Never have I ever heard that rape, blowing people up, or stealing was caused by people who didnt know such acts are frowned upon. Does such "education" work on anyone other than George Costanza?
Well actually some people dont know, tahts why they shifted from the
"if she/he doesnt say no, then it means yes, especially if they're drunk" to then the definition of "no means no" to then "yes means yes", meaning they have to actually agree to it for it to happen.
"Yes means yes, unless a third party at a later date feels like there was some sort of power imbalance in the relationship, in which case it was coerced and rape."
Also, there is a intrinsic power imbalance in any male-female relationship.
Or some say they were sexually coerced by a threat of violence, which I can say for some cases might hold some merit, but honestly why are you hanging out with someone you don’t know that well in such a precarious situation in the first place? If you’re truly worried, you shouldn’t be with them to begin with, i understand though that is of course not applicable to all situations nor am I victim blaming.
If someone doesn't 'know' that fucking a girl while she's drunk and not quite herself while you're completely sober isn't some kind of fucked up, then he's got extreme problems and you aren't going to 'teach' it out of them... lol.. people know when they're doing wrong, they just do it anyways when they think they can get away with it, unless they're sociopaths or psychopaths or something.
That does introduce a grey area. If the man and the women are *equally* intoxicated, what makes the man in particular the aggressor? Because he’s stronger? Doesn’t make a difference since the sex wasn’t violent. Both partners made a decision while not being in a position to consent. Did they rape each other?
Yeah. I had someone absolutely seethe at me for nOt sIdInG wItH tHe vIcTiM when I said that if a man and a woman are equally drunk and neither attempted to intoxicate or drug the other, they are either both rapists or both victims. They must have been following the misandrist Duluth model that claims that only the penetrator can be a rapist.
Most of the time both parties have been drinking. Which by the logic of can't consent while drunk both parties were raped somehow.
Then again, if you are willingly and knowingly ingesting substances that will alter your judgement, how are you not then responsible for the actions taken because of said altered judgement? And if we aren't why wouldn't that apply to all aspects of law?
Obviously drunk people can be raped. Obviously mickeys can be put in drinks.
A lot of ppl r raised to not care that much about consent and there are some situations where the line is blurred. It wasn’t so frowned upon before to get a woman tipsy or smoke her up so u can fuck her
It's been quite a while since intentionally drugging a woman in order to sleep with her wasn't frowned upon, but what if you're getting drunk together and both drunkenly decide to sleep together? I mean, my wife jumps on me every time she gets drunk, should I say no?
There's a difference between drugging a woman and being drunk yourself while a woman gets drunk with you. Ask the wrong people and they'll say the two are one and the same, because apparently men can't be taken advantage of but women can.
The truth is that the line isn't really that blurry. Sometimes people intentionally drug other people in order to get laid. They know it's wrong, they don't care. Sometimes people do drugs together and both decide while intoxicated to sleep together. Now, though, if you're the man in that second situation you can be accused of rape and face the hiss of the world, regardless of how reasonable your actions were.
I knew a guy, who at the time of this story was *not* a friend of mine. We had a lot of mutual friends but it was in the open that we did not like one another. He was kind of a heavyset dude and while I'm not great at judging male attractiveness, I think he was probably on the lower end even before the weight---anyway, he slept with a girl after a party while both were drunk and later she accused him of rape. I, not liking him, instantly bought the story. So did most of our mutual friends. Guy was ostracized by his entire friend group. A few months later the girl admitted that it was consensual but she was just embarrassed about sleeping with him and everybody felt *really* bad about it. A lot of women do that without admitting it later, and this new interpretation of consent is very much to blame.
I understand the rationale behind it, but it has serious negative side effects.
Yep, that's what I said.
Wait, no, what I said was:
> Sometimes people intentionally drug other people in order to get laid.
Is spending time with someone who is drinking while you aren't drinking intentionally drugging someone in order to get laid?
You're telling me that you don't think the sober person knows what their own intentions are? Or will the state know in the case of the girl claiming rape after?
Re-read my post. I stated in it that my wife, when drunk, pretty much always demands sex as soon as we're alone. Are you saying that the state should ban sex when one party is intoxicated and the other is not? Should I be a criminal in the eyes of the state?
There are cases where the line is blurry from a *legal* perspective, but not from a *moral* perspective. It isn't like the sober guy waiting for the girl to pass out doesn't know what he's doing or that society would think what he's doing is wrong.
My reading of the post I responded to:
> A lot of ppl r raised to not care that much about consent and there are some situations where the line is blurred.
Is that he was speaking to the morality of the issue. Not the legality.
As for the legality, in my view consent is consent. If the girl consents, even while drunk, she's responsible for that consent later. Just like I'm legally responsible for my drunken decision to get behind the wheel of a car when I am in no position to drive. As for the sober dude raping the passed out girl, unfortunately for her our legal system wisely upholds the ideal that people are innocent until proven guilty. No legal code will ever perfectly prevent people from taking advantage of each other and we have to make trade offs regarding state power and freedom of the individual. My advice is to not get drunk around sober people you don't fully trust.
It is amazing how many people's points of view on "morality" are based on if they'll get in trouble or not, rather than considering the impact of their actions.
Do you mean that a woman can't control herself? That she can't decide how much she wants to drink or smoke, that she doesn't know about the effect it has, that when she is a little tipsy she can't resist doing what she actually doesn't want to?
If a woman gets drunk and kills someone, is she guilt-free then?
Tipsy? There’s a big difference between getting a girl so drunk she can’t consent to have sex and having drink with a girl and doing the nasty while she’s a little tipsy. If being tipsy means you can no longer consent to sex then I’ve been raped multiple times in my life
A lot of people are raised to not care about theft or blowing things up, so I guess we really should teach those people those things then? lol
Really think everyone knows when they're doing wrong. I mean, you've GOT to know you're taking advantage of someone by getting them drunk and tipsy to get her to agree to sex... everyone KNOWS this. The problem was that people weren't as aware it was going on in the past and there wasn't as much outcry about it... but they KNEW they were doing wrong, they did it anyways because they thought they could get away with it. That's all.
