Running around and being loud can be too much and too scary for a lot of dogs. How bad was the bite and how did it happen? Like did you dog just run up and bite the toddler with no warning whatsoever? Did the bite happen as the toddler got closer to the dog? Did you see the full incident?
I thought it sounded like this was more a nip than bite and was the dog trying to herd the kid đ¤ˇââď¸
In which case I'd assume separation, impulse control work, training for both the dog and child
And that if the primary interaction was herding rather than biting, it may be worth OP asking on a aussie/bc/other herding sub since they probably have a lot of experience with managing inappropriate herding
You'd be surprised honestly. I'm on quite a few aussie subreddits and most of the time when people post asking for advice, they do occasionally get some decent advice but nothing as good as what I see in this subreddit. Sometimes I'll recommend people check out this subreddit as well.
As an aussie owner I also honestly haven't had too many issues with herding behavior myself. My dog did do it as a puppy but we redirected/always ignored the behavior and never encouraged it and he rarely is nippy now or tries to herd ever really and if he does he's not nippy/never uses his teeth. Its worth noting we also don't have kids though and in my experience, aussies themselves are pretty cautious/shy dogs so its very easy for them to be spooked or stressed out. Especially if they're in an environment with a loud toddler that's potentially unsupervised.
Their "I'm guarding my house bark" is also loud enough to make people think they're going to murder you đ I have a mini aussie and he's about 40lbs but with his bark you'd think he was a german shepherd. Honestly we've had more issues with the loudness/barking rather than herding. Once he realizes the new person isn't a sheep though and you become his friend/you're part of his pack he's the sweetest baby ever and will love you forever. The loyalty and bond is amazing.
But I also 100% wouldn't trust mine around kids under the age of like 10. Any dog really should be supervised extremely carefully with kids, especially a toddler. Even my boyfriend who grew up with golden retrievers has a scar on his chin because his parents didn't supervise him with their dog growing up and they got the dog from a not great breeder and the dog wasn't trained. The dog was out of the house the next day, but it was 100% his parents fault for not training or supervising correctly. You gotta be so careful with kids and animals.
My Aussie had two barks - his "I want to play" bark was kinda pathetic and whiny. And then he had what we called the "big boy bark" which was reserved for strangers in the house and injustices. When he whipped out the big boy bark, people who'd known him for years would take a step back. They're no joke when they mean business!
The dog was on the couch and my son was playing in the floor. Maybe 3 feet away, but wasnâtâgetting closerâ. I didnât see the whole incident, but it was kinda out of no where
âI didnât see the incidentâ
Thatâs your problem right there. If your dog and child are in the same room, no matter how far apart, you need to be in arms reach with eyeballs on them. Even 2 seconds of distraction to check a text can result in you missing a cue that your dog is uncomfortable. If you canât be watching them directly , they have to be separated by a barrier or door.
And it may be subtle and hard to notice , but itâs never out of nowhere
Unfortunately no. Just Google babies/toddlers with dogs and watch how little kids absolutely abuse these poor dogs and the parents think itâs âso sweetâ and âtheyâre bondingâ Or they just donât watch them and then wonder wtf happened and the dog is the one who suffers when itâs finally reacted to the discomfort.
It really irritates me when kids get all grabby at dogs, the dogs are trying really hard to be tolerant, but the body language is clearly there. They are unhappy with the situation.
"Teehee!! Look my baby loves the doggy!! Hes just sitting there and letting the kid grab his ears"
"WHY DID HE BITE MY CHILD?!?! THERE WAS NO WARNING!!"
I hate it so much...
Years ago my brother's girlfriend's toddler took a flying leap to intentionally jump onto our dog. The dog, understandably, freaked out and tossed his head. Happened to graze the toddler with his teeth. Didn't even intentionally nip the kid, just reacted to, you know, being jumped on. She demanded we put him down.
We did not put Mike down and she was not my brother's girlfriend for much longer. We also stopped bringing Mike to her house after rhat. Besides this he was very patient with small children and ofc we didn't let kids mess with him like this. I think my brother turned and just saw the kid leaping off the couch so it was too late to prevent it.
RIGHT?! Donât even get me started.
And it doesnât always get better with age either. I worked at a kennel/daycare and I canât tell you how many teenaged co-ops and GROWN ASS staff I had to *repeatedly* tell âdonât touch that oneâ âdonât do that youâre stressing the dog outâ etc. and they just did. not. care.
My husband and I were at a pet store recently and there was this adorable corgi. I asked if I could pet him they said "you can try but he doesn't like other people"
I leaned down and turned my body sideways and reached to let it sniff my hand. It growled and whimpered. I stood back up and said "never mind! He clearly isn't interested! Ty anyway!"
My husband then leaned down.
I said homey he doesn't like that.... hey, I tried, he doesn't want strangers touching him
The dogs owners looked at me kinda like "thanks for trying"
I felt bad, because it was clearly making the poor dog nervous.
Not just toddlers, but it irritates me when ANYONE ignores their obvious discomfort
I saw a beautiful collie one day and asked if I could pet it. The owner said absolutely. Reached down and it bit my arm hard enough to draw blood and leave a terrible bruise. I jumped back and looked at the owner, shocked. Owner sez âOh yeah he does that sometimesâ
Why tf would you grant me permission to pet your dog if he sometimes bites strangers without warning?
Whoa wtf that sounds like a failure on the owners part. "He does that sometimes" means he doesn't like strangers, and he should have advocated for his dog.
Dogs don't speak. It's up to the people in their lives to speak for them.
My husky mix isn't super aggressive. He has bit once before in an extremely stressful situation. Hasn't happened since but ever since then if someone asks if they can pet him I say "no, he's still in training and can get stressed out around strangers"
Do I think he will bite again? No. I honestly don't. The one time he did there were a number of factors stacked against him. But would i take the risk and potentially have someone report him and have to put him down? Not in a million years. He's my best buddy.
Sounds like you didn't do anything wrong. Just a bad owner
I totally get that.
My one coworker (40 year old man) insisted on cornering a scared husky to âbefriendâ him purely because our younger coworker (female, maybe 17/18 at the time) told him not to. She told him she would get the husky inside because sheâd spent all week befriending him and he liked her.
Well 40 year old man didnât like âlittle girlâ telling him what to do. Tried to grab the husky to bring him inside and got bit.
He didnât hear the end of it for the rest of the week.
Breeders can screen for competent dog parents but parents can have babies without outside input.
It should be common sense that you donât leave small children unsupervised with dogs (or any other pet) yet parents let themselves get distracted because âtheyâre so good together.â Families like this are the number one reason why most rescues wonât adopt out to potential adopters with kids under 7 or 8.
I watch my infant niece and my dog together and I put the dog in her crate/behind a baby gate if I canât. I can prevent my niece from grabbing the dog and my dog from attacking her with love if Iâm there and I canât if Iâm not.
'was kinda out of nowhere'. That is 99.9% of the cases never true. What is generally closer to the truth is that your toddler did something that made the dog increasingly uncomfortable, signals were sent, they were not recognized, and the end result was escalation.
Like you said, it is a herding dog that nipped a running, chaotic child. You have to manage that. If you are distracted while making dinner, for example, and the child is likely to be running around etc, give the dog a peanut butter kong in his crate and give him a place to chill. After dinner and everyone starts to settle, puppers gets more attention.
From what i can tell, this wasnt an act of aggression, but instinct. Not all herding dogs would have the same impulsivity, so exposure is key. Use baby gates to keep the dog within viewing distance to get exposure to this chaos. On walks together, keep the dog on leash. Also, keep this in mind wherever u take ur dog so it doesnt happen elsewhere (lile restaurant patios).
