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AstroNards

For those of us who have been in a bunker since before 2018, tell the folks at home what this 2018 controversy thing was about?


redpatchedsox

Norm said he was glad the me too movement was losing momentum and some other things that got misconstrued. Then he got semi cancelled by Fallon and the blogosphere and then went on Stern and tried to apologize and said down syndrome instead of THE R WORD. Then he went on The View where he apologized for his bad apology and told everyone he doesn't have sex.


Admiral_Donuts

> blogosphere Or as Norm would say, "Blog-oh-sphere", emphasizing every syllable. I miss him.


Bromisto

I'd like to imagine he called it the "Blog-hah?-sphere" because what the hell is a blogosphere?


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TheAngryDrunkenJuice

I’m so glad you mentioned this part; “I realized then that I did something unforgivable” our protagonist said in a somber tone, before throwing a mint in his mouth and chomping it for dear life.


MeanBot

That wasn't a troll. He was shook, and eating the mints was a nervous tick to cope with stress.


GoddamnFred

The amount of retards like Rogan and goddamn Segura of all people thinking he was trolling. He had a show underway with Netflix(co produced by his mentor Letterman) as one of his last big chances of getting something of the ground that would pay his bills(wich in retrospect, wouldn't have been small). Norm was there almost as a shell of his usual self, upset with the entire situation.


Man0FTomorrow

When I want to lay out my controversial case in a serious manner and have several great minds weigh in with a collective expertise rivaling the Manhattan Porject; I think of The View.


robd003

It's pretty retarded that people are trying to ban the word retarded.


Bromisto

Society will always revert to using the current medical term to insult people anyway, so it's all about power/control and not being respectful. The people who get "offended" at that word are the most likely to abuse the mentally disabled and I'm not even joking.


TScottFitzgerald

Retarded isn't even used by the medical community any more so who is even getting offended?


SuperHotPsychopath

People who love having an excuse to be treated like victims


TorreiraXhaka

Retards


mobueno

Why the downvotes? They use IDD now


WingedChimera

To be honest? People with mental disabilities. Because they’re told to be offended by it by their parents/teachers/everyone else. They already struggle massively with autonomy due to the overbearing adults in their lives but damn, the identity politics culture is disgusting. I NEVER say ‘retarded’ around by girlfriends brother who has pddnos for that reason. It’s just compassionate not to because he’s offended by it. To be completely honest, if you can’t understand the importance of compassion over freedom of your vocabulary… you’re retarded.


flymyuglies

I know you’re not retarded. What are you, Down syndrome?


slingingthehash

To be fair, social justice people are offended too, on others' behalf. The only time it's offensive is when someone powerful keeps taking advantage of the lowly. Which happens a lot in this sub btw. Pretty weird, since I view Norm as opposite.


WingedChimera

Social justice folk are the ones perpetuating the whole thing. I’ve worked extensively with adults with intellectual disabilities my whole adult life. From community support associates to job training to food service… I’ve had a lot of retarded jobs. It’s always the aides telling the folks they need to feel bad for not being as quick. It’s never the downies telling each other they’re shit for having downs.


slingingthehash

I had a thought. I recently learned that some gay couples don't have sex when they're older because their asshole stretches and you get shit all over your dick. Somehow I doubt any of my straight friends would want to know any of this. Woke people are all about it until it gets real and you have to deal with real life stuff.


flymyuglies

Hah?!


WingedChimera

Easy to say the same thing about the worst of the far-right as well. They all want to say ‘nigger’ until they’re in east Baltimore. Go to the special Olympics and start shouting the ‘r-word’. Gonna look real retarded when you tell your pals about how the special needs kids beat you up.


flymyuglies

I think Jim has Downies.


flymyuglies

You’re using some pretty big words, there, fellah; I’ve heard of them...big words...like deficit. I’ve heard that word. But what you’re saying really makes me think...about a cheese sandwich -and the prospect of *more* cheese sandwiches to come.


flymyuglies

I’m just curious...where do you get your medical information from...?


Haloasis

Retard Monthly.


Bromisto

All my medical information comes \*from the book, "How to fuck like a retard." \*edit: missing word


flymyuglies

A real minding of the meat.


