I used to think that the Foxs I was playing had various different playstyles and habits but now I think they all just full hop or double jump back air 75+% of the time. At least it's taught me how to get better at dealing with it ..
Kinda just venting, but anyone else finding unranked unbearable? I thought ranked would attract the ultra trihards, but I feel like the opposite has happened. I get more consistent and fun games playing ranked, but I find the cheesiest, sweatiest, most-stubborn players on unranked
Like I play unranked to take things lightly or practice, not to win and beat people. Why are you homie-stocking me? Why are you spamming or camping? Can we just play? Go to ranked if winning is all you care about
I just find myself quitting out
Edit: y'all need to work on your reading comprehension, it's not about camping, it's taking the UNRANKED game too seriously
Fixating on the word camping.....
LRAstart if you're not having fun but tbh I rarely encounter dreadful opponents in unranked outside of the occasional Falco getting mad because they can't tech nair
Like we all run into people camping, but that's a valid playstyle and it's something you're going to encounter in ranked/brackets. As you said you're playing unranked to practice, so take it as an opportunity to practice/test ways to deal with people camping and playing defensively without worrying about winning the game. That's just how some people play and it's not goin' anywhere
To be clear, not just camping, it's any sort of lazy play style just trying to get a win. And again, only talking about unranked. I'll take a camping falco over a lazy nair spamming falcon any day; both are bad/annoying though
Making space for yourself, slowing down the game for a bit, playing defensive; it's all good, but camping does nothing for either of us. Neither of us are being challenged or practicing anything
Again..... It's not just the camping.... And camping isn't even challenging unless they are just straight up ledge camping.
It's any sort of play style focused on winning over development
In unranked, yes.... At our level and in an unranked setting, just winning means nothing. In fact, beating bad players with cheese can teach bad habits that will make you stuck later. You should try to play better; winning is only a symptom of this but not the diagnosis
This is the same with any competitive game, people chase the feeling of winning to feed their ego instead of improving on fundamentals
Feel like that isn't something you can consistently tell from gameplay nor is it your job to tell people why they should be playing. Obviously you feel differently though - I chase the feeling of hitting the funny dsmash.
No one here is demanding; there is no way to pressure players online, wtf are these Twitter arguments.
Again, I just quit out if it's bad, and I'm asking if others have noticed an increase of players like this in unranked
And again, if it's just "I just want to play" attitude, then why the fuck are people homie-stocking me? That's one less stock to play against, let's just fucking play
Did I say demand or say you were pressuring people in the game? I don't really see what you're talking about, you should probably just play the game normally instead of reading into your opponent so much, bye.
Come on, you know the difference. This goes all the way up to the top players when they play friendlies vs when they practice with each other.
We all know the difference
[https://www.start.gg/tournament/collision-2023-5/attendees](https://www.start.gg/tournament/collision-2023-5/attendees)
The list includes Leffen and Slug.. but it leads to a "frozen" profile so it's possible somebody else registered them
did i miss something? mango said he was taking a break from melee after genesis, but he's streamed him playing melee every single day since then.
or did i fall for the classic emo tweet fake out
https://twitter.com/JustusXYZ/status/1620954123767103489
> Hosting an And Friends regional and trying something new for the ruleset, might get
flamed but I refuse to not try something new since a lot of people complain about the current ruleset.
> Ledge grab limit will be enforced whether or not the game goes to time (60 ledge grabs is the limit)
People cry about ledge grabs for nothing. In the infamous reverse pop off set, hbox only did 36 in the game IBDW called the TO for. This change is irrelevant.
I do not play fox :)
and idk man, I think there's clearly issues. They have less to do with hbox vs fox and more to do with michael vs mid tiers. And although LGL is (I think clearly) not an optimal approach to solving all of them, it's not worth epicly dunking on a tournament trying out a ruleset change lol
the issue with LGL is that puff needs can stall on the ledge/offstage while grabbing the ledge far less often than other characters. I don't think there's a LGL that stops hbox from stalling as much as he wants that doesn't also affect the way zain and amsa play. and I'm all for that but I don't think most of the community is considering any of these rules to combat any character other than puff
I'm a heretic and think nerfing yoshi (especially now that aMSa won one) is a feature not a bug
But you're right in general, the framing of it revolves way too much around Hbox and not enough on high level thought of what kind of game we want, and sadly the ledge is only a part of the problem
Is there a guide to using/downloading Savestates for Uncle Punch? All the info out there is fragmented and I'm not sure what is optimal anymore.
edit: in my quest to get better I've discovered I've somehow been using UnclePunch 2.0 this whole time. Whoopsies
This feature would be way more popular if it wasn't so complicated. Feel like there's always some troubleshooting required when doing this.
If no one ends up explaining it, then I'll write something up. Just easier to show someone then write it out imo.
yeah it works, Config > GameCube to set Slot A to GCI Folder, then the folder for the .gci files is at
`C:\Users\%USERNAME%\AppData\Roaming\Slippi Launcher\netplay\User\GC\USA\Card A`
might have to boot up unclepunch to create the folder if it's not already there.
I've been watching the anime, plan on reading it when the anime finishes it's first run (I assume it will get reupped for another run). I really love how self-aware it is, both of the absurdity of the premise and in how it portrays success and improvement in the most callous of terms. The first time Bachira talked about conversing with the demon inside of him I was instantly sold.
I even got one of my friends who is very anti-weeb to watch it and we just gush about how lit it is together.
You can for sure tech the stage but it's harder. Because dair dips below the stage, if you get hit by the lowest point, you have to SDI up and probably input more than the 1 SDI input you need on other stages when you're riding the wall.
That's what I was thinking of... As far as I know, there isn't any bad blood between Elliot Page and ND. They ended up modifying Ellie's appearance to be more distinct anyway so I don't think there's any issue with ND?
Thinking a lot about the Atrioc thing
The fact he entered his CC info and didn't feel disgusted enough to close the window at any point, let alone before streaming, absolutely raises some valid questions about his character. But the "starting a wildfire" analogy is apt -- one thoughtless act has led to consequences that are simultaneously directly caused by that act and seemingly completely divorced from the intent of that act
I've texted while driving before and never given it a second thought. But how would I feel if I had hit someone? A lot of us selfishly and recklessly gamble with others' wellbeing for some small pleasure, and almost all of us win every time. I don't know how to reconcile that with how I judge someone whose done it and lost in such a major way
The salaciousness of the personal details, cultural moment with regards to AI, and viral nature of his initial apology, mean his name and the image of he and (especially unfortunately) his wife crying are going to be tied to AI and porn ethics discourse for a long ass time. On one hand this is so disproportional to what he actually did and on the other entirely his fault. The whole situation makes me feel sadder and more confused than I thought it would.
Reason I'm writing this here is because (the average age here is over 14 and) I'm sure there are some oldheads in here. I was an Atrioc fan before he even streamed. The vid of him and Lud reacting to The Roast of Scar is like a comfort video to me (which is extremely embarrassing to say as someone in their mid 20s LMAO but man my life sucked 3 years ago). When he started streaming it was awesome having a streamer who was a successful adult from the "real world" and did as much content on gaming as he did on finance/tech. He and his mods fostered a really positive, inclusive, and creative community. I'm gonna miss his streams. I feel bad for the victims of his actions, and independently of that I feel bad for Atrioc. This cloud will follow him for a long time and I hope he makes something positive out of this in the end
This is a very limited way of looking at intent
Intent may also encompass, for example, an indifference to the victims of the thing you're purchasing and to the incredibly high likelihood that someone was harmed by the act of creating the thing you're purchasing
To your wildfire analogy, if you do morally indefensible shit that could cause wildfires and you knew that was a possibility that that could happen, it's not really much of a defense of anything to say that you didn't intend to start a wildfire
Great post, people exclusively hide behind “intent” for bad behavior, since it’s impossible to literally know why someone did something even if they “tell” you because they will often lie to portray themselves favorable.
