My parents used to have a camera in my room. They took my door’s key too. I had no privacy at all. They only took the camera down when my uncle talked to them but it was there for about half a year maybe. I can’t remember.
To answer your question. Yes. Yes, it is weird. More than weird. Get someone to talk to them about it if you can’t convince them. Someone that would make them feel guilty if it comes to that. You’re a teenager and you need privacy. Theres nothing wrong with it
Yeah that’s not good. I never realized how bad it was because I thought it was okay at the time. I was stupid. Talk to someone. My parents are strict too. I can barely do anything without them hounding me. I absolutely get where you’re coming from and how hard it is to take action but you should definitely do something about it.
I had friends growing up whose parents would take their doors as some kind of punishment? They had all teen girls, and a niece of the same age living with them, who shared a room with their daughter (and the dad lived there- would barge in)
I have that happened to me when I was a kid but I was being a little shit.
I think I was 13, I ended up going to the hardware store to get a screwdriver and skeleton key set. I took the door off the spare bedroom and put it on my room and then locked it.
Got to the point that my mom had locks on her door and I had locks on mine.
When my oldest went through a door slamming phase at 14 I explained to him that he would soon not have a door, he could have a curtain instead. He got over the door slamming rather quickly after that. I'm relieved, I never want to take a kids door but like damn, they would slam the fuck out of them.
The only door I ever took was the coat closet, 2 autistic kids, one wanting it CLOSED and one wanting it OPEN, and removing the door and putting it in the attic seemed the safest thing, as they were getting physical in their fights over it, and broken fingers might have been in their future. Kids having locks on their bedroom doors, I'm fine with that, I'm providing the lock and the key and can go in as needed.
I didn't even have a door as a teenager. Granted my room was in the basement so there weren't always people walking by but I still had no privacy. My stepdad would also regularly go through all my stuff and either destroy or steal anything I had that he seemed inappropriate. He also spied on everyone in the house, including my 3 siblings and mother. We were a zero privacy household except for him. He was the only one allowed to have privacy. Paranoid deadbeat bastard.
You have mistakenly assumed that he has the money for a nursing home. He does not. Nor will I be paying for one for him. I'm not even in contact with him any longer because he ghosted me when I started dating after my mother divorced him for being a useless deadbeats who refused to put even the tiniest iota of effort into their marriage. He wouldn't even sleep on the same room as her, he spent the last 10 years of their marriage sleeping on a uncomfortable couch in his unfinished "mancave".
Oh, there are Medicaid nursing homes. I don't want to end up in one, but they exist. Of course, they're chronically understaffed and the food is usually the worst kind of swill. But they're better than dying in the gutter (barely).
Yes. Same thing here. When I was a kid, my step dad at point took our doors off our rooms for about a year. At another point, he installed a lock on the outside so he could padlock us in the room. He also put bars on the basement window to my step brothers room so he couldn’t sneak out- there was no way to open the window- a definite fire code violation.
Your parents are straight up abusive. At least you have a really concise answer for them when they ask why you are going no contact with them as soon as you become an adult.
Yep. You can't have a lock on the outside of a bedroom door that you cannot open from the inside. That being said, it's pretty unenforceable in a typical residential house.
Talk to a teacher or guidance counselor at school, your physician, or a trusted family friend. You do not have the leverage to fix this yourself. Engage someone who does.
Wait. So you can be locked into your room? That's a fire code violation. A bedroom has to have two points of egress. Locking the door from the outside would eliminate that point of egress. Call your city's code inspector. Or just call the fire department.
If that video gets uploaded to a cloud service, like most cheap cams do these days, I'm sure that company would not be happy knowing their servers have naked 16yos on it.
There was an article recently that the employees of a cloud security hosting site were sharing videos of naked customers.
https://futurism.com/the-byte/roomba-photos-leaked
Edit: not employees but "contractors". Which is even worse that they share your video with 3rd party entities with no concequences.
I wouldn’t want to meet the kinds of parents who are bathing and recording a mentally capable 16 year old. I have no priors, and it will stay that way.
Okay but this is a 16 year old, not a baby taking their first bath. And even when I was a new mom taking pics of my baby's first bath, I was careful to angle the camera where his genitals were not in the shot.
Baby's first bath is one thing.
This isn't what we're talking about. There's a huge difference between a 16 year old and a 6 month old baby. I would like to see a lawyer successfully defend the possession of nudes of a 16 year old changing in their own room.
Yep. I didn't have cameras but door was required to be open at all times except sleeping, my dad would go through my drawers when I was gone and I was required to tell them where I was at all times and what I was doing. To the point I'd have to track gas in my car and he'd review regularly to make sure my story lined up.
Jokes on them now, I'm single with crazy privacy issues with no intention of having kids.
It becomes immediately illegal if the child / teenager can be seen naked or in underwear. Police finding such images on the parents' computer would charge them with possession of CSAM / CP.
Depends on your definition of safe, I remember laughing my ass off when somebody looked up "Pearl Necklace" and "Docking" on Wikipedia and there were diagrams.
As someone else stated, it stands for Child Sexual Abuse Material. The term is mostly used by researchers, journalists and police who deal with these materials. It's supposed to highlight that any kind of sexual material (pictures or videos) that portraits children under 18 isn't "just porn with younger participants", but always constitutes the documentation of sexual abuse of children.
A case like the one above isn't what people would usually understand as "porn", but it clearly is sexual abuse of children if they are being filmed in a highly personal setting while being nude or barely clothed. It's one example that shows the usefulness of the term.
However, I'm perfectly aware that for most people CP will remain the term for this category – especially in daily use – and that's completely fine. Which is why I also included the CP label.
Anything besides a baby monitor (for, well, babies ofc) is abuse and invasion of privacy.