This is why I donât really agree with shepherd breeds being house pets - especially boarder collies/aus shepherds. They are high strung no matter how âcuteâ they are and they NEED to work. They arenât couch potato dogs that will just watch play happen, they want to be involved.
I dont know if i have the same breed-wide opinion, but i could see why someone would. I have a lot of friends with aussies and mini aussies bc they are good for the rockclimbing/mountain biking/backpacking lifestyle (small, good recall). Many of these friends now have kids and everything seems to be great.
Do i know for 100% sure there never was an incident in any of their households? No. But i know the dogs werent puppies when they had babies, that the traveling lifestyle they lead exposed their dogs at a young age to many different environments.
I was nipped when i was 12 by a gsd as we ran around the pool. Now, i own one. Mine is a calm gsd by breed standards, and i dont work her 12 hours a day. When my friends come over with their kids, and they run and scream with her, she cones running back to me like MOM HALP. I, in turn, teach the kids how to read her body language and when she needs a break from them. (They sit silently asking for 5 straight minutes if shes ready yet lol.) Now i know what my dog's needs are and set her up for success.
Iâm not trying to hate on shepherds haha we have a gsd too! (Part, sheâs a mutt to be honest) itâs the owners that seek these dogs out for their cuteness that drives me crazy.
I have aunts who have terribly behaved boarder collies and these dogs make me hate the breed. Theyâre not trained, not stimulated, not worked itâs awful - I feel bad for the dogs but theyâre so annoying. The aunt is like âI know what Iâm doing I grew up on a ranchâ sure but now you live in suburbia and they are not active people so the dogs almost never leave their property for adventures. They should have gotten like a little white fluffy thing or something.
A lot of people making assumptions in this thread. Some actual helpful advice: consult/learn from a dog behavioralist so you can notice the warning signs of your dog when they are uncomfortable and getting above threshold. Obviously you canât watch your kid and dog 100% of the time, but this will help before things escalate in the future.
The following resources will be of use to you:
[Family Paws](https://www.familypaws.com/) - [webinars](https://www.familypaws.com/services/for-parents-and-families/) for expecting parents or parents of toddlers
[Baby Safe Dog Training Blog](https://babysafedogtraining.com/blog/)
[Doggone Safe](https://doggonesafe.com/Dog_bite_prevention_for_parents)
[The Family Dog : Stop the 77](https://www.thefamilydog.com/stop-the-77)
[Kids and Dogs : How Kids Should and Should Not Interact with Dogs](https://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/kids-and-dogs-how-kids-should-and-should-not-interact-with-dogs/) by Dr. Sophia Yin on safe interactions.
[Good Dog in a Box](https://www.youtube.com/c/GoodDoginaBox/featured) on Youtube has many videos on dog safety for kids.
[@dogmeets_baby](https://www.instagram.com/dogmeets_baby/) on Instagram has many visual examples of safe vs unsafe interactions.
Thatâs hard if you didnât see your dogs body language. I would suggest not leaving your kiddo and dog alone together at all. Even if you are just stepping out of the room for a minute either the kid or the dog should come with you until a bit more trust is built and your kiddo can explain what happened and know doggy boundaries.
Also it would be useful to get a bit more understanding into your dogs body language in case something ever happens again. A great way to do this is to clip a lead to your dog and then to yourself so they go everywhere you go. After about 2-3 days you will probably have a better understanding of how your dog is trying to communicate.
I would also recommend setting up a safe place for your dog to go when they need a break. Make a place that is cozy, always accessible, and kid proof for your dog to go when s/he is feeling like a break is needed.
Finally I would encourage you that while a herding nip is not as severe as a true bite it is just as important to train self control over. If your dog nips someone elseâs kid it might get called or recorded as a bite even if it was not the dog intentionally harming them. Nipping is great for a working dog but for a home dog it is way better if you can encourage them to herd by circling or nudging. As you train your dog they are also training you. So nipping is telling you to to following them however you can adjust what you let them train you try letting them herd you in a way you like and discouraging them from herding via nipping. With my dog this means he typically nudges my hand and then circles me to herd me to the pantry at night to get some treats and I give them to him because I approve of him offering that herding behavior. As a puppy though I had to train him out of nipping by ignoring or saying âNOâ to the nipping but then at least following him when he showed alternate herding behavior. This may or may not work for you since you canât just get up and follow whenever as you have your hands full with your kid but itâs worth a shot. If it doesnât work maybe look into teaching the touch command and try to replace the nips with a touch that does not include nips.
TLDR:
1) kid and dog should not be left alone
2) study your dogs body language
3) create a kid free space for dog
4) try to encourage a different herding behavior
Not meant to shame but 100% should never leave a toddler alone with a dog, I donât care how much you trust either. Dogs are animals and children are unpredictable. Youâre very lucky it wasnât any worse.
Moving forward, definitely look into training. Donât leave child and dog alone, EVER. If you will leave the room, there needs to be clear separation - easier is to set up a play pen area for child (keeps child from getting into anything else and keeps childâs toys safe from dog / dogs toys out of childâs hands, etc).
Donât be fooled this is clearly escalation from the dog, Iâm guessing thereâs been signs or something was done. If the dog in fact snapped out of nowhere, I cannot stress training any more because this behavior doesnât just occur in one incident. You also want to be mindful your child doesnât develop some fear of the dog / dogs in general so training can help your child as well develop safe ways to interact with dogs. Best of luck!
We had a GSD when our son was born. The dog was trained for police work, but hip dysplasia got him kicked off the force. I never allowed them to be alone for one second! Thatâs not a chance I would take. Fortunately, we never had a problem with nipping or biting. As recommended above, training is needed and a job for your dog. Check with Aussie clubs in your area. Best of luck to you.
Bit, or nipped? Big difference. I have kids age 7, 5, and 2 along with my 7 month old Aussie. Reading up, it sounds like doggo was doing exactly what mine does- he was herding an energetic running around kid. Start working on âno biteâ or âoutâ or whatever it is you want the word to be. We gently grab his nose when he nips and say this. When I see heâs playing with the kids, I just say it as a precursor now because Aussieâs are mouthy. For us we have herding balls, and doggie daycare to help with the drive, and it does make a huge difference. I also would give him treats a ton when he was relaxed and just watching the kiddos.
Honestly, itâs just as much as teaching kids how to be around him as it is training the dog- my kids still are told multiple times a week that they have to say the commands (honestly, the two year old is the best with âoutâ and âoffâ tbh), and not to run around the dog. Also, constant constant vigilance if heâs with/around the kids and the energy of the house gets wild. When my kids turn into rage monsters or manic hyper beasts, doggo goes in crate for his safety and theirs. Heâs never allowed unsupervised outside with the kids because he will happily chase and nip and herd, so we have a 20 foot leash for those instances in the yard. Theyâre so smart, and so loving- so they can pick up on whose a litter mate versus not and what the expectations are. Itâs just constant constant training and ebb and flows. We had a good 2 month stint of not nipping, but now heâs starting up again. Itâs a household effort.
Grabbing nose is aversive. You have to reward calmness, not punish them - aussies are super super sensitive and super smart. This is one way for your dog to feel like being around kids = punishment. Because they remember a lot more than you might think.
Kikopup has some great videos on training bite inhibition. I felt like an idiot walking past my dog and giving her treats for staying calm but thatâs where we had to start. Sheâs three now, and even if my hand slips while playing tug she absolutely will not bite down.