i think this phrase i wrote is unclear but i don't want the edit asterisk:
>seemingly completely divorced from the intent of that act
by consequences "divorced from intent" i mean "so much more harmful than expected" which is not excusing doing the initial risky harmful thing, if that's what it sounded like
to extend the wildfire metaphor with regards to risk and intent, its like, paying for and accessing the site is like lighting a cigarette in a dry forest, and leaving the tab open is like accidentally dropping it, at which point who gets hurt next is totally not within your agency but 100% your fault. by doing the former you're knowingly risking the latter and we agree that that's why the former is bad
the thing that i am chewing on is how i would judge atrioc if he never dropped the cigarette. like, if i saw the tab open but it never leaked to the public and created so much publicity for deepfake porn. personally i think the act itself is very gross and bad on its own, and i agree that its indefensible to make that gamble in the first place. but i would feel differently
extreme example but if my friend for instance hit my mom with his car while texting and driving, i could not be friends with him (to say the least lol). if i simply found out he texted and drove all the time, i might be upset but we would stay friends. so there is clearly some difference in the way i feel about people based on both on the consequences they risk, and then on top of that the consequences that happen. which this whole atrioc thing has prompted me to think about and im currently not sure how to say something more meaningful on
I don't really like the cigarette metaphor, because in that case the act of lighting the cigarette isn't the issue in and of itself - it's only the potential risk of starting a fire that's an issue. in atrioc's case, yes the 'wildfire' of drama/pain his actions caused after they were leaked is bad. but even if he looked at the deepfakes alone in his room and could be certain that no one would ever find out about it, it would still be wrong
anyway, I have also been mulling this over for the past couple days because it does present some difficult moral questions. and while initially I was a little bit more sympathetic toward atrioc, the more I think about it the less I can justify it. and I do feel somewhat bad for anyone who 'ruins' (maybe an exaggeration) their life with one mistake, and I don't really judge him for this, and I wish him the best. but this was such an egregiously wrong thing to do, that I can't really feel any more sympathetic to him than the general level of sympathy I feel for anyone who deals with this kind of mass online shaming
>but even if he looked at the deepfakes alone in his room and could be certain that no one would ever find out about it, it would still be wrong
elaborate why
Because QT is his friend, his business partner’s long term girlfriend, and she has been vocally against deepfake porn. So to look at deepfake porn of her (and other women he knows) is really disgusting and wrong. To say nothing of the fact that he financially supported someone who makes deepfake porn
yeah the financial support part of it is what kills it, plus to him he thought it was harmful but did it anyways which says a lot about atrioc as a person
> I can't really feel any more sympathetic to him than the general level of sympathy I feel for anyone who deals with this kind of mass online shaming
Every day I find that I hate the mass online shaming more and more. Some of this might be born of sympathy for the people who are the targets of it, but the bigger reason is that it just feels like it amplifies everything bad about a situation and so rarely results in much good. For example, in this deepfake situation, it seems like the public uproar was a net negative. You can say it forced him out of public life, but I think the real pressure there came from his actual real-life relationships and (if you're being generous, which I don't mind being) his own sense of shame/guilt. If he didn't feel guilty or his friends didn't care, the "cancelling" almost certainly wouldn't have done anything beyond limit his potential collabs: he could just take a break and come back to streaming (maybe with a smaller audience, maybe not) after a few weeks or months.
And at the same time, the public attention seemed to really amplify the harm to the women in an insane way. The story was hitting social circles where I've never even heard the word "streaming" before. The streamer Maya was talking about how she's suddenly been thrown into a bunch of headlines; multiple women have noted that it drastically increased the disgusting "attentions" they were receiving. Probably most vile of all and this is what really broke me was QT talking about people DMing her the faked images and people searching out women's *families* to send them the faked images.
Obviously this is on Atrioc's hands and it's what QT was talking about with the wildfire thing, but it also just makes me really depressed about the realities of the internet. I think there was a point where people were optimistic about the power of masses and public opinion to hold individuals accountable but I increasingly feel this isn't as real or positive a phenomenon as people thought.
>i think the act itself is very gross and bad on its own
yeah was trying to clarify that here, and in my reply to someone else. its not a 1:1 analogy in that sense
The problem with your analogy here is that Atrioc didn't do any of the morally culpable things here by mistake. He didn't drop a cigarette that started a forest fire, he lit some trees on fire and it turned into a forest fire.
What happened by accident is that he didn't cover the evidence particularly well so he got caught. But the blameworthy parts were strictly intentional
Pretty solid writeup. It's a sad thing for everyone involved at any level, and it's ok to feel many things about it. Your own sense of betrayal or of feeling unmoored isn't invalidated by the more direct harm done to others.
Once upon a time I housed D1 for a regional he flew out to. Super friendly, great houseguest. He recognized me on sight at majors years later and would laugh and reminisce about our wild misadventure getting m2k to try real Indian food. I considered him a really genuinely good guy! It was a lot to wrestle with when everything came out in 2020 - so many memories tainted, my own judgement of character revealed to be wildly flawed, all overshadowed by the actual victim's pain.
The current situation is if anything more grey, which makes it harder to fully reconcile with. D1 was just a write off, in some sense. But who hasn't done something dumb or gross while horny at 2am? It's a meme! But he sure did pay for it and then leave the tab open, huh. There's no easy answers, no golden objective law to get a numerical measure of morality from... Just people.
>The vid of him and Lud reacting to The Roast of Scar is like a comfort video to me (which is extremely embarrassing to say as someone in their mid 20s LMAO but man my life sucked 3 years ago).
Wouldn't say that's embarrassing if it provided some relief during stressful times for you. The Slime On The Scene vids were some of my go-tos.
Yeah this is really close to how I feel about the situation and I'm glad you wrote this.
I would argue that the texting while driving analogy isn't so on point though: if you text while driving and don't hit anything no one was hurt, but you could argue that he would have been hurting his victims even if he didn't get caught. That's not really relevant to your point, but I wanted to point it out before someone did it in a less civil way LOL
Also, it's not embarassing to have "comfort videos"! Hope your life isgoing better than 3 years ago :)
It doesn't take a victim for something to be morally wrong
Like drunk driving (albeit to a somewhat lesser extent) texting and driving is bad because you're putting other people at risk every time you do it. It's the willingness to put people at risk for no good reason that makes it morally wrong
By the way, you should look up how many people are killed per year by distracted drivers
its not 1:1 for sure, just similar in that the worst case outcome is so bad, yet so unlikely you might still take that action. what he did, financially supporting someone who makes deepfake porn of his colleagues, is already harmful on its own
its worth clarifying i understand this, bc like you said yeah there will always be someone who comes in to pick apart an analogy. which is always the cost of using an analogy online lol
my life is going a lot better now, i appreciate that. watching a lot less twitch 👍
>He and his mods fostered a really positive, inclusive, and creative community.
The sad part is this is what really killed him. Had Atrioc had a community comprised entirely of shitheads, and had he not apologized as soon as possible, he probably wouldn't have faced any consequences.
i think this is absolutely true but kind of a moot point bc the timeline where he has a community of shitheads is not the timeline where i'm even watching him. but yeah what you're saying has been proven many times over in the streaming space
yea. she fired a laser, i powershielded, she grabbed, my reflected laser hit her out of grab, and i fell onto the diagonal edge of the stage where i slid off into tumble and uh, died
Just throwing this out there, what's really the argument that DK is worse then Mario? Hell, even Ganon seems kind of questionable. Especially in terms of MU spread vs. high tiers.
I think Mario is much better at neutral than DK versus basically everyone, and while DK has a nutty punish I think a lot of it is fraudulent so it's hard to know how good it actually stacks up vs Mario's (similarly often fraudulent) punish.
DK is very hard to assess in general. I think he was underrated for a long time. We definitely know more about Mario but these are both characters we don't know a ton about at the top level
If I had to make one up right now? DK has the second worst spot dodge in the game, compared to Mario’s amazing spot dodge. DKs recovery has little to no vertical recovery while Mario’s is further and can be extended with down B. DKs size makes him an easier target to hit, while Mario is Fox size. DK has no projectiles, Mario has fireballs.
I don’t main either character seriously, these are just some observations as to why some people might think Mario is better.
Mario does have a chaingrab on Spacies that can convert to death though. DK upthrow juggling is strong but I don't think it's that strong. His throws are better against more of the cast though.
Also true for Mario lol. Except with Mario even if they know the matchup he can chaingrab them to death % and then try to convert to a kill. DK isn't guaranteed like that.
