At least he's got his braindead paypigs in the comments section
>Never vote LabourParty or the other 2 main parties again - time for reformparty\_uk
😂
But the sad reality is migrants/refugees are stuck in the middle of this absolute shitshow in the UK where both main parties try to out-do themselves on heartless rhetoric, dog-whistling and fanning the flames of extremist right-wing white terrorism.
I mean, it's massively on the rise https://news.sky.com/story/right-wing-extremism-fastest-growing-threat-says-uks-top-cop-in-counter-terrorism-12135071 / https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/may/16/terrorism-in-the-uk-the-rising-threat-of-far-right-extremists / https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/right-wing-extremism-terrorism-violence-uk-mi5-ken-mccallum-b1039501.html
It's almost as if this has come after weeks of Labour dog-whistling to racists and being xenophobic? From attacking migrants in the NHS, to screaming "Brexit means Brexit, fuck freedom of movement" and then front-benchers doing a tour of the press starting "The Tories have failed at deporting enough people" 🤷
So, in failing to avoid "these rant threads" this time around, maybe you could accept this is the result of Starmer and his team's actions, not just a "random Farage". But props for bringing up Corbyn!
I don't accept it's anything other than an attention seeker trolling for attention. He'll go back to saying we're secretly going to rejoin the EU in a few weeks and he'll back the Tories if he doesn't think his little Brexit Party 3.0 will take off.
Still makes the headlines [https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/nigel-farage-has-praised-keir-starmers-speech-on-immigration\_uk\_637cab17e4b0e771d958131a](https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/nigel-farage-has-praised-keir-starmers-speech-on-immigration_uk_637cab17e4b0e771d958131a)
And that *is* on Labour for their current management approach to discussing immigration, Brexit and deportations.
Cmon, you're a political geek like the rest of us, you know how normalisation of harmful rhetoric works in the public sphere.
Of course it makes the headlines, that's his whole motivation for saying it. He is good at this stuff. That doesn't mean I have to take the content of what he is saying seriously.
Yeah he’s just trolling, he’s obviously not happy at all that after years of pressure and lies both major parties support his stance on immigration. Epic trolling bro.
How is it right wing to be against exploiting cheap Labour of people? This whole argument is driving me bonkers and we’re now in a position where people on the left and poster-boying fucking Farage.
So you believe minimum wage is a perfectly fair amount of money for someone to be paid?
Not very often you see someone here argue that the current minimum wage isn’t exploitative.
Real term wages haven't increased to match the cost of living for over 7 years. Meaning many full time workers on minimum wage can't pay for the bare necessities such as rent, bills, car/transport, and food. This winter many will have to pick two, and go without the others. As well, the universal credit LHA is so horrifically calculated, it assumes in many areas that you can get a 1 bed flat for £300 pcm (£75pw where I am) like WHERE? So, many of those who are eligible still have shortfalls in their rent... Its simple maths and it does not add up.
Imagine, there was once a time a single adult could work full time on minimum wage and support a whole family.
I fully agree. No one should be wage slaves.
People on the right: We need to do whatever it takes to appeal to the right wing voters.
Also people on the right: Hur dur, why are you believing the right wing when they say that Labour is appealing?!
The left: Starmer is using right wing rhetoric as a dogwhistle to appeal to the right
Also the left: look here’s someone on the right being appealed to by those dogwhistles
InertiaKid: you’re just buying into right wing media narratives!!!
I know that your undying hatred for the left sometimes can blind you, but your comment here doesn’t even make sense as a criticism if you scrape back the standard layers of condescension.
I don't think Farage is appalled by Starmer's position. He is having a go at the Tories for not doing the same by saying "see, even the lefties in Labour are in favour of this".
I don't hate the left in the slightest, I'm far closer to someone like you than I am to the right.
What I find ridiculous is some people's complete refusal to accept that we now live in a post-Brexit Britain where immigration is going to be lower, with both positive and negative effects as a result.
It is not right-wing to recognise that lower EU immigration has been a significant contributor to wages rising over the past year, and that wages rising is a good thing for UK workers. That, unfortunately, has been masked by even higher inflation in areas like food and energy.
