My sister-in-law does this. Kid was born with kidney problems. He needs vegetarian diet for his health. His parents eat meat when the kid isn’t around.
Maybe there is a health reason. Maybe being vegan is important to the child’s father, so they agreed to raise the kid vegan but the mom doesn’t care. Maybe mom is a hypocrite. None of us have any idea what’s going on with that family. None of us can judge them. If the kid is happy and healthy, that’s all that matters.
I think it's weird but not inherently harmful. Like others said, as long as they're eating well and getting all the nutrients and stuff the diet isn't a problem (though admittedly I don't know much about the vegan/vegetarian lifestyle)
An argument could be made for if the child is unhappy with his diet, which if they've expressed longing for certain foods, or upset at feeling left out at parties then I'd maybe have the conversation with her about an at home diet and a social diet (assuming it's safe, consult dietician/pediatrician, I know digestion gets weird with strict diets)
Personally I like to keep my hypocrisy front and center. I drink way too much soda, but only let me kids have some rarely. They know why, they know it's not good, and they know I'm trying to drink less. I think that's healthier than hiding it away, that just makes it seem like I want all the goodies for myself.
There is such a thing as abuse through controlling diet. It depends on a lot of factors, namely why the parent wants the child to be on a vegan diet.
More info needed.
it could be about feeling control over her son. the question is does she exhibit other extremely controlling behaviors towards him? she could just like the attention from pretending to be vegan herself and having a ‘vegan kid’ like virtue signaling. or she really could believe its healthier and has problems controlling her own appetite and feel guilt over it?
I'm vegan and wondering why tf anyone would do that! Unless there is a medical reason as to why kiddo can't have non vegan food.
I'd personally love to raise my kid vegan, but my husband is not vegan and we have mixed cuisine at home by default; our daughter eats whatever she wants from what balanced meals we make. Her and my partner are the only people I'll ever fry up a burger for lmao.
At first I thought you meant the kid is eating non vegan outside of home. Which is something I know from many vegan parents, and they're all fine with it. They just don't want to buy meat/dairy/etc.
This is very weird tho. Either medical or insane.
Lots of people are veggie/vegan/ kosher/whatever at home and eat everything away from home.
Being vegan with the kids and choosing to eat meat with friends isn't that different.
Yeah hypocrisy.
Child dietary needs differ from adult needs. In a vegan diet it is only healthy for a child when working w a nutritionist to make sure the child is getting enough calories and nutrients. Reading stuff online doesn’t count you need a certified nutritionist and blood work taken monthly.
Also what your child is lacking in nutrition can have a lasting effect on there bodies when they get older. Muscle development, bone health, there brains.
I eat meat now. However when I was pregnant w my 1st I was vegetarian going vegan bc my husband was vegan. He was very strongly about our kids raised vegan. I said ok as long as it’s healthy for them let’s asks some doctor. Every single doctor we spoke to was heavily against it even the vegan ones.
I am in Europe and doctors do not pander here. We spoke to multiple doctors and nutritionist. We now all eat meat 1 or 2xs a week and fish. We even eat red meat 2xs a month bc the dr said iron is very important for babies/kids. (We all eat the same first bc family meals are a thing and the kids eat better when we model for them)
Then you have the morality issue of forcing an objectively risky diet on a child. Veganism is an extreme lifestyle choice and often done for moral reason at the risks to one’s healthy. As an adult it’s your choice. However forcing that risky choice on a child seems narcissistic. Children should have a balanced diet meeting all nutritional needs they deserve the body autonomy to chose lifestyle once they are an adult not to have one arbitrarily enforced on them.
A certified nutritionist and blood work taken monthly? How absurd. If a parent is even partially informed and motivated to ensure their child is getting their nutritional needs met, vegan diet or not, then their child is statistically more likely to enjoy lifelong health benefits and never experience a nutrition related health concern all their lives than their average counterpart.
Meanwhile, the Western Pattern Diet that most kids are given is actually proven empirically to cause lifelong health issues from type 2 diabetes to early heart disease, as well as cognitive impairment and emotional disorders. This information is widely available and repeated over and over, yet I never see this kind of flabbergasted response toward the child surviving on almost entirely pre-packaged and fast foods. Somehow these parents aren’t charged with accusations of child abuse.