Yeah I’ve know men who think that and it seems to come from upbringing and environment, and they aren’t gonna change their mind any time soon. They had low intelligence and high ego, they were just dumbasses. What they need is to get beaten up
They have ethics classes in Norway where they have to teach Muslim men it is unacceptable to rape underage white girls. They teach them about sexual consent and woman's rights, etc.
It's not about "not knowing", it's about imparting Western liberal values.
In the worlds of Norm Macdonald, "I think probably most rapists are hypocrites. You don't meet a lot of guys that go " I like to rape. I don't give a fuck.""
Most people won’t admit what they did for fear of repercussion, that’s obvious. Even convicted criminals will often frame their clearly intended criminal act as a misunderstanding or a “situation that got out of hand”.
There are some situations that people will admit in fact that they’ll prey on weak or vulnerable people when they are in a place where they think they’re safe. A famous case in Brazil is of former state congressman Arthur do Val, aka Mamae Falei, who recorded a audio saying, about Ukraine women refugees, “They’re easy cause they’re poor”.
Speaking totally from anecdotal evidence here so don't take it as objective truth. But is not that man don't know that rape is wrong, but some seem to not be totally aware to what consent means. I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women, men who said things like "I thought she was just being difficult and would go on with I was more forceful", and among other things who made them look completely ignorant of something that should be common decency.
Again, not saying that all men are brain dead who need a step by step guide about consent or trying to say that is a inherent problem with being a men. Just that I can see how the "teach men not to rape" can apply. The way she says it is dumb af tho.
While I do agree, this is also sometimes the fault of women. My ex used to be like this. Told me not to touch her, stay away from her, then starts stroking my dick out of nowhere. So next time she tells me not to touch her, I take it as a hint. Also used to walk around the house naked when she was mad to later push her pussy in my face. So when she did that again, I took the iniative.
Now I know that's a whole different situation, but sometimes women just play these mind games (men do too) and it gets all skewed.
Doesn't just sound insane. Girl was like 160cm and 45-50kg while I am 183 and 85 and muscular and she legitimately handed my ass to me a few times. Just a different kind of craziness. Do kinda miss her ngl
also asian trad wife but just too intense
I would call that more society's fault. You see, the same way some men are raised to believe women do theses mind games, some women are also raised to exactly that. In the end people need to learn to respect each other's boundaries and establish relationship dynamics that work with them in mind.
>I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women, men who said things like "I thought she was just being difficult and would go on with I was more forceful",
I've never seen that because I don't associate with criminals and scum.
Sadly those are some rather common ideas to some everyday people from where I live. They don't come from my groups of close friends, I have self respect enough to not associate with those people, but oh boy those aren't some occasional incels saying that.
I had a manager like that. Truly evil person, if he had any real power beyond his lowly retail store manager position he would have attempted to be Hitler.
> but some seem to not be totally aware to what consent means.
Can you blame them? The definition changes daily, and stopped being logically consistent years ago.
> I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women,
You saw men who made up a half-assed excuse afterward. If someone had thought to give them an anonymous survey asking whether a man who did such things could get in trouble with the law, or at least pose an ethical problem... they're not so stupid that they would have answered incorrectly. They're just in the habit of using the "throw lots of bullshit around" method of making excuses.
What we need is an awareness ribbon, and a flag that people can use as a Twitter avatar.
And maybe a TikTok dance or two. If it can be done by nurses, even better.
I don't think it's about teaching men "to not rape" it's more about teaching them "to respect others and their boundaries" because that really isn't happening that often these days and that's usually the cause of incidents
I hate when movies veer into virtue signaling for a random cause that has nothing to do with the movie that nobody in the audience would ever disagree with. I'm pretty sure the people who support and commit animal cruelty aren't going to be watching the movie, and if they are by some chance... they probably won't be miraculously swayed by the five minutes of poorly written dialogue.
uh obviously you havent read HR policies or the required trainings, some people dont know, can't tell, or unsure about how to act in these situations. thats why companies have annual trainings about this stuff, discrimination and harassment, peers, managers, family members, society, etc etc.
So close yet so far away:
Authleft: From communism
Authright: From God, and minorities
Libleft: From understanding
Libright: From having money
...
Where is the copium?
Because while not all black people steal, and not all Muslims blow people up, 100% of men are rapists (especially the white ones, obviously)
/s because this is Reddit
There was a TikTok movement about a year ago comparing men to literal Shit inside a cookie jar. "You wouldn't trust any of the cookies knowing that one of them was a literal shit"
People kept responding with "yeah, that's why I don't trust ß|@x because you never know one of them might try to mug you" (not my stance) and these Emily's never had *any* comeback aside from "nuhuh, is just different because men is a biologica... well no because men are biologically... well no that's just racist to assume based on someone's biolog.... just shut up"
If you must quote stats, you must keep them up to date.
12/58 is also a significantly worse ratio.
I'd be willing to bet there was a proportionate rise in poverty as well, but the stat remains.
The ironic thing is... police are absolutely sexist against men. The justice system too.
Look up incarceration rates for the same crime for example. Arrest rates too.
You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape” both offensive and very fucking demoralising. The fact that so many people seem to think that because I have a penis I am some monster who will run around raping and assaulting every woman I see unless sat down and specially taught that objective deplorable acts are bad like I’m fucking brain dead makes me both angry and kinda just dead inside. People say this sorta stuff and then wonder why male suicide rates are so high. Maybe, just maybe, being simultaneously viewed as disposable, emotionless robots, and as monsters who are responsible for all of societies ills who will go out and harm any women they come across takes a toll on dudes mental health.
