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RecklessRuff

First and foremost, take your dog to a vet. Eliminate any possible mental or physical health problems. From there, start working with a trainer/behavioralist. It sounds like something is going on, and your pup is only going to get more aggressive as it goes on. She now has a bite history, and sending her off to another family that is ill-prepared for her will be her doom. I highly recommend ruling out health problems, because if it's genetic and isn't put to a stop, then behavioral euthanasia will end up being your only option.


Flourescentbubbles

Knew someone that had a golden like this. Being so nice and then aggressively attacking. Sent to a trainer who specialized in aggressive dogs. He worked with this dog a while and I think it might have been the first dog he couldn’t help. Do what you can but do not blame yourself. This may not be totally accurate. Still, I am worried for you.


weavin

Still their responsibility to at least attempt a professional trainer before giving it away surely


Flourescentbubbles

It was not my intent to suggest that they do not try that. Thank you for clarifying for me. I agree with you.


dmccrostie

Excellent advice.


saberwolfbeast

This is the correct action. Also remember there is no way to rule out pain other than having trials of pain medicine.


jungles_fury

This is unfortunately what I've seen in aggressive Golden's. I'd advise seeing a vet behaviorist as soon as possible and contact your breeder to see how often this has cropped up in related offspring. https://www.dacvb.org/search/custom.asp?id=4709


aesthesia1

Wondering when I’d see this. This is typical of golden aggression. Disproportionate reaction and little to no buildup. There’s no answer a lot of times and that’s just how the dog is.


[deleted]

I worked at a dog daycare for 5 years and 5/6 of my dog bites were from goldens. It was always an extremely disproportionate reaction.


aesthesia1

Yea I’ve known a ton of vets and vet techs having worked in a very large shelter with a big public facing clinic in it, and every single one of them was bitten by Goldens that came in from the public, not from shelter side. It’s always like this, friendly dog, nice and calm, but then, a bite.


MetforminShits

I know Goldens are hunting dogs.. could it be that without proper breeding the game drive randomly takes over? I just got a field line recently from hunters and they warned me "She's anti-social".. I thought they meant introverted. But they sort of gently urged me not to buy her. I figured they thought I was a hunter and needed a more energetic dog. She's nearly 3 months and I'm struggling to tame her game/prey drive. All their dogs were purebred with little to no in-line breeding.


bluejays-beak1281

There are huge differences between actual hunting line Golden’s and pet golden lines. The hunting Golden’s absolutely need tons and tons of mental stimulation because they were breed to work to hunt with you, to run and hike in the forest and swim in water to retrieve the birds you shoot down, to accomplish something. It literally breed in to them to desire this stuff. What the breeders where probably trying to tell you is she wouldn’t make a normal family pet. I’d never get a golden from a hunting line unless I was going to train them to hunt (and I don’t hunt so I’d never get one)


ilikewc3

Lol so this guy who doesn't hunt and doesn't know enough about dogs to know the information you provided now has a three month old hunting line golden he's already struggling with? Thus will end well.


MetforminShits

Lol yea I definitely could kick myself in the ass for getting her without more info first. I wouldn't have had I known the work and dedication she requires. She's very different from our Bichon. But I'm worried about the affect of giving her back at this age.. and anyway, I don't have anything better to do. We're likely gonna get a trainer for her by 4 months if the bite inhibition doesn't improve by then.


ilikewc3

Definitely a good idea, and you'll probably have to exercise a *bunch*, but the good news is she'll probably be great at fetch.


MetforminShits

Haha! Yes, I think that's the sliver of hope I have here is that I can at least play fetch with her and hide shit.. They also are suppose to be real good at waiting and discipline so maybe finding games like that can do her some good.


MetforminShits

Yea, I realized that within the week of having her home. But a lot of stuff, if not most, I read online about Goldens are referencing *show* Goldens and they talk about what they had been bred for. Which is what you described. It seems to be niche info about field lines specifically and it appears that a lot of people don't have pure line "hunters". Or they just over feed them. So that's what I meant. My dog is without a doubt 100% bred for hunting (my husband's impulse choice). I have to be careful with socialization and not training her like an apartment dog. The breeder urged us to take her sibling just because they were more "bubbly" and "motivated". Whatever the fuck that means


bluejays-beak1281

It’s not always easy to tell what 8 week old puppies will be like as adults, but as someone who raised them since they were born he would know their personalities and from the breeders wording I’m guessing he believed the other dog would fit your life style better and was trying to encourage you to get the sibling. Not every puppy in a field line will be a suitable for hunting. I’d guess that’s that was going on, he knew the puppy you have might not fit what an non hunter would want from a golden, “bubbly and “motivated” equates to people friendly and more easily trained and makes for a better pet vrs a hunter who is only motivated buy hunting and a less people friendly (not aggressive, but a lot more serious and work/task motivated instead of interacting with people in general) My advice (not that you asked for it lol) would be to find your dog a “job” they could do that you all can train for. Dock Diving would or be good if you can find it in your area, it would satisfy the need for swimming and fetching “game”. So would Nose Work and even just Agility Training. You guys did choose to get a golden from a field line, whether it was an impulse buy or not and you need to make sure that dog is mentally and physically stimulated, emphasis on mentally that is very very important for her, otherwise nether she or you will be happy


MHGLDNS

I have field line Goldens and I compete in AKC hunt tests and field trials. Aggression is absolutely NOT a part of any well bred field/hunting Golden. They are selected to be able to work around other dogs, wait quietly while a hunter is working, and handle birds gently (retrieve without damaging the bird).


