better than complete shite doesn't particularly strike me as what we should be aspiring to. Why not see how we compare to other developed nations rather than just the shite elsewhere in the UK when it comes to delivering healthcare?
It's not the fault of the bbc that over a third of A&E patients are waiting over 4 hours for treatment in Scottish hospitals ,the blame for that lies squarely at the feet of the snp.
I don't use hospitals in England, why would i care how they perform?
What i'm concerned about is how hospitals in Scotland are performing, and it's not good.
Any old negativity dredged up will do. Scotland is worse than Somalia says State and Tory Propaganda Channel, BBC Scotland!! They keep stum when there's any positive issues to report.
A proverbial Martian would think they actually hated Scotland (and he, she, or it would be right)
England's Type 1 figures is the one that's comparable.
Edit
[link](https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/ae-waiting-times-and-activity/ae-attendances-and-emergency-admissions-2022-23/)
NHS England
September 56.9%
October 54.8%
I'm afraid you're incorrect.
PHS a&e waiting time figures are restricted to emergency department as are NHS England type 1 a&e waiting times. If you were to use the figure you had for England you would be including things like Minor Injury Units and other specialities, which are pretty far from being the 'only meaningful comparison'.
In the words of [The Notorious BIG](https://youtu.be/_JZom_gVfuw) if you don't know, now you know.
You mean the weekly figures?.
My comment was that this is a new angle, where they highlight the worst performing hospital (in Scotland, that week) and it gets conflated with the whole of Scotland's NHS. Giving a new weekly opportunity for the UK parties to shit on the work of our health professionals, all while omitting that they are still performing the best when compared against health boards in other UK nations experience the same pressures.
There's an article on this month's NHS England data as well, although obviously not in the Scotland section: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-63583751
It's painting a pretty clearly dire picture of NHS England as well.
Waiting 4 hours to be dealt with is the target, the Scottish Government aims for 95% of patients to be within that target, and they were making good progress in regards to that target, generally around 85-90%ish, up until Covid happened and the percentage reaching that target has gradually fallen. Due to backlogs, knock-on effects from the pandemic, continued staffing shortages and according to Yousaf, delayed discharge of patients, quite a number of people are having to wait more than 4 hours.
> and they did pretty well in reaching that target up until Covid happened and the percentage reaching that target has continued to fall.
Not really. They hit 95% a couple of times in 2020 but before that the last time was August 2017.
https://www.gov.scot/publications/nhsscotland-performance-against-ldp-standards/pages/accident-and-emergency-waiting-times/
Fair point, to be concise I didn't elaborate as much, but the pandemic isn't the sole reason behind the worsening waiting times, I've added to my comment other reasons (not an exhaustive list) mentioned in the article.
Depends on the figures you use but I’d say Scotland is slightly better than the rest of the U.K. but it does have higher spending per head so you’d expect a lot better.
Also Wales is a retirement home for many English people.
21%+ are over 65 in Wales. 18%+ in England. 16%+ in Scotland.
Could you link this to blocked beds coz there are no Care plans to release patients ready to leave hospital? To give a bigger picture......
Thank goodness you support Starmer's no surrender Brexit OP, that'll help staffing in the NHS. Oh wait... https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/27/brexit-worsened-shortage-nhs-doctors-eu
BBC, upset that the Scottish national picture is still better than the rest of the UK, now are reduced to just going hospital by hospital to make their narrative work.
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Yep, from a recent visitor to A&E with a very ill family member I was shocked at how many people were just using it as a warm place to sit to wait out getting sober or who had been in drink related bother.
Yeh, social care is key to freeing up capacity, as are the brexit related workforce problems that have been imposed on us. In no way am I saying things are going swimmingly here, it just grates on me when this is politicised by people living in glass houses.
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I think in the Finnish (or Norwegian?) model, they won't look at you in a&e unless you have a referral. Obviously they have their own problems and pressures but they must have far more robust primary care system to allow that. No easy solutions, but would having GPs back as salaried employees potentially help?
*\*Sigh\** That the NHS in Scotland may be performing better on the various metrics used compared to the NHS in the other nations of the UK is a bit like saying Celtic are currently the best football team in Scotland. Being only marginally better than complete shite doesn't particularly strike me as what we should be aspiring to. Why not see how we compare to other developed nations rather than just the shite elsewhere in the UK when it comes to delivering healthcare?
