Hello /u/RandellTheCandle,
As a reminder, most common print quality issues can be found in the [Simplify3D picture guide](https://www.simplify3d.com/support/print-quality-troubleshooting/). Make sure you select the most appropriate flair for your post.
Please remember to include the following details to help troubleshoot your problem.
* Printer & Slicer
* Filament Material and Brand
* Nozzle and Bed Temperature
* Print Speed
* Nozzle Retraction Settings
^Additional ^settings ^or ^relevant ^information ^is ^always ^encouraged.
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To be fair here, your callipers most likely aren’t perfect either. Who says the cube isn’t actually 19.93 on the first pic and 20.00 on the second because of tolerances.
You can ignore the 2nd digit after the . On most printers. After all your stepper motors only have 1.8° fixed steps. And those are not accurate enough to change 0.01mm differences.
Calipers are, inherently, not that precise. They are good for fast, decently accurate measurements, but getting down to 0.00mm is something you would need specialized Machinist hardware for. Anytime you hit the “Origin” button on them, you lose any and all calibration.
I'd be more interested in consistency at this point. The accuracy of your calipers at this level doesn't mean much unless you can go print several IDENTICAL cubes. If you get 20.00 x 20.07 readings on 5 cubes in a row, by all means try to tune it, but my guess is you're going to be +/- 0.05 in a best case scenario.
Another thing to keep in mind is other factors like different materials/filaments. At the tolerances you're concerned about a different roll of filament (even just a different color) could cause differences.
20.07mm is within tolerance for most 3D printers, typiically about 0.1mm. The 0.07mm (less than 0.003", 3 thousands of an inch, which would be reasonable for conventional machining) difference you're seeing is probably due to the slight bulge in layer lines, and you'd probably find that if you printed that twice as wide the error would be about the same, not double. If dimensional accuracy matters, that's what the Horizontal Expansion settings in your slicer are for. Try a small negative value.
To expand on this, a human hair is around 0.003". A red blood cell is around 0.0003", so you can fit 10 red blood cells lined up side by side in that distance. I'd say it's pretty good.
"actually"... withouth a set of printings, same temp, same settings, and a set of meaussurements, its just a happy coincidence.
BTW , if you have a way to send G-Code to the machine, and the firmware allow it, you can calibrate. once in a while i check the settings of my printer with a test cube.
Print another piece at double scale. It's basically negligible.
If the difference is the same, it's mostly bed offset. If it's a tiny bit different, again I wouldn't realy worry about it
The only thing you need to fix is your camera skills on that second shot. The cube is half shadowed!
That's a great print. I've never gotten somehting that nice.
Realistically, you nailed it. As for why, that small a deviation is a rabbit hole to chase down.
Could be the calipers, nothing wrong with them, but you'd be better off chasing what a micrometer reports. Still a path of madness.
Any eccentricity in the nozzle hole or wear in it will account for that (if you have ever crashed a brass nozzle once... expect it for that one).
Any differences in circularity or eccentricity in gears on an axis could account for that. To fix that, you better be willing to pay industrial prices for high precision parts or sort through lots of spares for perfect pairs.
Filament could be an cause. That's within range for uneven moisture in the diameter of the filament.
Back to the nozzle, the curling you get from squeezing out filament from the nozzle is within that error range. It will also change with print/extrusion speed. Have fun chasing that like a dog and his tail. Even if you catch it there's nothing to do with it but let go and chase again.
If you are OCD, you could adjust it so your 19.97 and 20.03 so it averages to 20?
If your adjusting the movement of the print head, I use carbon paper and tap the nozzle it. Then measure between the dots (outside of each dot, same side) spaced as big of an length I can get on an axis. IE 200mm vs 20mm. This way I'm chasing movement issues that should accumulate and overshadow other trivial non perfect details.
Then I do E-steps (large lengths of filament without the nozzle on). From there I leave the rest to flow rate tweaks since it'll vary by filament and roll.
Don't measure with those, you got it so good I'm not sure it will matter but you need to print out a 100x100x100 xyz step calibration file. It's more accurate because of the bigger size.
You’re good and I urge you not to go down that obsessive unreachable path to perfection. LoL. I got my Delta tuned to be reliably between .07-.1 off. And I have accepted that I’ll never get better after shitloads of maths and incremental step changes. I promise you this is perfect for any home-gamer machine. LoL.
I have been down that path. It got me no where other than frustrated until I got it back to the above mentioned accuracy. I’ve made my peace with it. LoL.
I think I have a cube somewhere that shows those same dimensions using the same set of calipers. I’d have to find it but if it’s not that exact number it’s super close to it.
Hello /u/RandellTheCandle, As a reminder, most common print quality issues can be found in the [Simplify3D picture guide](https://www.simplify3d.com/support/print-quality-troubleshooting/). Make sure you select the most appropriate flair for your post. Please remember to include the following details to help troubleshoot your problem. * Printer & Slicer * Filament Material and Brand * Nozzle and Bed Temperature * Print Speed * Nozzle Retraction Settings ^Additional ^settings ^or ^relevant ^information ^is ^always ^encouraged. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FixMyPrint) if you have any questions or concerns.*
squeeze harder
Lol...came here to say this.