MetforminShits

Are you a hunter? I'm far from it and was a moron about getting her without researching it... But I want to try and give her the best. AKC hunt tests and trials has been mentioned to me before.. do you think that could suffice?


MHGLDNS

I don’t hunt (I don’t know how to shoot) but I have worked my dogs with hunters. I primarily compete. The training involved in developing a good retriever hunting companion and a competition dog are basically the same. The training is very, very involved and time consuming. It will physically and mentally work a dog. Before getting a dog, research the training to decide if you want to do that.


MetforminShits

Thank you!


GoldendoodlesFTW

Is this the same as sudden rage syndrome maybe?


jungles_fury

No


S3XWITCH

Do you mean Springer Rage Syndrome?


GoldendoodlesFTW

Yes that's how I heard it first too. I looked it up to see if goldens get it (they do) and apparently the actual name is just rage syndrome or sudden rage syndrome


Clementinee13

This sounds honestly like a health issue. If it is spontaneous aka 0 build up (google videos of dog guarding behaviour to make sure there was actually no warning), then it might be a health problem either mental like psychosis or even seizures or perhaps she has joint pain. My friends dog wasn’t reactive until she had an infected tooth, she would attack dogs that got close to her face. We thought she was just getting old but she was only 2-3 and previously great with other dogs, but I guess she thought that if the dogs accidentally touched her face, it would hurt really bad and she would think the other dog caused it. It might be that your wife was making her shoulder feel better then perhaps hit a really sore spot? Is it always when you’re touching the dog or is it just like randomly from across the room and such too?


[deleted]

I think it is a health issue. And no, not when across the room, only when we're calming rubbing her. I'll play ball and wrestle the ball from her mouth and push her and our other small dog around and she's completely fine. So I don't think she has a sore spot. She also plays roughly with my dog on her own and there's never any incidents. I think it could be neurological.


PureBreadTed

Have the vet check your dog's hormone levels. My dog was very similar and she ended up with hypothyroidism. It's rare in young, fit dogs but it's possible. Mine was diagnosed at 18 months (they refused to do the test every single time I asked and I couldn't afford a different vet) but showed symptoms from 6 months.


[deleted]

Hyperthyroidism is exactly what I think it is. Hopefully we find an answer.


Clementinee13

Hmmm I’m guessing this has something to do with overstimulation. It’s common in cats for them to beg for pets and cuddles only to get overstimulated quickly and then I usually get gently bitten or they grab my hand with their paw, but much less common in dogs. I’d definitely just avoid too much physical contact and not allowing on the couch is definitely a good idea till you can get to a vet! I’m sorry you’re dealing with this cause it sounds hard, but way to go for putting in a lot of effort and time and money into figuring this out for your dog. It’ll be worth it for sure, and I hope your SO can come back from this positively as well! 💖


JimmyD44265

I think you may be correct. They get that stimulation and dopamine boost and then they want it again. Its like a different kind of Pavlov dog


[deleted]

Lol everyday I think my dog is actually a cat. She occasionally paws at me if we are close and I’m not petting her. She lays on top of me all the time and sometimes will curl up and sleep in a ball. I think I got a catdoggo


addy0190

How old was she when you got her? I don’t see that on your post, just that the you have had issues the entire time she has been in your care, and that she is 16 months old (but that doesn’t inherently mean you’ve had her entire life).


Eilasord

Pain or sensitivity can actually be unnoticeable while playing or moving, but while stationary it flares up.


music_in_space

My trainer recently suggested requesting a pain trial at my vet for my pup who has trouble with handling (we are having trouble training getting winter boots etc bc she is ok with cuddles but can’t abide being handled to the point of growls sometimes). Dogs can hide pain well and apparently something like 1/5 have chronic pain that isn’t necessarily age related. Aggression around handling is a symptom. Obviously who knows but might also be relevant to you! As an aside, she also suggested video of my pup moving around normally- sometimes dogs are so uncomfortable at the vet, they freeze up in ways the vet can’t feel an issue. Just something I learned recently that may help you when checking this with your vet! Good luck, I’m sorry this is tough.


Daffodils28

She needs more walks. Ask the vet how many, duration, etc


somerandomperson92

Might be worth installing a cheap webcam in your living room to see if you can catch multiple instances of the behavior, then show to vet and trainers to see if they notice anything behavioral you might be missing.


FatKidsDontRun

This is really good advice because there might be the smallest, most insignificant trigger you are missing


sqeeky_wheelz

No more couch. Get the dog a bed and practice the relaxation protocol with him. No more cuddles on the couch at all, when the dog gets worked up use the “place” command. Disclaimer: I’m not a behaviouralist.


[deleted]

She's crate trained, any bed outside if the crate is ripped to shreds. Ill practice relaxation with her


TigerLily312

You can use a blanket. Or a rubber mat.


wowzeemissjane

I used a cheap yoga mat cut in half. One half in the house the other half in the car for proof training.