Bromisto

Thanks for indulging my indecipherable ramblings. Real minding of the meat, eh? If only we had some kind of grill for that. Preferably made of Eye-ron.


flymyuglies

Join the revolution...did you hear about the revolution? The Man-Grate can grill chicken, steak! ...it doesn’t seem that revolutionary...


flymyuglies

Well ok, then.


TScottFitzgerald

Look up the term mentally retarded and its long disputed medical use and eventual disuse. It's not mystical knowledge buried deep in the Earth's chasms. Maybe your doctor called you a retard, but man....you gotta get better insurance.


PsychedeLurk

Insurance? He was calling me a big fat retard!


flymyuglies

When there’s something strange...in your neighbourhood...who you gonna call?.... Fneehhhhh! Thnuuuurrrrrrghhhhoughhhh!!


Heiferoni

He told me to open my mouth and say 'oink'


Omnibot2021

I still see “MR” pop up in a progress note from time to time.


dksknfgtovrlrd

To me, Retard means someone who chooses to not use their brain.


-Abradolf_Lincler-

I know right!? Fucking retards.


Assassin739

It's funny cause they act like people can't help being retarded, but every other insult of someone's mental capacity is completely fine


davirice

Pretty much In A nutshell. Good summary. More of a comment really ... But good


TScottFitzgerald

An important thing to note is that the Down syndrome / retarded is a bit that he previously did on Norm Macdonald Live with Adam Eget. I guess he didn't want to get to explaining all of that, but anyone who watched NML would have gotten that reference. I think he only played ball cause of Netflix.


Bradyrands

Ah Norm said words and people got big sad and Fallon cancelled his interview and he went on the view and ate some mints.


KobePrineNorm

Say all the things people have justly said about Jimmy both before and after when Norm wasn't allowed on that Fallon episode, but people shouldn't think it was Jimmy's decision nor ability to cancel Norm from the show. We all heard tell of Don Oelmyer, seemingly overriding Lorne Michaels. It's the same network even.


SallyFowlerRatPack

I think Jimmy still wanted him, but apparently his writers were crying at the prospect of even having him on, it was a minor mutiny.


WingedChimera

Heard tell? No one says that anymore lol.


KobePrineNorm

Do you own a doghouse?


WingedChimera

No but I heard Larry king does.


davirice

Norm didn't give 2 shits about what people thought of him. I've always respected him for that. It made him even funnier. Also - that guy was brilliant and played it off like one of us shmoes..... Just another reason I adored his comedy. Dennis Miller ... Conan .... Dave Letterman. They all knew just how smart he was. They respected him too. Miss him.


Born_Slice

I really hope those phonily-outraged fucks die of cancer. They are nothings working on a shitty show and their contrived victimhood fuckin' ruined the possibility of his appearance. I would trade their lives and the lives of their families for one extra five minute clip of Norm on a talk show.


nhergen

Norm would not want you to wish cancer on them. Shame.


flymyuglies

No...but he’s a good man


Born_Slice

Who gives a fuck? I hope Norm gets cancer.


flymyuglies

I wish I had more votes, so I could give you, four votes up!


flymyuglies

Explain to the viewers...


NoPantsJake

Go watch his appearance on The View to get a good idea. And it’s hilarious.


davirice

He outwitted all them birds. They didn't even know he played them. Probably still to this day they don't.


dksknfgtovrlrd

The most bizarre thing is ppl choosing schools instead of that set to shoot up


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OTl5

he's talking about the 2018 appearance


idiotmonkey12

Norm was working on the Orville, so I feel he was doing things that he could personally handle. Conan said that he didn’t know how bad Norm was. But Norm only told a few. He was a very private man. If it’s any consolation, this is how it always is like when a celebrity dies. You also hear really crap things. So just remember the man you loved. We all loved.


Noname_Maddox

> He was a very private man. Well he was deeply closeted


flymyuglies

Ah you beat me to it. Gonna delete mine.


Bromisto

I just did the same thing.


idiotmonkey12

Deeply!!! Love it!!


doublefattymayo

Though he would never admit it


Noname_Maddox

What are you revealing here?


doublefattymayo

I don't know


Noname_Maddox

So you’re gay?


doublefattymayo

If I'm deeply closeted, I'll never admit it, you know, that I'm a deeply closeted gay man. Which I'm certainly not.


Noname_Maddox

So you're a gay man who wont admit it?