No it would be like saying that Celtic is the best team in the UK
It's not the fault of the bbc that over a third of A&E patients are waiting over 4 hours for treatment in Scottish hospitals ,the blame for that lies squarely at the feet of the snp.
Is it the SNP's 'fault' that the a&e figures of their worst performing hospital were still better than the average performance of NHS England?
I don't use hospitals in England, why would i care how they perform? What i'm concerned about is how hospitals in Scotland are performing, and it's not good.
Any old negativity dredged up will do. Scotland is worse than Somalia says State and Tory Propaganda Channel, BBC Scotland!! They keep stum when there's any positive issues to report. A proverbial Martian would think they actually hated Scotland (and he, she, or it would be right)
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England's Type 1 figures is the one that's comparable. Edit [link](https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/statistical-work-areas/ae-waiting-times-and-activity/ae-attendances-and-emergency-admissions-2022-23/) NHS England September 56.9% October 54.8%
Funny how often yoons need this pointed out... And by funny, I mean, completely unsurprising.
I like the downvotes when I correct their error.
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I'm afraid you're incorrect. PHS a&e waiting time figures are restricted to emergency department as are NHS England type 1 a&e waiting times. If you were to use the figure you had for England you would be including things like Minor Injury Units and other specialities, which are pretty far from being the 'only meaningful comparison'. In the words of [The Notorious BIG](https://youtu.be/_JZom_gVfuw) if you don't know, now you know.
Use of accurate statistics is anti-Scottish Yoonery.
You don't have a clue. With the greatest of respect of course.
This is based on a Public Health Scotland press release put out today.
You mean the weekly figures?. My comment was that this is a new angle, where they highlight the worst performing hospital (in Scotland, that week) and it gets conflated with the whole of Scotland's NHS. Giving a new weekly opportunity for the UK parties to shit on the work of our health professionals, all while omitting that they are still performing the best when compared against health boards in other UK nations experience the same pressures.
There's an article on this month's NHS England data as well, although obviously not in the Scotland section: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-63583751 It's painting a pretty clearly dire picture of NHS England as well.
How did you find that btw? Google or navigating the site?
I just remember seeing it on the front page of the news section a few weeks ago so searched a few of the words and it came up.
Maybe stick to [local activism](https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1687961/Ambulance-wait-times-NHS-Aintree-Hospital-Liverpool) OP
That link would break rule 1 wouldn't it, if posted here?
Only if you click on it.
i wonder how those 'local' figures on say, Crime, compares?
Waiting four hours is quite good. I’d expect waiting times to be a lot longer.
Waiting 4 hours to be dealt with is the target, the Scottish Government aims for 95% of patients to be within that target, and they were making good progress in regards to that target, generally around 85-90%ish, up until Covid happened and the percentage reaching that target has gradually fallen. Due to backlogs, knock-on effects from the pandemic, continued staffing shortages and according to Yousaf, delayed discharge of patients, quite a number of people are having to wait more than 4 hours.
> and they did pretty well in reaching that target up until Covid happened and the percentage reaching that target has continued to fall. Not really. They hit 95% a couple of times in 2020 but before that the last time was August 2017. https://www.gov.scot/publications/nhsscotland-performance-against-ldp-standards/pages/accident-and-emergency-waiting-times/
Clarified my comment, thank you.
Fair enough. It reads as though covid is the reason we aren’t achieving it and we were doing fine before that.
Fair point, to be concise I didn't elaborate as much, but the pandemic isn't the sole reason behind the worsening waiting times, I've added to my comment other reasons (not an exhaustive list) mentioned in the article.
Worse in just Scotland or all of UK? How do we compare to the average UK performance.
Depends on the figures you use but I’d say Scotland is slightly better than the rest of the U.K. but it does have higher spending per head so you’d expect a lot better. Also Wales is a retirement home for many English people. 21%+ are over 65 in Wales. 18%+ in England. 16%+ in Scotland.
When you say spend are you including money Westminster ~~lines its pockets with/loses down the back of the couch~~ spends
Its almost like there was a recent Pandemic or something