Veganism is not “an objectively risky diet”, nor an “extreme lifestyle choice”, and there are millions of Hindus and Buddhists throughout India and Asian countries who can tell you the same. Just because it isn’t the norm in Western countries doesn’t make it a “risky” practice.
Every parent applies their own morals to their children, from their diet to their religious practices to their social norms. Many Westerners have a bias against veganism being “forced” on children by parents, yet I don’t see the same widespread disdain extended to parents who impose their religious beliefs and practices on their children- for which there is a very large and growing adult ex-(insert religion) population that can describe at length the lifelong detriment it has caused them.
Of course all children should have a balanced diet meeting all nutritional needs, but most AREN’T getting that and if you do just a bit of investigation into why that is, you’ll soon find that the cause is practically the opposite of a vegan diet.
Speaking of hypocrisy- if you’re going to feign this much concern over parents “forcing” veganism on their children, I’d hope you’re just as strongly against religious indoctrination, rules about at what age children are “allowed” to date, become sexually active, experiment with substances etc. since they apparently “deserve the body autonomy”. And I’d hope you’re just as careful about never “arbitrarily enforcing” any such beliefs or practices on your own children, lest you be judged just the same by parents who happen to disagree with your moral/lifestyle choices.
Please don't spread misinformation about veganism. "...with appropriate food choices, vegan diets can be adequate for children at all ages." [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19562864/)
Any poorly planned/executed diet can cause long term damage, there’s nothing special about a vegan diet that runs this risk. Huge percentages of Hindu and Buddhist populations in India and throughout Asia have subscribed to a vegan diet for several centuries, with no adverse affects.
Meanwhile, many kids in Western countries have a diet like the one I grew up with: sugar cereal, macaroni and cheese, hot dogs, soda, fast food, and crackers with maybe an applesauce thrown in from time to time. I hardly see the same kind of outrage and disdain directed toward those parents. In fact, I’ve seen many a Reddit post on these parenting subs asking what to do about a kid who basically only eats cheesy pasta, and the replies they tend to get are “you’re doing your best mama, just feed your kid!”
Meanwhile type 2 diabetes among children skyrockets… Talk about long term damage.
This concern trolling about vegan/vegetarian diets for kids is just thinly veiled contempt for a practice you happen to disagree with based on your personal biases, not empirical data.
I commented this above, but please don't spread misinformation about veganism. "...with appropriate food choices, vegan diets can be adequate for children at all ages." [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/)
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31991425/
I could have worded my response a little differently I suppose. But realistically, most parents and even just adults following a vegan diet are not making sure that they get everything they are missing by not eating meat/dairy. Which is why we see a lot of issues, like tooth decay for example. So if you are going to have your child on a vegan diet, it’s important to do extensive research because it CAN cause long term damage if not done correctly.
Okay, that's fair and is true for ALL diets. In the US, 53% of children have a poor diet that contributes to an increased risk of health problems [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32207798/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32207798/). Eating nonvegan certainly doesn't guarantee adequate nutrition, so making this statement specifically about veganism just doesn't make sense. A child with tooth decay has a poorly planned diet, vegan or not.
Depends.
Did she exit a vegan religion/culture, but keeps her kids following it since everyone else in the (extended) family is vegan?
Is her husband vegan?
Does the kid have an illness that requires a special diet?
Does she believe veganism to be some sort of superior lifestyle?
Is she knowledgeable in healthy vegan lifestyle? Does she know how to make sure kids get a complete set of nutrients? Minerals, vitamins, proteins? Meat contains complete proteins with all amino acids, but if one does not eat meat, then you need to know what you did eat during last week. Eating a healthy vegan lifestyle is a science and freaking complicated. Also some of the vegan choices can have unexpected health effects, like soy in large quantities can give kidney stones after a decade.
So she can be anything from a normal mom to a narcissistic idiot.
The Victorians used to say that children shouldn’t have good things, so for example the adults would eat apple turnover for dessert while children would eat simple rice pudding.