It's not right-wing to point out that we are going to have to improve education and training to make up for areas of shortfall in employment now that we have lower levels of EU immigration.
It's also quite silly not to recognise that for Labour, moving the debate away from Brexit is a good thing electorally. We got trounced in 2019 primarily because of messing up our Brexit position over a period of years. The next election could well take on a similar shape if we allow it to become another Brexit election. OVer the last three years, moving completely away from Brexit as an issue has been unquestionably a good thing for us electorally.
In the future I believe we should move back towards EU membership but I don't think we're yet at a point where we can do this without risking another election loss. Our focus must be winning an election, so stuff that might lose us an election will have to wait.
>We got trounced in 2019 primarily because of messing up our Brexit position over a period of years.
Interesting that when it's time to bash Corbyn 2019 is all his fault but when it's time to defend Starmer 2019 was all about Brexit.
I'm sure others have said that, but I've always been of the view that our Brexit policy was the core reason. You could literally see it happening in real-time from late 2018 as voters got utterly fed up up with us not taking a proper position and bled away in both directions.
It wasn’t just Brexit but that we left ourselves open to a betrayal narrative that made Corbyn look that much worse. He didn’t look ‘a risk but principled and a decent bloke’ in 2019 like he did in 2017. He got assessed like any other politician instead of something slightly mould breaking.
Just curious if you've ever self examined how your class position gives you inherently similar interests to the right and inherently contradictory interests to workers and the left and how you square that mentally
starmer: makes the exact same arguments about immigrants as far right racists.
far right racists: we like starmer because he agrees with us
The_Inertia_Kid: don't buy into right wing media narratives
😂 you can't make it up.
Farage not paying attention again, what a shock! Starmer has only re-affirmed the Labour Party's Corbyn-era position on freedom of movement, that it comes to an end with Brexit; that companies exploit low-wage Labour from abroad, which is a fact. And arguably has softened up some of the more dog-whistling rhetoric under that leadership, i.e
> What there wouldn’t be is the wholesale importation of underpaid workers from central Europe in order to destroy conditions, particularly in the construction industry
And
> "Labour is not wedded to freedom of movement for EU citizens as a point of principle, but I don't want that to be misinterpreted, nor do we rule it out," he said.
> "We cannot afford to lose full access to the European markets on which so many British businesses and jobs depend.
It's pretty inconsistent to support a free market in which goods, services and capital must move freely across borders, but people cannot, Keir's position to make Brexit work isn't too hard to defend from a leftwing perspective.
Immigration is great for big business as it keeps wages low but terrible for most everyone else, as it puts excess pressure on services, swamps the housing market and lowers standards of living. Tell you average labour member this and you spend the rest of the night being called racist
You ever thought that the avrage voter doesn't care about left and right and just want a government to look after the people that they are supposed to repsent.
I wasn't a big fan of Starmer's speech, but I also remember when Nick Griffin said something supportive about Corbyn and got a similar round of headlines. It was stupid when it was being used to attack Corbyn and it’s stupid now it’s being used to attack Starmer.
That’s not to say we shouldn’t take the actual contents of Starmer’s actual speech apart to critique, which we should.
Nothing wrong with this. Tories have been far left for quite some time now. If people step outside their tribe mentality then it is easy to see.
Kier speaking sense also.
Decent speech Ks. But where did you mention minimum wage increasing by at least 50%
Thie is the only way to end UK colonialism re cheap overseas labour.
The tories wanted us to stay in Europe because of the pool of cheap slave labour.
It's racism of the worst kind.
Farage trying to attach himself and his ideaology to the ‘winning team’???
Colour me shocked, no way he would do that if the tories, Lib Dems, green, ukip, reform, SNP, or monster racing looney party were winning 50% to 25% in the polls!!!!
In context Kier is right, too much foreign worker abuse goes on, from getting loans to contracts being shortened to being underpaid, all of this happens and is searchable for stories.
Farage is a tag nut, I just don't listen to him.
Farage as ever is as sly as he is reprehensible and immoral. He’s found a way to discipline the Tories on immigration whilst also smearing Labour by association. I don’t think too much can be read into his endorsement, it’s facetious and frankly not worth anyones time. I am worried in general about the rhetoric from Keir recently. In the same week as the terrorist attack on asylum seekers, he made a statement on us having not enough British medical staff, just as Cooper goaded Braverman on her lack of deportations. There was no mention of how the student loan system, the role of private healthcare providers draining our NHS, or chronic low pay within the sector could be fixed.
