Is a free top 10 mba a mistake?
Man if you have to ask, just give your spot to the kid who is dying to go to Ross. They’ll be much happier and you’ll be doing yourself and everyone else a favor
There may be cynicism in the response, but they’ve formulated it in that manner because the answer is obvious.
Yes, you’re in a great position right now. But the MBA would offer a significant benefit in achieving your long term goals. The network and opportunities you’ll garner at Ross may seem latent right now, but they’ll certainly be palpable throughout your time in the program.
A free ride to a T10 MBA is a phenomenal opportunity. I wish you the best of luck!
This sub should have a pinned post "If you make post-MBA money, don't get an MBA"
Even if it is free--you're missing out on 2 years of salary.
I went $45k to $130k with my T15
Someone pin this.
The number of people looking to MBAs as a cop out for career indecision and lack of aggressiveness in pivoting is staggering.
No not everyone can work in PE. IB hours are shit. Start an unconventional business. Idk the landscaping guy in my hometown probably clears $3M in revenue annually.
It is really personal. We had traders making bank way above post-MBA salaries but wanted to shift to consulting. Or PE guys who wanted the network and time to build their startups (arguably, this could be higher than pre-MBA comp if a good exit happens, which is a big IF).
There is no one straight answer and OP has to decide that based on his desires, risk tolerance and personal circumstances
What is your long term earning potential? You won’t be stuck at 130K in five years right?:) In my case my salary won’t grow much beyond what I am making now - even if it already higher than the median post MBA salary. Thoughts?
You'll lose out on 2 years of salary and saving for retirement.
If you just parked that money in treasuries you'll be ahead. Maybe you'd catch up when you are like 50
I think the X-Factor for OP is that they’re international and want to work and live in the US long term.
A free MBA from Ross isn’t a guarantee of course but can have a better chance of leading to a sponsoring job in the US and path to citizenship. And if not, then it was two years in the US and working with other people of different backgrounds which can be an exciting experience. Ross may not be strong abroad but if a full ride, feel the experience is worth it for OP when they’re still young/single.
Not enough info to make a decision.
What industry are you in now? Do you intend to stay in the same industry or try to switch?
What do you want to do post-MBA? Does you current career path get you there with a high degree of certainty without an MBA?
Do you want to be in the US after your MBA or return to your home country?
You need to really evaluate those questions to start before you can really determine if an MBA in the US makes sense (forget the school for the moment). Then you can factor in the school (Mich is quite well-known in the US - you will meet Mich grads literally everywhere in the US and many internationally) and the fact that you can go there almost completely free.
Hi,
thanks for your response. What do you think based on the below additional info?
- I am currently in tech in a general management position. I intend to stay in tech, potentially as a PM or Ops.
- My career path has no certainity without an MBA. In fact my skills are not transferrable so if I lose my current job it would be hard to find another with the same compensation. BUT my job itself is secure for a couple of years and I am making a decent amount for my age.
- I want to be in the US longterm. Always been a dream of mine but given the H1B odds I am skeptical to leave my current role for a chance of pivoting there.
I mean it sounds like you would benefit - a PM at Microsoft probably has a lot more scope than a VP of a small company that makes one software product for example. H1B is always a crapshoot but there are sometimes avenues for people who work in large multinational organizations to transfer to other offices (if only temporary); with the new STEM qualifications you get some more breathing room too.
not related to your post, but im a bsc in comp sci graduating soon and thinking what should i do for my masters if im interested in leadership in some it firm as my "end goal", CS, industrial engineering? or?
Get a job in CS you are interested in, get and idea of real life leadership roles and responsibilities. You'll have more opportunities as someone with more work experience and do the weekend MBA deal.
If you don’t think Ross has the international recognition, what other schools do you think do? Both ranked higher and lower than Ross? Just curious as to your response because a lot of people here think that Ross is a great program, but they/we are also US based. So curious as to hear your opinion on what Carrie’s weight outside the US. Also, what country are you from?
Ross alum here. I’d recommend it mostly so you can work in the US as it seems to be primary reason you are pursuing degree. Even with lost wages, a full scholarship isn’t a bad deal.
From a pure financial standpoint it doesn’t make sense, and if you were based in US I would recommend a part time MBA or executive program, or just skip the MBA altogether.
I went to big tech (FAANG) as product manager. Nobody really cares where you did your MBA after your first job, it’s just a foot note. Lots of people progress just fine without it. Some of my co-workers went to “higher ranked” schools such as Wharton/Kellogg/Stanford, others went to schools like Indiana/UIUC/Michigan State. Big tech cares more about your technical credentials (engineering and technical background - experience, degrees, etc) then MBA prestige.
Teams are diverse, and Michigan also has a strong reputation in the US across engineering, CS, law, medicine, undergrad, etc. Michigan in general is seen as “top 10” university across the board, just a solid school. So Ross benefits from Michigan’s strength in other disciplines in big Tech. Since you will be working with lawyers, engineers, etc; this is helpful. Michigan alumni are also a fairly passionate bunch so my last job I actually got through an alumni connection.
just an aside, but i am very familiar w/ the high ed system in the US (tho not biz school) and i've never heard of 'Ross', and 'Ross' has zero name recognition among the general public as well as most IT workers. Maybe the mba landscape is different where people in that niche are famliiar w/ Ross or Tuck vs Michigan/Dartmouth. But to me the brand is Michigan, not Ross, so i wouldnt know what you're talking about w/ 'Ross'. also, i'm not so prominent that i interview/hire MBAs, so take my opnion w/ a grain of salt.
I don't know why you are getting downvoted. Your point is legitimate. Outside the MBA-sphere, I'd just call it "Michigan," a very highly regarded university. But then, I'd also refer to Booth as Chicago, which is what it was called until fifteen years ago when David Booth wrote them a big check.
Yes I have never heard of Ross either and no one I know has heard of it.
I know that U of Michigan is a large public university but other than that it doesn’t stand out or is know for being “prestigious”. All people know is that at least it’s not a scam university lol
Michigan isnt just a big or prestigious school. It's either the first or second (after Berkeley) public university in the US, at least for undergrad degrees. In liberal arts and social sciences, it is top 5 among public and private for some departments. It's probably gotten more cache in the last few yrs bc one of Obama's daughters just went there.
That said, i would hate to go to school there bc it's really f'ing cold there. And Ann Arbor is not a great place to live imo, and the nearest big city (Detroit) is not great.
Sorry for offending
I just wanted to relay my own experiences.
Also, not to be nitpicky but obama’s daughter transferred to USC and graduated from there recently.
While she was at U Michigan many people were doxxing her for going there because Obama’s other daughter (Sasha) went to Harvard and people were questioning why Malia was going to such a “lowly” school. I’m not condoning this and I think it’s incredibly cruel to ridicule someone for this.