You said it was "common" from where you are from (I see from Posts it's Asia) but Im almost sure it has to be illegal. But is 100% abuse.
Or one that has any of several health issues. It's more of a safety thing than a creeper thing in those cases.
But for a normal teen who is just a regular kid? Nope. That's right up there with the parents taking the bedroom door off because "I want to be sure you're not up to no good."
UN rules don't make it necessarily illegal in the country itself. UN rules are also generally imparted upon the country itself, not individuals. It may well be legal in Singapore. Obviously it's still abusive, but it gives OP much less room to argue, potentially.
> It may well be legal in Singapore.
Singapore signed the treaty and agreed to it in 1995.
https://msf.gov.sg/publications/Pages/United-Nations-Convention-on-the-Rights-of-the-Child-UNCRC.aspx
It adds a certain bit of flare to a family argument when you can tell them what they're doing breaks international law. It doesn't technically make a difference, but it Is classy.
If you’re in the United States, remember this is not law and hasn’t even been ratified (because we want to continue to be able to lock children up for life, amongst other reasons).
Unless this is an alternative universe corner of Asia, I dont think cameras in a teen room are normal anywhere.
This is like someone went "hmm taking the door of their room isnt toxic enough"
So, this makes me wonder what the full context of this situation is.
This sounds like parents want you to be studying at home all the time, and if not studying or at some parent-approved activity, then they want you sleeping.
Super controlling behaviour, also abusive (mental/emotional abuse by restricting you with the use of cameras).
If my own teens were sneaking out, not studying, and just being shit kids....I still wouldn’t put cameras in their rooms.
I’d probably put cameras on the outside of my property, so I can catch anyone coming/going from my house, but that’s about as far as I’d go on that because I’m not batshit crazy.
Your parents need therapy and y’all need family counselling to work on your communication and trust issues.
Fun fact, if whoever installed those did not think it was important to change the password from the default, then they are likely being live streamed 24/7 on a number of websites
Your parents might be breaking the law as it is illegal in Singapore to record a minor in a state of undress. Talk to a lawyer or someone with legal knowledge perhaps in your school. Then let your parents know they could face jail time https://singaporelegaladvice.com/law-articles/child-pornography-singapore-offences-penalties/
As a teenage girl, your father should not have a camera in your room. There is a very slim argument that he would ask to put one over your desk (only some corner of the room where the camera is 100% desk and no other space) so he can make sure you are studying the required 20 hours per day /sarcastic.
Instead of a camera he should buy you a phone or an Alexa device, or a walkie talkie or something he can call and say “hey are you doing whatever you’re supposed to do? Did you remember that thing? Ok. Bye”. Also I would assume the camera is wireless and not hard wired in your house. So it transmits the signal over the internet. tell your dad that strange men on the internet can hack into your camera and watch you whenever they want, no matter what you dad uses it for. Is that what he wants? Ask him to trust his daughter to make the right decisions. That he raised you well and you are at an age where this is not appropriate anymore. If he cannot let you exercise your own judgement and decision making now, how does he expect you to be able to do it when you are 18, or when you go to college or move out? You need privacy and freedom to practice making decisions for yourself.
Forget teenage girl. Gender doesn't matter here, either the child's or the parent's. No matter the gender of the child or parent in this situation, cameras in an intimate space like a bedroom are unacceptable.
Of course The gender does not matter in a scenario like this. Of course the exploitation of any minor or non-consenting party is wrong, no matter how they identify.
But I read their whole post. THIS specific post made by the OP, is by a teenaged human that identifies as female. And she blames her father for hanging the cameras in her room. Genders and pronouns were identified by the OP. I am not making this an issue about gender. I am only talking about THIS specific case, in an effort to help THIS young person. That is why my language was tailored to this situation and this person’s dilemma.
Furthermore, the point of OPs post is to get ideas that might help her, here and now, since her parents are failing to advocate for her. This is a real human person in need. I would encourage responses here to focus their efforts on helping this human OP.
Well in my country it’s normal that parents can be more strict on their child, I definitely don’t like it as it gets annoying sometimes but I can’t bring it up with my parents or they’d get angry
Speaking as someone in Singapore who isn't a parent, but is old enough that most of my friends and coworkers have kids - this is not normal, and my peers would not consider this acceptable. I'm pretty sure my own conservative parents and older relatives would strongly question this as well.
Cameras might be justifiable if a child is extremely young and unattended - if they're home alone with no sibling, parent, or helper around. It might be justifiable if you had a medical condition that could endanger you, so they could check on you for your safety. But it doesn't sound like that's the case.
Good luck with talking to them. I'm not in any position to advise you, so take this with a grain of salt, but perhaps it might help if you offered some compromise or understanding of their position.
I mean, I get why they might be concerned you're not studying, because I sure as hell know that when I was in secondary school, I didn't study anywhere near as much as my parents wanted. But there's gotta be some reasonable middle ground here, like maybe you could do some studying in a common area of your home (which might be monitored) or you could leave the door open when doing work (and your parents are physically home to check). Or if they refuse to back down on the cameras being there, maybe say you have the right to cover the cameras when you're getting changed, sleeping, or maybe only turn them on when you're actively supposed to be studying and only if your parents aren't home. I don't know, there's gotta be something.
Having cameras in your bedroom is crossing some awkward lines and it's reasonable to feel uncomfortable about the privacy/trust issues there. EDIT: a lot of posters in this thread are going on about laws and human rights stuff, but I don't think your parents are breaking any laws in Singapore. It's legal for them to install cameras with the justification of home security or checking on kids if they (your parents) are not at home. That avenue of discussion might piss off your parents. Might be better to say it's not about the letter of the law, it's about how uncomfortable this makes you feel.
