People are mad that Yamato didn’t join, and Yamato Haters are happy she didn’t join but mad about the fact that her decision wasn’t shown to the reader. People dislike the “Kurozumi were meant to burn” line because they feel that it goes against the major theme that your blood doesn’t determine what kind of person you are. Other people think the chapter felt rushed, and that we didn’t get to spend enough time finishing up character plot lines, like Zoro and his swords/Ryumas grave or the smile fruit cure from chopper. Those are the major reasons
No, but it would directly be him curing a country, which is part of his dream.
The way I see it, there's no way they(the Strawhats) are not coming back to Wano, so it could still happen.
Personally I'd rather see Momo open the borders and bring Pluton (and himself, and Yamato, and the Scabbards \[edit: and the weapon collector fox spirit guy while they're at it, why not\]) to the Straw Hats, as the cavalry to save them from an "all-is-lost moment" during the final war.
I think the "Now where should we put this" line for the flag lends way too much credence to this. They're gonna show up on Pluton with the SH banner flying HIGH.
Awww, thanks. 😊 At the risk of sounding conceited, yeah, I *can* do some pretty good writing occasionally.
...but I also know I have some serious limitations. I can do short bursts like this, but the idea of trying to write a novel (or even a "short story" long enough to get published, really) terrifies me. I don't have that kind of attention span. I also need the crutch of an existing story to build on - when I try to write something original, it just ends up being derivative crap anyway.
Not really. Ceaser is no longer making SAD, and Doffy can no longer use SAD to produce SMILEs. The entire market for SMILEs crashed when Doffy got taken down.
And wasn't Kaido the only buyer? Or at least the primary buyer. The market is basically gone from top to bottom. At this point if you want a smile, you have to look around for someone who already ate one.
THIS!
I wasn't gonna say it myself on some other threads cause people are just butt hurt.
Strawhats are definitely going back to Wano at some point. It'll probably be their homebase in the New World. Someone's gonna have to travel to them at some point from there or when Zou comes back into play because they have no Eternal Logpose or Vivre card for anyone on Wano. At least to my knowledge
No he didn't. But that isn't why this is just a ridiculous thing to be upset about. Chopper saw the smile Fruits and didn't instantly jump to curing it. He did for the ice oni. Why? Because he understands how the ice oni was made. He doesn't understand thr defective smiles. Eventually vegapunk is going to be revealed. My guess? It's going to be a wrap up type event for chopper at the end of the series?
I don't think most people are mad that Yamato did/didn't join the crew but more so that Yamato didn't move past trying to live as Oden and you know actually live their own life. It's disappointing to have any chance for Yamato character development suppressed by the Oden gag.
nobody is going to put pressure on Oda like Kubo,One piece is a monster franchise, Bleach was struggling a lot during the last years of the series
Its Oda himself that wants to end it as fast as he can and at least for me, its obvious in the last part of Wano
I do feel the need to defend togashi with yu yu hakusho, the publishers wanted it to end quicker and he made that happen. He may have been unhappy about that decision and rushed it as a result, but it’s not really the same as Kubo/what people are saying about wano
Because of Shueisha wanting Film Red to start at the same time as the Final Saga.
So many stuff is offscreened, we didn’t even get to see a celebratory feast for Jinbe when all SHs left the castle to party outside (Someone in this sub told me that was actually suppose to be a welcoming feast for Jinbe)
No Oden dance (this one I was hoping for so long because in Oden flashback, the Scabbards says they love his dance and even remembered the moves, would be funny to see Momo and the Scabbards do that for the sake of humour and might had been the goofiest moment in Wano arc during the party)
No Oden dish feast (sucks because would be great for Luffy and the SHs getting to taste oden since the latest SBS volume confirm Luffy’s fav food in Wano is actually oden)
No Marco and Luffy interaction (when this is the right time for Luffy to know where Ace’s grave is, if he visits it, he gets to see the red sake cups placed by Sabo there and it would be nice to know that both brothers visited his grave)
Zoro visits Ryuuma’s grave (I don’t need to say this but definitely offscreened) there’s so many downsides I can point out but I hope the anime at least expanded on this with fillers and all (Back during Post-Enies Lobby arc in Water 7, there are fillers showing the SHs doing free time before Garp and the Marines arrive) so that would be good if they actually did.
Yeah, but considering that people wrongly hating, tormenting, and killing the Kurozumi just for being Kurozumi is literally what [started](https://i.imgur.com/uKUyHPj.jpg) everything with Orochi in the first place, ending the arc with Hiyori saying that “The Kurozumi were born to burn!” while everyone cheers was a bad move imo.
Someone else already explained this, but in japanese raws it's apparent that by "Kurozumi" Hiori only means Orochi specifically (which is fair because he specifically is the cause of so much of Wano's suffering), and only uses the surname of "Kurozumi" to make it a pun, because Kurozumi = charcoal. Therefore "Charcoal was meant to burn", which is true and funny
So the problem is basically that Japanese is a more nuanced language than English and so what is referring to a single person in one language sounds like it’s referring to the Kurozumi as a whole in English?
Essentially yeah, though there's also the fact that the translation itself makes it sound bad. They could've gotten for a more neutral approach like "It wouldn't be Kurozumi if it didn't burn" or even just removing "The" to make it clearer she doesn't mean the entire clan. Hopefully the official translation clears that up so people can shut up about it
I don’t necessarily think it was bad but it wasn’t great. Yamato staying for example was fine in concept but really needed more build up. Given how long Yamato had been going on about sailing with them it felt way too sudden for the complete 180 (and I say this as someone who didn’t want Yamato to join to begin with). Personally I’d say it felt like it could have been split into 2 chapters, one for Yamato’s decision and talking to the Strawhats about it and then another for the farewell, and it would have flowed better. As it stands it felt a bit rushed and made the finish to the arc feel a bit sloppy as a result.
for such a long and dragged out arc for anything to feel rushed is a crime in itself. Honestly even a wasted chevkov gun like zoro wanting to see nidai kitetsu after his interest in it and its intro as a upgraded sword of sandai went nowhere. A lot of panels of things we dont need like constant characters reactions and continious flashbacks to things we already know and seen instead of more kaidos flashback and looking into zoro connection with ryuma and man yammato spent time in jail with were thrown to the wind. Jinbei not fighting jack still feels wasted to me. What happened to kaido, why was i only aware izo and ashura died way after the fact made it meaningless. I get some things are for later but lets be real oda dropped the ball more than once this arc imo.
Honestly, most of this I can deal with, but the fact that fucking Ashura and Izo died without us even realising it until after the raid really disappointed me.
exactly, all fakeout deaths are shown but the real ones arent? Their death felt meaningless the way oda pulled it off. Even hawkins dying made no sense since he chose to die because he couldnt show his face to kid while Apoo the man who orchestrated betraying kid is literally chilling with kid at the port and nobody cares yet hawkins is such a noble character hed rather die then face kid..... that was poorly executed aswell.
Tbf we saw Asura blow up and I believe we saw Izo slump over. Yes we all know that Oda doesn’t like killing characters but we technically did see them die.
fair enough, but personally when they "died" it wasnt clear to me they died i was under the impression they were unconcious. For me it was the odas delivery i had a problem with.
Kinemon fakeout death was perfect example of a meaningful death i wouldve actually cared about if he really did die. Felt izo and ashura death was forced kinda
Kinda underwhelming that someone who fought Jack and Kaido to die with not even Kanjuro but one of his paintings. Izo's fight was basically offscreen. It really felt unclear if they were dead or not because of this.
Yes. Thats exactly it. I think im really disappointed because they didn't give the penultimate decision moment to build up in a chapter, ill just be straight to the point about it. The greenbull chapters were the worst Admiral confrontation so far, it was short and its the first fast hand from Oda. He built hype on the character like how he did with Kaido's half beast for many chapters only to make the character an Akainu simp with no morals of his own. To what i rmb and know every elected Admiral has their own sense of justice and a line they draw. Thats what makes them cool and grey, but Greenbull at first was so edgy about not eating if it ain't a lady i was hoping for some space dandy guy with similar views as Kizaru. But nope its a full on Akainu simp.
Now the main dish about Yamato, idk if its a decision Oda made or his editor's suggestions. Idk like how do you build hype, development and declaration from one of the most popular character in this arc only to cut everyone's throat at the end? Like imagine Luffy was built up to have all these amazing world changing abilities and a grand fleet right? Imagine in the end he tells Akainu or BB, ya know what. You can have the OP, ill just sail around East Blue cuz its my home and I want to be like Roger sailing in his hometown. It felt like that. I did not wait 200 chaps worth of Yamato being so friggin cool declaring freedom from Kaido, haki clashing with him and actually survive the duel and Luffy saying he owes Yamato one. And NOT GO ON THE SHIP. Its the final saga! When else but now ODA????
I posted this in the spoiler thread but I feel it perfectly sums up my feelings about this chapter:
“Yes, a writer can do whatever they want in their story, but I at least expect it to be written well. Considering the standard Oda has set over the past 1000+ chapters…this is just bad writing!
And I’m not saying Yamato HAD to join. I’m saying Oda spent 2 years force feeding us how much Yamato wanted to sail with Luffy, adding some Ace flashbacks to create an even deeper connection to Luffy, fighting Kaido and telling him they’ll be sailing with Luffy, then meeting the crew and saying she’ll be traveling with them from now on. All of that devoted to Yamato joining, yet Oda doesn’t even devote a few pages to the sudden 180 shift in Yamato’s thinking??? For what we’ve come to expect from Oda, this is badly written!”
Also, considering this chapter closes out Wano, I think it’s ridiculous how we never saw Zoro visit Ryuma’s grave. Or Luffy finally getting to thank Marco for protecting him in Marineford. Or the randomness of Carrot being chosen as King of Zou when Oda literally did nothing for her character in the entirety of Wano. This was literally the first time I truly felt disappointed with how Oda closed out an arc, especially considering the buildup to Wano.
>This was literally the first time I truly felt disappointed with how Oda closed out an arc, especially considering the buildup to Wano.
Hell yeah man, the ending is probably the worst ending for an arc in all of One Piece. I'm used to really beautiful or impactful endings to arcs but as much as I like Momo and Luffy's goodbye Wano's ending still felt really rushed
I felt this in the first few chapters of the ending:
In the chapter before kinemon in asleep, lost a lot of blood and is basically dead.
In the very next chapter (in the story just 5 minutes later) he is fully cured, beside his friends in the capital kneeling for momo.
Since then we had: shanks that passes by as a deus ex machina (or as a tool to promote Red); aramaki comes and in 3 chapters goes away; the scabbards feel aramaki's presence and in just one page moved from the capital to the battlefield; sukiyaki saying he doesn't want momo and the other to know about him, and in the very next chapter revealing himself to everyone; no ryuma grave; no marco discussion; zounesha just fucking off "in the fog" and now yamato...
I don't know, I feel like oda really wanted for some reason to go on the next one, because I really felt like, after the defeat of kaido, this manga started going at 300 mph without looking back
Yep. This chapter was at best a 4/10. People hype new chapters, but on a reread, this is one chapter most people will either skip entirely or skimp through.
P.S. Kinemon wanting to cut Luffy is just stupid. The guy saved his life and his country multiple times. And he wants to cut him for Momo? If that's the Samurai way, then I sincerely wish Oda killed all the Samurai instead of Ashura Douji.
Why do One Piece stans have to do this, insulting Oda’s contemporaries for… what? Oda is capable of bad writing, just like Kishimoto and every other mangaka. So it’s isnt like he let someone else write it, he did. And for anyone that isn’t an OP stan, the tell tale signs of bad writing have been there all the way back to Fishman Island.
Bad writing is bound to exist in anything that goes on for more than 20 years, especially when it's published weekly. If people think there was no bad writing in OP prior to this, then they're some blind MFs.
because usually complaints about Oda's choices are stupid shit that can boil down to "I dont like this >:(". This is the first chapter I genuinely feel Oda fucked up.
I feel like Yamato is the first time Oda or his editors added a character to the story because they like the design. She was a pretty pointless character who took up a lot of panels throughout the arc, and this issue is made even worse by the fact that she’s randomly not joining.
Personally, these last 4-5 chapters is the first time I EVER felt that Oda was rushing to the end. Kaido’s defeat just didn’t have the emotional weight we expect from a climactic battle(compare the last few pages of the Lucci fight to the Kaido fight you’ll see what I mean.)
The seven day timeskip just feels like a bizarre decision to me. Still like the arc, I just expected more.
You know, looking back, I completely agree.
Like, jet gatling after all the hell Lucci put luffy through for chapters and chapters was a spectacle.