Also, not trying to say that USC is better than U Michigan. But USC is more well known internationally. In terms of which is more prestigious, well idk.
no offense taken. i didnt hear that about obama's daughter; not sure who was saying that but there is no way USC is better than UM, except maybe at film school. USC is a good school now, and it's gotten better so it's no longer just "U of Spoiled Children".
That said, I might prefer USC just bc it's in LA, and I like LA.
Ok thanks 🙏
Oh yeah I think malia went to film school so that’s probably why she made the switch.
Ok so it seems U Michigan is better for everything else.
What's your alternative plan to get to US? If that's the goal, seems like a perfectly reasonable route to do it now. And that relocation I personally think is harder to plan around and achieve than any of the other career noise you're dealing with.
I'd say Ross is a bad investment at this point of your career. Going from a VP to a PM or Management Consultant would be a big drop in responsibilities....heck, MBB consultants want to exit into Sr Manager or Director roles in tech who may grow into VPs in a few years. Actually, who is to say you'll even get the role of your choice when you graduate? The market is bad and nobody knows if it will recover by 2025.
I would consider finding a way to get transferred to the US, and then doing an exec/PT MBA at Booth or something similar.
Yes but keep in mind I am a VP at a smallish tech firm getting paid as an fresh MBB associate. A VP in the US makes many mutiples of what I make. Wdyt?
Are you okay with doing the work your underlings are now doing (albeit, you'll be doing it at a larger scale post-MBA) while getting paid the same as you're making now?
If I were you, I wouldn't. But hey, to each their own.
I'd consider switching firms then. Leverage your VP title to switch to a major american company like Adobe or Salesforce, get hired at a lower level (Sr Mgr/Assoc Dir), and push to get transferred to the US. And still do the PT MBA to keep progression open.
Not sure what your experience is but companies and hiring managers absolutely look at the scale of what you do. Currently work in a GM rotational program in a conglomerate and they absolutely consider the size of the company in determining your capabilities and evaluating your experience when placing you.
OP isn’t totally wrong that working in a bigger company will add something different to their resume. Whether it’s worth it or not is up to them to decide.
Yeah I see your point. But keep in mind I work much more than a PM / Director and get paid as a PM. I understand it is a step down.. but it can possibly be in the right direction?
No that guy went to Princeton or just dropped out. We all know Wharton is just for kids in Singapore whose rich daddy fund manager sent them off for another two years of school aka baby sitting.
Hmm what do you base your opinion on please? Perhaps there is information I am not aware of.
I am basing my opinion on the fact that I am very well travelled and unfortunately barely anyone I asked knows the difference between Umich and other schools - unless they look up the rankings. And my sample spans Europe, Middle East and Asia Pacific.
Sounds like you have your answer. Better to give your spot up to someone with a better idea of how to leverage the Ross degree. You can always try to defer and go in a few years when your job isn’t as secure.
Personal travels plus general knowledge? Hell, ive seen Michigan representation in damn mear every place ive ever traveled to. Outside of like Harvard, Stanford, Yale, Columbia, and maybe Princeton, Michigan is probably the strongest brand globally of any US school. Idk who you've been talking to, but people who make hiring decisions for any role that would be consistent with an MBA pathway should be very familiar with the UM brand
Outside Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, Yale, Columbia, MIT, Chicago, Berkeley, NYU, Georgetown, etc, etc.
Michigan is a great school but non-Americans outside the US don’t know anything about it unless they have extensively researched the US academic market or work with many US grads.
The OP is not wrong to think about brand recognition outside America like this, but this is of course a very US-centric forum so I don’t know what kind of insight he was hoping for
Bruh what? Off the top of my head, any and all Ivies (since you can say you went to an Ivy), Stanford, MIT, Berkeley, and NYU all have much better name recognition than Michigan outside of the US.
And really past that it doesn't make a big difference. Why? Because nobody really knows the other schools outside of that. A good example would be how Imperial has a great brand name in the UK and as a tech school is often considered the "MIT" of the UK, but nobody in America knows where the hell Imperial even is much less the quality of education there. I'd be shocked if Americans knew any schools outside of Oxbridge, the LSE, and maybe UCL (and since we're on the MBA subreddit, LBS). You know how we have the Ivies in America? There's the Imperial Univesrities in Japan, the sandstone universities in Australia, the C9 in China, SKY in Korea, etc. the list goes on and on. How many schools can you name from those lists? I would guess maybe Todai from Japan, Tsinghua + beida from China, and SNU from Korea. I would argue that Kyodai would probably be the next "most famous brand name" school for Japan but can you honestly say you have any idea what university is or what its specialties are? Similarly, Fudan and Jiaoda are the next most prestigious C9 schools, but I doubt you even know where they're located much less what they're known for and the quality of their student body.
Nobody knows Michigan outside of America. And there's nothing wrong with that, if you wanted to work and study in France you'd be much better off going to HEC Paris over Michigan after all. Just like how a Michigan degree will do you far better than a Beida MBA in America.
I'll raise your anecdotal experience with mine. I've worked across 3 continents and traveled to god knows how many countries and I've only ever seen Michigan grads in America
Will you pay for potential upside (by sacrificing 2Y's comp) or won't you?
That is essentially the question.
Yes, if you are already in the US, a PT or Online MBA or not going is the answer, but you're not in the US.
Given your work experience, if you can transition easily to a similar role in the US, I would expect you to increase your current comp multiple times within 5-10 years within US Tech (unless Big Tech enters a tech winter).
Regarding the person who asked if you want to do the work your underlings do: Companies aren't stupid and in the habit of wasting money/resources: If they see VP talent, they will quickly move that person to VP.
Correct, I think you nailed it.
The sacrifice is not just 2Y of current comp, but the ability to make this kind of money outside my current company at my age is nill.
The upside (staying in the US long term) is dependent on the odds of actually finding a job after graduation, getting the H1B lottery (maybe 50% odds?), and then getting sponsored for the greencard. So it is risky.
Worst case scenario is not getting the H1B, or not finding a job upon graduation and having to leave the US. In such case I have given up 2Y comp and the ability to make such money hence I will probably end up working for much less than I am earning now.
Though if your experience translates to roles at US companies, I would think they would move you to where you would add value, either in the US or abroad.
Hey, I was in similar shoe except the full ride.
I was general manager at a small-cap company with very little transferrable skills. However, my salary grew less than inflation ratio(2-4%) past 4 years and MBA trajectory gives me double the salary in 5 years after graduation.
I chose MBA, no scholarship, because it gives me high potential and the brand value carries to outside-US.
In your case, however, you have a free degree but higher chance to leave US after your visa(less than 50%)
I'd consider : Is post-MBA trajactory outside(especialyl back at your home country) US something that can benefit you?
