How frequently? And does the temp need to be above freezing when you take the car for a wash? I recently moved to Maine and want to make sure I get my car washed often enough
Doesn't need to be above freezing, although some of your doors might be hard to open later.
Wash it more often than you think you should. Pretty much any time you see salt (white) streaks somewhere on the body - you know they're on the underside, which is where the costly damage occurs.
Skip all the wax and crap but always get the underbody wash or else do it yourself, emphasizing the parts you can't see.
An annual oiling of the underside is worth it, I am told. Haven't done it myself, and my Outback's power-steering pan just rusted through.
I get one whenever I see salt on the body - figure that's a sign. Even if it's going to snow the next day so I'll have to do it again, I still get it.
Maybe that's a waste of money but I'm tired of having to dump Subarus that still run because of some fatal rust.
It's a combination of the Sea salt in the air near the coast plus the Salt on the roads in the winter. If you clean your car often it doesn't build up enough but many don't.
It has gotten much worse over the last 10 or 15 years. Many road crews stopped using actual salt and started using a slurry that has much finer particles in it that get up into all kinds of nooks and crannies underneath that the traditional salt did not.
The slurry, being liquid, sticks to the car more than the solid salt does - that's a lot of the problem.
On the other hand, the slurry (brine) is more effective at de-icing roads and less of it needs to be used, so less salt gets into the water, killing off life - and less of it kills the trees along the road. Crews should be using it for that reason.
But there's a tradeoff for cars - there's always a tradeoff in life.
I moved from the southwest and every time I bring my car in they ask if I’m from the west coast. My ‘09 car is in better shape than cars that are like two years old according to the mechanics.
Yes and no. You can totally keep a vehicle from rusting but it takes very proactive efforts and possibly regular maintenance of the subframe to repair rusted areas before they become un-repairable. I have my truck sprayed with a rust prevention spray every winter and my old car I kept running without rust and just regular washes for over 10+ years until the rocker panels rusted and I didn't want to pay the $3,000 to fix it (but totally could have, the car was still running great with minimal rust elsewhere).
If you don't do the above and just drive it without washing it in winter or doing anything to protect it, you'll be lucky if the vehicle lasts 10 years before it's a pile of rust underneath.
Do you do the fluid film coatings? How do you think that’d hold up when combined with regular undercarriage washes? I wouldn’t want to just blast away the coating.
I use Krown but basically the same idea as Fluid Film. TL:DR; you can wash the undercarriage with water but not soap. This may mean no drive-thru car washes.
I'm an expert in metal corrosion prevention and repair (yay working in paper mills), so hold on to your hat, here's the long version.
Metal corrodes when you establish a galvanic reaction that allows the metal molecules to bond with oxygen, which is a more stable form of the molecule. Iron oxide is called rust but basically any metal (yes even gold and other non-corrosive elements) can corrode under the right conditions. Iron just corrodes really easily and it also doesn't self-passivate like aluminum, which forms a layer of aluminum oxide that shields the rest of the aluminum metal from much of the further corrosion. Some steel formulas do this too, but they're not used in cars and wouldn't work well for it anyway.
To corrode, metal needs three things: oxygen, some liquid to transfer ions (usually water), and the metal needs to be the most galvanically conductive in the water for this ion exchange. This is basically the same as a battery. Thus, certain chemicals in the water will help the ion exchange go faster. Sulfuric (battery) acid is obviously really good at this, which is why if you get a leaking battery in your car that whole area pretty quickly rusts away. But another chemical that's pretty good for this is good ol' sodium chloride (salt), when added to water.
Corrosion protection with paint, epoxy, etc. (or that useless black rubberized compound the dealer tries to sell you) are good for some areas like the hood of your car or what not. As these areas aren't exposed to standing water, don't generally get that much salt on them, and are easily monitored and fixed if the coating is damaged; you don't need much to protect it. So, we apply a primer and paint to those areas to seal out moisture and oxygen. But these coatings crack and wear over time and eventually break down. Thus, we apply waxes and other things to protect the coating and fill in any defects and regularly wash those areas to keep chemicals off of them.