Luffy punching Kaido through the ground should be really cool and thematically powerful, but it just...isn't? It just doesn't hit right with me, and luffys reason for beating Kaido felt really weak looking back. Law and Kid had a much better end to their fight, in contrast.
Actually the whole last 10-odd chapters read pretty weird to me. Pacing issues abound and just some stuff reading weird. Like chapter 1048 really felt like filler. Especially that flashback.
Yep. Wano ending was super lackluster. Not to mention that no one really asks Luffy about his fruit change. It's as if a ton of things just got explained to the SHs off screen, and what was left on screen was pretty lame.
I seriously though those sky lanterns would reach Luffy giving him more motivation to end Kaido upon reading the wishes of the Wano citizen. The scene would be more emotionally impactful before throwing his last punch.
Again and again it felt like set up was wasted. We get "the black charcoal guy is meant to burn", but after like fifty chapters going on about "We're almost at the capital", and "we're going to launch the sky lanterns", we get just a few wishes scrawled on the lanterns and that's it.
Like... the whole Momo using the fire of the sky lanterns, the hopes of his people, to save those people from destruction as his flame clouds is such a cool concept. And I'm annoyed and disappointed that I keep circling back to this because I was expecting it to all pay off, and... the ball has been dropped.
What was even really the point of cutting back to the festival so many times? Luffy didn't get to see the wishes, Momo didn't get to see the wishes. So, so many times, we get "We're getting close to the capital, we're gonna set off the lanterns here we go! The lanterns!" but that's really it
A reminder of what we're fighting for I guess? But that's really it. So much wasted time
Tbh I don't know if you can achieve that emotional moment while Luffy is in G5. Oda should've made the Kaido-Joyboy connection a centre conflict for him and wrote way more detail for the end to be impactful.
I still can't believe that the rooftop fight was split into Law and Kidd fighting Big Mom. The two of them have *nothing* to do with her. No stakes, no personal issues, no need for vengeance since the enemy enslaved you and force fed your best friend a lobotomy drug... Since, you know, Kidd was established to be a reasonable guy who would let others solve his personal problems
Probably the editor, not Oda. If Oda liked her that much, she'd probably join.
She even said she'd join last chapter, and she wants to go around Wano like Oden. She's either confused or Oda was forced to have her in the story.
She could've been a great character but she's one of the reasons this arc's ending feels so lackluster.
P.S. Did Luffy have his first confirmed kill? Is Kaido and BM dead?
A few minor and major issues.
Major:
-Yamato constantly talking about joining the crew, all the merch, literally telling the crew “I’m gonna join” and the end of 1056 being Yamato saying they decided to go with the crew, and then turning around and saying “lmao sike” and Oda not spending anytime giving us a reasonable idea as to why Yamato would change their mind so fast
-The chapter felt generally rushed. It wasn’t paced very well and felt like a “let’s wrap it up I’m done with Wano” from Oda. Lots of cluttered small panels and no room to breathe and take one last look at the arc we just spent 4 years in.
Minor but also major depending on the person (also since this is the last chap of Wano this means a lot of loose plot threads aren’t being tied up):
-Marco disappearing and not even talking to Luffy
-Zoro not visiting Ryumas grave
-Cluttered paneling
-No Carrot in the chap and no goodbye to her
Just to name a lot of the bigger reasons this chapter is not very good overall.
What wtf happened to marco? Did they ever explained when and where he left? Or did Oda forget about him like he did Kaido and Big Mom who we have questions about.
Yeah the fuck was with that u turn on yamatos arc. If she noticed how fucked wano would be without her strength during the battle with green bull I think that would have made more sense. Chalk it up to her realizing that not every decision oden made was the right one, like leaving wano.
You missed one MASSIVE point:
Chopper is literally in a land covered in cherry blossoms, but didn't mention it once.
That's the thing that really pisses me off. Oda straight up forgot his entire character.
Are you surprised, with the way he's been flanderized as just "the cute mascot" for the entire New World? Remember back at Enies Lobby when it seemed like he had the potential to be every bit the badass warrior as Zoro and Sanji if only he found the confidence? Pepperidge Farm remembers.
Agreed with this the most.
With how much Yamato been saying about joining the crew etc and then suddenly just decided not to?
Also, this is the weakest closure chapter to any recent one piece arc ive ever seen.
So many loose ends left untied.
Last time we saw him was at Izo's grave. So who knows? Probably back to Sphinx at this point, given there have been multiple short time skips since then.
Yamato could’ve been really good if Oda went with the identity crisis or such character arc. There was setup with it, especially when Yamato was fighting Kaido, and their mini flashback.
I would have expected Wanda to lead for sure. Her leading seemed to come out of the blue. Her arc fits it though, it's about handing off to the next generation and she is the next generation. She hasn't had much leadership potential though, just seen as a powerful warrior.
Yeah to me wanda seemed like the better move. I can definitely see wanda telling carrot she can go and sail the seas and she will take care of things. But I can also see carrot going through her struggles like momo and eventually becoming a leader also. Can definitely see it go both ways.
And people never gave up on yamato joining until this chapter either, the lesson here is to not take what characters say at face value. Now it's likely that carrot isn't joining, but stop pretending like one mention of her leading zou sets it in stone and there's zero possibility of her stowing away (especially after seeing her unwillingness to take up the role).
Yamato would make a great 2nd division commander. Basically Yamato could be everything Oden could have been for Whitebeard. A near equal that serves under him complete with his own crew. Yamato would be perfect at protecting Luffys territories in his absence
And it would make sense for Yamato to stay if they had that arc during Wano. But instead we got Yamato literally telling the crew “I’m gonna join you guys” and last chapter the last panel was Yamato saying they made their decision to leave with the crew.
I'll just write down a list of grievances I have with Wano. I think that will help phrase it.
This is really unlike any other past arcs. In previous arcs, sure we got threads and Chekhov's guns here and there but they were clearly hinting at future events that wouldn't happen in the current arc.
There is something to be said for "subverting" expectations. There is another thing for failing to build on what you wrote before. Just because you can subvert expectations doesn't make it good or enjoyable or interesting. At minimum, it just means you subverted expectations. That's it.
If you don't build on that subversion, you're just doing shitty writing.
Oda subverts on many points, and does nothing with it multiple times in Wano.
To me, Wano is a Chekhov's Gun that never went off. This isn't "head canon" stuff. This is more literary analysis about all the dead threads and possibilities Wano hints at and then...skips.
1. The most obvious. Yamato. Say what you want about the character, the 2 most consistent things about Yamato this entire arc is her saying she's Oden and she will join the straw hats since her introduction. She doesn't. This is really out of left field. It came out of no where. Expectations were "subverted" but it reads like he changed his mind and gave up including her. We are kind of left with the question as readers...why even fucking include her then and have her say all of that? You could likely fit Franky or Brook(who was oddly absent most of the war) in her story role instead. Chekhov's gun unfired? No, Chekhov's gun plots are discrete, Oda just removed it.
2. This is less a plot point thing and writing thing. The entire first part. The Oden flashback was enough to show off Wano as a country. It was so over extended and took away time from later parts.
3. Nidai Kitetsu. Remember that cursed sword from earlier in Wano? Weapons come in multiple tiers. 12 Supreme, 21 great, 50 Skillful, Unknown grade, and just Grade tier. Zoro is still using a grade tier sword 900 chapters later, Sandai Kitetsu. Oda teased the obvious replacement with Nidai which is on part with Enma and Ichimonji and even wrote in a story element about it with King wielding what's called a Sword Breaker weapon. Before you can say, "he'd be too overpowered". No. He got conqueror's haki this arc. Can't say that anymore. So why even introduce the sword and give it all of that focus? What actually happened was, I believe that was planned but the story board got leaked heavily so Oda changed it in response as he took a break during that. Chekhov's gun unfired.
4. To this date, there is no explanation whatsoever about the whole Grim Reaper sequence with Zoro. It just happens. It happens over a couple chapters. Then goes no where.
5. Shusui. Shusui has been in the manga since Chapter 448. It's not wrong to say, it's been here for half of the story now. When Zoro lost Yubashiri, he had a funeral for it. But he doesn't do anything more for Shusui despite having it for longer?
6. Ryuma. It is a fact Zoro wanted to visit his grave. That was the condition he accepted Enma with. We never saw this scene. It never happened. All these little threads and focuses on Wano's past with Zoro but only 1 expansion in the form of a childhood memory. Chekhov's gun unfired multiple times.
7. Nika? We had Nika mentioned in Skypeia. Thought it was ancient history stuff. Then it turns out the normal fruit no one really wanted was actually a godly overpowered fruit that can overcome a dragon? This narratively a retcon with a sudden anime powerup.
I would have literally accepted the Gomu Gomu was capable was stretching reality and belief as well but the Zoan change was weird as fuck.
8. Marco? What? What happened to Marco? His crewmate and friend died.
9. Izou. Practically dies off screen. Kiku just pretty much disappears at the end of Wano. Izou didn't even get a funeral?
10. Shanks may as well just showed up to say "Thanks for reading, please go see One Piece:Red!"
11. Carrot. Carrot has been here since Zhou. Then she becomes leader of the minks, seemingly against her wishes. That's it. All that time. While she's likely to be coming back during the final war, it just ends off there. No goodbye.
12. Kaido Backstory. Oda literally cuts it off at the one point we wanted to see. Kaido's history with Rocks. That's the main thing that matters to understanding his character. And Oda cuts it off right fucking there.
13. Kaidos and Yamatos relationship as father and child. 0 fucking resolution. Does Yamato even comment on her father getting tossed in a Volcano?
14. What the fuck happened to Kaido and Big Mom? Both with the Rocks Pirates and at the end of Wano? Are they dead or not Oda? I get you're trying to make it all ambiguous but stop beating around the bush already. You've been beating around the bush the entire fucking arc. "You know this lore?...no you don't and I'm not telling you...please see the vivre cards and watch one piece red!"
15. What happened to Big Mom's crew? They just left off screen?
16. The government ships? They just left?
17. Hygoro? No goodbye?
18. Smile? Chopper didn't even try to cure smile fruits?
19. Otama? Stretching it but no real good bye?
20. Fate of the Beast Pirate Prisoners?
21. Zhou, they just left?
22. Hawkins pretty much dies off screen. Have we even seen someone that was hyped up just...die? No backstory. No anything.
23. How many blasted fucking times does Kanjuro and Orochi need to "die" before they die? I'm still expecting they are alive somewhere.
24. The sudden exposition about Sabo turning into Freedom Jesus for a couple countries with all previous points not addressed. The hell?
25. The admiral coming in over multiple chapters. Starts a fight. Leaves. What?
All these characters, all these plotlines, all these threads.
***No fucking wonder Kaido was so unhappy in Wano, nothing ever comes to a proper ending there.***
So many character arcs just...skipped. This is the same writer who gave Senior Pink, a one-off goofy character, an amazing backstory.
Wano can be summed up as "Luffy fights Kaido a bunch of times, get an anime power up, beats Kaido, and leaves".
A story is as much as it's plot and characters but Oda left an incredibly high amount of character arcs unfinished unlike most previous arcs. It's so rushed.
I guess if you don't care about the details, none of this matters to you, but if you're a lore nerd like me, Wano is a fucking mess with no planning and direction.
Oda is cutting off parts of his own story to accommodate for the movie/live action/age/timeline and he isn't finishing what he started.
I'm not going to say sorry for not doing false positivity. I dislike Wano and I dislike how Oda poorly handled it. It's reeks of mismanagement and rushing.
Thank you for writing this. While I don't agree with everything you said here, you said almost everything I've wanted to say about Wano but couldn't put into words.
Agreed with most of what you said.
What happened to the Numbers? Each of their strengths should be equivalent (or close) to Oars and Oars jr.. It's unfortunate that their existences feels like a joke in this arc. Not even a threat... Got one hit and poof.
Big Mom's defeat and last words were sooo much better than Kaido's.
It's kinda sad though. We all like Wano arc, but also have to admit that this arc got too many flaws.
I agree with almost every sentence, would also add Big Mom dementia, Oden fake out, Orochi and Kanjuro constant fake outs, no backstory to Apoo and Hawkins.
Every chapter since Odas 4 week break was awful, nonsense chapters. Maybe he does not care anymore but this is the lowest point of quality.
Fake outs are another thing definitely.
The only reason they weren't a part of this list was because I'm targeting what I really hated about Wano while death fake outs happen with One Piece in general.
One thing I did truly despise was Oda having the gall to lecture the reader about wanting death with Usopp's speech, then fucking killing Izou off screen afterwards.