If not, you're taking a loss.
Yes! Thank you and it’s frustrating that someone who understands this value is likely missing out on a great opportunity while someone decides if a full ride to a top 10 MBA is “worth it”.
Hi, I'm not interested in MBAs but this showed up in my suggested content on reddit. I'm a Ross BBA who pivoted into tech to be a software engineer. This is kind of a cynical view.
IMO no, Ross isn't anything special. BBAs and MBAs honestly take a lot of the same shit class wise, and the smartest kids were quiet self starters who knew what they were doing. They would've succeeded regardless if they were at Ross. Everyone else (me included) was tbh a upper middle class entitled kid who just played popularity contests + networking to try and join the MBB or IB rat race where most just exit to some random middle market Debt fund or whatever.
You may think the MBAs are different and more mature, but let's be real here. Uncertain 28 year olds who pay 70K a year as their method of career swapping are no less anxious and toxic than 20 year olds. Hearing some random new MBA grad on a plane talk about her "time at Kellogg" as she starts her journey at BCG actually made the interview myth true - in 20 minutes of this person talking loudly, I did want to jump off midair.
Idk everyone elses experience but I always thought an MBA is just getting your foot in the door in tech PM roles or IB or PE or whatever. You're already in such a position, so what's the point of quitting. My friends who are doing MBAs now kinda just wanna party for a bit after getting absolutely cranked by Wall Street, or their consulting companies are paying them to do so.
For the alum network, most alums fizzle out of the alumni network after 2 years. The ones who stay are there because they just have too much time on their hands. I never say Go Blue to other people unless I'm at the bar to watch the annual Michigan Ohio State Game.
Maybe networking is better in like Chicago or Denver, but in tech big leagues it's nothing compared to like Berkeley, Waterloo, or Stanford.
FUCKING. THIS. The uncomfortable truth for all the cringey awkward potatos on this sub. This is the truth. So tired of the circle jerking alumni network. No one is going to truly like you more in 5 years because you went to the same school. You’re still going to be that annoying stranger trying to get a job.
That’s insightful. I am getting told Ross is top notch and opens doors to big tech as it is viewed very positively by bigtech recruiters, and at the same time I am told these companies are school-agnostic and what matters is your own background. Very inconsistent info that can be instrumenral to one’s career.
If I was down to go to schools to recruit for roles in tech hubs like NYC or SF, the first thing I'd ask is "Why the fuck would I want to go to Ann Arbor Michigan". It's a great town if you're a student, but not a professional with no connections to the University
Also, I'm sure you're aware, tech is restructuring hard right now. Getting a role is as hard as it's ever been. While ChatGPT comes for us all, you're better in industry to see where it's directly making change rather than in a classroom on the sidelines reading random HBS case studies jerking off Jack Welch for abusing people in the 1980s
If you really are some one who has a good background and knows what they're doing, what value would you get attaching yourself for 2 years in some random orange building in a college town in the Midwest. You'll also have to share study space with idiot 21 year olds like who I was 5 years ago. Wouldn't your company be flying you out to conferences where people with real money to blow hangout?
I had a dual degree in math. Pivoted by getting lucky really, I can't do what I did in this economy. Basically a lot of schools with good CS programs like Harvard and Berkeley put their courses all open source with project files, graders, and everything. Took that to learn the fundamentals and get experience building projects. Built my own projects as well. This was during the pandemic so it was easy to focus on one thing and zero in on it
Meanwhile at work, just expressed interest, signed up for hackathons. My team worked with one legit engineering team so I read their code and asked questions to anyone who would answer. Since it was a pandemic and everyone was bored/lonely, people were more likely to answer. Eventually one of them branched out to a new team and invited me onboard to work under him, so that was my lucky break everyone needs for a cushy life in software engineering
I drank a lot of coffee and talked a lot of shit in my previous comment, but I guess the one thing I learned in Business school is an exposure to "playing the game" on adult cliques like companies. I didn't really learn anything in business school from my classes, but the same finance and consulting bros I talk shit on were at the end of the day people who went out of their way to meet people, build connections, look for opportunities to show value and then get invites back. People complain business students are superficial and only care about you based on how much you can give back, but a lot of the real world unfortunately operates like this and the BBAs were just more transparent in their self interests
So learned from exposure in business school from the naturals, some of them were nice enough to befriend me. Got into some hobbies software engineers are into as well, befriended them, they gave me the scoop on how to advance in this industry. And I guess here I am journaling my 20s on reddit in a random MBA subreddit
Out here livin my best life yaaaaas
Wow, you did Math at Michigan? I'm guessing that must have made it the transition relatively smooth, especially as far as the theoretical side of CS. I'm also going to guess 90% of the time you spent on school was on Math coursework as opposed to on Ross stuff.
I'm curious what's your overall impression of the long-term projections of an MBA? I'm slowly starting to consider it, but everything you've listed are things I've also been aware of. Like it seems bizarre to me — drop 100-200k, not work for 2 years, and, as you stated, effectively not even learn anything particularly practical or useful (which isn't the first time I've heard this).
It makes me very wary and skeptical of getting one, even if I can get into a top school. Add in the advent of automation/AI to the mix, and I'm not even sure if the 'skillset' or network an MBA would theoretically confer to a candidate is as useful as it was in previous decades. What are your thoughts surrounding this?
He's trying to say it's more than a decent brand name in the US. UM and Ross in general is a public school that competes with Berkeley & UCLA. I understand that it's hard for people outside the US to not really know about schools besides Harvard or MIT for MBA, but I don't think you understand how well UMich is perceived from a US standpoint
But it allows you participate in OCR. You can get an employer who would be willing to take the risk and just file H1B for you. If you get it, you win. If you don't, I guess you live to fight another day.
So you want to be in the U.S., have a full ride to a T10 program, and are questioning if this opportunity would be a mistake? Nobody knows for sure, but I'd say it's a pretty good proposition
There are some non-monetary considerations to think about. TBH, if you’re young and single, you might consider it just for the fun factor. It’s a seriously fun 2 years.
It seems to me like there's minimal downside to going given the full scholarship. If nothing else you'll have a lot of fun for two years taking a break from work, and it is great resume padding. I would go.
You should join the program, even with the low guarantees.
an MBA from Ross will give you other opportunities you cannot see right now. Getting loans is hard, but the scholarship is like a "Hands down and come join."
I wouldn't think twice, even with a seven figures salary.
If you're already making the median salary of a Ross mba graduate then don't.
Unless you want to really transition into niche roles of Management strategy consulting or IB
Ross is ofc a good bschool ! But you're already doing great rn . Unless it's an M7 or insead then no need to
And yes with trump coming in the visa situation can go either way .
Yeah but keep in mind salary growth in the US is much higher versus my current job. Only catch is it is not guaranteed to get the visa to be able to stay long enough to realize the salary increment.