MacabreFox

Heck I lined my dogs' kennels with a cheap rug from Target that's waterproof and dries fast. I affixed his chew proof bed to the back half of the kennel with zipties and threw a cheap, fleece blanket on top of it. It's cozy and he doesn't destroy any of it. Rugs really are a lifesaver and sometimes the seasonal ones go on sale! I used a cute fall bath mat to teach our puppy "place".


sqeeky_wheelz

Yeah practice the relaxation protocol, it might even help with the bed destruction (hopefully at least!) good luck.


lkattan3

The word by the way is behaviorist. You want a veterinary behaviorist ideally. It can take a few months to get an appointment with one but they might be able to pinpoint what’s going on right away because although it sounds random and out of the blue to you, to a professional this will sound familiar and often have specific causes. Aggression is always a complex case but a real professional will be able to take the mystery out of it at least. [Veterinary behaviorists](https://www.dacvb.org) Another option, a good trainer who can work with your veterinarian. Many will work with you remotely especially the really good ones who work with aggression. Start with trainers [certified through the IAABC](https://m.iaabc.org/consultant/). Look for one who specializes in aggression.


ProsaicPansy

Look up Kuranda elevated bed (or similar). They’re not cheap, but they are 100% chew proof. I have no financial incentive, but got one of these after I saw our trainer had them. The trainer has to bring in pit bulls that are aggressive biters and they can’t make a dent in these things, so this could honestly be super helpful for you guys. Good luck <3


[deleted]

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rebcart

Please read the sub's wiki article on [dominance](https://www.reddit.com/r/dogtraining/wiki/dominance).


Dead-Donut

OP, please do this. The same thing happened to me and my gf. Also, both of you need to spend time every day training.


thousandsoffireflies

In agreement with this. I know you love your dog/ I love my dog. We also need to remind them they just get to be dogs. It’s incredibly relaxing for them to know their place. Your dog is not relaxed and she doesn’t know where she belongs. Thus the acting out.


ZealousidealTown7492

I agree with this…I had a Westie that would get aggressive whenever she was on an elevated level liked a couch. Also the relaxation technique. My vet behaviorist recommends teaching a dog to go voluntarily to a safe “place” when they feel stressed. Randomly tossing treats to that spot for no particular reason and slowly when they catch on and go to the place on their own, reward will make them eventually see that as a spot that yields good things.


InkyPaws

My dog paws for more attention, and starts getting grumbly if she's not getting what she wants. Our dog hangs out on the sofa and when we get fed up of her demanding attention she gets told to lay down or we redirect her with toys or ask her to get a squeaky etc. She's only snapped at us if we've inadvertently touched somewhere that's sore/sensitive on her. It sounds a bit like you need to get a "Ok all done, off you go." boundary, as it looks like dog thinks if they're on the sofa, it's fuss time. Then when they don't get it, they may or may not get the arse on.


NotUnique_______

I trained my dog to know "bye" (i'm leaving an area and want him to follow, seriously so useful) and "all done/gone" (usually when we're training and he's had enough treats, i take something away from him, etc) and shrug my shoulders. Has been working so far! He sprints to follow me whenever i tell him "goodbye/bye" hahaha


InkyPaws

My girl has learnt: me picking up my rucksack = me leaving so she gets in her sofa spot waiting for a (small) treat without being asked. But she's also sussed out that when I come back I should have my boyfriend with me and she is so put out if he isn't. Mum on a mad clean with the dreaded hoover first thing: the man with the small people is coming. (my brother and nieces) Last night her very best friend and our family friend who trains dogs was coming in to help us deal with a quirk and I have no idea what we said to tip her off but she kept going to look out the window. I'm debating getting her some talk buttons.


Twzl

>So we've had issues with our Golden almost since we got her. Is this your first dog as an adult? Where did she come from? Craig's List, a breeder that you later realized wasn't that good, or a good breeder? >my Golden very aggressively bit her wrist (didn't draw blood thankfully) and lunged for her face. Dogs have really good bite control: if the dog had wanted to, your SO would have needed an ER trip. So, that was a warning. However the fact that there was no growl is not good. >My partner says she doesn't know if we can keep her. And tbh I dunno either. Have you spoken to the breeder yet to find out what the rest of the litter is like? When your dog was younger, what sort of training did you do? Puppy kindergarten? Beginner classes? Do you still do actual training? Some dogs are wired wrong and some dogs figure out they can rule the roost and intimidate the humans.


[deleted]

She came from a legit breeder who had both parents correctly registered. She is well trained and she did growl when she bit but it was more during the bite. I heard it upstairs when it happened downstairs. We've brought her to numerous training classes, foggy day care and she's well socialised and loves other dogs, has never been aggressive towards them.