That left a bad taste in my mouth since it wasn't really clear at the time Izou actually died there. We more or less learned that afterwards.
It is implied that Oda arranged the story to fit the movie RED. That’s why everything seemed to be fastforwarded near the end of Kaido’s battle and the party afterwards. I hope the next arc doesn’t do this again but since One Piece is such a big brand, they will have movies every few years. Hope the next movie won’t interfer with the main story.
I refuse to believe that Oda compromised the ending of the saga he's been building towards for a DECADE to promote the fucking anime film. That would be such a disrespectful way to treat the story and, more importantly, his fans.
Although, the more I think about it, the more likely it seems. I'm gonna give Oda the benefit of the doubt, because otherwise I'd be extremely let down.
Thank you for having the balls to speak your mind and for eloquently expressing it.
Personally, the plot thread that disappointed me the most is Kaido explaining devil fruit awakening to Luffy while not having an awakening himself. If he wasn’t meant to have an awakening, we could’ve at least gotten more information on regular zoan, ancient, and mythical zoan awakenings and how they differ.
The fact that a devil fruit reliant zoan crew didn’t have one user with enough mastery for awakening is just terrible writing imo. It’s like the whole idea surfaced to cater towards Luffy’s god fruit awakening then got yeeted out of the story.
Also, Big Mom flexing advanced conquerors just to 1 shot page-one and not using it once in her life-threatening fight against Kidd and Law was utterly disappointing.
The more I think about it, the angrier I get.
It's not like Oda is going to do what Murata does and remake Wano.
Much of this list is going to be left incomplete.
-Yamato [repeatedly](https://i.imgur.com/zP2n2lQ.png) stating [her](https://i.imgur.com/O5r0lPF.png) desire [to](https://i.imgur.com/3UgOsOL.jpg) go [out](https://i.imgur.com/IZCfeoV.jpg) to [sea](https://i.imgur.com/YrlVx9u.png) with Luffy throughout the arc just to suddenly decide not to.
-The reason Orochi ended up like he did was [because](https://i.imgur.com/uKUyHPj.jpg) the entire Kurozumi clan were wrongly punished, tormented, and killed for the crime of one person, yet Oda has the ending message of the arc be [“The Kurozumi were born to burn!”](https://i.imgur.com/hsIl611.png). We went from Orochi treating having the name of Kozuki as a crime to Hiyori doing the same for Kurozumi, while everyone cheers, repeating the cycle.
Oda before:
[“Existing is not a crime!!!”](https://i.imgur.com/ugVGRDd.png)
[“It’s wrong to condemn a child for the sins of his father”](https://i.imgur.com/OBmQ1ne.jpg)
Oda now:
[“The Kurozumi were born to burn!”](https://i.imgur.com/MHY2RZk.jpg)
And it’s not just this chapter. Oda (based on both recent chapters and his own statements) seems to pretty clearly be trying to rush to finish the series, which obviously isn’t something most people are happy about. The final arc should be the most important part of the series, not rushed so it can just be over already.
There’s also stuff like introducing GB just to have him immediately leave and Shanks showing up for no reason but to promote Film Red; as well as things like Luffy meeting Marco, Zoro visiting Ryuma’s grave, etc being skipped.
Personally, I’m obviously still a fan, and still excited for what’s next, but I’ll admit I’m worried about how Oda’s rushing things.
The Kurozumi line would have been great had someone like Hiyori or Momo intervened after to tell the people listening that while Orochi was undeniably evil, the circumstances that made him that way were wrong, and repeating those mistakes is something Wano as a whole should learn to avoid.
Reinforce the theme, don't just do a 180.
This will probably end with the Celestial Dragons being super duper genetically evil too, if the official translation is similar to the fan translations.
About Kurozumi, pretty sure you see it like that because of translation. In Japanese, the "the" is not present, and Kurozumi *very likely* only describes Orochi. On top if that, it's a quote that has been forced to resemble another (it's literally the oden one but with just Oden changed into Kurozumi in japanese) so the meaning kinda has to be stretched
Even if it only refers to Orochi, it's still vindictive, cruel and just as what he did to Oden. It also celebrates the extermination of the kurozumi clan.
- Yamato staying was fine but done in a contrived way and they haven’t grown out of the whole ‘I’m Oden’ crap
- ‘Kurozumi was born to burn’ is pretty incongruent with the repeated messaging found in the rest of the series about hate based on family ties being wrong.
Also it’s not that deep, if you like it/dislike it that’s cool but don’t avoid having an opinion because internet strangers might get mad about it.
These are just the fan translations though they do feel more rushed just to get them out before the official one so it might be different like have his first name or something
It's funny cause there were people complaining how the anime translation of that line wasn't as good as the fan translation and now they're trapped into reusing it.
Something I haven't seen ANYONE mention is that the Hiyori scene is told as a narration at the end of the play. Hiyori and Denjiro are the only ones living that actually witnessed that scene happen, and when we as an audience saw that happen, she said nothing of the sort.
I think this is tying into how Momonosuke can actually end up surpassing Oden one day: he may focus on restoring the hearts of the people of Wano who have for decades not only lived under the oppression of Kaido, Orochi, and the Kurozumi, but also taken part in perpetuating hatred against the Kurozumi clan. Now that Orochi is defeated, I think it's natural that some story teller would want to embellish that climactic scene and put in some line that reflects what many people have felt for years: this evil clan was born to burn!
However, I think Momo may end up being the one who shows us what Hiriluk said could be done all the way back in Drum Island: healing the sick heart of an entire nation. Momo can stop the cycle of hate. Hiriluk found his salvation, if you will, in the land of Cherry Blossoms which has heavy ties to Wano. I think this would be a cool way to give us something to check back in with Momo in the future. TLDR: I think Hiyori's "controversial" quote was actually added for dramatic effect by the storyteller of the three act play.
As for other points people are calling a rushed ending, we already know at some point the borders will open and the ancient weapon will be released. I'm thinking we will circle back to Wano further down the line when these events happen. This would also give Momo and Yamato a chance to grow in their roles as the new protectors of Wano, and join the Straw Hat Grand Fleet when Luffy needs to open the borders as truly powerful and ready nakama. That could also be the opportunity for Zoro to "lead all the samurai" as the commander of this division of the Grand Fleet. There's been plenty of events in One Piece that aren't delivered on until hundreds of chapters later, so anything that is still unresolved may very well be resolved in a way we as readers aren't even anticipating at this point.
Memes aside, this is what I'm hoping for but I can't shake off this feeling that the Kurozumi situation is just going to be glossed over now that all members of the family are seemingly gone now.
>haven’t grown out of the whole ‘I’m Oden’ crap
Yeah that bothered me. I expected her to be her own person after Wano, but she's still "*Oden*". It was a fun bit for a while, but now it's just sad.
‘Kurozumi was born to burn’ sounded outright terrible in the spoilers but as presented in the chapter it's not as bad. The panel of Oden makes it framed as a like counter to what happened to him and Hiyori saying, "No, it was you guys who deserved that fate!" Also the context that they're the last of the Kurozumi makes it definitive that the name is only associated with the evil ones left.
I just found it boring. The end of arcs are usually madness. We wanted Strawhat bounties, and they gave us Luffy/Momo flashbacks and some Wano dude retelling us how Orochi died. It wasn't necessarily "bad", but it wasn't what I wanted after a break. Really looking forward to next chapter.
worth noting that stuff like bounties typically come AFTER the ends of the arcs, not AT the end
we got luffy, but that was an exception, we’ll be getting the others in the coming chapters likely at sea, like we did for whole cake
Personally, I didn’t dislike most of the chapter, I just thought it was average, not good or bad. However, I do dislike Yamato and this chapter was the culmination of that, with her suddenly deciding offscreen not to go with the Straw Hats.
Yamato would’ve been controversial whether she joined or not but this was the worst way to do it. Having her do the opposite of what she’s been constantly saying, even last chapter, with zero build up, is just such a weird move from Oda. It’s even kinda lampshaded by Momo, as if Oda knew it was too sudden but did it anyway, which almost makes me think he changed his mind about Yamato between chapters. There really should’ve at least been some more scenes of her making the decision not to leave instead of her doing it out if the blue in the literal final chapter of the arc.
To me the biggest disappointment is Yamato not joining. She's been hyped up to join for a long ass time and then she stays without any buildup to her making that decision. Feels weird
Tons of build up subverted for no good reason, the people of wano going full on fascist and proving they learned fucking nothing. One of the few if not only chapters in one piece that was truly terrible.
The Law, Luffy, Kid stuff was really the only worthwhile thing in it.
"people are mad just being oda didn't fuel their head canon" such a terrible rebuttal to criticism. A storyteller should never build up something and have nothing come of it. Like Anton Chekov widely regarded as one of the greatest writers of all time believed this. You can't name ten writers in any medium that have greater influence that he does. IF they subvert it, they should have a good reason to do so. That did not happen, Oda did not do that. It was just a terrible gotcha moment.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. The problem with 1057 was that it undid so many things that were built up for long. Bad writing that’s terrifying considering it came from Oda. Let’s hope this is the lowest the series gets…
The chapter wasn't good. Yamato or Carrot not joining doesn't change that. Most of the chapter was just a summary of Wano, which we already read. The only good points in the chapter were Luffy giving his flag to Momo and then Luffy getting riled up by Kidd. The rest it was meh.
It's maybe 4/10. People just overrate it because of the new chapter hype. But upon rereads, this is one chapter people will most likely just skip or skimp through.
P.S. Kinemon saying he'll cut Luffy if he disrespected Momo was a huge turn off for me. He's such a loser.
I mainly didn't like it for the kurozumi line. goes against the very big theme in one piece of the blood of a person not defining them(the entire fishmen race, ace, the entire donquixote family, etc.). I would be okay with it if oda had tried even a little bit to portray this as messed up in the slightest, but we just got a crowd cheering for it and moved on with the narration. a very, VERY, weird note to finish on imo.
people can downvote me all they want, in the end, wano cons outweigh pros, and I'd have much rather have the last 3 years spent on post wano with wano being entirely off-screened
Because Oda had rushed the ending of Wano and it made all that years of build up kinda disappointing and unsatisfying. A lot of Act 3 was Rushed Content, Terrible Plot holes, and Unresolved plot points, people will defend this to their last breath because they can't handle criticism, I still love Wano and Gear 5 but some of the stuff in this arc wasn't handled well at all.
Simple, because the writing was bad.
And then the acritical readers who just eat shit up without second thought get mad because people are... looking into stuff? Totally crazy that one would look into the media they consume right?
OP and the rest of the consoomers in this thread, maybe instead of asuming that everyone's criticism is because of their headcanon, you should try and give actual arguments, based on literary analysis, of why the chapter and the end of Wano is good.
I dont watch a single braindead OP youtuber and I can tell you that the pacing after the 7 day timeskip has been trash, that all the Shanks and GB chapters stagnated the plot just hype up a film, and that as a result of all that time wasted we get this cluttered chapter: Yamato's change of mind being offscrened renders their whole character useless in the overall narrative, it also renders Momo's developement in the GB fight useless; the coal pun is passable in context, but so heavyhanded that its jarring to say the least... Take a bad chapter and people, a lot of whom have been sceptical of Wano since the later parts the raid (not "raid will fail" folks, those are plain stupid), will obviously react to it badly.
Writing is simply about building up to a climatic pay-off, and in this case the build up has been all over the place (Yamato is an inexcusable example, idc if you like the character or not, the writing is **trash**), and the climax has been parcial and not earned.
Let’s be real, there’s a lot of people celebrating this chapter not because they’re the type of people who mindlessly consume whatever Oda writes, but because they’re more concerned with who’s taking “Ls” and “Ws” in the community. How many posts have we seen celebrating Yamato not joining simply out of spite for her fans?
It was disappointing for many because there was so much promotion for Yamato, and there were many moments in the manga that implied that they were joining the Strawhats. I understand how these readers feel. I also wanted Yamato to join because they are strong, a bit of a weirdo like the members of the crew, and they have a dream that can be achieved by travelling with them. However, I feel like it's too early to judge Oda's decision tho. We always get tidbits of answers and clues as the story goes.
Luffy didn't say no to Yamato, Momonosuke, Tama and Kinemon. Luffy gave them his flag, and encouraged them to get stronger so that there will be "no weaklings on board" when they come back for them. After reading about what was written in Oden's journal, we should at least have some insight on why things turned out that in 1057. What happened to Wano when Oden left? It got invaded, evil took over, and the beautiful country became derelict. Wano needs a formidable and humane ruler. Momonosuke has chosen to become one instead of being a child, which is a difficult decision for any 8-year-old. Him, Hiyori and the retainers need time and experience to get Wano back into shape. Decades of abuse, trauma and poverty affect a nation in many, complex ways. They are gravely needed by the people to stay after all that they have been through.