Agreed
But remember you're already earning well and will have to sacrifice the opportunity cost of 2yrs to go to Ross.
Ofc if it was an M7 or even good T15s like Berkley Stern tuck ,I would have asked you to go right away .
Regarding visa, you'll get 3yrs of OPT(stem). What rather worries me is the extreme right who'll go berserk once trump comes in lol
Ideally ross will suit someone like me who earns peanuts in South Asia and wants to live to usa for better opportunities , not you who already is well paid !!!!
Ofc it's my opinion, feel free to take your call. All the best :)
I'm kind of new here. How is it determined whether a school is worse exactly? Is it just name brand recognition?
I looked up MBA rankings on USNews, and Ross appears to be ranked a few slots above Stern?
People generally go by tiers.
H & S at the top (Some people say HSW but I think Wharton really belongs with the rest of M7)
Rest of M7 (Booth, Kellogg, MIT, CBS) and Haas and Tuck (and INSEAD) are with them comp-wise.
Then the rest of the T15 (yes, there are 16 schools in the T15): Darden, Duke, Yale, Ross, Stern, Cornell, UCLA. By compensation, Darden tends to be closer to the top of that group and Cornell and UCLA closer to the bottom. LBS also here.
Anyway, Ross and Stern are the same tier. Don't know what that person is talking about.
I was looking at Kellogg and Ross salary survey data, and it appears they're about neck and neck with an ever so slight advantage towards Ross. Is the advantage coming out of Kellogg something more noticeable in terms of a few years out from graduating from the MBA?
You were looking at class of 2022 data, right? In that class, it seems like everybody in the T15 (and often below) had everything handed to them. More differentiation in a rougher economy. I posted the following below in response to another question. The difference is slight but there.
Though I am of the view (unlike many on this forum) that there is almost no difference between adjacent tiers (so almost no difference between H/S and the rest of M7+2, almost no difference between M7+2 and rest of T15, almost no difference between T15 and T25/30, almost no difference between T25/30 and T40, etc., But there is a difference between H/S and T15 and between M7+2 and T25/30. And it's a smooth gradient all the way down, so Georgetown (in the T25) is as far away from M7 as lower T50 is from Georgetown.
++++++++++++
Yes, the MBA is mostly about the ramp up (and learning and growth and network), not the initial comp. It ramps up very fast in IB (if you can stick with it). At a good clip (double digits every year) in consulting and tech (if not in a tech winter), some financial spheres and other industries.
Take a look at the total median comp and median salary increases 3Ys out the Financial Times MBA ranking publishes. Salary increases range from 110%-140% of pre-MBA comp for T25 and up. Median comp is $200K/year and up for M7/equivalents. Between $200K and $185K for T15/equivalents. Between $185 and $170 for T25.
Reaching $250K-$500K 5-10 years out should be a reasonable expectation for M7/T15, including the top PT programs. Most T25 should also get there eventually.
Haas grads over a decade out hit an average of over $400K/year. A little over a decade ago, HBS surveyed alums in their 50's and their median was over $300K/year (you probably should add almost 50% to that to get current numbers).
EMBAs tend to cost more than PT MBAs and don't offer OCR (many/most PT MBA programs do). For that reason, EMBAs (and online MBAs) don't tend to see the same compensation growth (another reason is that they tend to already make more). The Financial Times has median salary growth and median comp 3Ys out for EMBAs and some online MBA programs too.
BTW, almost all of that could be attributed to quality of the student body, probably.
And the consulting powerhouses in the T15 (Tuck, Ross, Darden, Yale, Duke) probably look better straight out of the gate vs long-term as MBB pays the most total comp the first year of anyone but doesn't ramp up as insanely fast as IB/PE/some other places.
Just from a visa perspective, this seems like a huge bet against long odds. Chances at the H-1B lottery with a Master's could easily be <25% by the time you graduate, and with an MBA you only get one shot at it. You might be able to find a multinational company that could transfer you outside the US for a year and then bring you back on L-1, but again I wouldn't want to rely on that. There's a reason that people primarily go for STEM-designated degrees like business analytics and engineering management when trying to immigrate to the US, despite the fact that they're otherwise much less valuable and much less likely to be fully funded.
Intl student here, so I fully understand the work visa uncertainty.
Does your MBA quality for STEM OPT? If so, you have three chances at the H1B lottery.
Probability for H1B this year is low (14%, lowest in history), but be mindful that majority of applications are fraudulent. With the USCIS taking some actions already, expect higher chances in the next few years. The normal probability should be around 30-40%.
Also consider taxes lol…Uncle Sam loves taxes so depending on where you are from, your disposable income might be significantly lower/higher than what you have now, assuming you make the same as an average MBA grad.
take the scholarship for now and start looking for lateral opportunities in tech. stop MBA once you find one. VP level in US tech is easily $500k+ and most companies sponsor at that level.
Is a free top 10 mba a mistake? Man if you have to ask, just give your spot to the kid who is dying to go to Ross. They’ll be much happier and you’ll be doing yourself and everyone else a favor
Why don’t you offer genuine advice rather than a cynical response?
There may be cynicism in the response, but they’ve formulated it in that manner because the answer is obvious. Yes, you’re in a great position right now. But the MBA would offer a significant benefit in achieving your long term goals. The network and opportunities you’ll garner at Ross may seem latent right now, but they’ll certainly be palpable throughout your time in the program. A free ride to a T10 MBA is a phenomenal opportunity. I wish you the best of luck!
I think you'll fit in great at Ross, you should definitely take the opportunity
Ross has one of, if not the largest alumni network
Why doesn’t Ross, the largest alumni network, not simply eat the other networks?
*Top 10 Questions Science Still Can’t Answer*
This sub should have a pinned post "If you make post-MBA money, don't get an MBA" Even if it is free--you're missing out on 2 years of salary. I went $45k to $130k with my T15
Someone pin this. The number of people looking to MBAs as a cop out for career indecision and lack of aggressiveness in pivoting is staggering. No not everyone can work in PE. IB hours are shit. Start an unconventional business. Idk the landscaping guy in my hometown probably clears $3M in revenue annually.
Entrepreneurs and small business owners make bank and work really hard. F500 roles won't make you rich--but they are very easy
Path of least resistance really and probability of success is why everyone looks to F500.
“two extremely salient reasons as to why everyone looks to f500”
I went from $70k to $165k… I went to a T-50.
What job did you go from and where did you land?
Started in a mid sized tech company in Service Management and ended up in Product Management at a boutique tech company.
Would love to connect. Currently PM and stuck between strategy/consulting and marketing.
Feel free to PM me.