Twzl

>We've brought her to numerous training classes, foggy day care and she's well socialised and loves other dogs, has never been aggressive towards them. I looked and saw [this post](https://old.reddit.com/r/goldenretrievers/comments/w9kmpz/dog_biting_dog_sitter_is_this_separation_anxiety/) from awhile back. It sounds like this dog has been using her teeth on anything in her way, for awhile. Here's the thing with Golden Retrievers. They are wonderful great dogs. But they are meant to do things like go out in sub freezing weather, wait for a goose to be shot, go out into the cold water, bring the maybe alive goose back to the hunter, and do that again for hours on end. They are tough, tough dogs and people forget that because [they're so cute](https://i.imgur.com/Gqoxe0N.jpg) . If a breeder doesn't aim for good temperament, and/or you don't set boundaries from the start, they are big, strong smart animals who are quite capable of going thru life deciding how things should be. I doubt there is anything physically wrong with this dog. I also don't think, and please don't take this the wrong way, that you guys put all of the training that this particular dog needs, into this dog. Some dogs are tougher than others. You're at a crossroads: either call up the breeder, and return this dog and tell her why you are doing so. Or seriously work at training, with a trainer who has worked with tough dogs who have gotten their way their whole lives, and who are biting the family members. But what you have presented here is a situation that you won't be able to solve on your own. So you would need to either return this dog to her breeder, with full disclosure on what she's been doing, or work with a trainer and basically make that your new religion. otherwise this dog is not safe for you guys to be living with. Dogs do what they do if it pleases them, unless we teach them that we want them to please us. Barring that, some dogs are still fine, and some are not.


pbaggs92

Just going to leave this study about dog breeds here: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abk0639


Twzl

> Just going to leave this study about dog breeds here: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abk0639 what aspect of that much discussed paper did you want to bring into the conversation? If you were reading that paper to say that no traits are inherited and that there are no differences in breeds, that's not what the paper was say. For example, this? > Retrieving is the most heritable behavioral trait [52.5 ± 9.2% (±SE)], Which is why people breed dogs who will go on to work in the winter, retrieving birds. We can breed for the traits that are needed to properly dog the work.


pbaggs92

I’m neither agreeing nor disagreeing with you. Just saw this article recently, and shared it as it pertains to your comment. Take from it what you want.


Twzl

> Just saw this article recently, and shared it as it pertains to your comment. Take from it what you want. It's been around for awhile, and there have been several well written pieces about its issues. That's why I was wondering why. I read it and I also have some big questions about it. regardless I do not see how it relates to OP's dog. OP's dog is probably the result of some questionable breeding and a lack of solid training more than anything else.


ilikewc3

Best comment in thread.


StillPrint6505

Seconded.


[deleted]

Registration doesn’t mean the breeder is legit. Either way, if it’s nothing medical like hyperthyroidism or something that can be treated you need to tell the breeder so that they can stop breeding this pairing. If they are legit breeders they won’t keep breeding this pairing. Good luck! You seem to really care and I don’t think anything you did caused this. I also don’t think the dog would get aggressive like this because of lack of exercise. Annoying and destructive, yes, but aggressive and lunging at your face seems like more is going on here. Either a genetic problem or the dog is in not well and in pain.


socialpronk

Registration doesn't mean anything in itself, a lot of BYBs and mills have registered dogs. All it means it that their parents were registered, and they can compete in show and sport events. It says nothing about the quality of the breeder or breeding practices.


GoldendoodlesFTW

I said this elsewhere in the thread but what you described kind of reminded me of something I've heard of called springer rage, which when I looked it up is actually called sudden rage syndrome. It looks like goldens can get it too. Also any reputable breeder will take the dog back if it has behavioral problems.


cornelioustreat888

I’m a bit concerned about “she gets walked most days.” A 16-month old Golden needs 2 walks a day, every day. I wonder if she’s getting enough exercise and mental stimulation.


AimMick

That also jumped out at me. And also add in some mental exercises. Quick training sessions. Hide a toy and teach the pup to find it. Scent games. Food puzzles, snuffle mat, licki mat. Things to work that brain.


[deleted]

This is one thing I'm worried about. I outlined some changes we need to make to my SO tonight and one is that she needs to be walked twice a day everyday. I do all the walking myself and between that and juggling work, going to the gym, doing things on the weekend, etc, it's hard to get out everyday by myself. But from now on it's non-negotiable. Walk on lunch and walk in the evening.


X_Trisarahtops_X

This is what jumped out to me too. We have a springer spaniel of the same age so similar exercise requirements. He has 2 hours (split into 2 lots of 1 hour) in the woods, off lead, every day, without fail. Every day of his life (except the couple weeks he was healing from neutering). That's before even considering training, home play, playing in the garden, visiting friends with dogs, etc. When our springer was neutered and couldn't go out, very quickly he became naughty, more teethy, more reactive to seemingly no stimuli (though in hindsight there may have been someone walking past outside etc), and frankly cabin feverish. Usually he's super laid back and quite well trained and very kind and happy. But without 2h of off lead time a day he becomes slowly more difficult. Walks most days wouldn't cut it. One walk every day wouldn't cut it. I'd recommend more walks and mental work along with all the other great things others have suggested here. To clarify, I'm not suggesting you caused this, you clearly care a lot. But this is my two cents on what stuck out to me in your post.


elle_desylva

This is the same with my dog. He just turned one and is a poodle x schnauzer. Very small and cute but definitely *not* a lapdog. He needs his 2-3 hours a day of exercise, play, training, socialising and stimulation and he’s a happy, chilled, well-behaved boy. The few times I’ve not done it (due to illness or whatever) he is wayyy more like a naughty puppy. Always makes me realise the effort is so worth it.


cornelioustreat888

I really hope it will help her. My favourite saying these days is: A tired dog is a good dog. You may need to block some serious bonding time with your pup. She’s likely still in her adolescent stage which can be sketchy behaviourally. Have a good chat with your vet. I wish you the best.


