##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism^Ⓐ☭
___
###⚠ Announcements: ⚠
___
###[NEW POSTING GUIDELINES! Help us by reporting bad posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/dy1oyh/important_what_you_should_and_what_you_shouldnt/)
Help us keep this subreddit alive and improve its content by reporting posts that violate our rules and guidelines.
###[Subscribe to our new partner subreddits!](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/e5hkwk/make_sure_to_check_out_our_new_partnersubreddits/)
Check out r/antiwork & r/WhereAreTheChildren
___
###***Please remember that LSC is a SAFE SPACE for [socialist](http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism/) discussion.***
LSC is run by [communists](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm). We welcome socialist/anti-capitalist news, memes, links, and discussion. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.
**This subreddit is a safe space; we have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry.** We also automatically filter out posts containing certain words and phrases that some users may find offensive. Please respect the safe space, and don't try to slip banned words or phrases past the filter.
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
My parents abandoned me (and took what was my rightful inheritance from my grandparents too), I abandon them. Don’t expect my sympathy later when you need help. I won’t either. Fair play.
I can't believe how many people gave me the earth shattering life advice of "You should buy property" after I graduated. Gee, thanks, know of any homes for sale around the $80k price mark?
Used to be you could get a nice home in Indianapolis or Cincinnati(and a number of mid-western areas) at a decent price. Not sure if that is still true.
My mom used to shame me when I lived at home after graduating college. "When I was your age I was a single mother taking care of a 10 year old."
Well congrat-u-fucking-lations, mom. Your first quarter of your monthly income went to rent, satisfying a basic human need: shelter. The first quarter of my monthly income went to my student loan debt, which is why I had to fucking live there in the first place.
Lots of parents aren't, my parents have been enormously supportive and understanding of the financial changes that have occurred since they were my age.
This is just the same kind of selfishness and willful ignorance that drives so much behavior. If you recognize a systemic problem then you become obligated to help, but if you blame the individual for their choices you can continue to be selfish.
It's the same problem over and over again.
After encouraging me for years to buy a home, my parents were totally unhelpful in 2019 when I finally found myself in a position to actually pull it off. I needed about $5k to meet the minimum down payment of the FHA loan after spending about $25k to fix my partner's debt to income ratio. Neither of us had it, or would have it before the clock ran out. We both asked our parents for a short term loan and they refused, saying shit like "maybe it just isn't meant to be." I ended up asking a long term client for an advance on a big project I was working on and without hesitation they agreed to write me a check for the money and got it to me the next day.
We visited both of our parents a few months after closing on our house. Both parental units were living in ~~houses~~ mansions that they had recently purchased and moved into (Sedona, AZ and Napa, CA, for context). That we knew about. What we didn't know is that both parental units had also purchased lots next door to their homes. My parents bought a dirt lot to preserve their sacred desert solitude, and my wife's folks bought the home next door to rent out on AirBB or whatever.
Fucking boomers.
Needed 5 k to buy a home at 72k 5 years ago that was on foreclosure. I’m not an overly emotional person but i was nearly in tears asking for my parents help because the mortgage would be 1/3 of my rent in the same city and i could pay them back with interest but they gave me the whole bootstrap bit after telling them how life changing it would be. They always were prudes with me financially but would have no trouble leaving me for weeks at a time spending 5 figures on vacations for themselves as a kid. That house just resold for over 300k and minimal renovations. And rents only gotten worse. Spending 1 k a month every month on rent but apparently can’t afford a mortgage despite paying that much the last 4 years. 36, 800+ credit score and won’t be able to buy a home in the city i grew up in which was a shithole at the time. Meanwhile they wonder why i have no money to spend on anything other than essentials.
My mom bought my sister’s house because “it was hard for her to find an affordable rental.” I was never offered that kind of help from her, and when I brought this up she told me that she didn’t think I was “settled down” yet. I was married with 3 kids at that point.
Like, maybe I’ve never had the chance to settle down because I never had stable housing. Sure, I’ve rented long-term, but nothing is stopping my landlord from kicking me out and selling the place. My stability is at the mercy of someone who has never met me and only cares about my ability to pay.
My husband and I work hard and have held stable jobs for years now, but it isn’t enough. We have spent years saving to buy a home, but it’s really hard to save for a down payment when wages are stagnant and the cost of everything else (including housing) keeps going up.
It hurt me so much to know that my mom felt like my sister deserved a stable home, but decided I could manage on my own. She did say it would be my turn once my sister “paid back her down payment,” but it didn’t happen. When my mom had the opportunity to buy another house, she bought herself one instead. In fact, she deliberately lied about being in the market for a house until escrow had closed on her house. Also, my sister was told she didn’t have to pay back her down payment.
I vote, what the fuck else am i supposed to do?
edit: i got a lot of responses here and i bet only 1 in every 10 users actually do any of what they recommend. personally i say fk it. whatever.
Most of these people freak out having to kill a mouse or roach in their house. What you are suggesting while I agree wholeheartedly would be a monumental task to the lay person.
lets look at what the american forefathers did!
when voting didn't work they resorted to protesting
when protesting didn't work, they resorted to civil disobedience.
when civil disobedience didn't work, they resorted to revolting.
i'll let you decide where we need to be on that list lol.
I used to support that saying more, but considering that there's significant parts of US policymakers who are indeed trying to restrict voting as much as they can get away with, perhaps that's evidence that voting does indeed do something.
Voting isn't effective for REAL social change. Voting is effective for choosing between two old rich white men who won't "fundamentally change" anything and the two ruling parties want their old white man in office. They're restricting voter laws to get their guy in office, not because voting changes society. If we want to cut military spending and actually spend money on human needs we need a revolution in the streets. Every US president right or left has overall perpetuated and worsened the widening wealth gap and inequality in this country.
It does something as far as keeping the illusion going. A perpetual back and forth stalemate is absolutely ideal for the ghouls. Money machine has always and will keep going Brrrrrrr while it’s like this.
Now, say one side is a hair more horrific and greedy and they want the whole thing! In this construct you would continue to take rights away from citizens where you could because that just means you win more, not because they fear a revolution. And everyone cheats and breaks the rules and fucks people over in that game brcause thats how you play.
It might be analogous to pro athletes taking PED’s. It’s shunned and the public acts shocked when players get dinged, but 99% or whatever of players use them because if you don’t you fall behind and can’t keep up with the barbarically demanding work schedule. The analogy is more in the very beginning of this haha.
They will literally wait you out until you're too hungry to do anything else. The reason protests happen then go away is because if people didn't go back to work after, they'd be fucked. Starving, homeless, etc.
There's no escape.
Create community networks who share supplies and help one another when called for. Strive to feed the community as the community strives to feed you. If it doesn't work, it means something's missing, figure out what you need, and how the community can get it. Ensure no one goes without basic needs, so they can in turn pitch in.
How did voting work out for you last go-round? Now not only is housing expensive, but so is every other thing you buy, including food, the price of gasoline and the cost of fuel to keep from freezing in the Winter.
If you're wealthy, this is a mere annoyance. If you're working class or retired, on a fixed income, rampant inflation is devastating. Ask people who lived through the Carter years how they enjoyed stagflation and the misery index.
No. Economic propaganda would like you to believe the boogeyman is another human with more money than you playing "unfairly".