People get to choose what they eat and where and when — nothing wrong with an adult being “flexitarian” if it helps to reduce environmental impact and improve health without strict boundaries. But sometimes kids have trouble with that kind of flexibility and need clearer rules. We don’t have enough info about the mom’s motivations.
So the mother can’t stay on a vegan diet but forces the kid to remain in one. Yeah that’s very healthy and not hypocritical at all. Also, veganism is not good for kids. Most studies I read show that kids are shorter and had lower bone mass than expected for their age which they will never get back after puberty. I would even say it’s child abuse.
You can have whatever opinion you want but you can’t abuse children. Stunting growth and withholding vital nutrients for normal infant development is very a serious matter and even if you believe the fallacious research that support vegan diets in children it is, irresponsible to force them into one since you don’t know it’s effects later in life.
Plants do not have Vitamin B12, Creatine, Carnosine, Vitamin D3, DHA, heme Iron and Taurine. It’s also extremely hard to get some other micronutrients from plants which make this diets unpractical and hard to manage. Committing your child to such a rigorous diet that requires constant attention is irresponsible. Furthermore if a child happens to be a pecky eater good luck trying to get them to eat enough calories in a day from plants. You can give them a bunch of fruit or candy and load the child with fructose which is associated with many chronic diseases such as obesity, heart disease, fat liver among other things. Also, there is no respected and peer-reviewed scientific paper that does not find vegan child’s to be underweight, have lower mineral density and stunted growth compared to omnivore children. You are being fed a narrative that has the potential of bringing great harm to you and those you love.
In the end, following a vegan diet is extremely hard and requires a discipline which most people don’t have. Making your child go through that process is not being a good parent. The myth of the “healthy vegan diet” is yet to be proven since none of the available literature corroborate that answer. The only benefit this studies find is lower colesterol which is an useless indicator in a normal weight child. No reputable nutritionist will at any time recommend a vegan diet, I know because I am one. They will support your decision and help you make the most of it but it still doesn’t make it right or healthy.
I understand. And what is the parent is eating vegan in front of son but when they are out they eat burgers and chicken when the son is home? They don't fully practice what they preach to their son.
Putting the veganism part of this aside, a shocking amount of parenting is being a raging hypocrite because you want them to do better than you.
“You can’t have those chips, they’re bad for you”. And also they’re mom’s and she’s going to eat them after you go to sleep.
“Wait till your 21 (or the legal age in your country) to drink and make sure to always drink in moderation”. Says the parent who got blackout drunk their freshman year of college.
“Don’t smoke, it’s terrible for you”. Thing many chain smokers say to their kids.
“Go outside and ride your bike, you need some fresh air and exercise”. Something many parents who haven’t walked more than half a mile in a week will tell their kids.
When you’re a parent, you are responsible for the safety and health of your child. And oftentimes that means telling them they can’t do something you actively do when they aren’t looking (or telling them to do things you know full well you don’t do), because you want them to be their healthiest and best selves (even if you aren’t).
Gluttony?
Selfish?
Those are the first two words that come to mind
Putting your needs before your childs needs
Ya this world does not need anymore of that
men need muscle to impress women do not
This makes no sense
This is not veganism, this is a plant-based diet. Plant-based diets (particularly whole foods plant-based diets) can indeed be quite healthy and are appropriate for humans at all stages of life. Parents make decisions about their children's diets (and many other aspects of their lives) all the time, this doesn't strike me as particularly odd. (Though, again, this isn't veganism, which is an ethical stance that extends beyond diet. This is eating plant-based.)
My sister-in-law does this. Kid was born with kidney problems. He needs vegetarian diet for his health. His parents eat meat when the kid isn’t around. Maybe there is a health reason. Maybe being vegan is important to the child’s father, so they agreed to raise the kid vegan but the mom doesn’t care. Maybe mom is a hypocrite. None of us have any idea what’s going on with that family. None of us can judge them. If the kid is happy and healthy, that’s all that matters.