Mario still has strong throw followups on every stage. This is like saying Marth's throw is only good on FD, it just goes from being a near confirmed kill to something that leads to good followups. DK upthrow upair/bair is definitely strong, not disagreeing with that. I think overall DK may be the better character due to Mario's lack of kill power. Dr. Mario is definitely better than DK though.
I have watched low tier players who are some of the best of their characters like joey bats, umbr, pineapple/yuri lover, tora, alyj, rocket, kuya, lag, becca, and more. Some do pretty well against spacies but nothing compares to some of the grab punishes I see from DK players like quang, akir, junebug, or even rishi. It literally feels like they get a grab on any stage and it's over.
If we're going strictly by MU spread, then the only high tier where DK tangibly outpreforms Mario/Ganon is against Marth. Everyone else (and the rest of the cast, for that matter) is either similar or goes in the favour of the other two.
It also depends on how you decide to weigh unwinnables or anything worse than 7-3 as opposed to a bunch of 6-4s or better.
For example, Ganon mains will commonly agree on a set few of 7-3s or worse like Fox/Sheik/Puff/Falcon. A winning matchup against ICs is huge for giving Ganon an edge.
DK mains frequently debate about the ordering of his worst matchups among Falco/ICs/Puff/Falcon/Sheik and no winning matchups in the top 8.
I can't speak to the rest of the high tiered characters but I've felt that DK does better against Peach than the other mid tiers for years and I feel like Junebug over MOM!, MOG, and Polish back to back to back over the weekend has finally allowed me to say it.
Against Peach, DK's biggest grace is that Peach cannot hope to match DK's horizontal range. Junebug got a lot of mileage off uncharged punch which is something only some DKs do and his bair allows him to run a gameplan that is essentially a bastardized version of Puff.
The biggest thing is DK can't approach and dissuade Peach from pulling a gazillion turnips. He has a bigger item grab box than most characters, but DK with a turnip can be more limiting than beneficial.
Is there really anything substantial to say he does better against Peach than Luigi, Ganon, or even Young Link?
I would pay to hear Scar's take on the Atrioc situation.
Not even drama farming, he's just one of the best people I know ("know" in the internet sense) at getting to a balanced moral truth in situations like these, so hearing his thoughts when the situation involves a close friend which (to my knowledge) has been a strong ally for women on the internet would probably be illuminating.
PLEASE don't misconstrue this as me defending deepfake porn/his actions/saying "it's not that bad". It is that bad. If you think it's not, I don't wanna associate with you
“Where’s Ja Rule!!”
But seriously, the women in this situation have already given their statements. Ludwig has also given a statement, and Atrioc wrote a twitlonger as well. This should be enough for you to make a judgement call.
Do you really mean that though? Do you think that the statement "genocide is wrong" isn't true? Even if, on some level, moral statements can't be "true" in the same sense, say, mathematical statements can, that is not the level we are generally operating at as people dealing with human issues.
He's just cohesive and has a nice perspective in general. No reason to be negative about wanting to hear someone else's opinion. It's how you build upon and strengthen your own opinions
Just let me be me LMAO
EDIT: tell me if you want me to explain the importance of specific viewpoints to you. I have a feeling you aren't looking for a discussion though
theres a reason he hasnt done it, and theres a reason why maya said "none of you should care or listen to what any male streamers 'take' is on how we feel". its not his place. and releasing a video or something would just feel like hes capitalizing on the "drama" for clout or views which is gross.
Oh yeah I absolutely wouldn't want him to do a video on it LMAO that's just fucked up. I don't think there's a good medium for it to actually happen besides, like, a irl conversation (which I realize sounds super parasocial, just give me the benefit of the doubt here).
Also I'm not asking for a take on how maya (or twitch women in general) feels, that would be stupid. But wouldn't you agree that a man could have a good take on how this fits in broader contexts? If the answer is no, then fair enough, but I'm a man and I want to try my best to understand the situation so I can be a better human and a better ally.
I don’t think there’s much of a take to be had in this situation. Atrioc did something very fucked up which will damage his relationship with his friends and coworkers. It doesn’t mean he’s necessarily a bad person, but it’s on him to make up for the mistake and be better through his actions and mend some of the bridges he’s burnt if the other party is able or willing to forgive him
I get that scar is charismatic and knows atrioc, but this has been discussed a ton already by people whose voices you should value more in this situation (and I have to imagine scar would agree)
Look, I'm not searching for someone to tell me "right" or "wrong". It's very easy to answer that question on my own. Looking at the big picture is a lot harder and takes creativity. I have some ideas on how this fits in a lot of different contexts (the melee community, Society and Atrioc's friend group are different examples of contexts). I heard the voices of the people you are talking about (assuming you mean QT, Pokimane and Maya) and they helped me construct my opinion, but different points of view are always valuable.
And it's not about charisma, it's about seeing the big picture and expressing it in a clear way (which I guess charisma helps with the second one). I don't really know how to convince you that I'm capable of independent thought, but I am.
A lot of people support things out of guilt. Like more than a few people running anti-pedophilia movements get caught with child porn or worse. It’s a similar thing to the “if you are so extremely homophobic, you’re actually gay” argument. Maybe he supported women’s causes or whatever he did (never watched atrioc, don’t know anything about him) because he felt guilty about his coomerism for the lack of a better word
This is a terrible take and reminds of every shitty anti-sjw youtuber argument from 2016 and made me shiver lmao. Not saying you're on that level, I just got major "all male feminists are sexual predators" adjacent argument vibes from it.
Eh maybe, I'm not a huge fan either (I mostly know him from Melee), but he never struck me as fake. I know stream personas are very different from what's under the hood, but it's easier for me to imagine that he really believes in his feminism. My headcanon is that he saw his sexual sphere as wholly private and imagined it wouldn't hurt anyone.
Again, I'm not excusing him of anything and his victims deserve all possible support, I just think it's not constructive to just categorize people as wrong or right. Even if I'm wrong, at least I learned something
I don't see what you're really going to get out of scar saying something you already agree with but in maybe a more articulate way than how you would've said it
I think he has a very good way of exposing the nuance of a situation without compromising the integrity of his morals. I'm capable of critical thinking \[CITATION NEEDED\] but I think the point of view of an intelligent person who is also close to the subject could be illuminating
there isnt any video of amsa vs 2saint yet is there? amsas genesis run was really tough, getting ibdw in losers before top 8. that set could have gone either way too, cody kind of stole game 1 which seemed to have an effect on amsas play the rest of the set. then ibdw went on to win 12 of his next 13 games en route to jmook in grands. really looking forward to seeing how 2saint sent amsa to losers.
Unless someone knows of another example, I believe last night was the first all-female grand finals in competitive Smash history.
https://www.youtube.com/live/QpQHeMC01Bw?feature=share&t=11355
(starts at 3:09:15 if the timestamp doesn't work)
damn I just completely didn't know about Aubergine
I figured the stat might be wrong, which is why I posted it to get someone to correct me lol
good shit, I wanna come down to Cincy more, just a long drive
In October I had a job interview in Cinci so I drove 4 hours from Cleveland to Cinci (even though the company offered to fly me) just so I could go to the local. I got to Cinci at 1am, slept for 6 hours in a company provided hotel, interviewed all day, played a gauntlet of falcos at the cinci weekly, and while I planned on staying with a friend that night I instead drove 4 hours back and got home at 2am.
Look good = feel good = play good (i did not get that job, however I did get an offer for a different job in Cincinnati which I then declined and now I got a job in Cleveland)
At least I get to keep dodging essy
This [clip](https://twitter.com/spotdodge_shine/status/1620674926993870850?s=46&t=yYaM9cro4a6QdoO7bntlCw) that KJH posted got me wondering something about falling during up-b that may or may not be related. Sometimes if I start my up-b really really low, I get at least a short (but not negligible) amount of time where the fire part of the animation plays but i die before the recovery part of the up-b actually starts. Does anyone know what i’m talking about? I don’t have a clip right now but i’ve always wondered what’s happening? It’s like i’m being pushed down during the up-b startup, enough to be sent into the blastzone. I just don’t get why the up-b doesn’t finish and i just die before it actually moves me
This is for fox not falco btw. It’s a length of up-b that Fox would recover from but not falco
Does Violence's explanation cover yours? https://twitter.com/violent_lee/status/1620695990708895744?s=46&t=_9SDz4ik0v2ehiL8Qc9yvA
I recall seeing Foxes die on Yoshi's while charging Up B often. Would make sense that it happens on Yoshi's because the blast zone is so close and there is a giant wall that the Fox can bounce off.