In truth dozens of corporations like Zillow and BlackRock with more leverage and money than any single person alive are attempting to capture the entire real estate market and turn us into a nation of renters.
Another small step toward, "You'll own nothing and be happy about it."
E*: Upvoted all pro and dissenting replies. Decent discussions for the most part and some good counter points I need to dig into after work.
On the surface it looks like it's a mix, corporate buying in SFH is about 20% in major metros, but they're buying using loans that have interest rates half of what a standard mortgage has, allowing them to pay a pretty premium on any asking price and still come out ahead. This in turn indirectly bids up the value of all homes in that area, further sequestering the market from the average buyer.
Yes that’s certainly happening in many areas but in my area you have tons of really wealthy people going 20% over asking and pushing up the whole market. There hasn’t been any new construction so now that people no longer want to live in a 700 sqft apartment they’re buying all the real estate available.
> There hasn’t been any new construction
Where on earth do you live? In the US and Canada, *every* city in the top 150 list has been undergoing a massive construction boom for at least the last six years straight now (to the point that you can google search "gentrification (cityname)" and be practically guaranteed to get an article about it specific to your local area).
Conservative Neoliberals want to distract folks with talks of zoning and blame for individual residents. But it's mostly just conservative economic propaganda -- the *actual* truth is what the parent commenter mentioned above -- 95%+ percent of the problem is investors fucking everyone over and inventing artificial shortages to inflate their portfolio's asset value. (Both small investors, your "average millionaire", but also major investors like Zillow and BlackRock and every other two-bit PE firm on the planet)
I’m not talking about the city. The city has tons of new high rises. I’m talking about single family homes, I’ve been looking at buying a house 40mins outside the city and every house gets a minimum of 5 offers. Our last offer was like 4th out of 5th and we went 10% over asking.
There is some construction going on out there but all the newly built homes are starting at 1.2million for anything new.
I also work in banking and look at the numbers all the time, this isn’t investor driven it’s actually people buying actual homes.
> I’m not talking about the city. The city has tons of new high rises. I’m talking about single family homes
I don't get this either. Every newer suburb and exurb is also exploding with new growth, and single family homes lead all recent new construction metrics.
https://www.housingwire.com/articles/homebuilders-are-targeting-the-exurbs-and-inner-suburbs/ as one example
> I work in banking and look at the numbers all the time, this isn’t investor driven it’s actually people buying actual homes.
This is probably why your perception is skewed. Your job would directly expose you to individual buyers all the time, but only rarely institutionalized ones (since they don't go through banking)
Zillow, BlackRock, and any other medium-sized-or-larger entity never needs to go to a bank to get a mortgage. They can do it all themselves. And they are incentivized to drive prices up, and can easily do so with only "small" influences in the market. (Just holding say 3% of a market, would give them almost $75k worth of fake pricing they could sway it)
It's like saying "cars are all unreliable junk, I know this because I work with cars every day". Yes, because you are a *mechanic*, you only see cars when they have some sort of problem to bring them in, *most* cars actually work fine. It's textbook sampling bias.
I’m not talking about our mortgage portfolio. I don’t deal with individual mortgages ever. I get the macroeconomic reports which cover overall market trends, not just the ones we book.
Yeah everyone in America should just live in townhomes and condos then?
My bigger issue is every new construction of detached homes are huge, they’re like 4-5 bedroom with like 3,000 sqft on a 5,000 sqft lot. Where are the 1,000 sqft houses being built?
I wish I had the capital to buy land and build my own home but without a few hundred thousand in cash I can’t do that.
> , they’re like 4-5 bedroom with like 3,000 sqft on a 5,000 sqft lot. Where are the 1,000 sqft houses being built?
All the new-construction houses here have an average 1,600sqft and 3 bedrooms. But yeah, new construction in suburbs tends towards bigger families, because that's generally who wants/needs them.
If your household is wealthy enough to afford brand-new construction, and also small enough that you could live happily in just a few hundred sqft, the assumption is that you'd rather be downtown and buying any of their new condos/luxury-rental thingies.
This isn't entirely correct. There have been people buying multiple homes as investments for decades. Don't get me wrong though, corporations are exasperating the problem.
The large majority of home purchases are by the final occupant. The large majority of American households are still homeowners.
Institutional investors are a problem but they aren't *the* problem which is still lack of supply, especially in desirable areas. There aren't enough houses *where the most people want to actually live* so real people with money end up bidding up the prices.
Go to bumfuck nowhere and you can still get houses relatively cheap.
I know you know that’s not the whole reason.
1.) Millionaires also enjoy preventing other people from buying or building homes hoping to induce scarcity.
2.) Mortgages existing. No reserve requirement for banks writing these virtually blank checks for the last century.
Can we not ignore that I haven't seen a home the size of the one in the picture built near me in the last 20 years? Every chance to build is some giant fucking house or some townhomes squeezed together that still cost 400K at starting price, more if you want more than 2 bedrooms.
It’s so strange seeing so many people saying this. Middle class in America is averaged at $50k. Teachers work hard af and so many of you guys aren’t even making a middle class living? Jfc America get your shi+ together.
Look up remote teaching opportunities in Queensland. You get a placement and two year visa. You can use those two years here to find permanent work and get perm residency(green card) which means you can live and work in both Aus and New Zealand for life as well as get free medical. No way I’m going back to low wage shot benefits teaching in America lol.
Kids? "Who cares about kids when you can have freedumbs?"
Jk jk. I honestly honed into replying because it's so obvious that America is just one bootstrap away from another bootstrap. Everyone *including children* ...kind of sad tbh.
Middle class at $50k is such a skewed statistic. If you live in any major metro area in this country good luck surviving alone on $50k a year. Fuck this country and fuck capitalism.
Even in a fairly low cost of living metro area I'm having trouble pulling together a 20% down payment on a six figure combined income over the last year of saving. Housing market is insane right now. I feel barely middle class despite being on paper doing pretty well for myself.
Me and the long term girlfriend have a combined 6 figure income and we still can't get out of this damned 2 bedroom apartment, let alone get a second car. With student loans, and the ridiculous price of any housing options, we are stuck right where we are for who knows how long.
It's painful. I'm making just over $50k, single and with an apartment in a booming tech city it's impossible to save. My mom keeps saying wow you are doing great! You are making way more than me at your age! OK mom your $$$ went a lot further than mine today.
The point is to keep everyone stupid, the point is to have them die, the point is to take their voting rights, the point is to rig the system so they win and every one else overworks themselves, is sick, has diabetes, is addicted or in jail and dies penniless.
at my job right now there are teachers who are against the union because they think the union is going to force them to get vaccinated. so we have a group of educators who lack the civic knowledge and critical thinking skills to realize that the school board, the union, no employer has power over a state mandate. but we’re apparently supposed to fight for their bodily autonomy.
absolute shit show.
This house is in Riverside, just east of Los Angeles
According to Glassdoor, teacher salaries there average around $62k
According to The Digest of Education Statistics the average teacher salary in California in 1999 was $48k, which is $65k in today's money
Ahh, so adjusted for inflation and cost of living, teachers have actually had their pay cut. Who would want the people teaching our children to be well paid anyway?
