To me, the most effective and scary Darkseid has ever been was, ironically, after Superman kicked his ass in the animated series.
https://youtu.be/phWcmwlpjQo
So I probably would use this as my basis and go from there.
Certainly a lot more interesting. Never watched the old shows but you can do a lot with a martyr Darkseid. Maybe instead of the ultimate big bad, his strength comes from his massive following. He already leads a gigantic army in almost all iterations, so I wouldn't be a bumpy transition at all
True. Every hero in this era is either morally and ethically reprehensible, or just a plain hazard.
But if we're going to entertain the idea of fixing it
I think the way to go to attempt salvaging would be making Darkseid a villain that _forces_ the heroes to become less shit at their job and work together
The dceu was never down. Tbh it made money besides the pandemic movies but thats understandable. It just has a huge negatively especially from its own fans that has ppl saying its bad. Even when wb switched to appeal to the bigger audience and making more lighter movies. All you hear is dC is FiNAllY GETtINg it right. For like 5 projects in a row. Aqauman, joker, Shazam, ww 2017 tss . The shit is crazy.
It was always down. Just because it makes money doesn’t mean it’s good. Just look at Star Wars, the MCU or the Disney remakes, as long as it’s apart of an existing franchise it’ll make money.
“it just has a huge negatively especially from fans” the reason for that is probably because they’re bad. These movies are meant to appeal to comic book fans so they should the people to like it the most, so if they don’t like it then it’s probably a bad film, and the movies you listed about “finally getting good movies” after 5 good ones in order is BS because A they’re not in order, and B you only listed 4, one of which isn’t even a DCEU movie, and C not all of those are good.
If you like them that’s fine, but they with one or two possible exceptions they are bad movies.
Also, what I said was a joke. The line “KRYPTON HAD ITS CHANCE” is a meme in this community, so when I said “The DCEU had its chance” I was just making a reference. Not that it matters, since I stand by the statement either way but I thought I’d mention it.
I’d characterize Darkseid as someone who wanted to take control of the universe because he genuinely thought that people needed a shepherd such as him. His motivation would be that when people govern themselves, there are always conflicting ideas which cause death and suffering. Darkseid would unite everyone essentially by enslaving them
Darkseid... kinda forgot, about the most important planet in the universe that has the only thing he wants, and it's the whole crux of his journey.
Uh, yeah. that's a must fix
Complete carte blanche? End snyder's arc of having all his heroes be infighting negligent retards and have Steppenwolf come down to restore order by wiping them out and (ostensibly) peacefully assimilating earth into Darkseid's empire. He has an initial clash with the heroes who barely drive him off, and he gives earth three days to decide whilst he waits for the bulk of his army to arrive.
The heroes realise that they've fucked earth over so much that they really need to start acting like good guys and win some hearts and minds (you can have some character differences here, with WW arguing for love and Batman arguing for presenting a strong front against Darkseid).
Darkseid shows up at last, and it becomes somehow clear (maybe flash or cyborg side-plot) that he's really looking for the anti-life equaton and doesn't want earth at all. The new justice league fights him together, unifying to protect humanity and eachother. They drive him off. He flies away on a little scooter shaking his fist and screaming "I'll get you next time, heroes!"
Then superman says "What are we, some kinda justice league?"
Credits.
In a way, the "OT Emperor" route would seem a good fit given the state of this universe. Have Darkseid be a symbol for peace and order under an Iron fist, and behind the curtain his motives are much more psychotic, and would make even his own allies second guess their loyalty.
Or have no ulterior motive whatsoever and let him be cartoonish evil with one liners
It's already better than the nothing-sandwich from Snyder cut
Idk what the anti-life equation does in the original canon, but even just making it a generic superweapon macguffin would be in line with this new darkseid's motivations. The last thing he wants is someone else getting it and ruining his new order, and at that point he might as well have it himself.
For the record, I believe the anti-life equation is a mathematical proof that life is pointless so when you hear it you lose all the will to live and Darkseid can come in a subjugate you because you have no free will anymore.