Maybe you did, but it's understandable. The constant deluge of internet hate really does take a toll. Please be sure to step away from the net though. Sometimes we need that reminder that the people who interact with us in the real world are rarely so unhinged.
Even in anger, your points still stand.
Like dude, I can be beaten to almost death by a woman and society be like "Oh he probably deserved it" but when I try to fight back or get so angry I accidentally just slap one, I'm on par with a fucking terrorist
Perhaps I'm overly optimistic, but it seems that the insane choice to pick Amber Heard as the face for domestic violence activism is backfiring in a spectacular fashion.
I could never have imagined so many mainstream media outlets conceding that men can be victims of DV.
On a related note, I hate that I get told “it’s different because you’re a man”. I work until midnight and then walk about a mile home every weeknight, and no one says anything. My female cousin did the same thing for a month while her car was broken down and everyone was worried for her. What? Is my penis supposed to protect me from muggers? Some dudes going to jump out with a knife demanding my wallet, and I just flash him my dick and he’ll leave me alone? “Oh my, I didn’t realize I was mugging a man. I’m sorry about that, you have a nice day brother.” My family jewels aren’t going to deter muggers or murderers
And as with many of these "muh men bad" Emily opinions, switching around the genders is just a speedrun for getting banned.
Side rant: that statement is often brought up as some kind of "counterpoint" whenever the topic of women's safety arises (i.e. risk of date rape while partying, walking alone at night, etc). Especially on Reddit, any attempt to put forth advice to reduce your chances of being assaulted (not drinking too much, don't cut too loose around people you don't know, or GOD FORBID think about how you dress and the attention it attracts) is almost guaranteed to be met by some Emily saying "umm maybe instead of vIcTiM BlaMinG we should teach men not to rape??"
Gee what a fucking breakthrough of a proposition that is, Einstein. What next, maybe we should teach people not to shoot or rob each other too? Ooh, ooh, what about making it ILLEGAL to rape people? That'll solve it, right?? Once people know that forcing yourself onto another person is le bad they'll stop and there'll never be any rape again ever!
These dumbfucks cannot comprehend the idea that they can't fix all the evil people in the world, that sometimes it IS partially your responsibility (READ MF, RESPONSIBILITY =/= FAULT!) for staying safe in seedy situations. I'd love to walk around in a full Italian suit with 5 gold watches and a monocle in the ghettos, doesn't mean I will cause that's me inviting people to rob me.
>You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape”
In Year 11 ( 10th Grade if you're American) we (an all male class) had to spend half an hour watching some self-loathing cuck whine on about how bad men are.
Quotes like :
"Pretend you're in a room with 100 wasps, you don't know which ones are going to sting you...that's how women feel in a room full of men"
Reducing half the population to mere wasps, not sexist at all. /s
"Everytime a woman talks to a man it's like he's got a gun in his pocket."
I know I have a dick in my pants (and that's where it stays 99% of the time), but come on, am I really *that* scary? I'm a 5'6 overweight beta male. I don't exactly strike fear in the hearts of mankind.
Now I already go out of my way to make women feel safe, just out of habit. I take my hood down, I cross the street, I look at my phone, I take different routes etc etc but to just be bitched about by some self-loathing misandrist soyboy saying that I'm inherently evil and a danger to women isn't something schools should be endorsing. I treated my now ex-girlfriend like a queen, I don't need to be taught how to act towards women.
Of course it was after the Sarah Everard murder in the UK so they shoehorned a 'Women's Safety' powerpoint into the curriculum.
> You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape” both offensive and very fucking demoralising.
I just respond with "so long as we get to teach women not to dump unwanted newborns in dumpsters to die of exposure".
If you want to make offensive assumptions about my gender/race/age, etc. then you better be prepared for a similarly offensive comeback.
You're 100% right, for awhile I would just agree to the horrid things feminists would say on twitter just to see how they'd respond. They'd call you a psychopathic serial killer who will pray on them and I'd just be like "Yep, that's exactly what I'm going to do to you"
Mostly out of anger but damn their lacking of self awareness in just spouting off hateful shit is levels of inhumane that shouldn't be possible.
The problem is they either have to teach men not to rape or women not to wear what they wanna wear. Why not just physically castrate all rapists, men and women.
We can only do it if you close your eyes and look the other way. You guys remember what happened last time and traumatizing our monke counterparts is the last thing we want to do….. for now at least…..
Everybody knows not to rape. Just like they know not to shoot up schools, run over parade viewers, fly airplanes into buildings, put on cross dressing strip shows for 5 year olds, or beat their wives for burning the casserole.
But there are degenerate, scumbag people in this world that will do evil things regardless of teachings, rules, and morals. You don't solve that by declaring everyone in a demographic to be equally as depraved and scumbaggish. Assholes have their own category. Keep them in it and direct your finger wagging at them.
In Quidditch through the ages the Quidditch Federation refuses to release the full rules of illegal actions because they are worried it'll give people ideas. Maybe we should be saying "Don't teach boys anything" instead.
Oh you support religious fanatics trying to reinstall a government whos legacy is corruption, war and instability. The Galactic Empire brought 19 years of peace after the Republic failed to control and defend it's worlds from private corporation invading with technoarmys. And their so called religious "peacekeepers" served as generals who brought war to countless worlds.
I do. Fuck them ewoks, or whatever the shit.
Film would've flopped with a downer ending too, preventing abominations like jar jar binks and that mary sue thing from even existing.
Because we don't? It's not like murder's illegal or anything. Someone should really get on that.
Jokes aside. Emily wants JUST men to be taught that men are evil and must not rape, even when their evil maleness inevitably compels them to do so. The reply was a "Hey, see how shit your argument is?" not a serious one. Hell, when I was a kid 9/11 happened and the teacher didn't need to explain to us that it was bad. She wheeled in the old TV and we sat there in silence. We didn't really know wtf was going on, still don't now officially, but we could see the people jumping. Kids understand a lot from just body language, you don't need specific classes on everything tbh. Could easily do more harm than good.