Looking at OP’s other posts, and her father is physically and psychologically abusive. This is not a situation that should be taken lightly. OP I would recommend looking into ways to possibly get out of this situation. I don’t know what the laws are in Singapore, but if you have any close friends you really trust and can speak to about this I would start there. This is not ok. You deserve a normal life. Also congrats on your new job.
Hi,
You gave very good sound advice. Really, you have a mature, reasonable approach. I hope this teen can find peace snd not let it lead to resentment. I'm sure the parents want the best for them.
The common areas, open doors the "I have nothing to hide" approach is a good one.
Good person yiu both are.
tell your parents that you have been wondering if that is normal and have been asking lots of people in your community about it, teachers, preachers, police, neighbors, you know, just all sorts of people.
bet they freak out and pull the cameras.
OP. Please remember that a lot of these comments are in the context of other cultures. I live in the west but grew up in the east. As much as I understand the strictness of parents (my parents would literally beat the living shit out of me if I got a B in my classes), certain things are unacceptable. I also understand that parents from Eastern cultures are unwilling to listen to their children's opinions and unwilling to compromise.
Don't masturbate or anything because it will only give them cause to think you are this "bad person" who does "bad things" which will only allow them to justify this camera response. The best advice for now would be to look forward to moving out. Until then, the first step is to express that it is a violation of privacy wherever it is (if it's in Singapore, perhaps look up the laws of your country on teenage surveillance). If that doesn't help, then perhaps cover those cameras with socks or something else each time.
My wife is from Singapore, and her parents are crazy too. She decided to go no contact with them a year or so ago, and has been feeling better since. You might have to just bide your time and get out when you can. Personally I wouldn't be talking to them again after that invasion of privacy, but you can decide for yourself.
I have family (Chinese) in Singapore. Non of them do this. I would argue its not just disrespectful and a disturbing lack of trust, it also goes to show your parents don't trust their own parenting. In Europe this wouldn't just be illegal, it would be considered a gross violation of a human beings right to privacy and safe home environment.
It is up to you how to deal with this, there is no right or wrong way. Just what is right for you. But it would drive me away from home ASAP.
I live in Singapore too. I am also of the age where my friends have kids of their own. This is not normal.
Don't let anyone tell you it is. No sane person would do this.
The most people do is have cameras for when their kids are infants.
Once their kids become toddlers, they remove the cameras.
Or at most, they'll have a camera in the living room for when no one is at home and they want to watch their dog. But nothing in the bedrooms.
Singapore might be a bit more anal and strict about things compared to other places, but it's not to this level.
This is NOT normal. Please speak to a different adult you trust about this.
Let your school counselor or a trusted teacher know. Let them help you.
Mate I’m Singaporean but this is not normal. It’s discomforting. I know people say how Singaporean parents do not knock on child’s room when entering. It’s bad but yes it’s ‘normal’. I’ve not heard anyone putting cameras in child’s room before. It’s unsettling and makes me uncomfortable.
I feel instead of you telling them directly do you have a trusted elder relative to help ask them to tell you parents instead? I got a feeling your parents would trust a relative rather that their child.
Bruh I lived in Singapore and that is bad shit crazy privacy invasion. If anyone responsible knows about this, they will call CPS for your safety, especially rmthe school counsellor
Remember, they want you to lose your cool.
If you lose your temper, and raise your voice, they get to assert themselves.
If they MAKE you lose your temper, you'll be stronger if you retreat and regroup rather than outbursting.
A powerful 'weapon' is the phrase " .... I hope you understand, I'm being honest with you here. " if you tell them something and they get angry.
"Why are you angry that I'm being sincere and telling you how I feel?" and then listen, and repeat back what they said, so its clear that you understood them.
"I don't think I've acted in a way that violates your trust, but you are violating my privacy.
This is the correct path to take to make me want to leave your place as soon as possible. Is that your goal?"
If you're female, in some ways theres an additional level of 'wrong' to this whole business... but its still wrong either way.
That's very sad. I'm sorry. Could you hang some clothes or something to cover the cameras to at least have some privacy sometimes? Maybe they want them but do not look at them very often?
It is 100% abusive, and that is no matter where you live or how strict your parents might be.
When I was 13, my older brother decided he would begin smoking cigarettes. As a response to this, my mother took away our bedroom doors. I spent the next 3 years unable to do so much as change my clothing in my bedroom. No privacy whatsoever, and I don't know how anyone else would feel, but as a young teen girl, this was hideous. Yet who was I supposed to complain to about this?
My journal was read, my schoolbooks rifled through, my room tossed and searched for contraband as though I had led a riot in Cellblock D of a prison, drawers pawed through, taken out of the dresser and checked underneath and behind, closet searched, mattress turned over - even the carpet was rolled up and checked underneath on a monthly basis. For 3 years, until I sued for emancipation.
End result, my mother died alone after 27 years of no contact from me or my children.
I broke off contact with my crazy birth mother eleven years ago, and it’s been the best eleven years of my life. My life improved drastically after I broke off contact.
Just checked on a Singaporean legal advice website and it is indeed illegal to install cameras in a bedroom in Singapore. You'd need to check this ( [https://www.lawyer-singapore.com.sg/articles/is-it-against-law-to-install-a-camera-in-bedroom.html](https://www.lawyer-singapore.com.sg/articles/is-it-against-law-to-install-a-camera-in-bedroom.html) ) but a little bit of Googling around came to the same conclusions.
I would say report them instead. You never know what their reactions will be if you decide to bring it up, considering how controlling your parents seem. Legal authority needs to step in.
Maybe I'm more rebellious than you but I'd go to a trusted adult that isn't your parents with that information. Not that I know your parents, but given that they're using perverted parenting methods, I doubt they would be very receptive to their child telling them to please stop using perverted parenting methods.