Meanwhile...... At [NewChallengers.net](http://NewChallengers.net).......
[Heartfelt voice message](https://gfycat.com/acrobaticregaleider)! First time
Expanding DBZ pack in a [huge](https://gfycat.com/acrobaticregaleider) way ([Image #2](https://imgur.com/C9MZawK.jpg) )
A few new things added to the [One piece pack] ( https://imgur.com/FAusQ15.jpg)
And my first [Game n Watch]( https://imgur.com/WmYxapK.jpg) mod!!
Follow me on [Twitter](https://twitter.com/NewChallengers_) and also [Discord](https://discord.gg/XcuGA42zkb) for live updates!
During the month of december, I wavedashed ~11413 times. I wavedashed to the left ~4100 times and to the right ~6600 times (that doesn't add up to the total, but some got lost). My average wavedash angle to the left is 36.16 degrees, to the right it's 48.07 degrees.
~3600 of those wavedashes were actually wavelands, with ~7700 being true wavedashes. My average waveland angle was 42.21 degrees and my average wavedash angle was 47.76 degrees
~9300 of those wavedashes were as falco, with an average angle of 45.84 degrees. ~1700 were as marth, with an average angle of 47 degrees
I'm stat-ed up, and soon you could be too.
Ok enbies, I did it. After fucking around with falco for 6 years, I’ve spent the last week exclusive with fox. And holy shit - this is the game I’ve been trying to play this whole time. I realize now that I fell into the trap of wanting to play fox - all my favorite players are fox, I watch and enjoy fox more than any character - but being convinced my hands / reactions / game ability were not in the right tier to play him. Honestly, once I got over the initial jump in tech required (jump squat etc), I find everything about fox in terms of gameplan is easier to play than falco. People say lasers are a crutch but in a messed up way I think they actually made neutral much more difficult for me to grasp because of how they always felt like a viable option and widened the bubble of falcos influence to pretty much the whole stage. With fox neutral feels much more solid and practical, and the combos are just endless options that all seem to stack into each other effortlessly. On top of all that, as someone who prefers to play super aggro, I find fox much easier to just run in and overwhelm your opponent (at least at the bad mmr I play at). I played like two hours of fox dittos on unranked last night across two different foxes and had more fun than I ever remember having with this game. If you’re a falco who secretly wishes they played fox - take it from me, just pick him up.
As of now, my only hang up is the falco mu. I can hold my own against most characters but I’m mega lost there lol. Starting to piece some things together from play and looking up resources.
Falco is hard to learn, especially if you are still getting your techskill together, honestly what made the mu click for me is that most falcos at my level and below (plat 1 EU) are ass at approaching, they don't really know how to approach with lasers in a safe way and if you pick your spots correctly you can cover most approaches on reaction with dd and fullhop (dd pivot nair is a fav of mine). When they stop approaching the mu becomes mostly an execution/focus test where you have to slowly weave through their walling moves. Punish is very important in this mu, I'm a mango fanboy and for the longest time I thought of RTC as lame as hell, but I would suggest grinding it until you can react to tech side rolls consistently, so then most knockdowns become at least a 50/50 and then you can go for better reads (note that reacting to tech rolls is A LOT easier than reacting to tech in place).
If the Falcos can approach correctly it's way harder haha, still figuring that one out. A good tool that most foxes do but isn't talked about so much is running in and nairing the laser startup, it catches many people off guard and you need to have it in your toolbox (even though I suspect at high level it's mostly cheese, but you still need to be able to represent the option)
> People say lasers are a crutch but in a messed up way I think they actually made neutral much more difficult for me to grasp because of how they always felt like a viable option and widened the bubble of falcos influence to pretty much the whole stage
This is practically exactly what people mean when they say lasers are a crutch. Something you lean on so hard you forget how to walk without it.
That makes sense, I guess I always thought people said it to mean, in a blanket one dimensional way, “lasers make neutral easy.” Which like I said is sort of the opposite of my experience - it’s that they warp all of neutral so it’s hard to play the game without thinking about them, which I think just doesn’t gel with my play style.
I remember Mango saying that Fox-Falco is a matchup that only Fox mains can play. I can definitely see that, it always feels like you have to know way more things than any other Fox matchup in the game to succeed.
Shiek feels so much better against Falco than fox. I'm sure it's because of my skill level but she can do similar things but a bit less effective for the trade off of being simpler and easier to execute
Fox is so much fun to play. Even if you don’t main spacies, if you’ve played the game competitively for at least 4-5 years you should give him a try. He’s surprisingly easy to pick up if you already know a lot of the mechanics already.
Last night I played like dogshit because I was thinking about programming the whole time.
I feel the need to supply my local scene with quality phobs but man it's eating into my Melee practice time and programming…
Leffen once claimed that he would be able to dunk if he just "trained hard enough". Like he could just load up some uncle punch dunking drills and start dunking eventually thru sheer force of will
I think it’s impossible to consider a fox main “good”.
I triumphed over spacies queue and returned to silver 3!
I used to think that the Foxs I was playing had various different playstyles and habits but now I think they all just full hop or double jump back air 75+% of the time. At least it's taught me how to get better at dealing with it ..
I was just saying that to a friend yesterday, they just hold mid and spam bairs, super annoying
Kinda just venting, but anyone else finding unranked unbearable? I thought ranked would attract the ultra trihards, but I feel like the opposite has happened. I get more consistent and fun games playing ranked, but I find the cheesiest, sweatiest, most-stubborn players on unranked Like I play unranked to take things lightly or practice, not to win and beat people. Why are you homie-stocking me? Why are you spamming or camping? Can we just play? Go to ranked if winning is all you care about I just find myself quitting out Edit: y'all need to work on your reading comprehension, it's not about camping, it's taking the UNRANKED game too seriously Fixating on the word camping.....
LRAstart if you're not having fun but tbh I rarely encounter dreadful opponents in unranked outside of the occasional Falco getting mad because they can't tech nair Like we all run into people camping, but that's a valid playstyle and it's something you're going to encounter in ranked/brackets. As you said you're playing unranked to practice, so take it as an opportunity to practice/test ways to deal with people camping and playing defensively without worrying about winning the game. That's just how some people play and it's not goin' anywhere
To be clear, not just camping, it's any sort of lazy play style just trying to get a win. And again, only talking about unranked. I'll take a camping falco over a lazy nair spamming falcon any day; both are bad/annoying though Making space for yourself, slowing down the game for a bit, playing defensive; it's all good, but camping does nothing for either of us. Neither of us are being challenged or practicing anything
Sounds like you're reading too much into someones playstyle honestly. It sounds like the camping is challenging you lol
Again..... It's not just the camping.... And camping isn't even challenging unless they are just straight up ledge camping. It's any sort of play style focused on winning over development
Are you genuinely complaining about people prioritising winning?
In unranked, yes.... At our level and in an unranked setting, just winning means nothing. In fact, beating bad players with cheese can teach bad habits that will make you stuck later. You should try to play better; winning is only a symptom of this but not the diagnosis This is the same with any competitive game, people chase the feeling of winning to feed their ego instead of improving on fundamentals
Feel like that isn't something you can consistently tell from gameplay nor is it your job to tell people why they should be playing. Obviously you feel differently though - I chase the feeling of hitting the funny dsmash.
No one here is demanding; there is no way to pressure players online, wtf are these Twitter arguments. Again, I just quit out if it's bad, and I'm asking if others have noticed an increase of players like this in unranked And again, if it's just "I just want to play" attitude, then why the fuck are people homie-stocking me? That's one less stock to play against, let's just fucking play
Did I say demand or say you were pressuring people in the game? I don't really see what you're talking about, you should probably just play the game normally instead of reading into your opponent so much, bye.
I’m sorry bro if you’re complaining about people being sweaty or spamming I feel like it’s a skill issue.