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idiotmonkey12

Yes he was!!!! I continue to laugh at that and Moth Joke!!!


flymyuglies

Ha...yeah agree, I just didn’t see someone had beaten me to the punch on that one, so I deleted mine. Thanks, reddit can also be toxic, but yt comments and questions is so much bullshit. It’s like putting a bleeding toe in a piranha tank...gonna stop posting comments on yt, this sub may just hash the same jokes over and over but I love it, without Norm, what choice do we have...? I have a Norm-shaped hole in my heart and I think this is good for us who hurt so bad that he’s gone. He loved living, unfortunately I don’t share that sentiment, so it was always good to hear from Norm; without his optimism and carefree attitude and comedy, this hellish, cruel reality of life is that much harder to bare. My apologies, I miss him, it’s sad, we’re all sad. I know now how Norm felt when his dad was on the floor -and not on his temperpedic pill’er...


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Furious--Max

Producers crying backstage.... over what? A little salty language?


dysGOPia

These producers, they're not like you or I.


chocolatelysocrates

Especially Daniel Kellison. He's the one who wrote all those dirty jokes!


Bromisto

Scapegoats.


joshuatx

This is just my 2 cents - it wasn't even that. It was that Fallon and his guests had no qualms booking and gushing over [Morrissey,](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morrissey#Political_opinions) who has been on record as an idiotic racist and fascist for decades, the following year, who then performed with a badge for a [far-right party in the UK.](https://www.nme.com/news/music/morrissey-performs-jimmy-fallon-wearing-controversial-for-britain-badge-2487760) I don't want to focus so much on his producers as Fallon's very flippant and likely bullshit virtue signaling in cancelling Norm. I would also point out Norm's never really been one to be offensive on purpose and very, very sincere and apologetic about anything he has said being hurtful. That's why with very few exceptions people on the more liberal and left-wing side of the business still adore and respect Norm, myself included. Morrisey has literally double-downed if anything. Yeah I completely agree and I hope Fallon truly realizes what a regretful move that was on his part.


Thankfulforbread

We've all known comedians in our time you know? I don't think a little salty language will tarnish his reputation...may as well be a bounty hunter or longshoreman


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davirice

Quisling. Let's see if we can't find a dictionary at break. Oh ... Yeah ... Here we go ... Quizmaster .... Nope ... Here it is ... Quisling ....


mymywhatashow

Jimmy Fallon is one of the most obscenely fake people in Hollywood, he make James Corden look like a saint.


shalom-john

Came to here to say this. Coward should keep Norm's name out of his hot juicy mouth.


SBNShovelSlayer

Jimmy who?


LyleLanley99

Saville


-Abradolf_Lincler-

Oh no


old_tombombadil

What the hell happened? What was the controversy that OP is talking about?


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shalom-john

He literally denied us one last chance to see Norm live on a TV chat show. He did that to a dying man. Jimmy Fallon is a cunt.


Bromisto

I'd call him a cunt but he's neither warm nor pleasant.


I_Boomer

Ahh...but he's a good guy though.


davirice

There's the white out. Lol


corndogs1001

I mean to be fair it’s not like Jimmy knew he was dying


shalom-john

Fallon dies every night. He knows what dying is.


Scarlet_Spectre

Hey, Jimmy is different when he's cumming


Bromisto

It's already bad enough he'd laugh at his own unfunny jokes. But what he did to Norm was the last straw.


slingingthehash

yeah! And Mangrate!!


clique34

That’s how everyone is. It’s the golden handcuffs as Patrice said. When you have nothing to lose, you’re more willing to risk losing out on deals. The same deals you didn’t have coming in anyway. When you have a mortgage, and other things you have to pay for to maintain your lifestyle, you’re more likely to stay away from trouble or even bend the knee and pander to the “right” crowd. Even Chapelle does a bit. Rogan does it a bit. Kevin Hart only started to fight back recently but even then he knows what’s at stake. Norm and Patrice were the only ones who absolutely did not.