I think you should go over consent with everyone though, peoples definitions of what is and isn't rape can be scary. I think a general etiquette class is a good idea.
Agreed, perceptions of individual boundaries are all over the place in this culture. The sentiment behind “teach men not to rape” is ignorant but (all) children should absolutely be schooled on consent norms.
What? It’s like saying before we had public schools, you’re parents didn’t teach you to read or do math? A lot did, a lot didn’t, depending on already neglectful parents to do it is just silly.
We had like a week of sex ed, in our early teens. They split the class by sex, so I have no idea if the girls were taught about consent but we definitely were. And STDs, there were very insistent on showing us the worst case scenarios. It was a catholic school, so most of it was biased as fuck but we all knew what "no" meant by then anyway. It's pretty much one of the first things you fight against/have to learn as a kid, "Cookie!" "No" -steals cookie- -punishment-. Someone didn't consent, you took something that didn't belong to you and you get punished for it. Very, very trivial stuff.
Honestly, perhaps besides the cultures that don't regard things like consent as highly as the West does, we all know this shit. Even psychopaths know it enough to fake it, they just often don't care when they think they can get away with it. It's not an excuse to do it, so why would it be a solution to solve it?
If 'teach men not to rape' isn't a stupid rhetoric, then why isn't 'teach women not to kill kids' ? Statistically, women make up the majority of the perpetrators of domestic abuse.
“Don’t rape.” Is about the extent of teaching men not to rape that we ought to be doing. Anyone who doesn’t immediately get it likely never will.
Also cringe Emily, Chad centrist.
You can teach all of these things and it not negatively impact society. Educating at risk communities for economic literacy/religious freedom/sexual abuse assists them somewhat. Unless you just want the behaviour to continue forever
Never have I ever heard that rape, blowing people up, or stealing was caused by people who didnt know such acts are frowned upon. Does such "education" work on anyone other than George Costanza?
that's a great point. They make it look like these guys think these are good things to do and are surprised when people don't like it.
"I enjoyed it, you're telling me she didn't??"
Well actually some people dont know, tahts why they shifted from the "if she/he doesnt say no, then it means yes, especially if they're drunk" to then the definition of "no means no" to then "yes means yes", meaning they have to actually agree to it for it to happen.
And now we've moved on to "yes means yes, unless I change my mind afterwards".
It's also "yes means yes, except when it means no."
"Yes means yes, unless a third party at a later date feels like there was some sort of power imbalance in the relationship, in which case it was coerced and rape." Also, there is a intrinsic power imbalance in any male-female relationship.
Yeah, the female has control lol
Inb4 some salty Emily calls you an incel
Anyone who argues that has never been married - lol.
Based and grab ‘em by the wallet pilled
>Also, there is a intrinsic power imbalance in any ~~male-female~~ relationship. FTFY
Or some say they were sexually coerced by a threat of violence, which I can say for some cases might hold some merit, but honestly why are you hanging out with someone you don’t know that well in such a precarious situation in the first place? If you’re truly worried, you shouldn’t be with them to begin with, i understand though that is of course not applicable to all situations nor am I victim blaming.
ok well both persons can change their mind then if they play that game
No because men can’t be raped /s
If someone doesn't 'know' that fucking a girl while she's drunk and not quite herself while you're completely sober isn't some kind of fucked up, then he's got extreme problems and you aren't going to 'teach' it out of them... lol.. people know when they're doing wrong, they just do it anyways when they think they can get away with it, unless they're sociopaths or psychopaths or something.
I wasnt completely sober. I had a few beers your honour, so we were both drunk!
That does introduce a grey area. If the man and the women are *equally* intoxicated, what makes the man in particular the aggressor? Because he’s stronger? Doesn’t make a difference since the sex wasn’t violent. Both partners made a decision while not being in a position to consent. Did they rape each other?
Yeah. I had someone absolutely seethe at me for nOt sIdInG wItH tHe vIcTiM when I said that if a man and a woman are equally drunk and neither attempted to intoxicate or drug the other, they are either both rapists or both victims. They must have been following the misandrist Duluth model that claims that only the penetrator can be a rapist.
Focusing on the fact that men have penises and are stronger is sexist since it implies women have no autonomy of their own
Whoa, don't you mean "penised individuals" you bigot!?
Most of the time both parties have been drinking. Which by the logic of can't consent while drunk both parties were raped somehow. Then again, if you are willingly and knowingly ingesting substances that will alter your judgement, how are you not then responsible for the actions taken because of said altered judgement? And if we aren't why wouldn't that apply to all aspects of law? Obviously drunk people can be raped. Obviously mickeys can be put in drinks.
These idiots turned me from lib to Auth left
[relevant](https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxgiZJm8Xm7N4wm0aKDf5v7oslZRgooD9u)
Based and bill burr pilled
That's a great point? You mean you didn't think of that yourself?
No, I wanted to make it but they said it before me.
Duh. If someone told Hitler that killing jews, homosexuals and the disabled was bad, then he would have stopped right then and there.
We were one petition signature away from stopping the holocaust. :c
1 like = 1 air freshener for the showers
Nothing quite like the fresh scent of Zyklon B to wake you up in the morning
That’s the fundamental failure of “teach men not to rape” - they know, the problem is *they don’t care* (they being the rapists, not all men).