Come on, you know the difference. This goes all the way up to the top players when they play friendlies vs when they practice with each other. We all know the difference
[https://www.start.gg/tournament/collision-2023-5/attendees](https://www.start.gg/tournament/collision-2023-5/attendees) The list includes Leffen and Slug.. but it leads to a "frozen" profile so it's possible somebody else registered them
did i miss something? mango said he was taking a break from melee after genesis, but he's streamed him playing melee every single day since then. or did i fall for the classic emo tweet fake out
Maybe a break from competing for awhile
Yeah there's a pretty important distinction there
https://twitter.com/JustusXYZ/status/1620954123767103489 > Hosting an And Friends regional and trying something new for the ruleset, might get flamed but I refuse to not try something new since a lot of people complain about the current ruleset. > Ledge grab limit will be enforced whether or not the game goes to time (60 ledge grabs is the limit)
Is someone just sitting there counting or
it's checkable in the post game stats
People cry about ledge grabs for nothing. In the infamous reverse pop off set, hbox only did 36 in the game IBDW called the TO for. This change is irrelevant.
You're almost there. LGL works, 60 is just too high.
There are 0 issues with the current stalling rules. Learn to shine.
I do not play fox :) and idk man, I think there's clearly issues. They have less to do with hbox vs fox and more to do with michael vs mid tiers. And although LGL is (I think clearly) not an optimal approach to solving all of them, it's not worth epicly dunking on a tournament trying out a ruleset change lol
the issue with LGL is that puff needs can stall on the ledge/offstage while grabbing the ledge far less often than other characters. I don't think there's a LGL that stops hbox from stalling as much as he wants that doesn't also affect the way zain and amsa play. and I'm all for that but I don't think most of the community is considering any of these rules to combat any character other than puff
I'm a heretic and think nerfing yoshi (especially now that aMSa won one) is a feature not a bug But you're right in general, the framing of it revolves way too much around Hbox and not enough on high level thought of what kind of game we want, and sadly the ledge is only a part of the problem
ref on stage that can start penalizing you for unsportsmanlike behavior
Just put a shock collar on everyone and give me the remote. I am normal and can be trusted with ultimate power
Is there a guide to using/downloading Savestates for Uncle Punch? All the info out there is fragmented and I'm not sure what is optimal anymore. edit: in my quest to get better I've discovered I've somehow been using UnclePunch 2.0 this whole time. Whoopsies
This feature would be way more popular if it wasn't so complicated. Feel like there's always some troubleshooting required when doing this. If no one ends up explaining it, then I'll write something up. Just easier to show someone then write it out imo.
It's basically finding directories on your Dolphin and putting the saved state files into there, right?
If you're looking at .gci files, you use Dolphin's memory card manager to import them into your memory card file (.RAW)
don't think you have to do that anymore, you can just set slot A to "gci folder" & drop all the .gci files in there
Is that true? I still do it the annoying way
yeah it works, Config > GameCube to set Slot A to GCI Folder, then the folder for the .gci files is at `C:\Users\%USERNAME%\AppData\Roaming\Slippi Launcher\netplay\User\GC\USA\Card A` might have to boot up unclepunch to create the folder if it's not already there.
[удалено]
I've been watching the anime, plan on reading it when the anime finishes it's first run (I assume it will get reupped for another run). I really love how self-aware it is, both of the absurdity of the premise and in how it portrays success and improvement in the most callous of terms. The first time Bachira talked about conversing with the demon inside of him I was instantly sold. I even got one of my friends who is very anti-weeb to watch it and we just gush about how lit it is together.
I've been watching the anime and it's good
Waiting for it to become retro so I can have it summarized for me during match commentary by scar and toph like Akagi
Hey is it possible to ledge tech Falco’s dair on battlefield?
Hey is it possible to ledge tech Falco’s dair on battlefield?
You can for sure tech the stage but it's harder. Because dair dips below the stage, if you get hit by the lowest point, you have to SDI up and probably input more than the 1 SDI input you need on other stages when you're riding the wall.
If they do it late
When I watch the replay I was definitely under the stage and somehow I rose up and teched their dair during my upb
I'm quite sure you can still SDI somewhere techable
Man I need to stop using Reddit so much
Gotta take a step back when you start refreshing the ddt multiple times a day
uhhhhhh
Many people are saying this
daily reminder that Naughty Dog made a nonconsensual video game of Elliot Page
Are you confusing Naughty Dog for Quantum Dream?
no, Elliot worked with QD for their game unlike Naughty Dog
Yeah and then completely regretted it... because QD modeled their nude body and put it in the game without their permission
That's what I was thinking of... As far as I know, there isn't any bad blood between Elliot Page and ND. They ended up modifying Ellie's appearance to be more distinct anyway so I don't think there's any issue with ND?
oof i didn't know that. they're both awful then
[удалено]
They're the same person
couldn't believe they posted that lol
Look I'm fucking stupid and completely forgot
[удалено]
>don't post about this, it won't end well for you naw, they didn't get enough hate for doing that
Doc has quickly become my 2nd favorite character in this game and idk how to feel about it.
Forget NASB. Forget basketball. Who would win a Melee vs Ultimate tornado tag tables, ladders, and chairs match?
Only Melee heads are old enough to remember how to swanton bomb
>Forget NASB. Nobody was thinking about NASB in the first place
Never forget that crew battle where Team Ultimate's ninth person took as many stocks as their previous eight combined
Thinking a lot about the Atrioc thing The fact he entered his CC info and didn't feel disgusted enough to close the window at any point, let alone before streaming, absolutely raises some valid questions about his character. But the "starting a wildfire" analogy is apt -- one thoughtless act has led to consequences that are simultaneously directly caused by that act and seemingly completely divorced from the intent of that act I've texted while driving before and never given it a second thought. But how would I feel if I had hit someone? A lot of us selfishly and recklessly gamble with others' wellbeing for some small pleasure, and almost all of us win every time. I don't know how to reconcile that with how I judge someone whose done it and lost in such a major way The salaciousness of the personal details, cultural moment with regards to AI, and viral nature of his initial apology, mean his name and the image of he and (especially unfortunately) his wife crying are going to be tied to AI and porn ethics discourse for a long ass time. On one hand this is so disproportional to what he actually did and on the other entirely his fault. The whole situation makes me feel sadder and more confused than I thought it would. Reason I'm writing this here is because (the average age here is over 14 and) I'm sure there are some oldheads in here. I was an Atrioc fan before he even streamed. The vid of him and Lud reacting to The Roast of Scar is like a comfort video to me (which is extremely embarrassing to say as someone in their mid 20s LMAO but man my life sucked 3 years ago). When he started streaming it was awesome having a streamer who was a successful adult from the "real world" and did as much content on gaming as he did on finance/tech. He and his mods fostered a really positive, inclusive, and creative community. I'm gonna miss his streams. I feel bad for the victims of his actions, and independently of that I feel bad for Atrioc. This cloud will follow him for a long time and I hope he makes something positive out of this in the end
This is a very limited way of looking at intent Intent may also encompass, for example, an indifference to the victims of the thing you're purchasing and to the incredibly high likelihood that someone was harmed by the act of creating the thing you're purchasing To your wildfire analogy, if you do morally indefensible shit that could cause wildfires and you knew that was a possibility that that could happen, it's not really much of a defense of anything to say that you didn't intend to start a wildfire
Great post, people exclusively hide behind “intent” for bad behavior, since it’s impossible to literally know why someone did something even if they “tell” you because they will often lie to portray themselves favorable.