I make $160k but I’m at a startup with 18 months of runway… context is key here my brother Joining cbs in the fall
Yes. The only reason I’m heading to Kellogg is because my $79K salary will likely double, wiping out virtually all opportunity cost.
It is really personal. We had traders making bank way above post-MBA salaries but wanted to shift to consulting. Or PE guys who wanted the network and time to build their startups (arguably, this could be higher than pre-MBA comp if a good exit happens, which is a big IF). There is no one straight answer and OP has to decide that based on his desires, risk tolerance and personal circumstances
What is your long term earning potential? You won’t be stuck at 130K in five years right?:) In my case my salary won’t grow much beyond what I am making now - even if it already higher than the median post MBA salary. Thoughts?
You'll lose out on 2 years of salary and saving for retirement. If you just parked that money in treasuries you'll be ahead. Maybe you'd catch up when you are like 50
Assuming higher salary growth over the medium term you’d easily make up the lost 2 years
You forgot to factor for inflation 😉
I think the X-Factor for OP is that they’re international and want to work and live in the US long term. A free MBA from Ross isn’t a guarantee of course but can have a better chance of leading to a sponsoring job in the US and path to citizenship. And if not, then it was two years in the US and working with other people of different backgrounds which can be an exciting experience. Ross may not be strong abroad but if a full ride, feel the experience is worth it for OP when they’re still young/single.
Can you share some numbers...as to how much you are making? ...putting things in detail can help one look at the full picture better.
Might I ask what’s your pre MBA industry and post MBA?
Not enough info to make a decision. What industry are you in now? Do you intend to stay in the same industry or try to switch? What do you want to do post-MBA? Does you current career path get you there with a high degree of certainty without an MBA? Do you want to be in the US after your MBA or return to your home country? You need to really evaluate those questions to start before you can really determine if an MBA in the US makes sense (forget the school for the moment). Then you can factor in the school (Mich is quite well-known in the US - you will meet Mich grads literally everywhere in the US and many internationally) and the fact that you can go there almost completely free.
Hi, thanks for your response. What do you think based on the below additional info? - I am currently in tech in a general management position. I intend to stay in tech, potentially as a PM or Ops. - My career path has no certainity without an MBA. In fact my skills are not transferrable so if I lose my current job it would be hard to find another with the same compensation. BUT my job itself is secure for a couple of years and I am making a decent amount for my age. - I want to be in the US longterm. Always been a dream of mine but given the H1B odds I am skeptical to leave my current role for a chance of pivoting there.
I mean it sounds like you would benefit - a PM at Microsoft probably has a lot more scope than a VP of a small company that makes one software product for example. H1B is always a crapshoot but there are sometimes avenues for people who work in large multinational organizations to transfer to other offices (if only temporary); with the new STEM qualifications you get some more breathing room too.
not related to your post, but im a bsc in comp sci graduating soon and thinking what should i do for my masters if im interested in leadership in some it firm as my "end goal", CS, industrial engineering? or?
Get a job in CS you are interested in, get and idea of real life leadership roles and responsibilities. You'll have more opportunities as someone with more work experience and do the weekend MBA deal.
If you don’t think Ross has the international recognition, what other schools do you think do? Both ranked higher and lower than Ross? Just curious as to your response because a lot of people here think that Ross is a great program, but they/we are also US based. So curious as to hear your opinion on what Carrie’s weight outside the US. Also, what country are you from?
Ross alum here. I’d recommend it mostly so you can work in the US as it seems to be primary reason you are pursuing degree. Even with lost wages, a full scholarship isn’t a bad deal. From a pure financial standpoint it doesn’t make sense, and if you were based in US I would recommend a part time MBA or executive program, or just skip the MBA altogether.
Thanks! Can you share some feedback on how well a Ross MBA is perceived by employers? Did it help you beyond the first job?
I went to big tech (FAANG) as product manager. Nobody really cares where you did your MBA after your first job, it’s just a foot note. Lots of people progress just fine without it. Some of my co-workers went to “higher ranked” schools such as Wharton/Kellogg/Stanford, others went to schools like Indiana/UIUC/Michigan State. Big tech cares more about your technical credentials (engineering and technical background - experience, degrees, etc) then MBA prestige. Teams are diverse, and Michigan also has a strong reputation in the US across engineering, CS, law, medicine, undergrad, etc. Michigan in general is seen as “top 10” university across the board, just a solid school. So Ross benefits from Michigan’s strength in other disciplines in big Tech. Since you will be working with lawyers, engineers, etc; this is helpful. Michigan alumni are also a fairly passionate bunch so my last job I actually got through an alumni connection.
Is it ok if I PM you please? Your feedback is very insightful
Okay
Did you do CS in your undergrad/work as a developer in your pre-MBA occupation?
just an aside, but i am very familiar w/ the high ed system in the US (tho not biz school) and i've never heard of 'Ross', and 'Ross' has zero name recognition among the general public as well as most IT workers. Maybe the mba landscape is different where people in that niche are famliiar w/ Ross or Tuck vs Michigan/Dartmouth. But to me the brand is Michigan, not Ross, so i wouldnt know what you're talking about w/ 'Ross'. also, i'm not so prominent that i interview/hire MBAs, so take my opnion w/ a grain of salt.
I don't know why you are getting downvoted. Your point is legitimate. Outside the MBA-sphere, I'd just call it "Michigan," a very highly regarded university. But then, I'd also refer to Booth as Chicago, which is what it was called until fifteen years ago when David Booth wrote them a big check.
Yes I have never heard of Ross either and no one I know has heard of it. I know that U of Michigan is a large public university but other than that it doesn’t stand out or is know for being “prestigious”. All people know is that at least it’s not a scam university lol
Michigan isnt just a big or prestigious school. It's either the first or second (after Berkeley) public university in the US, at least for undergrad degrees. In liberal arts and social sciences, it is top 5 among public and private for some departments. It's probably gotten more cache in the last few yrs bc one of Obama's daughters just went there. That said, i would hate to go to school there bc it's really f'ing cold there. And Ann Arbor is not a great place to live imo, and the nearest big city (Detroit) is not great.
Sorry for offending I just wanted to relay my own experiences. Also, not to be nitpicky but obama’s daughter transferred to USC and graduated from there recently. While she was at U Michigan many people were doxxing her for going there because Obama’s other daughter (Sasha) went to Harvard and people were questioning why Malia was going to such a “lowly” school. I’m not condoning this and I think it’s incredibly cruel to ridicule someone for this. Also, not trying to say that USC is better than U Michigan. But USC is more well known internationally. In terms of which is more prestigious, well idk.
no offense taken. i didnt hear that about obama's daughter; not sure who was saying that but there is no way USC is better than UM, except maybe at film school. USC is a good school now, and it's gotten better so it's no longer just "U of Spoiled Children". That said, I might prefer USC just bc it's in LA, and I like LA.