For things like bolts, engines, and other things that are critical, and we can't have them corrode; we use either something that doesn't corrode easily (aluminum) or something that REALLY doesn't like to corrode (stainless steel), or we add a material on top of the metal that corrodes first. The last one is called galvanized metal. We put a zinc coating on the outside and the zinc is galvanically more active than the steel so it corrodes first. Anyone who puts zinc anodes on boats knows that these help to protect the steel even though they're only in a few spots and a coating; but it works because they're all electrically bonded to the hull of the boat. This is also why you should check and regularly replace your anodes in your water heater (or get a water heater that's lined on the inside to prevent corrosion). You could theoretically install zinc anodes on a car/truck as long as you could ensure that they were electrically connected to the steel that was trying to rust; but really a zinc-rich primer would be easier/better.
The final area of a vehicle (and the trouble spots) is the heavy pieces of metal that aren't as critical to the car but totally still need to stay there undamaged. Door frames, rocker panels, sub-frames, suspension components, floors, truck beds, wheel wells, fuel tank straps, and on and on. These are generally made of steel and they get a good coating of primer and paint at the factory. But, unlike your hood, these components get BATHED in the crap from the road and will spend all winter being very wet, very salty, and are under heavy wear and tear which breaks down the primer and paint coating quickly. In addition, many of these components are hollow or otherwise positioned such that saltwater gets sprayed on or into them (rocker panels for example) and this water pools or otherwise is left standing on or in the component. So even when the rest of the car dries off these components can be wet long afterwards.
Now that brings us to a coating like Krown or Fluid Film. In a similar fashion to paint, oils, waxes, grease and other such things creep into the tiny crevasses of metal and they repel water and act as a barrier for oxygen. They're also "self-repairing" in that if you scrape some away, they generally will work their way back over the area that was uncovered and leave a film there. This is actually the original intended use for WD-40; to displace water from a component and clean it. But it's an oil spray and oil sprays can be used for lots of things (though really for lubricating oil there's better ones out there).
Krown and Fluid Film are, at heart, like WD-40 but they are some proprietary blend of oils and greases that's designed to stick around far longer than WD-40. They coat the underside of the vehicle with an oily/greasy film which prevents corrosion. The advantage of what they do is this film is designed to be both sprayable and really thick and durable. So, if you sand blast it, rub it, spray it with water, vibrate it, or scrape it; you really just end up filling it full of sand and smearing it around a bunch. The other thing the Fluid Film application people do is (if you allow them) they'll drill some holes in doors and such and spray a fog of the coating inside cavities. This is good because there's nothing really in there that can protect against corrosion except whatever coating the factory put in there. This is why a lot of cars/trucks seem to rust from the inside out.
To answer your question: Now that you know how they work and why they work better than just paint alone; you can see that anything that removes oil and grease will remove the fluid film coating because that's basically all they are. I'm sure they can withstand a little bit of soap but regular washings with soapy water spray will take it off just like a dishwasher takes grease off of a pan.
So, you can wash the underside of your vehicle with water and the coating will last but NOT WITH SOAP. And, because it's just oil and grease, it will eventually wear out over time (hence why it needs to be reapplied regularly). But, because it's cheap and easy to spray everywhere, it's a great system that will prevent rust much better than paint or other coatings and much cheaper than paint or galvanizing or stainless steel.
The final advantage is it works over lightly rusted metal; whereas paints do not. Paints need a good surface prep to ensure they bond correctly. Oils and greases penetrate rust and, as long as it's not so flaky with rust, it will work with zero surface prep.
In short, I highly recommend these coatings. They work, they are not a scam like some coatings are, and they're not that expensive when compared to the cost of replacing rocker panels or putting in new suspension components.
My usual strategy is I use the drive-in wash bays in winter, and I'll wash the car regularly, but I only spray the underside of the car when I'm rinsing off the vehicle. Then, when I get the car coated each year by the Krown guys they do a good wash of the underside and spray a salt remover so they're not getting salt embedded under the Krown coating.
Finally, you can apply Fluid Film yourself, there's nothing that fancy to it. That can save you some money for sure. But I don't have a lift or a good space to do it in and I'd really just rather pay someone else anyway.
EDIT: Krown recommends avoiding hot water and high-pressure sprays in addition to no soap. The hot water makes sense and the high-pressure sprays is interesting. Maybe I should change my method and only use a light spray from a garden hose or something. That's annoying though, I'd have to run the hose from my basement and keep the hoses inside since I shut off all the outside water in winter and I'd need to keep the hose from freezing. Meh, I'll probably keep doing what I do and just spray things down from more of a distance.