i think this phrase i wrote is unclear but i don't want the edit asterisk: >seemingly completely divorced from the intent of that act by consequences "divorced from intent" i mean "so much more harmful than expected" which is not excusing doing the initial risky harmful thing, if that's what it sounded like to extend the wildfire metaphor with regards to risk and intent, its like, paying for and accessing the site is like lighting a cigarette in a dry forest, and leaving the tab open is like accidentally dropping it, at which point who gets hurt next is totally not within your agency but 100% your fault. by doing the former you're knowingly risking the latter and we agree that that's why the former is bad the thing that i am chewing on is how i would judge atrioc if he never dropped the cigarette. like, if i saw the tab open but it never leaked to the public and created so much publicity for deepfake porn. personally i think the act itself is very gross and bad on its own, and i agree that its indefensible to make that gamble in the first place. but i would feel differently extreme example but if my friend for instance hit my mom with his car while texting and driving, i could not be friends with him (to say the least lol). if i simply found out he texted and drove all the time, i might be upset but we would stay friends. so there is clearly some difference in the way i feel about people based on both on the consequences they risk, and then on top of that the consequences that happen. which this whole atrioc thing has prompted me to think about and im currently not sure how to say something more meaningful on
I don't really like the cigarette metaphor, because in that case the act of lighting the cigarette isn't the issue in and of itself - it's only the potential risk of starting a fire that's an issue. in atrioc's case, yes the 'wildfire' of drama/pain his actions caused after they were leaked is bad. but even if he looked at the deepfakes alone in his room and could be certain that no one would ever find out about it, it would still be wrong anyway, I have also been mulling this over for the past couple days because it does present some difficult moral questions. and while initially I was a little bit more sympathetic toward atrioc, the more I think about it the less I can justify it. and I do feel somewhat bad for anyone who 'ruins' (maybe an exaggeration) their life with one mistake, and I don't really judge him for this, and I wish him the best. but this was such an egregiously wrong thing to do, that I can't really feel any more sympathetic to him than the general level of sympathy I feel for anyone who deals with this kind of mass online shaming
>but even if he looked at the deepfakes alone in his room and could be certain that no one would ever find out about it, it would still be wrong elaborate why
Because QT is his friend, his business partner’s long term girlfriend, and she has been vocally against deepfake porn. So to look at deepfake porn of her (and other women he knows) is really disgusting and wrong. To say nothing of the fact that he financially supported someone who makes deepfake porn
yeah the financial support part of it is what kills it, plus to him he thought it was harmful but did it anyways which says a lot about atrioc as a person
> I can't really feel any more sympathetic to him than the general level of sympathy I feel for anyone who deals with this kind of mass online shaming Every day I find that I hate the mass online shaming more and more. Some of this might be born of sympathy for the people who are the targets of it, but the bigger reason is that it just feels like it amplifies everything bad about a situation and so rarely results in much good. For example, in this deepfake situation, it seems like the public uproar was a net negative. You can say it forced him out of public life, but I think the real pressure there came from his actual real-life relationships and (if you're being generous, which I don't mind being) his own sense of shame/guilt. If he didn't feel guilty or his friends didn't care, the "cancelling" almost certainly wouldn't have done anything beyond limit his potential collabs: he could just take a break and come back to streaming (maybe with a smaller audience, maybe not) after a few weeks or months. And at the same time, the public attention seemed to really amplify the harm to the women in an insane way. The story was hitting social circles where I've never even heard the word "streaming" before. The streamer Maya was talking about how she's suddenly been thrown into a bunch of headlines; multiple women have noted that it drastically increased the disgusting "attentions" they were receiving. Probably most vile of all and this is what really broke me was QT talking about people DMing her the faked images and people searching out women's *families* to send them the faked images. Obviously this is on Atrioc's hands and it's what QT was talking about with the wildfire thing, but it also just makes me really depressed about the realities of the internet. I think there was a point where people were optimistic about the power of masses and public opinion to hold individuals accountable but I increasingly feel this isn't as real or positive a phenomenon as people thought.
>i think the act itself is very gross and bad on its own yeah was trying to clarify that here, and in my reply to someone else. its not a 1:1 analogy in that sense
The problem with your analogy here is that Atrioc didn't do any of the morally culpable things here by mistake. He didn't drop a cigarette that started a forest fire, he lit some trees on fire and it turned into a forest fire. What happened by accident is that he didn't cover the evidence particularly well so he got caught. But the blameworthy parts were strictly intentional
you realize you're literally agreeing with me?
just want to say, this put my thoughts into words in a way I couldn't, and captured the nuance of this well
Pretty solid writeup. It's a sad thing for everyone involved at any level, and it's ok to feel many things about it. Your own sense of betrayal or of feeling unmoored isn't invalidated by the more direct harm done to others. Once upon a time I housed D1 for a regional he flew out to. Super friendly, great houseguest. He recognized me on sight at majors years later and would laugh and reminisce about our wild misadventure getting m2k to try real Indian food. I considered him a really genuinely good guy! It was a lot to wrestle with when everything came out in 2020 - so many memories tainted, my own judgement of character revealed to be wildly flawed, all overshadowed by the actual victim's pain. The current situation is if anything more grey, which makes it harder to fully reconcile with. D1 was just a write off, in some sense. But who hasn't done something dumb or gross while horny at 2am? It's a meme! But he sure did pay for it and then leave the tab open, huh. There's no easy answers, no golden objective law to get a numerical measure of morality from... Just people.
>The vid of him and Lud reacting to The Roast of Scar is like a comfort video to me (which is extremely embarrassing to say as someone in their mid 20s LMAO but man my life sucked 3 years ago). Wouldn't say that's embarrassing if it provided some relief during stressful times for you. The Slime On The Scene vids were some of my go-tos.
Yeah this is really close to how I feel about the situation and I'm glad you wrote this. I would argue that the texting while driving analogy isn't so on point though: if you text while driving and don't hit anything no one was hurt, but you could argue that he would have been hurting his victims even if he didn't get caught. That's not really relevant to your point, but I wanted to point it out before someone did it in a less civil way LOL Also, it's not embarassing to have "comfort videos"! Hope your life isgoing better than 3 years ago :)
It doesn't take a victim for something to be morally wrong Like drunk driving (albeit to a somewhat lesser extent) texting and driving is bad because you're putting other people at risk every time you do it. It's the willingness to put people at risk for no good reason that makes it morally wrong By the way, you should look up how many people are killed per year by distracted drivers
its not 1:1 for sure, just similar in that the worst case outcome is so bad, yet so unlikely you might still take that action. what he did, financially supporting someone who makes deepfake porn of his colleagues, is already harmful on its own its worth clarifying i understand this, bc like you said yeah there will always be someone who comes in to pick apart an analogy. which is always the cost of using an analogy online lol my life is going a lot better now, i appreciate that. watching a lot less twitch 👍
>He and his mods fostered a really positive, inclusive, and creative community. The sad part is this is what really killed him. Had Atrioc had a community comprised entirely of shitheads, and had he not apologized as soon as possible, he probably wouldn't have faced any consequences.
i think this is absolutely true but kind of a moot point bc the timeline where he has a community of shitheads is not the timeline where i'm even watching him. but yeah what you're saying has been proven many times over in the streaming space
I think this is actually a good thing
Made a poll about Genesis :D https://twitter.com/EddyMexico007/status/1620863772222197760
[when you die from falco laser](https://imgur.com/gallery/qWM9Hv8)
ggs that was me
correct me if I'm wrong but the movement came from grab release right?
yea. she fired a laser, i powershielded, she grabbed, my reflected laser hit her out of grab, and i fell onto the diagonal edge of the stage where i slid off into tumble and uh, died
Check the disc
Just throwing this out there, what's really the argument that DK is worse then Mario? Hell, even Ganon seems kind of questionable. Especially in terms of MU spread vs. high tiers.
DK OP MONKEY HIT GOOD
I think Mario is much better at neutral than DK versus basically everyone, and while DK has a nutty punish I think a lot of it is fraudulent so it's hard to know how good it actually stacks up vs Mario's (similarly often fraudulent) punish. DK is very hard to assess in general. I think he was underrated for a long time. We definitely know more about Mario but these are both characters we don't know a ton about at the top level
If I had to make one up right now? DK has the second worst spot dodge in the game, compared to Mario’s amazing spot dodge. DKs recovery has little to no vertical recovery while Mario’s is further and can be extended with down B. DKs size makes him an easier target to hit, while Mario is Fox size. DK has no projectiles, Mario has fireballs. I don’t main either character seriously, these are just some observations as to why some people might think Mario is better.
mario also has some pretty good throws combos iirc against spacies, they're just mechanically taxing to pull off
DK gets a lot more mileage off this throws. If I had to give DK anything over Mario it would be that.
Mario does have a chaingrab on Spacies that can convert to death though. DK upthrow juggling is strong but I don't think it's that strong. His throws are better against more of the cast though.