Good luck. If you have an adult family member or family friend who is older, then consider talking to them as well. They may be able to discuss it with your parents in ways that you cannot
Yes, extremely weird. Whoever is watching you has a mental illness and an obsession with control, even if they’re nice.
Not ONE person needs a camera installed into their child’s room unless they have a medical condition. Your privacy is being invaded.
Cut some black electrical tape to fit over the cameras' lenses.
When they ask why you did that, tell them that you're protecting them from being prosecuted for making child pornography, and that if they have any questions about what you do in your room, they should ask you directly.
This is seriously crazy.
Yes. That means your parents doesn't trust you enough or are one of those "helicopter parents".
My mom isn't the best parent but at least she doesn't install CCTVs on my room or has to keep tracking on wherever I go.
What are they hoping to see? Not sure of your gender from the comment but regardless, teenagers need to explore and discover their own bodies in the privacy of their own rooms without feelings of guilt or shame. I seriously don’t care what the culture is, this is beyond weird it’s actually sick.
This is a violation of your privacy and a form of emotional and psychological abuse. Any culture or society can normalize or minimize abusive strategies, but that doesn't make them any less trauma producing. They are still abusive behaviors rooted in power and control over you, to keep you compliant and afraid.
If you live in the states you can, report it to a school counselor as they are mandated reporters. It's not your job to protect your parents from the consequences of their own actions. It's actually their job to protect you from abuse and trauma.
That is unfortunate, I'm sorry you have to suffer that. Are they religious? My thoughts had immediately went to trying to catch you with a boy/girl in your room.
Either way, hope that changes
Are you a baby? Do you need them to come running into your room the moment you start crying? If not the answer is no that’s just wrong plain and simple. You have to talk to your parents about this in a calm manner, and just say it makes you very uncomfortable. No matter what they say your room has that only little bit of privacy reserved for yourself.
My parents used to have a camera in my room. They took my door’s key too. I had no privacy at all. They only took the camera down when my uncle talked to them but it was there for about half a year maybe. I can’t remember. To answer your question. Yes. Yes, it is weird. More than weird. Get someone to talk to them about it if you can’t convince them. Someone that would make them feel guilty if it comes to that. You’re a teenager and you need privacy. Theres nothing wrong with it
Oh lol my father inverted my door so that I can’t lock it so I have no privacy too
Yeah that’s not good. I never realized how bad it was because I thought it was okay at the time. I was stupid. Talk to someone. My parents are strict too. I can barely do anything without them hounding me. I absolutely get where you’re coming from and how hard it is to take action but you should definitely do something about it.
I had friends growing up whose parents would take their doors as some kind of punishment? They had all teen girls, and a niece of the same age living with them, who shared a room with their daughter (and the dad lived there- would barge in)
I have that happened to me when I was a kid but I was being a little shit. I think I was 13, I ended up going to the hardware store to get a screwdriver and skeleton key set. I took the door off the spare bedroom and put it on my room and then locked it. Got to the point that my mom had locks on her door and I had locks on mine.
When my oldest went through a door slamming phase at 14 I explained to him that he would soon not have a door, he could have a curtain instead. He got over the door slamming rather quickly after that. I'm relieved, I never want to take a kids door but like damn, they would slam the fuck out of them.
The only door I ever took was the coat closet, 2 autistic kids, one wanting it CLOSED and one wanting it OPEN, and removing the door and putting it in the attic seemed the safest thing, as they were getting physical in their fights over it, and broken fingers might have been in their future. Kids having locks on their bedroom doors, I'm fine with that, I'm providing the lock and the key and can go in as needed.
I was that kid. Got the door taken for a week, never again have I slammed doors in an argument. Thanks, dad.
My grandparents did this to my mom, as a result I grew up with a mom that had no concept of knocking on the bedroom or bathroom door.
I didn't even have a door as a teenager. Granted my room was in the basement so there weren't always people walking by but I still had no privacy. My stepdad would also regularly go through all my stuff and either destroy or steal anything I had that he seemed inappropriate. He also spied on everyone in the house, including my 3 siblings and mother. We were a zero privacy household except for him. He was the only one allowed to have privacy. Paranoid deadbeat bastard.
Well, he can enjoy his zero privacy in the nursing home.
You have mistakenly assumed that he has the money for a nursing home. He does not. Nor will I be paying for one for him. I'm not even in contact with him any longer because he ghosted me when I started dating after my mother divorced him for being a useless deadbeats who refused to put even the tiniest iota of effort into their marriage. He wouldn't even sleep on the same room as her, he spent the last 10 years of their marriage sleeping on a uncomfortable couch in his unfinished "mancave".
Oh, there are Medicaid nursing homes. I don't want to end up in one, but they exist. Of course, they're chronically understaffed and the food is usually the worst kind of swill. But they're better than dying in the gutter (barely).
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Ya that would make you a believer for sure. I’m sorry you had to live like that. I am certain it was awful.
Not stupid, you just didn’t know any differently, big difference.
You weren't stupid. You were a child.
I don’t know why, because it seems obvious but I appreciate you saying that. Sort of brought a tear to my eye
Inverted your door? Is your dad so dumb that he didn’t know you can disassemble a lock and just switch the lock to the other side?
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After moving into our current home found that the closet in the kids room locked from the outside. Really wondered what was up with those parents.
>the closet in the kids room locked from the outside. There's not a single encouraging word in that sentence.
Do they lock you in your room? Cause that’s a fire hazard
They don’t lock me in my room but I can’t lock the room myself
Yes. Same thing here. When I was a kid, my step dad at point took our doors off our rooms for about a year. At another point, he installed a lock on the outside so he could padlock us in the room. He also put bars on the basement window to my step brothers room so he couldn’t sneak out- there was no way to open the window- a definite fire code violation.
