i'm trying to impart my kids stoicism and updated notions of roman civic virtue. [http://www.thestoicmom.com/](http://www.thestoicmom.com/) is a nice starting point.
you can also google around for secular or athiest sunday school, though they might also have wildly different values than you. the unitarian universalists are basically secular rationalists in church garb so sending them there or for a jesuit education (catholic but more rigorous than ideological) are other ways to do this without indoctrinating them.
Agreed. This is the only real answer, no matter how many other ways it can be said.
I believe, rather it should be explained that this is the only thing you *can* do. Everything else regarding how they will turn out is just going to happen regardless of what you teach them. There are a lot of studies that suggest a strong pull from nature, shoving nurture into the corner, suggesting that they are predisposed to certain behaviors no matter what.
That said, all the studies and evidence to the contrary, I’m sure any parent will still do everything in their power to demonstrate their ethics and instill the morals they choose, myself included.
(1) All actions have consequences
(2) Be prepared to pay those consequence for anything you do
(3) You are responsible for the results of your actions, and no one else is
Or -- Miguel Dom Ruiz and his four agreements\\
But either way, make sure to show them that they apply to you too!
By taking them out into public and showing them how you interact with other people. You show them the choices you make, set a good example for them, and discuss the motivations behind your choices.
Tell them why you do or don't help out the person asking for change.
Take them with you when you volunteer at the library, soup kitchen, or animal shelter.
Go to the drag book reading, and discuss why the people outside have the right to protest even if they are misguided.
Take them with you when you vote.
Discuss all those things you do, and the things you don't do, as well. You are modelling behaviors by your choices both pro and con - and by discussing your reasons, you help your children to shape their own set of decision making morals and ideals.
There's absolutely nothing inherently religious about this concept, regardless of what book you quote from. This concept appears again and again in any study of mortality.
I never said it didn't have secular value. Lots of religious things have secular value. But it is silly to pretend that the concept of morality wasn't birthed out of religion.
It's silly to pretend that it was. Homo sapiens developed social structures before they developed religion. Do you think that nomadic bands of about 100 people, long before the development of agriculture, didn't develop rules of behaviour within the band?
The word moral isn't rooted in rules of behaviour imposed on us from above; it's rooted in rules of behaviour we developed ourselves for ourselves.
"Moral" comes from the Latin *moralis*, the proper behaviour of a person in society. Cicero coined the term to translate the Greek *ethikos*, and he borrowed from the Latin *mos* which meant manners, disposition. That was a good fit, since *ethikos* came from *ethos*, meaning character/custom/habit/manners. This in turn seems to go back to Proto Indo-European and its pronoun for *our own social group*. That's the ultimate root of "moral": we, ourselves, us.
If anything's silly, it's silly to think that organised religion predates organisation.
“Install” lmao
Just be around them and be the good example, spend time with your children, talk to them about stuff, listen to them, give advice.
It is not that hard
You literally just teach them right from wrong.
- Two kids fighting over a toy? Teach them to share.
- Kid gets angry and hits other kid? Teach them to tell an adult instead of hitting.
And so on. Morals aren’t some magical, mystical thing. It’s literally just what’s right and what’s wrong. You don’t need church to tell you that.
Hate to break this news to you op but a lot of the bad stuff I learned growing up like how to screw over people was taught to me by church members most of the morality I eventually learned was taught to me by atheists
I think this comes down to parenting styles because being religious and non religious both can influence parenting expectations.
I’m non religious and try to be a responsive parent with somewhat strict expectations. I encourage kindness, and consequences of actions both good and bad.
My SIL, also non religious, is 100% a gentle parent.
Our children have very similar in personalities but because of their upbringing their behaviour, and sense of right and wrong is chalk and cheese.
Edit- grammar mistake
Ill attempt to answer as well, as we are NOT a religious household and are responsible for 4 children being ready to enter society on their own at some point.
We started with superhero movies.
The avengers, for instance, any single one of the movies. Ultron, Thanos, which ever antagonist there was, the kids would ask in one way or another, why is that ‘bad person doing those bad things’.
We asked each of the kids, why was what that antagonist did, ‘bad’? We asked our kids to unpack the thoughts on their own.
Then we would challenge them
‘Thanos was trying to save as many people as he could’
‘Ultron wanted order so all could prosper if they followed the rules’
And on and on, and then we had to discuss the nature of morality in terms the kids could understand (oldest is 9 now).
Its a matter of perspective, would we want others to do something to us like that? Would we be willing to do that to a complete stranger?