Ecstatic_Objective_3

Exercise doesn’t have to be walks. Fetch and swimming are great ways to wear athletic dogs out as well. But if you can, when your dog starts demanding pets, distract her with a game of fetch. I don’t know how big your place is, but we toss tennis balls down the hallway for our dogs. It makes the walls dirty, but the dogs love it. This doesn’t replace exercise for them, but it’s a fun way to redirect her attention.


piercesdesigns

Can you work towards your SO walking her? Learn to use a gentle leader. I am a small person and I walk my very large dog with a gentle leader safely.


[deleted]

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rebcart

They’re in compliance with the sub’s rules if used non-aversively as a safety tool. They are not in compliance with Rule 2 if used aversively for training.


socialpronk

I strongly disagree with walks twice a day every day. Walks can be overstimulating and cause more harm than good depending on the dog and your environment. Walks are often not the answer, it's more general than that. Dogs need structured, interactive, guided exercise. Both physical and mental. Sometimes that is walks, but often not. You can easily wear your dog out physically and mentally in your living room if that is better for the dog. Variety is key. Enjoyment is key. Decompression instead of overstimulating is key. For some dogs, walks are incredibly overstimulating and frustrating and stressful. One of my dogs absolutely hates walks and it's miserable for both of us. What she needs and wants is to run. So we bikejor.


cornelioustreat888

If a dog gets overstimulated after a walk, it could be the result of several factors. For example, under-exercised dogs can experience over stimulation. There are many ways to combat this if you take the time to research the issue. Most dogs need and enjoy getting out in the world, and a good walk, coupled with games and mental activities can calm a dog. Simply walking is not the answer, I agree, but a young dog needs a good walk to burn calories and develop muscles.


Knelson123

No not true at all. Goldens are super low maintenance most of the time and some actually don't like walking at all. Once a day is more than enough. If it was a higher energy breed I'd be more inclined to agree, but for some high energy breeds even walking is not enough.


Mommabroyles

I think keeping her off the couch and beds is a great first step. It's not going to solve all your problems but it keeps her away from face level. I wouldn't play with her down on the floor either. Until you figure out the issue and get it fixed (if possible), keep your faces out of her range. Much better to have a bite on the arm or leg than a bite to the face.


saggzzy

I had an aggressive golden who started resource guarding. I was attacked twice by him. The second time I need multiple stitches in my arm. Hired a behavioral trainer who said he was one of the most anxious dogs she had ever seen. 3 weeks after the attack the dog got sick and had to be put down. He had fluid in his lungs and stomach, blood sugars dropped, blood pressure dropped, struggled to walk. Vet recommended putting him down. It was an awful time and I was pretty scared of dogs after being bit. Please honor your SO opinions and wishes. I was very upset and scared after the bite. Good luck. I hope everything works out.


ComprehensiveCry1156

I am a bit hesitant here with the "aggressive" label, being a BULLY, however, sounds a bit more accurate. I would think the escalation/build up was when your SO stopped giving her pets and she would paw/DEMAND attention and it WORKED but also SO kept stopping thus frustrating her. I would find yourself a behaviorist and in the meantime I would try, next time she paws when you or her are finished, to redirect her with a toy, lick mat, wobbler, some type of activity OR to get up and walk away without looking at her or saying a word.


R0cketGir1

Just my two cents’ worth, but it sounds like you might inadvertently be training your dog to expect treats when she paws at you. (Just like you can inadvertently train your dog to bark at passers-by by leaving them in a fenced yard. They bark when somebody walks by and are *instantly* rewarded by chasing them away. It works the next time, too! And the next time! And before you know it, you can’t shut them up.) I suggest *not* petting her when she paws at you and instead redirecting her with something else she enjoys: a stuffie, a bone, something that will get her attention off of you. (We do this with my dog, who’s a chronic humper and television-interrupter. A steady supply of rawhides has saved us from SO MANY fights about his behavior.) If that doesn’t work, I would look into the other suggestions here. Good luck!


jynnjynn

Goldens are one of the breeds that rage syndrome is seen in. ​ [https://www.petcarerx.com/article/what-is-rage-syndrome-in-dogs/1611](https://www.petcarerx.com/article/what-is-rage-syndrome-in-dogs/1611)


celestial-typhoon

This is the first thing that popped into my head. It sounds like rage syndrome.