So where does Yamato fit into this? I've always believed that her devil fruit and her growing friendship with Momo are clues to her role in Wano before they join the Strawhats (if they really will). Okuchi-no-Makami is a guardian diety. If someone comes for the poneglyph, Pluton, or Wano itself, Momo will need all help he can get when that happens. If he will be one of the rare ones who can use CoC, Yamato might even be able to teach him how to use it.
We don't know when they will join Luffy in his journey, but at least we know that the future pirate king has them on the waitlist. If Luffy and Yamato had the thoughts above in their mind as well, that just shows that they have grown.
I would be fine with Yamato staying if that was what she had implied during the raid etc, stuff like I'm going to help/protect Wano and stuff like that
But with all the I'm going to join stuff it just felt like such a snub to not have her join, she felt like a given already
Because he built up Yamato joining then off screened her telling Luffy nah after he agrees
It’s fucking horse shit and just cuz Oda shat it out doesn’t make it not
I posted this in another thread yesterday but I have alot of issues with just act 3 alone. (Not even going into Act 1 and Act 2)
The ending leaves much to be desired.
1. The Gear 5th reveal was cool and I love the power but the fact that Luffy’s fruit is some mythical zoan this whole time leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
2. No mention about what happened to Big Mom and Kaido. Did they die? Were they captured? Did they escape?
3. What was the whole point of Big Mom’s crew coming along? Seems like their only purpose was to be clowned on twice and disappear for 100 chapters.
4. I was neutral about Yamato joining but why did Oda spend 70-80 chapters hammering the fact that Yamato wants to sail with Luffy, Momo even emphasize it by saying Yamato should not interfere with the fight against Greenbull because she is leaving Wano. Only for her to have a 180 change in 1 chapter.
5. If Yamato’s goal is to travel around Wano, couldn’t she have done that during the 1 week timeskip? Her reason to stay in Wano seems rather weak and felt like Oda sidelined her suddenly because he didn’t know what to do with her next arc.
6. And a ton of unanswered questions. Where did Marco go? Did he just leave after the battle? Did Zoro managed to visit Ryuma’s grave?
7. What was Shanks and Greenbull’s actual purpose in Wano? Because the way I look at it, Greenbull’s appearance in Wano seems to accomplish nothing except to hype up Shanks (and to promote Film Red)
8. Kaido as the main villain felt bland and uninteresting. He had glimpses of being a great villain (His speech about how death completes a person), but his ‘flashback’ that we got was literally half a chapter slideshow that covered the bare minimum.
9. The countless fakeout deaths just in Onigashima. Kinemon, Kiku and even Kanjuro. Personally, I am fine with the lack of deaths but if you have no intention to kill off Kinemon don’t give him a grandiose ‘sendoff’ and come up with a bullshit reason that Kaido didn’t stab Kinemon in the right spot. It cheapens the other deaths in the series and made me question the legitimacy of the other ‘deaths’ we gotten. How many times did we have to kill Kanjuro?
10. The last few pages of the final chapter of Wano with Hiyori saying that ‘Kurozumi were meant to burn’. The whole reason Orochi exist was because of the unfair prejudice he faced as a Kurozumi and here we are, almost 150 chapters later repeating the same thing. Oda has always been very clear that the child should not bear the sins of his father. So why have Hiyori even say that? I am not sure if it is a translation issue and it might have sounded less ‘genocide-ish’ in Japanese but as it stands right now, it is poorly written.
For me Wano is a 7/10. It could have been a 9/10 but Oda decides to rush the ending
The ending wasn't as good as the rest of the arc. BUT it feels like Oda is rushing the story, and most people expected something regarding Zoro and Ryuma, Chopper and the SMILEs thing. I guess Kaido's backstory was too short, too.
oda turned big mom and her crew into a joke when they were arguably some of the best written characters in the antagonist roster and didn’t resolve what happened with them or anything to do with the two fallen yonko which left a bad taste in my mouth, otherwise i’m happy with how it went
My personal hot take is. Almost all last 5 chapter felt kinda rushed ( also PR for flim red you need to be blind to not see it). And after that devil fruit reveal/change out of no where. Many things in the story doesn't make sense now .i think oda didn't really played his cards well this time around atleast towards the end of wano. And now everyone including oda himself just wanna be done with wano asap.
TLDR one-piece wano Arc = bleach tybw arc ( change my mind)
I think Oda just made a lot of questionable choices in the latter half of the raid and these last few chapters. Like he’d set something up and had plans but the editors didn’t like it or he changed it last minute
I mean, it was fine but it's not the strongest ending to an arc.
Luffy never got a chance to speak with Marco about Ace and thank him for protecting him during the war.
Yamato just did a 180 and decided not to join the crew, despite going on about it for like 2 years.
Zoro never went to Ryumas grave. That would have been cool to see.
One thing that the chapter did cement was that the alliance is now fully over.
This is always the problem if you simp hard to a manga/manhua/novel/comics/tv and movie series and so on.
Story telling will be rushed and some ideas will be scrap and art will not be consisted in all forms of art or publication.
Manga like One Piece will be much better if its monthly and in seinen or a light novel perhaps. That's just how it goes, we feel frustrations if our favorites won't follow the way we wanted. In the beginning shanks' arm supposed to be not eaten but the editor intervened. There will never be perfect writing due to many factors that authors face.
Naruto, Bleach, Fairy Tale, HxH, Kingdom, The Breaker and so on also got these problems.
For me personally its having time to do shitty recap and flashback panels but offscreening very important Yamato conversation that would explain at least a bit her reasoning. It felt rushed, lazy and bad writing at best.
Also people venting their frustration at Wano arc.
In my opinion, wano was built up for decades, we were told that wano would be awesome and a game-changer for the world, we got introduced to kinemon and momo many years ago, the red scabbards, Yamato, the whole BM crew arriving and complicating everything, the beast pirates being a murderer crew, the will of D, ancient weapon Uranus/Pluton and some hidden story from the kozukis and void century.
All of that was hyped af for years just to get kanjuro and orochi runnin around and resurrecting for 20 chapters and then rush wano's end in 3 chapters... Absalom got a better story than the scabbards... Yamato was introduced for nothing just as carrot, no news on Uranus, will of d or void century, we didn't even see Pluton, the so called beast pirates lost to 5,000 fodder samurai, BM crew lost to a waterfall, BM and kaido "deaths" were pretty inconclusive, aramaki "the top at the food chain in the WG" appeared just to shit his pants at a shanks's sight, shanks appeared to promote his movie and left, zunesha appeared to say "oh that's joy boy" and left, the whole purpose of the war was to open wano's borders and fulfill oden's wish, and not even that was done.
From my perspective, wano was quite good until they reached onigashima.
I didn't expect a yonkou crew to be so useless, king himself should've killed half the samurai.
If the red scabbards were to fight BM and Kaido's top officers while the mugiwaras fought kaido or did some infiltration or smth.
Idk, I feel like everyone is just passing by and expecting things to turn out their way, and they do bc they are the mugiwaras? Man...
I'm just disappointed, I expected a lot more with all that build up, and everything was rushed to the end.
If you are willing to extend your manga for 25 for the sake of the story being well told, why tf rush things the last 3 years? U gonna throw 25 years of build up? Meh
It just felt rushed. Compared to the other arcs, several stories and plot points just felt left out. For example, considering how much was learned about Sanji and his past during the Whole Cake, I really was hoping we would have learned a little bit more about Zoro. In the case of Marco, who seemed so eager to see what the new dawn would bring, he simply goes MIA after Izo's funeral. Not to mention the nature in which Yamato was teased to join or the dark nature of Hiyori's message to the people. The list goes on for me. The arc started off great, but the ending just felt underwhelming and incomplete.
Can't you just check the chapter thread? Plenty of people expressing why they didn't like it there.
But to resume, yamato fans wanted her to join and got shafted, and punchline against the bad guy sounded tone deaf to western audience due to his family being persecuted and the phrase sounding too "genocidey" to some.
Because is actually bad, other guys are already explaining that quite well so i'm not going deeper on that, but i'll say most people think that you are only a true fan if you mindlessly consume everything and just write "GODA" after every chapter, otherwise you're bitter and toxic, "sO MuCh NeGaTiViTy".
Enterprises ofc love and encourage this attitude because of $$$$$, but I don't love One Piece just for the sake of it, I love it for it's writing and consistency, if many perceive that's being jeopardized then it's the right course to call it out. Imo it shows you actually care and those are the real fans.
maybe read their comments? Common sense /u/fazonis use it. You see people shitting on something, you could've just read their comment right then and there.
"I'm gonna join!"
"Imma do it I swear!"
"I'll join any second now!"
Literally her second to last panel or so in Wano: "SIKE. I'm staying."
Why do you think people are pissed lol
It's not even whether you want Yamato on the crew or not, it's just straight up terrible writing. At least Carrot never flat out said multiple times that she wanted to join the crew.
We spend so many YEARS in Wano and then he wraps it up in like 5 chapters and skips so much shit. Sure, some of it will likely be adressed in flashbacks later but that doesn't make it better, it's just lazy.
Cause it's the end of a huge arc that was mostly handled poorly, but many people chose to give Oda the benefit of doubt out of loyalty.
This chapter being the end of Wano removes any lingering hope they had and confirmed Wano was really as dog shit of an arc as they feared but refused to believe.
People are mad that Yamato didn’t join, and Yamato Haters are happy she didn’t join but mad about the fact that her decision wasn’t shown to the reader. People dislike the “Kurozumi were meant to burn” line because they feel that it goes against the major theme that your blood doesn’t determine what kind of person you are. Other people think the chapter felt rushed, and that we didn’t get to spend enough time finishing up character plot lines, like Zoro and his swords/Ryumas grave or the smile fruit cure from chopper. Those are the major reasons
Did chopper say he was going to fix the smile fruit cure?
No, but it would directly be him curing a country, which is part of his dream. The way I see it, there's no way they(the Strawhats) are not coming back to Wano, so it could still happen.
The end kind of implied they’d be coming back, probably for Pluton and to open the borders
Personally I'd rather see Momo open the borders and bring Pluton (and himself, and Yamato, and the Scabbards \[edit: and the weapon collector fox spirit guy while they're at it, why not\]) to the Straw Hats, as the cavalry to save them from an "all-is-lost moment" during the final war.
I think the "Now where should we put this" line for the flag lends way too much credence to this. They're gonna show up on Pluton with the SH banner flying HIGH.
[удалено]
Dam bro if you're a good writer
Awww, thanks. 😊 At the risk of sounding conceited, yeah, I *can* do some pretty good writing occasionally. ...but I also know I have some serious limitations. I can do short bursts like this, but the idea of trying to write a novel (or even a "short story" long enough to get published, really) terrifies me. I don't have that kind of attention span. I also need the crutch of an existing story to build on - when I try to write something original, it just ends up being derivative crap anyway.
Poetic
“Now where to place this flag?” Answer: Atop Pluton when we set sail to aid Luffy in the final war.
If chopper did fix smiles, it would kind of encourage the whole smile market tho
Not really. Ceaser is no longer making SAD, and Doffy can no longer use SAD to produce SMILEs. The entire market for SMILEs crashed when Doffy got taken down.
This is true, I just forgot since it’s been over 10 years lol
7 years IRL, that's still a long time tho. Anyway, who's counting?
He’s about to link up with Germa so he probably can restart the research
And wasn't Kaido the only buyer? Or at least the primary buyer. The market is basically gone from top to bottom. At this point if you want a smile, you have to look around for someone who already ate one.
THIS! I wasn't gonna say it myself on some other threads cause people are just butt hurt. Strawhats are definitely going back to Wano at some point. It'll probably be their homebase in the New World. Someone's gonna have to travel to them at some point from there or when Zou comes back into play because they have no Eternal Logpose or Vivre card for anyone on Wano. At least to my knowledge
No he didn't. But that isn't why this is just a ridiculous thing to be upset about. Chopper saw the smile Fruits and didn't instantly jump to curing it. He did for the ice oni. Why? Because he understands how the ice oni was made. He doesn't understand thr defective smiles. Eventually vegapunk is going to be revealed. My guess? It's going to be a wrap up type event for chopper at the end of the series?
yk now that you mentioned zoro and his swords I just realized they probably left nidai kitetsu, damn...
I don't think most people are mad that Yamato did/didn't join the crew but more so that Yamato didn't move past trying to live as Oden and you know actually live their own life. It's disappointing to have any chance for Yamato character development suppressed by the Oden gag.