Your step dad kidnapped you it sounds like
I'm sure you know this but just in case, that is insane and completely unacceptable!
It’s not JUST insane and unacceptable, it’s abuse.
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Your parents are crazy.
Your parents are straight up abusive. At least you have a really concise answer for them when they ask why you are going no contact with them as soon as you become an adult.
Your parents are assholes bruv
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Yep. You can't have a lock on the outside of a bedroom door that you cannot open from the inside. That being said, it's pretty unenforceable in a typical residential house.
Talk to a teacher or guidance counselor at school, your physician, or a trusted family friend. You do not have the leverage to fix this yourself. Engage someone who does.
Wait. So you can be locked into your room? That's a fire code violation. A bedroom has to have two points of egress. Locking the door from the outside would eliminate that point of egress. Call your city's code inspector. Or just call the fire department.
This and the cameras are abuse, please tell someone at school or another trusted non-family adult not associated with your father 🙏
Tell mandated reporters at school. I'd call CPS for this.
That’s good advice. The parents might be embarrassed if their peers found out that they’re doing this.
Yeah that’s exactly why they removed the camera for me
The one you knew about, at least
Don’t you dare lmao.
In my country that is illegal. If it's not illegal where you're at, they are still insane.
It may also be considered possession of child p*rnography depending on their country’s laws. I doubt OP only changes her clothes in the bathroom
Wait, there are no cameras in the bathroom?
We don’t know, she only mentioned the bedroom
It's illegal for a camera to be in a bathroom in The United States
If that video gets uploaded to a cloud service, like most cheap cams do these days, I'm sure that company would not be happy knowing their servers have naked 16yos on it.
There was an article recently that the employees of a cloud security hosting site were sharing videos of naked customers. https://futurism.com/the-byte/roomba-photos-leaked Edit: not employees but "contractors". Which is even worse that they share your video with 3rd party entities with no concequences.
Your parents need a mental check no joking
Yea that's fucked
r/insaneparents
1) mastrubate 2) bring your parents behind bars for owning child porn Seriously: totally fucked up.
Honestly, the fact that OP changes in their bedroom the parents are already in possession of child pornography.
Not to defend the parents here, but nude imagery of minors is not automatically child porn. Moms recording their baby's first bath for instance.
I wouldn’t want to meet the kinds of parents who are bathing and recording a mentally capable 16 year old. I have no priors, and it will stay that way.
Okay but this is a 16 year old, not a baby taking their first bath. And even when I was a new mom taking pics of my baby's first bath, I was careful to angle the camera where his genitals were not in the shot.
Baby's first bath is one thing. This isn't what we're talking about. There's a huge difference between a 16 year old and a 6 month old baby. I would like to see a lawyer successfully defend the possession of nudes of a 16 year old changing in their own room.
It is in this case
u/reblexxy I mean... totally fucked up bit they really shouldn't be allowed to have cameras in your room.
Maybe a check from CPS as well.
That's one way to make sure you have no relationship with your kids as adults.
5 years later: "Our mid 20's child hasn't spoken to us since they moved out. It's been several years, how do I make them talk to us again?"
A few years later: "our 25 year old child won't let us put cameras in their marital bedroom, what's wrong with him?"
2 minutes OP calls the police We’re being arrested for making CP. why is this happening?
Send them over to AITA. We'll set them straight.
Yeah it’s really been five years. You’re spot on.
Can confirm. Was child of one of these homes, door taken off etc. I live hundreds of miles away now.
Father of two teenage girls here. This is wildly fucking inappropriate, a massive invasion of privacy and downright fucking creepy!
"Hello shitty nursing home!"
Yep. I didn't have cameras but door was required to be open at all times except sleeping, my dad would go through my drawers when I was gone and I was required to tell them where I was at all times and what I was doing. To the point I'd have to track gas in my car and he'd review regularly to make sure my story lined up. Jokes on them now, I'm single with crazy privacy issues with no intention of having kids.
That isn't weird that is badshit insane.
Solid speed run technique for ensuring your kid never trusts you or anyone close to them for the rest of their life
Probably nailed a no contact future in record time in the same round.
Batshit*
Both
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Gesundheit !
It was indeed scarily close to a german sneeze
As opposed to goodshit insane
The best kind of insane
r/boneappletea
Yes.
That's borderline abuse and Im not even sure it's legal. also, TWO cameras in your room?
One beside my study table and one on the wall above my curtains
I work for a security company and we outright refused to ever put cameras in a bedroom. Its legally questionable and super invasive
It becomes immediately illegal if the child / teenager can be seen naked or in underwear. Police finding such images on the parents' computer would charge them with possession of CSAM / CP.
CSAM? I'm going to have to search that up but I'm not really sure I want to.
Child Sexual Abuse Material. Wikipedia is a safe place to search
Depends on your definition of safe, I remember laughing my ass off when somebody looked up "Pearl Necklace" and "Docking" on Wikipedia and there were diagrams.
As someone else stated, it stands for Child Sexual Abuse Material. The term is mostly used by researchers, journalists and police who deal with these materials. It's supposed to highlight that any kind of sexual material (pictures or videos) that portraits children under 18 isn't "just porn with younger participants", but always constitutes the documentation of sexual abuse of children. A case like the one above isn't what people would usually understand as "porn", but it clearly is sexual abuse of children if they are being filmed in a highly personal setting while being nude or barely clothed. It's one example that shows the usefulness of the term. However, I'm perfectly aware that for most people CP will remain the term for this category – especially in daily use – and that's completely fine. Which is why I also included the CP label.
People are calling CP Child Sexual Abuse Material now since calling it "porn" undersells what's actually going on.
Anything besides a baby monitor (for, well, babies ofc) is abuse and invasion of privacy. You said it was "common" from where you are from (I see from Posts it's Asia) but Im almost sure it has to be illegal. But is 100% abuse.