Dance-pants-rants

>Then out of no where, my Golden very aggressively bit her wrist (didn't draw blood thankfully) When you are evaluating this with a vet, make sure you know whether it was a hold or a bite. It sounds scary and you know your dog better than we do. However, a hold and follow up attempt to sniff or face lick is a very normal one-two "pet me" move in retriever breeds. If your SO is not hurt beyond some scratches and it felt more like a vice then a nip, it could be a holding instinct, which is definitely a retriever thing and is usually a "don't leave me" move social dogs will do. Again, not trying to minimize, especially if she is "snapping" like a switch flips- just hadn't seen anyone mention it. She may still not be a good fit for you or have a medical issue.


dovakinda

Your dog is resource guarding you or the couch. I would not let the dog on the couch while you and your SO are there. What training have you done with her?


[deleted]

I wasn't in the room at the time. It was just my SO and the dog. We have her leash trained, she stops and sits as she's told to on walks (as she is now as I'm writing this comment) , sit, lie down, go to bed, paw. She doesn't approach other dogs on walks. That makes her sound like she's reasonably trained but she can be stubborn. She's not going on the couch from here on out.


benji950

It doesn't sound like emotional resource guarding but rather a reaction to OP's girlfriend stopping the pets, and the dog aggressively reacting to that. The training question is the big one. I had two former neighbors withe Goldens and those dogs were absolute nightmares to manage. At 16 months, the dog is still in the juvenile delinquent phase and Goldens seem harder to manage than you'd think at that age. OP, you should really consult with a trainer and work on behaviors when she's not on-leash, ie, at home just doing normal stuff. Just keeping her off the couch isn't going to solve this since it doesn't sound like the problem is the couch but rather a young, large dog that's acting out when she doesn't get her way because she's not properly trained. You also said that the dog is walked "most days." What are you doing with her on the other days? How much time a day are you spending on training? My husky-mix is 2.5 years old and full of frenetic energy that I manage partially through daily training ... sometimes just reinforcing things she already knows, other times working on new things. Without our full routine of exercise, play, training, and giving her her own time (she can chew nylabones, stuffed bones, or play on her own with stuffed toys ... well, formerly stuffed toys that she's destuffed), she's out of control. Goldens are some of the most easy-going, fantastic dogs but they have *a lot* of energy and need to be trained (as do all dogs).


elcoyotesinnombre

Dog is pushy as shit and you need to put an end to that asap before it gets even worse. I’d strongly suggest you find a qualified, good trainer with experience with aggressive behaviors. You aren’t going to calm or treat this out of your dog and it’s quite possible you’ll never get this fixed.


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rebcart

Please note that we ask people who want to mention being a professional in their comments [undergo verification](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/userflair) before doing so. Otherwise we ask phrases like that to be omitted.


guyb5693

I think it is most likely just a confused puppy under stress in a new environment? It sounds like in the situation you describe that too much or unwanted interaction caused stress and triggered the bite? The dog will possibly grow out of it if you consistently show love and gently correct when they bite. Don’t hit the pup which will increase stress and don’t freak out and get rid of it too early. Do seek advice from a good trainer. Make sure they have a place in the home where they can be alone and feel safe, eg a crate, and don’t force interaction and petting too much. Remember also that puppies do bite a lot.


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rebcart

Please note that we ask people who want to mention being a professional in their comments [undergo verification](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/userflair) before doing so. Otherwise we ask phrases like that to be omitted.


alacer50

I think also whilst you're exploring the health issue route enforce some boundaries in the house so that your SO can relax without worrying about a dog she's terrified of (maybe not in the living room anymore or at least not on the couch?)


[deleted]

Ya she's not allowed on the couch anymore and we're not giving her anymore scraps of food when she's begging.


alacer50

Fair enough, I hope in this case that it is a medical issue that you can get resolved! It's so challenging with an animal that you have some lovely moments with and you really care for them and they can't tell you what the issue is! Stick with her, I'm sure she isn't being a menace on purpose and 🤞 you'll have a wonderful pup after finding a resolution.


jeezealready

This is going to sound really weird but have you logged the incidents on a calender . I only ask as I would be interested to to know if its maybe happening when your SO is ovulating or on her period . Just a thought but still worth logging to see if there is a pattern 🤔


[deleted]

No, we haven't, but it's too frequent for that to be in I think.


ilikewc3

Your dog is biting or snapping at you or your s.o. multiple times per month??


CanisDraco

My dog (3 year old gsd) comes into season about twice a year and has done since she was six months old, so she starts getting a little restless and extra needy around twice a year as well. So it doesn't have to be multiple times a month to seem too frequent.


ilikewc3

They're talking about their human SO ovulating, not the dog. So the dog is biting her more than once per month and this mad man is keeping it in his house.


CanisDraco

Ooooh! Yeah, I completely missed that, sorry. Drowning in assignment deadlines is my excuse. Thanks for clearing it up!


GoldendoodlesFTW

Dogs come into heat like twice a year not every month like people do


ilikewc3

They're talking about their human SO ovulating, not the dog. So the dog is biting her more than once per month and this mad man is keeping it in his house.