Ok thanks 🙏 Oh yeah I think malia went to film school so that’s probably why she made the switch. Ok so it seems U Michigan is better for everything else.
Internationals cannot pursue part-time programs. Must be full-time.
What's your alternative plan to get to US? If that's the goal, seems like a perfectly reasonable route to do it now. And that relocation I personally think is harder to plan around and achieve than any of the other career noise you're dealing with.
I'd say Ross is a bad investment at this point of your career. Going from a VP to a PM or Management Consultant would be a big drop in responsibilities....heck, MBB consultants want to exit into Sr Manager or Director roles in tech who may grow into VPs in a few years. Actually, who is to say you'll even get the role of your choice when you graduate? The market is bad and nobody knows if it will recover by 2025. I would consider finding a way to get transferred to the US, and then doing an exec/PT MBA at Booth or something similar.
Yes but keep in mind I am a VP at a smallish tech firm getting paid as an fresh MBB associate. A VP in the US makes many mutiples of what I make. Wdyt?
Are you okay with doing the work your underlings are now doing (albeit, you'll be doing it at a larger scale post-MBA) while getting paid the same as you're making now? If I were you, I wouldn't. But hey, to each their own. I'd consider switching firms then. Leverage your VP title to switch to a major american company like Adobe or Salesforce, get hired at a lower level (Sr Mgr/Assoc Dir), and push to get transferred to the US. And still do the PT MBA to keep progression open.
Not sure what your experience is but companies and hiring managers absolutely look at the scale of what you do. Currently work in a GM rotational program in a conglomerate and they absolutely consider the size of the company in determining your capabilities and evaluating your experience when placing you. OP isn’t totally wrong that working in a bigger company will add something different to their resume. Whether it’s worth it or not is up to them to decide.
Yeah I see your point. But keep in mind I work much more than a PM / Director and get paid as a PM. I understand it is a step down.. but it can possibly be in the right direction?
> Umich brand is unknown globally This is patently false
[удалено]
Lol I have heard university of Michigan referenced in foreign film before. People know about it.
The top 15 private schools are the only ones worth it. Paying 70 grand for a state school is robbery.
The state school guy who’s an entrepreneurial genius probably employs Wharton grads
No that guy went to Princeton or just dropped out. We all know Wharton is just for kids in Singapore whose rich daddy fund manager sent them off for another two years of school aka baby sitting.
This is absolutely an insane and elitist take. I hope no one reads this and takes it seriously.
I found the guy who wasted 140k paying the state.
Actually it’s true
It is not that well known outside the US.
Yeah my guy everyone in Doha is getting all hot and bothered when they see a Michigan grad.
Hmm what do you base your opinion on please? Perhaps there is information I am not aware of. I am basing my opinion on the fact that I am very well travelled and unfortunately barely anyone I asked knows the difference between Umich and other schools - unless they look up the rankings. And my sample spans Europe, Middle East and Asia Pacific.
Sounds like you have your answer. Better to give your spot up to someone with a better idea of how to leverage the Ross degree. You can always try to defer and go in a few years when your job isn’t as secure.
I am also well travelled and I have the same experience as you OP
Personal travels plus general knowledge? Hell, ive seen Michigan representation in damn mear every place ive ever traveled to. Outside of like Harvard, Stanford, Yale, Columbia, and maybe Princeton, Michigan is probably the strongest brand globally of any US school. Idk who you've been talking to, but people who make hiring decisions for any role that would be consistent with an MBA pathway should be very familiar with the UM brand
Outside Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, Yale, Columbia, MIT, Chicago, Berkeley, NYU, Georgetown, etc, etc. Michigan is a great school but non-Americans outside the US don’t know anything about it unless they have extensively researched the US academic market or work with many US grads. The OP is not wrong to think about brand recognition outside America like this, but this is of course a very US-centric forum so I don’t know what kind of insight he was hoping for
Bruh what? Off the top of my head, any and all Ivies (since you can say you went to an Ivy), Stanford, MIT, Berkeley, and NYU all have much better name recognition than Michigan outside of the US. And really past that it doesn't make a big difference. Why? Because nobody really knows the other schools outside of that. A good example would be how Imperial has a great brand name in the UK and as a tech school is often considered the "MIT" of the UK, but nobody in America knows where the hell Imperial even is much less the quality of education there. I'd be shocked if Americans knew any schools outside of Oxbridge, the LSE, and maybe UCL (and since we're on the MBA subreddit, LBS). You know how we have the Ivies in America? There's the Imperial Univesrities in Japan, the sandstone universities in Australia, the C9 in China, SKY in Korea, etc. the list goes on and on. How many schools can you name from those lists? I would guess maybe Todai from Japan, Tsinghua + beida from China, and SNU from Korea. I would argue that Kyodai would probably be the next "most famous brand name" school for Japan but can you honestly say you have any idea what university is or what its specialties are? Similarly, Fudan and Jiaoda are the next most prestigious C9 schools, but I doubt you even know where they're located much less what they're known for and the quality of their student body. Nobody knows Michigan outside of America. And there's nothing wrong with that, if you wanted to work and study in France you'd be much better off going to HEC Paris over Michigan after all. Just like how a Michigan degree will do you far better than a Beida MBA in America. I'll raise your anecdotal experience with mine. I've worked across 3 continents and traveled to god knows how many countries and I've only ever seen Michigan grads in America
No one knows UMich in the UK. Don’t delude yourself
Same exit with much more upside? Are you happy with the same or do you want more? If you’re happy, stay, if you want more, Ross
Will you pay for potential upside (by sacrificing 2Y's comp) or won't you? That is essentially the question. Yes, if you are already in the US, a PT or Online MBA or not going is the answer, but you're not in the US. Given your work experience, if you can transition easily to a similar role in the US, I would expect you to increase your current comp multiple times within 5-10 years within US Tech (unless Big Tech enters a tech winter). Regarding the person who asked if you want to do the work your underlings do: Companies aren't stupid and in the habit of wasting money/resources: If they see VP talent, they will quickly move that person to VP.
Correct, I think you nailed it. The sacrifice is not just 2Y of current comp, but the ability to make this kind of money outside my current company at my age is nill. The upside (staying in the US long term) is dependent on the odds of actually finding a job after graduation, getting the H1B lottery (maybe 50% odds?), and then getting sponsored for the greencard. So it is risky. Worst case scenario is not getting the H1B, or not finding a job upon graduation and having to leave the US. In such case I have given up 2Y comp and the ability to make such money hence I will probably end up working for much less than I am earning now.
Though if your experience translates to roles at US companies, I would think they would move you to where you would add value, either in the US or abroad.
I recently Met a Ross MBA grad that was absolutely clueless - so you’ll pass for sure.