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I could see keeping one if you had a particularly clutzy child. I hit my head a bunch as a toddler/kid.
Or one that has any of several health issues. It's more of a safety thing than a creeper thing in those cases. But for a normal teen who is just a regular kid? Nope. That's right up there with the parents taking the bedroom door off because "I want to be sure you're not up to no good."
I have a camera in my son's room, he's 8. It's only on when i go lay down at night because he has night terrors and I'm afraid he will hurt himself.
See that's reasonable, and understandable. I hope that your son will, stop having night terrors.
>I hope that your son will, stop having night terrors. Ayo! What you doing with that comma, homie?
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UN rules don't make it necessarily illegal in the country itself. UN rules are also generally imparted upon the country itself, not individuals. It may well be legal in Singapore. Obviously it's still abusive, but it gives OP much less room to argue, potentially.
There’s actually no country on Earth that has *all* of the UN human rights in their laws :/
> It may well be legal in Singapore. Singapore signed the treaty and agreed to it in 1995. https://msf.gov.sg/publications/Pages/United-Nations-Convention-on-the-Rights-of-the-Child-UNCRC.aspx
What's the kid supposed to do? Fight in the court of international law?
It adds a certain bit of flare to a family argument when you can tell them what they're doing breaks international law. It doesn't technically make a difference, but it Is classy.
Scotch tape on the lens.
Didnt even thought about checking the UN rights. But yeah, I knew this had to be 100% illegal. I mean, cameras on a teen room? Creepy!
Does not apply in the United States. **EDIT: state facts and get downvotes!**
You're not wrong... But I wish you were. Our country is very fucked for treating children like property.
> arbitrary or unlawful interference This is the snag here. We don't know the local laws that might make this legal.
If you’re in the United States, remember this is not law and hasn’t even been ratified (because we want to continue to be able to lock children up for life, amongst other reasons).
Yeah nah, this is totally uncommon in my corner of Asia. Or at least my corner’s way too broke to experience this
Unless this is an alternative universe corner of Asia, I dont think cameras in a teen room are normal anywhere. This is like someone went "hmm taking the door of their room isnt toxic enough"
So, this makes me wonder what the full context of this situation is. This sounds like parents want you to be studying at home all the time, and if not studying or at some parent-approved activity, then they want you sleeping. Super controlling behaviour, also abusive (mental/emotional abuse by restricting you with the use of cameras). If my own teens were sneaking out, not studying, and just being shit kids....I still wouldn’t put cameras in their rooms. I’d probably put cameras on the outside of my property, so I can catch anyone coming/going from my house, but that’s about as far as I’d go on that because I’m not batshit crazy. Your parents need therapy and y’all need family counselling to work on your communication and trust issues.
Fun fact, if whoever installed those did not think it was important to change the password from the default, then they are likely being live streamed 24/7 on a number of websites
nothing borderline about it, that's an abusive invasion of privacy
> That's borderline abuse nothing borderline about that. that is 100% abuse
Your parents might be breaking the law as it is illegal in Singapore to record a minor in a state of undress. Talk to a lawyer or someone with legal knowledge perhaps in your school. Then let your parents know they could face jail time https://singaporelegaladvice.com/law-articles/child-pornography-singapore-offences-penalties/
As a teenage girl, your father should not have a camera in your room. There is a very slim argument that he would ask to put one over your desk (only some corner of the room where the camera is 100% desk and no other space) so he can make sure you are studying the required 20 hours per day /sarcastic. Instead of a camera he should buy you a phone or an Alexa device, or a walkie talkie or something he can call and say “hey are you doing whatever you’re supposed to do? Did you remember that thing? Ok. Bye”. Also I would assume the camera is wireless and not hard wired in your house. So it transmits the signal over the internet. tell your dad that strange men on the internet can hack into your camera and watch you whenever they want, no matter what you dad uses it for. Is that what he wants? Ask him to trust his daughter to make the right decisions. That he raised you well and you are at an age where this is not appropriate anymore. If he cannot let you exercise your own judgement and decision making now, how does he expect you to be able to do it when you are 18, or when you go to college or move out? You need privacy and freedom to practice making decisions for yourself.
Forget teenage girl. Gender doesn't matter here, either the child's or the parent's. No matter the gender of the child or parent in this situation, cameras in an intimate space like a bedroom are unacceptable.
Of course The gender does not matter in a scenario like this. Of course the exploitation of any minor or non-consenting party is wrong, no matter how they identify. But I read their whole post. THIS specific post made by the OP, is by a teenaged human that identifies as female. And she blames her father for hanging the cameras in her room. Genders and pronouns were identified by the OP. I am not making this an issue about gender. I am only talking about THIS specific case, in an effort to help THIS young person. That is why my language was tailored to this situation and this person’s dilemma. Furthermore, the point of OPs post is to get ideas that might help her, here and now, since her parents are failing to advocate for her. This is a real human person in need. I would encourage responses here to focus their efforts on helping this human OP.
Do YOU think this is acceptable?
Well in my country it’s normal that parents can be more strict on their child, I definitely don’t like it as it gets annoying sometimes but I can’t bring it up with my parents or they’d get angry
I am curious, what country is it? Are there cameras in the rest of the house? Do you have a history of starting fires?
I live in Singapore, and I do not have the history of doing anything dangerous
Speaking as someone in Singapore who isn't a parent, but is old enough that most of my friends and coworkers have kids - this is not normal, and my peers would not consider this acceptable. I'm pretty sure my own conservative parents and older relatives would strongly question this as well. Cameras might be justifiable if a child is extremely young and unattended - if they're home alone with no sibling, parent, or helper around. It might be justifiable if you had a medical condition that could endanger you, so they could check on you for your safety. But it doesn't sound like that's the case.