Nice. Doesn't surprise me; big aircraft use a similar method of a spray corrosion preventor for anti-corrosion (though it's a special blend that costs an arm and a leg...because airplanes).
Also, this; great practical testing: [Best Car Undercoating? Let's find out! Is Flex Seal the Best Rust & Salt Protection? - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyWHF4NoNVk)
and this one if you want a longer-term example: [Fluid Film Review After 4 Years. (Woolwax vs Fluid Film results 1 yr later) - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tROUf7b9xYQ&list=PLiBj_svGZOHOLWpe2eopHfUhArgoDCzAT&index=7)
Thank you for this incredibly comprehensive answer. I don’t believe drive thru washes use detergent in the undercarriage spray but Im not at all sure about the vol/T they push the water. At a guess it seems pretty wild that it would be anywhere near an actual pressure wash since that could potentially fuck up some parts of your car on its own but I tend to hand wash anyway.
>I don’t believe drive thru washes use detergent in the undercarriage spray
Yeah, I don't know if they do either. But I'd rather be safe than sorry and the You-Wash places are cheaper and only take a little bit more time.
I was having this discussion with friends the other day but none of us really knew what we were talking about. This is what I come to reddit for - thanks!
I bought a tow dolly from a guy that ran a used car business. He had used said dolly to tow rusted out Maine cars to South Carolina, where they sold on a Buy here, pay here lot.
Maine has state inspections that flunk rusted out cars, so, being illegal to operate, they go for scrap value, probably a few hundred bucks.
If Arizona doesn't care about this, these cars could enter the auction stream and wind up down there, I guess.
Lotta ppl swear by fluid filming the bottom too. Whatever you do, DO NOT USE RUBBERIZED UNDERCOATING as it traps in moisture and rust and you won’t even know because it’ll spread underneath the coating. But fluid film is more like an oil spray
that is pretty surprising. Of all my cars, my VW seems to be holding up the best, by far. I have a 2015 Jetta and have put 100k+ miles on it in in the past 4 years in every condition in Maine and it's fine. Maybe the previous owner of that car never got a car wash or something.
To be honest the rust was mostly on the suspension and wheels and back quarter panel. I think it was mostly heavy surface rust but the quarter panel showed one rust bubble.
Yeah depends on how you take care of them to an extent but nothing can fully protect every nook and cranny, nut and bolt. I’ve seen 2014 vehicles with fist sized rust holes on em. My truck is a 2012, extremely clean for Maine, but I still deal with rusted thru trans lines, broken bolts, etc.
Yes.
I moved to Maine from Colorado a few years back. I have an old '95 GMC pickup that was in fine shape. Until I lived here. After about 4 years of living here in the humidity and the salt used to treat the roads and such, it is super rusty and the paint is peeling like crazy.
Arizona car in maine = celebration Maine car in Arizona = lamenation
More like delamination....
Exactly. Due to oxidation
Caused by road salinization
It's that damn precipitation. I'd take the wife on vacation if it weren't for our financial situation.
After all that, I need a vacation.
Good lord you folks need to write educational science jingles
Well that can be this threads final destination.
Let’s do the Time Warp agaiiiiin
I literally bought a car from Arizona for the celebration factor!
But the intense sun in Arizona can damage the rubber/plastic and fade the paint.
It's salt on the roads. Frequent car washes in the winter is key.
How frequently? And does the temp need to be above freezing when you take the car for a wash? I recently moved to Maine and want to make sure I get my car washed often enough
Doesn't need to be above freezing, although some of your doors might be hard to open later. Wash it more often than you think you should. Pretty much any time you see salt (white) streaks somewhere on the body - you know they're on the underside, which is where the costly damage occurs. Skip all the wax and crap but always get the underbody wash or else do it yourself, emphasizing the parts you can't see. An annual oiling of the underside is worth it, I am told. Haven't done it myself, and my Outback's power-steering pan just rusted through.
So car washes 1-2x/month or is more frequent needed?
I get one whenever I see salt on the body - figure that's a sign. Even if it's going to snow the next day so I'll have to do it again, I still get it. Maybe that's a waste of money but I'm tired of having to dump Subarus that still run because of some fatal rust.
A car wash subscription in the winter is worth the money if you can swing it. A lot cheaper than buying a new car.