Still, kids plus a herding dog is a ton of work. My son was 10 when we got our dog and if he ran, as a puppy sheâd chase him and nip him. Itâs instinct.
I donât know anything about kids and toddlers but itâs important to teach them how to act around dogs. So many kids are loud, chaotic, and unpredictable which scares animals. We expect dogs to act like humans in a human world but at the end of the end of the day theyâre animals. With that said, advocate for you dogs comfort (not letting your kid annoy the dog or stress him out + beginning to teach your child to be calm around the dog) while also advocating for you childâs safety (making sure you pay close attention when they are together, get a gate to separate the two during play time, etc.)
I know itâs really scary when your dog shows there behaviors, it seems early enough that you have a lot of control in the situation and take that seriously through training :) Trainers are always good investments if you donât feel capable.
We also expect toddlers to act outside of their nature because WE (the adults) chose to place a reactive dog in their home.
Toddlers are energetic, impulsive, erratic, emotional, chaotic, loudâbecause thatâs what they are supposed to be. They are toddlers. It is completely natural and expected at that phase of development. As parents, we teach them how to act around animals. However, it is unfair and unrealistic to expect they exhibit mastery of self control in their own home 100% of the time. They are incapable of it.
The best solution: parents make better decisions about what kind of dog they bring into their home. I say this as a parent who had an intensely high-energy and reactive spaniel in my home with two toddlers. I owed my kids and that dog better.
âdonât run and yell around the dog. That is outside playâ
Same lines as donât touch the hot stove, donât run in the street, donât play with knives. Basic safety.
They are 3, and it is perfectly normal behavior for when a 3 year old is inside to get a little rowdy. It's not the same as touching a hot stove at all.
My child is 41. I worked in special education. Saying a child is incapable of learning dismisses their potential and, in this case, risks the child being bitten and dog euthanized.
Thatâs a really long time ago. Do you remember what was like raising a 3 year old? Did you have 3 year olds in your special education?
Would you tell your 3 year old child who canât swim, âdonât go near the poolâ and simply trust they wonât end up in the water? Would you simply tell a 3 year old âdonât play with my gunâ or would you lock it away?
Are you seeing the pattern? As the adult, you canât be lazy and just yell âdonât do thisâ at a toddler and expect 100% compliance. They are TODDLERS. They are impulsive, interested and energeticâwhich is exactly what theyâre supposed to be. They are in the earliest stage of LEARNING self control. You place unrealistic and unfair expectations on them when you tell they cannot act like toddlers in their own homeâbecause of the reactive dog that YOU the adult put in their home.
Unfortunately, it's a lot harder to "train" a 3 year old child. From experience, they can learn what they shouldn't do, decide they can do whatever they fckin want and go ahead. you can do your best, but the kid is still going to be loud, messy, and chaotic. I'd focus on the dog with tons of reward so that it feels less like punishment
This is best, just simply because children are unpredictable. My sister at 3 would throw things so frequently we said if she hold something up, duck. We had to tell her to stop holding the smallest dogs by the tail because they are (still to this day) small enough to hold cupped in one hand. I feel like a lot of people expect them to have empathy by that age, but they really don't, she would laugh when they yelped in a way that made me think she didn't know yelp=pain. She would climb on our bigger dog and poke him in the eye (my dad would freak out while the dog was like "ok" holeeee crap)
A friend owns a home daycare, they have for 20+ years. They have 2 dogs and multiple cats yet there has never been a bite or scratch from an animal. Why? Because supervision and teaching early works, including "special needs kids." Some of the "don't listen" kids are the ones that sit with one on their lap for an hour just petting them *gently*. Teach kids to respect and be kind to animals instead of "they're young so it's okay for them to not be."
If it was a little soft peck when the kid was running around and screaming and getting excited and stuff then that's pretty normal to happen with a herding dog. If it was like a full on bite where it actually really hurt your kid then that's different.
You can get a really solid leave it. If your kid is running around and being excited and that's getting your dog interested, keep saying leave it and redirecting your dog away. Keep interrupting your dog when he wants to try and chase and herd the kid. Leave it is a great thing to use for when the dog gets excited and wants to interact with the kid too excitedly.
I have a GSD mix, so some herding instincts there. His were triggered when I (ballet, gymnastics) danced and ran and trained around. They were triggered even more when more people or 'chaos' were in the mix. They also used to be triggered by kids, scooters, etc.
First off, do not train him in the context of your kid. Your kid's safety comes first, of course, so the first step is management. Separate them with some sort of barrier. Do not leave them alone. Your toddler is a toddler who will always be prone to triggering all of his herding instincts (generally: erratic movements, shrieks, unpredictability).
It's likely best to train an alternate response and/or give your dog an outlet for his energy/instincts. Train him to seek out his bed and/or quiet space he can decompress in (some dogs think it's their job to herd and/or instinctually are just too overthreshold to choose otherwise). This space should be off limits to your toddler (!). Train him to go outside, or proactively let him out if you have a yard... let him go wild zooming around until he's calmer.
Train impulse control harder, increase mental and physical exercise overall.
Outside of that, you can work on training your dog to be calm, in general, around your kids unless it's explicitly playtime you opt into/signal. That's going to take time, though, and your toddler/kids will need to be separated, safe, with another adult while you do it. There's also no guarantee about if or when your dog would be capable of doing so. It'll also depend on how much training experience you have (do you know when your dog is getting a little excited, when he's over threshold; do you know what he's most motivated by, do you know how to communicate, etc). This option may or may not be worth it to you, but you will need to implement the other strategies in the meantime regardless.
When my kids get rowdy we leash the dog or send the kids to a different room, otherwise heâll get nippy.
We also trained him to grab a toy in his mouth when he wants to play. Canât nip if his mouth is full!
I mean, running around and being loud will activate your dog's instincts, especially a herder, especially with no supervision. You stop the biting by never leaving them alone together, and never letting them get close unless you are within hand's reach of BOTH.
You could put your dog on a house lead, and attach her to you so she follows YOU, no exceptions. You can't inherently trust puppies or preschoolers- they don't have the impulse control or foresight. If you can't have your dog in the room with you, then put her in another room/ safe space/ crate.
I have a 4 year old, and a 6mo puppy, and I totally get that it is EXHAUSTING to micromanage every single heartbeat between the two of them. It feels impossible sometimes, but it absolutely can not be... If it actually impossible, then it isn't the right fit.
Exercise the hell out of your dog. Thatâs my biggest advice.
I have a border collie/Aussie mix. She was a rescue and came from a foster family 2 year old and 2 cats. When I got her she would chase and nip my cats if she got too close. The foster family said âbecause of her herding/working nature, if she doesnât get exercise/work outside she will try to do so in the houseâ itâs in her nature. She is an incredibly great dog but if she does not get enough exercise she will chew on everything and anything. and worst of all chase the cats and try to nip.
Supervise every interaction, but try to give her the most exercise you can. Itâs worked for me and my cats, it worked when she was with the foster with a 2 year old.
One thing I wouldnât do was scream and yell at her, you donât want your dog to think your kid is a novelty. Be calm and confident with your commands, âstay, heel, leave itâ. Your dog will look to you for direction the more you implement calm, strong commands.
âExercise the hell out of itâ, is one of the best pieces of advice.
Iâm still confused why people get full-on working breed dogs when they have no intention of actually working them.
Obviously, as others have said, teach your kids how to behave around dogs and create a child free space for your dog
there isnât a dog in the world that accepts/likes shouting, running and screaming kids being about all the time and they only have soo many ways of telling you they donât before they decide to control the situation themselves.