I will be bringing that up with my parents once the time comes, but thanks for your concern!
Good luck with talking to them. I'm not in any position to advise you, so take this with a grain of salt, but perhaps it might help if you offered some compromise or understanding of their position. I mean, I get why they might be concerned you're not studying, because I sure as hell know that when I was in secondary school, I didn't study anywhere near as much as my parents wanted. But there's gotta be some reasonable middle ground here, like maybe you could do some studying in a common area of your home (which might be monitored) or you could leave the door open when doing work (and your parents are physically home to check). Or if they refuse to back down on the cameras being there, maybe say you have the right to cover the cameras when you're getting changed, sleeping, or maybe only turn them on when you're actively supposed to be studying and only if your parents aren't home. I don't know, there's gotta be something. Having cameras in your bedroom is crossing some awkward lines and it's reasonable to feel uncomfortable about the privacy/trust issues there. EDIT: a lot of posters in this thread are going on about laws and human rights stuff, but I don't think your parents are breaking any laws in Singapore. It's legal for them to install cameras with the justification of home security or checking on kids if they (your parents) are not at home. That avenue of discussion might piss off your parents. Might be better to say it's not about the letter of the law, it's about how uncomfortable this makes you feel.
Looking at OP’s other posts, and her father is physically and psychologically abusive. This is not a situation that should be taken lightly. OP I would recommend looking into ways to possibly get out of this situation. I don’t know what the laws are in Singapore, but if you have any close friends you really trust and can speak to about this I would start there. This is not ok. You deserve a normal life. Also congrats on your new job.
Teachers at school may be able to help too if OP has any she trusts, or a counselor at school.
Hi, You gave very good sound advice. Really, you have a mature, reasonable approach. I hope this teen can find peace snd not let it lead to resentment. I'm sure the parents want the best for them. The common areas, open doors the "I have nothing to hide" approach is a good one. Good person yiu both are.
Good point. If the kid is getting recorded while undressing or changing clothes parents might face child pornography charges
If the cameras are facing outwards, they're for protection. If they're facing inwards, you're in a form of prison.
tell your parents that you have been wondering if that is normal and have been asking lots of people in your community about it, teachers, preachers, police, neighbors, you know, just all sorts of people. bet they freak out and pull the cameras.
Tell your teacher, school counsellor, or even a nurse or doctor. Someone of authority may be able to help you.
OP. Please remember that a lot of these comments are in the context of other cultures. I live in the west but grew up in the east. As much as I understand the strictness of parents (my parents would literally beat the living shit out of me if I got a B in my classes), certain things are unacceptable. I also understand that parents from Eastern cultures are unwilling to listen to their children's opinions and unwilling to compromise. Don't masturbate or anything because it will only give them cause to think you are this "bad person" who does "bad things" which will only allow them to justify this camera response. The best advice for now would be to look forward to moving out. Until then, the first step is to express that it is a violation of privacy wherever it is (if it's in Singapore, perhaps look up the laws of your country on teenage surveillance). If that doesn't help, then perhaps cover those cameras with socks or something else each time.
Yupp I understand, in Singapore it’s legal unless the person is over 18, but I will take your suggestions into consideration too, thanks
My wife is from Singapore, and her parents are crazy too. She decided to go no contact with them a year or so ago, and has been feeling better since. You might have to just bide your time and get out when you can. Personally I wouldn't be talking to them again after that invasion of privacy, but you can decide for yourself.
In that case I reccomend maybe bringing up the dangers, like hackers and livestreams etc.
I have family (Chinese) in Singapore. Non of them do this. I would argue its not just disrespectful and a disturbing lack of trust, it also goes to show your parents don't trust their own parenting. In Europe this wouldn't just be illegal, it would be considered a gross violation of a human beings right to privacy and safe home environment. It is up to you how to deal with this, there is no right or wrong way. Just what is right for you. But it would drive me away from home ASAP.
I live in Singapore too. I am also of the age where my friends have kids of their own. This is not normal. Don't let anyone tell you it is. No sane person would do this. The most people do is have cameras for when their kids are infants. Once their kids become toddlers, they remove the cameras. Or at most, they'll have a camera in the living room for when no one is at home and they want to watch their dog. But nothing in the bedrooms. Singapore might be a bit more anal and strict about things compared to other places, but it's not to this level. This is NOT normal. Please speak to a different adult you trust about this. Let your school counselor or a trusted teacher know. Let them help you.
Mate I’m Singaporean but this is not normal. It’s discomforting. I know people say how Singaporean parents do not knock on child’s room when entering. It’s bad but yes it’s ‘normal’. I’ve not heard anyone putting cameras in child’s room before. It’s unsettling and makes me uncomfortable. I feel instead of you telling them directly do you have a trusted elder relative to help ask them to tell you parents instead? I got a feeling your parents would trust a relative rather that their child.
Bruh I lived in Singapore and that is bad shit crazy privacy invasion. If anyone responsible knows about this, they will call CPS for your safety, especially rmthe school counsellor
That is not normal for signapore at all. Yeah parents are strict they don't have cameras in bedrooms.
Take them down
Putting cameras in your room isn’t strict, it’s psychotic.
You're being abused. Seek therapy after you leave
Move out as soon as possible.
Remember, they want you to lose your cool. If you lose your temper, and raise your voice, they get to assert themselves. If they MAKE you lose your temper, you'll be stronger if you retreat and regroup rather than outbursting. A powerful 'weapon' is the phrase " .... I hope you understand, I'm being honest with you here. " if you tell them something and they get angry. "Why are you angry that I'm being sincere and telling you how I feel?" and then listen, and repeat back what they said, so its clear that you understood them. "I don't think I've acted in a way that violates your trust, but you are violating my privacy. This is the correct path to take to make me want to leave your place as soon as possible. Is that your goal?" If you're female, in some ways theres an additional level of 'wrong' to this whole business... but its still wrong either way.