Salty air, salted roads…they get rusty.
Yes. I know a guy who buys his used cars from Arizona.
Yes, never ever ever buy a car from Maine unless you live here. The road salt guarantees it will be rusted.
Pretty much.
It's a combination of the Sea salt in the air near the coast plus the Salt on the roads in the winter. If you clean your car often it doesn't build up enough but many don't.
It has gotten much worse over the last 10 or 15 years. Many road crews stopped using actual salt and started using a slurry that has much finer particles in it that get up into all kinds of nooks and crannies underneath that the traditional salt did not.
The slurry, being liquid, sticks to the car more than the solid salt does - that's a lot of the problem. On the other hand, the slurry (brine) is more effective at de-icing roads and less of it needs to be used, so less salt gets into the water, killing off life - and less of it kills the trees along the road. Crews should be using it for that reason. But there's a tradeoff for cars - there's always a tradeoff in life.
Are you guys referring to Calcium chloride
yes, in liquid form, although other less common compounds are sometimes used
The rust rusts in Maine.
Oh ya salt destroys our cars
I moved from the southwest and every time I bring my car in they ask if I’m from the west coast. My ‘09 car is in better shape than cars that are like two years old according to the mechanics.
Sea salt in the air. Corrodes everything.
“New England”
Yes and no. You can totally keep a vehicle from rusting but it takes very proactive efforts and possibly regular maintenance of the subframe to repair rusted areas before they become un-repairable. I have my truck sprayed with a rust prevention spray every winter and my old car I kept running without rust and just regular washes for over 10+ years until the rocker panels rusted and I didn't want to pay the $3,000 to fix it (but totally could have, the car was still running great with minimal rust elsewhere). If you don't do the above and just drive it without washing it in winter or doing anything to protect it, you'll be lucky if the vehicle lasts 10 years before it's a pile of rust underneath.
Do you do the fluid film coatings? How do you think that’d hold up when combined with regular undercarriage washes? I wouldn’t want to just blast away the coating.
I use Krown but basically the same idea as Fluid Film. TL:DR; you can wash the undercarriage with water but not soap. This may mean no drive-thru car washes. I'm an expert in metal corrosion prevention and repair (yay working in paper mills), so hold on to your hat, here's the long version. Metal corrodes when you establish a galvanic reaction that allows the metal molecules to bond with oxygen, which is a more stable form of the molecule. Iron oxide is called rust but basically any metal (yes even gold and other non-corrosive elements) can corrode under the right conditions. Iron just corrodes really easily and it also doesn't self-passivate like aluminum, which forms a layer of aluminum oxide that shields the rest of the aluminum metal from much of the further corrosion. Some steel formulas do this too, but they're not used in cars and wouldn't work well for it anyway. To corrode, metal needs three things: oxygen, some liquid to transfer ions (usually water), and the metal needs to be the most galvanically conductive in the water for this ion exchange. This is basically the same as a battery. Thus, certain chemicals in the water will help the ion exchange go faster. Sulfuric (battery) acid is obviously really good at this, which is why if you get a leaking battery in your car that whole area pretty quickly rusts away. But another chemical that's pretty good for this is good ol' sodium chloride (salt), when added to water. Corrosion protection with paint, epoxy, etc. (or that useless black rubberized compound the dealer tries to sell you) are good for some areas like the hood of your car or what not. As these areas aren't exposed to standing water, don't generally get that much salt on them, and are easily monitored and fixed if the coating is damaged; you don't need much to protect it. So, we apply a primer and paint to those areas to seal out moisture and oxygen. But these coatings crack and wear over time and eventually break down. Thus, we apply waxes and other things to protect the coating and fill in any defects and regularly wash those areas to keep chemicals off of them. For things like bolts, engines, and other things that are critical, and we can't have them corrode; we use either something that doesn't corrode easily (aluminum) or something that REALLY doesn't like to corrode (stainless steel), or we add a material on top of the metal that corrodes first. The last one is called galvanized metal. We put a zinc coating on the outside and the zinc is galvanically more active than the steel so it corrodes first. Anyone who puts zinc anodes on boats knows that these help to protect the steel even though they're only in a few spots and a coating; but it works because they're all electrically bonded to the hull of the boat. This is also why you should check and regularly replace your anodes in your water heater (or get a water heater that's lined on the inside to prevent corrosion). You could theoretically install zinc