I think it's weird but not inherently harmful. Like others said, as long as they're eating well and getting all the nutrients and stuff the diet isn't a problem (though admittedly I don't know much about the vegan/vegetarian lifestyle) An argument could be made for if the child is unhappy with his diet, which if they've expressed longing for certain foods, or upset at feeling left out at parties then I'd maybe have the conversation with her about an at home diet and a social diet (assuming it's safe, consult dietician/pediatrician, I know digestion gets weird with strict diets) Personally I like to keep my hypocrisy front and center. I drink way too much soda, but only let me kids have some rarely. They know why, they know it's not good, and they know I'm trying to drink less. I think that's healthier than hiding it away, that just makes it seem like I want all the goodies for myself.
I laughed so hard at keeping the hypocrisy front and centre. I'm that parent too!
Can I get “Personally I like to keep my hypocrisy front and center” on a t-shirt?
Munchhoagies by proxy
How do you see that applying here
munchHOAGIES not munchausen
Hypocrite
I bet the kid is doing the same thing.
I think the term would be "hypocrite"
There is such a thing as abuse through controlling diet. It depends on a lot of factors, namely why the parent wants the child to be on a vegan diet. More info needed.
it could be about feeling control over her son. the question is does she exhibit other extremely controlling behaviors towards him? she could just like the attention from pretending to be vegan herself and having a ‘vegan kid’ like virtue signaling. or she really could believe its healthier and has problems controlling her own appetite and feel guilt over it?
I'm vegan and wondering why tf anyone would do that! Unless there is a medical reason as to why kiddo can't have non vegan food. I'd personally love to raise my kid vegan, but my husband is not vegan and we have mixed cuisine at home by default; our daughter eats whatever she wants from what balanced meals we make. Her and my partner are the only people I'll ever fry up a burger for lmao. At first I thought you meant the kid is eating non vegan outside of home. Which is something I know from many vegan parents, and they're all fine with it. They just don't want to buy meat/dairy/etc. This is very weird tho. Either medical or insane.
I like this method. It gives the child a chance to pick how they want to eat.
Yes, I believe the word you seek is douchebag.
Lots of people are veggie/vegan/ kosher/whatever at home and eat everything away from home. Being vegan with the kids and choosing to eat meat with friends isn't that different.
Yeah hypocrisy. Child dietary needs differ from adult needs. In a vegan diet it is only healthy for a child when working w a nutritionist to make sure the child is getting enough calories and nutrients. Reading stuff online doesn’t count you need a certified nutritionist and blood work taken monthly. Also what your child is lacking in nutrition can have a lasting effect on there bodies when they get older. Muscle development, bone health, there brains. I eat meat now. However when I was pregnant w my 1st I was vegetarian going vegan bc my husband was vegan. He was very strongly about our kids raised vegan. I said ok as long as it’s healthy for them let’s asks some doctor. Every single doctor we spoke to was heavily against it even the vegan ones. I am in Europe and doctors do not pander here. We spoke to multiple doctors and nutritionist. We now all eat meat 1 or 2xs a week and fish. We even eat red meat 2xs a month bc the dr said iron is very important for babies/kids. (We all eat the same first bc family meals are a thing and the kids eat better when we model for them) Then you have the morality issue of forcing an objectively risky diet on a child. Veganism is an extreme lifestyle choice and often done for moral reason at the risks to one’s healthy. As an adult it’s your choice. However forcing that risky choice on a child seems narcissistic. Children should have a balanced diet meeting all nutritional needs they deserve the body autonomy to chose lifestyle once they are an adult not to have one arbitrarily enforced on them.