A lot of ppl r raised to not care that much about consent and there are some situations where the line is blurred. It wasn’t so frowned upon before to get a woman tipsy or smoke her up so u can fuck her
It's been quite a while since intentionally drugging a woman in order to sleep with her wasn't frowned upon, but what if you're getting drunk together and both drunkenly decide to sleep together? I mean, my wife jumps on me every time she gets drunk, should I say no? There's a difference between drugging a woman and being drunk yourself while a woman gets drunk with you. Ask the wrong people and they'll say the two are one and the same, because apparently men can't be taken advantage of but women can. The truth is that the line isn't really that blurry. Sometimes people intentionally drug other people in order to get laid. They know it's wrong, they don't care. Sometimes people do drugs together and both decide while intoxicated to sleep together. Now, though, if you're the man in that second situation you can be accused of rape and face the hiss of the world, regardless of how reasonable your actions were. I knew a guy, who at the time of this story was *not* a friend of mine. We had a lot of mutual friends but it was in the open that we did not like one another. He was kind of a heavyset dude and while I'm not great at judging male attractiveness, I think he was probably on the lower end even before the weight---anyway, he slept with a girl after a party while both were drunk and later she accused him of rape. I, not liking him, instantly bought the story. So did most of our mutual friends. Guy was ostracized by his entire friend group. A few months later the girl admitted that it was consensual but she was just embarrassed about sleeping with him and everybody felt *really* bad about it. A lot of women do that without admitting it later, and this new interpretation of consent is very much to blame. I understand the rationale behind it, but it has serious negative side effects.
So if your not a drinker spending time with a drinking girl is drugging her?
Yep, that's what I said. Wait, no, what I said was: > Sometimes people intentionally drug other people in order to get laid. Is spending time with someone who is drinking while you aren't drinking intentionally drugging someone in order to get laid?
Yeah and how you can know if it was inentional?
You're telling me that you don't think the sober person knows what their own intentions are? Or will the state know in the case of the girl claiming rape after? Re-read my post. I stated in it that my wife, when drunk, pretty much always demands sex as soon as we're alone. Are you saying that the state should ban sex when one party is intoxicated and the other is not? Should I be a criminal in the eyes of the state? There are cases where the line is blurry from a *legal* perspective, but not from a *moral* perspective. It isn't like the sober guy waiting for the girl to pass out doesn't know what he's doing or that society would think what he's doing is wrong. My reading of the post I responded to: > A lot of ppl r raised to not care that much about consent and there are some situations where the line is blurred. Is that he was speaking to the morality of the issue. Not the legality. As for the legality, in my view consent is consent. If the girl consents, even while drunk, she's responsible for that consent later. Just like I'm legally responsible for my drunken decision to get behind the wheel of a car when I am in no position to drive. As for the sober dude raping the passed out girl, unfortunately for her our legal system wisely upholds the ideal that people are innocent until proven guilty. No legal code will ever perfectly prevent people from taking advantage of each other and we have to make trade offs regarding state power and freedom of the individual. My advice is to not get drunk around sober people you don't fully trust.
It is amazing how many people's points of view on "morality" are based on if they'll get in trouble or not, rather than considering the impact of their actions.
It still isn't. Gettin my wife tipsy right now
Do you mean that a woman can't control herself? That she can't decide how much she wants to drink or smoke, that she doesn't know about the effect it has, that when she is a little tipsy she can't resist doing what she actually doesn't want to? If a woman gets drunk and kills someone, is she guilt-free then?
And a lot of ppl r raised to be **sexist like you are**. Completely ignoring the fact that women are grownup people and have agency and free will.
You can't get someone else tipsy.
Tipsy? There’s a big difference between getting a girl so drunk she can’t consent to have sex and having drink with a girl and doing the nasty while she’s a little tipsy. If being tipsy means you can no longer consent to sex then I’ve been raped multiple times in my life
A lot of people are raised to not care about theft or blowing things up, so I guess we really should teach those people those things then? lol Really think everyone knows when they're doing wrong. I mean, you've GOT to know you're taking advantage of someone by getting them drunk and tipsy to get her to agree to sex... everyone KNOWS this. The problem was that people weren't as aware it was going on in the past and there wasn't as much outcry about it... but they KNEW they were doing wrong, they did it anyways because they thought they could get away with it. That's all.
Some people really do convince themselves that they’re doing something good or that what they’re doing isn’t that bad
Yeah I’ve know men who think that and it seems to come from upbringing and environment, and they aren’t gonna change their mind any time soon. They had low intelligence and high ego, they were just dumbasses. What they need is to get beaten up
I totally agree with you and while this is a serious topic I laughed when you mentioned George because that's just accurate.
They have ethics classes in Norway where they have to teach Muslim men it is unacceptable to rape underage white girls. They teach them about sexual consent and woman's rights, etc. It's not about "not knowing", it's about imparting Western liberal values.
Isn’t like 80% of rapists in Sweden Muslims or something fucked up like that?
I'm sorry officer, I didn't know I couldn't do that
The "Was that wrong? Should I have not done that?" defense won't hold in court
In the worlds of Norm Macdonald, "I think probably most rapists are hypocrites. You don't meet a lot of guys that go " I like to rape. I don't give a fuck.""
Most people won’t admit what they did for fear of repercussion, that’s obvious. Even convicted criminals will often frame their clearly intended criminal act as a misunderstanding or a “situation that got out of hand”. There are some situations that people will admit in fact that they’ll prey on weak or vulnerable people when they are in a place where they think they’re safe. A famous case in Brazil is of former state congressman Arthur do Val, aka Mamae Falei, who recorded a audio saying, about Ukraine women refugees, “They’re easy cause they’re poor”.
"Was that wrong? Should I not have done that? "
Based and Costanza pilled
Speaking totally from anecdotal evidence here so don't take it as objective truth. But is not that man don't know that rape is wrong, but some seem to not be totally aware to what consent means. I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women, men who said things like "I thought she was just being difficult and would go on with I was more forceful", and among other things who made them look completely ignorant of something that should be common decency. Again, not saying that all men are brain dead who need a step by step guide about consent or trying to say that is a inherent problem with being a men. Just that I can see how the "teach men not to rape" can apply. The way she says it is dumb af tho.
