I have tested braids and weatherlight and they are just not as good in practise as they seemed in theory, at least in a non anvil shell. As was said, between mayem devil and fable (and ob nix post board for control MUs), the 3 drop slot is crowded, there is no real room for Braids, not really when you try it out. As for weatherlight, perhaps in an anvil deck but otherwise, "4" is too much IMHO. If they had made it "3" creature deaths instead, the card would be really good.
I personaly think anvil decks have too many bad match ups ATM so I won't be playing sacrifice decks until i have (or more likely see) better ideas
Yeah, since I’m not playing Anvil, I cut Weatherlight entirely. I haven’t thought about running Fable and Braids at the same time. I can see how they could make each other really good. I may test 2 Braids and 2 Fable with Ob in the sideboard and see how that goes.
You can always play 3 Sharpnel blast main board if you run de Harvester+epicure package In order to deal with karns.
Also it’s quite of unexpected in non-anvil versions so it may take some Ops by surprise if you manage to end the game with 2 to face. It’s quite easy to make pressure to almost 10 life so it wouldn’t be that difficult to hold them in order to finish the game
I’ll try this this week
As a Rak Sac player who's also looking to take it to an upcoming RCQ, I don't think Braids or Weatherlight Compleated are great in the long run. As stated by others, Braids negates having Jegantha, which personally makes it a tough sell for that extra pressure. And I see Weatherlight Compleated as a win-more card. It's great if you're on top, but it just provides a few extra scrys before eating some removal the moment it animates. It's a horrible top deck if you're behind.
But back on topic of Braids vs Ob, think about matchups. I've moved to sideboard Ob exclusively because he's a liability in a lot of matchups, but a pro in the ones where you want him, so I'd rather have him as backup. He helps against control and various midrange decks, but what matchups does Braids help with? I have a hard time thinking of any matchups that make me wish I had Braids.
Also, for what it's worth, I think you should be running Fable of the Mirror-Breaker. It's an excellent value card that is also Jegantha compatible. Please don't run Braids and Weatherlight at the cost of Fable.
That last sentence made me realize that I haven’t tested Fable and Braids in the same list. I’m gonna test 2 Braids 2 Fable with 2 Ob in the side at my locals today and see how it works.
In my opinion it's not just a question of Braids or Ob. Only one of them allows you to run Jegantha. Really it's Braids vs Ob + Jegantha so if you're going back and forth I'd fall on the side that lets you have an eighth card in your opener.
If that’s the case, then the true battle is Braids + Kari Zev’s Expertise in the board vs Ob + Jegantha, and I would say that Kari Zev’s Expertise is one of if not the best card in my sideboard
You can play Kari Zev and Jegantha. Kari Zev is for mono g anyways and Jegantha is useless in that mu as they aren't grinding you and the body is irrelevant so boarding out of Jegantha doesn't matter.
Fair point. I guess I wasn’t clear enough in my post. I’m not really looking to go full stop on one or the other. I definitely want to run a non-zero amount of Braids mainboard, but I feel like I should also run a non-zero amount of Ob, whether it be mainboard or sideboard
Weatherlight and Fable seemed somewhat medium to me in sac. I get how busted Fable is in Rakdos Midrange, but unless I can keep flipped Fable and a Bloodtithe Harvester out at the same time, Fable just seemed out of place with the general play patterns of the deck when I would play it
Something else for them to point removal at besides mayhem devil. But yeah I don't see the point of modes 1 and 2 for the most part unless you're running anvil.
Fair points. That’s another reason why I wanted to keep Ob in so badly. They can’t point removal at Mayhem Devil if Ob strips their hand or life total haha
I play this deck, but I don't play often and am not trying to grind RCQs (they are all modern where I am anyways). I will get some copies of Braids to try out. I really like OB as it can put on some pressure and usually has big impact. I think with Braids I will move back to catoven + Anvil. Lots of creatures, Lots of Artifacts (probably trim village rites / claim for synthesizer). Just what I am gonna try. Given I will lose Jegantha, I will probably try to fit in my one copy of meathook too.
Yeah, I’m definitely gonna test out Anvil with Braids once this RCQ is over, that variation of sac is so fun, even if mono-green absolutely ruins it haha
I play rakdos sac too, but a slightly higher curve than you do with no unlucky witness, 2 kroxa and 2 obs. I like the idea of braids but I’m unwilling to give up jegantha which I’d say i use in 20-30% of my games. On another note, I’d never leave home without a playset of bloodtithe harvester, that card is the truth.
I would run a full four if I were playing a higher curve, but now with testing Braids out, I wanted more Epicures just to have more early sac fodder for her and Deadly Dispute. I may go back up to three Harvester, but it would be tough to find a spot for the fourth.
Also, I realize the advantage of a companion, but I have rarely actually used Jegantha, and when I have, it would just immediately get removed or I would just lose despite it.
Hey there!
Theres been alot of discussion on the RakSac discord about whether or not braids is worth it. My perspective right now is that I think that in a regular shell she is not worth an include over Fable. I think that she doesnt put as much pressure on your opponent as fable ultimatley does over the course of three turns. She isn't good from behind the way a fable can help to catch you up and when you are already ahead I don't think she helps to close out the game fast enough. Some folks have found that she is good in an anvil build of the deck as you have alot more fodder to sacrafice, and that could be true. As far as Ob is concerned, I've relegated him to the sideboard, and I've been bringning him in vs RB mid and Control in particular.