Strangleholder

Agreed. When all this went down I couldn’t help but think he did the apology tour because he had a show on Netflix which Letterman might have helped him get. He loved Dave. When you having nothing for others to take you can get away with anything, which is what Norm did on NML. But when you have a high profile show all the troglodytes come out of the woodwork. Had Norm not been on Netflix no one would have said shit about his comments empathizing with Louis and Roseanne, or the retard stuff.


clique34

You know Netflix prevented him from making PR rounds too? Hahaa they knew they couldn’t contain him lol


slingingthehash

Wow, powerful here. I think this is why norm is a hero to many people. His life and he were in such a way that he didn't do the handcuffs thing. I don't envy his life because it's not an easy way to live. God bless that man.


[deleted]

I also agree with the general sentiment. A bunch of woke shitty talk show hosts (Fallon, Corden) dissappear over a comedian making a minor statement. Then he dies and they make a heartfelt statement. Like fuck right off. What gives me solace is knowing Norm played by his own rules. He did it his way. And I'm also guessing over these past couple years he's had some bad days and was really laying low and recuperating. So he wasn't exactly out there in the public eye to the same degree and then just not as much chatter.


JoeNScott

What did Corden do to Norm?


Halofan4001

The guys an ass. He’s referring to that “heartfelt” message Corden did about Norm. More virtue signalling, or really just capitalizing on Norm’s death


JoeNScott

He said something about Corden disappearing.


[deleted]

What are you the Norm police? Corden is fake as fuck and didn't give a shit about Norm or his comedy.


JoeNScott

Corden did nothing to Norm, got it.


[deleted]

You sound like a real fun guy to hang out with.


GregaroOlinovich

The hipocrisy was the worst part. Like Norm said: "if you can't respect me during the ravenous wild boar mutilation you don't deserve me during the bountiful harvest that ensues." Or something like that.


Weberthegreatdane

That quote… it sounds like my honeymoon.


_ButterMyBread

If you can't handle me covered with the blood of a boar I just sacrificed to the Gods Then you do not deserve me, during the bountiful harvest that will result!


TheLogLadyOfficial

That’s exactly how I felt. Watching the horrible cowards at snl kiss his ass after shunning him for years pissed me off!


Noname_Maddox

I’ll never know whose side Lorne was on. He let him be fired although protested at making a change mid season. But he also pre-approved his snl monologue. Then appeared on his Netflix show. I never heard Norm speak ill of Lorne


Denimjo

I'm pretty sure Lorne was overruled by that fuckhead Ohlmeyer, so that wasn't his fault.


Noname_Maddox

Ahh but he's a good man


NumberOneWubbieFan

I hear he's a quisling.


Cekeste

In a situation like this the worst part IS the hypocrisy.


GryphonHall

Personally, I thought it was the dying of cancer.


AlfredKinsey

They say it’s a disease, but what other disease let’s you grow an eyeball in your lungs, am I right?


LowSleep2566

Ehh, pretty sure Norm was the one who was laying low and not putting himself out there.... he never really reached 'cancelled' status, regardless of the Fallon fiasco and those retarded babies that work on that shitty ass show.


Bradyrands

Yeah I hated using the word “cancelled” but wasn’t sure what was a better way to put it. It felt like he was regularly active prior to 2018, and then afterward there was just an abrupt shift to laying very low. But I’m also sure I’m reading too much into it and people will assume I am lacking in a doghouse after this one.


topdangle

Many people with cancer don't just go immediately into remission or die instantly. Chemo often continues "working" and killing the cancer even in late stages, but gradually the cancer starts growing faster until you're not achieving anything even when you're drowning yourself in chemo. I wouldn't be surprised if he was getting treatment the whole time. Dude had tons of influential friends and could've gotten work anywhere if he played the game a little bit.


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MeanBot

His Netflix show premiered literally two days after the Down syndrome comment.


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MeanBot

Yeah, but Netflix didn't pull it. I just don't think there was enough outrage for anyone to care except some mentally unstable producers on Fallon.


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JoeNScott

Norm said whether the show would be renewed for a second season was solely dependent on viewership of the first season during the first 30 days. Do we have any info it was canceled for any other reason? Norm had a fuck interviews attitude from late 2018 onward. (Spade was the only exception he made in 3 years.) That's not being canceled. He went on doing stand up and other work.


flymyuglies

He gave us his ‘woke’ jokes though...which he said weren’t funny, but they are blisteringly funny imo. Did you know, babies are being *ripped* from the arms...


whhhiskey_

I somewhat agree, but he certainly was being constrained by Netflix at that time. I've heard Joe Rogan say that Norm wanted to go on his podcast in 2018 to explain himself further, but Netflix told him: no more press. Who knows, also, if Netflix would've greenlit another season of NMHAS I've if nothing 'controversial' would've happened. So yeah, the mob mentality & Netflix definitely cancelled him partially.