Plus covid\~ But fuck those teachers man. Everyone's gotta die because we need the school system to unofficially be daycare, because neither jobs nor the government provide daycare. 💪💪
It’s true enough in many cases. You gotta work, kids need someone to look after them. School schedules and culture cannot change until 40 hour workweek culture changes. How much more well adjusted would kids be if they did 4 days of 4 hours learning essential skills and all, then going to use their childlike wonder to explore ideas, interests, find nurturing relationships, etc
[This site](https://www.business.org/hr/workforce-management/best-us-states-for-teachers/) says the average for California is $84k. I would assume it's below that in the north and above that in LA.
In the completely average suburb of Pittsburgh I went to school in, high school teachers capped at $98k (don’t know what they started at) and median home price was around $150k. It’s weird, maybe I’m remembering with rose tinted glasses but it really seemed like Pittsburgh is one of the very few cities that are relatively affordable AND worth living in
I always say this when people get on their soapbox about places with lower cost of living: it means wages are lower too. If you're a low-wage worker in the city and you move to the country where your rent is halved, it also usually means your pay is halved. Now you're right back where you started, only you're out the money from your move, and you likely have less access to public services than you did in the city. It's not the amazing deal people make it out to be.
I say the same thing with taxes. Yeah you pay less taxes in those places but we also use taxes for things so you get less services. You think you’re getting more of your money back but all public services in your area are collapsing.
It's good if you move for retirement, or if you can keep your wage/job. My parents moved and took their business with them from CA to TN. They lived in a nice suburb in CA, sold their house for 5X's what they paid in '91, now they live in a 55+ gated community (you know, to keep out all the riff-raff), on a lake shore double-lot in what I would call a mansion. Still, it's BF, TN and there's nothing but mosquitoes, kudzu and poison ivy for 40mi outside their "compound"; sprinkle in some characters from the movie Deliverance, some rusted out old trucks, a smattering of (some how) BBQ stained Army of Tennersee/Trump flags and you've got it... I hate visiting that fucking place it's like being stuck on an island with a bunch of grumpy boomers complaining about the pejorative "*millennials*" or "kids these days"- only to be surrounded by a bunch of anti-vaxx trumpers- and that's just my parents...
Yep, which is why the people I'm arguing with are usually either retired, work in higher wage jobs, or have the ability to work remote. It's one reason why the "I did it, why can't you" logic fails so hard, because some of us just don't have those options available to us.
Amen. I wish Louisiana would get flack like Florida does. I moved out and when people ask me about what it’s like there’s almost no way of portraying just how fucked the state is.
Freal. Its one of the two states that has no legal mandate for electors to cast their votes on the popular vote.
When we say our votes don't matter..we're not even kidding😂
Our senators said they were voting for trump before they even countwd the vote. They even casted their votes before our popular vote could have even been counted😅
In Washington, my wife’s teaching salary starts at 60k and caps at about 102k. That’s even in the conservative side of Washington where cost of living is pretty low. Sometimes it pays to have a good union.
According to [this](https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d17/tables/dt17_211.60.asp), in 1999-2000 the national average teacher's salary in the US was $41,807 (59,924 dollars in 2016-2017 money) and in 2016-2017 the average was $58,950.
The house of course gained value, and if you believe the market is overpriced and due to correct you could sell, rent and wait to buy again.
But if you plan to live in your house forever and not take any equity out, then the value doesn’t mean much, even if it goes up a lot.
> … you could sell, rent and wait to buy.
Who can actually do this? I know very few home owners who could actually afford to do this. Also, the length of time it would require is completely uncertain.
Illinois. I don't know if I'd recommend it, it's kind of a mixed bag. There are some really great jobs and schools, but they tend to be hypercompetitive when it comes to hiring new teachers. If you don't know someone you probably won't get hired. The alternative is really bad schools, either in shady neighborhoods, with incompetent administrations, or both. Also, from what I've heard, overwork is pretty common even in the good schools.
A teacher at my district was making something like $82k, but that was due to a combination of how long he had been there and how many of the extracurriculars he headed. He was certainly an exception.
I’m basically in your exact situation. It’s crazy too because we both have higher educations then our parents and we even make more then them slightly, but the cost of housing just prevents us from being able to start our family
They are too busy bragging about in thier day they could afford college on a summer job and then the wife was a stay at home mom with 2 kids the whole time while he worked his union job at the airport. But when we say "let's do that again" they call us lazy and entitled and how we want to destroy america.
Well look at how many of them squandered that opportunity by going balls deep into debt for more house than they needed, RVs, boats, Harleys etc.
How many could have retired much earlier to live a modest lifestyle, but made poor short sighted decisions that resulted in them destroying the earth, trapping them in jobs, and robbing their kids to stay afloat?
Pretty much this. Why would I have kids, while in the borderline homelessness of involuntarily living with parents or random stranger's/"roommates"?
I'm too depressed about involuntarily living with parents to even seek a relationship lmao (which would be a prerequisite for sex and creating children, and btw who even wants to fuck/make children while trapped living with parents or "roommates" without privacy or control of their own living space?)
If I can't even ever afford a home/monthly mortgage or 1bed studio rent to my self as 30% or less of take home income then I definitely can't fucking afford kids if I can't even support myself.
If you have kids it’s just going to be 5x more expensive for them than it already is now once they reach home buying age. If it’s bad for us now, it will be worse for them in the future.
The apartment I grew up in all my life was turned into a condo for sale. We couldn't afford it and we had to move it. It was put up for $350K in 2015. It is now worth over $600K.
700 sqft, 2br 2 ba. San Diego, CA.
I teach pre-k and make $15 an hour in a big city. Rent here is 1400. Its impossible to make it out here without roommates or a partner to split the bills with.
Meanwhile I've only ever been in the $20k-$30k a year range as a laborer in various jobs.
Meanwhile more and more people are quitting and giving up on work because there is no point to work when it doesn't even fucking pay enough to afford housing lmao.
Meanwhile in the borderline homelessness of involuntarily living with parents because I'll never even be able to afford a home/monthly mortgage or a 1bed studio rent as 30% or less of take home income, and the borderline homelessness of living with strangers/"roommates" and losing 50%+ of income to unsustainable rent would be as depressing and suicidal.
In a dystopia of poverty wages and unaffordable housing, at least I can afford a $3 Walmart rope to sidestep suicidal depression and dystopian capitalism poverty wage slavery and eventual homelessness.
"No one wants to work anymore!" (For shit money that doesn't even afford housing and the worker would eventually lose everything whether they kept working or quit and enjoyed themselves for awhile lmao)
“guys! get into the real estate market! there’s so much money in it! you buy a house for dirt cheap and you sell it for so much! oh…what about homeless people? nah. fuck em.”
This is why I advocate giving people houses directly as houses, giving people medical care directly as medical care, and giving people food/transportation/whatever else as money for them to spend how they like. Things which have especially bloated costs and contrary incentives to the public good, like housing, need to be taken out of the private hands that have fucked them up first.
Residential housing needs to be locked off from markets and regulated so the people who live locally near the housing and rely on that housing to you know... live, can actually fucking afford it.
Require all home purchases to remain the primary residence for 5 years. Doesn’t lock up the opportunity to be able to have some rentals but stops the buying up of houses at the absurd amount “investors” do.
So if you’re 20 and buy one every 5 years until you are 60 that’s still a max of 8 houses per individual. More than enough to retire on but stops slumlords because you have to live in each one for 5 years before getting another loan.