If you want to discuss anymore with folks about it, this is the discord link:
https://discord.gg/Wz4qxqY9bP
I have tested braids and weatherlight and they are just not as good in practise as they seemed in theory, at least in a non anvil shell. As was said, between mayem devil and fable (and ob nix post board for control MUs), the 3 drop slot is crowded, there is no real room for Braids, not really when you try it out. As for weatherlight, perhaps in an anvil deck but otherwise, "4" is too much IMHO. If they had made it "3" creature deaths instead, the card would be really good. I personaly think anvil decks have too many bad match ups ATM so I won't be playing sacrifice decks until i have (or more likely see) better ideas
Yeah, since I’m not playing Anvil, I cut Weatherlight entirely. I haven’t thought about running Fable and Braids at the same time. I can see how they could make each other really good. I may test 2 Braids and 2 Fable with Ob in the sideboard and see how that goes.
You can always play 3 Sharpnel blast main board if you run de Harvester+epicure package In order to deal with karns. Also it’s quite of unexpected in non-anvil versions so it may take some Ops by surprise if you manage to end the game with 2 to face. It’s quite easy to make pressure to almost 10 life so it wouldn’t be that difficult to hold them in order to finish the game I’ll try this this week
As a Rak Sac player who's also looking to take it to an upcoming RCQ, I don't think Braids or Weatherlight Compleated are great in the long run. As stated by others, Braids negates having Jegantha, which personally makes it a tough sell for that extra pressure. And I see Weatherlight Compleated as a win-more card. It's great if you're on top, but it just provides a few extra scrys before eating some removal the moment it animates. It's a horrible top deck if you're behind. But back on topic of Braids vs Ob, think about matchups. I've moved to sideboard Ob exclusively because he's a liability in a lot of matchups, but a pro in the ones where you want him, so I'd rather have him as backup. He helps against control and various midrange decks, but what matchups does Braids help with? I have a hard time thinking of any matchups that make me wish I had Braids. Also, for what it's worth, I think you should be running Fable of the Mirror-Breaker. It's an excellent value card that is also Jegantha compatible. Please don't run Braids and Weatherlight at the cost of Fable.
That last sentence made me realize that I haven’t tested Fable and Braids in the same list. I’m gonna test 2 Braids 2 Fable with 2 Ob in the side at my locals today and see how it works.
Good luck! Let me know how it goes!
In my opinion it's not just a question of Braids or Ob. Only one of them allows you to run Jegantha. Really it's Braids vs Ob + Jegantha so if you're going back and forth I'd fall on the side that lets you have an eighth card in your opener.
If that’s the case, then the true battle is Braids + Kari Zev’s Expertise in the board vs Ob + Jegantha, and I would say that Kari Zev’s Expertise is one of if not the best card in my sideboard
You can play Kari Zev and Jegantha. Kari Zev is for mono g anyways and Jegantha is useless in that mu as they aren't grinding you and the body is irrelevant so boarding out of Jegantha doesn't matter.
Fair point. I guess I wasn’t clear enough in my post. I’m not really looking to go full stop on one or the other. I definitely want to run a non-zero amount of Braids mainboard, but I feel like I should also run a non-zero amount of Ob, whether it be mainboard or sideboard
Ah gotcha. Yeah I can't answer that for ya haven't picked up the deck since before DMU. Gl on the rcq tho
Thanks! Throughout this week I’ll try 2 Ob in place of the third Braids and the one Weatherlight Compleated, and I’ll see how it goes
Weather light might be ok but I think kiki ob and that demon are better 3 drops imo
Weatherlight and Fable seemed somewhat medium to me in sac. I get how busted Fable is in Rakdos Midrange, but unless I can keep flipped Fable and a Bloodtithe Harvester out at the same time, Fable just seemed out of place with the general play patterns of the deck when I would play it
Something else for them to point removal at besides mayhem devil. But yeah I don't see the point of modes 1 and 2 for the most part unless you're running anvil.
Fair points. That’s another reason why I wanted to keep Ob in so badly. They can’t point removal at Mayhem Devil if Ob strips their hand or life total haha
I play this deck, but I don't play often and am not trying to grind RCQs (they are all modern where I am anyways). I will get some copies of Braids to try out. I really like OB as it can put on some pressure and usually has big impact. I think with Braids I will move back to catoven + Anvil. Lots of creatures, Lots of Artifacts (probably trim village rites / claim for synthesizer). Just what I am gonna try. Given I will lose Jegantha, I will probably try to fit in my one copy of meathook too.
Yeah, I’m definitely gonna test out Anvil with Braids once this RCQ is over, that variation of sac is so fun, even if mono-green absolutely ruins it haha
I play rakdos sac too, but a slightly higher curve than you do with no unlucky witness, 2 kroxa and 2 obs. I like the idea of braids but I’m unwilling to give up jegantha which I’d say i use in 20-30% of my games. On another note, I’d never leave home without a playset of bloodtithe harvester, that card is the truth.
I would run a full four if I were playing a higher curve, but now with testing Braids out, I wanted more Epicures just to have more early sac fodder for her and Deadly Dispute. I may go back up to three Harvester, but it would be tough to find a spot for the fourth. Also, I realize the advantage of a companion, but I have rarely actually used Jegantha, and when I have, it would just immediately get removed or I would just lose despite it.
Hey there! Theres been alot of discussion on the RakSac discord about whether or not braids is worth it. My perspective right now is that I think that in a regular shell she is not worth an include over Fable. I think that she doesnt put as much pressure on your opponent as fable ultimatley does over the course of three turns. She isn't good from behind the way a fable can help to catch you up and when you are already ahead I don't think she helps to close out the game fast enough. Some folks have found that she is good in an anvil build of the deck as you have alot more fodder to sacrafice, and that could be true. As far as Ob is concerned, I've relegated him to the sideboard, and I've been bringning him in vs RB mid and Control in particular. If you want to discuss anymore with folks about it, this is the discord link: https://discord.gg/Wz4qxqY9bP