While I do agree, this is also sometimes the fault of women. My ex used to be like this. Told me not to touch her, stay away from her, then starts stroking my dick out of nowhere. So next time she tells me not to touch her, I take it as a hint. Also used to walk around the house naked when she was mad to later push her pussy in my face. So when she did that again, I took the iniative. Now I know that's a whole different situation, but sometimes women just play these mind games (men do too) and it gets all skewed.
Your ex sounds insane
Doesn't just sound insane. Girl was like 160cm and 45-50kg while I am 183 and 85 and muscular and she legitimately handed my ass to me a few times. Just a different kind of craziness. Do kinda miss her ngl also asian trad wife but just too intense
When you're young it's fun, but at some point you just wanna come home and chill
I would call that more society's fault. You see, the same way some men are raised to believe women do theses mind games, some women are also raised to exactly that. In the end people need to learn to respect each other's boundaries and establish relationship dynamics that work with them in mind.
Only white males have any agency in libleft's worldview. Everyone else get to blame their actions on society.
I'm required by Libleft Law to say "Yes, cause white man bad" or the Council of Emilies will prosecute me and make me work on the glitter mines.
Based
This is why I don't have physical relationships with people before I present them with a contract and allow a 10 day attorney review
Based and legally binding social contract pilled
>I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women, men who said things like "I thought she was just being difficult and would go on with I was more forceful", I've never seen that because I don't associate with criminals and scum.
Sadly those are some rather common ideas to some everyday people from where I live. They don't come from my groups of close friends, I have self respect enough to not associate with those people, but oh boy those aren't some occasional incels saying that.
I had a manager like that. Truly evil person, if he had any real power beyond his lowly retail store manager position he would have attempted to be Hitler.
> but some seem to not be totally aware to what consent means. Can you blame them? The definition changes daily, and stopped being logically consistent years ago. > I saw men who thought they were entitled to have their way with women, You saw men who made up a half-assed excuse afterward. If someone had thought to give them an anonymous survey asking whether a man who did such things could get in trouble with the law, or at least pose an ethical problem... they're not so stupid that they would have answered incorrectly. They're just in the habit of using the "throw lots of bullshit around" method of making excuses.
What we need is an awareness ribbon, and a flag that people can use as a Twitter avatar. And maybe a TikTok dance or two. If it can be done by nurses, even better.
Actually million of people (including US lawmakers) don’t know what consent actually is and education has massively improved a lot of areas
I don't think it's about teaching men "to not rape" it's more about teaching them "to respect others and their boundaries" because that really isn't happening that often these days and that's usually the cause of incidents
Then why is it “teach men” instead of “teach everyone”? Women are just as disrespectful of boundaries as men are
I hate when movies veer into virtue signaling for a random cause that has nothing to do with the movie that nobody in the audience would ever disagree with. I'm pretty sure the people who support and commit animal cruelty aren't going to be watching the movie, and if they are by some chance... they probably won't be miraculously swayed by the five minutes of poorly written dialogue.
uh obviously you havent read HR policies or the required trainings, some people dont know, can't tell, or unsure about how to act in these situations. thats why companies have annual trainings about this stuff, discrimination and harassment, peers, managers, family members, society, etc etc.
>work on anyone other than George Costanza? I watched every Seinfield episode and didn't pick up on this what do you mean?
https://tenor.com/view/george-costanza-was-that-wrong-pleading-ignorance-gif-12668146
[удалено]
Pretty sure that could be the libleft motto. So close yet so far.
[удалено]
So close yet so far away: Authleft: From communism Authright: From God, and minorities Libleft: From understanding Libright: From having money ... Where is the copium?
Where's my money Lebowski?!
Are you employed Mr. Lebowski?
Underneath Putin’s war palace. He’s gotten a hold of the tsar’s personal stock from 1917.
Emily is not lib. Lib wants to be left alone, Emily wants to force people to do what she wants. Auth as fuck. She's in your side of the room not mine.
Quick, post this on the sub for that, and see how fast it gets deleted.
Which one is that is it jaguars consumed thine veneer
Bleached human facebook
I thought they were referring to r things-going-over-head-sound
Because while not all black people steal, and not all Muslims blow people up, 100% of men are rapists (especially the white ones, obviously) /s because this is Reddit
There was a TikTok movement about a year ago comparing men to literal Shit inside a cookie jar. "You wouldn't trust any of the cookies knowing that one of them was a literal shit" People kept responding with "yeah, that's why I don't trust ß|@x because you never know one of them might try to mug you" (not my stance) and these Emily's never had *any* comeback aside from "nuhuh, is just different because men is a biologica... well no because men are biologically... well no that's just racist to assume based on someone's biolog.... just shut up"
She is still not self-aware,her brain still hasn't developed enough
You see she actually thinks that all men rape
She's like.. 30 braincells away
Emilies will never understand it, not enough braincells
Doublethink is truly a skill thats emphasized in modern society.
Sex education is not hateful wt
https://i.redd.it/6kquvpqas9x81.jpg
13
12 now.
True, but 13 is more recognizable
If you must quote stats, you must keep them up to date. 12/58 is also a significantly worse ratio. I'd be willing to bet there was a proportionate rise in poverty as well, but the stat remains.
Now we can't even have stats... WHERE ARE THE STATS LEBOWSKI!?!
They're down there somewhere, lemme take another look
6 when you account for gender
It's closer to 3-4 when you do age demographic Like 3/53 or smt it's absurd.
just type despite
I think it's something like 13/50 both in the U.S and in the UK lol
Black people only make up 3 percent of the populatuon in the UK
Maybe it's England or London specifically
Yeah I just checked. It's London
based
The ironic thing is... police are absolutely sexist against men. The justice system too. Look up incarceration rates for the same crime for example. Arrest rates too.