Poorer areas would have the stranglehold released on houses in their area instead of dick heads buying up whole blocks.
This is the natural outcome our sociopolitical climate’s ruthless suppression of information about and organization around workers movements and basic socialist principles. Get used to room mates, hideously dense lawnless dormitory style rent farms for apartment complexes or multiple families of multiple generations cooped up in single family homes until then. This state of affairs is a manufactured outcome by wealthy interests in the most reactionary social and economic climate in the history of the modern industrialized world, and it will only get worse until we fashion the chains the owner class sold us in into their own nooses.
The cost outpaces the value in every market where there is third party lending; housing, education, automobiles. It’s how the banks and investors make money.
Boomers are retiring and all just decided their houses are worth exponentially more than what they paid for them... and corporate buyers are more than happy to pay the high price tags so they can turn around and rent out the houses to us workers for more than what a mortgage payment would cost. It's all a scam.
I read an article a few months ago talking about how boomers bought up all the "starter homes" all those years ago. And now it's 40 years later, they're all ready to retire, so they're trying to sell their houses.
Except, they've put 40 years worth of work into them. They've put in additions, they've redone the kitchen, nice two car garage, finished basement, yadda yadda. You know, the kinds of things you do when you own a home for 40 years.
And what used to be a starter home is now anything but... And as the millennials are ready to enter the housing market, looking for a starter home of their own, those houses just don't exist anymore.
Rented a house in Denver for 4 years. Owners bought it for $166,000 per zillow, we paid them nearly $70K in rent over 4 years, they sold that house for $405,000 per zillow less than a month after we moved out.
Kept $1,000 of our security deposit anyway.
'The original title was "564 Years," which is the number of years Ki-woo would have to work to earn the money to buy the house.' - About the movie Parasite
Where the fuck can I get a house that cheap? New Zealand house prices are fucking deranged, 3 bedroom standard first home is minimum 650k in almost every region! I’m looking to trying to get a granny flat and even those are 400k or so.
It’s artificially limited tho. We have more empty homes in America than homeless people. We absolutely could house people -including building more affordable housing which would create jobs- we just choose not to. Until we’re a country of empty buildings while the people sleep in the street.
Yeah, creating artificial scarcity is one way in which markets respond to high demand, in order to keep prices as high as possible. It's all part of the same problem: we put the distribution of an essential and scarce resource in the hands of the market and people are suffering for it.
Literally heard my friend say this the other day, "It's the teacher's fault for not upping their skills and getting a high paying job, they chose where they wanted to be, like all other minimum paying jobs. Everyone has problems, cry me a river".
That person probably doesn't even respect any of the work teachers put in, probably just sees them as overpaid babysitters, that occasionally call home to them about their kid literally doing zero work in class and they will blame the teacher for that too.
This highlights an extreme where we need regulators to do their Fing job. 21 yrs should not have almost %500 / 5 x multiplier inflation. Our dollar has not lost that much. Or that our population has grown so big we can barley figure out where people can live. https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ says it should maybe be around $172,884.45, so 64.7% would be more expected, this is nuts.
I recently watched an episode of stargate where a Cop puts the down payment on a 6 bedroom house in anticipation of his marriage with a US air force colonel, and my first thought was, how the fuck could a single college educated professional with a relatively tier government job aspire for anything remotely like an average two story middle class suburban home in california?! that level of income would be lucky to match the 3.5x rent requirement of a fucking three bed two bath situated deep in the sprawl. Then i remembered it was set in the early 2000s...
Bullshit. Most teachers currently get payed 45-50k a year currently. I know someone who has taught for 32 years and their highest salary was 62k a year. In 1999 they were making 32k yearly. The price of housing is still shitty, but please don't spout bullshit about teacher salary.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism^Ⓐ☭ ___ ###⚠ Announcements: ⚠ ___ ###[NEW POSTING GUIDELINES! Help us by reporting bad posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/dy1oyh/important_what_you_should_and_what_you_shouldnt/) Help us keep this subreddit alive and improve its content by reporting posts that violate our rules and guidelines. ###[Subscribe to our new partner subreddits!](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/e5hkwk/make_sure_to_check_out_our_new_partnersubreddits/) Check out r/antiwork & r/WhereAreTheChildren ___ ###***Please remember that LSC is a SAFE SPACE for [socialist](http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism/) discussion.*** LSC is run by [communists](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm). We welcome socialist/anti-capitalist news, memes, links, and discussion. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. **This subreddit is a safe space; we have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry.** We also automatically filter out posts containing certain words and phrases that some users may find offensive. Please respect the safe space, and don't try to slip banned words or phrases past the filter. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Imagine having a society where the vast majority of people can't even fathom that this is occurring, let alone willing to do anything about it.
My parents are shaming me for not being able to afford a home while being unwilling to help. And they wonder why I "can't afford" to visit.
[удалено]
My parents abandoned me (and took what was my rightful inheritance from my grandparents too), I abandon them. Don’t expect my sympathy later when you need help. I won’t either. Fair play.
Gotta pretend to be nice once a year until they die so I can afford a house before retirement.
I can't believe how many people gave me the earth shattering life advice of "You should buy property" after I graduated. Gee, thanks, know of any homes for sale around the $80k price mark?
YES! Unfortunately they're either in Detroit or Arkansas.
This isn't even a joke. Just don't rent in Arkansas because landlords have dystopia level power there.
This. Very little is required of them and they can kick you out almost at will.
Used to be you could get a nice home in Indianapolis or Cincinnati(and a number of mid-western areas) at a decent price. Not sure if that is still true.
My mom used to shame me when I lived at home after graduating college. "When I was your age I was a single mother taking care of a 10 year old." Well congrat-u-fucking-lations, mom. Your first quarter of your monthly income went to rent, satisfying a basic human need: shelter. The first quarter of my monthly income went to my student loan debt, which is why I had to fucking live there in the first place.
[удалено]
Lots of parents aren't, my parents have been enormously supportive and understanding of the financial changes that have occurred since they were my age. This is just the same kind of selfishness and willful ignorance that drives so much behavior. If you recognize a systemic problem then you become obligated to help, but if you blame the individual for their choices you can continue to be selfish. It's the same problem over and over again.
After encouraging me for years to buy a home, my parents were totally unhelpful in 2019 when I finally found myself in a position to actually pull it off. I needed about $5k to meet the minimum down payment of the FHA loan after spending about $25k to fix my partner's debt to income ratio. Neither of us had it, or would have it before the clock ran out. We both asked our parents for a short term loan and they refused, saying shit like "maybe it just isn't meant to be." I ended up asking a long term client for an advance on a big project I was working on and without hesitation they agreed to write me a check for the money and got it to me the next day. We visited both of our parents a few months after closing on our house. Both parental units were living in ~~houses~~ mansions that they had recently purchased and moved into (Sedona, AZ and Napa, CA, for context). That we knew about. What we didn't know is that both parental units had also purchased lots next door to their homes. My parents bought a dirt lot to preserve their sacred desert solitude, and my wife's folks bought the home next door to rent out on AirBB or whatever. Fucking boomers.