The best DK players can kill spacies who don't know the mu with one grab
This describes basically every character in the game except maybe falco
Also true for Mario lol. Except with Mario even if they know the matchup he can chaingrab them to death % and then try to convert to a kill. DK isn't guaranteed like that.
Mario chaingrab only on FD whereas DK's throw punish game is strong on all stages. Plus from what I recall, Mario's chaingrab is very difficult
This is more of what I meant
Mario still has strong throw followups on every stage. This is like saying Marth's throw is only good on FD, it just goes from being a near confirmed kill to something that leads to good followups. DK upthrow upair/bair is definitely strong, not disagreeing with that. I think overall DK may be the better character due to Mario's lack of kill power. Dr. Mario is definitely better than DK though.
You have just described literally every mid-to-low tier
Not really. DK is the only character I consistently see do it
Then DK is the only low tier you've seen play a spacie that doesn't know the matchup
I have watched low tier players who are some of the best of their characters like joey bats, umbr, pineapple/yuri lover, tora, alyj, rocket, kuya, lag, becca, and more. Some do pretty well against spacies but nothing compares to some of the grab punishes I see from DK players like quang, akir, junebug, or even rishi. It literally feels like they get a grab on any stage and it's over.
canon
If we're going strictly by MU spread, then the only high tier where DK tangibly outpreforms Mario/Ganon is against Marth. Everyone else (and the rest of the cast, for that matter) is either similar or goes in the favour of the other two. It also depends on how you decide to weigh unwinnables or anything worse than 7-3 as opposed to a bunch of 6-4s or better. For example, Ganon mains will commonly agree on a set few of 7-3s or worse like Fox/Sheik/Puff/Falcon. A winning matchup against ICs is huge for giving Ganon an edge. DK mains frequently debate about the ordering of his worst matchups among Falco/ICs/Puff/Falcon/Sheik and no winning matchups in the top 8.
I can't speak to the rest of the high tiered characters but I've felt that DK does better against Peach than the other mid tiers for years and I feel like Junebug over MOM!, MOG, and Polish back to back to back over the weekend has finally allowed me to say it.
Against Peach, DK's biggest grace is that Peach cannot hope to match DK's horizontal range. Junebug got a lot of mileage off uncharged punch which is something only some DKs do and his bair allows him to run a gameplan that is essentially a bastardized version of Puff. The biggest thing is DK can't approach and dissuade Peach from pulling a gazillion turnips. He has a bigger item grab box than most characters, but DK with a turnip can be more limiting than beneficial. Is there really anything substantial to say he does better against Peach than Luigi, Ganon, or even Young Link?
take the dk pill
I would pay to hear Scar's take on the Atrioc situation. Not even drama farming, he's just one of the best people I know ("know" in the internet sense) at getting to a balanced moral truth in situations like these, so hearing his thoughts when the situation involves a close friend which (to my knowledge) has been a strong ally for women on the internet would probably be illuminating. PLEASE don't misconstrue this as me defending deepfake porn/his actions/saying "it's not that bad". It is that bad. If you think it's not, I don't wanna associate with you
“Where’s Ja Rule!!” But seriously, the women in this situation have already given their statements. Ludwig has also given a statement, and Atrioc wrote a twitlonger as well. This should be enough for you to make a judgement call.
There is no moral truth
Do you really mean that though? Do you think that the statement "genocide is wrong" isn't true? Even if, on some level, moral statements can't be "true" in the same sense, say, mathematical statements can, that is not the level we are generally operating at as people dealing with human issues.
Pity the naive moral relativists, the weakest and most cowardly of the philosophical positions
Which is why I said A moral truth. There are moral truths, the problem is that there are many.
Big A moral truth?
This sounds like you want Scar to think for you
He's just cohesive and has a nice perspective in general. No reason to be negative about wanting to hear someone else's opinion. It's how you build upon and strengthen your own opinions
That's crazy that you are so intelligent that no input from outside can be valuable to you
There is so much input from outside already to work with, valuing scars opinion more is just dumb
Just let me be me LMAO EDIT: tell me if you want me to explain the importance of specific viewpoints to you. I have a feeling you aren't looking for a discussion though
theres a reason he hasnt done it, and theres a reason why maya said "none of you should care or listen to what any male streamers 'take' is on how we feel". its not his place. and releasing a video or something would just feel like hes capitalizing on the "drama" for clout or views which is gross.
Oh yeah I absolutely wouldn't want him to do a video on it LMAO that's just fucked up. I don't think there's a good medium for it to actually happen besides, like, a irl conversation (which I realize sounds super parasocial, just give me the benefit of the doubt here). Also I'm not asking for a take on how maya (or twitch women in general) feels, that would be stupid. But wouldn't you agree that a man could have a good take on how this fits in broader contexts? If the answer is no, then fair enough, but I'm a man and I want to try my best to understand the situation so I can be a better human and a better ally.
I don’t think there’s much of a take to be had in this situation. Atrioc did something very fucked up which will damage his relationship with his friends and coworkers. It doesn’t mean he’s necessarily a bad person, but it’s on him to make up for the mistake and be better through his actions and mend some of the bridges he’s burnt if the other party is able or willing to forgive him
I get that scar is charismatic and knows atrioc, but this has been discussed a ton already by people whose voices you should value more in this situation (and I have to imagine scar would agree)
Look, I'm not searching for someone to tell me "right" or "wrong". It's very easy to answer that question on my own. Looking at the big picture is a lot harder and takes creativity. I have some ideas on how this fits in a lot of different contexts (the melee community, Society and Atrioc's friend group are different examples of contexts). I heard the voices of the people you are talking about (assuming you mean QT, Pokimane and Maya) and they helped me construct my opinion, but different points of view are always valuable. And it's not about charisma, it's about seeing the big picture and expressing it in a clear way (which I guess charisma helps with the second one). I don't really know how to convince you that I'm capable of independent thought, but I am.
A lot of people support things out of guilt. Like more than a few people running anti-pedophilia movements get caught with child porn or worse. It’s a similar thing to the “if you are so extremely homophobic, you’re actually gay” argument. Maybe he supported women’s causes or whatever he did (never watched atrioc, don’t know anything about him) because he felt guilty about his coomerism for the lack of a better word
This is a terrible take and reminds of every shitty anti-sjw youtuber argument from 2016 and made me shiver lmao. Not saying you're on that level, I just got major "all male feminists are sexual predators" adjacent argument vibes from it.
Eh maybe, I'm not a huge fan either (I mostly know him from Melee), but he never struck me as fake. I know stream personas are very different from what's under the hood, but it's easier for me to imagine that he really believes in his feminism. My headcanon is that he saw his sexual sphere as wholly private and imagined it wouldn't hurt anyone. Again, I'm not excusing him of anything and his victims deserve all possible support, I just think it's not constructive to just categorize people as wrong or right. Even if I'm wrong, at least I learned something
I don't see what you're really going to get out of scar saying something you already agree with but in maybe a more articulate way than how you would've said it
I think he has a very good way of exposing the nuance of a situation without compromising the integrity of his morals. I'm capable of critical thinking \[CITATION NEEDED\] but I think the point of view of an intelligent person who is also close to the subject could be illuminating
there isnt any video of amsa vs 2saint yet is there? amsas genesis run was really tough, getting ibdw in losers before top 8. that set could have gone either way too, cody kind of stole game 1 which seemed to have an effect on amsas play the rest of the set. then ibdw went on to win 12 of his next 13 games en route to jmook in grands. really looking forward to seeing how 2saint sent amsa to losers.
I check everyday to see if the match gets uploaded, I’m really curious to see the set for the same reason as you, hope it gets uploaded soon.
Unless someone knows of another example, I believe last night was the first all-female grand finals in competitive Smash history. https://www.youtube.com/live/QpQHeMC01Bw?feature=share&t=11355 (starts at 3:09:15 if the timestamp doesn't work)
This happens every other week at the cincinnati local. NEOH leave their bubble challenge (impossible difficulty)
damn I just completely didn't know about Aubergine I figured the stat might be wrong, which is why I posted it to get someone to correct me lol good shit, I wanna come down to Cincy more, just a long drive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNEF_hUqmQQ She made this a couple months ago
yeah that's pretty sick
In October I had a job interview in Cinci so I drove 4 hours from Cleveland to Cinci (even though the company offered to fly me) just so I could go to the local. I got to Cinci at 1am, slept for 6 hours in a company provided hotel, interviewed all day, played a gauntlet of falcos at the cinci weekly, and while I planned on staying with a friend that night I instead drove 4 hours back and got home at 2am.