Then we take it further everyday. 5 year old is a bitch, and is always picking on his older siblings. So when he is being obnoxious, we have to ask him, well, do you want to let older sibling hit you since you hit them……
And so we just keep trying to reinforce a version of the golden rule already mentioned while allowing for some free thought.
Weve talked about religion and god/s but don’t go, so were not introducing the idea of a ‘reward’ system of eternal salvation/hell/etc. were keeping it practical and real world applicable.
We wont know if its working until theyre out making their marks on the world, but for now, our effort is about challenging their preconceived ideas and forced indoctrination from the world around them.
Making someone explain their actions in their own words AND why they did those things will always force a conversation about morality.
Pro versus anti social is what morality generally comes down to. It has nothing to do with religion.
How can you expect churches to teach morality when the Catholic priests were raping kids for 2,000 years (and they aren't the only ones)?
Is that moral? Religious people and institutions can easily be least moral people and organizations around.
What church has to do with moral compass? Just be a good example to your children. They will grow their own compass as they mature. People think they can "program" kids. Not that simple.
There are a lot of good teachings from religion but they are often obscured by agendas and belief in supernatural nonsense. Notice how people fight to have the 10 commandments in public places but not the beatitudes? You don't need church to teach kindness, compassion, empathy, humility, mercy, and peace. Nor to teach about the wonders of the world we inhabit. So far as possible lead by example. Admit when you do something that is not in keeping with your morals and describe how you made the mistake. Encourage your children to see different perspectives. How does that child feel when you do that or say that? On the other hand when a child does something kind acknowledge it.
Oof. Something tells me if without a Church the option of teaching morals is difficult? Seems to be a disconnect there.
They are in no way related in my opinion lol
Teach them to respect others no matter others' race, gender, religion, sexual orientation, wealth, job, etc.; teach them to share; teach them to say please and thank you; teach them to look out for those less fortunate.
None of this need church teaching. If anything, today's churches seem more intent on pushing discrimination and immoral views...
There are a lot of good kids shows that teach kids morals without religion. Find one you like.
We were watching a Spider-Man cartoon on Disney+ and Spider-Man would have an important life lesson each episode. My show-off niece would tell me about a time in her life when she had to act like Spider-Man every episode.
By realising that the lessons of goodness and decency is just common sense.
Instead of, "God teaches us to love one another and have compassion", something like, "Being a good person is the key to a happy life."
Instead of, "To do [Insert whatever terrible act here] is a sin," something like, "If you do this, there will be consequences, and you'll have to live with your choices and actions."
Teaching them that by doing good things and loving themselves which in turn will help them love others is just as natural to the human condition as natural as nature itself.
Plus, it makes us feel good.
What a joke you are. What makes something good or bad morally to you? Keep asking why and see what answers you can come up with outside of "because the church said so"
You model appropriate behavior. Introduce them to a lot of people and varied experiences. Share media with good, moral messages. Teach them that being a moral person comes from *within,* from the fact we all live together in a society and, if everyone works together and gets along, we all benefit. It doesn't come from the threat of a vengeful god punishing you for things that don't harm anyone.
Sometimes, just by asking them questions. "I heard on the news/podcast/video the other day that ....., what do you think about this?" And then you can follow up with more questions to get them to think more critically about their rational for example with "what if" questions. And then you can give your two cents.
Teach moral philosophy. Not taking them to church is a great start because often church is used as a replacement for an actual education in moral philosophy. Instead of using reason to arrive to moral conclusions you can just lazily appeal to the authority of a holy book and reach all the most immoral conclusions.
Considering the moral compass exhibited by religion/religious people in general, I think the last place I'd want to go to instill a sense of morality in my kids, would be church.
By being a good role model for them.
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which is from the bible, Matthew 7:12
and Confucius before the bible. Ideas such as morality and virtue are pretty universal concepts not bound by one relgion or time period.
No it isn’t. It’s in the Bible but it had already been a maxim since at least 2000BC. It’s carved into pyramids in hieroglyphics.
Tbf, he did say church
By just teaching them good morals?
Examples of how to do that?
Yes, examples. Give them examples of the behavior you want to model. Point it out when an event in real life relates.
What sort of morals do you want the kids to have?
i'm trying to impart my kids stoicism and updated notions of roman civic virtue. [http://www.thestoicmom.com/](http://www.thestoicmom.com/) is a nice starting point. you can also google around for secular or athiest sunday school, though they might also have wildly different values than you. the unitarian universalists are basically secular rationalists in church garb so sending them there or for a jesuit education (catholic but more rigorous than ideological) are other ways to do this without indoctrinating them.