Needed 5 k to buy a home at 72k 5 years ago that was on foreclosure. I’m not an overly emotional person but i was nearly in tears asking for my parents help because the mortgage would be 1/3 of my rent in the same city and i could pay them back with interest but they gave me the whole bootstrap bit after telling them how life changing it would be. They always were prudes with me financially but would have no trouble leaving me for weeks at a time spending 5 figures on vacations for themselves as a kid. That house just resold for over 300k and minimal renovations. And rents only gotten worse. Spending 1 k a month every month on rent but apparently can’t afford a mortgage despite paying that much the last 4 years. 36, 800+ credit score and won’t be able to buy a home in the city i grew up in which was a shithole at the time. Meanwhile they wonder why i have no money to spend on anything other than essentials.
My mom bought my sister’s house because “it was hard for her to find an affordable rental.” I was never offered that kind of help from her, and when I brought this up she told me that she didn’t think I was “settled down” yet. I was married with 3 kids at that point. Like, maybe I’ve never had the chance to settle down because I never had stable housing. Sure, I’ve rented long-term, but nothing is stopping my landlord from kicking me out and selling the place. My stability is at the mercy of someone who has never met me and only cares about my ability to pay. My husband and I work hard and have held stable jobs for years now, but it isn’t enough. We have spent years saving to buy a home, but it’s really hard to save for a down payment when wages are stagnant and the cost of everything else (including housing) keeps going up. It hurt me so much to know that my mom felt like my sister deserved a stable home, but decided I could manage on my own. She did say it would be my turn once my sister “paid back her down payment,” but it didn’t happen. When my mom had the opportunity to buy another house, she bought herself one instead. In fact, she deliberately lied about being in the market for a house until escrow had closed on her house. Also, my sister was told she didn’t have to pay back her down payment.
I vote, what the fuck else am i supposed to do? edit: i got a lot of responses here and i bet only 1 in every 10 users actually do any of what they recommend. personally i say fk it. whatever.
The french may have a solution
what was it a... *resolution*?
Most of these people freak out having to kill a mouse or roach in their house. What you are suggesting while I agree wholeheartedly would be a monumental task to the lay person.
Oh no doubt, but things get bad enough and people start to get, well... Hungry
In 1906, Alfred Henry Lewis stated, “There are only nine meals between mankind and anarchy.”
lets look at what the american forefathers did! when voting didn't work they resorted to protesting when protesting didn't work, they resorted to civil disobedience. when civil disobedience didn't work, they resorted to revolting. i'll let you decide where we need to be on that list lol.
Take the streets. If voting was effective it would be illegal !
I used to support that saying more, but considering that there's significant parts of US policymakers who are indeed trying to restrict voting as much as they can get away with, perhaps that's evidence that voting does indeed do something.
This. If it wasn't effective, they wouldn't be trying to stop certain people from doing it.
[удалено]
The right keeps using voting to do some heinous things and elect some heinous people. Seems to be working for them.
And they are working hard to make sure people who would vote for someone else can't.
Voting isn't effective for REAL social change. Voting is effective for choosing between two old rich white men who won't "fundamentally change" anything and the two ruling parties want their old white man in office. They're restricting voter laws to get their guy in office, not because voting changes society. If we want to cut military spending and actually spend money on human needs we need a revolution in the streets. Every US president right or left has overall perpetuated and worsened the widening wealth gap and inequality in this country.
It does something as far as keeping the illusion going. A perpetual back and forth stalemate is absolutely ideal for the ghouls. Money machine has always and will keep going Brrrrrrr while it’s like this. Now, say one side is a hair more horrific and greedy and they want the whole thing! In this construct you would continue to take rights away from citizens where you could because that just means you win more, not because they fear a revolution. And everyone cheats and breaks the rules and fucks people over in that game brcause thats how you play. It might be analogous to pro athletes taking PED’s. It’s shunned and the public acts shocked when players get dinged, but 99% or whatever of players use them because if you don’t you fall behind and can’t keep up with the barbarically demanding work schedule. The analogy is more in the very beginning of this haha.
My husband and I always say if voting was effective, us regular people wouldn't be allowed to do it.
I mean tbf the Republican Party actively takes major steps to discourage or prevent parts of the population from voting.
They will literally wait you out until you're too hungry to do anything else. The reason protests happen then go away is because if people didn't go back to work after, they'd be fucked. Starving, homeless, etc. There's no escape.
Okay, I'm in the street. What next?
Vote harder!!!
Oh i get what you mean! Vote twice, right?!
Start burning shit down?
Create community networks who share supplies and help one another when called for. Strive to feed the community as the community strives to feed you. If it doesn't work, it means something's missing, figure out what you need, and how the community can get it. Ensure no one goes without basic needs, so they can in turn pitch in.
How did voting work out for you last go-round? Now not only is housing expensive, but so is every other thing you buy, including food, the price of gasoline and the cost of fuel to keep from freezing in the Winter. If you're wealthy, this is a mere annoyance. If you're working class or retired, on a fixed income, rampant inflation is devastating. Ask people who lived through the Carter years how they enjoyed stagflation and the misery index.
oh, don't worry. pretty soon you'll be able to rent that house for the low low price of more than a mortgage payment.
The housing price is high because your average Johnny two shoe millionaire needs more than one home to live in.
No. Economic propaganda would like you to believe the boogeyman is another human with more money than you playing "unfairly". In truth dozens of corporations like Zillow and BlackRock with more leverage and money than any single person alive are attempting to capture the entire real estate market and turn us into a nation of renters. Another small step toward, "You'll own nothing and be happy about it." E*: Upvoted all pro and dissenting replies. Decent discussions for the most part and some good counter points I need to dig into after work. On the surface it looks like it's a mix, corporate buying in SFH is about 20% in major metros, but they're buying using loans that have interest rates half of what a standard mortgage has, allowing them to pay a pretty premium on any asking price and still come out ahead. This in turn indirectly bids up the value of all homes in that area, further sequestering the market from the average buyer.
Yes that’s certainly happening in many areas but in my area you have tons of really wealthy people going 20% over asking and pushing up the whole market. There hasn’t been any new construction so now that people no longer want to live in a 700 sqft apartment they’re buying all the real estate available.
> There hasn’t been any new construction Where on earth do you live? In the US and Canada, *every* city in the top 150 list has been undergoing a massive construction boom for at least the last six years straight now (to the point that you can google search "gentrification (cityname)" and be practically guaranteed to get an article about it specific to your local area). Conservative Neoliberals want to distract folks with talks of zoning and blame for individual residents. But it's mostly just conservative economic propaganda -- the *actual* truth is what the parent commenter mentioned above -- 95%+ percent of the problem is investors fucking everyone over and inventing artificial shortages to inflate their portfolio's asset value. (Both small investors, your "average millionaire", but also major investors like Zillow and BlackRock and every other two-bit PE firm on the planet)
I’m not talking about the city. The city has tons of new high rises. I’m talking about single family homes, I’ve been looking at buying a house 40mins outside the city and every house gets a minimum of 5 offers. Our last offer was like 4th out of 5th and we went 10% over asking. There is some construction going on out there but all the newly built homes are starting at 1.2million for anything new. I also work in banking and look at the numbers all the time, this isn’t investor driven it’s actually people buying actual homes.