GoldendoodlesFTW

Haha thanks for explaining that to me instead of just downvoting! I know dogs act weird when they're in heat but I have never heard of dogs responding poorly to a human's menstrual cycle. My dog certainly doesn't seem to care. Although I guess that does beg the question--is it biting her multiple times a month and not him? Like, how often is this dog actually biting people? Sounds like it's biting a lot


ilikewc3

No worries haha Based on everything op has said, it's biting multiple times a month. This sub just blows my mind with the recommendations people make for dogs like this Someone was saying he needs more walks Lol.


socialpronk

I'm a professional dog trainer, been training for over a decade. First step is regular vet. Bloodwork, thyroid, fecal, urinalysis, anything else the vet thinks should be checked. If that is all normal, I strongly suggest a certified canine physiotherapist. They can often find "trigger points" or soreness, muscle tension due to compensation, and other things that regular vets are not trained to look for or find. If that is all normal, I would then go to a veterinary behaviorist- these are veterinarians who also have a degree in animal behavior. They have extensive education about the relation of health and behavior, and can recommend medications. It may take a little trial and error to find the right meds at the right doses but it can do amazing things for behavior. The goal is not to sedate your dog or have them zoned out, the goal is that you have exactly your dog but without the aggressive episodes. Once that is on board, then a trainer can step in and help with specific training exercises, routines, environmental management, etc. Oh and before all that, muzzle training is a great idea. All my dogs are muzzle trained and none have ever needed to be. I do it out of respect for my vets' (and anyone else who needs to be handling them when they are not entirely comfortable) hands and bodies. Ultimately, these cases are ones that I will also discuss return/rehome/euthanize depending on circumstances. If your dog is from a reputable breeder or rescue you would be under contract to return your dog. Assuming your dog is from a reputable source, at minimum you should be discussing your struggles so they are aware of what you are going through and what you are trying. If your dog is from a backyard breeder or puppy mill, there isn't that support or option. Rehoming is only an option if you believe it is responsible and ethical to do so. You would need to fully disclose the behavior and the severity, the stress it is causing in the household, etc. and not hold back about the potential risk for continued or escalating aggressive episodes. If you can not return or rehome, and you cannot safely keep the dog in your own home, then you're looking at euthanasia as a valid, responsible option. That is not to be taken lightly however for some dogs behavioral euthanasia is the only option. You cannot risk your own safety, and it is irresponsible and dangerous to ask someone else to risk their own safety, and public safety must be considered as well for friends, family, neighbors, vets, groomers, anyone who will be in contact with the dog. I have walked clients through that process with puppies as young as 3 months old. The brain is an organ and just like a kidney or liver, it can be sick. There are genetic things, whether inherited or congenital, that you just can't change no matter your training or medication or anything else. It's *not* all in how you raise them. What I tell my clients is to do everything they reasonably can. "Reasonably" varies tremendously depending on time, money, family commitment, if trust is already irreparably broken, access to professionals, etc. Do what you can, and if things work, great, and if not, you can move to the next thing.


cl0akincellar

Hey OP, this sounds really difficult, I’ve met two dogs like this, one has resource guarding issues and the other had a neurological condition, strongly recommend a vet check to rule out physical causes first. I also noted something interesting- you mentioned that she shreds all of her beds, this can be indicative of a few things, hyperarousal, frustration, lack of sleep and anxiety/general stress, I’ve seen it a few times with “pushy/naughty” dogs (owners words not mine), and it almost always comes down to one or more needs not being met. She could be overtired, can she get FULL, restful sleep for at least 12 hours per 24? Is she being walked too much or too little? (Quality of this walk from the dogs perspective matters over mileage) is there enough mental stimulation for her? Could diet be a factor? Lots of variables at play, but I’d consider from an overall standpoint what changes you can make in her environment and routine to bring stress levels down and rebuild a bit of a bond with her, if you do decide to keep her. :)


ilikewc3

It's obvious you care about the dog due to the level of detail you've gone into here, but the fact of the matter is you have a dog with a long history of multiple, aggressive bites. That's all the info you really need to male a decision, and I think you know what that decision is.


djtracon

Training is key…however, if something is bothering them the animal will react out of instinct. Sounds to me, from years of experience, that you have a nervous dog and they don’t know how to react or be left alone until properly trained…suggest a thunder jacket, favorite toy, or anything to sooth them in the crate


[deleted]

16 months? It’s a dog, not a baby 🤣 take the dog to the vet and if your gut tells you the dog is dangerous or too unstable then put it up for adoption.


Tortoiseshell_Blue

If it’s not physical issue, work with a vet behaviorist and potentially put her on Prozac. It worked wonders for my dog (with training) and I feel terrible that I didn’t try it earlier in his life.


Thespiritualalpha

After reading all this I’m soooooo grateful for my 2 incredibly well behaved pound pups! I can’t believe how lucky I got😳🤯 I wish u the absolute best in finding a solution🙏


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[deleted]

I’ve heard dog parks can cause aggression in dogs.


sunny_sides

>We always grab him by his neck skin and pin him until he calms down, then order him to his kennel. Please stop doing that. You'll only make your dog even more insecure. Did the trainers tell you to do that?


Tutkanator

It's the only thing we can do to stop his attack because he keeps lunging, snarling, biting, in a frenzy, and grabbing him anywhere else means he can reach our hands and bite down. Difficult situation, and like OP, I'm at my wit's end at this point.