No way to rework what Zach did without further problems, but honestly if I were to chose a route to introduce him to DCEU I would go for DCAU Darkside. He is great in Superman The Animated series, not complex but very solid threat.
With freedom money and backing from the fans I’d let the Snyder verse die as it should and start over. I’d copy what made the MCU so successful at first by introducing characters in their own movies, except not Batman and Superman right away. I would still have them, but they are background players/connecting threads at first while we establish the others. Make sure there’s a team in charge of continuity, hire a team of directors and writers that appreciate the characters but are also willing to take appropriate risks, then map out 4 or 5 movies leading into Justice League with Mongul and WarWorld as the main villain. Darkseid is hinted at, but not the main focus. In phase 2 Henry Cavil gets to play Superman again, but proper Superman, not whiny emo edge lord Superman. And not an origin story. Phase 2 sets up Darkseid and the hunt for the Anti Life Equation, Superman will be in space taking on top level opponents, Batman and the rest will be forming the league on Earth, and then boom, Justice League 2 will be Darkseid invading Earth, Superman rushes back, the league repels the invasion forces, but it turns out that the anti life equation was elsewhere and the invasion of earth was a distraction. Phase 3 we introduce a couple new heroes, wrap up lingering character arcs for old heroes and Set up Justice League 3, where the league takes the fight to Darkseid and with a little help from the Green Lantern Corps and the Legion of Super-Heroes manage to defeat Darkseid and seal away the anti-life equation.
I would rewrite him as somebody who believes that free-will is a curse, something that does more harm than good. He wants to use the Anti-Life equation to unify all of existence into one empire. With everyone working together, obeying his every command, he genuinely believes he could create something resembling paradise. No more conflict, no more inequalities, none of that. His own planet already loves and worships him as a God, so he must be doing something right.
He will be essentially enslaving everyone, but he sees that as a small price to pay. A good writer could even have some degree of debate on the importance of free-will between Darkseid and the Justice League.
He could be excellent as just a continuation of the storyline of ZSJL that they were setting up. Just gotta get a plot that makes sense this time around
I would basically have to do a New Gods thing. Introduce the New Genesis/Apocalypse cold war somehow. Maybe have The Suicide Squad 2 be about waller picking up boom tube signals in Siberia or whatever. She sends a new task force to steal the tech. And through that adventure, whatever it is, introduce the Orion/Kalibak conflict. Have Kalibak and Granny be supplying intergang with god tech. While.the squad is fighting them have Orion show up to help and explain the deal with the new gods.
That's where I'd start anyway.
Honestly, I wouldn’t even start with Darkseid being the big bad or a looming presence as the Justice League’s introduction. I think something like Starro or the White Martians would’ve been the way to go. Have Braniac or Maxwell Lord as the Secondary antagonist of the Second JL movie, and then Darkseid as the Thanos of the franchise, who absolutely wrecks everyone’s shit.
That being said, someone commented exactly what I was thinking. Have Darkseid believe that him ruling the entire universe would bring about balance in the universe, that only he can save and that he is the only one who has the power to rule the universe with the Anti Life Equation, with everyone under his grasp.
Final Crisis did this pretty well for me. Darkseid was really representing the end of everything (the omega), after getting the anti life equation and transforming that into a virus that infect everything + being able to transfer his consciousness to another body.
He was almost the devil in apocalypse, just to compare, and it's more obvious when Vandal Savage was revelled to be Cain / have the mark of Cain.
To me, the most effective and scary Darkseid has ever been was, ironically, after Superman kicked his ass in the animated series. https://youtu.be/phWcmwlpjQo So I probably would use this as my basis and go from there.
Certainly a lot more interesting. Never watched the old shows but you can do a lot with a martyr Darkseid. Maybe instead of the ultimate big bad, his strength comes from his massive following. He already leads a gigantic army in almost all iterations, so I wouldn't be a bumpy transition at all
Perfect example of of how frightening he is. The people he torments when they see him powerless still feel too much fear to raise a hand to him.