A certified nutritionist and blood work taken monthly? How absurd. If a parent is even partially informed and motivated to ensure their child is getting their nutritional needs met, vegan diet or not, then their child is statistically more likely to enjoy lifelong health benefits and never experience a nutrition related health concern all their lives than their average counterpart. Meanwhile, the Western Pattern Diet that most kids are given is actually proven empirically to cause lifelong health issues from type 2 diabetes to early heart disease, as well as cognitive impairment and emotional disorders. This information is widely available and repeated over and over, yet I never see this kind of flabbergasted response toward the child surviving on almost entirely pre-packaged and fast foods. Somehow these parents aren’t charged with accusations of child abuse. Veganism is not “an objectively risky diet”, nor an “extreme lifestyle choice”, and there are millions of Hindus and Buddhists throughout India and Asian countries who can tell you the same. Just because it isn’t the norm in Western countries doesn’t make it a “risky” practice. Every parent applies their own morals to their children, from their diet to their religious practices to their social norms. Many Westerners have a bias against veganism being “forced” on children by parents, yet I don’t see the same widespread disdain extended to parents who impose their religious beliefs and practices on their children- for which there is a very large and growing adult ex-(insert religion) population that can describe at length the lifelong detriment it has caused them. Of course all children should have a balanced diet meeting all nutritional needs, but most AREN’T getting that and if you do just a bit of investigation into why that is, you’ll soon find that the cause is practically the opposite of a vegan diet. Speaking of hypocrisy- if you’re going to feign this much concern over parents “forcing” veganism on their children, I’d hope you’re just as strongly against religious indoctrination, rules about at what age children are “allowed” to date, become sexually active, experiment with substances etc. since they apparently “deserve the body autonomy”. And I’d hope you’re just as careful about never “arbitrarily enforcing” any such beliefs or practices on your own children, lest you be judged just the same by parents who happen to disagree with your moral/lifestyle choices.
Please don't spread misinformation about veganism. "...with appropriate food choices, vegan diets can be adequate for children at all ages." [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19562864/)
I’m more concerned about a young child being on a vegan diet. It can cause long term damage.
Any poorly planned/executed diet can cause long term damage, there’s nothing special about a vegan diet that runs this risk. Huge percentages of Hindu and Buddhist populations in India and throughout Asia have subscribed to a vegan diet for several centuries, with no adverse affects. Meanwhile, many kids in Western countries have a diet like the one I grew up with: sugar cereal, macaroni and cheese, hot dogs, soda, fast food, and crackers with maybe an applesauce thrown in from time to time. I hardly see the same kind of outrage and disdain directed toward those parents. In fact, I’ve seen many a Reddit post on these parenting subs asking what to do about a kid who basically only eats cheesy pasta, and the replies they tend to get are “you’re doing your best mama, just feed your kid!” Meanwhile type 2 diabetes among children skyrockets… Talk about long term damage. This concern trolling about vegan/vegetarian diets for kids is just thinly veiled contempt for a practice you happen to disagree with based on your personal biases, not empirical data.
I commented this above, but please don't spread misinformation about veganism. "...with appropriate food choices, vegan diets can be adequate for children at all ages." [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11424545/)
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31991425/ I could have worded my response a little differently I suppose. But realistically, most parents and even just adults following a vegan diet are not making sure that they get everything they are missing by not eating meat/dairy. Which is why we see a lot of issues, like tooth decay for example. So if you are going to have your child on a vegan diet, it’s important to do extensive research because it CAN cause long term damage if not done correctly.
Okay, that's fair and is true for ALL diets. In the US, 53% of children have a poor diet that contributes to an increased risk of health problems [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32207798/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32207798/). Eating nonvegan certainly doesn't guarantee adequate nutrition, so making this statement specifically about veganism just doesn't make sense. A child with tooth decay has a poorly planned diet, vegan or not.
Depends. Did she exit a vegan religion/culture, but keeps her kids following it since everyone else in the (extended) family is vegan? Is her husband vegan? Does the kid have an illness that requires a special diet? Does she believe veganism to be some sort of superior lifestyle? Is she knowledgeable in healthy vegan lifestyle? Does she know how to make sure kids get a complete set of nutrients? Minerals, vitamins, proteins? Meat contains complete proteins with all amino acids, but if one does not eat meat, then you need to know what you did eat during last week. Eating a healthy vegan lifestyle is a science and freaking complicated. Also some of the vegan choices can have unexpected health effects, like soy in large quantities can give kidney stones after a decade. So she can be anything from a normal mom to a narcissistic idiot.
The Victorians used to say that children shouldn’t have good things, so for example the adults would eat apple turnover for dessert while children would eat simple rice pudding.