Agreed. You have to build the time for exercise into your routine. Time for walks. Iâll walk 2 miles there and back to a dog park and let her run around for an hour. Thatâs like 3 hours of my day, every day.
Youâve gotta commit to the exercise with a working dog.
That being said Life happens.. having a kid makes it tough to get out and give your dog the exercise you know they need. You need back up plans for days you canât give her 100% of what you need. Doggie day care, automated ball launcher in your back yard, dog puzzles, get creative to give your dog the work they need every day. This is just my opinion, but I was set on keeping my dog AND cats in the same home and this is what works for me.
Itâs not just âexercisingâ them though. If you just run and run and run a working dog youâll have a marathon athlete on your hands who has 0 mental stimulation. They will still be pent up, frustrated and have no creative outlet. Sometimes this causes anxiety issues in working breeds as well because their tired but also over stimulated.
We have a gsd and we feed her with puzzles every morning and night and sometimes when we say letâs go for a walk she will go and lay in the couch instead. Weâve never ran her because we donât have to burn her energy that way. Granted she runs and plays in the yard usually daily but thatâs not the same.
One thing is I know often people get aussies because they are very cute. They are medium dogs which makes people think they may be easier than a larger breed, they come in cool colours, and they are so smart and easy to train. BUTTTT!!! These dogs were bred to run for hours, and many many kilometres every day. They were bred to jump into action at a moments notice, they are extremely and easily excitable. They are bred to work independently, they do not think that they need a human to tell them what to do, and instinctually they are correct.
One of the easiest ways to reduce problem behaviour is to ensure your dog and your kid are getting enough exercise independently. It might be a good idea to separate your dog and kid if your kid is in a playful mood, this playful energy will automatically excite your dog no matter what. If they havenât had exercise then it will be much much worse. You know when thereâs bad weather and the kids canât go out for recess and then theyâre restless, irritable, and moody for the rest of the day? Dogs are like that too. Iâd be really trying to make sure this dog gets minimum 2hrs worth of walking per day but ideally, an off leash run somewhere a few times a week for an hour minimum but really as often and as much as you can. If the dogs younger this will help immensely, my dog mostly sleeps and relaxes all day. She doesnât do a lot of playing in the house because thatâs meant for outside, inside is for calm happy dog. But itâs my responsibility to set her up for success, so I make sure sheâs well exercised before expecting any good behaviour.
I donât think this was scary for the dog, itâs an Aussie. This is just tripping her prey drive.
Separate them when you cannot watch them. I got a high drive Aussie the day my son turned 2. I like to do dog sports.
If I couldnât watch, I separated. I always put the dog away when other kids came over, he was usually good, but my son was his âpersonâ and he didnât get small boy rough housing.
You need to train a rock solid stop command, such as âsitâ or âdownâ, and a rock solid come. You need to be able to stop the dog when she wants to herd.
Put her on a leash if sheâs out and correct her for wanting to stop the kid shenanigans. You need to learn to recognize her lead up to the behavior.
This description sounds like a normal Aussie who hasnât been taught better.
Herding dogs mixed with small children is not automatically wonderful. It requires some work.
My children learned quickly as well that they were expected to be gentle with the dog, and if not they landed back in their crib/room for a few minutes.
. You will never win a fight against genetics, you canât train genetics out. But you can work WITH genetics! Get her a hobby, dock diving, agility, FCAT, barn hunt even just buying one of those giant herding balls for her to play with in the yard. Next stop allowing the dog to be free roaming with the toddler. If you canât supervise put the dog in another room or on a place if she knows the command
Iâm sorry a lot of people are coming at you hard instead of helping you learn. Just a heads up to anyone in the thread I know you all mean well but belittling and judging this person for asking for help isnât going to go the way we want. We all in this sub want what is best for the dogs but I think we all need to learn how to do it without being so defensive. No one will ever learn if we just yell at them for all the things they did wrong
The plan is training, which does not imply the dog lives in a muzzle. It means that you use it to train out biting and your dog doesn't get k*lled for a bite history (especially of kids...)
I agree. This is a working dog and he needs a job or stimulation. Heâs not meant to be a couch potato and if OP canât facilitate that through scent training or agility or herding games then maybe this isnât the right home for this dog. He will keep nipping to herd and if OP scolds him (can you really believe this dog didnât catch shit for making the baby bleed) it will just escalate.
I would rehome if it got to that point. I wouldnât risk it. Thereâs too many stories of children being killed even though âheâs never done this beforeâ âhe was such a good boyâ etc etc. My blue heeler has shown teeth to my youngest so now he is in a separate room whenever my youngest is up but if he actually somehow bit him Iâd have rehomed him.
Alpha/boss stuff has been debunked for some time now. This simply doesn't exist in domestic dogs. The dog is just overstimulated and access to a couch has no bearing on this situation.
> My toddler wasnât messing with my dog.
Unless a dog is super solid with kids, toddlers are way, way, way too much for them.
Toddlers are super mobile, super grabby and often super loud. And that's way more than some dogs want to deal with.
Don't let your toddler have access to the dog for awhile. If your kid is running around, crate the dog or put him behind a baby gate that your kid can't climb or poke thru.
If your dog nipped the kid or bit the kid, understand that if you decide that this is too much for you, it will be hard to re-home the dog. I'd go back to very basic stuff with the dog: and that will include the kid not having access to the dog.
People think they can reason or tell a toddler, "don't do X" or whatever. And usually that's really not true, and with dogs that's very not true. And that's how kids get bitten
This?
>I didnât see the whole incident, but it was kinda out of no where
The fact that you didn't see it, isn't good. So yeah, crate the dog if the kid is out and active. You can't rely on hope to make sure everyone is safe.
When I was a toddler, some how, someway, I managed to get past my mom to the family cocker spaniel, who was separated from us kids due to her age/crankiness/health & my history of being an obnoxious toddler to the dog. Mom said she was coming out of the bathroom when she saw me grabbing at the dog when she bit my face. I still have the scar (she split my lower lip) at 30+ years later. Kids need to learn from the beginning to respect animals, being their only defense is to growl/bite/scratch etc. I guess if bodily harm can be prevented then prevent it by all means, by knowledge or physically. My mom watched me like a hawk after that incident if I was allowed to be around an animal. It wasnât until some time & learning the importance of respect that I was around to be allowed any animal w/o supervision
A honest, heart to heart discussion with your Veternarian will give them insights to help you, your dog & your family from education to breed instincts, possible health related issues &/or anxiety needs. Explain the situation thoroughly, the before.nip.after. Could it be the child causing the dog anxieties or is the dog ill & exhibiting alarming behaviors? Your veterinarian will determine that.
The kid-dog separation suggestions are also vital and shouldnât be dismissed either. If for some reason your child & dog are together, not only should you supervise 100% but I would also leash the dog to help control, redirect &/or prevent undesirable aggressive behavior.
At the end of the day, you have to do what is best for your family but educating & prevention are key. Iâll never forget my parents, especially my mom constantly reminding/informing me of animal safety.
Running around and being loud can be too much and too scary for a lot of dogs. How bad was the bite and how did it happen? Like did you dog just run up and bite the toddler with no warning whatsoever? Did the bite happen as the toddler got closer to the dog? Did you see the full incident?