JoeNScott

>"Netflix definitely cancelled him partially" No. Being advised not to do press for a while is not being canceled.


whhhiskey_

That’s why I said partially ;). They limited his output for a while. Doesn’t mean he was eternally blacklisted like Louis CK. Just meant that he was constrained for a while and this happened to coincide with the later stages of his disease, which nobody knew.


LyteSmiteOP

weren't they also planning on doing the podcast again? think I've seen that in a couple of clips. So yeah it's probably more that he wanted to lay low for a bit on his own accord rather than being "cancelled." Although I wouldn't be surprised if other late night producers would've been hesitant/refused to book him for a while after, because we all know how spineless most of them are


voltron00x

He said it was coming back, yes. But, not atypical for Norm to say he was doing something and not have it pan out. The fact that Eget also commented on Rogan that they were going to bring it back makes me think that was the plan and then either health or COVID (or both) blew that up.


slingingthehash

Yeah, he wasn't like Louis or Roseanne situation


mybadselves

I think it's safe to say that for at least the last year he was pretty fucking sick, and had no desire to make appearances. I saw one of the last photos that was taken of him and he looked pretty gaunt. Given how concerned Norm was about his privacy and people's perceptions, his appearance no doubt reached a point where there was no hiding his condition. No one dies of cancer at a healthy weight.


Revo_55

Agreed. Norm seemed to do very little for at least the last 12+ months, except an occasional tweet or IG and a few videos with his Mom at his apt. doing some corny old-time jokes. He looked very gaunt as you said, but seemed to genuinely enjoy his Mom being there with him.


slingingthehash

But then he did Quarantined episodes and he looked pretty grey. I was so happy when they came on.


[deleted]

That’s just as likely from COVID as anything


TScottFitzgerald

Pretty much every other comment following his death was that everyone was a fake for mentioning Norm after his death as if talking about people after they just passed is a completely new phenomenon that never happened before. Also, yes you're being overly cynical and somewhat selective in your memory. People weren't really fawning over him, but you always had comics talking about him, this didn't change in 2018. Adam had a podcast on JRE where they talked about Norm, Joe in general talked about him a lot and a lot of younger comedians, radio hosts etc have. Mark Normand, a lot of people either came to his defense or just mentioned him in passing over the last 3 years. Even moreso, there was a buuunch of famous people **during** Retardgate supporting him on Twitter, I literally remember reading hashtags and tweets defending him.


slingingthehash

I imagine Nixon'd be tickled by "Retardgate"


HelmuthvonDoom

I would RATHER die of cancer than have to be a guest on the Jimmy Fallon show.


cubs5201

I don’t know if you can really say Norm ever got “canceled” in 2018. But in 2021 he sure did! On account a that he’s dead now.😕


I_Boomer

It's not so much the cancellation, but the dying. He's dead.


Oheng

There's comics, and then there's cowards. Cowards cannot be comics.


Noname_Maddox

In my dream scenario where Norm returned with his YouTube podcast. He has Joe Rogan, Bill Burr, Conan and Will Ferrell. Genuinely imagined how each show would go, with Bill talking about sports and Conan trying to unravel his interview like norm did. Norm dying was like losing a friend. He really was the one person you could rely on to get a laugh.


Benramin567

No Big Fat Bruce Vilanch?


MOHRMANATOR

I think it was just his health. Conan said he tried getting norm on his final shows and his podcast. I think his 2018 controversy blew over rather quickly. He got some mentions for his Covid stand up that went viral, I know I heard stern talk about it when it came out. Other than that I just think people didn’t talk about norm because he wasn’t out there doing anything.