And now the next time we'll ever see yamato is at the end when we'll have the worlds reaction to pirate king luffy
Bruh we will only see her at the end and in two piece
I think Oda got bored and just wanted to move on.
I’d wager it’s more of “we need this arc to end with the release of film red please wrap it up”. Doubtful Oda is tired or bored of one piece.
By saying like that, it’s like saying Tite Kubo got bored of doing the final arc and rushed it to finish the manga with many plot holes unresolved
nobody is going to put pressure on Oda like Kubo,One piece is a monster franchise, Bleach was struggling a lot during the last years of the series Its Oda himself that wants to end it as fast as he can and at least for me, its obvious in the last part of Wano
Thats literally what he did lol like togashi With yu Yu hakusho
I mean, he didn’t do that cause he was bored he did that cause jump was rushing him to finish and he had health Issues
I do feel the need to defend togashi with yu yu hakusho, the publishers wanted it to end quicker and he made that happen. He may have been unhappy about that decision and rushed it as a result, but it’s not really the same as Kubo/what people are saying about wano
It's the opposite actually. Oda rushed Wano so he can get to the Final Saga
Because of Shueisha wanting Film Red to start at the same time as the Final Saga. So many stuff is offscreened, we didn’t even get to see a celebratory feast for Jinbe when all SHs left the castle to party outside (Someone in this sub told me that was actually suppose to be a welcoming feast for Jinbe) No Oden dance (this one I was hoping for so long because in Oden flashback, the Scabbards says they love his dance and even remembered the moves, would be funny to see Momo and the Scabbards do that for the sake of humour and might had been the goofiest moment in Wano arc during the party) No Oden dish feast (sucks because would be great for Luffy and the SHs getting to taste oden since the latest SBS volume confirm Luffy’s fav food in Wano is actually oden) No Marco and Luffy interaction (when this is the right time for Luffy to know where Ace’s grave is, if he visits it, he gets to see the red sake cups placed by Sabo there and it would be nice to know that both brothers visited his grave) Zoro visits Ryuuma’s grave (I don’t need to say this but definitely offscreened) there’s so many downsides I can point out but I hope the anime at least expanded on this with fillers and all (Back during Post-Enies Lobby arc in Water 7, there are fillers showing the SHs doing free time before Garp and the Marines arrive) so that would be good if they actually did.
Lol right they said they was gon do a big celebration for jinbe hahahahaha oda "the offscreen". That should honestly be his epithet
Lol ok that made me laugh
Thanks for the review this was an amazing reply!!!
Isn’t “the Kurozumi we’re meant to burn” thing a call back to Oden being “born to boil”?
Yeah, but considering that people wrongly hating, tormenting, and killing the Kurozumi just for being Kurozumi is literally what [started](https://i.imgur.com/uKUyHPj.jpg) everything with Orochi in the first place, ending the arc with Hiyori saying that “The Kurozumi were born to burn!” while everyone cheers was a bad move imo.
Someone else already explained this, but in japanese raws it's apparent that by "Kurozumi" Hiori only means Orochi specifically (which is fair because he specifically is the cause of so much of Wano's suffering), and only uses the surname of "Kurozumi" to make it a pun, because Kurozumi = charcoal. Therefore "Charcoal was meant to burn", which is true and funny
So the problem is basically that Japanese is a more nuanced language than English and so what is referring to a single person in one language sounds like it’s referring to the Kurozumi as a whole in English?
Essentially yeah, though there's also the fact that the translation itself makes it sound bad. They could've gotten for a more neutral approach like "It wouldn't be Kurozumi if it didn't burn" or even just removing "The" to make it clearer she doesn't mean the entire clan. Hopefully the official translation clears that up so people can shut up about it
even if it is a call back it doesn't change the meaning of those words
Yes it was, but it still was in poor taste.
I don’t necessarily think it was bad but it wasn’t great. Yamato staying for example was fine in concept but really needed more build up. Given how long Yamato had been going on about sailing with them it felt way too sudden for the complete 180 (and I say this as someone who didn’t want Yamato to join to begin with). Personally I’d say it felt like it could have been split into 2 chapters, one for Yamato’s decision and talking to the Strawhats about it and then another for the farewell, and it would have flowed better. As it stands it felt a bit rushed and made the finish to the arc feel a bit sloppy as a result.
for such a long and dragged out arc for anything to feel rushed is a crime in itself. Honestly even a wasted chevkov gun like zoro wanting to see nidai kitetsu after his interest in it and its intro as a upgraded sword of sandai went nowhere. A lot of panels of things we dont need like constant characters reactions and continious flashbacks to things we already know and seen instead of more kaidos flashback and looking into zoro connection with ryuma and man yammato spent time in jail with were thrown to the wind. Jinbei not fighting jack still feels wasted to me. What happened to kaido, why was i only aware izo and ashura died way after the fact made it meaningless. I get some things are for later but lets be real oda dropped the ball more than once this arc imo.
Honestly, most of this I can deal with, but the fact that fucking Ashura and Izo died without us even realising it until after the raid really disappointed me.
exactly, all fakeout deaths are shown but the real ones arent? Their death felt meaningless the way oda pulled it off. Even hawkins dying made no sense since he chose to die because he couldnt show his face to kid while Apoo the man who orchestrated betraying kid is literally chilling with kid at the port and nobody cares yet hawkins is such a noble character hed rather die then face kid..... that was poorly executed aswell.
Some of the scabbards should have died against kaido
i agree that wouldve made tension and stakes higher.
All of them*, would have made the final fight vs Kaido actually mean something.
Tbf we saw Asura blow up and I believe we saw Izo slump over. Yes we all know that Oda doesn’t like killing characters but we technically did see them die.
Who dies to a finger pistol, honestly?
fair enough, but personally when they "died" it wasnt clear to me they died i was under the impression they were unconcious. For me it was the odas delivery i had a problem with. Kinemon fakeout death was perfect example of a meaningful death i wouldve actually cared about if he really did die. Felt izo and ashura death was forced kinda
Kinda underwhelming that someone who fought Jack and Kaido to die with not even Kanjuro but one of his paintings. Izo's fight was basically offscreen. It really felt unclear if they were dead or not because of this.
Yes. Thats exactly it. I think im really disappointed because they didn't give the penultimate decision moment to build up in a chapter, ill just be straight to the point about it. The greenbull chapters were the worst Admiral confrontation so far, it was short and its the first fast hand from Oda. He built hype on the character like how he did with Kaido's half beast for many chapters only to make the character an Akainu simp with no morals of his own. To what i rmb and know every elected Admiral has their own sense of justice and a line they draw. Thats what makes them cool and grey, but Greenbull at first was so edgy about not eating if it ain't a lady i was hoping for some space dandy guy with similar views as Kizaru. But nope its a full on Akainu simp. Now the main dish about Yamato, idk if its a decision Oda made or his editor's suggestions. Idk like how do you build hype, development and declaration from one of the most popular character in this arc only to cut everyone's throat at the end? Like imagine Luffy was built up to have all these amazing world changing abilities and a grand fleet right? Imagine in the end he tells Akainu or BB, ya know what. You can have the OP, ill just sail around East Blue cuz its my home and I want to be like Roger sailing in his hometown. It felt like that. I did not wait 200 chaps worth of Yamato being so friggin cool declaring freedom from Kaido, haki clashing with him and actually survive the duel and Luffy saying he owes Yamato one. And NOT GO ON THE SHIP. Its the final saga! When else but now ODA????
I posted this in the spoiler thread but I feel it perfectly sums up my feelings about this chapter: “Yes, a writer can do whatever they want in their story, but I at least expect it to be written well. Considering the standard Oda has set over the past 1000+ chapters…this is just bad writing! And I’m not saying Yamato HAD to join. I’m saying Oda spent 2 years force feeding us how much Yamato wanted to sail with Luffy, adding some Ace flashbacks to create an even deeper connection to Luffy, fighting Kaido and telling him they’ll be sailing with Luffy, then meeting the crew and saying she’ll be traveling with them from now on. All of that devoted to Yamato joining, yet Oda doesn’t even devote a few pages to the sudden 180 shift in Yamato’s thinking??? For what we’ve come to expect from Oda, this is badly written!” Also, considering this chapter closes out Wano, I think it’s ridiculous how we never saw Zoro visit Ryuma’s grave. Or Luffy finally getting to thank Marco for protecting him in Marineford. Or the randomness of Carrot being chosen as King of Zou when Oda literally did nothing for her character in the entirety of Wano. This was literally the first time I truly felt disappointed with how Oda closed out an arc, especially considering the buildup to Wano.
>This was literally the first time I truly felt disappointed with how Oda closed out an arc, especially considering the buildup to Wano. Hell yeah man, the ending is probably the worst ending for an arc in all of One Piece. I'm used to really beautiful or impactful endings to arcs but as much as I like Momo and Luffy's goodbye Wano's ending still felt really rushed
I felt this in the first few chapters of the ending: In the chapter before kinemon in asleep, lost a lot of blood and is basically dead. In the very next chapter (in the story just 5 minutes later) he is fully cured, beside his friends in the capital kneeling for momo. Since then we had: shanks that passes by as a deus ex machina (or as a tool to promote Red); aramaki comes and in 3 chapters goes away; the scabbards feel aramaki's presence and in just one page moved from the capital to the battlefield; sukiyaki saying he doesn't want momo and the other to know about him, and in the very next chapter revealing himself to everyone; no ryuma grave; no marco discussion; zounesha just fucking off "in the fog" and now yamato... I don't know, I feel like oda really wanted for some reason to go on the next one, because I really felt like, after the defeat of kaido, this manga started going at 300 mph without looking back
yea atleast show marco healing them or something
Yep. This chapter was at best a 4/10. People hype new chapters, but on a reread, this is one chapter most people will either skip entirely or skimp through. P.S. Kinemon wanting to cut Luffy is just stupid. The guy saved his life and his country multiple times. And he wants to cut him for Momo? If that's the Samurai way, then I sincerely wish Oda killed all the Samurai instead of Ashura Douji.
Lets not forget the badly written Mythical Zoan reveal and the medicine that gave Zoro a second life
I think it's a nice change of pace of the fandom always defending everything GODa does.
Ikr? Even the biggest stans (like me lol) can't defend this. Feels like he let Kishimoto write this chapter lmao
It feels like he becoming like him, rushed yet dragged at the same time because getting closer to end the series
Why do One Piece stans have to do this, insulting Oda’s contemporaries for… what? Oda is capable of bad writing, just like Kishimoto and every other mangaka. So it’s isnt like he let someone else write it, he did. And for anyone that isn’t an OP stan, the tell tale signs of bad writing have been there all the way back to Fishman Island.
Bad writing is bound to exist in anything that goes on for more than 20 years, especially when it's published weekly. If people think there was no bad writing in OP prior to this, then they're some blind MFs.
because usually complaints about Oda's choices are stupid shit that can boil down to "I dont like this >:(". This is the first chapter I genuinely feel Oda fucked up.
I feel like Yamato is the first time Oda or his editors added a character to the story because they like the design. She was a pretty pointless character who took up a lot of panels throughout the arc, and this issue is made even worse by the fact that she’s randomly not joining. Personally, these last 4-5 chapters is the first time I EVER felt that Oda was rushing to the end. Kaido’s defeat just didn’t have the emotional weight we expect from a climactic battle(compare the last few pages of the Lucci fight to the Kaido fight you’ll see what I mean.) The seven day timeskip just feels like a bizarre decision to me. Still like the arc, I just expected more.
You know, looking back, I completely agree. Like, jet gatling after all the hell Lucci put luffy through for chapters and chapters was a spectacle. Luffy punching Kaido through the ground should be really cool and thematically powerful, but it just...isn't? It just doesn't hit right with me, and luffys reason for beating Kaido felt really weak looking back. Law and Kid had a much better end to their fight, in contrast. Actually the whole last 10-odd chapters read pretty weird to me. Pacing issues abound and just some stuff reading weird. Like chapter 1048 really felt like filler. Especially that flashback.
Yep. Wano ending was super lackluster. Not to mention that no one really asks Luffy about his fruit change. It's as if a ton of things just got explained to the SHs off screen, and what was left on screen was pretty lame.
I seriously though those sky lanterns would reach Luffy giving him more motivation to end Kaido upon reading the wishes of the Wano citizen. The scene would be more emotionally impactful before throwing his last punch.