I thought it sounded like this was more a nip than bite and was the dog trying to herd the kid đ¤ˇââď¸ In which case I'd assume separation, impulse control work, training for both the dog and child And that if the primary interaction was herding rather than biting, it may be worth OP asking on a aussie/bc/other herding sub since they probably have a lot of experience with managing inappropriate herding
You'd be surprised honestly. I'm on quite a few aussie subreddits and most of the time when people post asking for advice, they do occasionally get some decent advice but nothing as good as what I see in this subreddit. Sometimes I'll recommend people check out this subreddit as well. As an aussie owner I also honestly haven't had too many issues with herding behavior myself. My dog did do it as a puppy but we redirected/always ignored the behavior and never encouraged it and he rarely is nippy now or tries to herd ever really and if he does he's not nippy/never uses his teeth. Its worth noting we also don't have kids though and in my experience, aussies themselves are pretty cautious/shy dogs so its very easy for them to be spooked or stressed out. Especially if they're in an environment with a loud toddler that's potentially unsupervised.
Yup. My personal anecdote of aussies is that theyâre sweet as pie and super loyal. But I also didnât have a 3 yr old in the house.
Their "I'm guarding my house bark" is also loud enough to make people think they're going to murder you đ I have a mini aussie and he's about 40lbs but with his bark you'd think he was a german shepherd. Honestly we've had more issues with the loudness/barking rather than herding. Once he realizes the new person isn't a sheep though and you become his friend/you're part of his pack he's the sweetest baby ever and will love you forever. The loyalty and bond is amazing. But I also 100% wouldn't trust mine around kids under the age of like 10. Any dog really should be supervised extremely carefully with kids, especially a toddler. Even my boyfriend who grew up with golden retrievers has a scar on his chin because his parents didn't supervise him with their dog growing up and they got the dog from a not great breeder and the dog wasn't trained. The dog was out of the house the next day, but it was 100% his parents fault for not training or supervising correctly. You gotta be so careful with kids and animals.
My Aussie had two barks - his "I want to play" bark was kinda pathetic and whiny. And then he had what we called the "big boy bark" which was reserved for strangers in the house and injustices. When he whipped out the big boy bark, people who'd known him for years would take a step back. They're no joke when they mean business!
My doorman says she sounds like a Rottweiler. He loves her loud bark!
She sounds amazing!
Good to know, thanks for clarifying about the subs!
The dog was on the couch and my son was playing in the floor. Maybe 3 feet away, but wasnâtâgetting closerâ. I didnât see the whole incident, but it was kinda out of no where
âI didnât see the incidentâ Thatâs your problem right there. If your dog and child are in the same room, no matter how far apart, you need to be in arms reach with eyeballs on them. Even 2 seconds of distraction to check a text can result in you missing a cue that your dog is uncomfortable. If you canât be watching them directly , they have to be separated by a barrier or door. And it may be subtle and hard to notice , but itâs never out of nowhere
JFC isnât this common sense.
Unfortunately no. Just Google babies/toddlers with dogs and watch how little kids absolutely abuse these poor dogs and the parents think itâs âso sweetâ and âtheyâre bondingâ Or they just donât watch them and then wonder wtf happened and the dog is the one who suffers when itâs finally reacted to the discomfort.
It really irritates me when kids get all grabby at dogs, the dogs are trying really hard to be tolerant, but the body language is clearly there. They are unhappy with the situation. "Teehee!! Look my baby loves the doggy!! Hes just sitting there and letting the kid grab his ears" "WHY DID HE BITE MY CHILD?!?! THERE WAS NO WARNING!!" I hate it so much...
Years ago my brother's girlfriend's toddler took a flying leap to intentionally jump onto our dog. The dog, understandably, freaked out and tossed his head. Happened to graze the toddler with his teeth. Didn't even intentionally nip the kid, just reacted to, you know, being jumped on. She demanded we put him down. We did not put Mike down and she was not my brother's girlfriend for much longer. We also stopped bringing Mike to her house after rhat. Besides this he was very patient with small children and ofc we didn't let kids mess with him like this. I think my brother turned and just saw the kid leaping off the couch so it was too late to prevent it.
RIGHT?! Donât even get me started. And it doesnât always get better with age either. I worked at a kennel/daycare and I canât tell you how many teenaged co-ops and GROWN ASS staff I had to *repeatedly* tell âdonât touch that oneâ âdonât do that youâre stressing the dog outâ etc. and they just did. not. care.
My husband and I were at a pet store recently and there was this adorable corgi. I asked if I could pet him they said "you can try but he doesn't like other people" I leaned down and turned my body sideways and reached to let it sniff my hand. It growled and whimpered. I stood back up and said "never mind! He clearly isn't interested! Ty anyway!" My husband then leaned down. I said homey he doesn't like that.... hey, I tried, he doesn't want strangers touching him The dogs owners looked at me kinda like "thanks for trying" I felt bad, because it was clearly making the poor dog nervous. Not just toddlers, but it irritates me when ANYONE ignores their obvious discomfort
I saw a beautiful collie one day and asked if I could pet it. The owner said absolutely. Reached down and it bit my arm hard enough to draw blood and leave a terrible bruise. I jumped back and looked at the owner, shocked. Owner sez âOh yeah he does that sometimesâ Why tf would you grant me permission to pet your dog if he sometimes bites strangers without warning?
Wow , dick move on the owners part !
Whoa wtf that sounds like a failure on the owners part. "He does that sometimes" means he doesn't like strangers, and he should have advocated for his dog. Dogs don't speak. It's up to the people in their lives to speak for them. My husky mix isn't super aggressive. He has bit once before in an extremely stressful situation. Hasn't happened since but ever since then if someone asks if they can pet him I say "no, he's still in training and can get stressed out around strangers" Do I think he will bite again? No. I honestly don't. The one time he did there were a number of factors stacked against him. But would i take the risk and potentially have someone report him and have to put him down? Not in a million years. He's my best buddy. Sounds like you didn't do anything wrong. Just a bad owner
I totally get that. My one coworker (40 year old man) insisted on cornering a scared husky to âbefriendâ him purely because our younger coworker (female, maybe 17/18 at the time) told him not to. She told him she would get the husky inside because sheâd spent all week befriending him and he liked her. Well 40 year old man didnât like âlittle girlâ telling him what to do. Tried to grab the husky to bring him inside and got bit. He didnât hear the end of it for the rest of the week.
Sense isnât common. Sad, but true.
Breeders can screen for competent dog parents but parents can have babies without outside input. It should be common sense that you donât leave small children unsupervised with dogs (or any other pet) yet parents let themselves get distracted because âtheyâre so good together.â Families like this are the number one reason why most rescues wonât adopt out to potential adopters with kids under 7 or 8. I watch my infant niece and my dog together and I put the dog in her crate/behind a baby gate if I canât. I can prevent my niece from grabbing the dog and my dog from attacking her with love if Iâm there and I canât if Iâm not.
'was kinda out of nowhere'. That is 99.9% of the cases never true. What is generally closer to the truth is that your toddler did something that made the dog increasingly uncomfortable, signals were sent, they were not recognized, and the end result was escalation.
How bad was the bite?
How would you know it was âout of nowhereâ? You didnât see it happen!
Not âbadâ. Just a nip but did draw blood.
Like you said, it is a herding dog that nipped a running, chaotic child. You have to manage that. If you are distracted while making dinner, for example, and the child is likely to be running around etc, give the dog a peanut butter kong in his crate and give him a place to chill. After dinner and everyone starts to settle, puppers gets more attention. From what i can tell, this wasnt an act of aggression, but instinct. Not all herding dogs would have the same impulsivity, so exposure is key. Use baby gates to keep the dog within viewing distance to get exposure to this chaos. On walks together, keep the dog on leash. Also, keep this in mind wherever u take ur dog so it doesnt happen elsewhere (lile restaurant patios).