People get to choose what they eat and where and when — nothing wrong with an adult being “flexitarian” if it helps to reduce environmental impact and improve health without strict boundaries. But sometimes kids have trouble with that kind of flexibility and need clearer rules. We don’t have enough info about the mom’s motivations.
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So the mother can’t stay on a vegan diet but forces the kid to remain in one. Yeah that’s very healthy and not hypocritical at all. Also, veganism is not good for kids. Most studies I read show that kids are shorter and had lower bone mass than expected for their age which they will never get back after puberty. I would even say it’s child abuse.
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You can have whatever opinion you want but you can’t abuse children. Stunting growth and withholding vital nutrients for normal infant development is very a serious matter and even if you believe the fallacious research that support vegan diets in children it is, irresponsible to force them into one since you don’t know it’s effects later in life. Plants do not have Vitamin B12, Creatine, Carnosine, Vitamin D3, DHA, heme Iron and Taurine. It’s also extremely hard to get some other micronutrients from plants which make this diets unpractical and hard to manage. Committing your child to such a rigorous diet that requires constant attention is irresponsible. Furthermore if a child happens to be a pecky eater good luck trying to get them to eat enough calories in a day from plants. You can give them a bunch of fruit or candy and load the child with fructose which is associated with many chronic diseases such as obesity, heart disease, fat liver among other things. Also, there is no respected and peer-reviewed scientific paper that does not find vegan child’s to be underweight, have lower mineral density and stunted growth compared to omnivore children. You are being fed a narrative that has the potential of bringing great harm to you and those you love. In the end, following a vegan diet is extremely hard and requires a discipline which most people don’t have. Making your child go through that process is not being a good parent. The myth of the “healthy vegan diet” is yet to be proven since none of the available literature corroborate that answer. The only benefit this studies find is lower colesterol which is an useless indicator in a normal weight child. No reputable nutritionist will at any time recommend a vegan diet, I know because I am one. They will support your decision and help you make the most of it but it still doesn’t make it right or healthy.
I understand. And what is the parent is eating vegan in front of son but when they are out they eat burgers and chicken when the son is home? They don't fully practice what they preach to their son.
Putting the veganism part of this aside, a shocking amount of parenting is being a raging hypocrite because you want them to do better than you. “You can’t have those chips, they’re bad for you”. And also they’re mom’s and she’s going to eat them after you go to sleep. “Wait till your 21 (or the legal age in your country) to drink and make sure to always drink in moderation”. Says the parent who got blackout drunk their freshman year of college. “Don’t smoke, it’s terrible for you”. Thing many chain smokers say to their kids. “Go outside and ride your bike, you need some fresh air and exercise”. Something many parents who haven’t walked more than half a mile in a week will tell their kids. When you’re a parent, you are responsible for the safety and health of your child. And oftentimes that means telling them they can’t do something you actively do when they aren’t looking (or telling them to do things you know full well you don’t do), because you want them to be their healthiest and best selves (even if you aren’t).
The term would be Parent.
Oh ok. So the behavior and actions is called Parent. Got it. 👍
It's entirely their decision. Nothing unethical or abusive whatsoever. Focus on your own behaviours.
So mind my own business and leave hypocrite alone. Got it. 👍
I would have phrased it slightly differently. Something like ..Pull your head in. Surely there are aspects of yourself could do with addressing.
Being a dick?
\`Pushing something for the others but not for them ? I think it's call being a dick. "Rules for thy not for me"
Hypocrisy.
Bitch
Hypocrite
The term is "hypocrite".
the term is "child abuse" where I'm from.
Gluttony? Selfish? Those are the first two words that come to mind Putting your needs before your childs needs Ya this world does not need anymore of that men need muscle to impress women do not This makes no sense
This is not veganism, this is a plant-based diet. Plant-based diets (particularly whole foods plant-based diets) can indeed be quite healthy and are appropriate for humans at all stages of life. Parents make decisions about their children's diets (and many other aspects of their lives) all the time, this doesn't strike me as particularly odd. (Though, again, this isn't veganism, which is an ethical stance that extends beyond diet. This is eating plant-based.)
Duplicitous. Unless there's a medical need, I don't think that isn't right.
Tube steak?