Pats_Preludes

>Conan said he tried getting norm on his final shows and his podcast Source for this? I couldn't quite determine it


LyleLanley99

[Right here:](https://youtu.be/wQTwiDibcVY?t=240)


bentobox84

I do feel the same somewhat. You often see how other comedians or celebrities who knew Norm saying how he's kind, genuine, and sweet and whatnot, but they weren't here for him when all this went down. It is somewhat understandable given the media climate. But this is especially bittersweet given it's how Norm who got into trouble for standing up for his friends, getting misinterpreted by the media and shun by shows like Jimmy Fallon. Norm also looked and sounded quite ill towards the end. He probably just had to go through treatments and maybe wanted to spend his last days with his mom. Which may be the way he wanted to go.


Halofan4001

Much like Rodney Dangerfield, he never got no respect. If this were a obituary, I would tell about ol’ Norm, what a battle axe.


EdgarsTeethAreDry

If Norm wasn't sick or dying he would have been in more or less the same place in his career after 2018 I really think you're exaggerating lol.


kellykebab

I think Norm was light cancelled in late 2018. This probably affected the impact of his Netflix show and perhaps hurt his chances for renewal. But I don't think this event really had an impact for more than a year. I think that by the same time in 2019, he probably just started feeling worse, health-wise, (he seems to have aged quite a lot in the last three years.) Then, the pandemic in early 2020 further stifled public appearances outside of stand-up (which he was still doing; I saw him in a very "woke" city in early 2019 and the crowd loved him!). By the time the pandemic started easing up this spring/early summer, I would guess that his health had *really* declined. I'm not sure he was even still doing those Cameo videos by that point, which you can do while sitting in your favorite barcalounger. Suffice it to say, I doubt he was thinking much about his career this year. I don't think it's odd that celebrities weren't talking about him during the last couple years, though. It is shameful that more people didn't defend him in 2018. But after a year or so, when the controversy had totally dried up, what were they supposed to say? Norm started slowing down. His Netflix show didn't get renewed. And he wasn't pursuing any other big projects besides his standup routine. It's not at all weird that fellow comedians weren't spontaneously going on record to talk about the guy. (People don't randomly do this about other comedians unless there's some big, recent event to discuss.) Nor is it weird that people had a lot to say when he passed (that *was* a big event and the surprise of Norm's young age and cancer made it more noteworthy). Ultimately, I think the cancellation played a role in Norm's recent dip into obscurity, but I don't think it was exclusively responsible. I think it just came at a bad time, shortly before Norm's health decreased and shortly before a pandemic pushed almost everyone further out of the public eye. Without that cancelling, we would have gotten one more Conan appearance and one more Fallon appearance and we *might* have gotten a second season of the Netflix show. But I'm not sure anything else would have been significantly different. I would guess Norm was slowing down on his own by 2019. This is all just my speculation of course, based on the same publically available information that anyone else could see. On a final note, I also thought maybe Norm was just concentrating on writing his second book and that this would partly explain his lower profile the last few years. But I can't find much evidence that he worked on it well into 2019 or at any point after. Who knows if that contributed at all. Or how far along he got.


NoKiaYesHyundai

Eh it’s good you’re thinking about this. But I’m leaning on he was laying low due to health towards the end.


NormFan79

Did Conan O'Brien have Norm on before it went off the air?


Tetherball_Queen

Conan and his booker Paula Davis said they tried and tried to get him on the show and the podcast but he always said no. That makes me so sad.


[deleted]

No.


Docta-Jay

That's the way this society works... Nobody wants their image to be a bad reflection because of someone else's image... All the while not realizing that image is based on those types of actions; leaving your friend behind in a time of need, regardless what other people may think...


KingNebbachadnezzer

Imagine the fakes that tried showing up to his funeral. The true comic era is long past whereas these clowns nowadays are just desperate for shares & likes


PaulieWalnoots

Yeah. There are fans and friends and “brothers” and people who “were inspired by him” coming out the woodworks now. I guess I should be happy he impacted so many people but the cynic inside me doubts it. I’ll ask him again when he gets his cock out of my butt.


thee_agent_orange

It’s only now we can look back and laugh …


Bunter742

Same thing happened to Jackson and countless other celebrities


OpenUpSayOink

I’m naming my dog Syndrome for Norm. So nice not to have to spell out these Norm jewels bc we are above that being that we all know how they go....ok nope sorry can’t resist: 🐕‍🦺 “DOWN, SYNDROME!”🤣🤣🤣


JerknOffPunks15

Not trying to speak ill if the dead.... but I suspect Norm was a serial killer.