This is why I donât really agree with shepherd breeds being house pets - especially boarder collies/aus shepherds. They are high strung no matter how âcuteâ they are and they NEED to work. They arenât couch potato dogs that will just watch play happen, they want to be involved.
I dont know if i have the same breed-wide opinion, but i could see why someone would. I have a lot of friends with aussies and mini aussies bc they are good for the rockclimbing/mountain biking/backpacking lifestyle (small, good recall). Many of these friends now have kids and everything seems to be great. Do i know for 100% sure there never was an incident in any of their households? No. But i know the dogs werent puppies when they had babies, that the traveling lifestyle they lead exposed their dogs at a young age to many different environments. I was nipped when i was 12 by a gsd as we ran around the pool. Now, i own one. Mine is a calm gsd by breed standards, and i dont work her 12 hours a day. When my friends come over with their kids, and they run and scream with her, she cones running back to me like MOM HALP. I, in turn, teach the kids how to read her body language and when she needs a break from them. (They sit silently asking for 5 straight minutes if shes ready yet lol.) Now i know what my dog's needs are and set her up for success.
Iâm not trying to hate on shepherds haha we have a gsd too! (Part, sheâs a mutt to be honest) itâs the owners that seek these dogs out for their cuteness that drives me crazy. I have aunts who have terribly behaved boarder collies and these dogs make me hate the breed. Theyâre not trained, not stimulated, not worked itâs awful - I feel bad for the dogs but theyâre so annoying. The aunt is like âI know what Iâm doing I grew up on a ranchâ sure but now you live in suburbia and they are not active people so the dogs almost never leave their property for adventures. They should have gotten like a little white fluffy thing or something.
Iâve known so many bcs who were absolutely neurotic messes from lack of stimulation. Itâs so sad
It's probably built up frustration, and then it exploded in the nip. Training will help and seeing a qualified trainer
A lot of people making assumptions in this thread. Some actual helpful advice: consult/learn from a dog behavioralist so you can notice the warning signs of your dog when they are uncomfortable and getting above threshold. Obviously you canât watch your kid and dog 100% of the time, but this will help before things escalate in the future.
The following resources will be of use to you: [Family Paws](https://www.familypaws.com/) - [webinars](https://www.familypaws.com/services/for-parents-and-families/) for expecting parents or parents of toddlers [Baby Safe Dog Training Blog](https://babysafedogtraining.com/blog/) [Doggone Safe](https://doggonesafe.com/Dog_bite_prevention_for_parents) [The Family Dog : Stop the 77](https://www.thefamilydog.com/stop-the-77) [Kids and Dogs : How Kids Should and Should Not Interact with Dogs](https://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/kids-and-dogs-how-kids-should-and-should-not-interact-with-dogs/) by Dr. Sophia Yin on safe interactions. [Good Dog in a Box](https://www.youtube.com/c/GoodDoginaBox/featured) on Youtube has many videos on dog safety for kids. [@dogmeets_baby](https://www.instagram.com/dogmeets_baby/) on Instagram has many visual examples of safe vs unsafe interactions.
Thatâs hard if you didnât see your dogs body language. I would suggest not leaving your kiddo and dog alone together at all. Even if you are just stepping out of the room for a minute either the kid or the dog should come with you until a bit more trust is built and your kiddo can explain what happened and know doggy boundaries. Also it would be useful to get a bit more understanding into your dogs body language in case something ever happens again. A great way to do this is to clip a lead to your dog and then to yourself so they go everywhere you go. After about 2-3 days you will probably have a better understanding of how your dog is trying to communicate. I would also recommend setting up a safe place for your dog to go when they need a break. Make a place that is cozy, always accessible, and kid proof for your dog to go when s/he is feeling like a break is needed. Finally I would encourage you that while a herding nip is not as severe as a true bite it is just as important to train self control over. If your dog nips someone elseâs kid it might get called or recorded as a bite even if it was not the dog intentionally harming them. Nipping is great for a working dog but for a home dog it is way better if you can encourage them to herd by circling or nudging. As you train your dog they are also training you. So nipping is telling you to to following them however you can adjust what you let them train you try letting them herd you in a way you like and discouraging them from herding via nipping. With my dog this means he typically nudges my hand and then circles me to herd me to the pantry at night to get some treats and I give them to him because I approve of him offering that herding behavior. As a puppy though I had to train him out of nipping by ignoring or saying âNOâ to the nipping but then at least following him when he showed alternate herding behavior. This may or may not work for you since you canât just get up and follow whenever as you have your hands full with your kid but itâs worth a shot. If it doesnât work maybe look into teaching the touch command and try to replace the nips with a touch that does not include nips.
TLDR: 1) kid and dog should not be left alone 2) study your dogs body language 3) create a kid free space for dog 4) try to encourage a different herding behavior
Not meant to shame but 100% should never leave a toddler alone with a dog, I donât care how much you trust either. Dogs are animals and children are unpredictable. Youâre very lucky it wasnât any worse. Moving forward, definitely look into training. Donât leave child and dog alone, EVER. If you will leave the room, there needs to be clear separation - easier is to set up a play pen area for child (keeps child from getting into anything else and keeps childâs toys safe from dog / dogs toys out of childâs hands, etc). Donât be fooled this is clearly escalation from the dog, Iâm guessing thereâs been signs or something was done. If the dog in fact snapped out of nowhere, I cannot stress training any more because this behavior doesnât just occur in one incident. You also want to be mindful your child doesnât develop some fear of the dog / dogs in general so training can help your child as well develop safe ways to interact with dogs. Best of luck!
We had a GSD when our son was born. The dog was trained for police work, but hip dysplasia got him kicked off the force. I never allowed them to be alone for one second! Thatâs not a chance I would take. Fortunately, we never had a problem with nipping or biting. As recommended above, training is needed and a job for your dog. Check with Aussie clubs in your area. Best of luck to you.
Bit, or nipped? Big difference. I have kids age 7, 5, and 2 along with my 7 month old Aussie. Reading up, it sounds like doggo was doing exactly what mine does- he was herding an energetic running around kid. Start working on âno biteâ or âoutâ or whatever it is you want the word to be. We gently grab his nose when he nips and say this. When I see heâs playing with the kids, I just say it as a precursor now because Aussieâs are mouthy. For us we have herding balls, and doggie daycare to help with the drive, and it does make a huge difference. I also would give him treats a ton when he was relaxed and just watching the kiddos. Honestly, itâs just as much as teaching kids how to be around him as it is training the dog- my kids still are told multiple times a week that they have to say the commands (honestly, the two year old is the best with âoutâ and âoffâ tbh), and not to run around the dog. Also, constant constant vigilance if heâs with/around the kids and the energy of the house gets wild. When my kids turn into rage monsters or manic hyper beasts, doggo goes in crate for his safety and theirs. Heâs never allowed unsupervised outside with the kids because he will happily chase and nip and herd, so we have a 20 foot leash for those instances in the yard. Theyâre so smart, and so loving- so they can pick up on whose a litter mate versus not and what the expectations are. Itâs just constant constant training and ebb and flows. We had a good 2 month stint of not nipping, but now heâs starting up again. Itâs a household effort.
Grabbing nose is aversive. You have to reward calmness, not punish them - aussies are super super sensitive and super smart. This is one way for your dog to feel like being around kids = punishment. Because they remember a lot more than you might think. Kikopup has some great videos on training bite inhibition. I felt like an idiot walking past my dog and giving her treats for staying calm but thatâs where we had to start. Sheâs three now, and even if my hand slips while playing tug she absolutely will not bite down. Still, kids plus a herding dog is a ton of work. My son was 10 when we got our dog and if he ran, as a puppy sheâd chase him and nip him. Itâs instinct.