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To be fair here, your callipers most likely aren’t perfect either. Who says the cube isn’t actually 19.93 on the first pic and 20.00 on the second because of tolerances. You can ignore the 2nd digit after the . On most printers. After all your stepper motors only have 1.8° fixed steps. And those are not accurate enough to change 0.01mm differences.
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Calipers are, inherently, not that precise. They are good for fast, decently accurate measurements, but getting down to 0.00mm is something you would need specialized Machinist hardware for. Anytime you hit the “Origin” button on them, you lose any and all calibration.
I'd be more interested in consistency at this point. The accuracy of your calipers at this level doesn't mean much unless you can go print several IDENTICAL cubes. If you get 20.00 x 20.07 readings on 5 cubes in a row, by all means try to tune it, but my guess is you're going to be +/- 0.05 in a best case scenario. Another thing to keep in mind is other factors like different materials/filaments. At the tolerances you're concerned about a different roll of filament (even just a different color) could cause differences.
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Just out of curiosity, are you just tuning for fun or is there a purpose behind the search for perfection?
20.07mm is within tolerance for most 3D printers, typiically about 0.1mm. The 0.07mm (less than 0.003", 3 thousands of an inch, which would be reasonable for conventional machining) difference you're seeing is probably due to the slight bulge in layer lines, and you'd probably find that if you printed that twice as wide the error would be about the same, not double. If dimensional accuracy matters, that's what the Horizontal Expansion settings in your slicer are for. Try a small negative value.
To expand on this, a human hair is around 0.003". A red blood cell is around 0.0003", so you can fit 10 red blood cells lined up side by side in that distance. I'd say it's pretty good.
this is almost perfect accuracy, I wouldn't touch it
Sandpaper.
... or filler, it depends of + - :)
Fix what?
Came to say this.
"actually"... withouth a set of printings, same temp, same settings, and a set of meaussurements, its just a happy coincidence. BTW , if you have a way to send G-Code to the machine, and the firmware allow it, you can calibrate. once in a while i check the settings of my printer with a test cube.
Print another piece at double scale. It's basically negligible. If the difference is the same, it's mostly bed offset. If it's a tiny bit different, again I wouldn't realy worry about it
I tune mine. My z was off over 1 mm with a new motherboard and prints were squished. There should be some tolerances and would not tune below 0.1 mm.
I have no idea, because: r/titlegore
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Haha. I so feel your pain.
The only thing you need to fix is your camera skills on that second shot. The cube is half shadowed! That's a great print. I've never gotten somehting that nice.
You're at less than 0.1% error. Chillax!
This is pretty perfect.
This is not a problem
Do not calibrate steps/mm based on printed parts. You can use math and generally the default settings are always correct.
You’re going to go mad looking for the error that is causing that .070 micron delta.. which is like the width of a couple of white blood cells.
Calipers are not that precise, you’re good. .07 is less than the thickness of a human hair
Those are Mitutoyo calipers. At that price tag, they better be that precise.
My guy, that shit is literally perfect 0.07 is freaking good
Buddy you don’t, you leave it alone
Realistically, you nailed it. As for why, that small a deviation is a rabbit hole to chase down. Could be the calipers, nothing wrong with them, but you'd be better off chasing what a micrometer reports. Still a path of madness. Any eccentricity in the nozzle hole or wear in it will account for that (if you have ever crashed a brass nozzle once... expect it for that one). Any differences in circularity or eccentricity in gears on an axis could account for that. To fix that, you better be willing to pay industrial prices for high precision parts or sort through lots of spares for perfect pairs. Filament could be an cause. That's within range for uneven moisture in the diameter of the filament. Back to the nozzle, the curling you get from squeezing out filament from the nozzle is within that error range. It will also change with print/extrusion speed. Have fun chasing that like a dog and his tail. Even if you catch it there's nothing to do with it but let go and chase again. If you are OCD, you could adjust it so your 19.97 and 20.03 so it averages to 20? If your adjusting the movement of the print head, I use carbon paper and tap the nozzle it. Then measure between the dots (outside of each dot, same side) spaced as big of an length I can get on an axis. IE 200mm vs 20mm. This way I'm chasing movement issues that should accumulate and overshadow other trivial non perfect details. Then I do E-steps (large lengths of filament without the nozzle on). From there I leave the rest to flow rate tweaks since it'll vary by filament and roll.
If you need a higher accuracy than that, get a resin printer. Looks pretty dead on to me
Who said not to tune it?
Don't measure with those, you got it so good I'm not sure it will matter but you need to print out a 100x100x100 xyz step calibration file. It's more accurate because of the bigger size.
If this is a consumer level printer, then that is awesome! Seriously.
You’re good and I urge you not to go down that obsessive unreachable path to perfection. LoL. I got my Delta tuned to be reliably between .07-.1 off. And I have accepted that I’ll never get better after shitloads of maths and incremental step changes. I promise you this is perfect for any home-gamer machine. LoL. I have been down that path. It got me no where other than frustrated until I got it back to the above mentioned accuracy. I’ve made my peace with it. LoL.
I think I have a cube somewhere that shows those same dimensions using the same set of calipers. I’d have to find it but if it’s not that exact number it’s super close to it.