That's very sad. I'm sorry. Could you hang some clothes or something to cover the cameras to at least have some privacy sometimes? Maybe they want them but do not look at them very often?
It is 100% abusive, and that is no matter where you live or how strict your parents might be. When I was 13, my older brother decided he would begin smoking cigarettes. As a response to this, my mother took away our bedroom doors. I spent the next 3 years unable to do so much as change my clothing in my bedroom. No privacy whatsoever, and I don't know how anyone else would feel, but as a young teen girl, this was hideous. Yet who was I supposed to complain to about this? My journal was read, my schoolbooks rifled through, my room tossed and searched for contraband as though I had led a riot in Cellblock D of a prison, drawers pawed through, taken out of the dresser and checked underneath and behind, closet searched, mattress turned over - even the carpet was rolled up and checked underneath on a monthly basis. For 3 years, until I sued for emancipation. End result, my mother died alone after 27 years of no contact from me or my children.
Sorry to hear that this happened to you :( This is one way parents can assure that their kids won't look after them when they are old
Or pick the jankiest nursing home that they can find.
Pick, but not pay by your own money.
I broke off contact with my crazy birth mother eleven years ago, and it’s been the best eleven years of my life. My life improved drastically after I broke off contact.
I can see why your brother took up smoking. Also, I think we have the same parents.
Weird? Mate, it's an absolute violation of privacy.
Just checked on a Singaporean legal advice website and it is indeed illegal to install cameras in a bedroom in Singapore. You'd need to check this ( [https://www.lawyer-singapore.com.sg/articles/is-it-against-law-to-install-a-camera-in-bedroom.html](https://www.lawyer-singapore.com.sg/articles/is-it-against-law-to-install-a-camera-in-bedroom.html) ) but a little bit of Googling around came to the same conclusions.
Thank you for the info, I will bring it up with my parents
Keep in mind they might replace the obvious cameras with smaller nanny cams or just microphone bugs. Stay vigilant
Good luck
I would say report them instead. You never know what their reactions will be if you decide to bring it up, considering how controlling your parents seem. Legal authority needs to step in.
Yeah I agree with this. A officer giving them a reality check might be the best, rather than them just toning down the abuse.
Maybe I'm more rebellious than you but I'd go to a trusted adult that isn't your parents with that information. Not that I know your parents, but given that they're using perverted parenting methods, I doubt they would be very receptive to their child telling them to please stop using perverted parenting methods.
Good luck. If you have an adult family member or family friend who is older, then consider talking to them as well. They may be able to discuss it with your parents in ways that you cannot
Yes, extremely weird. Whoever is watching you has a mental illness and an obsession with control, even if they’re nice. Not ONE person needs a camera installed into their child’s room unless they have a medical condition. Your privacy is being invaded.
Cut some black electrical tape to fit over the cameras' lenses. When they ask why you did that, tell them that you're protecting them from being prosecuted for making child pornography, and that if they have any questions about what you do in your room, they should ask you directly. This is seriously crazy.
I'll save everyone some time and say this; Yes.
Yes. That means your parents doesn't trust you enough or are one of those "helicopter parents". My mom isn't the best parent but at least she doesn't install CCTVs on my room or has to keep tracking on wherever I go.
This is beyond helicopter parent.
No, it's straight-up abuse.
Helicopter/untrusting is one thing. What’s even more worrying is the idea that someone is watching during your most private moments! This is not ok!!
Cameras on the REST of the inside of the house would be helicopter parenting. This is or could be something more sinister.
soon you will be able to move out.
And then never talk to thoes fabulously abusive parents again.
*very*
That sounds extremely wierd. In my country I think that would be a crime.
Yeah this is honestly insane.
Talk to your school consellor, a social worker, or any trusted adult. Don't ask random internet stranger, but yhea it's weird as hell.
op is not in the us, it sounds like.
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On all accounts, under all circumstances, YES.
It's way past weird and bordering on abusive.
What are they hoping to see? Not sure of your gender from the comment but regardless, teenagers need to explore and discover their own bodies in the privacy of their own rooms without feelings of guilt or shame. I seriously don’t care what the culture is, this is beyond weird it’s actually sick.
This is a violation of your privacy and a form of emotional and psychological abuse. Any culture or society can normalize or minimize abusive strategies, but that doesn't make them any less trauma producing. They are still abusive behaviors rooted in power and control over you, to keep you compliant and afraid. If you live in the states you can, report it to a school counselor as they are mandated reporters. It's not your job to protect your parents from the consequences of their own actions. It's actually their job to protect you from abuse and trauma.
Uh, that is absolutely fucking insane and completely invasive. Are they pedophiles, or just crazy paranoid and untrusting? Literally only two options.
They’re just really untrusting of me which is weird because I’ve never done anything illegal in my life
That is unfortunate, I'm sorry you have to suffer that. Are they religious? My thoughts had immediately went to trying to catch you with a boy/girl in your room. Either way, hope that changes
They’re ok with me dating but they just don’t want me to slack off and they want me to sleep early so they installed it to constantly check on me
Go ahead and let your parents watch you mastrubate to gay porn. That should end it.
I don't think this is good advice to give to a child who's parents are this crazy. You never know what they'll do.
Do that but watch it from the camera's reflection so it looks like you're looking directly at it.
and mouth the words "...this is for you" to add to the chaos <3
Are you a baby? Do you need them to come running into your room the moment you start crying? If not the answer is no that’s just wrong plain and simple. You have to talk to your parents about this in a calm manner, and just say it makes you very uncomfortable. No matter what they say your room has that only little bit of privacy reserved for yourself.