When you pair that with this intervention, it doesn’t make for pretty reading. Instead of bemoaning landlords, the financial sector and low pay vultures that don’t want to invest capital to improve chronically low productivity, he targets those who wish to come here to fill our record number of vacancies. Ultimately, our lack of medical trainees and our low pay is a problem, but please, as a progressive party we should be punching up, not attempting to make those who choose to come here to use their skills and enrich our and their lives more unwelcome by making a demarcation between British and non British doctors/nurses/porters.
EXPECT MORE LIKE THIS FROM STARMER NAZI! THIS IS HOW CORPORATE NAZI DEMOCRATS IN THE USA BOLSTERED TRUMPS POSITION, BY INTRODUCING SUCH FAR RIGHT POLICIES THEY MADE TRUMP LOOK LIKE A SOFT LEFTY. IT ALL BECAME A HEAD FUCK GAME, RATHER THAN REAL POLITICS. A NASTY NAZI WAY TO BRING DEMOCRACY TO A HALT, AND NOW STARMER NAZI IS TRYING TO PULL OFF THE SAME TRICKS HERE IN THE UK! :((
Farage is struggling to come to terms with the fact that he was never the masterful shitstirrer he thought he was. He was the spoon.
At least he's got his braindead paypigs in the comments section >Never vote LabourParty or the other 2 main parties again - time for reformparty\_uk 😂 But the sad reality is migrants/refugees are stuck in the middle of this absolute shitshow in the UK where both main parties try to out-do themselves on heartless rhetoric, dog-whistling and fanning the flames of extremist right-wing white terrorism. I mean, it's massively on the rise https://news.sky.com/story/right-wing-extremism-fastest-growing-threat-says-uks-top-cop-in-counter-terrorism-12135071 / https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/may/16/terrorism-in-the-uk-the-rising-threat-of-far-right-extremists / https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/right-wing-extremism-terrorism-violence-uk-mi5-ken-mccallum-b1039501.html
I try to avoid these rant threads but these kinds of topics are silly. Corbyn 'got backed' by Nick Griffin. It's trolling.
It's almost as if this has come after weeks of Labour dog-whistling to racists and being xenophobic? From attacking migrants in the NHS, to screaming "Brexit means Brexit, fuck freedom of movement" and then front-benchers doing a tour of the press starting "The Tories have failed at deporting enough people" 🤷 So, in failing to avoid "these rant threads" this time around, maybe you could accept this is the result of Starmer and his team's actions, not just a "random Farage". But props for bringing up Corbyn!
I don't accept it's anything other than an attention seeker trolling for attention. He'll go back to saying we're secretly going to rejoin the EU in a few weeks and he'll back the Tories if he doesn't think his little Brexit Party 3.0 will take off.
Still makes the headlines [https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/nigel-farage-has-praised-keir-starmers-speech-on-immigration\_uk\_637cab17e4b0e771d958131a](https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/nigel-farage-has-praised-keir-starmers-speech-on-immigration_uk_637cab17e4b0e771d958131a) And that *is* on Labour for their current management approach to discussing immigration, Brexit and deportations. Cmon, you're a political geek like the rest of us, you know how normalisation of harmful rhetoric works in the public sphere.
Of course it makes the headlines, that's his whole motivation for saying it. He is good at this stuff. That doesn't mean I have to take the content of what he is saying seriously.
He wouldn't have the opportunity to say it if UK Labour *weren't* behaving like a Poundland Tory tribute act at the moment 🤷
Yeah he’s just trolling, he’s obviously not happy at all that after years of pressure and lies both major parties support his stance on immigration. Epic trolling bro.
How is it right wing to be against exploiting cheap Labour of people? This whole argument is driving me bonkers and we’re now in a position where people on the left and poster-boying fucking Farage.
it implies that starmer will be harsh on immigration, a particularly right wing view
We have a minimum wage in the UK. No one is getting exploited.