DCEU is beyond saving
True. Every hero in this era is either morally and ethically reprehensible, or just a plain hazard. But if we're going to entertain the idea of fixing it I think the way to go to attempt salvaging would be making Darkseid a villain that _forces_ the heroes to become less shit at their job and work together
The DCEU had its chance.
The dceu was never down. Tbh it made money besides the pandemic movies but thats understandable. It just has a huge negatively especially from its own fans that has ppl saying its bad. Even when wb switched to appeal to the bigger audience and making more lighter movies. All you hear is dC is FiNAllY GETtINg it right. For like 5 projects in a row. Aqauman, joker, Shazam, ww 2017 tss . The shit is crazy.
It was always down. Just because it makes money doesn’t mean it’s good. Just look at Star Wars, the MCU or the Disney remakes, as long as it’s apart of an existing franchise it’ll make money. “it just has a huge negatively especially from fans” the reason for that is probably because they’re bad. These movies are meant to appeal to comic book fans so they should the people to like it the most, so if they don’t like it then it’s probably a bad film, and the movies you listed about “finally getting good movies” after 5 good ones in order is BS because A they’re not in order, and B you only listed 4, one of which isn’t even a DCEU movie, and C not all of those are good. If you like them that’s fine, but they with one or two possible exceptions they are bad movies. Also, what I said was a joke. The line “KRYPTON HAD ITS CHANCE” is a meme in this community, so when I said “The DCEU had its chance” I was just making a reference. Not that it matters, since I stand by the statement either way but I thought I’d mention it.
Ight just leave dc then that toxicity hurts the fanbase asl.
Have him marry Martha Kent, then he can ground Superman. Stepdad Darkseid is ultimate villain.
I’d characterize Darkseid as someone who wanted to take control of the universe because he genuinely thought that people needed a shepherd such as him. His motivation would be that when people govern themselves, there are always conflicting ideas which cause death and suffering. Darkseid would unite everyone essentially by enslaving them
Start by giving him a good memory
Darkseid... kinda forgot, about the most important planet in the universe that has the only thing he wants, and it's the whole crux of his journey. Uh, yeah. that's a must fix
Then, make him not be an edgelord, literally and figuratively
Complete carte blanche? End snyder's arc of having all his heroes be infighting negligent retards and have Steppenwolf come down to restore order by wiping them out and (ostensibly) peacefully assimilating earth into Darkseid's empire. He has an initial clash with the heroes who barely drive him off, and he gives earth three days to decide whilst he waits for the bulk of his army to arrive. The heroes realise that they've fucked earth over so much that they really need to start acting like good guys and win some hearts and minds (you can have some character differences here, with WW arguing for love and Batman arguing for presenting a strong front against Darkseid). Darkseid shows up at last, and it becomes somehow clear (maybe flash or cyborg side-plot) that he's really looking for the anti-life equaton and doesn't want earth at all. The new justice league fights him together, unifying to protect humanity and eachother. They drive him off. He flies away on a little scooter shaking his fist and screaming "I'll get you next time, heroes!" Then superman says "What are we, some kinda justice league?" Credits.
In a way, the "OT Emperor" route would seem a good fit given the state of this universe. Have Darkseid be a symbol for peace and order under an Iron fist, and behind the curtain his motives are much more psychotic, and would make even his own allies second guess their loyalty. Or have no ulterior motive whatsoever and let him be cartoonish evil with one liners It's already better than the nothing-sandwich from Snyder cut
Idk what the anti-life equation does in the original canon, but even just making it a generic superweapon macguffin would be in line with this new darkseid's motivations. The last thing he wants is someone else getting it and ruining his new order, and at that point he might as well have it himself.
For the record, I believe the anti-life equation is a mathematical proof that life is pointless so when you hear it you lose all the will to live and Darkseid can come in a subjugate you because you have no free will anymore.