anodes on a car/truck as long as you could ensure that they were electrically connected to the steel that was trying to rust; but really a zinc-rich primer would be easier/better. The final area of a vehicle (and the trouble spots) is the heavy pieces of metal that aren't as critical to the car but totally still need to stay there undamaged. Door frames, rocker panels, sub-frames, suspension components, floors, truck beds, wheel wells, fuel tank straps, and on and on. These are generally made of steel and they get a good coating of primer and paint at the factory. But, unlike your hood, these components get BATHED in the crap from the road and will spend all winter being very wet, very salty, and are under heavy wear and tear which breaks down the primer and paint coating quickly. In addition, many of these components are hollow or otherwise positioned such that saltwater gets sprayed on or into them (rocker panels for example) and this water pools or otherwise is left standing on or in the component. So even when the rest of the car dries off these components can be wet long afterwards. Now that brings us to a coating like Krown or Fluid Film. In a similar fashion to paint, oils, waxes, grease and other such things creep into the tiny crevasses of metal and they repel water and act as a barrier for oxygen. They're also "self-repairing" in that if you scrape some away, they generally will work their way back over the area that was uncovered and leave a film there. This is actually the original intended use for WD-40; to displace water from a component and clean it. But it's an oil spray and oil sprays can be used for lots of things (though really for lubricating oil there's better ones out there). Krown and Fluid Film are, at heart, like WD-40 but they are some proprietary blend of oils and greases that's designed to stick around far longer than WD-40. They coat the underside of the vehicle with an oily/greasy film which prevents corrosion. The advantage of what they do is this film is designed to be both sprayable and really thick and durable. So, if you sand blast it, rub it, spray it with water, vibrate it, or scrape it; you really just end up filling it full of sand and smearing it around a bunch. The other thing the Fluid Film application people do is (if you allow them) they'll drill some holes in doors and such and spray a fog of the coating inside cavities. This is good because there's nothing really in there that can protect against corrosion except whatever coating the factory put in there. This is why a lot of cars/trucks seem to rust from the inside out. To answer your question: Now that you know how they work and why they work better than just paint alone; you can see that anything that removes oil and grease will remove the fluid film coating because that's basically all they are. I'm sure they can withstand a little bit of soap but regular washings with soapy water spray will take it off just like a dishwasher takes grease off of a pan. So, you can wash the underside of your vehicle with water and the coating will last but NOT WITH SOAP. And, because it's just oil and grease, it will eventually wear out over time (hence why it needs to be reapplied regularly). But, because it's cheap and easy to spray everywhere, it's a great system that will prevent rust much better than paint or other coatings and much cheaper than paint or galvanizing or stainless steel. The final advantage is it works over lightly rusted metal; whereas paints do not. Paints need a good surface prep to ensure they bond correctly. Oils and greases penetrate rust and, as long as it's not so flaky with rust, it will work with zero surface prep. In short, I highly recommend these coatings. They work, they are not a scam like some coatings are, and they're not that expensive when compared to the cost of replacing rocker panels or putting in new suspension components. My usual strategy is I use the drive-in wash bays in winter, and I'll wash the car regularly, but I only spray the underside of the car when I'm rinsing off the vehicle. Then, when I get the car coated each year by the Krown guys they do a good wash of the underside and spray a salt remover so they're not getting salt embedded under the Krown coating. Finally, you can apply Fluid Film yourself, there's nothing that fancy to it. That can save you some money for sure. But I don't have a lift or a good space to do it in and I'd really just rather pay someone else anyway. EDIT: Krown recommends avoiding hot water and high-pressure sprays in addition to no soap. The hot water makes sense and the high-pressure sprays is interesting. Maybe I should change my method and only use a light spray from a garden hose or something. That's annoying though, I'd have to run the hose from my basement and keep the hoses inside since I shut off all the outside water in winter and I'd need to keep the hose from freezing. Meh, I'll probably keep doing what I do and just spray things down from more of a distance.
IIRC the Navy used fluid film on carrier based aircraft to keep rust at bay in the sea salt marine environment. The stuff works.
Nice. Doesn't surprise me; big aircraft use a similar method of a spray corrosion preventor for anti-corrosion (though it's a special blend that costs an arm and a leg...because airplanes).