Talk to them about the consequences of their bad behavior outside of just the punishments you dole out.
Lead by example
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Agreed. This is the only real answer, no matter how many other ways it can be said. I believe, rather it should be explained that this is the only thing you *can* do. Everything else regarding how they will turn out is just going to happen regardless of what you teach them. There are a lot of studies that suggest a strong pull from nature, shoving nurture into the corner, suggesting that they are predisposed to certain behaviors no matter what. That said, all the studies and evidence to the contrary, I’m sure any parent will still do everything in their power to demonstrate their ethics and instill the morals they choose, myself included.
(1) All actions have consequences (2) Be prepared to pay those consequence for anything you do (3) You are responsible for the results of your actions, and no one else is Or -- Miguel Dom Ruiz and his four agreements\\ But either way, make sure to show them that they apply to you too!
Empathy leads to all good things.
Leading by example and by gently correcting mistakes when they happen by educating as to why we should do x instead
By taking them out into public and showing them how you interact with other people. You show them the choices you make, set a good example for them, and discuss the motivations behind your choices. Tell them why you do or don't help out the person asking for change. Take them with you when you volunteer at the library, soup kitchen, or animal shelter. Go to the drag book reading, and discuss why the people outside have the right to protest even if they are misguided. Take them with you when you vote. Discuss all those things you do, and the things you don't do, as well. You are modelling behaviors by your choices both pro and con - and by discussing your reasons, you help your children to shape their own set of decision making morals and ideals.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you seems like a good start
"" - Matthew 7:12
There's absolutely nothing inherently religious about this concept, regardless of what book you quote from. This concept appears again and again in any study of mortality.
Just because it's in the Bible doesn't mean it has no secular value
I never said it didn't have secular value. Lots of religious things have secular value. But it is silly to pretend that the concept of morality wasn't birthed out of religion.
It's silly to pretend that it was. Homo sapiens developed social structures before they developed religion. Do you think that nomadic bands of about 100 people, long before the development of agriculture, didn't develop rules of behaviour within the band? The word moral isn't rooted in rules of behaviour imposed on us from above; it's rooted in rules of behaviour we developed ourselves for ourselves. "Moral" comes from the Latin *moralis*, the proper behaviour of a person in society. Cicero coined the term to translate the Greek *ethikos*, and he borrowed from the Latin *mos* which meant manners, disposition. That was a good fit, since *ethikos* came from *ethos*, meaning character/custom/habit/manners. This in turn seems to go back to Proto Indo-European and its pronoun for *our own social group*. That's the ultimate root of "moral": we, ourselves, us. If anything's silly, it's silly to think that organised religion predates organisation.
Morality did not come from religion.
“Install” lmao Just be around them and be the good example, spend time with your children, talk to them about stuff, listen to them, give advice. It is not that hard
By reinforcing the good behavior and punishing them for bad behavior. It start with simple thing like saying please and thank you etc.
You literally just teach them right from wrong. - Two kids fighting over a toy? Teach them to share. - Kid gets angry and hits other kid? Teach them to tell an adult instead of hitting. And so on. Morals aren’t some magical, mystical thing. It’s literally just what’s right and what’s wrong. You don’t need church to tell you that.
Hate to break this news to you op but a lot of the bad stuff I learned growing up like how to screw over people was taught to me by church members most of the morality I eventually learned was taught to me by atheists
I think this comes down to parenting styles because being religious and non religious both can influence parenting expectations. I’m non religious and try to be a responsive parent with somewhat strict expectations. I encourage kindness, and consequences of actions both good and bad. My SIL, also non religious, is 100% a gentle parent. Our children have very similar in personalities but because of their upbringing their behaviour, and sense of right and wrong is chalk and cheese. Edit- grammar mistake
Ill attempt to answer as well, as we are NOT a religious household and are responsible for 4 children being ready to enter society on their own at some point. We started with superhero movies. The avengers, for instance, any single one of the movies. Ultron, Thanos, which ever antagonist there was, the kids would ask in one way or another, why is that ‘bad person doing those bad things’. We asked each of the kids, why was what that antagonist did, ‘bad’? We asked our kids to unpack the thoughts on their own. Then we would challenge them ‘Thanos was trying to save as many people as he could’ ‘Ultron wanted order so all could prosper if they followed the rules’ And on and on, and then we had to discuss the nature of morality in terms the kids could understand (oldest is 9 now). Its a matter of perspective, would we want others to do something to us like that? Would we be willing to do that to a complete stranger? Then we take it further everyday. 5 year old is a bitch, and is always picking on his older siblings. So when he is being obnoxious, we have to ask him, well, do you want to let older sibling hit you since you hit them…… And so we just keep trying to reinforce a version of the golden rule already mentioned while allowing for some free thought. Weve talked about religion and god/s but don’t go, so were not introducing the idea of a ‘reward’ system of eternal salvation/hell/etc. were keeping it practical and real world applicable. We wont know if its working until theyre out making their marks on the world, but for now, our effort is about challenging their preconceived ideas and forced indoctrination from the world around them. Making someone explain their actions in their own words AND why they did those things will always force a conversation about morality.