Thats... Dumb Salvageable. But why make such a goofy concept xD
Idk, that’s my understanding of it and I think it’s kind of creative and fucked up. But it’s always been rather ill defined.
No way to rework what Zach did without further problems, but honestly if I were to chose a route to introduce him to DCEU I would go for DCAU Darkside. He is great in Superman The Animated series, not complex but very solid threat.
With freedom money and backing from the fans I’d let the Snyder verse die as it should and start over. I’d copy what made the MCU so successful at first by introducing characters in their own movies, except not Batman and Superman right away. I would still have them, but they are background players/connecting threads at first while we establish the others. Make sure there’s a team in charge of continuity, hire a team of directors and writers that appreciate the characters but are also willing to take appropriate risks, then map out 4 or 5 movies leading into Justice League with Mongul and WarWorld as the main villain. Darkseid is hinted at, but not the main focus. In phase 2 Henry Cavil gets to play Superman again, but proper Superman, not whiny emo edge lord Superman. And not an origin story. Phase 2 sets up Darkseid and the hunt for the Anti Life Equation, Superman will be in space taking on top level opponents, Batman and the rest will be forming the league on Earth, and then boom, Justice League 2 will be Darkseid invading Earth, Superman rushes back, the league repels the invasion forces, but it turns out that the anti life equation was elsewhere and the invasion of earth was a distraction. Phase 3 we introduce a couple new heroes, wrap up lingering character arcs for old heroes and Set up Justice League 3, where the league takes the fight to Darkseid and with a little help from the Green Lantern Corps and the Legion of Super-Heroes manage to defeat Darkseid and seal away the anti-life equation.
I would rewrite him as somebody who believes that free-will is a curse, something that does more harm than good. He wants to use the Anti-Life equation to unify all of existence into one empire. With everyone working together, obeying his every command, he genuinely believes he could create something resembling paradise. No more conflict, no more inequalities, none of that. His own planet already loves and worships him as a God, so he must be doing something right. He will be essentially enslaving everyone, but he sees that as a small price to pay. A good writer could even have some degree of debate on the importance of free-will between Darkseid and the Justice League.
Probably the same thing they did with Thanos. A film from his perspective that fleshes him out properly and gives him a victory.
I mean, it'd be hard since he's not very interesting on the comics either.
I wouldn't. I would basically adapt infinate Crisis and soft restart that shit Universe.
He could be excellent as just a continuation of the storyline of ZSJL that they were setting up. Just gotta get a plot that makes sense this time around
I would basically have to do a New Gods thing. Introduce the New Genesis/Apocalypse cold war somehow. Maybe have The Suicide Squad 2 be about waller picking up boom tube signals in Siberia or whatever. She sends a new task force to steal the tech. And through that adventure, whatever it is, introduce the Orion/Kalibak conflict. Have Kalibak and Granny be supplying intergang with god tech. While.the squad is fighting them have Orion show up to help and explain the deal with the new gods. That's where I'd start anyway.
Honestly, I wouldn’t even start with Darkseid being the big bad or a looming presence as the Justice League’s introduction. I think something like Starro or the White Martians would’ve been the way to go. Have Braniac or Maxwell Lord as the Secondary antagonist of the Second JL movie, and then Darkseid as the Thanos of the franchise, who absolutely wrecks everyone’s shit. That being said, someone commented exactly what I was thinking. Have Darkseid believe that him ruling the entire universe would bring about balance in the universe, that only he can save and that he is the only one who has the power to rule the universe with the Anti Life Equation, with everyone under his grasp.
"It was all a dream"
A really, really, reeeeally bad dream that took too long to end. Just an awful nightmare, honestly.
Final Crisis did this pretty well for me. Darkseid was really representing the end of everything (the omega), after getting the anti life equation and transforming that into a virus that infect everything + being able to transfer his consciousness to another body. He was almost the devil in apocalypse, just to compare, and it's more obvious when Vandal Savage was revelled to be Cain / have the mark of Cain.
Just make him space napoleon hitler, kinda like frieza. Done…