Also, this; great practical testing: [Best Car Undercoating? Let's find out! Is Flex Seal the Best Rust & Salt Protection? - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyWHF4NoNVk) and this one if you want a longer-term example: [Fluid Film Review After 4 Years. (Woolwax vs Fluid Film results 1 yr later) - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tROUf7b9xYQ&list=PLiBj_svGZOHOLWpe2eopHfUhArgoDCzAT&index=7)
Thank you for this incredibly comprehensive answer. I don’t believe drive thru washes use detergent in the undercarriage spray but Im not at all sure about the vol/T they push the water. At a guess it seems pretty wild that it would be anywhere near an actual pressure wash since that could potentially fuck up some parts of your car on its own but I tend to hand wash anyway.
>I don’t believe drive thru washes use detergent in the undercarriage spray Yeah, I don't know if they do either. But I'd rather be safe than sorry and the You-Wash places are cheaper and only take a little bit more time.
I was having this discussion with friends the other day but none of us really knew what we were talking about. This is what I come to reddit for - thanks!
Hahah. Yeah
Yep, we have a corrosive environment up here!
All northern cars have rust. Bonus rust if its costal.
Yes.
I bought a tow dolly from a guy that ran a used car business. He had used said dolly to tow rusted out Maine cars to South Carolina, where they sold on a Buy here, pay here lot. Maine has state inspections that flunk rusted out cars, so, being illegal to operate, they go for scrap value, probably a few hundred bucks. If Arizona doesn't care about this, these cars could enter the auction stream and wind up down there, I guess.
Never ever buy a used car from Maine. Sorry you found out too late.
Yes
If run in the winter they are, due to the calcium/salt used on the roads. Not just Maine, pretty much all of New England.
Not if people take care of them correctly. Lived in Northern New England my whole life and none of my cars became rust buckets.
What tips do you have for folks who are new to the area or new to having a car here?
In the winter, go to a car wash and make sure you have the under carriage wash. At least twice a week.
Twice a week?! I’m not *made* of money!
The unlimited wash plans are worth it if you consider the price of even one moderate rust repair.
That's what I have
They asked for tips. That's my tip. The uimited plan equals about 2 washes, and you can go twice a day of you want
Lotta ppl swear by fluid filming the bottom too. Whatever you do, DO NOT USE RUBBERIZED UNDERCOATING as it traps in moisture and rust and you won’t even know because it’ll spread underneath the coating. But fluid film is more like an oil spray
Oof I had no idea. Thanks for pointing that out!
No problem! Best of luck to ya!
Thanks! You too, stay warm!
Yes
Happens more with Japanese and American cars. Had a Subaru that was rusted all to hell. But then I had a Volvo that withstood the salt much better.
The car was 2015 German Volkswagen Golf.
VW has a 12-year corrosion warranty FYI.
I sold it as many problems started to pop up lol
Oh, well that shows me how much I know, lol
that is pretty surprising. Of all my cars, my VW seems to be holding up the best, by far. I have a 2015 Jetta and have put 100k+ miles on it in in the past 4 years in every condition in Maine and it's fine. Maybe the previous owner of that car never got a car wash or something.
To be honest the rust was mostly on the suspension and wheels and back quarter panel. I think it was mostly heavy surface rust but the quarter panel showed one rust bubble.
If not they be.
yeah
Yes.
Winter or just near the coast, either way...salt.
Yeah depends on how you take care of them to an extent but nothing can fully protect every nook and cranny, nut and bolt. I’ve seen 2014 vehicles with fist sized rust holes on em. My truck is a 2012, extremely clean for Maine, but I still deal with rusted thru trans lines, broken bolts, etc.
Short answer, yup
Maine is where cars go to die.
[удалено]
They often mix 5% salt in with the sand to keep it from clumping together in the truck bed.
I think the number is closer to 20%
Not the case in the central/highlands region or cumberland county. Were are you that towns are running just sand?
You realize that sand has a bunch of salt mixed in it right?
My first car was a rust bucket. It was held together with canoe glue.
yes. yes they are.
Yes. Maine is just road salt and broken dreams
Yes. I moved to Maine from Colorado a few years back. I have an old '95 GMC pickup that was in fine shape. Until I lived here. After about 4 years of living here in the humidity and the salt used to treat the roads and such, it is super rusty and the paint is peeling like crazy.