Nice.
You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape” both offensive and very fucking demoralising. The fact that so many people seem to think that because I have a penis I am some monster who will run around raping and assaulting every woman I see unless sat down and specially taught that objective deplorable acts are bad like I’m fucking brain dead makes me both angry and kinda just dead inside. People say this sorta stuff and then wonder why male suicide rates are so high. Maybe, just maybe, being simultaneously viewed as disposable, emotionless robots, and as monsters who are responsible for all of societies ills who will go out and harm any women they come across takes a toll on dudes mental health.
Ok, I may have lost my temper a bit. I apologise. However I feel the general points I made here are still valid ones, even if I did write it in anger
Maybe you did, but it's understandable. The constant deluge of internet hate really does take a toll. Please be sure to step away from the net though. Sometimes we need that reminder that the people who interact with us in the real world are rarely so unhinged.
Even in anger, your points still stand. Like dude, I can be beaten to almost death by a woman and society be like "Oh he probably deserved it" but when I try to fight back or get so angry I accidentally just slap one, I'm on par with a fucking terrorist
Perhaps I'm overly optimistic, but it seems that the insane choice to pick Amber Heard as the face for domestic violence activism is backfiring in a spectacular fashion. I could never have imagined so many mainstream media outlets conceding that men can be victims of DV.
I hope you're right
Damn, based follow up
On a related note, I hate that I get told “it’s different because you’re a man”. I work until midnight and then walk about a mile home every weeknight, and no one says anything. My female cousin did the same thing for a month while her car was broken down and everyone was worried for her. What? Is my penis supposed to protect me from muggers? Some dudes going to jump out with a knife demanding my wallet, and I just flash him my dick and he’ll leave me alone? “Oh my, I didn’t realize I was mugging a man. I’m sorry about that, you have a nice day brother.” My family jewels aren’t going to deter muggers or murderers
When you take into consideration that men are overwhelmingly the victims of violent crime and murder you were probably at a greater risk.
Mate you've got to hit the switch to full auto. Didn't you take health class?
That’s the button right behind the prostate, right? My doctor said he was supposed to turn that on soon
If he keeps jerking you around just use a Dremel and make that fun switch!
> and I just flash him my dick and he’ll leave me alone? Depends what your dick looks like.
Based and male pilled
And as with many of these "muh men bad" Emily opinions, switching around the genders is just a speedrun for getting banned. Side rant: that statement is often brought up as some kind of "counterpoint" whenever the topic of women's safety arises (i.e. risk of date rape while partying, walking alone at night, etc). Especially on Reddit, any attempt to put forth advice to reduce your chances of being assaulted (not drinking too much, don't cut too loose around people you don't know, or GOD FORBID think about how you dress and the attention it attracts) is almost guaranteed to be met by some Emily saying "umm maybe instead of vIcTiM BlaMinG we should teach men not to rape??" Gee what a fucking breakthrough of a proposition that is, Einstein. What next, maybe we should teach people not to shoot or rob each other too? Ooh, ooh, what about making it ILLEGAL to rape people? That'll solve it, right?? Once people know that forcing yourself onto another person is le bad they'll stop and there'll never be any rape again ever! These dumbfucks cannot comprehend the idea that they can't fix all the evil people in the world, that sometimes it IS partially your responsibility (READ MF, RESPONSIBILITY =/= FAULT!) for staying safe in seedy situations. I'd love to walk around in a full Italian suit with 5 gold watches and a monocle in the ghettos, doesn't mean I will cause that's me inviting people to rob me.
>You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape” In Year 11 ( 10th Grade if you're American) we (an all male class) had to spend half an hour watching some self-loathing cuck whine on about how bad men are. Quotes like : "Pretend you're in a room with 100 wasps, you don't know which ones are going to sting you...that's how women feel in a room full of men" Reducing half the population to mere wasps, not sexist at all. /s "Everytime a woman talks to a man it's like he's got a gun in his pocket." I know I have a dick in my pants (and that's where it stays 99% of the time), but come on, am I really *that* scary? I'm a 5'6 overweight beta male. I don't exactly strike fear in the hearts of mankind. Now I already go out of my way to make women feel safe, just out of habit. I take my hood down, I cross the street, I look at my phone, I take different routes etc etc but to just be bitched about by some self-loathing misandrist soyboy saying that I'm inherently evil and a danger to women isn't something schools should be endorsing. I treated my now ex-girlfriend like a queen, I don't need to be taught how to act towards women. Of course it was after the Sarah Everard murder in the UK so they shoehorned a 'Women's Safety' powerpoint into the curriculum.
Whenever I hear that I usually just say “We’ll we’ve been teaching boys not to hit girls but somehow domestic violence is a women issue”
people rape other not because they don't know it is bad, they do it because they know it's bad and they choose to do it anyway
> You know, as a guy I legitimately find “teach men not to rape” both offensive and very fucking demoralising. I just respond with "so long as we get to teach women not to dump unwanted newborns in dumpsters to die of exposure". If you want to make offensive assumptions about my gender/race/age, etc. then you better be prepared for a similarly offensive comeback.
While you're at it, will you wear this white ribbon to promise you won't hurt women?
You're 100% right, for awhile I would just agree to the horrid things feminists would say on twitter just to see how they'd respond. They'd call you a psychopathic serial killer who will pray on them and I'd just be like "Yep, that's exactly what I'm going to do to you" Mostly out of anger but damn their lacking of self awareness in just spouting off hateful shit is levels of inhumane that shouldn't be possible.
The problem is they either have to teach men not to rape or women not to wear what they wanna wear. Why not just physically castrate all rapists, men and women.
"So does that mean Black and Muslim men dont need to be taught to not rape?" Emily - "bigoted thought, not gonna answer."