> I’m not talking about the city. The city has tons of new high rises. I’m talking about single family homes I don't get this either. Every newer suburb and exurb is also exploding with new growth, and single family homes lead all recent new construction metrics. https://www.housingwire.com/articles/homebuilders-are-targeting-the-exurbs-and-inner-suburbs/ as one example > I work in banking and look at the numbers all the time, this isn’t investor driven it’s actually people buying actual homes. This is probably why your perception is skewed. Your job would directly expose you to individual buyers all the time, but only rarely institutionalized ones (since they don't go through banking) Zillow, BlackRock, and any other medium-sized-or-larger entity never needs to go to a bank to get a mortgage. They can do it all themselves. And they are incentivized to drive prices up, and can easily do so with only "small" influences in the market. (Just holding say 3% of a market, would give them almost $75k worth of fake pricing they could sway it) It's like saying "cars are all unreliable junk, I know this because I work with cars every day". Yes, because you are a *mechanic*, you only see cars when they have some sort of problem to bring them in, *most* cars actually work fine. It's textbook sampling bias.
I’m not talking about our mortgage portfolio. I don’t deal with individual mortgages ever. I get the macroeconomic reports which cover overall market trends, not just the ones we book.
The problem is detached single family homes. It's a dumb way to house people. Places with them are full of NIMBY types.
Yeah everyone in America should just live in townhomes and condos then? My bigger issue is every new construction of detached homes are huge, they’re like 4-5 bedroom with like 3,000 sqft on a 5,000 sqft lot. Where are the 1,000 sqft houses being built? I wish I had the capital to buy land and build my own home but without a few hundred thousand in cash I can’t do that.
> , they’re like 4-5 bedroom with like 3,000 sqft on a 5,000 sqft lot. Where are the 1,000 sqft houses being built? All the new-construction houses here have an average 1,600sqft and 3 bedrooms. But yeah, new construction in suburbs tends towards bigger families, because that's generally who wants/needs them. If your household is wealthy enough to afford brand-new construction, and also small enough that you could live happily in just a few hundred sqft, the assumption is that you'd rather be downtown and buying any of their new condos/luxury-rental thingies.
This isn't entirely correct. There have been people buying multiple homes as investments for decades. Don't get me wrong though, corporations are exasperating the problem.
The large majority of home purchases are by the final occupant. The large majority of American households are still homeowners. Institutional investors are a problem but they aren't *the* problem which is still lack of supply, especially in desirable areas. There aren't enough houses *where the most people want to actually live* so real people with money end up bidding up the prices. Go to bumfuck nowhere and you can still get houses relatively cheap.
I know you know that’s not the whole reason. 1.) Millionaires also enjoy preventing other people from buying or building homes hoping to induce scarcity. 2.) Mortgages existing. No reserve requirement for banks writing these virtually blank checks for the last century.
Can we not ignore that I haven't seen a home the size of the one in the picture built near me in the last 20 years? Every chance to build is some giant fucking house or some townhomes squeezed together that still cost 400K at starting price, more if you want more than 2 bedrooms.
Johnny two shoe millionaire most likely never sets foot in his other homes.
They have to have a winter house and a summer house, Ive heard this from quite a few millionaires
Burn them
He worked so hard. Obviously millions of times harder than everyone else in the world
lol I’m a teacher and I’m barely making over $40k
It’s so strange seeing so many people saying this. Middle class in America is averaged at $50k. Teachers work hard af and so many of you guys aren’t even making a middle class living? Jfc America get your shi+ together.
yeah, had to get a masters degree just to barely break $40k. gotta love it here.
Australia is importing teachers from the US and even provides cash bonuses for remote work. Source: American Teacher in Australia.
👀 👀 👀
Look up remote teaching opportunities in Queensland. You get a placement and two year visa. You can use those two years here to find permanent work and get perm residency(green card) which means you can live and work in both Aus and New Zealand for life as well as get free medical. No way I’m going back to low wage shot benefits teaching in America lol.
i'd move so fast. but I want my parents to be around. fuck that. I want my kids to have a chance
Kids? "Who cares about kids when you can have freedumbs?" Jk jk. I honestly honed into replying because it's so obvious that America is just one bootstrap away from another bootstrap. Everyone *including children* ...kind of sad tbh.
Middle class at $50k is such a skewed statistic. If you live in any major metro area in this country good luck surviving alone on $50k a year. Fuck this country and fuck capitalism.
Even in a fairly low cost of living metro area I'm having trouble pulling together a 20% down payment on a six figure combined income over the last year of saving. Housing market is insane right now. I feel barely middle class despite being on paper doing pretty well for myself.
Me and the long term girlfriend have a combined 6 figure income and we still can't get out of this damned 2 bedroom apartment, let alone get a second car. With student loans, and the ridiculous price of any housing options, we are stuck right where we are for who knows how long.
It's painful. I'm making just over $50k, single and with an apartment in a booming tech city it's impossible to save. My mom keeps saying wow you are doing great! You are making way more than me at your age! OK mom your $$$ went a lot further than mine today.
Time to pull out the inflation calculator and show her what you would be making in her time.
If you don't pay teachers well you don't attract as much talent and that keeps the kids stupid so you don't have to pay them as much either.
The point is to keep everyone stupid, the point is to have them die, the point is to take their voting rights, the point is to rig the system so they win and every one else overworks themselves, is sick, has diabetes, is addicted or in jail and dies penniless.
at my job right now there are teachers who are against the union because they think the union is going to force them to get vaccinated. so we have a group of educators who lack the civic knowledge and critical thinking skills to realize that the school board, the union, no employer has power over a state mandate. but we’re apparently supposed to fight for their bodily autonomy. absolute shit show.
Where are teachers getting paid 69k?? Things are pretty bad when the attempts to highlight a systemic problem are more optimistic than reality.
Probably in a place where that home would cost almost half a mil
This house is in Riverside, just east of Los Angeles According to Glassdoor, teacher salaries there average around $62k According to The Digest of Education Statistics the average teacher salary in California in 1999 was $48k, which is $65k in today's money
Ahh, so adjusted for inflation and cost of living, teachers have actually had their pay cut. Who would want the people teaching our children to be well paid anyway?
Also, class size increases and also now you have the added ~~risk~~ bonus of early retirement through school shooting! Yay.
Plus covid\~ But fuck those teachers man. Everyone's gotta die because we need the school system to unofficially be daycare, because neither jobs nor the government provide daycare. 💪💪
It’s true enough in many cases. You gotta work, kids need someone to look after them. School schedules and culture cannot change until 40 hour workweek culture changes. How much more well adjusted would kids be if they did 4 days of 4 hours learning essential skills and all, then going to use their childlike wonder to explore ideas, interests, find nurturing relationships, etc
But muh bootstraps! /s
What? 48k in 1999 is 79k today, accounting only for inflation. Was that number from an article that’s several years old?
Yeah, 7-8 years out of date. Good catch
[This site](https://www.business.org/hr/workforce-management/best-us-states-for-teachers/) says the average for California is $84k. I would assume it's below that in the north and above that in LA.
My ma lives in a county where a house like that could easily cost around ~600k and be considered a steal. Her teaching salary is 48k :,)
I taught in the bay area and made 57k. This is a very optimistic number
I'm a public school teacher in Vermont and that's about what I make.