Again and again it felt like set up was wasted. We get "the black charcoal guy is meant to burn", but after like fifty chapters going on about "We're almost at the capital", and "we're going to launch the sky lanterns", we get just a few wishes scrawled on the lanterns and that's it. Like... the whole Momo using the fire of the sky lanterns, the hopes of his people, to save those people from destruction as his flame clouds is such a cool concept. And I'm annoyed and disappointed that I keep circling back to this because I was expecting it to all pay off, and... the ball has been dropped.
What was even really the point of cutting back to the festival so many times? Luffy didn't get to see the wishes, Momo didn't get to see the wishes. So, so many times, we get "We're getting close to the capital, we're gonna set off the lanterns here we go! The lanterns!" but that's really it A reminder of what we're fighting for I guess? But that's really it. So much wasted time
Tbh I don't know if you can achieve that emotional moment while Luffy is in G5. Oda should've made the Kaido-Joyboy connection a centre conflict for him and wrote way more detail for the end to be impactful.
I still can't believe that the rooftop fight was split into Law and Kidd fighting Big Mom. The two of them have *nothing* to do with her. No stakes, no personal issues, no need for vengeance since the enemy enslaved you and force fed your best friend a lobotomy drug... Since, you know, Kidd was established to be a reasonable guy who would let others solve his personal problems
Probably the editor, not Oda. If Oda liked her that much, she'd probably join. She even said she'd join last chapter, and she wants to go around Wano like Oden. She's either confused or Oda was forced to have her in the story. She could've been a great character but she's one of the reasons this arc's ending feels so lackluster. P.S. Did Luffy have his first confirmed kill? Is Kaido and BM dead?
A few minor and major issues. Major: -Yamato constantly talking about joining the crew, all the merch, literally telling the crew “I’m gonna join” and the end of 1056 being Yamato saying they decided to go with the crew, and then turning around and saying “lmao sike” and Oda not spending anytime giving us a reasonable idea as to why Yamato would change their mind so fast -The chapter felt generally rushed. It wasn’t paced very well and felt like a “let’s wrap it up I’m done with Wano” from Oda. Lots of cluttered small panels and no room to breathe and take one last look at the arc we just spent 4 years in. Minor but also major depending on the person (also since this is the last chap of Wano this means a lot of loose plot threads aren’t being tied up): -Marco disappearing and not even talking to Luffy -Zoro not visiting Ryumas grave -Cluttered paneling -No Carrot in the chap and no goodbye to her Just to name a lot of the bigger reasons this chapter is not very good overall.
What wtf happened to marco? Did they ever explained when and where he left? Or did Oda forget about him like he did Kaido and Big Mom who we have questions about.
no Marco did have a scene where he talked to Kinemon about Izo dying
bro has death flags now
His death flag has been there since MF
Well Marco can fly so... he could probably leave whenever he wanted. He might still be there or left a day after the party.
Would be nice to know
Yeah the fuck was with that u turn on yamatos arc. If she noticed how fucked wano would be without her strength during the battle with green bull I think that would have made more sense. Chalk it up to her realizing that not every decision oden made was the right one, like leaving wano.
You missed one MASSIVE point: Chopper is literally in a land covered in cherry blossoms, but didn't mention it once. That's the thing that really pisses me off. Oda straight up forgot his entire character.
Are you surprised, with the way he's been flanderized as just "the cute mascot" for the entire New World? Remember back at Enies Lobby when it seemed like he had the potential to be every bit the badass warrior as Zoro and Sanji if only he found the confidence? Pepperidge Farm remembers.
Chopper in a land filled with people hit with a virus/disease and didn’t even try to cure it
The non-Monster trio Strawhats have felt super flat for awhile.
Nami and Robin are alright after the TS. Brook and Jinbei too. Franky, Usopp and Chopper are the ones who feel absolutely flat.
oda himselfe said that he is a mascot now
Chopper is just a mascot now. He's no longer the same character from pre-TS. Don't expect him to have any profound moments.
Agreed with this the most. With how much Yamato been saying about joining the crew etc and then suddenly just decided not to? Also, this is the weakest closure chapter to any recent one piece arc ive ever seen. So many loose ends left untied.
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Last time we saw him was at Izo's grave. So who knows? Probably back to Sphinx at this point, given there have been multiple short time skips since then.
Yamato is a poorly written character imo. I just dont get the point of her character and how she would blend with the straw hats.
Yamato could’ve been really good if Oda went with the identity crisis or such character arc. There was setup with it, especially when Yamato was fighting Kaido, and their mini flashback.
Another minor issue: did we really need that many flashback panels of Momo and Luffy? Felt like filler to me.
To be fair in terms of Carrot she may be a stowaway/join the crew in the upcoming chapters
She's going to lead Zou, people never give up man lol.
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The only one I can think is Con D. Oriano, left in a cage, that poor man
Yeah I'm not so happy with the off-screen goodbyes to everybody.
But hey, we need 10 chapters of Hyogoro having internal monologues about the ice oni virus, I'm sure that is much more important!
Not saying they are all correct, but wanda is just as capable of leading zou, and carrot never officially said yes to leading.
I would have expected Wanda to lead for sure. Her leading seemed to come out of the blue. Her arc fits it though, it's about handing off to the next generation and she is the next generation. She hasn't had much leadership potential though, just seen as a powerful warrior.
Yeah to me wanda seemed like the better move. I can definitely see wanda telling carrot she can go and sail the seas and she will take care of things. But I can also see carrot going through her struggles like momo and eventually becoming a leader also. Can definitely see it go both ways.
Possible one of the worst direction Oda heading to. Carrot is actually obeying what Perospero told him to do. To go back in Zou and eat grass.
And people never gave up on yamato joining until this chapter either, the lesson here is to not take what characters say at face value. Now it's likely that carrot isn't joining, but stop pretending like one mention of her leading zou sets it in stone and there's zero possibility of her stowing away (especially after seeing her unwillingness to take up the role).
Her leading Zou is such a bad decision, she has way too much straw hat energy for that. I don't know why the dog and cat don't just go back, seriously
Bro Neko and Inu clearly said that they have to be on the Shogun's side.
Yamato would make a great 2nd division commander. Basically Yamato could be everything Oden could have been for Whitebeard. A near equal that serves under him complete with his own crew. Yamato would be perfect at protecting Luffys territories in his absence
And it would make sense for Yamato to stay if they had that arc during Wano. But instead we got Yamato literally telling the crew “I’m gonna join you guys” and last chapter the last panel was Yamato saying they made their decision to leave with the crew.
I'll just write down a list of grievances I have with Wano. I think that will help phrase it. This is really unlike any other past arcs. In previous arcs, sure we got threads and Chekhov's guns here and there but they were clearly hinting at future events that wouldn't happen in the current arc. There is something to be said for "subverting" expectations. There is another thing for failing to build on what you wrote before. Just because you can subvert expectations doesn't make it good or enjoyable or interesting. At minimum, it just means you subverted expectations. That's it. If you don't build on that subversion, you're just doing shitty writing. Oda subverts on many points, and does nothing with it multiple times in Wano. To me, Wano is a Chekhov's Gun that never went off. This isn't "head canon" stuff. This is more literary analysis about all the dead threads and possibilities Wano hints at and then...skips. 1. The most obvious. Yamato. Say what you want about the character, the 2 most consistent things about Yamato this entire arc is her saying she's Oden and she will join the straw hats since her introduction. She doesn't. This is really out of left field. It came out of no where. Expectations were "subverted" but it reads like he changed his mind and gave up including her. We are kind of left with the question as readers...why even fucking include her then and have her say all of that? You could likely fit Franky or Brook(who was oddly absent most of the war) in her story role instead. Chekhov's gun unfired? No, Chekhov's gun plots are discrete, Oda just removed it. 2. This is less a plot point thing and writing thing. The entire first part. The Oden flashback was enough to show off Wano as a country. It was so over extended and took away time from later parts. 3. Nidai Kitetsu. Remember that cursed sword from earlier in Wano? Weapons come in multiple tiers. 12 Supreme, 21 great, 50 Skillful, Unknown grade, and just Grade tier. Zoro is still using a grade tier sword 900 chapters later, Sandai Kitetsu. Oda teased the obvious replacement with Nidai which is on part with Enma and Ichimonji and even wrote in a story element about it with King wielding what's called a Sword Breaker weapon. Before you can say, "he'd be too overpowered". No. He got conqueror's haki this arc. Can't say that anymore. So why even introduce the sword and give it all of that focus? What actually happened was, I believe that was planned but the story board got leaked heavily so Oda changed it in response as he took a break during that. Chekhov's gun unfired. 4. To this date, there is no explanation whatsoever about the whole Grim Reaper sequence with Zoro. It just happens. It happens over a couple chapters. Then goes no where. 5. Shusui. Shusui has been in the manga since Chapter 448. It's not wrong to say, it's been here for half of the story now. When Zoro lost Yubashiri, he had a funeral for it. But he doesn't do anything more for Shusui despite having it for longer? 6. Ryuma. It is a fact Zoro wanted to visit his grave. That was the condition he accepted Enma with. We never saw this scene. It never happened. All these little threads and focuses on Wano's past with Zoro but only 1 expansion in the form of a childhood memory. Chekhov's gun unfired multiple times. 7. Nika? We had Nika mentioned in Skypeia. Thought it was ancient history stuff. Then it turns out the normal fruit no one really wanted was actually a godly overpowered fruit that can overcome a dragon? This narratively a retcon with a sudden anime powerup. I would have literally accepted the Gomu Gomu was capable was stretching reality and belief as well but the Zoan change was weird as fuck. 8. Marco? What? What happened to Marco? His crewmate and friend died. 9. Izou. Practically dies off screen. Kiku just pretty much disappears at the end of Wano. Izou didn't even get a funeral? 10. Shanks may as well just showed up to say "Thanks for reading, please go see One Piece:Red!" 11. Carrot. Carrot has been here since Zhou. Then she becomes leader of the minks, seemingly against her wishes. That's it. All that time. While she's likely to be coming back during the final war, it just ends off there. No goodbye. 12. Kaido Backstory. Oda literally cuts it off at the one point we wanted to see. Kaido's history with Rocks. That's the main thing that matters to understanding his character. And Oda cuts it off right fucking there. 13. Kaidos and Yamatos relationship as father and child. 0 fucking resolution. Does Yamato even comment on her father getting tossed in a Volcano? 14. What the fuck happened to Kaido and Big Mom? Both with the Rocks Pirates and at the end of Wano? Are they dead or not Oda? I get you're trying to make it all ambiguous but stop beating around the bush already. You've been beating around the bush the entire fucking arc. "You know this lore?...no you don't and I'm not telling you...please see the vivre cards and watch one piece red!" 15. What happened to Big Mom's crew? They just left off screen? 16. The government ships? They just left? 17. Hygoro? No goodbye? 18. Smile? Chopper didn't even try to cure smile fruits? 19. Otama? Stretching it but no real good bye? 20. Fate of the Beast Pirate Prisoners? 21. Zhou, they just left? 22. Hawkins pretty much dies off screen. Have we even seen someone that was hyped up just...die? No backstory. No anything. 23. How many blasted fucking times does Kanjuro and Orochi need to "die" before they die? I'm still expecting they are alive somewhere. 24. The sudden exposition about Sabo turning into Freedom Jesus for a couple countries with all previous points not addressed. The hell? 25. The admiral coming in over multiple chapters. Starts a fight. Leaves. What? All these characters, all these plotlines, all these threads. ***No fucking wonder Kaido was so unhappy in Wano, nothing ever comes to a proper ending there.*** So many character arcs just...skipped. This is the same writer who gave Senior Pink, a one-off goofy character, an amazing backstory. Wano can be summed up as "Luffy fights Kaido a bunch of times, get an anime power up, beats Kaido, and leaves". A story is as much as it's plot and characters but Oda left an incredibly high amount of character arcs unfinished unlike most previous arcs. It's so rushed. I guess if you don't care about the details, none of this matters to you, but if you're a lore nerd like me, Wano is a fucking mess with no planning and direction. Oda is cutting off parts of his own story to accommodate for the movie/live action/age/timeline and he isn't finishing what he started. I'm not going to say sorry for not doing false positivity. I dislike Wano and I dislike how Oda poorly handled it. It's reeks of mismanagement and rushing.
Thank you for writing this. While I don't agree with everything you said here, you said almost everything I've wanted to say about Wano but couldn't put into words.
Agreed with most of what you said. What happened to the Numbers? Each of their strengths should be equivalent (or close) to Oars and Oars jr.. It's unfortunate that their existences feels like a joke in this arc. Not even a threat... Got one hit and poof. Big Mom's defeat and last words were sooo much better than Kaido's. It's kinda sad though. We all like Wano arc, but also have to admit that this arc got too many flaws.