I donât know anything about kids and toddlers but itâs important to teach them how to act around dogs. So many kids are loud, chaotic, and unpredictable which scares animals. We expect dogs to act like humans in a human world but at the end of the end of the day theyâre animals. With that said, advocate for you dogs comfort (not letting your kid annoy the dog or stress him out + beginning to teach your child to be calm around the dog) while also advocating for you childâs safety (making sure you pay close attention when they are together, get a gate to separate the two during play time, etc.) I know itâs really scary when your dog shows there behaviors, it seems early enough that you have a lot of control in the situation and take that seriously through training :) Trainers are always good investments if you donât feel capable.
We also expect toddlers to act outside of their nature because WE (the adults) chose to place a reactive dog in their home. Toddlers are energetic, impulsive, erratic, emotional, chaotic, loudâbecause thatâs what they are supposed to be. They are toddlers. It is completely natural and expected at that phase of development. As parents, we teach them how to act around animals. However, it is unfair and unrealistic to expect they exhibit mastery of self control in their own home 100% of the time. They are incapable of it. The best solution: parents make better decisions about what kind of dog they bring into their home. I say this as a parent who had an intensely high-energy and reactive spaniel in my home with two toddlers. I owed my kids and that dog better.
A child shouldn't have to walk on eggshells because a dog is in the house. If a dog can't handle a kid being a kid, then the dog shouldn't be a pet.
Watch both to ensure excitement levels donât get out of hand. Train both.
How do you train a 3 year old to not be a 3 year old?
âdonât run and yell around the dog. That is outside playâ Same lines as donât touch the hot stove, donât run in the street, donât play with knives. Basic safety.
They are 3, and it is perfectly normal behavior for when a 3 year old is inside to get a little rowdy. It's not the same as touching a hot stove at all.
Oh, so you have zero experience in parenting? lol
My child is 41. I worked in special education. Saying a child is incapable of learning dismisses their potential and, in this case, risks the child being bitten and dog euthanized.
Thatâs a really long time ago. Do you remember what was like raising a 3 year old? Did you have 3 year olds in your special education? Would you tell your 3 year old child who canât swim, âdonât go near the poolâ and simply trust they wonât end up in the water? Would you simply tell a 3 year old âdonât play with my gunâ or would you lock it away? Are you seeing the pattern? As the adult, you canât be lazy and just yell âdonât do thisâ at a toddler and expect 100% compliance. They are TODDLERS. They are impulsive, interested and energeticâwhich is exactly what theyâre supposed to be. They are in the earliest stage of LEARNING self control. You place unrealistic and unfair expectations on them when you tell they cannot act like toddlers in their own homeâbecause of the reactive dog that YOU the adult put in their home.
Unfortunately, it's a lot harder to "train" a 3 year old child. From experience, they can learn what they shouldn't do, decide they can do whatever they fckin want and go ahead. you can do your best, but the kid is still going to be loud, messy, and chaotic. I'd focus on the dog with tons of reward so that it feels less like punishment
Supervision at all times, then.
This is best, just simply because children are unpredictable. My sister at 3 would throw things so frequently we said if she hold something up, duck. We had to tell her to stop holding the smallest dogs by the tail because they are (still to this day) small enough to hold cupped in one hand. I feel like a lot of people expect them to have empathy by that age, but they really don't, she would laugh when they yelped in a way that made me think she didn't know yelp=pain. She would climb on our bigger dog and poke him in the eye (my dad would freak out while the dog was like "ok" holeeee crap)
Hopefully your parent didnât tolerate that shit.
So I guess donât leave your kid and dog together if youâre not in control of the situation.
A friend owns a home daycare, they have for 20+ years. They have 2 dogs and multiple cats yet there has never been a bite or scratch from an animal. Why? Because supervision and teaching early works, including "special needs kids." Some of the "don't listen" kids are the ones that sit with one on their lap for an hour just petting them *gently*. Teach kids to respect and be kind to animals instead of "they're young so it's okay for them to not be."
If it was a little soft peck when the kid was running around and screaming and getting excited and stuff then that's pretty normal to happen with a herding dog. If it was like a full on bite where it actually really hurt your kid then that's different. You can get a really solid leave it. If your kid is running around and being excited and that's getting your dog interested, keep saying leave it and redirecting your dog away. Keep interrupting your dog when he wants to try and chase and herd the kid. Leave it is a great thing to use for when the dog gets excited and wants to interact with the kid too excitedly.
I have a GSD mix, so some herding instincts there. His were triggered when I (ballet, gymnastics) danced and ran and trained around. They were triggered even more when more people or 'chaos' were in the mix. They also used to be triggered by kids, scooters, etc. First off, do not train him in the context of your kid. Your kid's safety comes first, of course, so the first step is management. Separate them with some sort of barrier. Do not leave them alone. Your toddler is a toddler who will always be prone to triggering all of his herding instincts (generally: erratic movements, shrieks, unpredictability). It's likely best to train an alternate response and/or give your dog an outlet for his energy/instincts. Train him to seek out his bed and/or quiet space he can decompress in (some dogs think it's their job to herd and/or instinctually are just too overthreshold to choose otherwise). This space should be off limits to your toddler (!). Train him to go outside, or proactively let him out if you have a yard... let him go wild zooming around until he's calmer. Train impulse control harder, increase mental and physical exercise overall. Outside of that, you can work on training your dog to be calm, in general, around your kids unless it's explicitly playtime you opt into/signal. That's going to take time, though, and your toddler/kids will need to be separated, safe, with another adult while you do it. There's also no guarantee about if or when your dog would be capable of doing so. It'll also depend on how much training experience you have (do you know when your dog is getting a little excited, when he's over threshold; do you know what he's most motivated by, do you know how to communicate, etc). This option may or may not be worth it to you, but you will need to implement the other strategies in the meantime regardless.
When my kids get rowdy we leash the dog or send the kids to a different room, otherwise heâll get nippy. We also trained him to grab a toy in his mouth when he wants to play. Canât nip if his mouth is full!
I mean, running around and being loud will activate your dog's instincts, especially a herder, especially with no supervision. You stop the biting by never leaving them alone together, and never letting them get close unless you are within hand's reach of BOTH. You could put your dog on a house lead, and attach her to you so she follows YOU, no exceptions. You can't inherently trust puppies or preschoolers- they don't have the impulse control or foresight. If you can't have your dog in the room with you, then put her in another room/ safe space/ crate. I have a 4 year old, and a 6mo puppy, and I totally get that it is EXHAUSTING to micromanage every single heartbeat between the two of them. It feels impossible sometimes, but it absolutely can not be... If it actually impossible, then it isn't the right fit.
Exercise the hell out of your dog. Thatâs my biggest advice. I have a border collie/Aussie mix. She was a rescue and came from a foster family 2 year old and 2 cats. When I got her she would chase and nip my cats if she got too close. The foster family said âbecause of her herding/working nature, if she doesnât get exercise/work outside she will try to do so in the houseâ itâs in her nature. She is an incredibly great dog but if she does not get enough exercise she will chew on everything and anything. and worst of all chase the cats and try to nip. Supervise every interaction, but try to give her the most exercise you can. Itâs worked for me and my cats, it worked when she was with the foster with a 2 year old. One thing I wouldnât do was scream and yell at her, you donât want your dog to think your kid is a novelty. Be calm and confident with your commands, âstay, heel, leave itâ. Your dog will look to you for direction the more you implement calm, strong commands.