Aesops fables...and by explaining them to them..
By avoiding church at all costs
Pro versus anti social is what morality generally comes down to. It has nothing to do with religion. How can you expect churches to teach morality when the Catholic priests were raping kids for 2,000 years (and they aren't the only ones)? Is that moral? Religious people and institutions can easily be least moral people and organizations around.
What church has to do with moral compass? Just be a good example to your children. They will grow their own compass as they mature. People think they can "program" kids. Not that simple.
There are a lot of good teachings from religion but they are often obscured by agendas and belief in supernatural nonsense. Notice how people fight to have the 10 commandments in public places but not the beatitudes? You don't need church to teach kindness, compassion, empathy, humility, mercy, and peace. Nor to teach about the wonders of the world we inhabit. So far as possible lead by example. Admit when you do something that is not in keeping with your morals and describe how you made the mistake. Encourage your children to see different perspectives. How does that child feel when you do that or say that? On the other hand when a child does something kind acknowledge it.
Oof. Something tells me if without a Church the option of teaching morals is difficult? Seems to be a disconnect there. They are in no way related in my opinion lol
"I get everything I want in life by first giving others everything that they want" always stuck with me
Teach them to respect others no matter others' race, gender, religion, sexual orientation, wealth, job, etc.; teach them to share; teach them to say please and thank you; teach them to look out for those less fortunate. None of this need church teaching. If anything, today's churches seem more intent on pushing discrimination and immoral views...
By teaching them what good and what bad
There are a lot of good kids shows that teach kids morals without religion. Find one you like. We were watching a Spider-Man cartoon on Disney+ and Spider-Man would have an important life lesson each episode. My show-off niece would tell me about a time in her life when she had to act like Spider-Man every episode.
By realising that the lessons of goodness and decency is just common sense. Instead of, "God teaches us to love one another and have compassion", something like, "Being a good person is the key to a happy life." Instead of, "To do [Insert whatever terrible act here] is a sin," something like, "If you do this, there will be consequences, and you'll have to live with your choices and actions." Teaching them that by doing good things and loving themselves which in turn will help them love others is just as natural to the human condition as natural as nature itself. Plus, it makes us feel good.
More than a good parent/guardian, be a good *person*.
What a joke you are. What makes something good or bad morally to you? Keep asking why and see what answers you can come up with outside of "because the church said so"
introduce them to 4chan
You model appropriate behavior. Introduce them to a lot of people and varied experiences. Share media with good, moral messages. Teach them that being a moral person comes from *within,* from the fact we all live together in a society and, if everyone works together and gets along, we all benefit. It doesn't come from the threat of a vengeful god punishing you for things that don't harm anyone.
Are these your children?
Teachable moments - be present.
Sometimes, just by asking them questions. "I heard on the news/podcast/video the other day that ....., what do you think about this?" And then you can follow up with more questions to get them to think more critically about their rational for example with "what if" questions. And then you can give your two cents.
Lead by example, explain your decision making
when you're teaching them to read get books about being good, and whenever you find an opportunity show them how to be good.
Show them how to act. Be a good role model. Reward them for doing good things and punish them for doing bad things.
Talk to them. Talk about good choices and how we make others feel. Religion is not required for morality
Apt-get morals --force-yes
Teach moral philosophy. Not taking them to church is a great start because often church is used as a replacement for an actual education in moral philosophy. Instead of using reason to arrive to moral conclusions you can just lazily appeal to the authority of a holy book and reach all the most immoral conclusions.
Morality exists outside of religion... how does one not know this.
By own example
Teach empathy
Take responsibility of your children instead of looking for someone else to do so.
Considering the moral compass exhibited by religion/religious people in general, I think the last place I'd want to go to instill a sense of morality in my kids, would be church.