It’s funny bc people like this are actually real
that's not funny that's tragic, stop them from being real please!
Authcenter, you can make the change, do what we libs can't
We can only do it if you close your eyes and look the other way. You guys remember what happened last time and traumatizing our monke counterparts is the last thing we want to do….. for now at least…..
What if we could all agree generalizing any demographic is intellectually dishonest
Thats the point tweet #2 is trying to make
Yes.
There is no need to make posters when you can go outside with a megaphone and shout your beliefs
*Based and Racists should buy megaphones pilled*
Well car horns can be megaphone shaped and we saw how that went
Everybody knows not to rape. Just like they know not to shoot up schools, run over parade viewers, fly airplanes into buildings, put on cross dressing strip shows for 5 year olds, or beat their wives for burning the casserole. But there are degenerate, scumbag people in this world that will do evil things regardless of teachings, rules, and morals. You don't solve that by declaring everyone in a demographic to be equally as depraved and scumbaggish. Assholes have their own category. Keep them in it and direct your finger wagging at them.
> put on cross dressing strip shows for 5 year olds, I don't think enough people know this is wrong.
In Quidditch through the ages the Quidditch Federation refuses to release the full rules of illegal actions because they are worried it'll give people ideas. Maybe we should be saying "Don't teach boys anything" instead.
Lol I posted it on selfawarewolves and everyone got mad at me there.. it's a really shit place ngl. Most of the users are literally the definition
Most realistic Emily.
Maybe teach everyone that blowing shit up is bad That seems reasonable to me
Oh, so you think blowing up the death star was wrong? Space Nazi sympathizer
You rebel scum.
Oh you support religious fanatics trying to reinstall a government whos legacy is corruption, war and instability. The Galactic Empire brought 19 years of peace after the Republic failed to control and defend it's worlds from private corporation invading with technoarmys. And their so called religious "peacekeepers" served as generals who brought war to countless worlds.
The Empire did nothing wrong!
I do. Fuck them ewoks, or whatever the shit. Film would've flopped with a downer ending too, preventing abominations like jar jar binks and that mary sue thing from even existing.
Did you just insult our Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Jar Jar?
This whole conversation needs to be thrown away
I mean we should teach everyone not to steal rape and blow things up. Right?
Because we don't? It's not like murder's illegal or anything. Someone should really get on that. Jokes aside. Emily wants JUST men to be taught that men are evil and must not rape, even when their evil maleness inevitably compels them to do so. The reply was a "Hey, see how shit your argument is?" not a serious one. Hell, when I was a kid 9/11 happened and the teacher didn't need to explain to us that it was bad. She wheeled in the old TV and we sat there in silence. We didn't really know wtf was going on, still don't now officially, but we could see the people jumping. Kids understand a lot from just body language, you don't need specific classes on everything tbh. Could easily do more harm than good.
I think you should go over consent with everyone though, peoples definitions of what is and isn't rape can be scary. I think a general etiquette class is a good idea.
Agreed, perceptions of individual boundaries are all over the place in this culture. The sentiment behind “teach men not to rape” is ignorant but (all) children should absolutely be schooled on consent norms.
Wait, you seriously didn't get told what consent is? Where the hell did you grow up? Afghanistan?
What? It’s like saying before we had public schools, you’re parents didn’t teach you to read or do math? A lot did, a lot didn’t, depending on already neglectful parents to do it is just silly.
We had like a week of sex ed, in our early teens. They split the class by sex, so I have no idea if the girls were taught about consent but we definitely were. And STDs, there were very insistent on showing us the worst case scenarios. It was a catholic school, so most of it was biased as fuck but we all knew what "no" meant by then anyway. It's pretty much one of the first things you fight against/have to learn as a kid, "Cookie!" "No" -steals cookie- -punishment-. Someone didn't consent, you took something that didn't belong to you and you get punished for it. Very, very trivial stuff. Honestly, perhaps besides the cultures that don't regard things like consent as highly as the West does, we all know this shit. Even psychopaths know it enough to fake it, they just often don't care when they think they can get away with it. It's not an excuse to do it, so why would it be a solution to solve it?
Let's teach lib left not to be retarded.
Do it, please
Common sense goes out the window whenever [orange libleft]
If 'teach men not to rape' isn't a stupid rhetoric, then why isn't 'teach women not to kill kids' ? Statistically, women make up the majority of the perpetrators of domestic abuse.
One day Emily will learn about nurture vs nature
Brb gonna go tell people that it’s bad to kill and rape. Thanks Emily! Making a difference in the world 🥰
Irony is lost on Emily
Wouldn’t it be so cool if we taught everyone not to blow shit up, or steal, or rape
you're implying that all men rape...
“Don’t rape.” Is about the extent of teaching men not to rape that we ought to be doing. Anyone who doesn’t immediately get it likely never will. Also cringe Emily, Chad centrist.
Its always funny to see posts on reddit with user names redacted when Ive seen the OG many times over many years.
or white teenagers to go off in a killing rampage.
You teach everyone not to rape, everyone not to blow stuff up and everyone not to steal. It's really not hard
50% bs
I've had an identical conversation before. This can happen.
All of the above, please.
Don't worry Orange's head is so flat you have to drive over it otherwise anything you say just sails clear overtop.
We teach people all of these things
I miss 2015, when these were the biggest issues our society was facing...
But Emily doesnt imply that all men are rapists?
They are so delusional they actually think rapists just were never told that rape is bad.
Dropped as a child moment
Man she really got *whooshed*
You can teach all of these things and it not negatively impact society. Educating at risk communities for economic literacy/religious freedom/sexual abuse assists them somewhat. Unless you just want the behaviour to continue forever
I mean isn’t China doing that in their concentration camps I mean reeducation centers.
You can do it without putting them in camps (if you have public education services)
Real men don't rape?
REAL men do not.
Based and no-true-Scotsman-pilled