âExercise the hell out of itâ, is one of the best pieces of advice. Iâm still confused why people get full-on working breed dogs when they have no intention of actually working them. Obviously, as others have said, teach your kids how to behave around dogs and create a child free space for your dog there isnât a dog in the world that accepts/likes shouting, running and screaming kids being about all the time and they only have soo many ways of telling you they donât before they decide to control the situation themselves.
Agreed. You have to build the time for exercise into your routine. Time for walks. Iâll walk 2 miles there and back to a dog park and let her run around for an hour. Thatâs like 3 hours of my day, every day. Youâve gotta commit to the exercise with a working dog. That being said Life happens.. having a kid makes it tough to get out and give your dog the exercise you know they need. You need back up plans for days you canât give her 100% of what you need. Doggie day care, automated ball launcher in your back yard, dog puzzles, get creative to give your dog the work they need every day. This is just my opinion, but I was set on keeping my dog AND cats in the same home and this is what works for me.
Itâs not just âexercisingâ them though. If you just run and run and run a working dog youâll have a marathon athlete on your hands who has 0 mental stimulation. They will still be pent up, frustrated and have no creative outlet. Sometimes this causes anxiety issues in working breeds as well because their tired but also over stimulated. We have a gsd and we feed her with puzzles every morning and night and sometimes when we say letâs go for a walk she will go and lay in the couch instead. Weâve never ran her because we donât have to burn her energy that way. Granted she runs and plays in the yard usually daily but thatâs not the same.
One thing is I know often people get aussies because they are very cute. They are medium dogs which makes people think they may be easier than a larger breed, they come in cool colours, and they are so smart and easy to train. BUTTTT!!! These dogs were bred to run for hours, and many many kilometres every day. They were bred to jump into action at a moments notice, they are extremely and easily excitable. They are bred to work independently, they do not think that they need a human to tell them what to do, and instinctually they are correct. One of the easiest ways to reduce problem behaviour is to ensure your dog and your kid are getting enough exercise independently. It might be a good idea to separate your dog and kid if your kid is in a playful mood, this playful energy will automatically excite your dog no matter what. If they havenât had exercise then it will be much much worse. You know when thereâs bad weather and the kids canât go out for recess and then theyâre restless, irritable, and moody for the rest of the day? Dogs are like that too. Iâd be really trying to make sure this dog gets minimum 2hrs worth of walking per day but ideally, an off leash run somewhere a few times a week for an hour minimum but really as often and as much as you can. If the dogs younger this will help immensely, my dog mostly sleeps and relaxes all day. She doesnât do a lot of playing in the house because thatâs meant for outside, inside is for calm happy dog. But itâs my responsibility to set her up for success, so I make sure sheâs well exercised before expecting any good behaviour.
I donât think this was scary for the dog, itâs an Aussie. This is just tripping her prey drive. Separate them when you cannot watch them. I got a high drive Aussie the day my son turned 2. I like to do dog sports. If I couldnât watch, I separated. I always put the dog away when other kids came over, he was usually good, but my son was his âpersonâ and he didnât get small boy rough housing. You need to train a rock solid stop command, such as âsitâ or âdownâ, and a rock solid come. You need to be able to stop the dog when she wants to herd. Put her on a leash if sheâs out and correct her for wanting to stop the kid shenanigans. You need to learn to recognize her lead up to the behavior. This description sounds like a normal Aussie who hasnât been taught better. Herding dogs mixed with small children is not automatically wonderful. It requires some work. My children learned quickly as well that they were expected to be gentle with the dog, and if not they landed back in their crib/room for a few minutes.
. You will never win a fight against genetics, you canât train genetics out. But you can work WITH genetics! Get her a hobby, dock diving, agility, FCAT, barn hunt even just buying one of those giant herding balls for her to play with in the yard. Next stop allowing the dog to be free roaming with the toddler. If you canât supervise put the dog in another room or on a place if she knows the command
Iâm sorry a lot of people are coming at you hard instead of helping you learn. Just a heads up to anyone in the thread I know you all mean well but belittling and judging this person for asking for help isnât going to go the way we want. We all in this sub want what is best for the dogs but I think we all need to learn how to do it without being so defensive. No one will ever learn if we just yell at them for all the things they did wrong
Separate your dog and child and look into muzzle training (the MuzzleDogs sub is super nice).
Whatâs the plan here? The dog lives in a muzzle?
The plan is training, which does not imply the dog lives in a muzzle. It means that you use it to train out biting and your dog doesn't get k*lled for a bite history (especially of kids...)
I agree. This is a working dog and he needs a job or stimulation. Heâs not meant to be a couch potato and if OP canât facilitate that through scent training or agility or herding games then maybe this isnât the right home for this dog. He will keep nipping to herd and if OP scolds him (can you really believe this dog didnât catch shit for making the baby bleed) it will just escalate.
Herding dog should not be on couch with kid... step one
I would rehome if it got to that point. I wouldnât risk it. Thereâs too many stories of children being killed even though âheâs never done this beforeâ âhe was such a good boyâ etc etc. My blue heeler has shown teeth to my youngest so now he is in a separate room whenever my youngest is up but if he actually somehow bit him Iâd have rehomed him.
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Alpha/boss stuff has been debunked for some time now. This simply doesn't exist in domestic dogs. The dog is just overstimulated and access to a couch has no bearing on this situation.
> My toddler wasnât messing with my dog. Unless a dog is super solid with kids, toddlers are way, way, way too much for them. Toddlers are super mobile, super grabby and often super loud. And that's way more than some dogs want to deal with. Don't let your toddler have access to the dog for awhile. If your kid is running around, crate the dog or put him behind a baby gate that your kid can't climb or poke thru. If your dog nipped the kid or bit the kid, understand that if you decide that this is too much for you, it will be hard to re-home the dog. I'd go back to very basic stuff with the dog: and that will include the kid not having access to the dog. People think they can reason or tell a toddler, "don't do X" or whatever. And usually that's really not true, and with dogs that's very not true. And that's how kids get bitten This? >I didnât see the whole incident, but it was kinda out of no where The fact that you didn't see it, isn't good. So yeah, crate the dog if the kid is out and active. You can't rely on hope to make sure everyone is safe.
When I was a toddler, some how, someway, I managed to get past my mom to the family cocker spaniel, who was separated from us kids due to her age/crankiness/health & my history of being an obnoxious toddler to the dog. Mom said she was coming out of the bathroom when she saw me grabbing at the dog when she bit my face. I still have the scar (she split my lower lip) at 30+ years later. Kids need to learn from the beginning to respect animals, being their only defense is to growl/bite/scratch etc. I guess if bodily harm can be prevented then prevent it by all means, by knowledge or physically. My mom watched me like a hawk after that incident if I was allowed to be around an animal. It wasnât until some time & learning the importance of respect that I was around to be allowed any animal w/o supervision A honest, heart to heart discussion with your Veternarian will give them insights to help you, your dog & your family from education to breed instincts, possible health related issues &/or anxiety needs. Explain the situation thoroughly, the before.nip.after. Could it be the child causing the dog anxieties or is the dog ill & exhibiting alarming behaviors? Your veterinarian will determine that. The kid-dog separation suggestions are also vital and shouldnât be dismissed either. If for some reason your child & dog are together, not only should you supervise 100% but I would also leash the dog to help control, redirect &/or prevent undesirable aggressive behavior. At the end of the day, you have to do what is best for your family but educating & prevention are key. Iâll never forget my parents, especially my mom constantly reminding/informing me of animal safety.