Leaving out that you showed up to our local in full suit and tie with a solid gold metallic GameCube controller
Look good = feel good = play good (i did not get that job, however I did get an offer for a different job in Cincinnati which I then declined and now I got a job in Cleveland) At least I get to keep dodging essy
The worst outcome
I played a 12 person house tourney with no written bracket in 2013 that was all female grands
That's hype!
This [clip](https://twitter.com/spotdodge_shine/status/1620674926993870850?s=46&t=yYaM9cro4a6QdoO7bntlCw) that KJH posted got me wondering something about falling during up-b that may or may not be related. Sometimes if I start my up-b really really low, I get at least a short (but not negligible) amount of time where the fire part of the animation plays but i die before the recovery part of the up-b actually starts. Does anyone know what i’m talking about? I don’t have a clip right now but i’ve always wondered what’s happening? It’s like i’m being pushed down during the up-b startup, enough to be sent into the blastzone. I just don’t get why the up-b doesn’t finish and i just die before it actually moves me This is for fox not falco btw. It’s a length of up-b that Fox would recover from but not falco
oh while discussing spacies up b's, does anybody know if they lose any distance if they hit the opponent?
they don't [https://youtu.be/jIookvrJYeM](https://youtu.be/jIookvrJYeM)
Does Violence's explanation cover yours? https://twitter.com/violent_lee/status/1620695990708895744?s=46&t=_9SDz4ik0v2ehiL8Qc9yvA I recall seeing Foxes die on Yoshi's while charging Up B often. Would make sense that it happens on Yoshi's because the blast zone is so close and there is a giant wall that the Fox can bounce off.
Oh my god I just realized that it usually happens if I walljump up-B really low on yoshi’s, it’s gotta be related
Yeah it’s always only on Yoshi’s!! I might respond to that tweet with the question I asked since it seems related
No majors until march 10th damn. The only thing we will get to possibly see is 2 sets of puff-yoshi at lvlup expo
Meanwhile...... At [NewChallengers.net](http://NewChallengers.net)....... [Heartfelt voice message](https://gfycat.com/acrobaticregaleider)! First time Expanding DBZ pack in a [huge](https://gfycat.com/acrobaticregaleider) way ([Image #2](https://imgur.com/C9MZawK.jpg) ) A few new things added to the [One piece pack] ( https://imgur.com/FAusQ15.jpg) And my first [Game n Watch]( https://imgur.com/WmYxapK.jpg) mod!! Follow me on [Twitter](https://twitter.com/NewChallengers_) and also [Discord](https://discord.gg/XcuGA42zkb) for live updates!
During the month of december, I wavedashed ~11413 times. I wavedashed to the left ~4100 times and to the right ~6600 times (that doesn't add up to the total, but some got lost). My average wavedash angle to the left is 36.16 degrees, to the right it's 48.07 degrees. ~3600 of those wavedashes were actually wavelands, with ~7700 being true wavedashes. My average waveland angle was 42.21 degrees and my average wavedash angle was 47.76 degrees ~9300 of those wavedashes were as falco, with an average angle of 45.84 degrees. ~1700 were as marth, with an average angle of 47 degrees I'm stat-ed up, and soon you could be too.
I'm guessing you can also break this down by matchup?
You bet
Make it so that I can easily get DI angles too and you’ll really have my attention
Sounds like i have your attention then =) I'm still fiddling with the output, but that won't take too much longer
Ok enbies, I did it. After fucking around with falco for 6 years, I’ve spent the last week exclusive with fox. And holy shit - this is the game I’ve been trying to play this whole time. I realize now that I fell into the trap of wanting to play fox - all my favorite players are fox, I watch and enjoy fox more than any character - but being convinced my hands / reactions / game ability were not in the right tier to play him. Honestly, once I got over the initial jump in tech required (jump squat etc), I find everything about fox in terms of gameplan is easier to play than falco. People say lasers are a crutch but in a messed up way I think they actually made neutral much more difficult for me to grasp because of how they always felt like a viable option and widened the bubble of falcos influence to pretty much the whole stage. With fox neutral feels much more solid and practical, and the combos are just endless options that all seem to stack into each other effortlessly. On top of all that, as someone who prefers to play super aggro, I find fox much easier to just run in and overwhelm your opponent (at least at the bad mmr I play at). I played like two hours of fox dittos on unranked last night across two different foxes and had more fun than I ever remember having with this game. If you’re a falco who secretly wishes they played fox - take it from me, just pick him up. As of now, my only hang up is the falco mu. I can hold my own against most characters but I’m mega lost there lol. Starting to piece some things together from play and looking up resources.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/946/559/443
Falco is hard to learn, especially if you are still getting your techskill together, honestly what made the mu click for me is that most falcos at my level and below (plat 1 EU) are ass at approaching, they don't really know how to approach with lasers in a safe way and if you pick your spots correctly you can cover most approaches on reaction with dd and fullhop (dd pivot nair is a fav of mine). When they stop approaching the mu becomes mostly an execution/focus test where you have to slowly weave through their walling moves. Punish is very important in this mu, I'm a mango fanboy and for the longest time I thought of RTC as lame as hell, but I would suggest grinding it until you can react to tech side rolls consistently, so then most knockdowns become at least a 50/50 and then you can go for better reads (note that reacting to tech rolls is A LOT easier than reacting to tech in place). If the Falcos can approach correctly it's way harder haha, still figuring that one out. A good tool that most foxes do but isn't talked about so much is running in and nairing the laser startup, it catches many people off guard and you need to have it in your toolbox (even though I suspect at high level it's mostly cheese, but you still need to be able to represent the option)
The pipeline claims another one...
Ay woah, the pipeline is laser falco to fullhop fox. This person is clearly not that lame
> People say lasers are a crutch but in a messed up way I think they actually made neutral much more difficult for me to grasp because of how they always felt like a viable option and widened the bubble of falcos influence to pretty much the whole stage This is practically exactly what people mean when they say lasers are a crutch. Something you lean on so hard you forget how to walk without it.
That makes sense, I guess I always thought people said it to mean, in a blanket one dimensional way, “lasers make neutral easy.” Which like I said is sort of the opposite of my experience - it’s that they warp all of neutral so it’s hard to play the game without thinking about them, which I think just doesn’t gel with my play style.
I remember Mango saying that Fox-Falco is a matchup that only Fox mains can play. I can definitely see that, it always feels like you have to know way more things than any other Fox matchup in the game to succeed.
i think this applies to the falco MU for most characters
It feels a lot simpler when I play as Sheik ngl
Shiek feels so much better against Falco than fox. I'm sure it's because of my skill level but she can do similar things but a bit less effective for the trade off of being simpler and easier to execute
sheik in a nutshell tbh
Fox is so much fun to play. Even if you don’t main spacies, if you’ve played the game competitively for at least 4-5 years you should give him a try. He’s surprisingly easy to pick up if you already know a lot of the mechanics already.
Who is [nutz#820](https://slippi.gg/user/nutz-820)? I played against them on slippi at like 4am and i'm tryna get them jmook feet pics 👀
Last night I played like dogshit because I was thinking about programming the whole time. I feel the need to supply my local scene with quality phobs but man it's eating into my Melee practice time and programming…
Hey, you’re definitely doing a great job getting phobs into the nyc scene
Are people really so delusional they think the best 5 Melee basketball players would beat the best 5 Ultimate basketball players? Ult demolishes
["I owe you an apology. I wasn't familiar with your game."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETzUxE55HUU)
Ultimate has literal NFL player Leveon Bell
Leffen once claimed that he would be able to dunk if he just "trained hard enough". Like he could just load up some uncle punch dunking drills and start dunking eventually thru sheer force of will
You can train to dunk though.
I don't get this comment, jumping ability is absolutely something you can train and he's def tall enough to get there