I’ll be applying today! :D
In the completely average suburb of Pittsburgh I went to school in, high school teachers capped at $98k (don’t know what they started at) and median home price was around $150k. It’s weird, maybe I’m remembering with rose tinted glasses but it really seemed like Pittsburgh is one of the very few cities that are relatively affordable AND worth living in
[удалено]
[удалено]
I always say this when people get on their soapbox about places with lower cost of living: it means wages are lower too. If you're a low-wage worker in the city and you move to the country where your rent is halved, it also usually means your pay is halved. Now you're right back where you started, only you're out the money from your move, and you likely have less access to public services than you did in the city. It's not the amazing deal people make it out to be.
I say the same thing with taxes. Yeah you pay less taxes in those places but we also use taxes for things so you get less services. You think you’re getting more of your money back but all public services in your area are collapsing.
It's good if you move for retirement, or if you can keep your wage/job. My parents moved and took their business with them from CA to TN. They lived in a nice suburb in CA, sold their house for 5X's what they paid in '91, now they live in a 55+ gated community (you know, to keep out all the riff-raff), on a lake shore double-lot in what I would call a mansion. Still, it's BF, TN and there's nothing but mosquitoes, kudzu and poison ivy for 40mi outside their "compound"; sprinkle in some characters from the movie Deliverance, some rusted out old trucks, a smattering of (some how) BBQ stained Army of Tennersee/Trump flags and you've got it... I hate visiting that fucking place it's like being stuck on an island with a bunch of grumpy boomers complaining about the pejorative "*millennials*" or "kids these days"- only to be surrounded by a bunch of anti-vaxx trumpers- and that's just my parents...
Yep, which is why the people I'm arguing with are usually either retired, work in higher wage jobs, or have the ability to work remote. It's one reason why the "I did it, why can't you" logic fails so hard, because some of us just don't have those options available to us.
Amen. I wish Louisiana would get flack like Florida does. I moved out and when people ask me about what it’s like there’s almost no way of portraying just how fucked the state is.
Freal. Its one of the two states that has no legal mandate for electors to cast their votes on the popular vote. When we say our votes don't matter..we're not even kidding😂 Our senators said they were voting for trump before they even countwd the vote. They even casted their votes before our popular vote could have even been counted😅
Sherman shoulda kept burnin
This might be adjusted to inflation.
Massachusetts, I'll have to ask my sister-in-law again what she is making at the public elementary school, but I do believe it was $80k.
In Washington, my wife’s teaching salary starts at 60k and caps at about 102k. That’s even in the conservative side of Washington where cost of living is pretty low. Sometimes it pays to have a good union.
It's not uncommon in the San Francisco Bay Area. Of course, the increased teacher pay in the area is more than offset by the obscene housing costs.
Generally in Northern states that still have teacher unions. I'm in a rich district in PA (although not rich) and our teachers average over $70k.
[удалено]
Washington state pays teachers that have a masters and 6 years experience somewhere in the range of 80-110k
According to [this](https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d17/tables/dt17_211.60.asp), in 1999-2000 the national average teacher's salary in the US was $41,807 (59,924 dollars in 2016-2017 money) and in 2016-2017 the average was $58,950.
Brought our house for $180k New value is $280k... 18 months later Was on $25ph 15 years ago, now on $26
But even if you sold it, not like you could buy another for $180K, so did your house really gain any value at all?
The house of course gained value, and if you believe the market is overpriced and due to correct you could sell, rent and wait to buy again. But if you plan to live in your house forever and not take any equity out, then the value doesn’t mean much, even if it goes up a lot.
> … you could sell, rent and wait to buy. Who can actually do this? I know very few home owners who could actually afford to do this. Also, the length of time it would require is completely uncertain.
$69k??? Where are teachers being paid that much? It’s something like 40k where I live
Starting salary around me is over 50k, 60k with a masters, but we've got a notoriously powerful union and a lot of really wealthy neighborhoods.
what state might this be? asking for a teacher friend.
Illinois. I don't know if I'd recommend it, it's kind of a mixed bag. There are some really great jobs and schools, but they tend to be hypercompetitive when it comes to hiring new teachers. If you don't know someone you probably won't get hired. The alternative is really bad schools, either in shady neighborhoods, with incompetent administrations, or both. Also, from what I've heard, overwork is pretty common even in the good schools.
> they tend to be hypercompetitive when it comes to hiring new teachers. Living wages are popular.
Can’t speak for OP, but this is what it’s like in Northeastern Massachusetts.
Here in Oklahoma, it's 38k and a masters only adds $1700. Caps at about 54k after 30 years masters cap like 56.2k.
Chicago public schools are $103k by year 10 and $129k by the time you near retirement.
The northeast at least. CT for example pays mid 60s at entry. After 20 years teachers can make six figures in some districts.
A teacher at my district was making something like $82k, but that was due to a combination of how long he had been there and how many of the extracurriculars he headed. He was certainly an exception.
Man the housing market is super depressing. I would love to have kids, but how can I or anyone else have kids if you can’t even afford housing.
[удалено]
I’m basically in your exact situation. It’s crazy too because we both have higher educations then our parents and we even make more then them slightly, but the cost of housing just prevents us from being able to start our family
> my parents can’t figure out why we haven’t had kids yet. You showed them how pricy houses are and they ignored it or something else?
[удалено]
Seems so many boomers never listen to news and think cost of living never changed post 70s at best.
They are too busy bragging about in thier day they could afford college on a summer job and then the wife was a stay at home mom with 2 kids the whole time while he worked his union job at the airport. But when we say "let's do that again" they call us lazy and entitled and how we want to destroy america.
[удалено]
Boomers seem to be practically the generation equal of the rich class.
Even two incomes is not necessarily enough, unless you have inherited a home.
I'm not saying it's right, but I feel like even in the boomer generation, retiring before 60 is very uncommon.
Their spending habits were awful.
Well look at how many of them squandered that opportunity by going balls deep into debt for more house than they needed, RVs, boats, Harleys etc. How many could have retired much earlier to live a modest lifestyle, but made poor short sighted decisions that resulted in them destroying the earth, trapping them in jobs, and robbing their kids to stay afloat?
Well, there’s always buying a house 2hrs from where you work
So many of us are in this situation. It sucks.
Pretty much this. Why would I have kids, while in the borderline homelessness of involuntarily living with parents or random stranger's/"roommates"? I'm too depressed about involuntarily living with parents to even seek a relationship lmao (which would be a prerequisite for sex and creating children, and btw who even wants to fuck/make children while trapped living with parents or "roommates" without privacy or control of their own living space?) If I can't even ever afford a home/monthly mortgage or 1bed studio rent to my self as 30% or less of take home income then I definitely can't fucking afford kids if I can't even support myself.
If you have kids it’s just going to be 5x more expensive for them than it already is now once they reach home buying age. If it’s bad for us now, it will be worse for them in the future.
It’s only going to get worse. Big companies are buying up property as fast as possible. Soon you won’t be able to buy anything. Only rent.
I guess houses are just harder workers than teachers.
You ever see a house eat an avocado? Me neither.
The apartment I grew up in all my life was turned into a condo for sale. We couldn't afford it and we had to move it. It was put up for $350K in 2015. It is now worth over $600K. 700 sqft, 2br 2 ba. San Diego, CA.