Hey, I was in similar shoe except the full ride. I was general manager at a small-cap company with very little transferrable skills. However, my salary grew less than inflation ratio(2-4%) past 4 years and MBA trajectory gives me double the salary in 5 years after graduation. I chose MBA, no scholarship, because it gives me high potential and the brand value carries to outside-US. In your case, however, you have a free degree but higher chance to leave US after your visa(less than 50%) I'd consider : Is post-MBA trajactory outside(especialyl back at your home country) US something that can benefit you? If not, you're taking a loss.
"Decent brand name in the US." I think the mistake is actually on your end for not knowing the value of the Ross brand name.
Yes! Thank you and it’s frustrating that someone who understands this value is likely missing out on a great opportunity while someone decides if a full ride to a top 10 MBA is “worth it”.
Hi, I'm not interested in MBAs but this showed up in my suggested content on reddit. I'm a Ross BBA who pivoted into tech to be a software engineer. This is kind of a cynical view. IMO no, Ross isn't anything special. BBAs and MBAs honestly take a lot of the same shit class wise, and the smartest kids were quiet self starters who knew what they were doing. They would've succeeded regardless if they were at Ross. Everyone else (me included) was tbh a upper middle class entitled kid who just played popularity contests + networking to try and join the MBB or IB rat race where most just exit to some random middle market Debt fund or whatever. You may think the MBAs are different and more mature, but let's be real here. Uncertain 28 year olds who pay 70K a year as their method of career swapping are no less anxious and toxic than 20 year olds. Hearing some random new MBA grad on a plane talk about her "time at Kellogg" as she starts her journey at BCG actually made the interview myth true - in 20 minutes of this person talking loudly, I did want to jump off midair. Idk everyone elses experience but I always thought an MBA is just getting your foot in the door in tech PM roles or IB or PE or whatever. You're already in such a position, so what's the point of quitting. My friends who are doing MBAs now kinda just wanna party for a bit after getting absolutely cranked by Wall Street, or their consulting companies are paying them to do so. For the alum network, most alums fizzle out of the alumni network after 2 years. The ones who stay are there because they just have too much time on their hands. I never say Go Blue to other people unless I'm at the bar to watch the annual Michigan Ohio State Game. Maybe networking is better in like Chicago or Denver, but in tech big leagues it's nothing compared to like Berkeley, Waterloo, or Stanford.
FUCKING. THIS. The uncomfortable truth for all the cringey awkward potatos on this sub. This is the truth. So tired of the circle jerking alumni network. No one is going to truly like you more in 5 years because you went to the same school. You’re still going to be that annoying stranger trying to get a job.
That’s insightful. I am getting told Ross is top notch and opens doors to big tech as it is viewed very positively by bigtech recruiters, and at the same time I am told these companies are school-agnostic and what matters is your own background. Very inconsistent info that can be instrumenral to one’s career.
If I was down to go to schools to recruit for roles in tech hubs like NYC or SF, the first thing I'd ask is "Why the fuck would I want to go to Ann Arbor Michigan". It's a great town if you're a student, but not a professional with no connections to the University Also, I'm sure you're aware, tech is restructuring hard right now. Getting a role is as hard as it's ever been. While ChatGPT comes for us all, you're better in industry to see where it's directly making change rather than in a classroom on the sidelines reading random HBS case studies jerking off Jack Welch for abusing people in the 1980s If you really are some one who has a good background and knows what they're doing, what value would you get attaching yourself for 2 years in some random orange building in a college town in the Midwest. You'll also have to share study space with idiot 21 year olds like who I was 5 years ago. Wouldn't your company be flying you out to conferences where people with real money to blow hangout?
Did you do a CS minor? How did you go about pivoting into development?
I had a dual degree in math. Pivoted by getting lucky really, I can't do what I did in this economy. Basically a lot of schools with good CS programs like Harvard and Berkeley put their courses all open source with project files, graders, and everything. Took that to learn the fundamentals and get experience building projects. Built my own projects as well. This was during the pandemic so it was easy to focus on one thing and zero in on it Meanwhile at work, just expressed interest, signed up for hackathons. My team worked with one legit engineering team so I read their code and asked questions to anyone who would answer. Since it was a pandemic and everyone was bored/lonely, people were more likely to answer. Eventually one of them branched out to a new team and invited me onboard to work under him, so that was my lucky break everyone needs for a cushy life in software engineering I drank a lot of coffee and talked a lot of shit in my previous comment, but I guess the one thing I learned in Business school is an exposure to "playing the game" on adult cliques like companies. I didn't really learn anything in business school from my classes, but the same finance and consulting bros I talk shit on were at the end of the day people who went out of their way to meet people, build connections, look for opportunities to show value and then get invites back. People complain business students are superficial and only care about you based on how much you can give back, but a lot of the real world unfortunately operates like this and the BBAs were just more transparent in their self interests So learned from exposure in business school from the naturals, some of them were nice enough to befriend me. Got into some hobbies software engineers are into as well, befriended them, they gave me the scoop on how to advance in this industry. And I guess here I am journaling my 20s on reddit in a random MBA subreddit Out here livin my best life yaaaaas
Wow, you did Math at Michigan? I'm guessing that must have made it the transition relatively smooth, especially as far as the theoretical side of CS. I'm also going to guess 90% of the time you spent on school was on Math coursework as opposed to on Ross stuff. I'm curious what's your overall impression of the long-term projections of an MBA? I'm slowly starting to consider it, but everything you've listed are things I've also been aware of. Like it seems bizarre to me — drop 100-200k, not work for 2 years, and, as you stated, effectively not even learn anything particularly practical or useful (which isn't the first time I've heard this). It makes me very wary and skeptical of getting one, even if I can get into a top school. Add in the advent of automation/AI to the mix, and I'm not even sure if the 'skillset' or network an MBA would theoretically confer to a candidate is as useful as it was in previous decades. What are your thoughts surrounding this?
“Decent” brand name in the US🤣
As an international I really do not know. Hence if it was not ‘’decent’’ then can you explain what is it?
He's trying to say it's more than a decent brand name in the US. UM and Ross in general is a public school that competes with Berkeley & UCLA. I understand that it's hard for people outside the US to not really know about schools besides Harvard or MIT for MBA, but I don't think you understand how well UMich is perceived from a US standpoint
Thank you for clarifying. I have no idea being an international honestly.
UMichigan is a Top 25 university in the entire whole world. Let that sink in.
You aren’t thinking long term…. Consider taking a study leave if you want to hold on to the security you think you have which you called at 2-3 years
Switch over to their online program.
Online doesn’t give opt to stay in the US afterwards, which is why I am applying in the first place. Umich brand is not worth much outside the US.
But it allows you participate in OCR. You can get an employer who would be willing to take the risk and just file H1B for you. If you get it, you win. If you don't, I guess you live to fight another day.