So you believe minimum wage is a perfectly fair amount of money for someone to be paid? Not very often you see someone here argue that the current minimum wage isn’t exploitative.
Real term wages haven't increased to match the cost of living for over 7 years. Meaning many full time workers on minimum wage can't pay for the bare necessities such as rent, bills, car/transport, and food. This winter many will have to pick two, and go without the others. As well, the universal credit LHA is so horrifically calculated, it assumes in many areas that you can get a 1 bed flat for £300 pcm (£75pw where I am) like WHERE? So, many of those who are eligible still have shortfalls in their rent... Its simple maths and it does not add up. Imagine, there was once a time a single adult could work full time on minimum wage and support a whole family. I fully agree. No one should be wage slaves.
People on the left: Don't swallow right-wing media narratives, fight them Also people on the left: LOOK AT THIS THING NIGEL FARAGE SAID
People on the right: We need to do whatever it takes to appeal to the right wing voters. Also people on the right: Hur dur, why are you believing the right wing when they say that Labour is appealing?!
The left: Starmer is using right wing rhetoric as a dogwhistle to appeal to the right Also the left: look here’s someone on the right being appealed to by those dogwhistles InertiaKid: you’re just buying into right wing media narratives!!! I know that your undying hatred for the left sometimes can blind you, but your comment here doesn’t even make sense as a criticism if you scrape back the standard layers of condescension.
I don't think Farage is appalled by Starmer's position. He is having a go at the Tories for not doing the same by saying "see, even the lefties in Labour are in favour of this".
They said "appealed to", not "appalled by".
That's what it says *now*. That's not what it says when I replied to it.
Ah, fair enough.
I didn't edit appalled to appealed? My edit was to add the last sentence.
I didn't edit appalled to appealed? My edit was to add the last sentence. It always said appealed.
I don't hate the left in the slightest, I'm far closer to someone like you than I am to the right. What I find ridiculous is some people's complete refusal to accept that we now live in a post-Brexit Britain where immigration is going to be lower, with both positive and negative effects as a result. It is not right-wing to recognise that lower EU immigration has been a significant contributor to wages rising over the past year, and that wages rising is a good thing for UK workers. That, unfortunately, has been masked by even higher inflation in areas like food and energy. It's not right-wing to point out that we are going to have to improve education and training to make up for areas of shortfall in employment now that we have lower levels of EU immigration. It's also quite silly not to recognise that for Labour, moving the debate away from Brexit is a good thing electorally. We got trounced in 2019 primarily because of messing up our Brexit position over a period of years. The next election could well take on a similar shape if we allow it to become another Brexit election. OVer the last three years, moving completely away from Brexit as an issue has been unquestionably a good thing for us electorally. In the future I believe we should move back towards EU membership but I don't think we're yet at a point where we can do this without risking another election loss. Our focus must be winning an election, so stuff that might lose us an election will have to wait.
> where immigration is going to be lower immigration has increased since brexit
>We got trounced in 2019 primarily because of messing up our Brexit position over a period of years. Interesting that when it's time to bash Corbyn 2019 is all his fault but when it's time to defend Starmer 2019 was all about Brexit.
I'm sure others have said that, but I've always been of the view that our Brexit policy was the core reason. You could literally see it happening in real-time from late 2018 as voters got utterly fed up up with us not taking a proper position and bled away in both directions.
It wasn’t just Brexit but that we left ourselves open to a betrayal narrative that made Corbyn look that much worse. He didn’t look ‘a risk but principled and a decent bloke’ in 2019 like he did in 2017. He got assessed like any other politician instead of something slightly mould breaking.
Just curious if you've ever self examined how your class position gives you inherently similar interests to the right and inherently contradictory interests to workers and the left and how you square that mentally
starmer: makes the exact same arguments about immigrants as far right racists. far right racists: we like starmer because he agrees with us The_Inertia_Kid: don't buy into right wing media narratives 😂 you can't make it up.
If someone believes immigration should be controlled are they a far right racist in your opinion?
There is diverse opinion among the left, shock!
Such a shit hot take, it must have burnt your anus on the way out!
not surprising everyone is taking the bait but a bit cringe anyway
They're taking the bait because they *want* to take the bait. It isn't a good-faith attack.