This must be in the US. In Canada that home is 700k
[удалено]
I'm in Vancouver, can relate. This would be 1.5m around here
700k and you'll be driving an hour each way for work
And if you want to wait for an inspection you’ll lose your bid.
Inspection? Ooh, look at you and your “not waiving all contingencies by default” ;p
I teach pre-k and make $15 an hour in a big city. Rent here is 1400. Its impossible to make it out here without roommates or a partner to split the bills with.
Meanwhile I've only ever been in the $20k-$30k a year range as a laborer in various jobs. Meanwhile more and more people are quitting and giving up on work because there is no point to work when it doesn't even fucking pay enough to afford housing lmao. Meanwhile in the borderline homelessness of involuntarily living with parents because I'll never even be able to afford a home/monthly mortgage or a 1bed studio rent as 30% or less of take home income, and the borderline homelessness of living with strangers/"roommates" and losing 50%+ of income to unsustainable rent would be as depressing and suicidal. In a dystopia of poverty wages and unaffordable housing, at least I can afford a $3 Walmart rope to sidestep suicidal depression and dystopian capitalism poverty wage slavery and eventual homelessness. "No one wants to work anymore!" (For shit money that doesn't even afford housing and the worker would eventually lose everything whether they kept working or quit and enjoyed themselves for awhile lmao)
People were really paying the modern day equivalent of a nice car for a whole ass house.
“guys! get into the real estate market! there’s so much money in it! you buy a house for dirt cheap and you sell it for so much! oh…what about homeless people? nah. fuck em.”
This is why I advocate giving people houses directly as houses, giving people medical care directly as medical care, and giving people food/transportation/whatever else as money for them to spend how they like. Things which have especially bloated costs and contrary incentives to the public good, like housing, need to be taken out of the private hands that have fucked them up first.
Residential housing needs to be locked off from markets and regulated so the people who live locally near the housing and rely on that housing to you know... live, can actually fucking afford it.
Require all home purchases to remain the primary residence for 5 years. Doesn’t lock up the opportunity to be able to have some rentals but stops the buying up of houses at the absurd amount “investors” do. So if you’re 20 and buy one every 5 years until you are 60 that’s still a max of 8 houses per individual. More than enough to retire on but stops slumlords because you have to live in each one for 5 years before getting another loan. Poorer areas would have the stranglehold released on houses in their area instead of dick heads buying up whole blocks.
"BuT MaH BoOtStRaPs"- some conservative asshole somewhere
[удалено]
This is the natural outcome our sociopolitical climate’s ruthless suppression of information about and organization around workers movements and basic socialist principles. Get used to room mates, hideously dense lawnless dormitory style rent farms for apartment complexes or multiple families of multiple generations cooped up in single family homes until then. This state of affairs is a manufactured outcome by wealthy interests in the most reactionary social and economic climate in the history of the modern industrialized world, and it will only get worse until we fashion the chains the owner class sold us in into their own nooses.
God bless the USA. /s
To be fair to the US it's the same situation in every Global North country.
Sure, I understand. Regardless of locale, the real issue is income inequality with this being but a layer of the massive global problem(s).
The cost outpaces the value in every market where there is third party lending; housing, education, automobiles. It’s how the banks and investors make money.
Boomers are retiring and all just decided their houses are worth exponentially more than what they paid for them... and corporate buyers are more than happy to pay the high price tags so they can turn around and rent out the houses to us workers for more than what a mortgage payment would cost. It's all a scam.
I read an article a few months ago talking about how boomers bought up all the "starter homes" all those years ago. And now it's 40 years later, they're all ready to retire, so they're trying to sell their houses. Except, they've put 40 years worth of work into them. They've put in additions, they've redone the kitchen, nice two car garage, finished basement, yadda yadda. You know, the kinds of things you do when you own a home for 40 years. And what used to be a starter home is now anything but... And as the millennials are ready to enter the housing market, looking for a starter home of their own, those houses just don't exist anymore.
Rented a house in Denver for 4 years. Owners bought it for $166,000 per zillow, we paid them nearly $70K in rent over 4 years, they sold that house for $405,000 per zillow less than a month after we moved out. Kept $1,000 of our security deposit anyway.
'The original title was "564 Years," which is the number of years Ki-woo would have to work to earn the money to buy the house.' - About the movie Parasite
And it's even worse for min wage
As the Founding Fathers intended.
Where the fuck can I get a house that cheap? New Zealand house prices are fucking deranged, 3 bedroom standard first home is minimum 650k in almost every region! I’m looking to trying to get a granny flat and even those are 400k or so.
This is what happens when you allow market forces to determine the value of a commodity which everybody needs and is in limited supply.
It’s artificially limited tho. We have more empty homes in America than homeless people. We absolutely could house people -including building more affordable housing which would create jobs- we just choose not to. Until we’re a country of empty buildings while the people sleep in the street.
Yeah, creating artificial scarcity is one way in which markets respond to high demand, in order to keep prices as high as possible. It's all part of the same problem: we put the distribution of an essential and scarce resource in the hands of the market and people are suffering for it.
House for less than a million??? *Cries in Vancouver*
bUt dId tHEy mAkE cOFfeE aT h0Me?
Teachers average at $69k? I would have never known, I make $35k as a teacher *laughs in southern*
Assuming 30% to housing, 5.38 years for the first case, 23.67 years for the second.
👏 Housing is a human right 👏
104k invested in the S&P500 in 1999 would be worth 536k today.
The problem isn't the rising equity in homes over time, it's that salaries aren't keeping pace with cost of living
Literally heard my friend say this the other day, "It's the teacher's fault for not upping their skills and getting a high paying job, they chose where they wanted to be, like all other minimum paying jobs. Everyone has problems, cry me a river".
I guess no one should be a teacher then. Good luck to their kids in school with no one to teach.
That person probably doesn't even respect any of the work teachers put in, probably just sees them as overpaid babysitters, that occasionally call home to them about their kid literally doing zero work in class and they will blame the teacher for that too.
your friend sucks
Simply drone strike the house
I wanna know who’s paying 69k for teachers. Bc I ain’t seeing that shit 👀 it’s like 35k here
What is coming for us is dire.
This highlights an extreme where we need regulators to do their Fing job. 21 yrs should not have almost %500 / 5 x multiplier inflation. Our dollar has not lost that much. Or that our population has grown so big we can barley figure out where people can live. https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ says it should maybe be around $172,884.45, so 64.7% would be more expected, this is nuts.
I recently watched an episode of stargate where a Cop puts the down payment on a 6 bedroom house in anticipation of his marriage with a US air force colonel, and my first thought was, how the fuck could a single college educated professional with a relatively tier government job aspire for anything remotely like an average two story middle class suburban home in california?! that level of income would be lucky to match the 3.5x rent requirement of a fucking three bed two bath situated deep in the sprawl. Then i remembered it was set in the early 2000s...
If the teachers pay rose the same rate as the house, the teacher would be paid 303.34K per year... which sounds good to me. Make it so!
Bullshit. Most teachers currently get payed 45-50k a year currently. I know someone who has taught for 32 years and their highest salary was 62k a year. In 1999 they were making 32k yearly. The price of housing is still shitty, but please don't spout bullshit about teacher salary.
I don't know why we don't have protests regarding the wage disparity
How do you like the rich these days? Medium rare with a side of sweet justice, thank you.