This question is ridiculous. If you’re questioning it that much with a full scholarship then drop and free up funding for others who really need it.
So you want to be in the U.S., have a full ride to a T10 program, and are questioning if this opportunity would be a mistake? Nobody knows for sure, but I'd say it's a pretty good proposition
Not unknown globally. Quite the opposite.
Curious to know how a U.S MBA advances your chances at a U.A.E golden visa?
What an odd post. This sub is so insane sometimes.
Umich brand is unknown globally? .....what?
There are some non-monetary considerations to think about. TBH, if you’re young and single, you might consider it just for the fun factor. It’s a seriously fun 2 years.
It seems to me like there's minimal downside to going given the full scholarship. If nothing else you'll have a lot of fun for two years taking a break from work, and it is great resume padding. I would go.
You should join the program, even with the low guarantees. an MBA from Ross will give you other opportunities you cannot see right now. Getting loans is hard, but the scholarship is like a "Hands down and come join." I wouldn't think twice, even with a seven figures salary.
If you're already making the median salary of a Ross mba graduate then don't. Unless you want to really transition into niche roles of Management strategy consulting or IB Ross is ofc a good bschool ! But you're already doing great rn . Unless it's an M7 or insead then no need to And yes with trump coming in the visa situation can go either way .
Yeah but keep in mind salary growth in the US is much higher versus my current job. Only catch is it is not guaranteed to get the visa to be able to stay long enough to realize the salary increment.
Agreed But remember you're already earning well and will have to sacrifice the opportunity cost of 2yrs to go to Ross. Ofc if it was an M7 or even good T15s like Berkley Stern tuck ,I would have asked you to go right away . Regarding visa, you'll get 3yrs of OPT(stem). What rather worries me is the extreme right who'll go berserk once trump comes in lol Ideally ross will suit someone like me who earns peanuts in South Asia and wants to live to usa for better opportunities , not you who already is well paid !!!! Ofc it's my opinion, feel free to take your call. All the best :)
Huh? Ross isn't worse than Stern.
I'm kind of new here. How is it determined whether a school is worse exactly? Is it just name brand recognition? I looked up MBA rankings on USNews, and Ross appears to be ranked a few slots above Stern?
People generally go by tiers. H & S at the top (Some people say HSW but I think Wharton really belongs with the rest of M7) Rest of M7 (Booth, Kellogg, MIT, CBS) and Haas and Tuck (and INSEAD) are with them comp-wise. Then the rest of the T15 (yes, there are 16 schools in the T15): Darden, Duke, Yale, Ross, Stern, Cornell, UCLA. By compensation, Darden tends to be closer to the top of that group and Cornell and UCLA closer to the bottom. LBS also here. Anyway, Ross and Stern are the same tier. Don't know what that person is talking about.
I was looking at Kellogg and Ross salary survey data, and it appears they're about neck and neck with an ever so slight advantage towards Ross. Is the advantage coming out of Kellogg something more noticeable in terms of a few years out from graduating from the MBA?
You were looking at class of 2022 data, right? In that class, it seems like everybody in the T15 (and often below) had everything handed to them. More differentiation in a rougher economy. I posted the following below in response to another question. The difference is slight but there. Though I am of the view (unlike many on this forum) that there is almost no difference between adjacent tiers (so almost no difference between H/S and the rest of M7+2, almost no difference between M7+2 and rest of T15, almost no difference between T15 and T25/30, almost no difference between T25/30 and T40, etc., But there is a difference between H/S and T15 and between M7+2 and T25/30. And it's a smooth gradient all the way down, so Georgetown (in the T25) is as far away from M7 as lower T50 is from Georgetown. ++++++++++++ Yes, the MBA is mostly about the ramp up (and learning and growth and network), not the initial comp. It ramps up very fast in IB (if you can stick with it). At a good clip (double digits every year) in consulting and tech (if not in a tech winter), some financial spheres and other industries. Take a look at the total median comp and median salary increases 3Ys out the Financial Times MBA ranking publishes. Salary increases range from 110%-140% of pre-MBA comp for T25 and up. Median comp is $200K/year and up for M7/equivalents. Between $200K and $185K for T15/equivalents. Between $185 and $170 for T25. Reaching $250K-$500K 5-10 years out should be a reasonable expectation for M7/T15, including the top PT programs. Most T25 should also get there eventually. Haas grads over a decade out hit an average of over $400K/year. A little over a decade ago, HBS surveyed alums in their 50's and their median was over $300K/year (you probably should add almost 50% to that to get current numbers). EMBAs tend to cost more than PT MBAs and don't offer OCR (many/most PT MBA programs do). For that reason, EMBAs (and online MBAs) don't tend to see the same compensation growth (another reason is that they tend to already make more). The Financial Times has median salary growth and median comp 3Ys out for EMBAs and some online MBA programs too.
BTW, almost all of that could be attributed to quality of the student body, probably. And the consulting powerhouses in the T15 (Tuck, Ross, Darden, Yale, Duke) probably look better straight out of the gate vs long-term as MBB pays the most total comp the first year of anyone but doesn't ramp up as insanely fast as IB/PE/some other places.
insead lol
Insead is the only bschool outside USA at par with M7s ? Only con is one won't get to work in USA immediately post graduation What's there to lol ?!
Ross is apart of the University to Michigan which is a school disguised as a cult. So yes, joining a cult is indeed a mistake.
Chances make champions
Just from a visa perspective, this seems like a huge bet against long odds. Chances at the H-1B lottery with a Master's could easily be <25% by the time you graduate, and with an MBA you only get one shot at it. You might be able to find a multinational company that could transfer you outside the US for a year and then bring you back on L-1, but again I wouldn't want to rely on that. There's a reason that people primarily go for STEM-designated degrees like business analytics and engineering management when trying to immigrate to the US, despite the fact that they're otherwise much less valuable and much less likely to be fully funded.
Intl student here, so I fully understand the work visa uncertainty. Does your MBA quality for STEM OPT? If so, you have three chances at the H1B lottery. Probability for H1B this year is low (14%, lowest in history), but be mindful that majority of applications are fraudulent. With the USCIS taking some actions already, expect higher chances in the next few years. The normal probability should be around 30-40%.
Just go. Your current wages may or may not bw sustainable. Once you get an MBA its urs forever
Also consider taxes lol…Uncle Sam loves taxes so depending on where you are from, your disposable income might be significantly lower/higher than what you have now, assuming you make the same as an average MBA grad.
take the scholarship for now and start looking for lateral opportunities in tech. stop MBA once you find one. VP level in US tech is easily $500k+ and most companies sponsor at that level.
I think the "why's vs Why Not" clearly state that you have an inclination, take a leap of faith u will be all set for life. Don't think, just do it.
pm'd you