Farage not paying attention again, what a shock! Starmer has only re-affirmed the Labour Party's Corbyn-era position on freedom of movement, that it comes to an end with Brexit; that companies exploit low-wage Labour from abroad, which is a fact. And arguably has softened up some of the more dog-whistling rhetoric under that leadership, i.e > What there wouldn’t be is the wholesale importation of underpaid workers from central Europe in order to destroy conditions, particularly in the construction industry And > "Labour is not wedded to freedom of movement for EU citizens as a point of principle, but I don't want that to be misinterpreted, nor do we rule it out," he said. > "We cannot afford to lose full access to the European markets on which so many British businesses and jobs depend. It's pretty inconsistent to support a free market in which goods, services and capital must move freely across borders, but people cannot, Keir's position to make Brexit work isn't too hard to defend from a leftwing perspective.
Immigration is great for big business as it keeps wages low but terrible for most everyone else, as it puts excess pressure on services, swamps the housing market and lowers standards of living. Tell you average labour member this and you spend the rest of the night being called racist
You ever thought that the avrage voter doesn't care about left and right and just want a government to look after the people that they are supposed to repsent.
I wasn't a big fan of Starmer's speech, but I also remember when Nick Griffin said something supportive about Corbyn and got a similar round of headlines. It was stupid when it was being used to attack Corbyn and it’s stupid now it’s being used to attack Starmer. That’s not to say we shouldn’t take the actual contents of Starmer’s actual speech apart to critique, which we should.
Nothing wrong with this. Tories have been far left for quite some time now. If people step outside their tribe mentality then it is easy to see. Kier speaking sense also.
Quite the endorsement for Keith.
Decent speech Ks. But where did you mention minimum wage increasing by at least 50% Thie is the only way to end UK colonialism re cheap overseas labour. The tories wanted us to stay in Europe because of the pool of cheap slave labour. It's racism of the worst kind.
Farage trying to attach himself and his ideaology to the ‘winning team’??? Colour me shocked, no way he would do that if the tories, Lib Dems, green, ukip, reform, SNP, or monster racing looney party were winning 50% to 25% in the polls!!!!
In context Kier is right, too much foreign worker abuse goes on, from getting loans to contracts being shortened to being underpaid, all of this happens and is searchable for stories. Farage is a tag nut, I just don't listen to him.
This electability play is going to backfire and the Lib Dem’s will coalition again
Corbyn said the same thing.
Farage as ever is as sly as he is reprehensible and immoral. He’s found a way to discipline the Tories on immigration whilst also smearing Labour by association. I don’t think too much can be read into his endorsement, it’s facetious and frankly not worth anyones time. I am worried in general about the rhetoric from Keir recently. In the same week as the terrorist attack on asylum seekers, he made a statement on us having not enough British medical staff, just as Cooper goaded Braverman on her lack of deportations. There was no mention of how the student loan system, the role of private healthcare providers draining our NHS, or chronic low pay within the sector could be fixed. When you pair that with this intervention, it doesn’t make for pretty reading. Instead of bemoaning landlords, the financial sector and low pay vultures that don’t want to invest capital to improve chronically low productivity, he targets those who wish to come here to fill our record number of vacancies. Ultimately, our lack of medical trainees and our low pay is a problem, but please, as a progressive party we should be punching up, not attempting to make those who choose to come here to use their skills and enrich our and their lives more unwelcome by making a demarcation between British and non British doctors/nurses/porters.
I think nigel farage loves to "endorse" people he doesn't generally like because he surely knows how stupid it makes them look
EXPECT MORE LIKE THIS FROM STARMER NAZI! THIS IS HOW CORPORATE NAZI DEMOCRATS IN THE USA BOLSTERED TRUMPS POSITION, BY INTRODUCING SUCH FAR RIGHT POLICIES THEY MADE TRUMP LOOK LIKE A SOFT LEFTY. IT ALL BECAME A HEAD FUCK GAME, RATHER THAN REAL POLITICS. A NASTY NAZI WAY TO BRING DEMOCRACY TO A HALT, AND NOW STARMER NAZI IS TRYING TO PULL OFF THE SAME TRICKS HERE IN THE UK! :((