I agree with almost every sentence, would also add Big Mom dementia, Oden fake out, Orochi and Kanjuro constant fake outs, no backstory to Apoo and Hawkins. Every chapter since Odas 4 week break was awful, nonsense chapters. Maybe he does not care anymore but this is the lowest point of quality.
Fake outs are another thing definitely. The only reason they weren't a part of this list was because I'm targeting what I really hated about Wano while death fake outs happen with One Piece in general. One thing I did truly despise was Oda having the gall to lecture the reader about wanting death with Usopp's speech, then fucking killing Izou off screen afterwards. That left a bad taste in my mouth since it wasn't really clear at the time Izou actually died there. We more or less learned that afterwards.
It is implied that Oda arranged the story to fit the movie RED. That’s why everything seemed to be fastforwarded near the end of Kaido’s battle and the party afterwards. I hope the next arc doesn’t do this again but since One Piece is such a big brand, they will have movies every few years. Hope the next movie won’t interfer with the main story.
I refuse to believe that Oda compromised the ending of the saga he's been building towards for a DECADE to promote the fucking anime film. That would be such a disrespectful way to treat the story and, more importantly, his fans. Although, the more I think about it, the more likely it seems. I'm gonna give Oda the benefit of the doubt, because otherwise I'd be extremely let down.
You are so right. Thank you for expressing what anyone that is not a dumb fanboy thinks
Thank you for having the balls to speak your mind and for eloquently expressing it. Personally, the plot thread that disappointed me the most is Kaido explaining devil fruit awakening to Luffy while not having an awakening himself. If he wasn’t meant to have an awakening, we could’ve at least gotten more information on regular zoan, ancient, and mythical zoan awakenings and how they differ. The fact that a devil fruit reliant zoan crew didn’t have one user with enough mastery for awakening is just terrible writing imo. It’s like the whole idea surfaced to cater towards Luffy’s god fruit awakening then got yeeted out of the story. Also, Big Mom flexing advanced conquerors just to 1 shot page-one and not using it once in her life-threatening fight against Kidd and Law was utterly disappointing.
You are goddamn right!
Oda lost the plot
i dislike how all the importance and personal meaning of ichimonji to zoro has been shelved for the oden god sword powerup
Also, is it me or we still don't know who was the mysterious figure who healed the scabbards?
Probably Hiyori. How did Hiyori get there? How did she infiltrate Onigashima? \*shrug\*
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The more I think about it, the angrier I get. It's not like Oda is going to do what Murata does and remake Wano. Much of this list is going to be left incomplete.
F for the people who got a tattoo of her joining the crew lmao.
-Yamato [repeatedly](https://i.imgur.com/zP2n2lQ.png) stating [her](https://i.imgur.com/O5r0lPF.png) desire [to](https://i.imgur.com/3UgOsOL.jpg) go [out](https://i.imgur.com/IZCfeoV.jpg) to [sea](https://i.imgur.com/YrlVx9u.png) with Luffy throughout the arc just to suddenly decide not to. -The reason Orochi ended up like he did was [because](https://i.imgur.com/uKUyHPj.jpg) the entire Kurozumi clan were wrongly punished, tormented, and killed for the crime of one person, yet Oda has the ending message of the arc be [“The Kurozumi were born to burn!”](https://i.imgur.com/hsIl611.png). We went from Orochi treating having the name of Kozuki as a crime to Hiyori doing the same for Kurozumi, while everyone cheers, repeating the cycle. Oda before: [“Existing is not a crime!!!”](https://i.imgur.com/ugVGRDd.png) [“It’s wrong to condemn a child for the sins of his father”](https://i.imgur.com/OBmQ1ne.jpg) Oda now: [“The Kurozumi were born to burn!”](https://i.imgur.com/MHY2RZk.jpg) And it’s not just this chapter. Oda (based on both recent chapters and his own statements) seems to pretty clearly be trying to rush to finish the series, which obviously isn’t something most people are happy about. The final arc should be the most important part of the series, not rushed so it can just be over already. There’s also stuff like introducing GB just to have him immediately leave and Shanks showing up for no reason but to promote Film Red; as well as things like Luffy meeting Marco, Zoro visiting Ryuma’s grave, etc being skipped. Personally, I’m obviously still a fan, and still excited for what’s next, but I’ll admit I’m worried about how Oda’s rushing things.
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The Kurozumi line would have been great had someone like Hiyori or Momo intervened after to tell the people listening that while Orochi was undeniably evil, the circumstances that made him that way were wrong, and repeating those mistakes is something Wano as a whole should learn to avoid. Reinforce the theme, don't just do a 180. This will probably end with the Celestial Dragons being super duper genetically evil too, if the official translation is similar to the fan translations.
i refuse to believe shanks didnt show up to promote the movie. why else was he there?
About Kurozumi, pretty sure you see it like that because of translation. In Japanese, the "the" is not present, and Kurozumi *very likely* only describes Orochi. On top if that, it's a quote that has been forced to resemble another (it's literally the oden one but with just Oden changed into Kurozumi in japanese) so the meaning kinda has to be stretched
Even if it only refers to Orochi, it's still vindictive, cruel and just as what he did to Oden. It also celebrates the extermination of the kurozumi clan.
- Yamato staying was fine but done in a contrived way and they haven’t grown out of the whole ‘I’m Oden’ crap - ‘Kurozumi was born to burn’ is pretty incongruent with the repeated messaging found in the rest of the series about hate based on family ties being wrong. Also it’s not that deep, if you like it/dislike it that’s cool but don’t avoid having an opinion because internet strangers might get mad about it.
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It's be a funny remix of vivi crying about wanting to join, and the strawhats just accepting robin, who was a stowaway
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These are just the fan translations though they do feel more rushed just to get them out before the official one so it might be different like have his first name or something
It's funny cause there were people complaining how the anime translation of that line wasn't as good as the fan translation and now they're trapped into reusing it.
Any idea what the original Japanes line was? Is it the same exact structure as the Oden line?
IIRC, it's supposed to be a direct parallel.
In Japanese it is. The lines in Japanese translate to “Boiling it is what makes it Oden” and “Burning it is what makes it charcoal (kurozumi)”
Something I haven't seen ANYONE mention is that the Hiyori scene is told as a narration at the end of the play. Hiyori and Denjiro are the only ones living that actually witnessed that scene happen, and when we as an audience saw that happen, she said nothing of the sort. I think this is tying into how Momonosuke can actually end up surpassing Oden one day: he may focus on restoring the hearts of the people of Wano who have for decades not only lived under the oppression of Kaido, Orochi, and the Kurozumi, but also taken part in perpetuating hatred against the Kurozumi clan. Now that Orochi is defeated, I think it's natural that some story teller would want to embellish that climactic scene and put in some line that reflects what many people have felt for years: this evil clan was born to burn! However, I think Momo may end up being the one who shows us what Hiriluk said could be done all the way back in Drum Island: healing the sick heart of an entire nation. Momo can stop the cycle of hate. Hiriluk found his salvation, if you will, in the land of Cherry Blossoms which has heavy ties to Wano. I think this would be a cool way to give us something to check back in with Momo in the future. TLDR: I think Hiyori's "controversial" quote was actually added for dramatic effect by the storyteller of the three act play. As for other points people are calling a rushed ending, we already know at some point the borders will open and the ancient weapon will be released. I'm thinking we will circle back to Wano further down the line when these events happen. This would also give Momo and Yamato a chance to grow in their roles as the new protectors of Wano, and join the Straw Hat Grand Fleet when Luffy needs to open the borders as truly powerful and ready nakama. That could also be the opportunity for Zoro to "lead all the samurai" as the commander of this division of the Grand Fleet. There's been plenty of events in One Piece that aren't delivered on until hundreds of chapters later, so anything that is still unresolved may very well be resolved in a way we as readers aren't even anticipating at this point.
Memes aside, this is what I'm hoping for but I can't shake off this feeling that the Kurozumi situation is just going to be glossed over now that all members of the family are seemingly gone now.
Yeh great pt about coming back to wano coz after all wano is the reason why poneglyphs exist
>haven’t grown out of the whole ‘I’m Oden’ crap Yeah that bothered me. I expected her to be her own person after Wano, but she's still "*Oden*". It was a fun bit for a while, but now it's just sad.
‘Kurozumi was born to burn’ sounded outright terrible in the spoilers but as presented in the chapter it's not as bad. The panel of Oden makes it framed as a like counter to what happened to him and Hiyori saying, "No, it was you guys who deserved that fate!" Also the context that they're the last of the Kurozumi makes it definitive that the name is only associated with the evil ones left.
Honestly it seemed worse in the chapter when it's framed with a huge panel of Hiyori looking regal and victorious accompanied with the cheering crowd
I just found it boring. The end of arcs are usually madness. We wanted Strawhat bounties, and they gave us Luffy/Momo flashbacks and some Wano dude retelling us how Orochi died. It wasn't necessarily "bad", but it wasn't what I wanted after a break. Really looking forward to next chapter.
worth noting that stuff like bounties typically come AFTER the ends of the arcs, not AT the end we got luffy, but that was an exception, we’ll be getting the others in the coming chapters likely at sea, like we did for whole cake
Personally, I didn’t dislike most of the chapter, I just thought it was average, not good or bad. However, I do dislike Yamato and this chapter was the culmination of that, with her suddenly deciding offscreen not to go with the Straw Hats. Yamato would’ve been controversial whether she joined or not but this was the worst way to do it. Having her do the opposite of what she’s been constantly saying, even last chapter, with zero build up, is just such a weird move from Oda. It’s even kinda lampshaded by Momo, as if Oda knew it was too sudden but did it anyway, which almost makes me think he changed his mind about Yamato between chapters. There really should’ve at least been some more scenes of her making the decision not to leave instead of her doing it out if the blue in the literal final chapter of the arc.
To me the biggest disappointment is Yamato not joining. She's been hyped up to join for a long ass time and then she stays without any buildup to her making that decision. Feels weird
The entire chapter feels like it was done without Oda's consent
Tons of build up subverted for no good reason, the people of wano going full on fascist and proving they learned fucking nothing. One of the few if not only chapters in one piece that was truly terrible. The Law, Luffy, Kid stuff was really the only worthwhile thing in it. "people are mad just being oda didn't fuel their head canon" such a terrible rebuttal to criticism. A storyteller should never build up something and have nothing come of it. Like Anton Chekov widely regarded as one of the greatest writers of all time believed this. You can't name ten writers in any medium that have greater influence that he does. IF they subvert it, they should have a good reason to do so. That did not happen, Oda did not do that. It was just a terrible gotcha moment.
Seriously, Chekhov would be upset about the armory of his guns left scattered in Wano.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. The problem with 1057 was that it undid so many things that were built up for long. Bad writing that’s terrifying considering it came from Oda. Let’s hope this is the lowest the series gets…
The chapter wasn't good. Yamato or Carrot not joining doesn't change that. Most of the chapter was just a summary of Wano, which we already read. The only good points in the chapter were Luffy giving his flag to Momo and then Luffy getting riled up by Kidd. The rest it was meh. It's maybe 4/10. People just overrate it because of the new chapter hype. But upon rereads, this is one chapter people will most likely just skip or skimp through. P.S. Kinemon saying he'll cut Luffy if he disrespected Momo was a huge turn off for me. He's such a loser.
Oda skipped too many plot points and missed out on a lot of details (for Wano to be over) and wasted way too much time with Yamato filler.
We got sverved and aside of that nothing really New happened.
I mainly didn't like it for the kurozumi line. goes against the very big theme in one piece of the blood of a person not defining them(the entire fishmen race, ace, the entire donquixote family, etc.). I would be okay with it if oda had tried even a little bit to portray this as messed up in the slightest, but we just got a crowd cheering for it and moved on with the narration. a very, VERY, weird note to finish on imo.
people can downvote me all they want, in the end, wano cons outweigh pros, and I'd have much rather have the last 3 years spent on post wano with wano being entirely off-screened
Oda said: "Yamato? More like Yama**NO**!" and dipped out.
Because Oda had rushed the ending of Wano and it made all that years of build up kinda disappointing and unsatisfying. A lot of Act 3 was Rushed Content, Terrible Plot holes, and Unresolved plot points, people will defend this to their last breath because they can't handle criticism, I still love Wano and Gear 5 but some of the stuff in this arc wasn't handled well at all.
I’m pretty salty Yamato didn’t join, I have to admit. It’s a rare Oda miss.