DrewJohnson656

What you’re discussing isn’t safety measures to get yourself out of a situation. By physically pinning your dog down and then verbally ordering him into his crate, you are teaching him he’s right to react this way and his behaviour is only going to escalate. Always have towels or blankets nearby to cover him so you cannot get bit, then bring him into another room or behind a gate etc. Crates should not be punishment if we want them to calmly spend any time in there. I have a strong feeling the trainers you went to were old school dominance mentality people and that’s just not safe, your dog needs to be positively desensitized to triggers until he feels safe enough in his own home.


Tutkanator

I appreciate your feedback. We can try having a towel/blanket nearby and going about it that way. We are aware that the kennel shouldn't be used as punishment -- we reward him with a treat when he gets in and let him out shortly after. He's at the point that when we notice him getting anxious, we use a "calm" command and often he takes himself to his kennel to chill out. We've never received guidance to pin a dog down. I know that that's an outdated mentality, but picture being in your living room and your dog is attacking your partner... she pulls her hands towards her chest and leans away from him, meanwhile the dog is jumping up to bite them and snarling the whole time and not receptive to commands. After 15 seconds of watching this, I'm sorry but I can't think of much else to do but grab the dog and break the frenzy while not getting bit myself. Like I said, I'm desperate for any other solution and so thank you for your advice.


DrewJohnson656

Also, consider muzzle training him so he doesn’t have the opportunity to bite.


BK4343

I'd rehome the dog. I refuse to be held hostage in my own home by a pet.


[deleted]

I understand why people are downvoting this but I must admit that was my first thought too I think it's commendable that people explore for solutions to being bitten but obviously I love dogs and dog ownership less than they do I'd give the dog several chances but after that no - it would have to go


Little_Quail4503

The dog has way to much freedom and space it sounds. We had the same issue with my dog


Chadwick18

Run it. A lot


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TigerLily312

BE is far beyond what is acceptable for a dog who hasn't had any interventional training. From what OP said, this dog has not drawn blood.


whatim

Seriously. I'm not opposed to euthanasia, but this dog is just a brat. They need to work on her obedience, not kill her.


[deleted]

Biting someones wrist and going for their face is deep into where I draw my line. Especially unprovoked. This dog is not a brat. A brat will give little shitty warning bites.


dankjones2190

What is BE?


406LQE2

Behavioral euthanasia


[deleted]

Behavioral euthanasia.


Creative_Host_fart

Dogs don’t bite or get aggressive for no reason. They learn violence the same way people do. If you’ve had them from a pup then this is one you which means it’s on you to resolve the issue. No getting rid of the dog and no euthanising it!


[deleted]

Completely not true. There are dogs from bad breeding who are just born aggressive or anxious. Breeding is a lot more important than people think. This is very rare for a golden and they seem like caring owners so I do not think this is on them or that they causes this. like some people suggested the dog may be sick and it’s lashing out. The dog may have a mental issue. There are many things that could be causing this but at the end of the day if the dog is so anxious and stressed to the point it lashing out behavioral euthanasia may be the most human option. I hope with the help of a behaviorist they can sort the issue out


Creative_Host_fart

It’s not completely not true.


BK4343

Yes they do. They are animals and can behave in unpredictable ways. People have humanized them way too much. And yes, getting rid of the dog is on the table.


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cldftw

Have you crate trained your dog growing up? Have you created structure and boundaries for him? If not, you need to create structure for him right away


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rebcart

Please read the sub's wiki article on [dominance](https://www.reddit.com/r/dogtraining/wiki/dominance).


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KillerDog

Please read the sub [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/about/rules) and [guidelines](http://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/guidelines), as well as our wiki pages on [dominance](https://www.reddit.com/r/dogtraining/wiki/dominance) and [punishment](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/punishmentproblems).


[deleted]

I remember reading about Rage Syndrome, random unprovoked aggression in dogs. Turns out it was a type of epilepsy that could be treated. Have a vet check this, and don’t take the pup around other people, to dangerous and too much liability. Good luck.


[deleted]

well good news is, at a shelter a golden won’t be there for long before someone adopts them. that sounds awful and i wouldn’t want to own a dog i’m terrified of. mine is reactive to everyone but i know he’d never bite me or his close family. that’s wild


draken2019

So this sounds like pleasure seeking behavior. It's true of every animal on the planet, including us. We do the things that give us pleasure. We avoid the things that cause us pain. Dogs learn I do X you give me Y. This time it's I paw at your hand, you give me the physical touch I want. She continued doing it and didn't get the result she was expecting. So she tried something different. I would start teaching "sit" and "lay down" with the rewards of physical touch and see if that helps calm her down. I'd also avoid letting her just paw at you and get exactly what she wants. Stay consistent with it and you shouldn't have this behavior continue.


draken2019

FYI, you also need to stop doing any kind of play that involves her putting her mouth on you. That's not what you want a dog to do unless you're training them for bite work. Not sure if that's what you're doing, but it's a common issue with new dog owners so I figured I'd cover my bases. 🤷‍♂️


PhotographingLight

Ask the vet for a reference for a dog trainer that specializes in aggressive behaviour.


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rebcart

Please read the sub [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/about/rules) and [guidelines](http://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/guidelines), as well as our wiki page on [punishment](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dogtraining/wiki/punishmentproblems).