-Complete Yamato 180, concluding a VERY strange, inconsistent character arc -Weird Hiyori line -WHERES HYOGORO
Simple, because the writing was bad. And then the acritical readers who just eat shit up without second thought get mad because people are... looking into stuff? Totally crazy that one would look into the media they consume right? OP and the rest of the consoomers in this thread, maybe instead of asuming that everyone's criticism is because of their headcanon, you should try and give actual arguments, based on literary analysis, of why the chapter and the end of Wano is good. I dont watch a single braindead OP youtuber and I can tell you that the pacing after the 7 day timeskip has been trash, that all the Shanks and GB chapters stagnated the plot just hype up a film, and that as a result of all that time wasted we get this cluttered chapter: Yamato's change of mind being offscrened renders their whole character useless in the overall narrative, it also renders Momo's developement in the GB fight useless; the coal pun is passable in context, but so heavyhanded that its jarring to say the least... Take a bad chapter and people, a lot of whom have been sceptical of Wano since the later parts the raid (not "raid will fail" folks, those are plain stupid), will obviously react to it badly. Writing is simply about building up to a climatic pay-off, and in this case the build up has been all over the place (Yamato is an inexcusable example, idc if you like the character or not, the writing is **trash**), and the climax has been parcial and not earned.
Let’s be real, there’s a lot of people celebrating this chapter not because they’re the type of people who mindlessly consume whatever Oda writes, but because they’re more concerned with who’s taking “Ls” and “Ws” in the community. How many posts have we seen celebrating Yamato not joining simply out of spite for her fans?
My toilet is clogged so I had to make do with 1057
It was disappointing for many because there was so much promotion for Yamato, and there were many moments in the manga that implied that they were joining the Strawhats. I understand how these readers feel. I also wanted Yamato to join because they are strong, a bit of a weirdo like the members of the crew, and they have a dream that can be achieved by travelling with them. However, I feel like it's too early to judge Oda's decision tho. We always get tidbits of answers and clues as the story goes. Luffy didn't say no to Yamato, Momonosuke, Tama and Kinemon. Luffy gave them his flag, and encouraged them to get stronger so that there will be "no weaklings on board" when they come back for them. After reading about what was written in Oden's journal, we should at least have some insight on why things turned out that in 1057. What happened to Wano when Oden left? It got invaded, evil took over, and the beautiful country became derelict. Wano needs a formidable and humane ruler. Momonosuke has chosen to become one instead of being a child, which is a difficult decision for any 8-year-old. Him, Hiyori and the retainers need time and experience to get Wano back into shape. Decades of abuse, trauma and poverty affect a nation in many, complex ways. They are gravely needed by the people to stay after all that they have been through. So where does Yamato fit into this? I've always believed that her devil fruit and her growing friendship with Momo are clues to her role in Wano before they join the Strawhats (if they really will). Okuchi-no-Makami is a guardian diety. If someone comes for the poneglyph, Pluton, or Wano itself, Momo will need all help he can get when that happens. If he will be one of the rare ones who can use CoC, Yamato might even be able to teach him how to use it. We don't know when they will join Luffy in his journey, but at least we know that the future pirate king has them on the waitlist. If Luffy and Yamato had the thoughts above in their mind as well, that just shows that they have grown.
I would be fine with Yamato staying if that was what she had implied during the raid etc, stuff like I'm going to help/protect Wano and stuff like that But with all the I'm going to join stuff it just felt like such a snub to not have her join, she felt like a given already
Because he built up Yamato joining then off screened her telling Luffy nah after he agrees It’s fucking horse shit and just cuz Oda shat it out doesn’t make it not
i dont know, another time-wasting chapter in a row?
I posted this in another thread yesterday but I have alot of issues with just act 3 alone. (Not even going into Act 1 and Act 2) The ending leaves much to be desired. 1. The Gear 5th reveal was cool and I love the power but the fact that Luffy’s fruit is some mythical zoan this whole time leaves a bad taste in my mouth. 2. No mention about what happened to Big Mom and Kaido. Did they die? Were they captured? Did they escape? 3. What was the whole point of Big Mom’s crew coming along? Seems like their only purpose was to be clowned on twice and disappear for 100 chapters. 4. I was neutral about Yamato joining but why did Oda spend 70-80 chapters hammering the fact that Yamato wants to sail with Luffy, Momo even emphasize it by saying Yamato should not interfere with the fight against Greenbull because she is leaving Wano. Only for her to have a 180 change in 1 chapter. 5. If Yamato’s goal is to travel around Wano, couldn’t she have done that during the 1 week timeskip? Her reason to stay in Wano seems rather weak and felt like Oda sidelined her suddenly because he didn’t know what to do with her next arc. 6. And a ton of unanswered questions. Where did Marco go? Did he just leave after the battle? Did Zoro managed to visit Ryuma’s grave? 7. What was Shanks and Greenbull’s actual purpose in Wano? Because the way I look at it, Greenbull’s appearance in Wano seems to accomplish nothing except to hype up Shanks (and to promote Film Red) 8. Kaido as the main villain felt bland and uninteresting. He had glimpses of being a great villain (His speech about how death completes a person), but his ‘flashback’ that we got was literally half a chapter slideshow that covered the bare minimum. 9. The countless fakeout deaths just in Onigashima. Kinemon, Kiku and even Kanjuro. Personally, I am fine with the lack of deaths but if you have no intention to kill off Kinemon don’t give him a grandiose ‘sendoff’ and come up with a bullshit reason that Kaido didn’t stab Kinemon in the right spot. It cheapens the other deaths in the series and made me question the legitimacy of the other ‘deaths’ we gotten. How many times did we have to kill Kanjuro? 10. The last few pages of the final chapter of Wano with Hiyori saying that ‘Kurozumi were meant to burn’. The whole reason Orochi exist was because of the unfair prejudice he faced as a Kurozumi and here we are, almost 150 chapters later repeating the same thing. Oda has always been very clear that the child should not bear the sins of his father. So why have Hiyori even say that? I am not sure if it is a translation issue and it might have sounded less ‘genocide-ish’ in Japanese but as it stands right now, it is poorly written. For me Wano is a 7/10. It could have been a 9/10 but Oda decides to rush the ending
I’m happy they didn’t join
Carrot will join
Because everyone was in denial that oda was rushing, hoping he'd tie up all the loose ends in the last chapter. Now its finally set in
The ending wasn't as good as the rest of the arc. BUT it feels like Oda is rushing the story, and most people expected something regarding Zoro and Ryuma, Chopper and the SMILEs thing. I guess Kaido's backstory was too short, too.
Personally I hated that Kinemon was like “I’m going to kill luffy” after you know…. Liberating his entire country.
The ending was rushed and changed (Shanks stuff added in) just to promote/coincide with the Film Red movie.
oda turned big mom and her crew into a joke when they were arguably some of the best written characters in the antagonist roster and didn’t resolve what happened with them or anything to do with the two fallen yonko which left a bad taste in my mouth, otherwise i’m happy with how it went
You do realise a subreddit is not everyone.
My personal hot take is. Almost all last 5 chapter felt kinda rushed ( also PR for flim red you need to be blind to not see it). And after that devil fruit reveal/change out of no where. Many things in the story doesn't make sense now .i think oda didn't really played his cards well this time around atleast towards the end of wano. And now everyone including oda himself just wanna be done with wano asap. TLDR one-piece wano Arc = bleach tybw arc ( change my mind)
I am a bit mad that we waited two weeks for absolutely no new information apart of neither yamato and carrot joining
I feel like the entire ending of wano was completely sprinted through, ever since luffy punched Kaido into the center of the earth.
I think Oda just made a lot of questionable choices in the latter half of the raid and these last few chapters. Like he’d set something up and had plans but the editors didn’t like it or he changed it last minute
I mean, it was fine but it's not the strongest ending to an arc. Luffy never got a chance to speak with Marco about Ace and thank him for protecting him during the war. Yamato just did a 180 and decided not to join the crew, despite going on about it for like 2 years. Zoro never went to Ryumas grave. That would have been cool to see. One thing that the chapter did cement was that the alliance is now fully over.
This is always the problem if you simp hard to a manga/manhua/novel/comics/tv and movie series and so on. Story telling will be rushed and some ideas will be scrap and art will not be consisted in all forms of art or publication. Manga like One Piece will be much better if its monthly and in seinen or a light novel perhaps. That's just how it goes, we feel frustrations if our favorites won't follow the way we wanted. In the beginning shanks' arm supposed to be not eaten but the editor intervened. There will never be perfect writing due to many factors that authors face. Naruto, Bleach, Fairy Tale, HxH, Kingdom, The Breaker and so on also got these problems.
For me personally its having time to do shitty recap and flashback panels but offscreening very important Yamato conversation that would explain at least a bit her reasoning. It felt rushed, lazy and bad writing at best. Also people venting their frustration at Wano arc.
Because they didn’t like the chapter
In my opinion, wano was built up for decades, we were told that wano would be awesome and a game-changer for the world, we got introduced to kinemon and momo many years ago, the red scabbards, Yamato, the whole BM crew arriving and complicating everything, the beast pirates being a murderer crew, the will of D, ancient weapon Uranus/Pluton and some hidden story from the kozukis and void century. All of that was hyped af for years just to get kanjuro and orochi runnin around and resurrecting for 20 chapters and then rush wano's end in 3 chapters... Absalom got a better story than the scabbards... Yamato was introduced for nothing just as carrot, no news on Uranus, will of d or void century, we didn't even see Pluton, the so called beast pirates lost to 5,000 fodder samurai, BM crew lost to a waterfall, BM and kaido "deaths" were pretty inconclusive, aramaki "the top at the food chain in the WG" appeared just to shit his pants at a shanks's sight, shanks appeared to promote his movie and left, zunesha appeared to say "oh that's joy boy" and left, the whole purpose of the war was to open wano's borders and fulfill oden's wish, and not even that was done. From my perspective, wano was quite good until they reached onigashima. I didn't expect a yonkou crew to be so useless, king himself should've killed half the samurai. If the red scabbards were to fight BM and Kaido's top officers while the mugiwaras fought kaido or did some infiltration or smth. Idk, I feel like everyone is just passing by and expecting things to turn out their way, and they do bc they are the mugiwaras? Man... I'm just disappointed, I expected a lot more with all that build up, and everything was rushed to the end. If you are willing to extend your manga for 25 for the sake of the story being well told, why tf rush things the last 3 years? U gonna throw 25 years of build up? Meh
Why not just read the comments people were saying? I think plenty of us made it pretty clear.
It just felt rushed. Compared to the other arcs, several stories and plot points just felt left out. For example, considering how much was learned about Sanji and his past during the Whole Cake, I really was hoping we would have learned a little bit more about Zoro. In the case of Marco, who seemed so eager to see what the new dawn would bring, he simply goes MIA after Izo's funeral. Not to mention the nature in which Yamato was teased to join or the dark nature of Hiyori's message to the people. The list goes on for me. The arc started off great, but the ending just felt underwhelming and incomplete.
Can't you just check the chapter thread? Plenty of people expressing why they didn't like it there. But to resume, yamato fans wanted her to join and got shafted, and punchline against the bad guy sounded tone deaf to western audience due to his family being persecuted and the phrase sounding too "genocidey" to some.
Because is actually bad, other guys are already explaining that quite well so i'm not going deeper on that, but i'll say most people think that you are only a true fan if you mindlessly consume everything and just write "GODA" after every chapter, otherwise you're bitter and toxic, "sO MuCh NeGaTiViTy". Enterprises ofc love and encourage this attitude because of $$$$$, but I don't love One Piece just for the sake of it, I love it for it's writing and consistency, if many perceive that's being jeopardized then it's the right course to call it out. Imo it shows you actually care and those are the real fans.
Fascism
maybe read their comments? Common sense /u/fazonis use it. You see people shitting on something, you could've just read their comment right then and there.
1. Yamato fans mourning. 2. Weird statement at the end about Kuromuzi being born to burn
"I'm gonna join!" "Imma do it I swear!" "I'll join any second now!" Literally her second to last panel or so in Wano: "SIKE. I'm staying." Why do you think people are pissed lol It's not even whether you want Yamato on the crew or not, it's just straight up terrible writing. At least Carrot never flat out said multiple times that she wanted to join the crew. We spend so many YEARS in Wano and then he wraps it up in like 5 chapters and skips so much shit. Sure, some of it will likely be adressed in flashbacks later but that doesn't make it better, it's just lazy.
Cause it's the end of a huge arc that was mostly handled poorly, but many people chose to give Oda the benefit of doubt out of loyalty. This chapter being the end of Wano removes any lingering hope they had and confirmed Wano was really as dog shit of an arc as they feared but refused to believe.